WP discard sends Poms into frenzy
6 Oct 2008
It’s premature to suggest that Bristol’s new South African signing Mathew Turner will become rugby’s version of Kevin Pietersen but the kid Western Province didn’t want has started his senior professional career brilliantly.
Turner has represented WP U19 and was the leading try scorer in the inaugural Varsity Cup for UCT in 2008. Many respected commentators predicted a bright future in South Africa for the youngster, some even suggesting that he was ready to make the step up to senior provincial rugby.
However, despite his obvious class he was deemed surplus to requirements at U21 level at WP and sought to forge a career with Bristol in the Premiership. He debuted on Saturday against Northampton and shone in a losing cause, scoring two tries and creating a number of opportunities for teammates.
Turner holds a British passport and has already been drafted into England’s Sevens 26-man training squad. If he makes an appearance for them he’ll be ineligible to play for South Africa. If he continues to build on his impressive start with Bristol there is every chance that he could be considered for the England Test side for their Year End Incoming Tours, where he could face the Springboks on 22 November. England have trialled a number of wingers in recent times and the position remains a headache for them.
Prior to the 2008 season Western Province opted to contract veteran wing Wylie Human from the Lions as cover for their first-choice players in that position. The deal made no sense given that Human is 29-years-old who had seemingly hit the ceiling of his potential. Turner was yet to spring to prominence during the Super 14, but WP would have surely known what Human could offer at that stage and could have gambled on a rookie.
Turner was apparently keen to stay at WP, but was given no indication that he was in the long-term plans of the union. This prompted his decision to move once the offer from Bristol came.
Western Province are particularly guilty of allowing their best young players to be poached by rival South African unions. They’ve already surrendered SA U19 players Francois Hougaard and Stephan Dippenaar to the Bulls. Both went on to acquit themselves well in the Super 14. Another former Western Province junior Juandré Kruger, has deputised brilliantly in the absence of Bakkies Botha. These are just the most recent of a number of top performers the union has let slip through their fingers.
Something needs to change at the union so as to ensure that they retain their best young players. If not, WP supporters must brace for more of the disappointment they’ve become all too accustomed to in recent years.
By Ryan Vrede
309 Comments
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6 Oct 2008, 14:37 pm
Dragons!
6 Oct 2008, 14:42 pm
This Matthew Turner, as I said on earlier occasions, was my Man of the Match during the Varsity Cup; he also performed consistently well for UCT.
I can’t believe Western Province passed him up, this is going to come back to bite us – and SA rugby – in the arse big-time, in my opinion.
6 Oct 2008, 14:47 pm
Just get the feeling at times that there seems to be an arrogance in the Cape (Colony) that they have a godgiven right to win the Currie Cup.
When they secured Rassie I thought we are looking at revival only for them to undo it again with Allister Coetzee.
Coetzee is a man of many words but limited results.
6 Oct 2008, 14:48 pm
Is he white
Surely not, white wingers in SA (worth dedicating an entire article about) are extinct
6 Oct 2008, 14:50 pm
There are so many boys from the Cape playing for the Bulls I think I’ll have to start supporting them!
Province love giving their young talent away and buying old has-beens.
It makes me sick!!!!!
soon I’m going to singing “ek bly n bul!”
6 Oct 2008, 14:54 pm
“in SA” = “from SA”
6 Oct 2008, 14:54 pm
#5 Candy:
Candy, as a proud Province supporter, I don’t think it can ever be bad enough that you would want to sing “ek bly ‘n bul”.
I’d slit my wrists before that happens…
6 Oct 2008, 14:57 pm
I’m sure it was mentioned a couple of times during the Bulls/Valke game that Juandre Kruger is going overseas. Can someone please confirm that this is another keo article written without some research being done.
6 Oct 2008, 15:01 pm
Ryan you were in the post match presser at Newlands on Saturday where you not?
6 Oct 2008, 15:04 pm
Oh no, I see it was JC.
6 Oct 2008, 15:06 pm
Yep, he is white! Even in his schoolboy year in 2006 at Bishops – he was the top try scorer in the country that year. Scoring 27 tries in 20 matches! So top try scorer in SA as an under 18 school boy and top try scorer in the varsity cup this year. This guy is amazing and a wing of pure class.
Can’t believe how WP let him go because he was white and he’s a wing.
He has the uncanny ability to run around his opposite wing with only about 2 meters of space(width) to do so!! Incredible hand off too. Anyone watching him this year in the varsity cup, witnessed his awesome individual tries.
6 Oct 2008, 15:07 pm
Turner is white, white as a Pom.
Kruger has signed an overseas contract, but they are trying to get out of it.
6 Oct 2008, 15:07 pm
Oh come on. I’m sure if this kid is as good as this article makes him out to be and he would have wanted to continue his playing career in SA he would’ve found a union within the republic to sign him.
I despise the fact that journos make out as if SA unions don’t scout for talent and couldn’t care for young blood coming through. It’s bullshit.
I’m sure Turner saw Pound signs and couldn’t get on that BA flight soon enough.
A hell of a lot of our up and coming young talents have been approached by countries like NZ, Aus and Eng including Franscious Steyn and it was his personal choice to play for his country, even if at that time he didn’t have a contract.
Rathbone, Pietersen etc can piss off for all i care. Good Riddance.
6 Oct 2008, 15:07 pm
Anycase, if you were there you would see what a bunch of toss-pots the WP administrators are.
They truly live in la-la land, seemingly with no clue how to administrate a rugby union.
Not only have they got no clue on how to hold on, and look after young talent, but as always, there are certain clubs who seemingly get everything, and others nothing.
Problems takes ages to get sorted out, with one shifting the blame to the other.
Amateur administrators with no clue on how to run a proffesional game.
6 Oct 2008, 15:07 pm
#11 benigma:
Yep, nice big, strong fast winger who is able to change direction quickly, also very strong on defence.
6 Oct 2008, 15:08 pm
#8 It is just a game: We must not criticise the journo’s here, else we will get told “if you don’t like it, leave”
I heard the same thing during that game. Pitty if it is true. That guy was really good the last couple of games/
6 Oct 2008, 15:08 pm
#13 Windhond_Sharks:
Young Steyn had a Sharks contract from a very young age already.
6 Oct 2008, 15:12 pm
#13 Windhound_Sharks
He was actually very posistive about staying in SA. Has had a few offers since he was 18. He kept refusing them, ‘hoping’ WP would deliver him a contract. The final straw, was him not even making the WP u21 side this year, nor the bench which had two reserve wings. The two wings picked ahead of him for the main WP u21 XV, were on the bench for the UCT side!! He was first choice for UCT, but fifth choice for WP u21. Complete joke.
6 Oct 2008, 15:12 pm
#17 PissAnt: #17 PissAnt: cant go letting anyone else poach from the freestate now can we?
thats our feeder, hands off!
6 Oct 2008, 15:12 pm
Mooi BERGDWERGIES, julle leer nie !
6 Oct 2008, 15:16 pm
#19 rangerman:
Hey WP is fast catching up!
6 Oct 2008, 15:19 pm
PRRROOOOOOBBBBBBLLLLLLLEEEEEEEEEMMMMMMMMSSSSSSSSSS
6 Oct 2008, 15:19 pm
#13 Windhond_Sharks:
I agree 100% with you.
6 Oct 2008, 15:20 pm
I agree with Windhond (post 13) that we musnt get too excited as a nation about this oke leaving. There are plenty of brilliant wings around, and if he was THAT good – someone would have swept him up.
I do however think that it speaks to a culture Rassie created at the Cheetahs, and is now creating at WP. He bought old chaps like Willem, AJ, Wylie, Bobo, and is apparently trying to get Barend Pieterse over there at the end of the year.
I have said it before – Western Province have more quality schools, club rugby, university etc etc than ANY other province, yet they seem to leak talent second to none.
Last year they won the U21 and U19 trophy, and those players seem to leak through the net like water through a siff. Sad.
6 Oct 2008, 15:22 pm
Province are their own worst enemy. When they had flyhalf problems, they should have started their U21 flyhalf – Coenie someone… He is fantastic. The keep buying Naqualivuki, Bobo, Wylie, and a whole bunch of other old farts, instead of developing their own young talent
6 Oct 2008, 15:23 pm
A dream union would have:
- the Sharks’s development structures
- the Bulls’s administration
- the Lions’s supporters
- the Free State’s natural talent
- WP’s reputation
6 Oct 2008, 15:23 pm
Lastly, speaking about buying big names from small unions (
) – I see my Cheetahs have gone and bought Danwell Demas. Go figure….
6 Oct 2008, 15:23 pm
#18 benigma: I didn’t know that, but my point stands. If he wants to play in SA and he is really that good then he would find a way. I just find, in general and not only professional sportsman, that Saffas are very negative and hit the road before even trying to find a way to make things work.
And by this i don’t mean those families who have been affected by violent crime and chose to leave.
6 Oct 2008, 15:26 pm
The fact still remain that WP is not holding on to exceptional talent. Cannot believe that Francois Hougaard was not contracted.
6 Oct 2008, 15:26 pm
#17 PissAnt: well, if Turner was that good, i’m sure the Sharks would’ve signed him…..
6 Oct 2008, 15:27 pm
#24 Cheetha Champs:
In all honesty, if it was not for the fact that they play a Wylie Human or contracted him instead of building on their young talent I would have agreed.
but this does not add up at all.
Surely you judge your assets (players) on more than just one thing, the immediate impact they will have? In which Human was not even that great in that department either!
Ag but I guess he is only Human.
6 Oct 2008, 15:28 pm
I think he had tried and financially hadn’t been offered a contract after consistently performing well the past couple of years. Then probably figured, he’s white and he’s a wing – how much politics lies ahead of him. I personally feel he could have been a springbok. Time will only tell, how much of a mistake it was for WP to let him go. His agent tried and tried to secure, but they told him he was 5th choice for the WP u21 side, let alone the senior side.
News has just come through – that he’s been picked for the England Seven’s squad already – and he’s only been in the UK for two weeks.
6 Oct 2008, 15:28 pm
A complete disgrace, heard this story a few days ago from a friend of Turner. He had outstanding pace, defence and finishing. A joke that WP spend money on Fiji, Venter and Wylie when they can just keep what we have. This is coming from a WP supporter. Next thing we lose Koster and JC Kritzinger for Jannes Laubaschagne and Balie Swart
6 Oct 2008, 15:28 pm
#28 Windhond_Sharks: I agree.
When Kevin Petersen left SA – he said it was because of the quota system. What we forget is that there were probably 7 white players in that team of 11. If Petersen was that good back then (which i doubt) he should have aimed to get in ahead of one of the 7 white okes !!!!!!
Poor performance at early regional level is often hidden behind excuses of quota systems.
6 Oct 2008, 15:28 pm
#18 benigma:
if that’s the case then there is something seriously wrong down wpru way.
ps assume your name is ben – if so, good nic.
#26 WP Till I Die:
katman will enjoy that!
6 Oct 2008, 15:29 pm
#31 PissAnt: LOL!!! ….flesh and blood, a man……
6 Oct 2008, 15:29 pm
#13 Windhond_Sharks:
I agree with you. Mathew Turner is a promising young winger and nothing more. He is not exceptional and is never going to be the next Jono Lomu of world rugby.
He has a British passport and took the easiest option. Good luck to him but here are many more young wingers of similar ability in WP and SA.
6 Oct 2008, 15:29 pm
South Africa need to run a system where by clubs that refuse to promote certain youngsters need to give them a chance to get into other top sides within SA first. Otherwise we will lose everybody..
6 Oct 2008, 15:30 pm
#31 PissAnt: You should be shot for that line….
6 Oct 2008, 15:30 pm
#33 liefling: LOL. Balie Swart!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! had a good laugh with that. He must be 40 or something now. Don’t think even WP will be signing him to play maybe as a scrum coach who knows!!
6 Oct 2008, 15:32 pm
#37 Robzim: I hope so, as I hear he finished top scorer in the University league. My mates from UCT were really impressed.
6 Oct 2008, 15:32 pm
Denwill Demas was contracted by the Bulls. He was released early from his contract so that he can have more game time. Denwill Demas really is moving from the Bulls to the Cheetahs.
Trompie Nontshinga is also contracted by the Bulls. He is on loan to the Lions also to give him more game time
6 Oct 2008, 15:32 pm
#34 Cheetha Champs: Soon the European club sides will be saturated with Antipodeans and they won’t be able go and make a quick buck anyway.
6 Oct 2008, 15:33 pm
All I ask of SA when they come to the UK is that they beat England and Wales. They can play kids in the other matches..
6 Oct 2008, 15:33 pm
I suppose the difficult part to stomach is the fact that your team has beaten 2 semi finalists convincingly. That’s understandable.
You have to then go back and say why, why did this happen.
And then again, like it has been said 1,000,000 times – Valke and Griquas.
Coetzee underestimated the potential of those 2 defeats. He failed to inspire his players to secure at least wins against those minnows. And that is the bottomline. But he will not want to look at that. He is also trying to fast-forward proceedings to next year already. No way, I’m frustrated NOW and I’m want him gone NOW. Or before close of business today.
6 Oct 2008, 15:33 pm
frenzied poms?
i dont think so.
6 Oct 2008, 15:34 pm
#28 Windhond_Sharks: I couldn’t disagree more. What you are saying is that if you feel you are good enough then stick around and fight no matter how long, no matter what the obsticles until you are chosen.
So if you are in a job and you are always getting over looked and your working climate is poor you are going to stay there?? Maybe time some of the muppets grew up.
Yes there is no bigger honour than playing for your country but in SA rugby – there is no such thing as fairness or impartiality. Politics and I am not talking race either has killed many great rugby players I am sure. Problem is the pool is so full with new talent that we quickly forget. In cricket Pietersen is a great example. The numbers the other side of the pond is growing.
Until rugby admisnistration in SA cleans up its act it will keep growing. Reading about an oke like this is a shame.
6 Oct 2008, 15:34 pm
#42 dWeePer: Who cares – point is that Cheetahs has once again gone and bought another average player. Makes me angry.
6 Oct 2008, 15:36 pm
#47 pedspin: do you have a problem at work. Talk to me, i’m listening……
6 Oct 2008, 15:39 pm
He’s not making excuses about quoto’s. The only oppurtunity he has been given is schoolboy First XV level and UCT first team side.
On both occassion’s he finished FIRST/TOP of the top try scorer list in the country. He was never given other oppurtunities. After having an amazing varsity cup and by far being the best wing on show. WP u21 said “Naaaah”…
His friend Nick Koster, whom he played with at school level in 2006, has made the senior WP side, but he couldn’t even make the WP u21 side squad.
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