Saru’s scrum solution
17 Mar 2010
Saru is forming an expert panel to address South African’s flagging scrum standards.
The state of the Springbok scrum and the poor performances of South African teams, such as the Sharks and Lions, is a major concern and this has prompted Saru to take action.
Last Thursday, the union organised a meeting with several former players and scrum experts to discuss the formation of a committee to help improve and maintain standards of scrumming from junior level right through to the Springboks.
World Cup-winning prop Balie Swart, who was one of the experts invited to this meeting, is positive this plan will be put into action. Robbie Kempson, Eddie Andrews, Os du Randt, Dougie Heymans were present, as were Saru manager of referees André Watson and official Tappe Henning.
‘The idea is for us to come together and help rebuild the South African scrum,’ Swart told keo.co.za. We will also advise the Bok selectors on who we think are the best scrummagers in the country. The selectors will still have the final say.
‘We are not going straight to the head, we will start working with coaches and players from U9 level so we can have a common understanding of scrumming in the country. For too long have different teams followed their own techniques which has led to mixed results. The committee will ensure everybody, junior and senior players, follow the correct methods.
‘We will also make sure that the techniques used are safe and accurate for all players, so there will be no danger of any serious neck or head injuries.
‘Nothing is concrete yet, we are still busy negotiating, but the word is that Saru has never had a more passionate, engaging meeting like the one we just had. There will be a follow-up soon, I predict some time next month, so I am positive things will fall into place.’
Swart added that no individual player can be criticised for the poor scrum performances by the Boks and Super 14 teams.
‘We used to be a powerful scrumming nation and we want to get back to that level. It’s not only one player who is the problem, it’s all eight men in the pack who hold the responsibility.
‘They are all supposed to be doing the same thing on impact. A lot of people are pointing fingers, but the truth is no individual can be blamed. The scrum techniques of some players are wrong or poor and we need to rectify this.
‘The referees are also not to blame, most of the times they get the calls right. The law is set, and the players need to follow these laws. That’s why André and Tappe were present, to gain a common understanding between players and refs as well.’
Saru manager of coaching Hilton Adonis has confirmed the meeting was successful from the union’s point of view.
‘The meeting was basically a blueprint to see what the chances are of former players or scrum experts being interested in joining the committee to review the scrum matters in the country,’ Adonis told this site. ‘We have identified certain individuals to join the advisory committee or scrum factory and we will meet again soon to take these plans further.’
By Gareth Duncan
– Read about Balie Swart’s mission to save the scrum in the new issue of SA Rugby magazine, on sale now
180 Comments
17 Mar 2010, 10:47 am
Steady Eddie Dragons!
17 Mar 2010, 10:48 am
Im shocked that Grant10 wasnt invited!
17 Mar 2010, 10:55 am
@Taahirah:
Brilliant!!!
17 Mar 2010, 10:56 am
The Great Hard Man Eddie Andrews!!! bwahahahahaha
17 Mar 2010, 11:16 am
Eddie Andrews oh my word..
17 Mar 2010, 11:21 am
@Taahirah: lmao
Grant10 wasnt invited
sorry Grant but htis made my day
i’m still cracking
LTHTT
17 Mar 2010, 11:21 am
well done mr swart! about time somebody said lets do something about it, cos the players often dont seem to know what the hell the ref is blowing.
our scrum factory come gametime is more like a scrum
lottery.@wpw: K@K funny …i agree
17 Mar 2010, 11:25 am
Pieter De villiers (French Prop) should also have been part of this team.
17 Mar 2010, 11:28 am
@Taahirah: Haha! Brilliant!
Seems a good initiative, although steady Eddie is a concern. Rather get old Garvey involved. Next we’ll be calling up Schalk Britz to the panel. I don’t agree with 1 comment though “most of the times they get the calls right!” If this is true, its because 51% of the time they get it right and 49% of the calls are wrong. Its a lottery.
17 Mar 2010, 11:33 am
Thabo Mbeki hasn’t got much on his plate let’s get him in the mix…
17 Mar 2010, 11:37 am
@Sonito:
I saw him in Cape Town last year (Gardens Centre Mall)
He has legs like tree trunks!!!
17 Mar 2010, 11:39 am
@gunther:
Aai tog. Kyk waar val djy uit!!!
17 Mar 2010, 11:39 am
@gunther: thabo was ascrumhalf @ sussex, he has no experience to impart on the front-row
17 Mar 2010, 11:44 am
@wpw: Do you mean that dogs constantly pee against him?
17 Mar 2010, 11:47 am
Transie
Come now if old fly halves know everything there is to know about front row play then surely old scrum halves have something to offer..
wpw
are you soli philander?
17 Mar 2010, 11:48 am
@katman:
hahahaha
17 Mar 2010, 11:49 am
@gunther:
Nope.
Soli is on Cape Talk as we speak!!
17 Mar 2010, 11:54 am
@gunther: 5
He did bench press more than Os, according to JW.
17 Mar 2010, 12:04 pm
Ever heard Balie Swart talk? When he speaks Afrikaans he ends every sentence with né – “Hulle moet skrum né. Hy druk so né, en hy moet weer so maak né.”
We won’t be having any scrum problems if players were picked in their right positions. Fat John and Heinke vd Merwe are not tightheads and should not be played in that position.
17 Mar 2010, 12:08 pm
good idea ! realy is a good idea
17 Mar 2010, 12:09 pm
@Taahirah: hahaha !!!
17 Mar 2010, 12:17 pm
Nama
Hell if he bench pressed more than os let’s get him involved..
17 Mar 2010, 12:20 pm
@gunther:
Say what you want about Eddie but he is doing great things among the disadvantaged in Cape Town.
17 Mar 2010, 12:20 pm
Just pick the Stormers scrum plus Victor and the Boks will be just fine!!!
17 Mar 2010, 12:25 pm
Joshua Foundation
“Impacting youth empowering them to become agents of change”
Using the platform we as professional sportsman have to impact lives for good by not giving handouts but hand ups!
17 Mar 2010, 12:28 pm
wpw
That’s great..
and?
17 Mar 2010, 12:30 pm
@wpw: 25. “not giving handouts but hand ups” – expect some handouts to the consultants and advisers of the Joshua Foundation – it is the way of NGOs and Charities.
17 Mar 2010, 12:35 pm
Lesson one in this sessions….
1. Don’t play players out of position….
Lesson two….
2. When no 1 apllied, work on technique in spesialized positions…by specialists…
17 Mar 2010, 12:39 pm
Heavens Game
you cynic..are you insinuating that he drives around in a nice big company bakkie?
17 Mar 2010, 12:47 pm
@Blouste: we dropped some places didnt we ?
17 Mar 2010, 12:48 pm
@gunther: 29. Cynic? A cynic would say he drives around in a Mercede Benz as in the proverbial waBenzi.
17 Mar 2010, 12:48 pm
@gunther:
I admire him for ‘giving back’ to the community and for trying to make a difference.
Not many former players do!!
17 Mar 2010, 12:49 pm
So let’s see. Did they involve:
Cobus Visagie? No.
Marius Hurter? Nope.
Willie Meyer? No.
Kees Lensing? Nah.
Insert name of random prop? No.
But did they put Eddie “The Contortionist” Andrews on the payroll? Oh yes.
Well, there goes the credibility of this initiative.
17 Mar 2010, 12:55 pm
@poppa69:
Hell yes !!!
GSP the big perpetrator !!!
Now like the Lions, in a rebuilding phase
17 Mar 2010, 12:58 pm
@poppa69:
The S14 log still looks nice though…
17 Mar 2010, 13:05 pm
eddie andrews was a more than capable loosehead – form loosie in the early years of JW’s reign both in workrate and in scrummaging. his fall from grace only occurred when he was shifted to tighthead in order to become specialist bench cover (since os had made the loosie position his own).
he’s hardly the first loosie (or hooker) to fail at becoming a tighthead midway through career, and he’ll unlikely be the last (heinke).
17 Mar 2010, 13:10 pm
33 Tac-
Cobus, is not going to give up his gig in the UK as Brendan Venters right hand man at Saracens..
Can they please take Graham Rowntree as part of the team…
17 Mar 2010, 13:15 pm
@Tacitus: Maybe Eddie will make up a nice balance. “what not to do” could be his message.
Look at Vlok Cilliers. He was not by any stretch of the imagination a great kicker in his playing days but he sure as hell has worked wonders with Morne Steyn and the other youngsters at the Bulls.
17 Mar 2010, 13:19 pm
Eddie Andrews – some may say he is might be a “quota” scrum doctor. No wings there, so an AA appointment to “right the wrongs of the past”?
17 Mar 2010, 13:21 pm
@Beertjie:
Hmmm. So you’re saying that due to the Vlok Cilliers example, we should always look for the LEAST suitable guy to train guys in any specific discipline?
As in, get Naas Botha to teach tackling, Ruan Pienaar to teach kicking at goal, McNeil Hendriks to do the wings’ speed training, Keegan Daniel to teach the guys about how to build muscle mass and Sireli Naquelivuki to teach them about focus and a high work rate?
17 Mar 2010, 13:23 pm
@Tacitus:33
He may be able to give good advice on “how NOT to be a contortionist when you’re a prop” to the youngsters then.
Come on, Eddie used to hold his own against most of his opponents, much like all the props we used since readmission. Never in the past 20 years did we have a front row who could demolish the opposition front row, like England did with the Aussies a few years ago.
Not even when Os and Tommy were there.
17 Mar 2010, 13:26 pm
@nama1: 41. Don’t forget England (2 men down) demolishing the All Blacks in NZ. It won’t happen again for many years but they held off a NZ attempted pushover with a 6 or 7 man scrum.
17 Mar 2010, 13:35 pm
@Heavens Game:
Exactly.
Now when did we ever have a scrum who could put up that kind of performances. Certainly not in the past 20 years.
People singling out Eddie as a weak scrummer, always gets on my nerve. CJ Botha is worse than him, I reckon.
17 Mar 2010, 13:35 pm
All things are relative. The Irish scrumming situation make all things look rosy in South Africa. We have the worst scrum in the world’s top 10 and by a distance…..
I watch BJ Botha destroying loose-heads week in week out and wonder why on earth we can’t produce anything similiar. Quite simply when players are chasing the shekels you haven’t got much hope. But at least you can produce these players as opposed to Ireland who are sending a man out on a zimmerframe every week……
Anyway, happy Patricks day all…….
17 Mar 2010, 13:40 pm
@Tacitus: LOL
Percy holds every type of points and kicking record for the Boks. I don’t think he was a success as kicking coach (Ruaan Pienaar). The point is, coaching/teaching is not equal to being good at it yourself. However, you can be **** at both – like Flekkie
17 Mar 2010, 13:45 pm
PdV said on eNews just now that John Smit will rotate between
2 & 3 for the Boks.
17 Mar 2010, 13:46 pm
you guys crack me up!
First, Eddie was useless in the bok scrum, he was there during the kwota years and for that reason only. It seems history has repeated itself.
Secondly, It’s no use teaching hookers how to be tightheads. Even if you have the best teachers in the world. It’s like teaching Tacticus how to be a supermodel
17 Mar 2010, 13:46 pm
@nama1:
I agree bru.
He had a very good 2004 when the Stormers made the S12 semis and the Boks won the Tri Nations!!
17 Mar 2010, 13:47 pm
@nama1:
Who is CJ Botha??
You mean CJ VD Linde??
17 Mar 2010, 13:49 pm
Oops….CJ vd Linde
17 Mar 2010, 13:49 pm
@nama1:
Grant10 is gonna have a hernia!!!
17 Mar 2010, 13:52 pm
Saru manager of coaching Hilton Adonis has confirmed the meeting was successful from the union’s point of view.
… Hilton = problem nr 1
17 Mar 2010, 13:53 pm
as was reported YESTERDAY by sport24!
17 Mar 2010, 13:53 pm
@logie_Jumpbuck:
“…he was there during the kwota years”
You mean to tell me that the kwota years are over?
Tell that to Hondo, What, Kobus Kitty, Mielieboer and the likes and see where it gets you.
17 Mar 2010, 13:54 pm
well if PDV is going to still play Smit at 3 i suggest Boks organise games against Wynberg u 13 Girls School ….
Because i hear there u 15 team got a half decent loosehead….and we all know what half decent looseheads do to smit !!!
17 Mar 2010, 13:54 pm
This bok scrum will have no issues:
1.BJ
2.John Smit
3.Beast
4.Matfield
5.Bakkies
6.Schalk
7.Juan
8.Pierre
17 Mar 2010, 13:55 pm
@wpw:
Someone should warn him to take his pills before logging on.
17 Mar 2010, 13:56 pm
glad we doing this….about time.
Now can someone coach the coaches please….
1 st lesson…
we will never try and convert players at the highest level again.
Thanks….
lesson over.
17 Mar 2010, 13:57 pm
@nama1: i have no doubt they are over. every black/coloured/indian/purple/white player in the bok team deserves to be there at the moment. as for the south african S14 teams, i can think of a couple of players on either side of the grey line that can be replaced by players waiting in the wings…..excuse the pun.
17 Mar 2010, 13:58 pm
PDV….I have stood up for you since day 1….
You choose Smit at 3 and its all over rover…goodnite nurse…thanks for coming but now buggeroff!!!
Sorry…but then PDV is selling his soul…..stuff that!
17 Mar 2010, 13:58 pm
Oh, he is here already.
Stay calm G10.
We need you here to point out the obvious weaknesses in the Bok team that the coaching staff don’t see or don’t want to see.
17 Mar 2010, 13:59 pm
Fantastic idea. Can’t wait to see the fruits.
Dougie Heymans. Now there is a man who knows the scrum.
Get Piet Bester involved. The most destructive tighthead dwarf ever in the game!!!
17 Mar 2010, 13:59 pm
its a good idea to have such an academy/mentoring school to filter good technique down to ALL levels.
mike cron did the same in nz didnt he?
not that it seems to have worked for them of late.
but the aussies seem to be coming right in a big way and thank goodness, i was getting a little tired of collapsed scrums.
grant, the floor is yours
17 Mar 2010, 14:02 pm
@nama1:
Oh dear!!!
17 Mar 2010, 14:03 pm
@logie_Jumpbuck:
I with you on that.
It just seems that some people expect the coloured/black player to be the finished product when he gets selected while they are willing to afford the white player the chance to develop within the team while playing.
Hence de Jongh is a quota while v/d Heever is not.
17 Mar 2010, 14:03 pm
@rangerman:
17 Mar 2010, 14:04 pm
I always thought that the stronger guys are the best scrummagers. So just let them arm-wrestle and get on with it….the problem of course is that Bismark will probable beat everyone.
17 Mar 2010, 14:04 pm
You know sometimes you guys are really flippin stupid. This is an article about an organised initiative to sort out our supposed scrum problem and most of the comments have as usual stooped to name calling and insults hurled at those who were there. Eddie this, and why isn’t so and so there,….the point is, there’s a co-ordinated effort by a bunch of guys with a great deal of experience between them, players and ref’s included, to build up a program that can only do a great deal of good, from schoolboy level up.
We all know that this is unlikely to make JS a great no 3, or stop PDV from picking him there, but it can only bear fruit in years to come.
17 Mar 2010, 14:04 pm
vd heever is a legend in the making
17 Mar 2010, 14:05 pm
Wat gaan hier aan
17 Mar 2010, 14:05 pm
@stormersboy: 68. Well said.
17 Mar 2010, 14:07 pm
@nama1: Only the single-minded bloggers on here think that way mate. It must be hell living in a country and having to come to terms with the fact that things have changed every single day.
17 Mar 2010, 14:07 pm
@rangerman: 63
you make a good point…it is a great idea.
17 Mar 2010, 14:07 pm
@nama1:
#66
That is spot on!!!
17 Mar 2010, 14:07 pm
@grant10: “well if PDV is going to still play Smit at 3 i suggest Boks organise games against Wynberg u 13 Girls School ….”
You have issues dude…
Stop repeating youself.
It’s like repeptitive verbal diarrhoea being spewed all over this site….
Please stop. It’s the same thing every day
17 Mar 2010, 14:08 pm
@nama1: 61
Bloody blind bats those 3 wise men….Gold and Muir??
Bloody hell man…2 x clowns….PDV must start taking action….no more farking around with the turbo reverse scrums….
17 Mar 2010, 14:09 pm
@Mielieboer: a legend who needs to learn how to tackle hey? he should really fire Naas and get a different tackling coach
17 Mar 2010, 14:10 pm
@nama1: 65
De Jongh a quota???
Smit is more of a bloody quota than De Jongh!! [ at 3 that is ].
17 Mar 2010, 14:11 pm
give away 2 tries, but go on to score 4 … i know what i’ll choose
17 Mar 2010, 14:11 pm
@stormersboy:
Exactly. Point well made
17 Mar 2010, 14:12 pm
@nama1: But that’s ridiculous. People who call players like de Jongh a quota shouldnt be taken seriously
17 Mar 2010, 14:13 pm
@WP_: 75
Who died and made you the bloody boss here??
Use the scroll button you illy Smit apologist…..dont let me bother you…..
the truth hurts hey…
17 Mar 2010, 14:14 pm
illy is silly
17 Mar 2010, 14:14 pm
People with long memories will remember that I called for the establishment of a scrum school of some sort after our scrum were annihilated during the EOY tour.
It seems as if people in high places also read this site.
17 Mar 2010, 14:15 pm
@grant10: The rather funny thing is that you think you are the boss…
“Smit apologist” – wow you are beyong help…
17 Mar 2010, 14:16 pm
i’m not a fan of J Smit .. but if its between him and d00s Luke … i’ll support JS 1000000%
17 Mar 2010, 14:17 pm
@grant10: Luke doos Watson wanker apologist.
17 Mar 2010, 14:18 pm
@WP_:
hehehe
There is no hope for him!!!
17 Mar 2010, 14:19 pm
Guys, please ignore Mielieboer!!
17 Mar 2010, 14:20 pm
@wpw: Haha, I know.
Help us!
17 Mar 2010, 14:29 pm
Mielieboer @ 69 – yes a legend like Naas Botha – starts the game clean and ends clean – that dude can’t tackle Dollie Parton on helium mate. He is a waste of time.
17 Mar 2010, 14:33 pm
I think John Smit is a great tighthead
17 Mar 2010, 14:37 pm
@Richie_7: you think like a moron…a ******….
17 Mar 2010, 14:39 pm
@Richie_7: 92. In fact he is the best the Boks have got. He is a legend.
They may soon call him up to the scrum school too. Face it, he has played at 1,2 and 3 at test match level.
He is a Fed Mendez with great leadership qualities. The best ever, in fact.
No Captain has led a team to WC victory, BI Lions victory, 3N victory and 3-duck over the AB’s (1987 WC Champs).
17 Mar 2010, 14:40 pm
@Heavens Game: 94. No other captain in the history of Rugby.
17 Mar 2010, 14:42 pm
@grant10: Yeah, and you ramble on and on like Malema. For a guy who lives in Clifton you need to get out more. Slap on that white speedo and hit the beach, go for one of those massages with the happy endings in Sea Point, or work on your float for the yearly parade.
Your infatuation with JS is bordering on stalking right now
17 Mar 2010, 14:44 pm
Smit training players at 3?
Like the Pope appearing in a porn movie…..
Not a pretty sight….
and not likely to happen.
However….Smit will be able to present the course on how to reverse at 0 to 100 km per hour without doing a hammie….
17 Mar 2010, 14:45 pm
@Richie_7: 96
And yout retardation and moronic ramblings are bordering on the criminally insane….
17 Mar 2010, 14:48 pm
@grant10: You and your vendetta is hilarious.
Get a fking life dude!
How ironically apt that you should mentioned the following AS IT DIRECTLY APPLIES TO YOU, YOU DIMWTTED DOOS:
“And your retardation and moronic ramblings are bordering on the criminally insane….”
17 Mar 2010, 14:49 pm
@grant10: Tell you what son, go back to rambling about John Smit and how much you dislike seeing him in the #3 jersey, or your self termed “turbo reverse” theory. At least sound half intelligent and manage to fool half the people here
17 Mar 2010, 14:49 pm
If they manage to roll out proper coaching prgrams at schools, and if this prevents just one neck injury, then I’ll considder it a success. If it breeds some scrumming monsters like Tommy Loubscher but with the mobility of a Robbie Kempson then so much the better.
Hey! Kempo is there. There must be an open bar.
17 Mar 2010, 14:49 pm
@Richie_7: It’s highly disturbing.
Tread carefully, this man has serious mental issues…
17 Mar 2010, 14:50 pm
LOL
You okes are such ladies…
17 Mar 2010, 14:54 pm
Everyone talks about the rugby brain of FdP, I reckon Smit actually has the best rugby brain of all. Some have said he was actually the person coaching the Boks (but we all know thats not true).
What player in the history of the game can take on all three positions in the front row with aplomb.
And that grubber…
Skills of the highest order.
17 Mar 2010, 14:55 pm
@grant10: I wouldnt be laughing if I were you ********.
Seek professional guidance to help you get over you obsession and inane infatuation with John Smit.
17 Mar 2010, 14:57 pm
@Heavens Game: Exactly the man’s a legend and deserves all the praise he receives..
Those who abuse him display their ignorance for all too see…
17 Mar 2010, 14:58 pm
@WP_: 106. Too true.
17 Mar 2010, 14:59 pm
@grant10: it seems WP_ has his own personal vendetta against you Grant, he is hounding you on every thread, lmao
i saw you warning the GrantV fellow to skrik wakker if he intends on using that nic…
17 Mar 2010, 15:00 pm
Just pick the right frickin players!!!
There doesn’t seem to be too much wrong with the Bulls, Cheetas and Stormers scrum??
Drop the Guppies!!
17 Mar 2010, 15:02 pm
Overall, I think it is a step in the right direction. We have serious problem at the monent with scrummaging and at least they have recognised it and want to rectify it.
Where they have selected the rightpeople or not is up for debate. However, I do believe that there is enough brains there to identify the problems that prevail and rectify them.
A good thing for me is that props will advise who they believe are the best scrummages in the country and not some guy who has never played there.
17 Mar 2010, 15:03 pm
@WP_: legends are infallible in your book? Well see what wyatt crockett did to the legend three weeks ago…you’re as good as your last game boet…
17 Mar 2010, 15:04 pm
@Transformation: Thanks for that bud!
17 Mar 2010, 15:05 pm
@Transformation: 111. That was a blip. Not to be repeated again. Surely…
And if it does, so what?
The Sharks loss against the Saders was not due to Smitty’s scrummaging.
17 Mar 2010, 15:06 pm
@Transformation: Didnt say he was infallable… I’m saying those who have a go at him for reasons other than being an average 3…
Basically I reckon when playing 2 he’s still the best option to start for the Boks..
17 Mar 2010, 15:08 pm
@Transformation: 108
LOL
They such little babies….the J Smit turbo reverse rah rah pom pom ladies….
cry me a river!!
17 Mar 2010, 15:09 pm
@Transformation: By the way… That wasnt his last game, lmao!
His last game was agianst the Brumbies mate…
@WP_: 114. And at 3 he gets by, not the best option but he’s as bad as people make out…
17 Mar 2010, 15:10 pm
@grant10: Real mature. How old are you 50 or 5?
17 Mar 2010, 15:11 pm
Crouch touch pause engage
17 Mar 2010, 15:13 pm
@Dawn: Bump ‘n grind..!!
17 Mar 2010, 15:14 pm
@WP_: 117
47 bud….and you?
17 Mar 2010, 15:15 pm
richie 7 is right…beach calls…
cheers all
outta here
17 Mar 2010, 15:15 pm
@grant10: 115. Did John Smit (Captain, Legend, WC Winner) ever spurn an advance from you, take your girlfriend/wife or insult your granny – because yor commentary on him is now showing “how to reverse at 0 to 100 km per hour without doing a hammie….”
17 Mar 2010, 15:18 pm
John Smit was a good player.
He was a VERY good captain.
He is no longer good enough for inclusion in the Bok team.
Just deal with it, give him his due honour and get a new captain so we can move on. That will solve everyone’s problems.
17 Mar 2010, 15:18 pm
@WP_: @Heavens Game:wyatt crockett is walking around christchurch saying “i shoved the sh*t out john smit, they’re whole scrum was in turbo reverse”, is he lying?
Benn Robinson can say the same, so can the French, Irish & Italian loosehead props.
The question is, has bismarck lost the form that forced the Springbok management to move the “best scrummaging hooker in the world” to tighthead?
17 Mar 2010, 15:20 pm
@Transformation: @111
I saw that 1 with my own eyes. I think Smit went off 3-4 times during that match for running-repairs, then subbed. I didnt rate Davey Crockett before or after either. Mind you, Beast was similarly smashed by Ben Franks and I rate him even less. Owen Franks, now there is a prop on the up !
I cant understand this obsession with taking frontrowers and making them cover all positions. If there is ever a position for specialists in rugby union then it is most certainly the front row. Check out da Malmuncha for eg. Scrums like a prop, because he is one. And throws like girl. And still they persevere…
17 Mar 2010, 15:21 pm
@Tacitus: you now officailly going to have to buy a bullet proof vest…..
i know of a decent deal….i have plenty….especially when i visit Durban….bugger the heat…i still wear 2 just in case i bump into Rangerman with that damn hunting rifle of his…
17 Mar 2010, 15:23 pm
@Transformation: Bissy has always been best coming on as an impact player,less time to get a yellow I presume..?
Smit should start at 2…and get back into happy hooking shape..!!
17 Mar 2010, 15:24 pm
@Tacitus: @Black Panther: @Black Panther: @Tacitus:
Please 3 wise men….stop all this treasonable talk….just because you all make perfect sense and speak truthfully does not exempt you from the gallows for dare suggesting Smit is struggling….
Come on now…i can understand the kiwi…but Tacitus and Transformation????
Clearly not allowed…all this sanity and honesty….sis man!!
17 Mar 2010, 15:25 pm
@grant10: 128
sorry…meant you as well transformation
17 Mar 2010, 15:27 pm
@Tacitus: That’s your opinion.
I have a feeling it might be diffent to old Uncle Snor’s opinion however.
@Transformation: Yes I think he has. I’d say he should be benched for the Boks this year. But even then pressure is being put on by G Botha and T Libenberg…
17 Mar 2010, 15:28 pm
@grant10:
A common misconception is that your average Kevlar vest will stop any bullet hurtling in your direction. That is a fallacy.
Kevlar vests will stop handgun bullets, which usually travel at a velocity of between 800 and 1300 feet per second.
However, a hunting rifle bullet will travel at a velocity in excess of 2800 feet per second. It will shred straight through a Kevlar vest.
For protection against a rifle bullet, you would need something with ceramic plating at the front and back, and then it will most likely only be in functioning condition for a single impact.
That kind of thing is a bit heavy to wear around on your average visit to Durban, I would think.
So sorry, if Rangerman is out to get you with his hunting rifle, a lightweight protective vest ain’t gonna make much difference, unfortunately.
17 Mar 2010, 15:28 pm
@Tacitus: You wouldnt happen to have anyone in mind Tac? A certain Mr. Matfield perhaps?
17 Mar 2010, 15:30 pm
@WP_: Tac just wants Vic to get a chance,but at this rate him and Barney will retire at the same time imo…
17 Mar 2010, 15:31 pm
@grant10: @128
heres a bucket of cold water for you……
J.Wilko – “the greatest no10 ever” – in your humble opinion, dropped like a dogs dinner for Toby Drought.
It takes some longer to see the light I suppose. I suggest you stick to your frontrow, G10, because you cannae pick flyhalfs for jam.
17 Mar 2010, 15:32 pm
@Taahirah: 132. Anyone but Smit it seems.
17 Mar 2010, 15:33 pm
If Rangerman aims for your body with a hunting rifle it means he can’t shoot in any case, so you might just aswell walk around with no bp-jacket…
17 Mar 2010, 15:34 pm
@Tacitus: 131
iN THAT CASE THE sTORMERS GOING TO HAVE TO DO WITHOUT MY SUPPORT ON THE 8 MAY…..
FAILING WHICH I WILL WEAR A j sMIT SHARKS NO 3 JERSEY…..THOSE SHARKIES WILL NEVER GUESS ITS g10!!!
sorry caps
17 Mar 2010, 15:36 pm
@Black Panther: 134
Good heavens…..i cant believe it….
hell the sharks will have him in a flash……
I suppose Morne Steyn now assumes the best in the world mantle BP??
17 Mar 2010, 15:37 pm
@Blouste: 136
No…i reckon the bugger will pin me with 1 between the eyes!!
17 Mar 2010, 15:39 pm
@grant10: 137. In that case, you must be a WC winning, BI Lions conquering, AB 3-duck leading, 3N prevailing Bok Captain and legend too…
17 Mar 2010, 15:45 pm
@Heavens Game: 140
Nah….not quite…..
but i had my lesser moments.
17 Mar 2010, 15:46 pm
@grant10:
Morne the Metronomic is certainly proving himself to be more than just a kicking FH this year, as Ive said for a while. No problem recognising exceptional talent when its due, G10. And the Boks will be far harder to beat when he does finally decide to stop kicking the leather off the pill. Surely Ireland and France proved that beyond all reasonable doubt.
The only thing that marked out Wilko as more than a kicking FH (eg a G.Fox or Naasty Boota) was his incredible ability in the tackle. But with ever more suffocating defensive patters in modern rugby, he looked more and more woefully limited. Morne cant tackle other than scragging but he has added real variety this year, no doubt.
17 Mar 2010, 15:54 pm
@Black Panther: well…sadly it seems the legend has had father time and an ailing injured body catch up with him.
Seems Johnson doesent suffer from the sentimentality disease that so suffocates SA Rugby.
DC ,Giteau and MS…..
3 helleva talented 10 s….
17 Mar 2010, 15:57 pm
@Black Panther:
142. Hello BP.
Morne Steyn was, if remember correctly, the top try scorer in the junior world cup, and at inside centre! There’s nothing wrong with his defence/attack.
17 Mar 2010, 15:58 pm
@Black Panther: 142. Can agree here. Wow, whats happening, BP you speak sense above.
17 Mar 2010, 16:00 pm
@grant10: Wilkinson has taken a lot of punishment in recent weeks and had to go off against Scotland. He’ll be our 10 at the World Cup, just needs to recover.
17 Mar 2010, 16:01 pm
@grant10: 141. Thats alright then, off to some coaching by Smitty and then you will easily deputise.
17 Mar 2010, 16:03 pm
@Big Hit: 146. Wilko needs a scrumhalf with rapid service and a decent pass.
17 Mar 2010, 16:03 pm
@Heavens Game: 147
No thanks….
i can turbo reverse without any assistance from cappie…
17 Mar 2010, 16:04 pm
@Heavens Game: agree Danny Care isn’t the man for No.9, Johnno’s been slow on that one (as slow as Care’s service actually)
17 Mar 2010, 16:04 pm
@grant10:
fella, Wilko was limited even back in his glory days. He played behind the best and most brutish Engl pack ever who earned him all those pens he built his reputation on. And he tackled like no other FH before or since. But I can only remember 1 or 2 flashes of individual flair winning matches, and Ive lived in UK throughout his entire career.
1 thing I do blame him for is this ridiculous proliferation of constipated prayer-meeting poses that has spread like a disease ever since he came on the scene. Have you seen Quade Cooper kick ?! somethings not right, I feel the need to book a session with my chiropractor after every Reds match now. Maybe he;s friendly with Adam Parore…..(thats one for the Kiwi fellas !).
Well, MS is a v.nice player but he’s still no DC. You dont see DC being hauled like MS was on EOYT’09. But he’s added alot more to his game this season and for that reason his upside is huge.
Sorry, but I dont fall in the Giteau-as-messiah brigade. A little genius, yes. But at FH he is far too individualistic, a touch of the King Carlos about him. Far better at 12.
17 Mar 2010, 16:04 pm
@Big Hit: 146
JW …a legend….my all time favorite 10….never ever shirked a tackle….what a star…..may he be 100% come WC time.
17 Mar 2010, 16:06 pm
@Heavens Game: @145
I apologise for calling you an ‘arrogant finger-pointing moron’ in my last entry. Youre not a finger-pointer at all.
17 Mar 2010, 16:07 pm
@Black Panther: 151
LOL
Yeah….agree about Gits….
DC….I hate to admit….scares the **** out of me….
as does Hayma….
What is he rumour that Hayman may go to Toulon instead of home??
He seems to be a mercenary of some note!
17 Mar 2010, 16:07 pm
@Big Hit: 150. Unrelated to that, I can’t understand the the dip in form of Armitage. Foden is a good replacement, though.
17 Mar 2010, 16:08 pm
@Black Panther: such nonsense, Wilkinson was our top line-breaker back in 2002/03, yes even more than the likes of Jason Robinson
@grant10: he will be, getting our pack right is more important however.
17 Mar 2010, 16:09 pm
@Heavens Game: Armitage was out injured for 3/4 months and never re-discovered his form. Foden has done well when he came on but France in Paris will be the acid test for him.
17 Mar 2010, 16:09 pm
@Black Panther: 153. Its alright then.
17 Mar 2010, 16:10 pm
@Big Hit: i bet you looking for a turbo reverse 3 …because them scrums are really not very important are they BH???
17 Mar 2010, 16:11 pm
BLOODY HELL….THINGS TO DO…
CHEERS
OUTTA HERE
17 Mar 2010, 16:14 pm
@Big Hit: 157. The backline looks like they have the same coach as the Sharks. No plan beyond 1st phase. There is no backrow link play either.
17 Mar 2010, 16:14 pm
@grant10: lol we have a decent scrum, it’s their work around the park that is the problem. Give me Beast/BDP/Smit/Matfield/Botha in our pack any day, they’re on a whole other world compared to Payne/Hartley/Deacon/Borthwick etc
17 Mar 2010, 16:15 pm
@Heavens Game: no decent ball is the biggest problem, everything is so slow. Best option is just to kick it or be smothered.
17 Mar 2010, 16:17 pm
@Big Hit: 162. Payne and Hartley are not bad and Borthwick has some good days, but he needs to stop the “We’re improving, everything is tra la la in the post-match interview”
17 Mar 2010, 16:19 pm
@grant10:
Hayman is King, long live the King.
Yep, looks like Toulon are waving the open cheque under his nose. The guy is a simple man of the land, he knows his time as a World-class pro sportsman is short so clearly holds that in priority to a RWC-glory. It tears my heart out, but cant really criticise him either. He certainly gave muchos pleasure when donning Black.
I hope its merely bargaining chips with the NZRU….
Not too distraught, the Owen Franks and Clint Newlands’ give me some cause for optimism however.
(*sob sob*……who am I kidding….).
@Big Hit:
the only ‘nonsense’ is your inability to see that the rugby World passed Wilko by many many moons ago. DC and Giteau and, lately, Morne too, make more linebreaks in 1-2 matches than Wilko has in the past 7 years. No pack, no Wilko.
17 Mar 2010, 16:21 pm
@Big Hit: 163. Yeah its like the forwards and backline are coached to death with separate drills and specialist coaches and ne’er the twain shall meet.
Hold on, but that is exactly what is happening.
A pity Woodward is not doing Andrew’s job to give Johnno a bit of guidance, and someone get rid of Brian Smith.
17 Mar 2010, 16:23 pm
@Black Panther: 165. Oh well, the AB’s have “bought the farm” on that one.
Hold on, didn’t they actually try and do that for Hayman.
17 Mar 2010, 16:24 pm
@Black Panther: no pack, no any flyhalf. People were calling for Giteau to be replaced by Barnes not long ago because his pack were struggling and there wasn’t much running out of Carter in Hamilton when his forwards were getting pounded.
Wilko makes breaks for Toulon all the time. Here’s one of his tries for example, youtube.com/watch?v=grcvKskeFJI
You have hit on a jey point however, we need to sort our pack out before the RWC.
17 Mar 2010, 16:25 pm
@Heavens Game: agree with that, there’s no cohesion, it might be time for SCW to return in Andrew’s position
17 Mar 2010, 16:27 pm
@Black Panther: #125 i remember when you came back from the game, in your first post you admitted that the words “turbo reverse” flashed across your mind while you watched wyatt crockett drill smit into doing some contortionist like exercises.
17 Mar 2010, 16:28 pm
@Big Hit: 169. It will never happen. The RFU love SCW like a bullet in the head.
17 Mar 2010, 16:31 pm
fdp signs with the japanese after wc 2011
17 Mar 2010, 16:40 pm
@Big Hit: @168
clearly we didnt watch the same game. In Hamilton, DCs comeback vs Boks, AB pack were minced in 1stH, and yet DC nearly stole the match singlehandedly in the 2ndH, giving the pack some momentum – changing the focus of the game entirely – and with 1 last kick was a fingertip away from a victory for the ABs.
Far more better examples the previous year when DC was the best player on the park in 1st 2 Tests with McCaw out and the pack completely shorn of experience after the post-RWC defections. He was stunning in beating the Boks in Weiington, but far more so in Dunedin where the Boks won despite the Blacks being down to the bare bones in the pack and almost played the Wallabies on his own in the defeat in Sydney.
Wilko only plays well behind a dominant pack and is badly exposed behind a poor one. Youve had 2 consecutive seasons to figure that one out, mores the pity that joke has finally come to an end.
But then I do seem to recall you basing an entire argument about DC being “soft vs France in Cardiff” despite him being injured off the entire 2ndH. And then turning around and excusing Wilko and others for years of poor form on the basis of injury (see Armitage above/elsewhere).
17 Mar 2010, 16:44 pm
@Black Panther: DC threw an intercept (and the game) to JDV trying to create behind a beaten pack, similarly he struggled at Twickenham when the English pack were on top in the first half. Carter is fortunate he always plays behind a pack which produces quick ball so he’s rarely exposed but it doesn’t surprise me much when he is and he gets that helpless puppy look on his face.
17 Mar 2010, 16:46 pm
@Heavens Game: true, but Francis Baron is moving on this summer so perhaps there will be an opening for Woodward. Hope so anyway.
@grant10: is this breaking news? doesn’t seem like the type to leave home.
17 Mar 2010, 16:48 pm
@Transformation:
must have been the jetlag, I was a mere few hours off the flight from Heathrow. What other answer could I have to thinking about G10 ?!
truly, that whole Bok Test frontrow were embarrassing that day, to a man. Bismarck doing his cocked-fist routine to a defenceless player on his back, you know the games up at that stage. I lost count of how many ‘bloodbins’ Smit took (aka ‘breathers’).
mores the pity, my father-in-law bought my daughter a Crusaders top and now she wont take the bloody thing off. Like a blunt poke in the eye to a Highlanders fan.
17 Mar 2010, 16:50 pm
@Big Hit: @174
ah, the English. You gotta love them. Noone else can quite turn a 13-pt home loss around and make it sound like a rousing victory. Lap.
17 Mar 2010, 17:30 pm
Wow. Grant, dude. You need serious help. I am serious!!
17 Mar 2010, 22:42 pm
The Kiwis have had a one man scrum shop in Mike Cron for years now. Its about time SARU woke up.
Not sure why you need so many involved – just one “mastah”.
What tyou do noeed is a scum workshop for refs. They need to learn the basics of scrum reffing.
In order of importance:
1) Penalise players who drop teh bind. When your arm is above your head, you cant wiggle your sjhoulders and drop teh srrum. This is non negotiable. Hands on floor is dropping teh bind. Immediate penalty.
2) Assuming no binds dropped, you can start looking for bent backs. Bent back the only way to drop the scrum if bound (although more chance of prop hurting himself).
3) Assuming 1 and 2 true, look for hips above shoulders. You have to push downwards to drop the scrum if you cant wiggle shoulders or bend back. This would be a last resort to drop teh scrum, as you will be limitedalready is limited as you cannot push down very hard.
4) Boring in – this should come last and is an obvious one to spot. If this is there, it overrides 1, 2 and 3 and is an immediate penalty.
Ref’s dont seem to understand that the first three requirements are in order. They will often penalise a player for a bent back when the opposing player has his hand on the ground and is ******** himn around with a low shoulder for example.
18 Mar 2010, 09:19 am
@WP_: Are you perhaps Roxy Smit?
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