The danger of derbies
1 Mar 2011
RYAN VREDE believes the brutal physicality of the South African Super Rugby derbies have the potential to seriously undermine the Springboks’ World Cup campaign.
With the expanded Super Rugby tournament in its infancy, that appears to be a premature assertion. But you would have to present a convincing argument to alter my position, shaped by watching the controlled violence played out in Johannesburg, Bloemfontein, Cape Town and Durban in the past fortnight.
South African derbies have featured more ruck cleans and counter rucks than in the Australian equivalent. Furthermore, South African derbies totalled 26 more tackles than their Australian counterparts and 241 more than the all-Kiwi contests (that figure is significantly higher because of the cancelled Crusaders-Hurricanes match).
However, those statistics fail to reflect the brutality of the collisions in South African derbies. I don’t have access to technology that could accurately measure force at point of contact, so my view relies on the experience of watching derbies live and from South African players in interviews consistently confirming that the physicality of matches against Australasian teams pales in comparison to those against their countrymen.
The Saffa player has always been driven by the primal urge to pummel his brother into submission. The Australasian teams don’t share that mentality, preferring to strike with the rapier rather than establish their dominance by wielding the bludgeon.
What’s more, South African players, particularly forwards, are bigger, stronger and faster than they have been at any point in the country’s history and so possess a greater capacity to inflict serious injury.
It is no surprise that with the forward-orientated approach that characterises most South African derbies a string of talented forwards have already been injured, with varying degrees of seriousness.
Bulls’ hooker Gary Botha injured his collarbone in the opener against the Lions and will be out for another fortnight. Schalk Burger of the Stormers is expected to miss between two to three matches with a knee injury sustained against the Lions. Bulls lock Bakkies Botha is doubtful for their match against the Highlanders as he is being treated for serious bruising to his foot.
However, the most significant injury is that of Cheetahs and Springbok blindside flank Juan Smith, who tore his Achilles tendon on Friday against the Bulls and faces a lay-off of between six and nine months, almost surely ruling him out of the World Cup. Smith, with the intense physicality of South African derbies, won’t be the last marquee Springbok to suffer this fate.
There are still 16 derbies to play in the next four months. Ominously the physicality will only increase the fitter the players get and the closer we get to the play-offs.
When the South African Rugby Union agreed to an expanded tournament they told us it was what locals wanted. Thousands of empty seats at those derbies thus far tell a different story. It speaks of the administrators’ greed and their lack of concern for the well-being of their prime assets.
In signing on for an expanded tournament they showed no appreciation for superior physicality of South African derbies when compared to those contested between Australasian teams. It was a shortsighted decision that has the potential to seriously undermine the Springboks’ World Cup defence.
COMPARISONS BETWEEN THE COLLISIONS IN DERBIES
SA derbies tackle stats – 1054 tackles made @ an average of 132 per game
Lions v Bulls – 70/203
Cheetahs v Bulls – 169/142
Sharks v Cheetahs – 56/110
Stormers v Lions – 152/152
Aussie derbies tackle stats – 1028 tackles made @ an average of 128 per game
Rebels v Tahs – 138/119
Rebels v Brumbies – 214/73
Tahs v Reds – 156/120
Reds v Force – 112/96
NZ derbies tackle stats – 816 tackles made @ an average of 136 per game
Landers v Chiefs – 147/184
Blues v Crusaders – 82/118
Canes v Highlanders – 121/164
SA derbies ruck cleans (own ball and counter rucking)
Lions v Bulls – 261 and 43/ 129 and 104
Cheetahs v Bulls – 251 and 103/ 271 and 69
Sharks v Cheetahs – 184 and 23/ 93 and 78
Stormers v Lions – 218 and 76/ 259 and 64
Aussie derbies ruck cleans (own ball and counter rucking)
Rebels v Tahs – 194 and 53/ 178 and 55
Rebels v Brumbies – 107 and 97/ 315 and 45
Tahs v Reds – 166 and 72/ 263 and 70
Reds v Force – 157 and 60/ 158 and 55
Kiwi derbies ruck cleans (own ball and counter rucking)
Landers v Chiefs – 313 and 108/ 201 and 116
Blues v Crusaders – 193 and 57/ 156 and 65
Canes v Highlanders – 236 and 77/ 217 and 108
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360 Comments
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1 Mar 2011, 12:24 pm
@capo(capo)-95: Dude. Im coloured.
You dont find Marc Lottering funny? Google his take on why coloured people cant be terrorists.
1 Mar 2011, 12:24 pm
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-94:
Absolutely correct. Written by a half wit amatuer who can only get recognition if she is controversial.
Fire her for being an illiterate baffoon.
1 Mar 2011, 12:30 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-99: dont be silly.
you exposed yourself.
maybe you can repent like ed the lion?
p.s. i attempted to show you that colonialism wasnt just white people washing up on shore, but black tribes in search of pastures.
but you are obviously too thick for sensible discussion.
as you were you ignorant east capian
@Dawn(Dawn)-98: just read it. it was very poorly written and badly thought out.
give her anudda chans i say!
@John Galt(John Galt)-100: lucky man. cray season opens today but the sea is a bit of a mess so i will wait til the weekend before my first bug braai.
1 Mar 2011, 12:33 pm
I am worried about Morne Steyn. He has played noon stop rugga since the B&ILions and must mentally exhausted. He also has the added bonus that the Bulls donnot have a second flyhalf to give M Steyn an rest!
J Msith is a huge loss as he a RWC winner and is our best forward!
1 Mar 2011, 12:33 pm
Haha, just seen the add for the coffee table book on the History of the Stormers!!! Should be called ‘Beaten Black and Blue’!!!
1 Mar 2011, 12:33 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-103: exposed myself hahaha as what? what did spooner expose himself as since you’re the arbiter and judge of morality on this blog ranger
1 Mar 2011, 12:34 pm
gunther and his mates like taahirah can mock coloured people but it’s very interesting to note the following from prof heese’s book: Professor Heese suggested a genetic mix for the average Afrikaner to be: 35.5% Dutch, 34.4% German, 13.9% French, 7.2% African/Asian/Khoi, 2.6% British, 2.6% Other European, and 3.5% undetermined. Hardly the ancestry you’d expect from such ardent segregationalists.
1 Mar 2011, 12:35 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-103:
OF COURSE we the only people who know what tik is!
That part made me
1 Mar 2011, 12:36 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-106: No, that would be Grant10!
1 Mar 2011, 12:36 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-103: yes you can paint me with all sort of stereotypes as you’ve done before, it makes no difference
clearly you get off on playing for the peanut gallery, who’ll be here any minute to cheer you on.
i’ve told you before i’m not the progeny of farm hands, get over it!
1 Mar 2011, 12:36 pm
@Taahirah(Taahirah)-101: listen here guinther’s buddy!i don’t find marc lottering funny so let’s just leave it at that.
1 Mar 2011, 12:37 pm
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-83:
Actually not! I’m carrying out interviews today and tomorrow. Quite time consuming and boring, but I’m in CT, and that is what matters.
@iori Yagami(iori Yagami)-85:
A bit early but will a bit later on!
1 Mar 2011, 12:38 pm
@capo(capo)-107:
who is an ardent segregationalist?
shut up now.
nobody cares what colour you are.
you are low class jiveass scum.
and that’s then end of it
1 Mar 2011, 12:40 pm
@capo(capo)-107: Dude. Which part of post 101 didnt you get?
My issue lies with those people who took the column to be an attack on coloured people, relating it to Jimmy’s comments. Whether or not it was funny is debatable. What is however beyond dispute is that it was an attempt at humor. She didnt set out to insult.
Dont be so touchy.
1 Mar 2011, 12:40 pm
all we need now is shaun pipjejoller and grantie and we will have a full house of whackjobs.
but for now let’s work with what we have.
1 Mar 2011, 12:40 pm
@capo(capo)-111: An exclamation mark. Wow.
You really showed me there.
1 Mar 2011, 12:42 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-110:
“playing for the peanut gallery”
Good one!
1 Mar 2011, 12:43 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-103: you suddenly trying to be a self-proclaimed protector of morality on this site but most of us know that you are nothing but a low-class racist and vile little man suffering from ‘last outpost’syndrome who believes that he is superior because of his so-called superior english education.you are scum squirrel hunter and are the kind of person that really sickens me!
1 Mar 2011, 12:43 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-103: what you seem to be impervious to rangerman is that whatever happened in the past is not commonly used to provoke people on this blog, i hardly ever here people making fun of the anglo/boer war concentration camps, imfecane or the holocaust.
but some protected species always go on about how good it was that this country was pillaged and colonised because the positives outweigh the negatives and they get away with it because apparently they’re only saying it to rile up the “chip on the shoulder brigade”
well i turned the tables and look at you now
1 Mar 2011, 12:43 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-110: whats wrong with the progeny of farmhands comrade?
the progeny of farmhands are the sons and daughters of the soil comrade.
you are a counter revolutionary and you have tendencies. bleddy agent
calm down transie, you like bob, we understand. he sent those bleddy english back to england eh?
what a man!
tell us what you think of gaddafi next please.
1 Mar 2011, 12:45 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-112: As you say, back in the Motherland
1 Mar 2011, 12:46 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-120:
Bonjour LeRangerman! You are in your element today!
1 Mar 2011, 12:46 pm
And another rugby blog goes down the tube labeled politics………………..
Get over yourselves, go to a DA, Afriforum or ANC meeting if you have issues. I’m sure your party of choice will listen to your all important views. As for me, I don’t give a rusty fark.
History of the Stormers!! Must be a lot of pictures in that book!!
1 Mar 2011, 12:47 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-110: hey, leave me out of it.
1 Mar 2011, 12:47 pm
@Pinky Kekana kills Beemer buys Merc(gunther)-113: i believe that it’s you mr wannabe comedian.you are the biggest low-life racist trash on this site together with yopur mates taahirah,woodycrossdresser,charo,shartks lover,rangerboytjie.why don’t you crawl back into the hole you came crawling out off!
1 Mar 2011, 12:51 pm
@capo(capo)-125: Yopur mates?
Im Jewish now?
Eish.
1 Mar 2011, 12:52 pm
@capo(capo)-118: thats about the biggest compliment i have had in years.
may the bile flow unimpeded from you until you are cleansed brother.
@Transformation(Transformation)-119: so you are saying that you are the same as all the people you detest?
or are you just so much smarter?
have you ever heard me making fun of someones suffering?
poor taste is poor taste wether you want to try and justify yourself or not pellie.
why does it matter so much to you that i think you are as ignorant as malema in this regard?
1 Mar 2011, 12:52 pm
@Taahirah(Taahirah)-126:
don’t confuse him
1 Mar 2011, 12:53 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-122:
ag, just keeping my mind nimble.
1 Mar 2011, 12:55 pm
@Pinky Kekana kills Beemer buys Merc(gunther)-113: so the man that loves to mock and racially attacks coloured people on this blog is nothing but a liquorice allsorts character himself now as per prof ja heese!
1 Mar 2011, 12:57 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-127: i am not your brother or your buddy you racist piece of gutter trash.
1 Mar 2011, 12:59 pm
@capo(capo)-131: Easy, pal. You need to calm the fck down.
1 Mar 2011, 13:00 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-120: pffft whatever, why would you care of opinions of a lying xhosa?
1 Mar 2011, 13:00 pm
@Taahirah(Taahirah)-126: another one very proud of their superior english education it seems.when all else fail it’s time to mock bloggers spelling and grammar mistakes!wow, i bow to you superiority!
1 Mar 2011, 13:01 pm
@capo(capo)-130:
capo.
when will you understand.
it’s not about colour.
it’s about class.
and you have none.
everybody knows what you are about…now and with your previous aliases.
1 Mar 2011, 13:01 pm
Well, if nobody is talking rugby, I would like my little political say:
“From the beginning of the Upper Paleolithic period, hunting and gathering cultures known as the Sangoan occupied southern Africa in areas where annual rainfall is less than a meter (1000 mm; 40 in),and today’s San and Khoi people resemble the ancient Sangoan skeletal remains. These Late Stone Age people in parts of southern Africa were the ancestors of the Khoisan people who inhabited the Kalahari Desert. Likely due to their region’s lack of suitable candidates for domestication, the Khoisan did not have farming or domesticated animals until a few hundred years before then, when they adopted the domesticated cattle and sheep of the Bantu that had spread in advance of the people’s actual arrival. The Bantu people, with advanced agriculture and metalworking technology developed in West Africa from at least 2000 BC, outcompeted and intermarried with the Khoisan in the years after contact and became the dominant population of Southeastern Africa before the arrival of the Dutch in 1642.
After the arrival of the Bantu, the Khoisan and their pastoral or hunter-gatherer ways of life remained predominant west of the Fish River in South Africa and in deserts throughout their region, where the drier climate precluded the growth of Bantu crops suited for warmer and wetter climates. It took the arrival of Mediterranean crops from Europe in the 17th century for the Bantu farmers, and later white Boer farmers, to spread to the rest of the country and begin replacing the Khoisan population. During the colonial era, the Khoisan survived in South Africa, Namibia and Botswana. Today many of the San live in parts of the Kalahari Desert where they are better able to preserve much of their culture and lifestyle.”
One could say South Africa was colonised well before the Europeans arrived couldn’t one?
1 Mar 2011, 13:03 pm
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-121:
Yeah I must say there is no place like this on mother earth mate! The beauty, the intelligent people and then the greatest sportsmen and woman in this country. I love adding water to batteries!
1 Mar 2011, 13:04 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-129:
How’s life treating you mate? I must say your team is quite impressive! Still early days, but looking good.
1 Mar 2011, 13:05 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-127: you think i care about what you think or call me? water of a duck’s back charlie
you may be “in your element” but you still using weak stereotypes to label me: a dishonest xhosa, a xenophobe who burns somalian spaza shops, a bleddy agent, a malema. these are all tired. get new material
1 Mar 2011, 13:06 pm
@capo(capo)-134: 2 more exclamation marks.
I am stunned.
When all else fails?
You are yet to respond to my post 114. Do you dispute that she at least attempted humor?
If yes; What specifically in the piece points to malicious intent as per you?
If no; can only other coloured people make fun of coloured stereotypes?
Or no one at all?
1 Mar 2011, 13:06 pm
ardent segregationist – heck that’s such big words, I’m not even sure if I am or not…. however I do know 3 things:
1. Marc Lottering is laugh out loud funny
2. NZ derbies are every bit as physical as SA derbies. After 10 years of excuses that we are always struggling because of extra travel, we now have uncovered something new to complain about…
3. I expect the Bulls and Sharks to do well in Super and CC rugby… and I’m already sick of the idea… Not that I care about the teams, but it means we might see up to 6 games with them in it. (Why go to the first, when you can see any of the other 5 life)
– The Super Rugby competition should be made smaller again. 3 NZ, 2 SA, 2 Oz and top Argentinean team (based in SA for travel reasons). Countries should decide who represent them with a local competition of choice (i.e. as many teams and format as you like, in our case a early CC?), but only players representing (contracted to) the local team can represent the team in Super competition.
– A Super Alternate competition will run. This competition will feature Japan, Fiji, Samoa, Tonga and the top team of Argentinia and every SanZar team not in Super A
The incentive to perform at top of your game in local competition will be clear. If you are not in top 3, you are going to loose some serious cash
1 Mar 2011, 13:06 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-137: Haha welcome home son, welcome home……
1 Mar 2011, 13:06 pm
@capo(capo)-125: only gtrash is you little yeast aftrebirth rubbish that you are
ur an insult to your people …
1 Mar 2011, 13:09 pm
@Pinky Kekana kills Beemer buys Merc(gunther)-135: everybody, accep your butt-licking pals ,know that you are nothing but racist scum old china!you have been mocking and racially abusing coloured people on this forum since your arrival on this site.you’ve got your friends like hg an the ones mentioned that finds you utterances very funny.you talk about class but it seems that you’ve got none yourself.how can a racist be classy?
1 Mar 2011, 13:10 pm
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-142:
Dis lekka in die Kaap bro!
1 Mar 2011, 13:11 pm
gtrash = trash
1 Mar 2011, 13:11 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-143: i left a message for you on the lambie mr low life racist plonker.quick to accept money from the the people that you so love to racially abuse and mock on this site ne down there at cattle baron,canal walk?
1 Mar 2011, 13:12 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-146:
Is gtrash turbo charged?
1 Mar 2011, 13:12 pm
@capo(capo)-144:
I mock universally.
with no respect to colour nor creed.
clearly you think irony is what you do to your shirts before you wear them.
1 Mar 2011, 13:14 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-146: don’t worry,you are forgiven for spelling mistakes due to your far super last outpost english education!
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