Stofile stuck in past
26 Jul 2007
Keo, in his Independent Newspaper column, asks why Minister of Sport Makhenkesi Stofile is willing to accept the Proteas as representative of a new South Africa, but not the Springboks?
Stofile remains adamant the Springbok World Cup squad does not represent South Africa as a new country.
He said it was proof South African rugby was stuck in the past.
Springbok coach Jake White included one ethnic black African and five coloured players in his World Cup squad of 30 – a number government officials said was not enough.
Rewind a few months to the cricket World Cup. The Proteas receive the following message: “Go out there and represent South Africa with dignity. We believe in you and we will be behind you as you stand toe-to-toe with Australia next week.” Yes, the same Stofile sent this message to a cricket side that did not contain one ethnic black player in the starting XI.
Staying with cricket, government officials and cricket administrators lauded the squad composition ahead of the World Cup. Seven players of colour in 15 was viewed as a dramatic breakthrough for transformation, but only one of those seven players was black African – Makhaya Ntini.
The window-dressing exercise at the cricket World Cup was completed when Roger Telemachus did not play a game, Loots Bosman played in one and the first choice slow bowler Robin Peterson bowled less overs than part-time spinner and captain Graeme Smith.
Prior to the tournament Smith told the media he believed in every player’s ability, but he obviously didn’t, otherwise Peterson would have bowled more. Telemachus did not bowl a ball in the West Indies, Peterson bowled just 72 and Bosman, picked as a batsman, never batted. Cricket’s transformation of the squad was a lie, which the government was willing to embrace.
Transformation in South African rugby since unification in 1991 has been a farce. We all know that, but it does not start with the selection of the national squad. A coach can only choose from the players available and in this light the squad is very representative of South African rugby’s player demographics.
This past weekend only seven ethnic black Africans started in eight premier division Currie Cup sides. Only five of these players are eligible to play for the Boks. When it comes to black African selection White is effectively picking from a pool of less than 10 and not 40 million who make up South Africa’s population.
The government should be condemning South African rugby’s failure to transform and should be demanding change at a domestic level. Instead all the criticism is irrationally levelled at the national squad. Cricket, no better than rugby when it comes to transformation, never feels the wrath of the Sports Minister or his colleagues. Why?
Is it because cricket was traditionally seen as an English sport and rugby as that of the Afrikaner? Does cricket get away with it because of the so-called white liberal association and rugby gets caned because of so-called Afrikaans conservatives?
If South African sport is to be transformed and representative of a new country then the sports ministry’s attitude has to be consistent to all sports, including cricket and soccer.
If Stofile believed so much in a cricket team devoid of black African representation, why can he not believe in a rugby team accused of a similar failing?
The answer could be that he, like rugby, is stuck in the past.
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240 Comments
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26 Jul 2007, 13:27 pm
#96 I love it how odogg can say what he has about “The White” man, and that wont be deemed racism. But if a white guy mentions any term that has “Black” in it, it’s taken as Racism. A sporting team should be chosen on merit, thats it. And odogg you say what has the white man ever done for you, what has this govt. done to help anyone black or white. The top govt. are the only ones that benefit. The poor are still getting poorer. Everyone wants everthing given to them these days, they dont want to work for it.
26 Jul 2007, 13:29 pm
Hello Pietman.
I have been hurting ever since the team was announced. I feel robbed. I feel like the spirit of the country we are trying to build had been robbed. The singular selection of Wyaand Olivier over Waylon Murray and Wayne Julies epitomised all that is wrong in SA Rugby. The right wing has won this battle.
26 Jul 2007, 13:35 pm
You know what?
I think Keo is black.
26 Jul 2007, 13:35 pm
Carefull not to generalize odogg. A hell of a lot of white people are doing fantastic work rebuilding this country…..think about it. If you for some reason do not believe it,it really is your problem if you suffer from tunnel vision.
26 Jul 2007, 13:36 pm
Typical Wobas, typical. Listen, you have zero idea of the conditions we lived in during apartheid so shut your mouth re anything the government has done for us cause you wudnt understand. And regarding your precious merit, is this some kind of scientific measuring instrument that determines nplayer eligibility or is it a White coach or selector making this “merit” call. You cant be judge, jury and excecutioner. Actually dont respond to that cause I doubt you will have the intellect to understand my point.
26 Jul 2007, 13:36 pm
#102 Damn for once we agree on something odogg. Reckon Waylon deserved a shot ahead of Wynand
26 Jul 2007, 13:41 pm
Howzit Kwagga,
I think we agree on alot of things, just the mechanics of it that seem to generate debate.
26 Jul 2007, 13:42 pm
You’re right Odogg,i dont know the conditons of apartheid. I was born mid 80′s & so were my black friends. We cant stand how our forefathers carry on with apartheid. It was a terrible thing that haapend. But we’ll never be able to get past it if the youth of today are made to hate one another coz of what happend. As with Waylon VS Wynand, i agree totally. Waylon shouldve gone, Wynand did nothing to prove he should be there.
26 Jul 2007, 13:47 pm
Wobas, this is whats happen right through the divisions. Its just that its not publicised. Black okes are not being given a fair opportunity to develop, get game time and be groomed into better players. Its sacrilage what happens to these young Black Boys. They put their all into rugby only to be stuffed around and fuqd over by a Rugby administration and media that is intent on keeping the game of Rugby the sole preserve of the White race
26 Jul 2007, 13:52 pm
At the end of WW1 the German Weimar republic was in dissaray – the average German had nothing.
Hitler and the Nazi party came to power and promised to make the German Aryan nation proud and in so doing rebuild Germany.
He started by removing Jews and other non-Aryans from positions of power (INCLUDING SPORTS TEAMS) culminating in 100% Aryan representation at the 1936 Olympics in Germany.
Jews were dispised because they were seen as non-German, and a minority which had way too much economic, social and political power.
I’ve always assumed South Africa to be different in that we all want to make South Africa great, not make blacks or whites great at the expense of the other. That to me was Nelson Mandela’s dream.
Stofile and co obviously don’t agree…..
26 Jul 2007, 14:01 pm
I am going to stick my neck out here and say good on you Odogg except for one thing try not to throw every last ditch of rational perspective out the window, else we might just be in for a spell of Stalinist type revolution.
26 Jul 2007, 14:03 pm
Skopskiet, nothing else will work.
26 Jul 2007, 14:08 pm
Odogg!! please!! cant you see its our goverments failings! Instead of standing up and shouting we demand that you transform they should be doing something proactive.. I also think that WO should not be there.. but im sure right now people In france or England or wherever are debating how Laurence Delialio has made the squad etc only in SA there has to be some underlying race thing.
26 Jul 2007, 14:09 pm
odogg Come to the rugby on Saturday, no right wingers there, except on the pitch!
26 Jul 2007, 14:11 pm
I can understand your feelings of frustration believe me Odogg I know some of what you feel cos even though I have not been one to suffer the dire consequences of the blind perpetrators activities I have been witness to the blindness and watch it with absolute disbelief and amazement still. Nevertheless I would still urge you to still hold some hope and faith in abeyance otherwise the reverse of the pendulum swing may only keep the cycle repeating itself add infinitum, somewhere somehow, somebody must stop the villifying pendulum swinging too and fro.
26 Jul 2007, 14:11 pm
It is a underlying race things when things almost always go against the Black oke.
26 Jul 2007, 14:11 pm
Ek kan dit nie meer vat nie.
I’m gonna jump.
26 Jul 2007, 14:15 pm
Pietman and friends are the true leaders in the field of bridge building, not politicians, nor sports administrators, neither coaches or assistant coaches, its the real pioneers who have thrown down the gauntlet to aristocratic make believe do gooders and have gone out into the trenches and declared war on the atrocities of misrepresentation.
26 Jul 2007, 14:16 pm
Where you gonna jump to Dawn, you got a parachute?
26 Jul 2007, 14:19 pm
115,
Wisdom. mmmmmhhhhh. I hear you.
26 Jul 2007, 14:20 pm
115 agreed
26 Jul 2007, 14:20 pm
Dawn, if you jump, I promise to I’ll catch you.
26 Jul 2007, 14:24 pm
Yep hold faith its just a trick around the corner before the wheel starts turning, the dinosaurs are en route to extinction believe me, the new beginnings will start their course of momentum pretty soon, next it will be to see who can steer the ship of new beginnings on a truly encouraging course and direction.
26 Jul 2007, 14:25 pm
Skunk & Kevin W
take a look at the demographics. Of course there are exceptions
I am not saying that no black players dont play rugby.
Most of the black community play soccer then cricket.
26 Jul 2007, 14:27 pm
odogg,
I’m not a South African. I live in a supposed tolerant society (is there such a thing?)
I would like to think that I don’t have any racial prejudices.
Can you tell me how enforcing quotas and pushing people into positions that their experience doesn’t merit is going to benefit SA in the long run? It’s a country that requires a competitive workforce to survive in the global marketplace. We all have to think about the global market whilst balancing our requirements at home.
Onto rugby, the problems lie at grassroots level. I’m sure there is some institutionalised racism in rugby, the same as there will be in every other walk of life in SA. I’ve seen it and experienced it in my own visits. But racism is a multi edged sword. It is white on black and black on white, it is white on Asian and Asian on white, black on asian and asian on black etc. etc.
Rather than join in the bun fight, wouldn’t you rather rise above it and set the example that will lead South Africa to a successful and prosperous future for all races, creeds and colours that the world so desperately wants South Africa to achieve?
26 Jul 2007, 14:29 pm
125..here here!!
26 Jul 2007, 14:35 pm
ditto 125 & 126
26 Jul 2007, 14:39 pm
Stodders,
Victor Matfield didnt just becme Victor Matfield. It was through development, opportunitites and mentoring that he became world class. Bakkies had a shocker on debut but continued to receive opportunity and grooming until he became world class. The same is not being afforded to Black players of potential. What quotas will do is force administrators and coaches to select Black players. The wise unions will invest money and time to groom and develop these Black players so as to ensure they lose nothing in terms of quality compared to White Players. net result, grooming and development of lack players till they are world class.
26 Jul 2007, 14:46 pm
Coach … where do you live in SA – because there must be a hell of a lot of black cricket clubs in your area.
stodders … we all know it should happen at grassroots level, but there is little finance at grassroots level. The large franchises CANNOT produce players of colour – why – they don’t have to. Living in the EC and the same goes for guys in the WC, we see these players and next thing they have a Bulls or a Sharks jersey on and are afforded little gametime.
cyberscamp … for all your political credentials, i find it strange that you are happy with the current transformation in thegame. But then again, you fought so hard for a country but choose to live in another for … financial gain maybe.
The Spears were the middle ground and the answer to transformation woes… like it or lump it. We will watch the Lions embarrass SA for another year and i feel very little sympathy.
26 Jul 2007, 14:50 pm
118# Well thank you Mr Skopskiet, Sir.
Your kind words are much appreciated.
People don’t usually treat me that politely over here.
Nee, ek waardeer skopskiet. Ek wil graag saamwerk en die verkeerde dinge wat gebeur het help regmaak.
Dis hoekom ek odogg nooi om die ‘struggle’ te skuif na n positiewe uitkyk vorentoe.
Madiba het ons gewys hoe, en hy gaan nie daarvan hou as ons al sy goeie werk en swaarkry in die wiele ry nie.
Kyk daai man se gelukkige gesig toe hy die Wereldbeker omhoog gehou het.
Ek wil Stofile en daai ou ouens so sien weer, al is daar ook 15 swart ouens in die span.
Ek het nie n saak met kleur nie.
26 Jul 2007, 14:51 pm
Odogg, thanks boet.
i really couldn’t believe what people are saying on this! These are the same guys that don’t sing nkosi sikelela at the game but they wanna tell us about national unity! They will always use the same old tired argument against blacks to exclude them from the sport.
Government should no longer leave transformation in the hands of administrators, MAKE IT LAW! Then you will see how many people on this blog will run out of the country to England! If that’s what it takes, SO DAMN BE IT!!!
26 Jul 2007, 14:53 pm
odogg,
I agree with your bottom to top approach. Only when players prove themselves at one level should they be promoted to the next. To do that of course, they need opportunities. On that we agree.
But if a white kid shows more consistency and talent over a non-white one if both have been given the same support and development, the white kid in my book should get the nod. Vice versa, the non-white one should if better.
Every coach will have his favourites because he feels they can carry out his gameplan. But if players, irrespective of their colour, are good enough they will succeed and adapt to differing styles and coaches.
26 Jul 2007, 14:59 pm
Kleur is net n ontduidelike gesig, niemand kan rerig enege iemand se hart duidelik toeken, nou is dit die tyd om kleur en al sy kortkomings uit die venster te gooi vir eeuwaards en altyd. Die game moet stoking kry van onder af soos wat julle daar in Bethlehem en Soweto probeer doen, dis die enigste mannier om die velde te probeer gelyk te maak, ek hoop julle gaan slaag om die ding op die gang te kry en die swaar wiel te begin rerig te laat rol Pietman.
26 Jul 2007, 14:59 pm
Azza 131#
Aagh man, that so naive and yesterday, bro.
That is exactly what shouldn’t happen.
It will get you nowhere.
But, anyway…
26 Jul 2007, 15:00 pm
133# skopskiet
Dankie, ons gaan nie ophou voor ons klaar is nie, glo my.
26 Jul 2007, 15:07 pm
Ek moet nou gaan, voerentoe en aahou tot die saak opgelos is, geluk, totsiens Pietman.
26 Jul 2007, 15:09 pm
skopskiet
Mooi loop.
Loer in daar op daai site en sien hoe ons vorder.
26 Jul 2007, 15:09 pm
Azza go play with your legos and let the grown up people talk!
26 Jul 2007, 15:14 pm
#128 Odogg valid point but am I wrong in saying that the players of colour like eddie andrews and lawrence sephaka etc was identified and given a hell of lot of rope but they just threw it away? Yet a guy like for example Hilton Lobberts is a far better prospect for the future. Question I am asking is simply are the guys in charge identifying the correct players to develop?
26 Jul 2007, 15:14 pm
Coach
It is this simple. You have no idea about what’s going on around you. Give it up.
26 Jul 2007, 15:14 pm
Kwagga
Jis mater.
Is jy al in daar by die ondersteunersgroep?
En Cousin?
26 Jul 2007, 15:16 pm
#141 yes pietta cousin kom na my toe vannad dan gaan ons bietjie opspring. Wou al gisteraand dit doen maar die vrou het heeltemal ander planne gehad.
26 Jul 2007, 15:17 pm
vannad? vanaand
26 Jul 2007, 15:18 pm
Kwagga
Saak is reg
Skunk
You driving down to Margate?
Look out for that guy in the blue suit with horns, ek se!
26 Jul 2007, 15:18 pm
Coach,
quite a few Black Rugby players of Nigerian origin played at the highest level for England – Victor Ubugo for 1, and in American Football – many players of Black origin, so to suggest that Black South Africans are not drawn to Rugby Union is ridiculous. I lived in South Africa when Black Players were not allowed to play Rugby in “white” clubs. Given the opportunity they will succeed. The SA goverment wants to redress the sins of the past before Merit kicks in. I for one think they’re right. They don’t care about one “lost generation” as they’ve had 300 years of lost generations, so you may have to accept bad results for 20 years or so, to achieve the greater good.
26 Jul 2007, 15:20 pm
Stodders, I agree about the White kid stuff but we will have to go through a transitional phase where quotas will force coaches to give opportunities to Black players. In time, once unions are investing as much energy into developing Black talent as they do White talent, what you will find is an equal competition for positions between Black and white players as they wud have received equal opportunity frm the get go and it wud truly be up to who is the better player. As it stands now the White player will on average be better not because of his genetics but simply because he has been given more opportunity, training and development. I just dont understand why people cant understand this. THis is why I paint all WHites with the same conservative brush. ITs really not rocket science and if one cant understand this then the logical conclusion is that one is bias and rascist. You cant merit selection now when one race has received superior opportunity and training. What makes the prolem bigger is that its the same race that decides on who gets to play, who get trained, etc etc. Judge, jury and executioner!
26 Jul 2007, 15:26 pm
Kwagga 139,
Its not only about selecting the right guy. You know being a sports star is a very special position to be in. The pressures are untold unless you have been one. Mentoring, life skills, guidance are huge elements of how a player ultimately turns out. Look at Heyneke Meyers success at the Bulls to see how important this aspect is. The problem is the Black okes are there alone. They have no support, no guidance, no mentoring and at times lke nobody actually gives a fuq. Look what confidence did to someone like Gaffie. Instilling self belief and the mental side of the game is so important. People shouldn’t look at Sephaka and Eddies failures in isolation. What are the factors around these players that led to them falling off the wagon as it were. People just refuse to challenge themselves and their thinking when it comes to race. ITs so much easier to say no Black okes are lazy, they want something for nothing etc etc. Verwoed’s legacy is stronger than ever bru!
26 Jul 2007, 15:31 pm
why are there no black locks?
26 Jul 2007, 15:31 pm
odogg,
you at it again i see – venting your racist spleen at white-skinned south africans because olivier got picked ahead of julies or murray!
if you take the time to read the threads, 95% the white-skinned bloggers also think that olivier shouldn’t have made it. so why get so carried away and emotional.
cool it – you get too hot headed sometimes. when you are cool, you post some very interesting and insightful comments, like the one a month or two back about african cultures and customs which was very informative to us folks.
26 Jul 2007, 15:33 pm
148,
you tell me. I know a few okes that played lock at 1st team level but hey, I guess higher up with selectors, its either wing or nothing.
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