Willemse unscathed from Pumas return
27 Jan 2006
Ashwin Willemse has returned to competitive rugby, playing the final 30 minutes of the Cats’ 41-13 win over the Pumas in Witbank.
Coach Frans Ludeke has been determined that the latest comeback by the former SA Player of the Year will not be aborted, and thus his reintroduction has been cautious.
“Ashwin is right on schedule to be fit for our first game,” a relieved Ludeke told keo.co.za. “He came through nicely last night and I will look to start him against the Sharks in our final game before the Super 14 begins. If he can get through 60 minutes there, he should have shaken off the cobwebs sufficiently to start against the Stormers.”
Despite again not impressing some observers, the Cats emerged from Witbank with the solace that there were no additions to the injury list.
They outscored the hosts five tries to one, with perennial favourite Jorrie Muller dotting down twice, and Jaque Fourie, Daniel Muller and Ernst Joubert all grabbing one each.
90 Comments
27 Jan 2006, 09:53 am
….perennial favourite Jorrie Muller…..never thought the word favourite would be associated with ol Jorrie !
Great that Ash is back !
27 Jan 2006, 09:59 am
Why do guys like Jorrie and Gus never pick up SERIOUS injuries?
27 Jan 2006, 10:00 am
Coz they die hards… onkruid vergaan nie
27 Jan 2006, 10:05 am
KWV – because they spend the first 60 minutes of the match wondering where the hell they are ! and then they get subbed !
27 Jan 2006, 10:15 am
2 Tries, brilliant by King Jorrie! We can definately expect a Springbok call-up for this legend in the making!
27 Jan 2006, 10:15 am
hehehe
good point ig.
the rugby gods do have a sick sense of humour, it is about high time the bulls gets o ‘gus’ too.
mind you they did have casper….
27 Jan 2006, 10:15 am
Grrr is gonna be thrilled!
27 Jan 2006, 10:16 am
i actually met casper once or twice, magic guy, really nice oke to have a beer with, as down to earth as you can get.
yup zero, grrrr is going to score!
27 Jan 2006, 10:17 am
Go Ashwin, you gengster! Hope it lasts this time.
27 Jan 2006, 10:19 am
Ya Pissant – i am sure they have a Gus lurking in the ranks somewhere….
27 Jan 2006, 10:25 am
I really rated Ashwin before his injuries… I sincerly hope that his injuries have not Jeopardized his ability to play good rugby – we shall see…
27 Jan 2006, 10:25 am
Unfortunately for Ashwin there are better wingers than him at the moment. It’s really a pity that Shandre Frolick is injured but a bok backline with the following names in it can be great. Imagine this backline:
15. Shandre Frolick
14. Jonghi Nokwe
13. Brain Habana
12. Jean de Villiers
11. Tonderia Chavanga
10. Andre Pretorius
9. Ricky January
What do we do with Jaque Fourie. Maybe on the bench to cover fullback, center and wing. Does anybody have news on Frolick?
27 Jan 2006, 10:27 am
Zinto – i stand to be corrected but i think he is on his way back from a shoulder injury and should turn out for WP during the Vodacom cup…..
27 Jan 2006, 10:31 am
Great news Ig. I’ve read that he was faster than Habana, Ryland, Chavanga and Nokwe. Real speedster this young man. Quite big aswell.
27 Jan 2006, 10:32 am
Agree Zinto – watched a bit of the U19 WC when he was playing at 15 – he looked like a real good runner…..
27 Jan 2006, 10:33 am
Zinto
Frolick is a talented player but to talk about bok selection?. He performed well for u19s but not that well.
27 Jan 2006, 10:35 am
True redox, one can dream hey? I disagree, I think he played well enough for the U19′s to be considdered a potential future Bok.
27 Jan 2006, 10:37 am
ja nooit PA, can’t see how you can call casper a jorrie. have you seen how many records he has for the bulls?
27 Jan 2006, 10:39 am
on ashwin, go boikie go!
a friend of mine is the chiro for the cats. she helped a lot with ashwin’s rehab (obviously not by crackin his back) and they are very positive. put in a massive amount of really hard work apparently. lots of dosh spent on this gansta!
27 Jan 2006, 10:40 am
jusm,
he was my favourite player when i lived in pta as a WP supporter – especially when he was the kicker for the bulls!!!!
but like i said, a magic guy – i was just pulling the piss.
27 Jan 2006, 10:40 am
Just a question for Bulls supporters. I have’t seen alot of the guy, but how good is Pierre Spies, Will he play wing or No8 in S14 and is he included in the Bulls squad? Also how is Chilliboy doing, playing with the big boys. Think he’ll play S14 this year already?
27 Jan 2006, 10:42 am
Zinto
Agree with that he is one to watch a potential bok in the future but IMHO he has to perform at provincial level first though.
27 Jan 2006, 10:42 am
Oh my goodness!!! ” Perinnial FAVEROUTE Jorrie..” LMFAO!!!
Every time he or “No Gas” Theron gets any playing time -Sa Rugby is the big looser!!!
27 Jan 2006, 10:42 am
Casper Steyn?
27 Jan 2006, 10:46 am
Agree 100% with you redox. Pitty he got injured. Hopefully he’ll be back for WP in the vodacom cup as Ig said.
27 Jan 2006, 10:46 am
the one and only
27 Jan 2006, 10:46 am
lol PA, now i know u taking the piss! if he is a magic guy, he sure as **** was a magic kicker. like i said, check the record books.
unfortunately he suffered a bad dip in confidence / form at some point and never quite got it back. i suppose round about that time he could have been in the oppo’s good books…
27 Jan 2006, 10:48 am
when morne steyn was slotting them from the corner last season, one aussie commentator wondered allowed if he was related to the friendly ghost of loftus..
27 Jan 2006, 10:49 am
hehehe,
must say, the pumas were lost without him…
27 Jan 2006, 10:49 am
I dig the friendly ghost!
27 Jan 2006, 10:50 am
zinto,
i think we could see spies get some s14 game time at 8 and chili get some at 2, both this season.
on your backline, nice, but you forget that habarnero is a wing
27 Jan 2006, 10:52 am
I’m nogal interested in seeing Spies play at 8 – didn’t see much of him last year.
hope he is a true find, give the Bulls pack another dimension
27 Jan 2006, 10:52 am
Even if it is only a second dimension…
27 Jan 2006, 10:53 am
zinto
Rather wait a bit before you start touting Frollick as a possible Springbok. SARugby Mag had a feature in it last year about how many guys go missing between SA U21 and SA U19 to the Boks. It is a big step up to take. We, South Africans, are always ready to chuck a guy in when he has talent and when he has one or two crappy games we drop them and forget about them. Never to be seen or heard from again. Let him cut his teeth first in Vodacom Cup and then make the step up to CC and the S14 and only if he excels there get him into the Boks.
And while he is waiting for the call up, busy playing in the “lower” competetions put him on a gim programme so that he doesn’t only measure up to the guys from other countries but in fact exceeds them. Also put talented guys like Frollick into a programme with Dr Calder (The Boks Eye coordination Coach) to better their vision. Also we should have a skills development programme. Learn to kick with both feet, pass pin point passes to left and right etc. Then when he’s good and ready and most of all hungry let them loose on the world stage. Tests match rugby isn’t the place to learn new things. That is what S14 and domestic competetions are there for.
Guys like Alister Heagraves, Chillyboy, Frollick , Jody Rose and a whole bunch of other guys with serious talent should be nurtured, not chucked to the wolves like Derrick Hougaard, Meyer Bosman etc.
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 10:53 am
think they actually called him that rodb. didn’t come up with that one myself unfortunately..
PA, i wonder if he played for the pumas in this game? i suspect that this will be his last season. got man of the match in the second tier CC final last season, so decided to stay on for one more.
27 Jan 2006, 10:56 am
JUSM
Yes he is a wing at the moment, but he played in his preffered position of outside center for the Lions. I still see him as a center and think himself and Jean could be a great combo. I think that JW is using him on the wing untill he metures. A bit like the All Blacks have done with Umaga?
27 Jan 2006, 10:57 am
i played some action cricket with him, he has great ball sense, cant bat for **** but good ball sense.
27 Jan 2006, 10:59 am
Fair comment Methos. Very true.
27 Jan 2006, 11:03 am
yes methos well thought through comment
zinto i know i was a bit tongue in cheek there. we have had a few lenghty arguments on the issue on this site. i am a habana on the wing man myself. he is the best in the country, so keep him there. imo.
issit PA, sure it was fun. i’ve actually also had the occasional bear with the guy. he is good friends with danie van schalkwyk as well. pity he got a career ending injury (danie). was a good player.
27 Jan 2006, 11:11 am
hehe jusm,
danie was there the same evening as well, it was at randburg action cricket club, both of them very nice guys – danie is the better batter though!
and very true about danie’s injury – he was a good player.
27 Jan 2006, 11:15 am
Just 15 more days before the S14 starts!!!!
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 11:15 am
JUSM
With Paulse posibly out of the picture, who would you bring in on the other wing. Nokwe,Mentz,Chavanga, Russel, Mkhize,Janjes, Willemse?? I’d pick Nokwe. Do you think Montgomery will still be the no1 fullback for the Boks this year or will we see Janjes or maybe Roets take over. Same for Os, Maybe Sephaka or Steenkamp?
27 Jan 2006, 11:18 am
Zinto
Paulse is comong home in June if I remeber correctly.
If he is not available I’d be tempted to play Marius Joubert there. That is where he started off his carreer. the we get to keep De Villiers and Fourie at centres.
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 11:21 am
Methos – as far as I know, part of David Campese’s roll at the Sharks is to assist the guys at the academy with honing their basic skills. A step in the right direction, I think. In fact, I like the way the Sharks academy seems to be managing its young players. It would’ve been really tempting to chuck guys like Hargreaves, Blignaut, Mxoli and Daniels straight into the S14 squad, but it looks like they’re being held back until they’re strong enough.
27 Jan 2006, 11:25 am
well well well PA, small world indeed. mind if i ask how you ended up playing action cricket with the guys?
Zinto,
wing: if willemse is fit, i back him all the way. awesome player. strong, fast, commited. don’t rate russel at all, sorry sharkies. next bet is nokwe. but later.
fullback: i’d still play monty me thinks. he only had a couple of bad games at the end of the season. was really good for the rest of it. but else, yes roets. pity he can’t kick for posts though
prop: still play os for half the game, and replace him with steenkamp. steenkamp is my choice for the future.
27 Jan 2006, 11:26 am
robD
That is excelent news. This is probably the first smart action anybody in SA rugby Admin took for quite a while.
I hope we can teach guys to first get the basics right before trying other things. Like kicking the ball OUT from penalties and other line kicks. Etc. That is one thing that gripes me like very few others.
If they chucked Hargreaves in the S 14 he’d be broken. What does he weigh now. Last I heard he was at 94 kg.
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 11:26 am
Good to see him back
27 Jan 2006, 11:30 am
really? That light? He needs to spend about a year with Mr Andrews… hitting the gym, picking up weight, getting the **** knocked out of him until he can put the old man to shame… he’s a good prospect, but seems way too nice. Mark will sort him out.
JUSM – Brent is a waste at wing. He’s my pick for Bok fullback.
27 Jan 2006, 11:32 am
What a good night! Finally the missus relented and like King Jorrie I went in for the score!! Ash, welcome back my man, we all missed you. Now, why did we conceed 14 points??? Mr. Ludeke, this is simply not good enough!!! 100 trashing should have been on the books. How are we going to lift the Super 14 trophy when we struggel against the Pumas?? Anyway, a win is a win and I feel like the ‘bees-knees’ today!!
27 Jan 2006, 11:32 am
jusm,
i played action cricket for quite a while, i lived in the burg before i moved to pta, even after i moved to pta i still played there. someone organised it, cant remember who exactly – i was not one of the most sober people around back then after a game and especially a fines meeting – still dont get that fines meeting stuffs though – even if you play well you end up pissed
27 Jan 2006, 11:32 am
Who wrote this? Very nice use of the word perennial. It realy sums up old Jorrie very well.
27 Jan 2006, 11:38 am
PissAnt
Fines meetings are wicked.
We always had fines meetings after rugby games at my previous club. Even if you didn’t play because of injury you still end up pissed.
Have you ever had proper court session after games where the guys accuse each other ? We once had a coach who wasn’t the biggest drinker around down 2 beers. He passed ou behind the bar 15 minutes later.
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 11:43 am
hehehe,
methos,
i am still trying to figure out which fines meetings were worse – the court sessions seems to be a CPT thing, no club in the north did that.
if i had to list the worse fines meeting according to the sport it would be:
3. action cricket
2. rugby (club)
1. cricket (club)
somehow the club cricket fines meetings were always the worse, man some of these guys could pack it away…….
had one or two baseball ones as well – those okes are just plain bloody loonatics
27 Jan 2006, 11:52 am
PissAnt
The court sessions gets done like this. The select a judge and 2 helpers (Accessors) ?Sp or something like that. They then sit a the table and the rest of the squad sit around them. They then start from the left to the right. Each guy has to nominate someone for something they did during that game. If you have a crappy accusation they make you drink. If the charge is upheld they decide on a suitable punishment for the offender.
(number of drinks.) Lots of fun. The worst one I had was when I accidently broke our 8′th man’s nose during a game. He was vice captain as well.
You also have to adress the judge as “Edelagbare” etc. If you screw up it’s bottoms up.
I’ve always wanted to try baseball. Where did you play ?
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 11:54 am
Hey PA,
Old casper has saved the Bulle on a many an occasion with his reliable boot.More than Percy can say in last 3n game…
27 Jan 2006, 11:55 am
ja robd thought you would say that. suppose if we could hide him at fullback that would be ok
PA, i also really enjoyed my action cricket. played in pta though. played for two teams at one stage. got pissed all the time. these days can’t get drunk on a school night any more. all professional and stuff. rediculous.
grrr… details please.
27 Jan 2006, 11:57 am
JUSM
Details??? Hell, I have pictures!!!
27 Jan 2006, 11:58 am
Grrr…
Attaboy!!!!!!!
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 11:59 am
methos, broke the vice cappies nose?? geez… that’ll cost ya. big time.
27 Jan 2006, 12:00 pm
ag pleeez, JUSM. He only appears to hide from the opposition – that is because he’s so fast they can’t tackle him.
(Really scraping the bottom of the barrell here)
27 Jan 2006, 12:00 pm
Zinto,
Spies is a unbelievable talent but still very young. Thats why Meyer is saving him and will slowly introduce him into big rugby to avoid another gaffie or Hougaard. he has played 8th man for most of his life and has only been converted into a winger the last 3 years. Dont expect too much from his this year, but watch him next year.
27 Jan 2006, 12:04 pm
lekker grrr!!!
hope you not joking about the pics!! any movies?
27 Jan 2006, 12:06 pm
But are they going to use him as a wing, or as a number 8? Surely they need to decide pretty damn fast, or he’ll end up being another Brent Russell, although far worse of.
27 Jan 2006, 12:10 pm
Very true Robd.
Fortunately he is still young.When he was younger, he was much bigger than the other wingers. Now he is in big league. Maybe he should stay at eigth, as we have a severe shortage of real no 8′s, but a lot of promising wings.
27 Jan 2006, 12:10 pm
Sorry to say but Paulse is out of the picture. Last Friday during Clemont-Auvergne vs Leicester his opposite wing scored four tries, one directly due to a bad Paulse miss-tackle, one due to Paulse not being able to stop the fullback from passing out the tackle and a third to a gap he left. Add two dropped balls to that.
It was sorry to see, painful to watch.
27 Jan 2006, 12:14 pm
RobD
They decided to convert him into a wing 2 or 3 years ago but now they seem to have changed their mind. My personal feeling is that they should use him at No 8. He’s big enough and speed will always be a bonus there. He’s also got a lot of ball skills and will spark some interesting attacks. Also tall enough for a lineout option.
We have lot of wings in SA with pace to burn. We have a desperate shortage of 8′th men with ball skills and speed. Big Joe has speed and skills but he’s not hard enoug for my liking. Jacques Cronje has the grunt but not the speed and skills.
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 12:15 pm
lol robd
27 Jan 2006, 12:15 pm
Methos is right – we are in dire need of a skillfull, yet hard, number 8
27 Jan 2006, 12:15 pm
But he would still make the Stormers with ease…
27 Jan 2006, 12:20 pm
Stan
Gaan K*k in die mielies
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 12:20 pm
Methos,
Krip jy, of do great minds think alike?
27 Jan 2006, 12:21 pm
Stan
Krip wat ?
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 12:22 pm
Methos,
Ek het verwys na Paulse, nie Spies nie.
Spies sal nooit die Stormers maak nie, hy is heeltemal te talentvol daarvoor!
27 Jan 2006, 12:22 pm
Stan – yesterday I read you rate Mametsa higher than (I can’t recall which wingers you mentioned). The guy puts in the effort, but his lack of pace is dead cert to block his higher honours.
Paulse though is at the end of his career – can look back with joy having achieved a lot. Internationally he is gone, provioncial (Currie Cup) he’ll still do OK.
27 Jan 2006, 12:23 pm
Ek verwys na ons 2 se post oor Spies wat amper dieselfde was!
27 Jan 2006, 12:26 pm
Methos,
I played club rugby in CPT, know all to well about that, but never experienced it up north, maybe the PTA boys can let us know if they have it up there????
27 Jan 2006, 12:26 pm
Stan
Sorry. I see your previous post now. Nope. Not kripping. I was busy typing an Email half of the time while also busy replying here. Didn’t see you comments until now. I saw the Bulls squad the other day and was struck with how many wings they have. Also Anton Leonard have retired so the will need a backup No 8.
The time he spent in the wing won’t be wasted since it would have taught him new lines of running that would be usefull in broken play. A 8′th man that runs like a wing. There is a match winner.
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 12:31 pm
Methos- Gecko
We have such a 8 – only problem is – he is not tall enough for Mr White
His mom called/calls him Ryno- in the Free State he is called yster
, but then he is often confused with a couple of other guys yet to get a green blazer, like Barend etc
27 Jan 2006, 12:35 pm
gecko,
I was referring to Mametsa as a winger that has proved himself at CC and S12 level, compared to Chavanga, who became a Bok before proving himself. At this moment i rate Ndugane higher than Chavanga as he he proved himself and scored some spectacular tries against decent international opposition.
27 Jan 2006, 12:40 pm
OO,
Ek stem. Met 2 goeie slotte en Burger het ons nie werklik n lang 8 nodig nie. Ryno sal nooit die Bokspan in die steek laat nie.
Methos,
onthou jy toe John Williams in n S12/10 wedstryd vir joost op vleuel gekies het en toe hardloop hy die kak uit hulle uit?
27 Jan 2006, 12:45 pm
Stan
Nope. Onthou nie daai een nie. Op daai stadium nig in die Noord Kaap gebly. Net enjins gehad wat krag opwek. Hulle is eers aangesit as dit donker is.
Ek en my broer het maar elke Saterdag middag op die gras rugby of krieket gespeel pleks daarvan om dit te kyk.
Cheers
27 Jan 2006, 13:06 pm
stan – I remember the incident, but I can’t say i recall it being a success…
27 Jan 2006, 13:09 pm
I do recall Joost replacing Chester (when concussed) against England in’94 at Newlands and having a run down the townline in the move that lead to Andre Joubert’s try.
27 Jan 2006, 13:10 pm
Robd,
That was out of desperation and need…
27 Jan 2006, 13:56 pm
I remember that Gecko, that was in his younger days, when he still had a bit of speed.
27 Jan 2006, 13:57 pm
I am glad Ashwin got through a game [or part thereof] unscathed. He was definately the SA player of the 2003 World Cup, only hope these injuries havent slowed him down.
27 Jan 2006, 15:26 pm
Craig – to be honest I thought Big Joe was our best player in that tournament. The moment we lost him for the quarter final, I knew any faint hope we had of winning had evaporated!
27 Jan 2006, 15:49 pm
Zinto – That backline is too light. Nokwe, Frolick will get destroyed by England and the likes.
And Jaque Fourie is the most creative player in the BOK backline. I would rather this backline
15. Fourie
14. Willemse/Paulse
13. Joubert
12. JDV
11. Habana
10. Bosman(Couple of years experience)
27 Jan 2006, 19:02 pm
And I thought the brave comeback attempt of Willemese was the thread’s topic?
End of last year I read that his future hanged in the balance according to the surgeon but no further news, so if we ignor the latest mumble jumble, question is: is Willemse is fully match fit? did he make a full recovery/
28 Jan 2006, 06:32 am
leeanthonyw- you say nokwe is too light? his bigger than paulse…
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