Eloff to decide on Lions job
16 May 2006
South African U19 coach Eugene Eloff has been offered the Lions coaching job in place of Frans Ludeke.
This is the decision taken by the Golden Lions board following a mammoth meeting at Lions HQ last night. It is not yet confirmed that Eloff will accept the proposal, but he is definitely considering the offer.
Eloff is currently in talks with Lions bosses at Ellis Park as they attempt to thrash out an agreement. However, Corrie Pypers – former Transvaal captain (1978 -1980), current chairman of the Lions’ Old Boys Trust and close friend of Eloff – says Loffie will not take the job if Ludeke is still involved in the union in any way.
Ludeke is apparently pencilled in as the new GLRU Director of Coaching, which would effectively make him Eloff’s boss. “There is no way Loffie will work with Frans as his boss. I just don’t see that happening,” Pypers told keo.co.za.
“He will only accept the position if certain non-negotiables are taken care of. The Lions need to meet his demands or he will not take the job, it’s as simple as that.” Those non-negotiables include being able to appoint his own assistants and management team as well as being in control of contracting players for the team.
Eloff is known to favour former Springbok lock Ian MacDonald as his right hand man. The Lions may be in a sticky situation. If they are serious about appointing Eloff, Ludeke is the obvious sacrifice. But it is a sacrifice that could cost the union as much as R7-million. Ludeke is sure to demand a payout of his five-year contract if he is dismissed.
Whether the Lions can afford to pay that kind of money is highly unlikely and a complete waste anyway. The men that need to answer for that are CEO Andy Turner and president Jannie Ferreira. That they allowed Ludeke to sign a five-year deal without having produced any results is, well…ludicrous.
Keo.co.za will bring you the outcome of the talks between the Lions and Eloff later today.
By Andrew Hollely
93 Comments
16 May 2006, 11:51 am
At last!!!!
16 May 2006, 11:54 am
hmmmm
16 May 2006, 11:55 am
Kan iemand my se wat van Blikkies Eastwoods Groenewald en Oom Rudi Joubert geword het?
16 May 2006, 11:57 am
Perhaps the first bit of the R7 bar could come from Turner & Ferreira’s bonusses. If they want to fire Ludeke because he didn’t do his job, perhaps they should look at who was involved with the contracts andget them the hell out of there as well.
If Ludeke was even just a bit of a man he would step down. He is basically stealing from the GLRU.
16 May 2006, 11:57 am
Jeeez, Turner and Ferreira need to sit down and take a long look at themselves- their corporate governance borders on negligent or reckless! They should pay that back out of their personal funds!! Only personal liaility for CRAPPY corporate governance will actually get these idiots off their asses (or the golf courses) and thinking about what they are doing!
Have they never heard of performance clauses?
16 May 2006, 11:58 am
Eloff has my full support. I don’t blame him for taking this stance. He must have full control else it will be a renaming of posts only. I was hoping for more drastic measures but let’s wait and see what happens during the rest of the day.
16 May 2006, 11:59 am
Hilarious, they want to appoint a bloke who’s team has just been hammered in the U19 championship.
This guy in turn wants to appoint Ian McDonald as his assistant. Ha ha ha.
All die repect to McDonald – he was a fantastic rugby player but go and ask his teammates from Transvaal about his rugby acumen and intelligence. Ha ha ha ha.
So glad I’m not a Lions supporter.
16 May 2006, 12:02 pm
Uhm Train, ever thought about it that this years u/19 team was just ****?
16 May 2006, 12:05 pm
Train, you are derailed. Eloff was handed a pathetic squad that will loose against the Lions Craven Week team. Can’t judge a man on that. It cannot be expected from a coach to make thoroughbreds from mules in two weeks. Look at the two years before this and judge him on that.
16 May 2006, 12:07 pm
And mules they where indeed
16 May 2006, 12:10 pm
Eloff , please go to the Stormers.
16 May 2006, 12:12 pm
Katesnor
Moet nie veralgemeen nie. Nie almal was pateties nie. Geen span gaan suksesvol wees as hulle net 2weke geoefen het nie. Die ander spanne was net soveel beter voorberei. Nie die afrigter of die spelers se skuld nie. Gee toe, ons voorspelers was nie groot en sterk genoeg nie.
16 May 2006, 12:12 pm
Loffie can only better the “katsies” performance.
Good thing to get rid of Ludicrous
16 May 2006, 12:13 pm
This stance of Eloff confirms what we expected all along – that the two coaches never got along – and then people ask why the Lions didn’t perform as expected. The cat is out of the bag at last. Now we can only hope the Cats will get out its bag – to be shot on the spot … new coach, new name.
16 May 2006, 12:14 pm
new players….
16 May 2006, 12:18 pm
How could they ever not have put a performance clause in Ludeke’s contract? Im baffeled. Someone dropped the ball big time. Thats a costly mistake!
16 May 2006, 12:19 pm
phoeboe, daar was enkelinge wat nie sleg was nie maar as ‘n geheel was die squad pateties. Dis nie veralgemening aan my kant nie – die resultate spreek vanself.
16 May 2006, 12:22 pm
kwensie, yes new players – or older players from somewhere else – is needed. It will cost big bucks but I’m sure they can find it in the City of Gold.
16 May 2006, 12:23 pm
They should just pay out Ludeke and learn from their mistakes. Again this calls for a rugby director in SA and Mallet is the only man for the job!!
16 May 2006, 12:26 pm
leeanthonyw, Mallet?! Make the whole of SA perform like the Stormers? Jeepers I’m not so sure it’s a good suggestion.
16 May 2006, 12:31 pm
Ludeke does not deserve a payout of his contract.
16 May 2006, 12:35 pm
Unfortunately we don’t know for sure if this R7m thing is for real. If so, then the GLRU can give Ludeke any job to do and if he doesn’t like it he can resign. If there is a will there is a way – but is there a really a will – that will do whatever it takes to correct things? I doubt it. Chances are the GLRU will rather sacrifice Eloff than Ludeke – especially if it is true that R7m will be lost to the union if Ludeke is cut loose. They will hunt for a coach that is willing to play second fiddle to Ludeke and save the R7m.
I’m very concerned about Eloff’s choice of MacDonald however. I prefer Balie Swart.
16 May 2006, 12:43 pm
For heavens sake!!! Loffie hang on there mate, I’m sending over some of my ‘Southern’ mates to go have a word with Fransie… I think he will come around to my preposal that he should actaully pay back the GLRU for the last few years of service. When that’s done, the job is yours!
16 May 2006, 12:44 pm
Based on this information i think the administators should be fired first. Then the new administators should go looking for a coach with at least super rugby experience.
16 May 2006, 12:45 pm
You shouldnt read too much into eloffs u19 there was a lot of political selections! Last years team 2005 Brad Barrit was overlooked for Jowayne Van Wyk look where Barrit is now and for some reason Waylon Murray was left out 2!
And this years team Morne Jooste the son of the Chief of Boks selectors was included! Wat also happened to all those monument boys – Byron Godfrey, Johan van Rensburg, Justin St Jerry and Ghaliel Markus!
16 May 2006, 12:51 pm
Mc Donald was ‘n flank nie ‘n slot nie!!!!
Hy mag dalk nie bright wees nie maar het al bietjie sikses behaal as afrigter. Kan in elk geval nie K2Kker wees as wat hulle nou het nie.
laat Ludeke maar vir JW gaan help, hulle weet ewe veel van rugby.
16 May 2006, 12:57 pm
yes, I also registered just to be able to add that MacDonald was a flanker and not a lock! (But I see Myler beat me to it!)
16 May 2006, 13:00 pm
If Eloff takes the job and makes a success of it we the fans will insist that Ellis Park be renamed to e-Lofftus
16 May 2006, 13:05 pm
Loffie seems to have what it takes…I hope they can work something out so that he takes the job today. We also need to scout for some new players…
16 May 2006, 13:06 pm
Walter, what happened to you?! You’ve been active on this site way back and then you vanished? How’s your website going?
16 May 2006, 13:08 pm
Somehow I lost my login details and wasn’t able to post….but I was still here…My site is going okay, click on my name to have a look…
16 May 2006, 13:22 pm
This story is going from the ridiculous to the sublime…
16 May 2006, 13:23 pm
Walter, I see Keo.co.za is not on your links table. Wonder why?
16 May 2006, 13:26 pm
Train, sorry buddy but you are WAY of the mark. Loffie is an excellent coach, who was responsible for our win in the under 19 tournament last year. He has earned his stripes in the age groups and certainly deserves some recognition.
I also applaud his stance. A coach is judged on his results. This is only fair if he can have a say in his assistants and the squad he is given. Otherwise he is on a hiding to nothing. All the luck to him, let`s hope for the Lion`s sake that he gets what he wants.
16 May 2006, 13:30 pm
Andre_WP, I agree brother!
We`ll take Loffie in exchange for Fester and gary Glitter!
16 May 2006, 13:32 pm
Katsesnor, probably because keo hasn’t got a link to my site! LOL!
16 May 2006, 13:55 pm
Keo, Ig,
Please place a banner for ############### on your website. Walter will then place a banner for Keo.co.za on his. Let this War of the Links end now!
Seriously, maybe a page with links to Muppets’ sites on Keo.co.za have merit. It will make this site more personal and “tribal”.
16 May 2006, 13:59 pm
Stormers need a new coach , i hope they get someone soon. Who’s coaching Province for the CC this year ? Paarwater ?
16 May 2006, 14:00 pm
How about canning both and bringing in an international fella, John Mitchell is out of the question, but i would think with that sort of money we could get a decent skills coach from Nz or Oz.
Also, lets buy some proper players for next season.
16 May 2006, 14:04 pm
cab – they tried with Lauire Mains. He got them places but the classic – player revolt and his unwillingness to heed the need for transformation saw that come to an end. I suspect too mnay closed minds running the ship.
16 May 2006, 14:06 pm
cab, with all the GLRU money “invested” in Australia they should buy the ‘Tahs and ship them over to SA. That will solve the players problem.
BTW Suparugby claims that Eloff’s appointment is a done deal. This site says it isn’t until Ludeke is out. What are we to believe? Andrew?
16 May 2006, 14:11 pm
Katsesnor, it’s clear that it’s not a done deal yet, sounds like the official announcement will be Wednesday, guess they are still negotiating the deal…
16 May 2006, 14:14 pm
Ig, ya and Laurie was a our best since Kitch. As you say, not the sharpest, but that Turner looked like he had a good plan in place.
kats, yes, i don’t think unions like the GLRU should be investing overseas, they should be investing in rugby in this country.
16 May 2006, 14:31 pm
Can someone unswear a simple question?
Why the same players were scoring loads of trys when Elof was a lion’s backline coach and the same players can’t do anything right for the Cats under springbok backline coach?
16 May 2006, 14:36 pm
Could you name those players please ciccino?
16 May 2006, 14:36 pm
I can do a lot of swearing after watching the Cats this season! LOL!
16 May 2006, 14:40 pm
I’ll nail my colours to the wall now:
Eloff won’t make it as a senior coach – and this is a inside view.
Sorry.
16 May 2006, 14:41 pm
Isn’t Loffie the idiot who made SPIES wing?
Lions fans your bad years far from over.
Loffie’s reign will end in a flood of tears as well..
Consider this: Is’nt the fact that when we won the u19 wc last year it was because of great players and when Lof had to come up with the goods this year with an ordinary side he was found lacking?
16 May 2006, 14:41 pm
Staal
What are you saying, that he will get the job and fail, or that he won’t get the job?
16 May 2006, 14:45 pm
Could someone please explain to me the difference between having Ludicrous standing around doing nothing at the GLRU and paying him his 7 million to go away and do nothing?
The money is already wasted. They just have accept the loss and move on.
16 May 2006, 14:46 pm
Loffie and the Lions!!
Sounds a bit like a Disney title.
16 May 2006, 14:50 pm
I don’t think it’s quite R7 million though, more like R5.5 million, I read somewhere he’s getting about R100k per month, and of the 60 months (5 year) contract 55 months will be left at the end of May…
16 May 2006, 14:52 pm
Rastfox the perhaps
“Moffie and the Mountain goats”
would also prove succesful
16 May 2006, 14:58 pm
Look on the bright side lions supporters, IT CANT GET WORSE that the way it is at present !!!!
16 May 2006, 15:01 pm
niels, Loffie wasnt just found lacking at the u/19 wc he came ******* 8th.
8th! I didnt even know 8 teams played.
8TH!!!!!!
16 May 2006, 15:02 pm
Sure Vinnie,
one of the Lions Team during CC 2005
1. Pietman van Niekerk
2. Lukas van Biljon
3. Marius Hurter
4. Trevor Hall
5. Willem Stoltz
6. Gerhard Vosloo
7. Wikus van Heerden
8. Cobus Grobbelaar
9. Nic Eyre
10. Andre Pretorius
11. Jorrie Muller
12. Wayne Julies
13. Jaque Fourie
14. Wylie Human
15. Conrad Jantjes
Replacements
16. Schalk Brits
17. Lawrence Sephaka
18. Kleinjan Tromp
19. Ernst Joubert
20. Jano Vermaak
21. Nel Fourie
22. Grant Esterhuizen
Cats Team last week
1. Lawrence Sephaka
2. Delarey Du Preez
3. Albertus Johannes Smit
4. Altenstadt Hulme
5. Willem Stoltz
6. Cobus Grobbelaar
7. Trevor Hall
8. Ernst Joubert
9. Jano Vermaak
10. André Pretorius
11. Grant Esterhuizen
12. Wayne Julies
13. Jaque Fourie
14. Wylie Human
15. Conrad Jantjes
Replacements
16. Willie Wepener
17. Pietman van Niekerk
18. Marius Hurter
19. Gerhard Vosloo
20. Russell Winter
21. Enrico Januarie
22. Doppies la Grange
not much different
16 May 2006, 15:04 pm
tompig, off course it could have been a lot worse! The Stormers could have ended at the top of the S14 log! LOL!
16 May 2006, 15:05 pm
yes Vinnie, U19 came 8th, but I’d rather blame team selection. Sa players looked phisicaly inferior to other sides.
16 May 2006, 15:10 pm
well done Walter, but at least we can say an SA side got there. At this stage I honestly couldn’t care if it were the spears. I am tired of all SA sides getting hammered year after year. How about starting a SA all combined teams like the brumbies, just for 1 season. Depending on the management, probably still get hammered….
16 May 2006, 15:13 pm
I guess with two teams ending 4th and 5th this must be one of our better years…but the Cats have been in the bottom 2 for the past 5 seasons I thing, which is scary if you are a Cats supporter
16 May 2006, 15:16 pm
thank god not, not that stormers are much better. Both teams were digging for scraps this year. I remember the opening game, stormers vs cats. Stormers guys were very happy thinking this could be the year we reach the semis……little did we know.
16 May 2006, 15:23 pm
No, luckily I went to the pre-season games where the Bulls B side beat the Cats A side, so I didn’t really have any expectations for us for the season after that…LOL!
16 May 2006, 15:23 pm
I suspect the rot in Lions rugby goes deeper than Ludicrous, though he obviously must go. Whoever negotiated and signed his contract should go too.
Sure R5 million+ is major tom, but how much revenue will continue to be lost if the fans can’t be bothered to pitch for Ellis Park games.
Bring out the new broom and get rid of this Cats branding too. It is now associated with chronic failure.
16 May 2006, 15:26 pm
walter 49 ,
won’t make it as coach. But seems to me the Lions differ. But then again they contracted Frans.
I don’t want to be negative about Loffie – but watch this space.
16 May 2006, 15:30 pm
Take the job, but you will have no excuses as Ludeke used it all up. If you are looking for an assistant, I am willing and able to lend a helping hand to the LIONS – more masculine.
16 May 2006, 15:31 pm
I guess the management at Ellis Park realised when they made the sums that…
13th on the log = very small crowds at the games = big losses for the union
So even though they wanted to stick with FL (?!) they can’t…
16 May 2006, 15:40 pm
Was Francois Pienaar in die meeting? Ek se skiet daai man so paar krummels. Hy het experience – Saracens.
16 May 2006, 15:42 pm
Anyone thought of buying/hiring the Saders assistant coach Vern Cotter, he would work wonders with this team. Saders produce great players and coaches.
Assistant coaches that were at the saders:
Colin Cooper – Canes
Peter Sloane – Blues 2005
Wayne Smith – AB’s
Steve Hansen – AB’s
Maybe Vern Cotter is the next big thing in caching rugby in SA, just an idea!!!
16 May 2006, 15:46 pm
I don’t think the problem is just with the coach, we obviously need to scout for some class players as well, some of the current bunch showed that they don’t have what it takes.
16 May 2006, 15:46 pm
It will probably not help much getting rid of Ludeke only. The top dogs must go and until that happens the Lions/Cats stand a good chance of remaining at the bottom of the logs. The Cats’ failure this season was caused by a mix of things including management, coaching and the players themselves. In a way it is unfair to single Ludeke out – and I feel for the man – and maybe it’s just right that he should demand his R5m bucks for taking the fall that some higher up should have taken as well. Unbelieveable that a once strong and healthy union under Luyt can fall apart like this in such a short time. The rot started when Van Rooyen took over. Luyt must feel vindicated I’m sure.
16 May 2006, 15:50 pm
Corrie Pypers ,ex player, Alberton and TVL capt, Card carrying member and speaker of the old KP. Surely the last type of person needed around Ellis Park right now.
I do not like the look of this at all. The mob that is backing Loffie is the last thing the GLRU needs. Surely Loffie can pick his back up staff anyway. Ian McDonald has sucked his way up the ranks at Ellis Park for years now. A failed teacher who has done ‘odd-jobs’ around Ellis Park for years.
When will people realise that the most important talent a coach should have above all else is intelligence. Van Der MacDonald? I do not think so.
I am starting to feel sorry for Ludicrous and also starting to understand some of his problems. Rather him I say than this verkrampte bunch of backstabbing boneheads.
I see things getting worse. My solution. tell Loffie to find employment elsewhere. Do not give Pypers the time of day.
I have said different but in the context of new developments, Stick with Fransie. He is still a decent guy.
BRING IN FOREIGN COACHING BACKUP THAT IS NOT CONCERNED WITH LOCAL POLITICS, ONLY RUGBY.
16 May 2006, 15:50 pm
CSI, brilliant idea. But is he a buddy of Ferreira? Only buddies get jobs at the Golden Ludeke Rugby Union.
16 May 2006, 15:55 pm
Catsenor, I believe Luyt caused the problems. When a dictator leaves, He leaves nothing behind but a civil war to fight for power.
He was not all bad, but his regime is to blame for much of this , despite his ability to make bucks.
Remember that the Cats concept was his. A reflection of his own business empire from Bloem to Joburg. Unworkable and non existant as a realistic entity outside of his own mind and the Boer War.
16 May 2006, 15:56 pm
Rednik,
I agree on MacD. It’s not what the Lions need. The Lions need fresh blood, fresh ideas, prefereably from abroad. Therefore I like CSI:R’s suggestion. But how to get that message across I don’t know. He’ll man I’m sick and tired of waiting for the GLRU to get back on track!
16 May 2006, 16:02 pm
Rednik,
Luyt caused many problems but I don’t buy the idea that in 2006 he is still to blame for all the kak going on at the GLRU. Would Luyt have given Ludeke a five year contract without a performance clause. No way. He would have kicked non-performers out a long time ago. Luyt got results – good results. I’ll take him back any day – with all the bagage that comes with the man. He gave us Lions fans the greatest memories ever. Will there ever be another Lions team like the one who won the 1995 WC
?
16 May 2006, 16:02 pm
Remember if Macdonald gets involved it will be as assistant coach for the forwards…I don’t think a high IQ is needed for that…LOL!
16 May 2006, 16:11 pm
Hi guys!
Anyone from PE?
16 May 2006, 16:12 pm
“PE?” … “Nee, ek bollie gou”
16 May 2006, 16:19 pm
kaballas soek julle alweer ‘n *****?
16 May 2006, 16:21 pm
Forwards have an IQ????????
16 May 2006, 16:27 pm
anyway, you guys are quite brave, have you ever seen how huge Macdonald is? Go tell him he is dumb to his face, I want to see what happens! LOL!
16 May 2006, 16:31 pm
Ja-nee Walter, jy’s reg.
Seen him in the gym a few times. He is the sort of guy you should rather call “Baas”
16 May 2006, 16:36 pm
and let me quickly add that he was always one of my favourite players in his playing days…
16 May 2006, 16:39 pm
Kaballas…
are you desperate or something?
16 May 2006, 17:03 pm
Walter who played number 8 in 1993 with him and Francois?
16 May 2006, 17:09 pm
Walter,
yes, it will not be a great idea to say that in his face, but it doesn’t change the facts. What has he achieved with the VC side? Zero. It really does not bode well for the Lions. I prefer a Balie Swart that knows something of scrumming. Maybe there must be specialists then, one for the loosies, lineouts and general forward play, and one for scrumming. MacD never played in the front row so I wouldn’t trust his opinions on that. Scary realy that a flanker will be allowed to teach a prop to scrum properly! Playing prop is highly specialised. The Lions have a chance now to start right but it seems they are going nowhere.
16 May 2006, 17:10 pm
Rudolph Strauli
16 May 2006, 17:24 pm
No doubt, MacDonald is big and strong and tough, how does this relate to him having the capability to coach a pack of forwards?
Anyway, i PREFER TALKING BEHIND HIS BACK! A genuine hard man. ultimately, I am sensing a further battle emerging, and Ellis Park has had its fair share in recent years. The news of a Ludeke vs Loffie conflict emerging, or the news of a conflict that has always been there does not bode well for on field performance, which is what coaching staff should be focused on while others attend to business and management matters.
The plot thickens.
16 May 2006, 17:26 pm
I also stand to be corrected on the basis that all my info re this issue has come via the pen of KEO. Interesting, but highly unreliable in the sense of accuracy and independant view point.
16 May 2006, 17:28 pm
Deon Lotter at the age of 36 I think it was, Also shoved his head between the arses of Kobus Wiese and Strydom. Had a great retirement season too.
16 May 2006, 18:01 pm
Rednik,
wasn’t Deon Lotter a lock before Wiese became a regular? I remember there was a time that Wiese was in and out of the team because he was … let’s just say … too heavy.
17 May 2006, 05:25 am
Loffie should get the job.At least as an interim coach.Give him a year with the Cats and judge him on the results.
The U – 19 disaster was kind of expected in a way.The squad had a limited time to train abd gel together as a team and it was not Loffie who selected these players.
Dont forget what Loffie has done with previous U-19 teams.He has proved himself already.
17 May 2006, 08:53 am
Lotter was ‘bought’ from WP during the ‘Amateur’ days . Yes he did play lock, probably more than loose forward, Kitch Christie made Kobus fit for the first time in his life! This is my point about Luyt, He was pro when most of the world was’nt. When everybody went pro, People like Luyt’s Lions could not work under the table anymore.
Have your say
You must be logged in to post a comment.