Chabal questions ABs’ mental strength
15 Jun 2009
Sebastien Chabal believes France have been able to get inside the All Blacks’ heads and have sown the seeds of doubt.
The French stunned the Kiwis last weekend in Dunedin, securing only their fourth win on New Zealand soil, and the Caveman now believes it’s advantage France ahead of this Saturday’s second round in Wellington.
‘Maybe now they [New Zealand] will start to doubt,’ the French forward told rugbyheaven.co.nz. ‘Next week if we can stay in the game during the first 30 minutes they will start to doubt. If we play 100% and if we don’t make too many mistakes we can win next week. I don’t want to be too confident … ‘
Chabal claimed that his side were in a good state of mind before the opening Test, and believes they had won both the mental and the physical battle on the field.
‘We didn’t mind before the game about the result,’ added Chabal. ‘We just wanted to be focused on our game and to play with a lot of passion, a lot of heart and give everything on the pitch.
‘That’s what we did from the start till the end. We worked well for the first 30 minutes, then the All Blacks started to doubt. I think we were mentally stronger than them after the first 30 minutes.’
The 29-year-old is confident his team can repeat their heroics of Dunedin when the two teams go head to head again this Saturday.
‘We will try to be focused and to prepare well for the next game. We know we have nothing to lose and maybe when we are in this spirit we play the best.’
141 Comments
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15 Jun 2009, 15:44 pm
#99 poppa69: Poppa see my #65 – definite back hand respect. I have utmost respect for the AB’s and many Saffas have too. There have been years when the Boks were inferior to the All Blacks, but this current Bok side is inferior to no-one. I have admiration for great AB sides, jeez never more so than the greatest side never to win a world cup – Lomu, Brooke, Brooke, Brown, Cullen, Marshall, Mehrtens, Little, Bunce, Fitzpatrick, Kronfeld, Wilson (to name a few) – They were a legendary team and one of the best ever.
But our Boks now are starting to get close. Their losses in the Tri-Nations puzzles me, leading me to believe that something other than talent is at play.
The same goes for the Super 12. With the Super 14 there has been greater parity.#97
BlackPanther: 2 s14 titles in 3 years disputes the statement: “Because they cant quite manage the feat based solely on merit.”
Merit will occur when the playing fields are level. When sides play an equal time away from their continents, and fans have an equal opportunity to support their teams away from home.
Tri Nations and S14 are clearly not level playing fields when the “weakest” team in the Tri-Nations wins a world cup, World Sevens Series and wins the Junior Worl Cups regularly.
One thing to be said though, except for Sharks and Bulls – SA coaching and Adminstration leaves a lot to be desired.
15 Jun 2009, 15:50 pm
#99 poppa69: I’m a South African. I’d like to assure you that the views on this forum doesn’t represent the majority. Most South Africans support only two teams: The Springboks and The All Blacks. Personally I feel that the Springboks shouldn’t lose to anybody, but if they do and it’s the All Blacks I can kinda live with it. I also want the All Blacks to beat the **** out of everybody except us. The two teams have always measured their strength against one another. It’s an awesome rivalry, and long may it last.
The mudslinging that took pace in this thread by both Kiwis and Saffas is sad, and not in the spirit of the long history of camaraderie and rivalry between our countries.
There is a huge amount of respect amongst SA rugby supporters for the All Black side, and that will never change, whether they are a bit better or a bit worse this year has no relevance. When they meet on the field it will always be a brutal, physical encounter. Some of the best rugby one could ever hope to witness.
15 Jun 2009, 16:04 pm
#102 Papercut: Most South Africans support one team – the Springboks.
15 Jun 2009, 16:09 pm
#101 Heavens Game: Maybe it’s just a case of priorities … South Africa’s is the world cup and they have been pretty successful at winning it, despite bad administration and some bad coaches.
In some ways, the Springbok administration is quite far-sighted, e.g. in allowing overseas players to be picked.
15 Jun 2009, 16:14 pm
#101 Heavens Game: “Tri Nations and S14 are clearly not level playing fields when the “weakest” team in the Tri-Nations wins a world cup, World Sevens Series and wins the Junior Worl Cups regularly.”
As far as I know
World sevens series SA won ONCE, just like Fiji. NZ – EIGHT times.
Junior world cup SA HAVE NOT WON yet. The only previous ws won by NZ.
15 Jun 2009, 16:18 pm
#104 CharlieBrown: Yeah, its just a pity that talent hasn’t been fulfilled though especially in 3N and S14.
If the core of this team is around for 2011 and a fair amount of success is tasted in Lions tour, 3N – as is rightly deserved, talent-wise, then who knows…
Imagine 2011 WC in NZ – Final between ABs and Boks, and no buffere zone between the 2 teams when the Haka goes down.
Beast staring down Dan Carter.
Nice dreams…, we will probably land up playing the French in the Final
15 Jun 2009, 16:21 pm
#105 Nils: I was present when SA won the U21 World Cup. I think it has been won by SA at least 3 times.
The one U21 World Cup Semi was determined by a penalty shoot out
The U20s will probably be won by SA this year.
15 Jun 2009, 16:23 pm
#107 Heavens Game: Then excuse me, I thought you were referring to Junior World Championship.
Probably that will be won by NZ.
15 Jun 2009, 16:25 pm
And probably Boks will meet the ABs after all. In the semifinal.
15 Jun 2009, 16:26 pm
#108 Nils: Probably – good one
15 Jun 2009, 16:28 pm
#110 Heavens Game: the same amount of “probable” as for Junior Boks. But first, it’s Australia and England respectively. No pushovers.
15 Jun 2009, 16:32 pm
#107 Heavens Game: No, SA have won U21 2 times.
Exactly the same number as NZ and once – France (last time).
15 Jun 2009, 16:32 pm
#109 Nils:
It used to be an U21 WC but that was changed to U20 – probably because SA was starting to win it more often (tongue in cheek)
Seriously:
Last U20 World Cup:
1 New Zealand 38, 2 England 3
3 South Africa 43, 4 Wales 18
This year:
17 Jun – 17:00 New Zealand – Australia Prince Chichibu Stadium, Tokyo
17 Jun – 19:00 South Africa – England Prince Chichibu Stadium, Tokyo
Hopefully a NZ vs SA final.
15 Jun 2009, 16:34 pm
#107 Heavens Game: and U19 – once, with NZ – 2 times with Australia once.
as both are defunct and replaced by current World championship in total we see:
NZ 5 wins, SA – 3, Australia and France – one each.
15 Jun 2009, 16:35 pm
#112 Nils:
SA won with Skinstad as Captain(unless that was U23)
SA won with Smit as Captain
SA won with Hargreaves as Captain.
Could be wrong – apologies
15 Jun 2009, 16:36 pm
#113 Heavens Game: that has to be big tongue in cheek.
No denial, SA have big plenty of talents, plus ideal climatic (and time) zone. In many ways SA are blessed.
That final should be great. But semis first.
15 Jun 2009, 16:37 pm
#103 CharlieBrown: Not true. Some of us have some SH pride and a knowledge of rugby lore. I will always shout AB’s if the Boks aren’t on the receiving end.
15 Jun 2009, 16:37 pm
#114 Nils: Dont worry, it will be NZ 5 SA 4 after this year. NZ in the lead for now.
15 Jun 2009, 16:39 pm
actually I used wikipedia and irb.org as a source. Maybe I was wrong.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Under_19_Rugby_World_Championship
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Under_21_Rugby_World_Championship
15 Jun 2009, 16:41 pm
#118 Heavens Game: Could be it. Could be NZ 6, SA 3.
And could be Australia/England win after all. (Wales did shock everybody after all in Sevens)
15 Jun 2009, 16:43 pm
alright, see you, Heavens Game and other folks, somewhere later. Probably at the Lions game.
15 Jun 2009, 16:47 pm
#121 Nils: Great bickering Nils
15 Jun 2009, 17:27 pm
There has always been nothing but great respect between the traditional powerhouses of the beautiful game, read All Blacks and Springboks… and we all hope that it may last always. History considered, these countries have been leading the game for almost a millenium.
Just really sad to see that NZ always sides with Oz when it comes to Sanzar administration, and when everything has blown over – Oz would have brokered a better deal for themselves at the expence of NZ.
I’m a big Bulls and Saffa supporter, but always enjoy the All Blacks dealing out the pain to the rest… coz they normally do it with style. Big up to the blacks.
15 Jun 2009, 18:46 pm
#101 Heavens Game:
Oh Im sorry. So WHEN was the last time SA had more than 1 team in the S14 Semis, ie on merit ? 2 years ago, but that was a 1st and contested when NZ had their whole AB squad out.
Unfortunately your Bok team that is ‘inferior to noone’ has somehow found itself 2nd in the World Rankings. And you cant explain away the Boks poor results at TriN time when you have the same no of home Tests as everyone else. Dont make assumptions that the RWC Champs in some way deserve a better result than the Wooden Spoon because you get what you deserve. NZ got what they deserved at the RWC, but that was a tournament where SA also avoided the 3 opponents they had a losing record to under White (Aus, France and NZ). So perhaps TriN results are a bit more reliable because there is NO escaping.
#102 Papercut:
Thats bloody great to hear. What I simply cant understand is when desperadoes are desperate to jump on AB losses achieved by other teams ???!!!! To be honest, most Kiwis care only about their teams. If the Boks lose to someone else, or win, it matters very little to Kiwis. Altho I suppose I can understand to a certain extent because NZers quite enjoy Aussie losing at anything. Personally I dont have that animosity, but our relations are so close in all matters of life whereas with SA its really only rugby.
15 Jun 2009, 23:22 pm
#69 Heavens Game:
Rugby playing numbers??
SA have alot more playing numbers than NZ,just about triple,or have i read your post wrong.
Anyway this thread went no where,except making a few people on here actually back there points up with facts that made tme look a little silly.SA rugby will always be respected by most Kiwis,as we know that SA can always field a team of great players and can beat you on any given day.
Some people on here use the word probably win this and probably win that,its good to see the confidence in your team but remember confidence can evolve into arrogance without you even knowing.Another thing i read on here and i cant find it again but someone said at the moment SA team answers to no one,this team is the best team they have had in many years,better than the 2007 boks.
Ok one game against Namibia and you came to that conclusion.
Anyway Heavens Game,i like your attitude towards the boks,you are a great supporter and know a good game,but alot of your posts with the word probably dosnt look good.Remember this line you quoted to me
“I get my kicks from a few chuckles at misplaced Kiwi arrogance that comes back and bites.”
Now with your famous probably win this probably win that you have left yourself open,its nice of you to give us the opportunity send a few told you so posts flying your way,but PROBABLY wont happen
16 Jun 2009, 10:37 am
#124 BlackPanther: Wipe your spittle from the screen, take a deep breath, count to ten.
Again, the Bulls (from SA) have won the S14 twice in 3 years. Why? the semi-final, final was played in SA.
Why was the semi and final played in SA – not because SA teams have got better – but because of greater parity in travel time (away from home ground on another continent).
SA teams have regularly made the knockout despite the structural disadvantages of Super rugby. For more detail see past posts.
On 2nd ranking – another loss to the French will put the Boks on top. I am not sure whether SA gains or loses points by playing the BI Lions.
Aha – the bugbear from some embittered supporters saying the Boks missed the 3 sides that “count”. Who are they? – Australia, ABs and France.
Well, SA did beat the holders of the World Cup, who they happened to meet again in the Final. England beat France who beat NZ. England also beat Aus. Aus and NZ were knocked out in the quarter finals. Yes, the QFs – does that reflect a no. 1 ranking? Again you will say that the ABs are continually no 1 in ranking between WCs – a great part attributed to victory in the Tri-Nations.
Its starnge that the “weakest team” in the Tri-NAtions is reasonably succesful at the WC. Or is that just luck we hear. it could be said that Aus was lucky to get the drop goal against SA in the Semi of 99, and they were lucky to play the French after they had peaked and beaten the ABs in the other Semi. A bit of wind and luck could have resulted in SA obtaining 3 WCs if we use Kiwi logic.
I am convinced therefore the Tri Nations and S14 are tournaments, by their very nature, put SA at a disadvantage. Evidence of this from a NZ side could be seen with the Chiefs – this year. Also the Crusaders – against the Cheetahs.
I would say the WC is a more reliable measure of team strength beacuse there is no escaping – SA did not escape. The Boks won and the ABs were knocked out in the QFs. The Tri NAtions are not a level playing field for SA. They also exaggerate the ABs rankings
16 Jun 2009, 10:45 am
#126 Heavens Game: You have to rememer too the Boks never played in the 87 or 91 world cups. Who knows if we could have won one of those? No one will ever know. We could have.
For now it looks great. 4 out of 2. Not bad at all for our Boks.
16 Jun 2009, 10:51 am
#125 Hurricane: SA has a hgue amount of playing numbers – there was a big tongue in a loose cheek there and I was being very sarcastic.
I have not based any conclusion on the Namibian game. Actually I am a bit worried about the B&I Lions. On other threads you would see this.
Hurricane, I do get my kicks from a bit of a kick in the pants to the AB’s but I know to expect it back from AB supporters when the Boks get their comeuppance.
I rpobably push the envelope with the Kiwi’s but I can take it when it is my turn. I am a newbie here but love this site when the talk is about rugby.
And the good thing is, Kiwis do know a little bit about Rugby. There is nothing better in the midst of football madness on this small, grey island in the Atlantic than to have a good bicker about Rugby.
Nevertheless, I probably will get a good boot up the backside (in a figurative sense) if the Boks improbably get their backsides kicked by the BI Lions.
If the Boks do win the BI Lions series, which is probable, then they will probably have a great chance of winning in the 3N (although the boks are structurally disadvantaged in the comp). The U20 Boks might probably win their U20s with a victory in the Sevens series and S14 and WC – would probably give SA a clean sweep of World rugby. Probably lol
16 Jun 2009, 11:03 am
#127 Puma: At least a QF, no worse than Aus or NZ in the last one.
Its a pity the world could not see Boks such as the “Darling from Despatch”, Du Plessis brothers, Uli, Serfontein, Botha, Tobias, Mordt, Geldenhuys, Louw and others from that era.
Remember, the Boks did beat the Cavaliers that did have many ABs who went on to win the 87 WC. So 87 I really believe the Boks would have had a great chance.
91 I reckon there was a transition – the Boks above were getting on and other talent needed to come through. The tests in 92 exposed SA for this.
So, I would say at least a semi for 87 and at least a QF for 91.
Remember France and Aus at that time were fairly good, Wales I think the Boks would have beaten, but the other sides would have been close.
16 Jun 2009, 11:06 am
#129 Heavens Game: one cant say that
if we had been there we too could have been far better
so to think we might have means zero mate
we could have won both tournaments , and we could have done sero
16 Jun 2009, 11:16 am
#130 sharks_lover: Our relatively limited time in WCs shows that we finish no worse than QF. So Zero would be very unlikely.
Performance against Cavaliers was ok – this would show that we were at least as good as the other Semi finalists in 87. The team that I thought we were better than, in the SFs was Wales. That is why I said at least SFs.
Look at the class of players for the Boks at that time.
16 Jun 2009, 11:45 am
#126 Heavens Game:
Excuses, apologies, nonsense.
Always the same. Complete BS.
Round hole. Square peg. No matter, we fix em !
“The TriN are not a level playing field for SA”
Gee, somehow that STILL doesnt explain WHY Boks dont win their home games.
No wonder every ref gets called a ‘cheat’ in SA because there simply ALWAYS needs to be a reason for defeat OTHER THAN the team/players/ocaches.
16 Jun 2009, 11:50 am
#132 BlackPanther:
agree with all you have said on quotas, which is a pisspoor excuse.
however, blaming the ref is not a south african phenomenon, its something that has been learnt recently with everyone else whinging.
lets also be quite clear, i dont think anyone has vaguely approached the levels of whining experienced after Barnes reffed FR v NZ in RWC2007. my god man, video evidence was assimilated, a 2-thousand page report commissioned and about 1 month off bitching and tears.
16 Jun 2009, 12:00 pm
#129 Heavens Game:
Cut the BS – “because the Boks beat the Cavaliers, blah blah = RWC glory”
What Planet are you on ?! Some little sheltered Universe ?
The Cavaliers left NZ shores nearly 2 full years AFTER being selected. They were geriatrics when they were selected (having waited around for the chance to play SA) and they were on pensions by the time they landed in the Republic. This after being outcasts in their own country, legal injunctions, court cases. Their Manager had never managed a team before. And their best player – John Kirwan – refused to travel and the RWC Capt – David Kirk – also refused to get on the plane. The tour Captain, Andy Dalton, was hit from behind by the coward Geldenhys only mins in to the tour, broken jaw. So leadership was ad-hoc at best.
Atleast the SARU graced the Cavaliers with (allegedly) neutral refs for that tour, a first for any NZ team in SA. Elsewhere, neutral refs had been the norm for many years.
In between the Cavliers tour there was the ‘Baby Blacks’ series vs France. Most of the RWC winning team emerged from that series, very FEW made it back from the Cavaliers.
Any inference of success by the Boks based on performance against an un-Managed team of geriatrics absolutely exposes the mindset of someone who always makes excuses about TriN and S14 failure/success. Go and find a witchdoctor who reads the sticks and bones the way you want em and pay your fee to the man.
16 Jun 2009, 12:16 pm
#133 cab:
And oh HOW the Safas love the whole Wayne Barnes episode. Its like a cleansing of the rugby soul, a Baptism of the oval ball spirit.
Yes, 1 ref, Mr Barnes. To be fair tho – it was a knockout RWC match, so fairly important.
It was NOT a normal EYOT match -> Paul Honiss vs Ireland.
It was not a normal TriN match -> David McHugh assaulted vs ABs
It was not a dead-rubber TriN match -> Stuart Dickinson vs ABs
It was not a tour match where the opposition won by 50pts -> Paddy O’Brien vs England (RC to Lappies). And actually its unfair to single out just ONE match involving Paddy – the Safas I know systematically called him a ‘heat’ after every match he controlled.
Neither was it a conspiracy of NZ and Aussie refs and emails -> throw the whole lot in, large sweeping movements of said tar-brush.
By all means, laugh about Barnes. NZs record of whinging relates to a RWC Final (the poisoning episode of 1995) and a RWC QterF (Barnes). But there doesnt seem to be tooooooo much cut-throat atmosphere about the matches involving SA and its supporters. And you only need to look at likes of Heavens Game above and a million of his disciples on this blog to know that finding a reason for defeat is and has been for many years, at epidemic levels.
BTW – did you know that Graham Henry recieved an International Fair Play Award, as voted for by the French, for NOT whinging about the ref “in the face of insurmountable evidence against him”. In normal parlance that means “the ref made repeated errors and, despite this, the losing coach was very gracious in defeat”.
Furthermore, as an aside, the referees mentioned above had been controlling Test matches for many years prior to those matches. Check out how absurd it looked when that hippo bowled an aging David McHugh. Now compare him to the 20-something Barnes who barely MONTHS in to his career as a Test ref (7 to be precise) was then awarded the knockout match between the Host nation and the Favourites. If thats not a stitchup, then what is ?!
16 Jun 2009, 12:18 pm
#133 cab:
Ahhh so now you are blaming everyone else cos of your whinging towards refs.It like a kids fight he moaned first.
Remember the spectator that ran on the field and attacked the ref cos he thought the ref was a cheat cos SA was losing?
Evey country complains about refs you guys take it one step further to violence.
16 Jun 2009, 13:12 pm
#132 BlackPanther: No excuses, just a fairly logical argument other than “Complete BS”.
Facts are AB’s are better than their record in the WC, even though apparently it is easy to hide in the WC as compared to 3N.
Another fact is that SA rugby is better than their record in the 3N or S14 would suggest.
3N exagerrates NZ “dominance” which comes back to bite the ABs in World Cups.
16 Jun 2009, 13:21 pm
#134 BlackPanther: Yeah – all true about the Cavaliers, but legend has it that players in the Cavalier Side recieved full NZ caps retrospectively. I may be wrong though.
On the other hand at that time the Boks were full of some quality players that were in their prime. A SF would have been a realistic result atr least in the 87 WC
I also remember some reffing “greatness” from a certain Clive Norling in a certain test series in that decade which prevented a certain Springbok side from PROBABLY winning the series in NZ.
#134 BlackPanther: Burger Geldenhuys gave that little squirt Dalton what he deserved. If he couldnt handle the heat he should have stayed out of the fire.
A certain “Cowboy” Shaw was no innocent with regards to that.
I also think Kirwan was a bit scared of facing the Raging Ray Mordt (Tongue-in-Cheek, I am having mercy it seems that you might be on the verge of a blood vessel explosion, BP.)
16 Jun 2009, 13:51 pm
#137 Heavens Game:
No excuses ? If that is your version of No Excuses, then Id hate to see it when you do have some.
Perhaps if the Boks had lost by slim margins in the TriN you may have logic to the ‘reasoning’. But they have succumbed to large margins, repeatedly, by both NZ and Aus. Including last year, at home, nill’ed in fact.
13 TriNs to date and ABs have won 9 of them. Boks have won 2, 1 of which was won on pts-differential and without an away win.
But, by all means, keeping throwing up them bones and sticks.
My guess is that if the Boks win this years TriN you will use that as evidence that SA truly IS ‘the Best’. Nothing surer.
#138 Heavens Game:
Yep, youre wrong.
your ‘realistic’ results are ‘probably’ BS too.
Clive Norling played 7mins of extra time after Hewson kicked a pen. Boks not good enough to get a pen or DG. Not good enough. I was at EP and those 7mins seemed liked an hour. Was wonderful watching Nassty Bootha screaming at his pack.
Safas have owned enough Welsh refs over the years tho. They bought some for that Cavaliers tour and then dished out gold watches after cheating the French out of a RWC Final in 1995 too. I suppose it was about the time with the coal mines closed in the valleys and money was in short supply.
Geldenhuys hit Dalton from BEHIND, without provocation. The big ****** clearly liked it that way, not man enough to look his victim in the eye. Cowboy Shaw likes females and would honour his victims by warning them first.
17 Jun 2009, 15:20 pm
#138 Heavens Game: 3N exaggerates something? ermmm…
All 3N teams are usually (and currently) the top 3 sides in the world. So – this is head-to-head tournament between three best sides in the world and no favours expected from France.
Ok, take away SA disadvantage of travelling eastwards and longer trip (which gives about 4 or so away wins in 13 years), let’s see how SA do AT HOME against NZ and we see 1:2 win/loss ratio there. Even altitude does not help much (0-3 Loftus, 2-1 Ellis park).
Exaggerated my ***.
17 Jun 2009, 15:35 pm
#127 Heavens Game: IMHO, the only tournament which exaggerates rankings – is WC. Double points.
That’s how in was enough for NZ to lose one single game and drop down in the rankings, despite having big lead before tournament.
But ok, double points just show the ultimate importance of this tournament, so that’s fine.
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