The danger of derbies
1 Mar 2011
RYAN VREDE believes the brutal physicality of the South African Super Rugby derbies have the potential to seriously undermine the Springboks’ World Cup campaign.
With the expanded Super Rugby tournament in its infancy, that appears to be a premature assertion. But you would have to present a convincing argument to alter my position, shaped by watching the controlled violence played out in Johannesburg, Bloemfontein, Cape Town and Durban in the past fortnight.
South African derbies have featured more ruck cleans and counter rucks than in the Australian equivalent. Furthermore, South African derbies totalled 26 more tackles than their Australian counterparts and 241 more than the all-Kiwi contests (that figure is significantly higher because of the cancelled Crusaders-Hurricanes match).
However, those statistics fail to reflect the brutality of the collisions in South African derbies. I don’t have access to technology that could accurately measure force at point of contact, so my view relies on the experience of watching derbies live and from South African players in interviews consistently confirming that the physicality of matches against Australasian teams pales in comparison to those against their countrymen.
The Saffa player has always been driven by the primal urge to pummel his brother into submission. The Australasian teams don’t share that mentality, preferring to strike with the rapier rather than establish their dominance by wielding the bludgeon.
What’s more, South African players, particularly forwards, are bigger, stronger and faster than they have been at any point in the country’s history and so possess a greater capacity to inflict serious injury.
It is no surprise that with the forward-orientated approach that characterises most South African derbies a string of talented forwards have already been injured, with varying degrees of seriousness.
Bulls’ hooker Gary Botha injured his collarbone in the opener against the Lions and will be out for another fortnight. Schalk Burger of the Stormers is expected to miss between two to three matches with a knee injury sustained against the Lions. Bulls lock Bakkies Botha is doubtful for their match against the Highlanders as he is being treated for serious bruising to his foot.
However, the most significant injury is that of Cheetahs and Springbok blindside flank Juan Smith, who tore his Achilles tendon on Friday against the Bulls and faces a lay-off of between six and nine months, almost surely ruling him out of the World Cup. Smith, with the intense physicality of South African derbies, won’t be the last marquee Springbok to suffer this fate.
There are still 16 derbies to play in the next four months. Ominously the physicality will only increase the fitter the players get and the closer we get to the play-offs.
When the South African Rugby Union agreed to an expanded tournament they told us it was what locals wanted. Thousands of empty seats at those derbies thus far tell a different story. It speaks of the administrators’ greed and their lack of concern for the well-being of their prime assets.
In signing on for an expanded tournament they showed no appreciation for superior physicality of South African derbies when compared to those contested between Australasian teams. It was a shortsighted decision that has the potential to seriously undermine the Springboks’ World Cup defence.
COMPARISONS BETWEEN THE COLLISIONS IN DERBIES
SA derbies tackle stats – 1054 tackles made @ an average of 132 per game
Lions v Bulls – 70/203
Cheetahs v Bulls – 169/142
Sharks v Cheetahs – 56/110
Stormers v Lions – 152/152
Aussie derbies tackle stats – 1028 tackles made @ an average of 128 per game
Rebels v Tahs – 138/119
Rebels v Brumbies – 214/73
Tahs v Reds – 156/120
Reds v Force – 112/96
NZ derbies tackle stats – 816 tackles made @ an average of 136 per game
Landers v Chiefs – 147/184
Blues v Crusaders – 82/118
Canes v Highlanders – 121/164
SA derbies ruck cleans (own ball and counter rucking)
Lions v Bulls – 261 and 43/ 129 and 104
Cheetahs v Bulls – 251 and 103/ 271 and 69
Sharks v Cheetahs – 184 and 23/ 93 and 78
Stormers v Lions – 218 and 76/ 259 and 64
Aussie derbies ruck cleans (own ball and counter rucking)
Rebels v Tahs – 194 and 53/ 178 and 55
Rebels v Brumbies – 107 and 97/ 315 and 45
Tahs v Reds – 166 and 72/ 263 and 70
Reds v Force – 157 and 60/ 158 and 55
Kiwi derbies ruck cleans (own ball and counter rucking)
Landers v Chiefs – 313 and 108/ 201 and 116
Blues v Crusaders – 193 and 57/ 156 and 65
Canes v Highlanders – 236 and 77/ 217 and 108
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360 Comments
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1 Mar 2011, 13:14 pm
@Pinky Kekana kills Beemer buys Merc(gunther)-149: the little outcast cant handle it boet , he sits and insults day in and day out in here and when he gets it back he cries like the little sniveling dog that he is
1 Mar 2011, 13:15 pm
@capo(capo)-144: Gunther does not have ay friends here.
He rides alone.
A one-man wolf pack he is.
1 Mar 2011, 13:15 pm
@capo(capo)-150: isnt there a truck for you to run in front of ? or a building to jump off……. do the world a favour dude
1 Mar 2011, 13:16 pm
i could say i pity capcrap , but that would be a waste , he aint worth anything
1 Mar 2011, 13:17 pm
The History of the Stormers! I wonder if it is factually based or written by the Argus.
1 Mar 2011, 13:18 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-154:
hiyas ratel ltnc
1 Mar 2011, 13:19 pm
@capo(capo)-147: should read lambie thread.don’t crucify me now sharks lover as i don’t possess(i think there might be far too many s’s in that word) your superior english eucation.
1 Mar 2011, 13:20 pm
The History of the Stormers! I hope there is a whole chapter on their Turbo-reverse scrumming techniques. They haven’t pulled their heads out of their arses since Robby Kempson stopped playing.
1 Mar 2011, 13:21 pm
@capo(capo)-157: what a sad little excuse for a human you are ?
1 Mar 2011, 13:21 pm
@Taahirah(Taahirah)-140: keep your racist chomma gunthie company.i don’t normally responds to coconuts.
1 Mar 2011, 13:22 pm
@capo(capo)-157: Dude, seriously?
1 Mar 2011, 13:23 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-158:
and they still got their headsw in their asses
WP wont win jack **** with the so called tight 5 they have
btw did you see jannie killing woodcock?? , woodcock should have been penalised about 6 times and not only the once for his scrumming in on jannie everytime he got crunched
1 Mar 2011, 13:24 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-156: Sharks looking good. That’s the real reason behind the Cape outburst. Whenever we up, they got to get all political. Their little Mediterranean island isn’t even part of Africa.
1 Mar 2011, 13:25 pm
@capo(capo)-160: jeez bro. Now if someone doesn’t agree with you he’s a coconut?
Ever considered that maybe it’s you?
You’re going to run out of people willing to talk to you soon on here if you’re not careful.
1 Mar 2011, 13:26 pm
The History of the Stormers! A text book on how to market a cr@p product.
1 Mar 2011, 13:26 pm
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-164: aint that a fact boet , that oke has serious issues
1 Mar 2011, 13:27 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-159: answer me this one question?how the heck can you come to the cape with your racist tendencies towards coloured people knowing that these people are the majority in the cape?i also see that you’ve got a friend in mnany ,that feels just like you, that there are too many coloureds in the cape.
1 Mar 2011, 13:28 pm
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-164:
oh I think we are well past that point.
1 Mar 2011, 13:28 pm
The History of the Stormers! One chapter on the final in Soweto and the rest photo’s of Bob Skinstad in a speedo.
1 Mar 2011, 13:29 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-162:
‘Jannie killing Woodcock’? That is not allowed now!
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-163:
As a Stormer I have to agree. Our tight five look a bit light! Light in weight that is.
1 Mar 2011, 13:29 pm
@capo(capo)-167: where have i said one fing word about the coloured people?? stop listening to the little **** voices you have in ur head dude , ur fiing mental
because you are a total waste of human skin it does not mean your race is , so stop making up **** , MORON
1 Mar 2011, 13:30 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-133:
we zulus just cant trust your lot from the ningi mzimo across the river you see.
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-136: that wasezactly my point to transie. he just didnt want to listen because it doesnt fit with the current “africa for black people only” nationalistic view.
1 Mar 2011, 13:30 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-169:
Why are you so obsessed with the Stormers? You only criticize a threat now – correct. When you talk all shoebeshoe about a team it means they are not a threat. But when you get nasty it means the team is a real threat! Thanks for that mate! Don’t stop! We like it.
1 Mar 2011, 13:31 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-170: lol hiyas bill ltn chat
sad but true mate , and like i said before, CJ is no scrum power , he never has been
1 Mar 2011, 13:32 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-172:
the Zulu’s dont take K*rap from them 
1 Mar 2011, 13:33 pm
i suddenly feel very dirty with sharks lover around.time to pump some iron and hit the shower afterwards.play nice now girls and see you soon.
1 Mar 2011, 13:33 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-174:
Yep very disappointed mate! Spent a lot of money on what! We should have bought The Beast instead. He is dying to come to Cape Town but he hasn’t been made an offer yet. He didn’t like the idea of Egoli though. Hehehe
1 Mar 2011, 13:34 pm
i dont know what you trying to stir up here Ryan, but you article is misdirected.
1 Mar 2011, 13:34 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-174:
In fact all rugby players want to come to the Cape. Just not enough space for them all!
1 Mar 2011, 13:35 pm
@capo(capo)-176: uhm get it right scum bucket i aint near you , i dont mingle with trash , so stop wishing aND DREAMING
1 Mar 2011, 13:35 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-173: Whatever, I don’t go on about the Bulls do I? You see whilst I hate (too harsh, but you know what I mean) the Bulls, I respect them. They walk their talk. Is there a coffee table book about the history of the Bulls?? Stormers are windgat. That’s why I pick on you guys. Also Solomen’s betrayed a great SA captain, in a Cape plot.
A threat! Please, when last did you beat us in Super rugby?
1 Mar 2011, 13:35 pm
I reckon the cape has one too many coloureds.
1 Mar 2011, 13:35 pm
The blogger at post 88 is responsible for this thread getting ugly. I went through the whole thread and it all went bad after comment 88.
1 Mar 2011, 13:36 pm
@capo(capo)-160: Coconut?
Indulge me. How did you arrive to this conclusion?
1 Mar 2011, 13:38 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-179: lol bill not quite mate , only sharks that ever come here to the cape is the ones on retirement
1 Mar 2011, 13:39 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-181:
LOL – I’m just stirring mate! Yeah you guys are great! Simply the best, better than all the rest! Which great SA captain? We haven’t had a good one for a while mate. You talking about Francious Pienaar now!
1 Mar 2011, 13:40 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-185:
Naa the Great Whites mate!
1 Mar 2011, 13:40 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-179: You right, all the Sharks want to go to the Cape. After all, the last time we lost there in Super rugby was 2005!!
1 Mar 2011, 13:42 pm
@rossoneri(rossoneri)-183: Not true rossi , this started by capo on another thread and just crept over to this one
1 Mar 2011, 13:43 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-188:
Really! I thought it was about 1999! Jeez so not such a great record after all! They way your were gloating mate I really thought 90′s! Well a semi finalist in Super 14 last year is not too shoddy! We didn’t take the silverware, but made it to the end. I think we also did so in the Currie Cup! Not consistent enough though!
1 Mar 2011, 13:43 pm
@Taahirah(Taahirah)-184: boet best just ignore it, the moron is just pulling us all down into his level of stupidity
1 Mar 2011, 13:44 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-186: Gary Teichmann. Mallet and Solomens stabbed him in the back for their cut on the Guiness man, I’m sure.
1 Mar 2011, 13:45 pm
@sharks_lover(sharks_lover)-191:
You guys never learn do you!
1 Mar 2011, 13:45 pm
@rossoneri(rossoneri)-183:
nice try lilly.
why don’t you just say that it was me
that sad thing is that nobody takes anything you have to say seriously anymore.
you have the same problem as steve hofmeyer and julius.
you have a credibility gap
1 Mar 2011, 13:46 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-192: Gary Teichman! He was mediocre boet!
1 Mar 2011, 13:46 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-190: Not enough for a whole coffee table book though, surely.
Hyped to the maximum!
1 Mar 2011, 13:49 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-196:
Teams usually raise their game when they play champion sides mate. We are used to it! We are used to be champions year in and out. Some sides who have rarely won anything really, come on here and bloat about winning 5 Currie Cups. Really in different league mate. Champion sides never need to boast.
1 Mar 2011, 13:50 pm
bloat = gloat hehehe
1 Mar 2011, 13:50 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-195: 17 wins in a row mediocre? Mixing fact and fiction again? Go read the Argus.
I’m sure Gary wasn’t ‘flash’ enough down in the Cape. After all he walked his talk.
1 Mar 2011, 13:50 pm
@Bill Reyts(Gumboots)-195: now thats BS bill and you know it, tis what cost us a world cup, for glory boy tongue
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