Leave Habana on the wing
8 May 2006
Jake White is toying with the idea of Bryan Habana as a centre. NO JAKE. Leave him on the wing.
The Rapport newspaper, following an interview with White, speculated that a Habana move infield was on the cards to give the Bok backline more creativity. Hopefully White was throwing a bit of bait and isn’t serious. If ever we needed reminding of just who should be playing at No 13 for the Springboks Jaque Fourie reinforced the view that he is as good as any outside centre in the game.
When White played Jean de Villiers and Fourie as his test midfield combination, they were comfortably the best option we have seen in Bok rugby for some time.
There seems a reluctance to play our best players in their best positions. And it is ridiculous. The Cats wasted Fourie on the wing for much of the Super 14 and the Stormers also sent De Villiers back to the wing to accommodate De Wet Barry at inside centre.
De Villiers is our most creative inside back and it is time he is entrusted unreservedly with this role. Outside of him Fourie provides the perfect foil. Shifting Habana infield would negate his impact. He needs space and his strength is his finishing and not his creativity. To borrow from soccer to emphasise the point, we don’t need to turn one of the best strikers into a decent midfielder.
If Habana is to be moved from the wing, then the position to give him a run at is fullback. He has a good kicking game, he understands defence and his pace will be maximised and not stifled if wearing No 15.
Marius Joubert showed he is trading on yesterday’s headlines against the Sharks, while Barry was honest without ever being influential in the final 10 minute flurry when the Stormers could not create anything to break down the Sharks defence.
Of the other midfielders on display Ronnie Cooke is an exciting prospect at No 13, but he is not better than what’s there at the moment (read Fourie) and Brad Barrit has something special about his play as an inside centre option.
But to shift Habana now would be dangerous and White would be making the same mistake John Hart made when he moved Christian Cullen from fullback to wing and then to centre for the 1999 World Cup. Cullen was not bad at centre, but he would have been so much better at fullback. The same applies to Habana. He would never disappoint playing at No 13, but he would not be the factor he is at No 11.
Keep your best finisher on the wing Jake.
191 Comments
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8 May 2006, 09:19 am
At sheer excitement at Jake’s new spirit of adventure, I’ve thought up a new adventurous Bok selection.
A more adventurous Springbok selection
Jake White’s comments to the Rapport about things he would like to try made me very excited. He talked about trying Habana at centre. So I thought based on that and two more matches, I’d propose a slightly more adventurous Springbok selection than my last.
Here’s my second selection with second choices in brackets.
First Choice Second Choice
1. JD Moller – Stormers [Lawrence Sephaka - Cats]
2. John Smit – Sharks [Schalk Brits - Stormers]
3. BJ Botha – Sharks [Eddie Andrews - Stormers]
4. Bakkies Botha – Bulls [Johan Ackerman - Sharks]
5. Victor Matfield – Bulls [Ross Skeate - Stormers]
6. Luke Watson – Stormers [AJ Venter - Cats]
7. Schalk Burger – Stormers [Juan Smith - Cheetahs]
8. Pedrie Wannenberg – Bulls [Joe van Niekerk - Stormers]
9. Ruan Pienaar – Sharks [Fourie du Preez - Bulls]
10. Jaco van der Westhuyzen – Bulls [Meyer Bosman - Cheetahs]
11. JP Pietersen – Sharks [Odwa Ndungane - Sharks]
12. Jaque Fourie – Cats [De Wet Barry - Stormers]
13. Bryan Habana – Bulls [JP Nel - Bulls]
14. Akona Ndungane – Bulls [Giscard Pieters - Cheetahs]
15. Percival Montgomery – Sharks [Bevin Fortuin - Cheetahs]
So this is based on an entirely different logic to my last selection which tried to mix Jake’s policy of selecting the incumbent and then thinking of form.
My changes start with selecting Schalk Brits ahead of Gary Botha as backup to John Smit. This is a selction based on sheer excitement value – I agree with Jake that Brits needs to firm up on his basics, specifically his lineout throwing.
My next change brings AJ Venter in as a loose forward backup. My loose forward backup don’t correspond directly to where I’d play them. I would clearly not play AJ on the open side, but with Luke Watson and Schalk Burger in the starting line up and both possible opensiders, a number of possible combinations are possible – including picking either of Luke or Schalk as the starting opensider with Juan Smith or AJ as the closed side flank.
After being delighted that Jake would consider Habana as a center, that has made selecting the rest of the backline a bit difficult. Habana is an outside centre, so finding him a partner means a rejig or dropping Jaque Fourie. The latter cannot happen, and something about Jaque Fourie at inside centre and Habana at outside centre is very exciting. Bringing Habana in at centre means we would need a new left wing. In the spirit of being adventurous, I think picking JP Pietersen has tonnes of potential and is a pick for the future. So I’ve picked him. There is a real problem as backup left wing – no one outside of Habana and Pietersen has shown international class. So I’ll assume that Odwa Ndungane can handle the switch – as I did in my initial selection.
Moving Jaque Fourie inside, has meant that I’ve relegated De Wet Barry to the bench, dropping Wynand Olivier. I thought Olivier’s performance against the Crusaders (crabbing across the field, etc) was worrying enough to warrant this anyway. I’ve kept JP Nel in the side giving him the benefit of the doubt.
In the spirit of adventure, I’ve dropped Breyton Paulse from my line up and promoted Akona Ndungane. I’ve brought in Giscard Pieters as the form right wing behind Ndungane.
I’ve continued to leave Jean de Villiers out based on his shocking defensive performance at 12 this season and his spoilt brat reaction at being moved to the wing.
Do I think Jake will select anything like this side? No. But it does show how difficult moving Habana into centre will be as a disruption. Exciting though.
8 May 2006, 09:23 am
Capebull@43
I am in fact hoping that non of our teams make the semis. What’s the point? To go over to Canterburry and get smacked by the Saders? And lets not kid ourselves, we will get smacked. This season is now over for us, Jake must have the extra time to pick up the pieces and put them back together. Then I see us having a good 3N’s. It would be good to have a Tah’s Saders final. Let those dudes work right to the end.
8 May 2006, 09:24 am
Storm_saam – i sent you a mail about your postings – please read it and follow the instructions !
8 May 2006, 09:27 am
jake’s backline for the WC:
9. january/fdp
10. percey/jaco/ap
11. snyman
12. jdv
13. habana
14. breyton
15. JF/percy
write it down, frame it, mark my words – looking at what he has done and what he is saying lately this is what it is going to look like.
as for habana, #13 gives him more than enough space if his #10 & #12 is on top of their games – good move in my view, but he must work on his distribution.
8 May 2006, 09:27 am
Ig – you worried you’re going to lose punters?
8 May 2006, 09:28 am
I think it’s worth an experiment to try him at centre against the Scots or even World XV. He didn’t do well with the Bulls at that position but for the Boks he’d have a genuine playmaker like JDV making space for him and it could produce something special.
It could be a disaster but we’ll never know if we don’t give it a try. As Knersboy suggested, play Fourie on the wing and if it goes to ****, swap him and Habana around during the game.
8 May 2006, 09:28 am
May Butch never see a Springbok jersey again.
8 May 2006, 09:32 am
Nah Frazer – just applying the terms and condition equally !
8 May 2006, 09:35 am
Storm, theres no way JW’s gonna leave Januarie out, he was fantastic in the 3N’s last year, in fact I rated him above FDP, Ruan Pienaar should be brought into the training squad, but FDP put serious pressure on him in the Bulls\Sharks match, so he needs more time.
8 May 2006, 09:41 am
Ja,id rather see the investment in Brad Barrit and Bosman at 12 (more future left) than Butch,altho he did well on the weekend in his 1st game back.
8 May 2006, 09:41 am
Indeed PA, we’re forgetting about Snyman. And he’s definately in Jake’s plans.
Gom Storm, what have you done wrong? the dreaded E-mail.
8 May 2006, 09:42 am
IG, terms and condition? I’ve forgotten them, what were they again?
8 May 2006, 09:47 am
Edwill
I agree that Keo has it wrong, butI dont think it is racism that is holding these guys back, it is lack of understanding of the difference between speed and acceleration.
Habana made a name for himself at centre and wing at the Lions. He has acceleration AND top end speed – he is good at scavenging, intercepts and chasing down bombs, and he rus good lines – perfect for centre.
JF made a name for himself at fullback and wing. JF has a better kicking game and a good top end speed (for joining the line from fullback. He is tall and good under the high ball – perfect fro fullback.
If someone like Jean, Bosman or Barry could create the smallest of spaces for Habana to exploit, then nobody could do it better. He has also shown that he can get his hands through the tackle and pass to wings.
Why not put Jacque Fourie at inside centre? He is a playmaker and has a good handoff, and god defence is essential at inside centre, as is a big boy…
8 May 2006, 09:47 am
I agree on Januarie last season – this season he’s been terrible. Looks unfit and slow.
I know Jake White will go with Jean div. Hopefully he’ll get the best out of him. But he was seriously **** there for the Stormers.
8 May 2006, 09:47 am
http://www.keo.co.za/terms-and-conditions-of-use-for-wwwkeocoza/
Leave Habana on the wing JF is hitting form and with a decent ten inside of JvD – they will be back to their best !
8 May 2006, 09:49 am
Sorry: there=inside centre
8 May 2006, 09:49 am
Wicked – because JF runs better lines of his inside centre than anyone else in this country.
8 May 2006, 09:51 am
sorry – of = off (better lines off…)
8 May 2006, 09:52 am
we will see about butch, u okes write him off but he has just come back, why dont we give him a chance first. remember, he was jakes forst pick when he took over.
8 May 2006, 09:55 am
Butch is shithouse, he is not and will never be South Africas flyhalf solution.
8 May 2006, 09:56 am
Yeah I have to say that with JDV and the brilliant JF as our 12&13 there isn’t much space for Jetshoes in the midfield.
8 May 2006, 09:58 am
Don’t get me started on Butch.
I swear that guy’s got problems. He looks to get cheap shots in at every opportunity.
Watch a video of Saturday’s game. He jumped all over Watson and Skeate in the loose, pulled Stormers players out of mauls in a headlock and punched Luke Watson.
Don’t get me wrong, the Sharks were fantastic and deserved to win.
But Butch is a thug. He will cost his teams the game one day and I’d rather that wasn’t when he plays for the Boks.
8 May 2006, 10:01 am
Agree, agree, agree!!!! Habana also can’t tackle for s**t. I would actaully leave him out of the Boks until he can prove he can do anything else than get intercept try’s. Fourie is KING!!!! My midfield would be De Villiers and Fourie. But only if Jean can also take the same tackle lessons as Habana. By the way… CATS WON!!!!!!
8 May 2006, 10:04 am
If Jean de Villiers was a better defender by all means play him at 12.With a defensive liability in the flyhalf channel Jean will struggle at 12. If a flyhalf like Butch James plays then de Villiers is the answer.
8 May 2006, 10:06 am
Don’t think that’s going to be a good idea. Leave him on the wing. He’s made a name for himself there. Fourie and De Villiers are our best centres at the moment. Fourie realy impressed me the last couple of games. He’s strong and he’s running straight. Barry needs a break from rugby , he’s no good anymore. Jake is going to sit with a alot of tallent and i hope his going to pic the best players available. We got lots of good forward players aswell as backline players.
8 May 2006, 10:07 am
Edwil is a tosser.
Jaque Fourie at center for the Boks.
Habana at center for the Bulls.
8 May 2006, 10:08 am
I think Butch has a lot to offer.
In 2004 he was prob the best 10 in the Super 12 and was playing some cracking rugby. He was, shock,horror, using his arms and was pulling off some huuuuuge tackles. His goal kicking was very good and his distribution top notch.
He has potential.
8 May 2006, 10:08 am
KEO!
I do believe that Habana would do quite well @ centre, but I do agree with you that the best bok side would have fourie and devilliers @ centre, they are by far our most talented pairing, all of you old die hard stormers fans should take your blinkers off, barry and joubert’s time has come to an end, they were very good and they had a nice run together, but there are quite a few players who offer a lot more than them now! Deal with it!!!
As far as Jean de villiers, Keo I don’t know if you have heard the same things as I have but word out there is that the stormers are not a happy team (political nonsense amongst the players/coaches I don’t know and don’t really care) but I can see on Jeans face in the game as well as some of the other players, they are not happy and it goes further that just losing a lot of games. Jean was very irritated on the field on Saturday, and his comments about equating his shift to the wing the same as being dropped were profound………players don’t normally make comments like that especially not to the media…something is up @ newlands…
so I agree he hasn’t had his best season but I know that when I play and im low on confidence and my head is not in the right place I play ****!!! simple as that..
So Keo do you think Jake is gonna give us all reason to pull our hair out and select barry and joubert at centre for quite a few games this year so that we can all watch the backline crash up channel one all day and we can scrape out couple of wins because our pack is really brilliant!!
By the way watch closely barry is starting to slip more and more tackles, John Smit bounced his *** on Saturday and him and Joubert were outplayed by two youngsters just starting out in the big time.
8 May 2006, 10:10 am
BlUECAP, but look what happened to FDP on Friday. He was a plonker.
FDP never put Ruan under pressure, the bulls pack did.No srummie is good behind a retreating pack.
8 May 2006, 10:13 am
Keo is missing the point. Monty is over it and Jake needs a 15 for the WC.
Fourie at 15, Habana at 13 and then please the gov by propping up the black quota on (yes, you guessed it) the wing.
Moving Haban is in the best interest of the backline oveall, it will make it stronger with the void left by over-the-hill Monty.
8 May 2006, 10:16 am
Hats off to one young Bradley Barritt on Saturday,this youngster plays the type of game at 12 I love to watch.A great defender and fantastic hands coupled with great vision.This kid will hopefully continue to grow and perhaps in a few seasons make the jersey his own.At 19 let him play CC and Super rugby and who knows where he might go.I hope it is to the top.For now Jacques Fourie is the definite form centre and I hope Jean de Villiers will up his game when in Green and Gold,it has not been a great season for him,there are a number of reasons for this I am sure.Habana should make the wing position his own he has everything to be a Springbok great and I have no doubt he could play centre too,but we don’t have a lot of quality wingers at present and this is where Bryan is needed.
8 May 2006, 10:18 am
BadBoy, for someone who is over the hill percy has done damn well in this years super 14.
but yeah, maybe 2007 is a bit far away. on current form though he is the best we have.
agreed rastafox, barit will go damn far and cooke is also really good.
8 May 2006, 10:19 am
Rick West, I am a Stormers supporter and like every Stormers supporter, NO ONE SUPPORTS BARRY.
Or Niel de Kock for that matter. Everything he does is a faak up.
8 May 2006, 10:20 am
Kners would love to see Barritt and Cooke as a pairing in an A game or something like that.They are fantastically exciting prospects.
8 May 2006, 10:24 am
Speaking of Faak ups, does anyone remember that SABC news presenter who was going over results in the FA cup one year and when he read “FA cup” on the teleprompter, he actually pronounced it “the FAAC UP”. Classic bit of SA television history. Still makes me chuckle.
8 May 2006, 10:24 am
apart from the ellis game last year in the 3N, i am struggling to remember when last jean impressed?
fourie, definately, this guy is by far probably the most professional player in the Super competition this year as far as backline players go.
he goes out and gets the job done, and he does it bloody well.
8 May 2006, 10:27 am
Pissant – I agree re Fourie. You’re also right about JDV. The kid has so much potential though. I’m sure a good coach like JW will get more out of him. Let’s face it, his current coach is kak.
8 May 2006, 10:28 am
agreed rasta. i am not all doom and gloom after this years super 14. i dunno why everyone stresses, we are always kak, every year.
but this year i feel there are positives. our forwards are performing. all the sa super 14 teams did relatively well in the forwards. imagine the combination of the sharks front row, the bulls locks and the stormers loosies.
watson has to get a go in the bok jersey. jake should respect this oke, he never complained or threatened to play overseas etc etc, he just said “well then i will play harder” and he did.
8 May 2006, 10:32 am
Knersboy – re Watson – I totally agree. I wasn’t convinced before this season, but in a very kak Stormers side this year, he has proven himself in every match he’s played. I’d rather he were in the squad than either J Cronje or Van Heerden. I reckon he’d also be an ideal backup skipper.
8 May 2006, 10:34 am
I am glad that it is not just me that sees some light.There is a huge ammount of young talent coming through and bar one or two results most games went to the wire.Only one of our sides had a long standing experienced coach and two of our teams were virtually new selections.The Sharks impressed by playing rugby as I believe it should be.The Cats I’m sure would have done better if their coach was in anyway good enough his selections have been baffling.The Cheetahs are a hugely inexperienced side and the Stormers let themselves down a bit.It has been hard and competitive this season and I for one have enjoyed most of it.
8 May 2006, 10:37 am
i dont think you should be so quick to write off trying a new combination. Barry and Habana would make a helluva midfield. Big fan of Fourie at 13, but he and JdV are also make awesome wings.
Always liked the idea of Barry and Habana, why dont we give it a go, if it doesn’t work then JdV and Fourie are worldclass.
8 May 2006, 10:40 am
Players that I feel have done their best to play their way out of the Bokke:
Jacque Cronje,Marius Joubert,Tonderai Chavangha, Lawrence Sephaka,Albert v/d Bergh and Solly Tiyabilika.Due to injury or bad form I feel these players have not merited selection.
Those who must be knocking:
Ruan Pienaar,Jacques Botes and BJ Botha from the Sharks.
Luke Watson,JD Moller,Andries Bekker and Schalk Brits from the Stormers.
Ernst Joubert of the Cats.
Akona Ndungane and JP Nel from the Bulls.
Ronnie Cooke,Tiaan Liebenberg and Barend Pieterse from the Cheetahs.
There are others that have been poor or excellent and I’m sure will agree and others not.
This is merely my little opinion
8 May 2006, 10:49 am
Habana should stay on wing.
If you have the world’s best kine out jumper, but the hooker can’t throw in, you dont make the jumper hooker now do you. Two wrongs doesn’t make a right.
If Habana played for say the crusaders or any of the teams who plays exciting running rugby, can you just imagine how many tries he would have scored?
Leave him on wing and sort out the cause of the problem.
8 May 2006, 10:52 am
Agreed Blouste
It’s like the Crusaders suddenly playing Rico Gear at flyhalf so he can score more tries!!!
8 May 2006, 11:00 am
rastafox/blouste,
what are you okes talking about Habana used to play outside center? Its his favoured position.
8 May 2006, 11:04 am
Huh ?
Why is it that a ref can blow a penalty with his back to a maul and still get it right, but not award a simple try without asking the television ref if it was indeed a try ?
Huh ?
8 May 2006, 11:05 am
huh??? indeed
cab
read earlier post we need Bryan on the wing,we are thin in this department!!
8 May 2006, 11:06 am
you right there cab. he played 13 for the lions and was awesome. he totally outplayed DWB and MJ that year. he played all his senior rugby at 13…
8 May 2006, 11:08 am
Cab
I think some guys thought Brian started playing rugby against the Poms at twickers. They dont seem to have seen him before his ‘trail and intro’ to the boks at wing.
Jake as just been conservative in wanting to have Barry and MJ at centers,and then when MJ was injured he found Fourie…..he also strted JdV at wing i beleive but most screamed for him to come in closer.
I dont understand what people miss but ive seen Habana do some amazing tackles ,filed high balls and when quiet on attack has been solid with occasional misses on defence. Ive also seen him be incredibly creative and able in a backline esp when he was a no 13.If anything he has been worjked out and is limited at wing,not center…..he is deaaling with very litttle space against the line often and is targetted.
Fourie needs a backup ,who’se it gonna be?
8 May 2006, 11:09 am
And last year everybody cried foul and “black wing syndrome” when Heineke M put him on the wing….
What am I missing here??
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