From top dog to underdog
7 Apr 2008
The challenge continues to mount for UCT with rumours Stellenbosch may field several WP players for Monday’s Varsity Cup final.
The Ikeys finished top of the log to earn a home semi-final and qualified for the final in incredible fashion when they edged Pukke 32-31 last week. However, the subsequent seven days have been tainted by controversy with event organisers ruling UCT’s floodlights are inadequate to stage a televised night game. They also ruled out the option of staging the final at Newlands, as the match needs to take place on a university campus.
Maties are the big winners as a result, earning the right to host the inaugural Varsity Cup final at the Danie Craven Stadium. The two universities are old rivals, with Stellenbosch having the wood over UCT at Coetzenberg. However, Maties have similarly struggled to pick up results at UCT in recent years.
There is little doubt home advantage will be a factor, and unfortunately for the Ikeys, television ratings and the all-important rand have won over the game itself. In any other competition in the world a team finishing top of the league earns the right to play at home. Not so on this occasion.
Another late development may see Maties with a further advantage. The latest rumour is that Western Province players will be used to bolster the Maties line-up with sources close to keo.co.za saying Stormers utility player Joe Pietersen is a likely starter at fullback. The teams have been announced, but the national club champs may have a surprise in store when the game kicks off at 18:45 tonight.
UCT will need to put aside the disappointment of the past week when they travel into hostile territory. The customary Ikey supporter bus loads will be in tow, but they’ll struggle to match the clamour of the home fans. The Danie Craven Stadium will be packed, and the majority of that crowd will be screaming for the men in maroon.
UCT have already recorded a win over Maties in the league stage of the competition, beating Stellenbosch 38-32 in George. Their backline has been the primary threat, with the prolific Mathew Turner certain to be a marked man. Maties will also be wary of the Ikey counterattack. UCT proved they can never be discounted even if they are down by three scores, as was the case against Pukke last week.
Their work at the breakdown will be a worry, and this is where the big men from Stellenbosch will fancy their chances. There’s no question a free-flowing game will play into the hands of the visitors, and so Maties may elect to keep it tight and force the Ikeys to play the ball close to the point of contact.
Both sides have played out of their skins to reach this point, but nobody should underestimate the value of home advantage. Hosting the final at UCT, the Ikeys would have been favourites, but the loss of this right has seen them slip from the position of top dog to underdog.
Stellenbosch – Therlow Pietersen, Henoe Stoffberg, Jean Stemmet, Sarel Potgieter, Llewellyn Winckler, Coenie van Wyk, Wilhelm Koch, Bennie Booysen (c), Jonathan Adendorf, Zandre Jordaan, Jaco Nepgen, Erich Laubscher, Jacob Adriaanse, Lisle Clark, Johan Roets.
Subs: Matthew Dobson, Andrew Crausaz, De Kock Steenkamp, Albert Fullard, Prieur de Jager, Lucian Cloete, Jowayne van Wyk.
UCT – Robert Hopwood, Marcello Sampson, Tim Whitehead, Pieter Engelbrecht, Mathew Turner, Matthew Rosslee, Danie van der Merwe, JJ Gagiano (c), Mzoi Simani, Enoch Panya, Martin Muller, Michael Ledwidge, Dylan Rogersm JP Koster, Herbert Mayosi.
Subs: Mark Goosen, Wesley Chetty, Dane Galley, Kyle Brown, Kyle Wickins, Peter Haw, Sean van Tonder.
By Jon Cardinelli
88 Comments
7 Apr 2008, 12:49 pm
peanuts for the dragons
7 Apr 2008, 12:53 pm
Well, Joe Pietersen is still contracted by Maties. If he has been released by the Stormers and Western Province to play in this match, where’s the problem?
7 Apr 2008, 12:55 pm
Well now, I wonder whether those who inspected the lights are by any chance “bos”old boys?
7 Apr 2008, 12:56 pm
fok hulle op UCT, fok hulle op!!!
7 Apr 2008, 12:58 pm
Look, you simply cannot have the final at UCT – the facilities ARE substandard.
However, (as a Maties oldboy) I agree that the final should not be played at Coetzenburg – UCT deserve the right to have (at least) some form of home advantage.
The match should have been played at Newlands, surely there wouldn’t have been a problem organising this?
7 Apr 2008, 12:59 pm
I must say, I’m behind UCT now. Couldn’t have been bothered, but since these new developments seem so unfair and since maties have used their vics team in the past, to manipulate rules, there is only one team now
7 Apr 2008, 13:02 pm
5
yeah sure, we have:
sub standard grounds
sub standard players
sub standard coaches
and for that we have to play against province this afternoon and on their home turf!
7 Apr 2008, 13:03 pm
UCT by 10
7 Apr 2008, 13:06 pm
The worst part is that the people at Newlands had given the ok for the stadium to be used for this match.
7 Apr 2008, 13:06 pm
Maties can use their Vics team to trample UCT.They dont need Joe Pietersen.
7 Apr 2008, 13:11 pm
ok here are my thoughts on why 2 WP teams made it to the final.
They had a distinct advantage over other teams as they were playing with the elves for ages and ages. Naturally teams from the GP province had to adapt and compete for a place in the final. So there you go.
7 Apr 2008, 13:12 pm
With or without Joe Petersen makes no difference, if he’s been practicing with the team, he might have an impact, if not, he’ll probably struggle to fit in at first. And how much impact can he have from fullback?
7 Apr 2008, 13:12 pm
Ons hier in stellenbosch kannie help dat julle nog op jan van riebeech se veld speel onder kerslug nie.
kom ons hoop die ref kom van pukke af.
ek dink joe pietersen is nie die enigste wp speler wat vanaand vir maties gaan speel nie.
MATIES
7 Apr 2008, 13:15 pm
# 13
Who are the other wp players that are expected to play tonight?
7 Apr 2008, 13:15 pm
11. Not true RL, the ELV`s were merely tested in Stellenbosch.
7 Apr 2008, 13:19 pm
kom ons sê net dat ek ‘n verandering op loskakel en buite senter ook verwag as mens na laasweek se maties oefeninge gekyk het.
7 Apr 2008, 13:19 pm
What’s happened to Nick Koster?
7 Apr 2008, 13:24 pm
So Tony
Maties will have no excuse should they lose the final since they have more experience with elves and now they have home ground advantage too.
Interesting indeed.
7 Apr 2008, 13:37 pm
Op die Bos
Speel die spul kommuniste in die grond in
7 Apr 2008, 13:40 pm
They only used the hostel teams for the initial testing phase of the then Stellenbosch Rules. So (& I say this under correction) no RedLion. The okes playing for Maties (bar one or two maybe) would not have played hostel rugby back then. The only “expereince” that might been carried through, maybe, was with any technical analysis that the Matie coaching staff could have done at hostel games – but that’s seriuosly unlikely.
7 Apr 2008, 13:47 pm
Ikeys met 10…alhoewel daai Therlow Pieterson van die Vrystaat is n ware fonds vir die Maties, het hom laasjaar op die Cravens al so gekyk.
7 Apr 2008, 13:48 pm
molly
Nic’s brothers is playing.
Don’t know where Nic is.
7 Apr 2008, 14:00 pm
Go Maties Go!
Still remember when all the first years were called together during the first year rugby tournament. The maties selecters looked at the 1000 or so guys gathered together there, and said:
“Right, if you played SA Schools, come stand over here, if you played Craven Week go stand over there. The rest of you can leave now.”
It really boggles the mind how ANY university team can compete with the rugby culture of Stellenbosch university. In my days there, Maties were the top club team in the Western Cape, and Vic’s (Maties second team), were the 2nd best.
If they are struggling to beat UCT now, standards must have dropped significantly in the last 8 years or so.
7 Apr 2008, 14:01 pm
all this “fok hulle op ikeys!”, “go maaties”…why cant these maaties and ikeys just be maaikeys?
7 Apr 2008, 14:03 pm
my skoonpa played maties firsts from his first year at stellies and my wife, her sister and two brothers were all educated at stellies so i will have to support…..ikeys!
7 Apr 2008, 14:06 pm
Maties should show faith in the players who got them to the final. Bit of a slap in the kisser to drop them now.
The Maties might have done a week of testing the ELV’s a year ago, but the Ikeys have been playing ELV rugby for decades under the Basil Bey influence, both at UCT and its feeder institution, Bishops.
Of all the teams I have witnessed in the Varsity Cup competition this year, my observation is that the Maties have adapted to the experimental laws worst of all. Too much “pick and kick” behind the base of the scrum, too little defensive structure, and not much natural flair displayed.
Should be a cracker, though. Anyone can win a final. It might come down to who wants it most.
7 Apr 2008, 14:06 pm
TACTICUS-YOU TALKING K@K-standards have not dropped-UCT have just put money and resources into refining the small player base they have.When were you a student?the only reason Vics were 2nd best is becausethe Maties players kept dropping down to strengthen Vics-its how Stellenbosch have bended the rules for donkeys years.Its a miracle that UCT are in the final to compete with the romans out from Stellenbosch-just look at the intake of rugby players for the eerstjaars tournooi and Varsitys player base.Standards have not dropped-UCT have just used their brains and players and maximised results in the last few years.
7 Apr 2008, 14:09 pm
Can’t wait for this one. It’s gonna be a cracker!!
7 Apr 2008, 14:10 pm
Being an old matie,I think it is unfair to have in stellies.Newlands was the answer.Last time it was played at newlands the maties won easily anyway.Everybody knows that it is an good uct team probaly best seen in a while,but dont under estimate the depth of maties rugby.Look if we were really looking at calling back maties players we would have to call back Peter Grant,Schalk Burger,Jean De villers,Conrad Hoffman,Diack,Francois Louw,Scalk Brits.
Who whould UCT call back? Ross Skeate!!!!!!!!!!
7 Apr 2008, 14:10 pm
LOL #24
7 Apr 2008, 14:12 pm
Aaaaaaaa….U
Aaaaaaaaaaa…..U
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa……UCT!
7 Apr 2008, 14:14 pm
Highlander
Seems like I struck a nerve there. Relax, it’s no big deal to me. Though I studied at Maties, if I had to pick a University to support, it would probably be Tukkies or Pukke. Between the two finalists, I’d go for Maties, but either way I don’t really care – that much.
7 Apr 2008, 14:15 pm
Go Ikeys!
7 Apr 2008, 14:21 pm
I dont know if anybody actually notices but the Cape is lucky to have 2 great universities.Trying to compare them is childish rather look at this way .Many great sportsmen and women and business men have come out of the two. ei Johann Rupert,Ramond Ackerman etc etc etc.Now let there be rivarly on the sportsfield but the two uni’s adding value to this country can not be measured
7 Apr 2008, 14:24 pm
Tacitus
Were you in a residence? If so, which one?
7 Apr 2008, 14:24 pm
Its actually Paul Roos and Paul Gym style rugby against Bishops.
7 Apr 2008, 14:30 pm
#36 bishops latest stormer is an matie Ie francois louw,Selborne Boome was an matie as well .I understand what you saying but I think the best rugby players from the country go to stellenbosch.Many english players have come and gone in stellies Ie bob skinstad,Peter Grant
7 Apr 2008, 14:31 pm
Tact-i dont really care if you support Pukke or Tukkies-i was commenting on the statement you made. I was also at Maties and saw exactly how they manipulated the situation with 2 teams in the super A league. When you are a student you are oblivious to these things , but as you get older you realise it is sad that they behave in such an unspotsmanlike manner.It happens with regular monotonity-thats what pisses most people off-and to boot nothing is ever done to recitfy the situation as Stellenbosch have had such a stranglehold on WP rugby for years. They feel that it is their divine right. I suppose its the Old South African mentality surfacing its ugly head yet again.
7 Apr 2008, 14:47 pm
Highlander,
How do you explain last season’s league match where Vics beat Maties?
Alternatively, if a player is dropped from Maties, should he be made to skip playing for Vics, and play 2nds or 3rds?
7 Apr 2008, 14:47 pm
As a UCT Old Boy I can only shout for one team really…I wonder how many poor Ikey supporters are going to be beaten up tonight!!!
AAAHH, I seriously miss the *** whipping we would get after a game at Stellies
7 Apr 2008, 15:16 pm
Hallo Pietman
Die Pietersen van die Vrystaat Craven week is nog steeds in die vrystaat en speel vir die Shimlas hy is actually Wilton Pietersen hy is ook omtrent dubbeld so lank soos Thurlow en Thurlow se heupies dubbel so breed soos syne o en hy het ook nie ‘n tipe van ‘n mohawk nie
7 Apr 2008, 15:31 pm
i know this will piss a lot of bloggers off but, in my opinion, doc craven was a cheat.
in his day he manipulated everything in favour of maties. he thought he was bigger than the game in wp and rsa.
never liked the little prick.
7 Apr 2008, 15:32 pm
LOL @ Rangerman @ # 24 & 25.
7 Apr 2008, 15:36 pm
Se gou hoekom speel Dagbreek (die kampieonkoshuis) teen Ikeys Colts en nie teen hulle koshuiskampioene nie? Of sit ek die pot heeltemal mis? Nou moet ‘n koshuisspan teen ‘n Clubspan speel? Dink nogsteeds Dagbreek sal wen, maar is dit maar nie ‘n wooden-spoon attempt deur Ikeys nie? En hoekom moan al hierdie fkn Ikeys oor waar hulle speel? Hulle het net hulself om te blameer vir die swak ligte die klomp wappe! Hou op wees soos die nuwe Suid-Afrika en DOEN IETS AAN JULLE K@K LIGTE!!!
7 Apr 2008, 15:42 pm
Hahaha pommie.
Dit was darem lekker vir ons oud-Daggies toe ons die Sauer verlede jaar weereens gevat het!
7 Apr 2008, 15:42 pm
Ikeys het ‘n uitstekende argument oor die hele ligte kwessie, en hulle behoort die finaal te host op Nuweland. Waar val die Varsity Cup organiseerders nou uit met dit moet op ‘n kampus wees, wat van die moerse klomp games op George oor paastyd? Nuweland is buitendien loop afstand van lower campus af so dit is vir alle praktiese doeleindes op kampus vir hulle.
7 Apr 2008, 15:48 pm
Moonie
Ek sou glad nie omgee nie – as dit by Nuweland was, was dit baie makliker vir my om daar uit te kom vanaand.
7 Apr 2008, 16:02 pm
Sharks team coaches will most probable be there to see who they can buy
7 Apr 2008, 16:04 pm
Highlander
I feel compelled to express my strong appreciation for your truthfulness and honesty in this sad rugby matter. Your being an ex- Matie must have made it very difficult for you because you are up against overwhelming numbers in the W.Cape. But I can back up all your comments.
Our country needs much more of the same honesty from all of us.
7 Apr 2008, 16:07 pm
AAAHH, I seriously miss the *** whipping we would get after a game at Stellies
Comment by Golden Boy : April 7, 2008 @ 2:47 pm
With all the soft little toffs at UCT reckon that *** whipping did not take much effort. A b*tch slap here, a b*tch slap there and off they ran back to the mountain. Only to be b*tch slapped once again at the return home match. And so the cycle repeats itself.
7 Apr 2008, 16:08 pm
Charo, as jy die chip op jou skouer afhaal en dit op Highlander se ander skouer sit, dan is julle altwee meer gebalanseerd. Dan is dit ‘n wen/wen vir ons almal
7 Apr 2008, 16:08 pm
#42 Charo
What you say has a lot of truth about it but expect the attack hounds to now spew and froth at the mouth because of what you said.
I commented on Sat. about this culture of cheating and/or accepting it and seeing things in perspective and they went ballistic for hrs. and hrs.Expect a storm.
7 Apr 2008, 16:09 pm
Maties have been manipulating the WP League since time began. The 1st team conveniently loses to the 2nd team whenever the 2nd team is faced with relegation. Nooo hidden secret in the WP Club league.
7 Apr 2008, 16:14 pm
Reading about this matter since it started last week it becomes clearer and clearer that ther are lies and cover about of weak lies followed by more lies and more cover up and back tracking. All of this begs the big question Why and to what end.
7 Apr 2008, 16:15 pm
I would kill to be in Stellenbosch tonight.
Mind you, the good old SAP might decide it is a good idea to have another raid on the unarmed students just out for a jol.
Cowards. Ek hou van die SAP nokken fiks.
7 Apr 2008, 16:20 pm
Go Maties!! Why is the article written from a UCT perspective. Bit biased methinks.
7 Apr 2008, 16:23 pm
Rangerman (24),
Classic, brother!
7 Apr 2008, 16:27 pm
#54 about should read up(cover up)
7 Apr 2008, 16:31 pm
I see there is still a lot unhappiness amongst the bloggers about the Maties/Vics situation in the past, the choice of venue and even poor old Doc Craven is not spared.
The Maties rugby club has carried Western Province (and lately also the Stormers) for decades and as a result can hardly ever field their strongest combination. Last Saturday for example approximately 14 players of the WP Vodacom team who beat Northern Transvaal (reserves included) were Maties. None of them are eligible to play tonight. If you include the Stormers who are Maties it means that tonights team is for all practical purposes a their third team.
So give them some rope if they try and bend the rules every now and then.
7 Apr 2008, 16:32 pm
24
lol, ma’ o’s gat hulle nog steeds opfok!!
7 Apr 2008, 16:40 pm
robzim @ 59
my dear friend
1. take your head out of your ***
2. take your head out of your ***
3. take your head out of your ***
now go read the first part of comment 23.
you believe (or try to make others believe) that the maties developed the players you so proudly mentioned. i beg to differ!!
7 Apr 2008, 16:56 pm
61# Asha,
What are you talking about? Where did I say that the Maties developed the players I mentioned?
If you want to reply to something someone posted please first read what they have said.
In any event if a good school player joins a club dont you believe the club can at least also claim some credit if the player later develops into a Springbok?
7 Apr 2008, 16:58 pm
some, but can that club then go out and say “we’re playing our 3rd team because danie x amount of players have moved on the higher honours”? isnt that the sole purpose of your club etc?
7 Apr 2008, 16:59 pm
shouls read x amount of players…
i’m tired! night guys!
7 Apr 2008, 17:08 pm
Cheers asha1 . I’m now off to DC stadium to check out the girls.
7 Apr 2008, 17:19 pm
charo you obviously did not know doc Craven. I was coached by him in the eighties. he was no cheat..(definitely no little prick!!).rugby was his life! why did guys like gert smal, tiaan strauss,carel du plessis etc. go to maties ? – to be coached by doc!
I agree that tonight’s final should have been played at UCT, but don’t blame maties – blame FNB !!
7 Apr 2008, 17:47 pm
Net om so bietjie agtergrond te gee, net in die Vodacom alleen, die een wat Saterdag die Bulle gewen het, is daar 14 Matie spelers, dan praat ons nie eers van die beseerde ouens en die manne wat in die Stormers groep is nie. Nee wat, Maties is die plek om te wees, en die kak van die Keo skrywers om Maties aftekraak raak ook vervelig. Dis nie Maties se skuld dat die ligte en stadion by UCT so kak is nie. En Maties het beslis nie daarop aangedring dat die game op DC gespeel moet word nie. En DC het buitendien baie meer gees as ‘n half vol Nuweland.
7 Apr 2008, 17:50 pm
GO MATIES! How lame is this chant:
A U!
A U!
A U C T!
7 Apr 2008, 17:56 pm
what time is the game?
7 Apr 2008, 17:58 pm
Fern
I think it starts at seven.
May the best team win.
7 Apr 2008, 17:58 pm
Robzim @ 59,
UCT have always fielded only full-time students, a policy that Maties have NEVER even dreamed of adopting (until it became enforced), always bolstering their side with seasoned professionals.
You can call it bending the rules, others may simply call it cheating.
Whatever.
The Tigers are visitin’ in just under an hour, and they’ve brought a big ol’ bag of Sodomy just for your boys!
7 Apr 2008, 17:59 pm
Sorry Fern.
It starts at 18:45.
7 Apr 2008, 18:18 pm
thank you
7 Apr 2008, 18:46 pm
Gaan interessant wees om die “Witkaart” in aksie te sien……… ek dink dis ‘n goeie ding !
Ek hoop goeie rugby wên….. daar was duidelik 4 goeie spanne by hierdie Varsity Cup…. Ikeys, Maties, Tukkies & Pukke…. die 2 semi’s was beide woes close, kon netsowel anders gewees het !
7 Apr 2008, 18:49 pm
Wat is die “Witkaart”?
7 Apr 2008, 18:51 pm
Elke span het 1 geleentheid, elke halfte om 1 beslissing van die Ref te querie…. dis die sogenaamde “Witkaart” geleenthede.
7 Apr 2008, 18:53 pm
Jislaaik, ek sal soos ‘n kind in sweets winkel wees, nie mooi weet wat om te kies nie
‘n Paar refs gaan “kaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaak”
7 Apr 2008, 18:56 pm
Sovêr ek weet is hierdie die enigste of eerste wedstryd waar hierdie Witkaart gaan werk….. ek dink mens gebruik dit seker maar as die ander span ‘n dubious drie druk wat nie TMO toe gaan nie…. of as daar net voor die drie ‘n vorentoe aangee was “in the field of play” waar die TMO nie jurisdiksie het nie.
Eishhhh 1 ste geelkaart vir punching…. aan Ikeys..
7 Apr 2008, 18:56 pm
can you guys who are watching on TV please update score every now and then? would be awesome. A U. A U. A UCT
7 Apr 2008, 18:58 pm
Maties 3 / Zip….
Ek dink ek ondersteun maar vir Maties, siende dat ek op Tukkies was en hulle ons tradisionele vyand / rivals was.
7 Apr 2008, 19:03 pm
Hoe weet jy ‘n ou was op Maties??
Hehehehe
Hy vertel jou !
7 Apr 2008, 19:04 pm
3-0 to Maties. Ikeys yellow card down and Roslee missed penalty. lots of handling errors in early stages
7 Apr 2008, 19:05 pm
Hoekom is daar nie ‘n ‘live’ thread nie?
Lui bliksemse “joernaliste”
7 Apr 2008, 19:06 pm
what was card for?
7 Apr 2008, 19:06 pm
Maties het al weer hulle span “gelaai” met WP Vodacom Cup spelers……
7 Apr 2008, 19:07 pm
punch
7 Apr 2008, 19:26 pm
Sorry….. handbriekie arrived….
Ikeys scored a try in the meantime, unconverted…. Maties scored a second penalty
Maties 6 / Ikeys 5
7 Apr 2008, 19:28 pm
Over to the actual game thread….. let’s move
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