I really find it quite amusing how you cloak your anti WP posts in supposed “logic” all based on the fact that the Bulls won the Super 14 and therefore deserve to have practically the whole team in the Springboks, and basically regard any of the other unions as irrelevant when it come to the National set up.

Let me ask you this: When the Crusaders were dominating the Super competition how many of their players were in the All Black run on team??

Work on that and come back to me (yes i’ve researched the answer)

But if I was Bok coach and we were playing a big test match, Duane would be my #8

Though Pierre Spies shines when the game is open and expansive, he often tends to fade away when the going gets tough, resulting in the two flankers having to work a lot harder and not giving them freedom play as they like.

Duane’s tactitcal and positional play is a bit superior to Spies’s. Duane makes a lot more tackles during a game and hits a lot more rucks (on the attack and defense), which is why you hardly see Spies making any turnovers.

I agree with Cane, altho I would have to say “one of”.

The Brick with Eyes was an immense player. Have you forgotten 1999 RWC, esp the Final, and the Brumbies of that era (2 titles) ? Finnegan was the dominant player, let alone no6.

@john123(john123)-63: agree, too much focus on pace, it ain’t 7s

@Black Panther(Black Panther)-78: this is like cane saying Owen Finegan was the best 6 in the last decade, good players not great.

My ideal 8 is Vermuelen’s brain in Spies’ body.

Kankowski can’t cut it at Bok level and should be dropped now to groom another 8.

My opinion (not that it matters) is that although Spies is not the most complte 8 in SA he should still be the Bok 8 because of his athleticism. I feel that if we structure our play around him just a little more by find ways to include him in set moves to better utilise his strengths then both the player and the team will benefit. Someone with that amount of pace and strengh is just always going to be difficult to deal with and we should take advantage of that when where in the opposition half.

Yes, he doesn’t tackle briliantly but unless I’m mistaken, and I could be, I don’t remember it ever costing the Boks or Bulls too badly.

And yes, he can be a little anonymous in tight games but what do you expect? He’s a ball carrier! He can’t run it up if we’re always in our own half, always on the back foot or we don’t have the ball for long periods.

Parrise sure is some player. He would fly in to most top teams, if not all of them.

Big Joe is the best SA no8. Im a big fan, always have been. All the attributes, incl the X-factor gene known as ‘mongrel’. Spies may be built like a thoroughbred but I dont see any mongrel in his eyes. For eg, Zinny and Buck Shelford – I still cant split them as to who is Best AB no8 – both had mongrel in spades.

Spies is still young tho. Zinny didnt really come in to his own until ’94 Bok tour of NZ where he seemed to grow arms and legs. He was King. But it was only ‘promise’ prior to that.

refer above.

He was an awesome no8.

Wasnt including Teich enough for your delicate disposition ?

I dont expect you to show too much respect to any non-Safa tho, Katman. I recall the ‘respect’ you showed to Bill McLaren and it gives me cold-shudders.

Toutai Kefu

60 Test caps.

On debut was rampant as Wallabies beat England 76-0.

1 x RWC – possibly Wallabies best player throughout the tournament. 1 x RWC RunnerUp medal.

2 x TriN titles.

Countless heartbreaking performances – in NZs eyes – in Bledisloes.

Fantastic player.

There is a rumour that the odd player outside Pretoria knows how to play the game.

Stop using hyperboles

The young man is good,but still has too many deficiencies

Best ever 8′s…Not even close as of yet..Not even close to Toutai kefu…Zinzan Brooke is the benchmark

Fair enough.

Thats why the HYBRID is the ultimate achievement.Problem is the athletic body-shape is prone to injury especially in loosies.

Ex:characteristics(1.87m-1.94m,105-112kg)

-Joe van Niekerk
-Pierre Spies
-Bok Skinstad
-Ron Cribb
-Imanol Harinodiqouy
-Simon Taylor
-James Haskell
etc

Mmm…nah, I think he was referring to Bulls players. Who could it be?

You need a blend of mobile and brutal – and if they both come in the same package then all the better.

Spies is a package. Sometimes he makes basic errors but the guy is irreplacable. My favourite is Spies in the tackle picking players up and driving them backwards – he is also good to watch on the gallop but in test against top teams he won;t have as much oppurtunity to show his attacking strengths as he does his defense.

Also a great lineout option.