249 Comments

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• 101.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:17 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-78:
  matfield really should sit him down for a heart to heart if thats the case. going to the world cup without a 1st choice kicker? iiiinteeeeresting…

• 102.President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:17 am

  @poppa69(poppa69)-94: poppa get ur mind outa the gutter mate hehehe

  but jokes aside you know i am right

  Steyn holds no fear for you kiwi’s

• 103.Big Hit:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:19 am

  @grant10(grant10)-92: I think Frans Steyn is a better fit at 12 these days, he is still powerful and more creative now but seems to lack that out and out full-back pace at the moment. Who is your scrummie? and your 15 if F.Steyn plays 12?

• 104.Tacitus:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:19 am

  @Ryan(Ryan)-93:

  Believe me, the “I told you so’s” will come aplenty if things transpire as you suggest.

  But rather than going ad hominem, why don’t you explain which of the points in my post no 88 you disagree with.

• 105.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:19 am

  @poppa69(poppa69)-94: LOL

• 106.whatever:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:19 am

  @poppa69(poppa69)-94:

  Same can be said of SBW and his league shoulder charges…………..never mind his brokeback mountain acting performance…………

• 107.Caper:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:20 am

  No doubt Butch James is a better all round flyhalf than the one dimensional Morne Steyn, but is there any flyhalf in the world better suited by the Boks’ type of game than Morne Steyn?

  Last year the Springboks played Bulls rugby, bombarding the opposition with up-and-unders, tactical kicking and big ball runners to set up positions for Morne Steyn to kick for some points. This game plan failed dramatically against the All Blacks and the Wallabies, but will PdV really wipe out the Springbok game plan of the past 4 years in a world cup year?

  Butch James is not the guy to chose at 10 if your game plan will stay the same. If you want to play Butch James, the Boks will have to play a more balanced game. Some kicking and some running, some bashing and some stepping.

• 108.justrugby:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:21 am

  @grant10(grant10)-95:

  Reeks of the 2007 fat boys club being extended to Butch ??

  I would personally also go with Butch, just hope he is able to stay injury free for the entire tournament ??

• 109.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:21 am

  @Big Hit(Big Hit)-84: oops…sorry …

  scrumhalf would be FDP….then Ruan Pienaar.

  Need the tactical kickers over there i reckon

• 110.President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:22 am

  my bok backline

  15 Lambie
  14 JPP
  13 Fourie
  12 F Steyn
  11 Habana (yes i would still select him)
  10 Butch
  09 Ruan

  20 Hougaard
  21 JDJ
  22 Aplon

• 111.Tacitus:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:23 am

  @Caper(Caper)-107:

  Exactly. We can TRY and play an expansive game, but we will lose. We don’t have the players for it, nor the ingrained habits or skills.

  Our only chance – and it is probably a one in three chance at that – of winning the World Cup, is to go with a kicking approach. Why are we ashamed of it?

  That’s England’s trademark game. Stick to what you are good at. We can do it, only we can do it better than England. We aren’t into the Pacific Islander type of game.

  Every SA team who has tried it has failed miserably. And changing our approach now, 2 months before the tournament is suicidal in any case.

• 112.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:23 am

  @President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts(sharks_lover)-96: I am with you here my man….give that oke stick …he only has blue tinted glasses….bloody plonker that he is!

• 113.Ryan:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:23 am

  @stormersboy(stormersboy)-89: Ok SB.

  ‘On a point of journalism, you cannot state something as fact before it’s happened. Only death and taxes Ryan. Injury? Cards? Form?’ – We were having an informal discussion on a blog and yet you now hold me to a standard not expected in that context. To appease you I’ll now interact with the muppets with the utmost professionalism. In which case I’ll now state – ‘Keo.co.za understands that Butch James will be the Springboks’ premier flyhalf at the World Cup’.

  Furthermore, it goes without saying that different factors could influence his selection – injury being the most obvious. Did I really have to say that? I suspect you were just being pedantic for the sake of strengthening your argument.

• 114.Big Hit:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:23 am

  @grant10(grant10)-109: Pienaar has been very good, a lot of motm awards last season, how was Du Preez’s form? I only saw a couple of Bulls games.

• 115.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:24 am

  @Ryan(Ryan)-80:
  really ryan, really! your honestly going to suggest to us all here ‘to our faces’ that butch would have nailed all the kicks that percy ‘did’ in the 2007 wc? based on a judgment of what he has done when ‘entrusted with the duty’. really?…

• 116.President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:25 am

  @grant10(grant10)-112: check my backline see what you think???? i know it might differ slightly from you , but to my mind that backline can make things happen

• 117.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:26 am

  @pakslae(pakslae)-99: farkit Pakslae….dont jinx it my man…those Irish in the wet will be helleva tough…you making me nervous boet….ooooohhh fark dont underestimate those farken irish….ever!

• 118.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:28 am

  @Big Hit(Big Hit)-103: FDP…Ruan …

  If Steyn goes to 12 ….i would go with Aplon….

• 119.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:28 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-82:
  you’d think basic arithmetic was a simple thing. 1+1=2 and so on, but nooooo…
  there are those among us.

• 120.kaksioek:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:29 am

  Plod looks in shocking shape in the photo at the top of this page:

  http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/opinion/5255276/Springboks-boxing-clever-over-injured-stars

• 121.President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:31 am

  @grant10(grant10)-118: for the extra kicker just in case i would play a safer Lambie @ 15

• 122.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:31 am

  @grant10(grant10)-83:
  and how do you accomodate both of them in the semi? 10/12? maybe…

• 123.President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:31 am

  @grant10(grant10)-118: Also i think lambie is a better defender

• 124.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:32 am

  @justrugby(justrugby)-108: If Butch went down ….I would probably have to go with Lambie.

  2010 showed up M Steyn as a rather clueless skop en bid player that will nullify all the rest of the boks backs.

  He also seems to travel poorly…..would love to see his kicking % s away from SA…..bet it would make for intersting reading.

  That oke is a melktert and borewors kid….needs the home comforts.

• 125.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:32 am

  @he’s not the messiah. he’s a very naughty boy!(i_love_u_bakkiesbotha)-122:
  sorry, i thought you meant butch and morne and not butch and frans…

• 126.President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:33 am

  @Big Hit(Big Hit)-114: Hiyas BH

• 127.stormersboy:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:33 am

  @Ryan(Ryan)-113: That’s exactly what i was doing, but not for the reasons you suggest,

  As it turns out I’m actually a James fan, however I have yet to be convinced on (a) his sharpness, (b) his ability to remain injury free and (c) his ability to go without getting suspended in the tournament. Not like that hasn’t happened before to an SA rugby player. You know our record in front of citing boards.

  So yes, I’m being pedantic, but it’s not like you’ve never stated something as fact before only to have it come back through no fault of your own as not transpiring. And yes, you are a journalist so I hold you to a higher standard.

  All I’m saying is, choose your words better, Once posted they are here forever. Don’t let yourself get dragged down to the standard of some of the bloggers here,

• 128.John Galt:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:33 am

  I fail to see how putting Butch into a Bok side would automatically make the Boks into a running, expansive team. The Boks didnt win in 2007 by playing expansively and Butch was there at 10. His kicking out of hand is among the best SA have at the moment.

  Also, people forget the role FdP played in 2007. He will still be there to play his usual excellent kicking game which was used so efficiently in the last WC and if Butch plays anything like he did in 2007, at least our backline will have a better chance of success.

  As for goal kicking, 83% goal kicking in test matches? you cant argue with that Im afraid.

• 129.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:34 am

  @President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts(sharks_lover)-110: no FDP?

  I think Ruan would be a great bench player….as you then can do a 5…2 bench split …..this may be very nb if we play kiwis as we will need 2 x props on bench….and I mean proper props….not plod!

• 130.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:34 am

  @President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts(sharks_lover)-90:
  what? like 10 losses out of 12 in their heads?…

• 131.Ryan:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:35 am

  @he’s not the messiah. he’s a very naughty boy!(i_love_u_bakkiesbotha)-115: Are you going to suggest he wouldn’t have and if so, what would be your justification? What else do you want me to judge him on? I cant say for sure that he would have kicked those goals, but neither can you. Indeed, based on his 83% success rate, I can predict with a greater degree of certainty than you can refute, that he would have been successful.

• 132.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:35 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-111: Butch is a better tactical out of hand kicker than M Steyn….so he can replicate the skop en jag if asked to.

• 133.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:36 am

  @Taahirah(Taahirah)-91:
  its not fire, just facts…

• 134.stormersboy:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:37 am

  @kaksioek(kaksioek)-120: For me the only guy who actually looks in shape in that photo is Bjorn Basson. All the others looks a bit “soft”

• 135.Ryan:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:39 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-104: None of those points, Tac. But your pessimism re James’ goalkicking has no justifiable basis given that the boy has kicked at 83%, which is only marginally lower than Steyn.

• 136.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:39 am

  @Big Hit(Big Hit)-114: Also hardly featured….so I reckon I am choosing him on historic data as opposed to current form.

  Ruan Pienaar was also superb over there by all accounts?

• 137.Big Hit:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:40 am

  @kaksioek(kaksioek)-120: lol it’s the illusion of the shirt design, funny tho

  @President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts(sharks_lover)-126: morning sharky, I think you’ve possibly picked the strongest backline, with the possible exception of Habana, has his form improved lately or might Basson be a better option?

• 138.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:41 am

  @President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts(sharks_lover)-116: I like it SL…brave and bold….

  For me its about FDP…if he is fit I would start him….Ruan is a brilliant bench option…

  I would have no problems with Lambie and or Aplon at 15, with F Steyn at 12…

• 139.Eish:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:42 am

  Peter Grant has to be the unluckiest 10 in rugby. We have the best all round 10 in he country not being given a chance.

• 140.pakslae:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:45 am

  @grant10(grant10)-117:
  Don’t worry, keo would jinx it if he said it.

• 141.Puma:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:45 am

  If this is PdV choice that Butch will be our fh for wc then well done.

  Morne kicks well and adds nothing much else. Butch offers us a whole lot more.

  So Morne will no doubt be back up fh. WHAT a damn pity they not gonna try out Lambie to start on the away leg of the Tri-Nations. Think Lambie adds more than Morne as well. Not kicking at posts but his all round game is way better.

  Would have loved to have seen Lambie playing with the backs we will have on this away tour. Just wish we had another inside centre other than Olivier. Doubt the exciting JdJ will be seeing much ball with Olivier and Morne there.

• 142.stormersboy:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:46 am

  @Ryan(Ryan)-135: I agree with you on the conclusion that Butch doesn’t get enough credit for his goalkicking but when you look at those stats I wonder how many of those are close tange attampts and how many are from farther out?

  I watched a few Bath games this year when Butch took the closer ones and someone else the longer range kicks, which mostly have a lower success rate.

  In Morne’s case he takes them all.

  If we went for James I’d want a back up for longer kicks. Frams Steyn’s goal kicking ability is very erratic to say the least, and i’d be more inclined to only entrust him with the “Hail Mary” type of attempts.

  For me that’s the Gap. Morne is comfortable anywhere up to the half way line, and a bit beyond,

  Butch’s range ends at the 10 meter mark IMO.

  Lambie could cover that gap, his range is no problem, but then you have to play him at 15. Which isn’t a bad option, but I’d really prefer Steyn there.

• 143.Sharkie10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:46 am

  Seems like under all PdV’s stupidity, there is still some brain sells functional. There are many people that will disagree with him and prefer Morne to Butch.
  In my personal opinion, Butch is the best bet at 10. Morne obviously have the golden boot of Loftus, and there is no question about his kicking ability, i will go as far as to say that he is one of the best goal kickers in world rugby. But kicking alone will not win u the world cup.

  Many will argue that, most sides that have won a world cup and been successful at test level had a world class goal kicker, true! Larkham, Wilkinson, Merthens,Carter, Stranskey, Monty ( obviously fullback, but was our goal kicker in 2007). But the difference was all these guys were brilliant at reading a game and there attacking ability was of high quality! Something Morne lacks.

  Butch on the other hand is maybe not a world class goal kicker, but he is more than a capable kicker at goal. Some still question his aggressive defensive style, and maybe some will say he is too old and too slow, maybe that is true, but he is a more solid pivot than Morne. He has the experience, and the tactical game to go with it. He has been there, he knows what it takes to win a world cup. Morne must be on the bench, and only give Lambie a run against, maybe Namibia.

  It has been a proven combination, Du Preez and Butch play well together, and with Jean and Jaque in the centers, you have a a brilliant and experienced, 9, 10, 12 and 13 combinations. When opposition looks at a line up of the boks backs and see Morne at 10, they will probably be like ok, we cant make too many mistakes anywhere in our own half, he plays from deep so we can stop them behind the advantage line, and on attack we target his channel. When Butch is in that line up, He can kick his goals, but maybe get away with one or two penalties. then have to be careful as he takes the ball flat on the gain line creating opportunities for 12 and 13. And we do not run down his channel on attack!

  So the choice is, do you have a pivot that will kick 9/10 goals, and plays a very one dimensional game, and has a defensive weakness or are you going to take the guy who will maybe kick 8/10, gets the backs on the front foot and over the advantage line, and is solid in defense ( hoping his tackles are all legal of course)

  I Choose BUTCH.

• 144.stormersboy:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:47 am

  @stormersboy(stormersboy)-142: tange = range.

• 145.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:47 am

  @Ryan(Ryan)-131:
  well then lets both agree that he WASN’T the FIRST choice kicker for the boks in 2007 wc. and, ryan, if we do agree on that then lets ask ourselves but why, oh why wasn’t he?
  more importantly, if he wasn’t the 1st choice then do think he could be the 1st choice now? and if not, then please answer the PHARKING question. who’s going to be our kicker in the semi?

• 146.stormersboy:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:48 am

  @Eish(Eish)-139: You’re kidding right?

• 147.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:48 am

  @President_of_the_Sharks_rugby_experts(sharks_lover)-121: Lambie and Aplon are both awesome players….Aplon does give you a left foot….

• 148.HHS:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:49 am

  @Eish(Eish)-139: Grant played himself out of that squad.

• 149.grant10:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:49 am

  @he’s not the messiah. he’s a very naughty boy!(i_love_u_bakkiesbotha)-122: 10/ 12

  or 10 / 15

• 150.he's not the messiah. he's a very naughty boy!:
  8 Jul 2011, 10:50 am

  @stormersboy(stormersboy)-142:
  finally…a sensible assessment.

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