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• 151.Hendrik Pienaar:
  5 Aug 2011, 05:43 am

  @HongKongSlong(HongKongSlong)-149:

  He’s alright. Had a good season for the Bulls. He could’ve been like superman out there, the Bulls were still intent on giving him and Gary Botha equal game-time.

  I do think Adriaan Strauss is probably a better player (Chilliboy is 4th – then Gary Botha – then daylight). But I won’t feel let down when Chilliboy goes to the World Cup ahead of him.

  I’m okay with Chilliboy. He’s better then most people make out.

• 152.Hendrik Pienaar:
  5 Aug 2011, 05:50 am

  @Hendrik Pienaar(hendrikp)-151:

  Keep forgetting about Schalk Brits. But heck I’m no big fan of including overseas based players unless we are really desperate in the position. A lot of the players seem to be thinking they can move to Europe and still have their spot in the squad secured.

  Francois Steyn is the only overseas based player who is clearly better then any SA player. Ruan Pienaar needs to have a desire to come back to South Africa as soon as his contract ends if he wants to stay in the squad.

• 153.sparticus:
  5 Aug 2011, 08:02 am

  I wonder what you would have said had Meyer been chosen as the coach and also used Jakes Conditioning coach or Rassie as a technical etc etc , how absurd to say Pdiv is copying Jake cos he used the personal that Jake used , maybe just maybe he used these guys cos they were the proven best ?

  I seriously wonder how u can call urself objective sometimes Ryan , its been a downward spiral here for a long time sadly.

  On the plus side , gotto love the division here and utter chaos. Almost like the Springbok management nowadays , its ironic u guys keep saying there is division in the Bok camp.

• 154.mpundulu:
  5 Aug 2011, 09:18 am

  Hendrik Pienaar: how can you say with such conviction that Francois Steyn is better than anyone SA has available? What is such a statement based on? When last did you watch Steyn play a game in the southern hemisphere at international level and how did he fare? This jingoism towards Francois Steyn for two fluke drop kicks at newlands is laughable!

• 155.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 09:24 am

  @mpundulu(mpundulu)-154:

  jingoism?

  I think you are trying to hard chap.

  laughable indeed.

• 156.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 09:25 am

  far too hard

• 157.BullDog15:
  5 Aug 2011, 09:32 am

  @Hendrik Pienaar(hendrikp)-152: On what basis is F Steyn clearly better than any local fullback, which is the position is guess you are referring to?

• 158.rocco:
  5 Aug 2011, 09:33 am

  Win-at-all-costs is the actual reason why we never seem to progress in this game. The very philosophy is counter productive and hardly ever ensures consistent success. When PdV unveiled his expansive approach, some liked the idea, but that all changed when we started losing. The rugby public demanded that we return to what we knew worked, i.e. they demanded stagnation for the sake of short term results.
  If we could rather adopt a policy of rugby excellence rather than win-at-all-costs, we would be a far more consistent force in world rugby. By “rugby excellence” I mean developing each player to do his job as competently as possible. Success in application of such a philosophy would mean that more complete players are produced as opposed our existing scenario where we may have mobile props who can’t scrum, or powerful centres who can’t step or pass in both direction, wings who are fast but are unable to create for anyone else when their space is shut down, locks who excel in the line-outs, but add little to the scrum effort. Bits-and-pieces players compound the job of a national coach who now has to expend significant effort in compensating for player weaknesses.
  Truth is, the Jake White “blueprint” is probably the only one that optimizes returns for a typically limited SA team. It focuses on doing what anyone else can do, but doing it better, simply because the opposition does not need or choose to sink to these levels (bash, kick-and-chase, tackle-‘em-dead etc) and shirks any opportunity do anything really creative or out of the ordinary.
  PdV erred in thinking he could get such a team to play such a radically different game.

• 159.JEZ:
  5 Aug 2011, 09:39 am

  I agree with Ryan 100% in fact I posted something to that effect yesterday before this commentary came out.
  Div’s era has been an embarassing stumble from one crisis to the next. The senior players took over the “planning and coaching” at the end of 2008′s tri nations. Even during the Lions tour the substitute debacle almost cost us. Smitty even referred to it in his book and basically said that he had to temper Div’s brain farts.
  We are going to struggle after this world cup because a lot of the stalwarts will be gone and nobody has been groomed to take over. We will suffer a fate similar to that of Aussie cricket. When will coaches get it into their heads that no-one is bigger than the game?
  RWC 2015 will be a write off and I hope SARU don’t judge the next coach on the first 2 tri nations after 2011. We need to look at a competent coach being put in place until RWC 2019 anything else simply wouldn’t be fair.
  When Div was picked we were told he wasn’t picked for “rugby” reasons which is ridiculous. I have no problem with AA and BEE I consider it to be a very necessary part of our development as a nation but what must Alistair Coetzee be thinking? Coetzee was part of the 2011 side. He knew all the players and systems intimately. If a coach of colour was necessary he was the obvious choice. Nobody would have batted an eyelid at his appointment. Once again we see the damage quota’s, BEE and AA can do if implemented in a haphazard way to appease political masters. Coetzee was shunned because he was too “White”.
  Everytime Chiliboy takes the field he impresses but he hasn’t been allowed to kick on. This is a travesty. He also has leadership qualities evidenced by his U21 world cup win but our “pro transformation” coach has never backed him. If you can’t back a diamond like Chiliboy then obviously transformation is not a priority.
  SARU by picking Div as coach have damaged our rugby terribly. I don’t personally blame Div as he didnt pick himself but seriously if he wants a frikking medal I will pin it on his chest with a bloody long pin.

• 160.mpundulu:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:00 am

  Gunther: if a word is too big or complex and you find it tricky to annunciate or associate words that are related to it that you understand, then your parents should have told you to pick up a dictionary or thesaurus to better yourself. Jingoist is a small word, look it up, write down the definition, find synonyms which will help you associate with the word, and then, and very importantly put the placard in two key places, your bathroom above the mirror, and on the ceiling of your bedroom directly positioned above your bed. In time it’ll be a word you use often at work to impress the boss, at home to keep the wife on her toes, and with friends to test who’s educated in your corner, and you know what they say of one’s friends? Another piece of charity I’ve done for womens month.

• 161.Couchcoach:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:15 am

  PDV has absolutely no plan. He reacts to situations instead of being proactive. The defensive and offensive systems within the team have gradually disappeared – even though he is sitting with players who have been a part of the team now for the best part of eight years.

  So, ask yourself the following question:
  1. Why is he the coach if he cannot add to the team’s playing style and structures that were left there by Jake White?
  a. He is a good man manager. I contest this point vehemently. He could not decide on where to play J Smit. He had him bulk up to play prop and then backtracked on this decision and said that he will only play hooker.
  He continues to select players who are grossly out of form – like Spies and Habana. He would have Ricky in the side if the latter did not retire from test rugby. He has favourites like Jacobs who are not even up to Super Rugby standard.

  b. Is he the coach because he is a good motivator? Again, I contest this because he could not motivate a group of professional rugby players to show pride in the jersey and put their lives on the line in the away leg of this year’s 2 Nations and 1 pretender.

  c. Is he the coach because he has the gift of the gab? HAAAAAA HAAAAA HAAAAA. His plans go lost between his brain and his mouth. He is on his own frequency.

  So, why is he the coach? He is the coach because SARU wanted to make a statement for transformation. PDV made one helluva presentation to them and promised that he would transform the Boks from a pragmatic team into a team that plays exciting rugby. He was going to get the boys to play the situation instead of playing to a rigid game plan. He was going to bring through players of colour and set right the inequalities of the past. He was going to hit a home run for transformation. How do I know this? I read the newspapers.

  This was his plan. He no doubt had his goals and the mission steps outlined to achieve these goals. He selected his two coaching assistants based on these goals. **** Muir was known as someone who loved giving teams free reign to go and express themselves on the rugby field and was considered a bit of a backline guru. He advocates exciting rugby and this appealed to PDV.

  What went wrong? International test rugby is not provincial rugby or age group rugby. The pressures placed on players and coaches are immense. Administrators, politicians, sponsors, players, the media and supporters have massive expectations and there is no place to hide. PDV soon realized that test rugby is not the place to want to make massive changes in the way that people play. Changing the structures is going to lead to a couple of losses, losses lead to loss in confidence and when you lose confidence you become desperate. A desperate team falls back on what they know and this is exactly what happened in 2009. The team returned to proper Bulls rugby and they smashed all comers. PDV was sold on the concept because the pressure was off, he was the Messiah of Bok rugby and, him being only human, he basked in the glory of the victories. Gone was the vision and the plans because results speak for themselves.
  Then came 2010. It was the year that put 2009 in perspective. There were subtle changes in law interpretations because the Aussies want us to play a faster game where forward domination is negated – mostly because they do not have the forwards with which to dominate. The AB’s suddenly adopted a more pragmatic approach with huge focus on set pieces and kicking for territory. They tried to run from everywhere in 2009, but the coach soon realized that this is not the way to go and that there is a place for the basics in rugby. The Boks were smashed in the set pieces and the more structured approach by the other two teams ripped our defense apart. PDV soon realized that his two assistants had become redundant. He originally appointed them with an eye on running rugby, but he now needed someone who could bring back structure to the team. It was the way the game was evolving and he did not have the right tools to tinker his team into shape. His attempts to get rid of the two fairy rugby visionaries failed.
  PDV himself was totally out of his depth because he is not a structure orientated coach. He did not have the experience of coaching at the highest level like Deans and Henry to anticipate the way that rugby is going to go, let alone lead the world in the changes. He is always a step behind the world leaders. Apart from that, his giving in to the demands of the senior players in 2009 to return to a more structured game made him lose credibility as a leader. They usurped the power and they determined the direction that the team was going to take. The problem is that they are all players and they do not have the luxury of distance away from the game itself that other international coaches have. There is no evolution in the way that they play the game – they are only capable of sticking to what they know. Hence we have not seen any progression in the Bok team over the last three seasons.

  PDV also failed in his transformation vision. This is not completely down to his failure as a coach. The unions have not done enough to develop players and the players of colour out there have not done enough on their part to ensure that they are selected. However, I do blame Divvy for his infatuation with players like Jacobs and Januarie when players like Heinie Adams and Waylon Murray would have served the Boks better in those positions.

  My prognosis? I am not very hopeful about the Boks’ prospects for the WC and the remaining tests against NZ and Aus. We could still beat the Wallabies, but the AB’s are in a league of their own. Rassie is undoubtedly doing great work with the Boks and along with Nienaber they will bring back the structure that has eroded away so dramatically. I know from experience and from observing carefully over the years that structures that are not drilled in over an extented period of time disappear suddenly when players are under pressure and they become tired. The pressure will be immense at the WC and I do not know if our geriatrics in the team will have the legs to see it through to the end of the tournament. Apart from that, we will essentially only have one game plan at the tournament whereas other teams who have had the luxury of decent coaching over the last four years will have more than one plan – depending on the situation and the conditions.

  I am also not convinced that PDV will get the selections right. There is no place for players who are out of form and, more alarmingly, out of their depth. Too much hope is being pinned on Fourie Du Preez, Brussouw, F Steyn, Juan Smith and Gurthro. These guys have not had decent game time and will most definitely be undercooked against Wales. Add to that the poor form of Habana and the fact that Spies is nowhere as a loose forward and I have my serious doubts.

  The AB’s will win the WC. We will be competitive, but will fall out in the semi’s if we are lucky enough to get there.

• 162.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:19 am

  @mpundulu(mpundulu)-160:

  No sweat bud. Its just that the word jingoism doesn’t really make sense in the context above.

  Jingoism would make sense if we were comparing Steyn to say Israel Dagg. But not so much when comparing him to Aplon. Unless you are try to infer that they are from different nations?

  Here ends the lesson.

  We all get that you have been educated and agree that it’s a great achievement.

  Even if St Andrews is a second tier school.

  

  Hey, you aren’t that dude from St Andrews who lost his **** here a few months ago?

  he was one funny guy.

  you don’t appear to be funny at all though.

  like I said, you try too hard.

• 163.Couchcoach:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:25 am

  @Gunther is an agent for white capital(gunther)-162:

  

• 164.Dusky:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:27 am

  I don’t think what Ryan says contradicts Keo at all.

  I agree – Pieter De Villiers is clueless – has been since the beginning. He has taken all of his guidance from those around him, coasted along on a team that Jake White build, and now 4 years later after all his talk about where he wants to take the Springbok team – he is hoping to win a world cup with almost exactly the same team, and even coaching team that Jake White used in 2007.

  Jake White created the Jean De Villiers/Jacques Fourie center combination – what like that has Pieter done ? Fokkol, and he needs a new set of false teeth – someone tell him, his current ones are completely worn down.

  But, I also agree with what Keo says in a way. If the players on this long injury list recover in time, one thing De Villiers will have is a team full of experienced players who have competed in and won a world cup before. There remains a chance that they will pull this through – so, I wouldn’t say the Boks are necessarily in disarray, but Pieter De Villiers is.

  The Springboks could still be around at the business end of this world cup, but it will be despite De Villiers efforts, not because of them. Clearly, its another example in this country of people getting pushed into positions they have absolutely no idea how to fill in order to satisfy some political need. Heyneke Meyer should have been the next Bok coach, but now its too late.

• 165.Dusky:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:31 am

  @BullDog15(BullDog15)-157: Lets turn that argument around. Which fullback in South Africa do you think is better than Francois Steyn ?

  I can tell you, if its Zane Kirchner you are talking about, I can give you at least 5 very good reasons why Francois Steyn is a better option.

  Who else is there ?

• 166.Dusky:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:33 am

  @Gunther is an agent for white capital(gunther)-162: Gunther – I don’t know if you think you’re the local comedian, but I should just inform you that you are about as funny as a school bus accident.

  Honestly – don’t overrate yourself. It seems you think you’re the f#$ken ‘Comedian Idols’ judge or something on here.

• 167.mpundulu:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:33 am

  Gunther: now you’ve crossed the line bringing in St.Andrew’s into it! We are formally now at war, and to term my beloved school second tier, is an underhanded shot which won’t be tolerated. Also which ever other Andrean is or was on the site, it certainly was not me mate. I’m happy to have open discourse with all and sundry at any moment as long as we stay above the level.

  Secondly, you must look up the word jingoist, what you wrote in your last message trying to make some attempt to show your understanding of the word is off the mark. Jingoism by definition would be a support of the player, Steyn, at all costs without factoring any of his overwhelming weaknesses.

• 168.Dusky:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:38 am

  @mpundulu(mpundulu)-167: With the current overwhelming media topic of choice, there are lots of people in South Africa that are hopelessly undereducated idiots but that like to use big words ridiculously out of context (mostly laughably so) and that they clearly don’t understand – so, don’t feel bad. My advice would be to just speak in layman’s terms – nobody will hold it against you.

  Tell me – which fullback in South Africa has Francois Steyn’s skill set. I am really interested to hear.

• 169.Zinto:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:40 am

  Pieter de Villiers is not copying Jake White in his team selection or game plan etc as you white people want to convince yourselves of. He is merely using the best players to his disposal, with good experience and he is slowly intergrating new players into the system. One case is with Brussow ahead of Shalk Burger. White would NEVER choose a shorter player ahead of he taller bulkier players. Another is Geo Aplon most probably ahead of Frans Steyn, dropping Smit for Bismark??? Juan de Jongh ahead of Olivier??? etc etc. No Pieter de Villiers has his own mind and he’s doing quite well. Look at Jake White’s 2007 Tri-nations results:
  Vodacom Tri-Nations
  Saturday, July 21 2007 New Zealand 26 – 12 Australia
  Saturday, July 14 2007 New Zealand 33 – 6 South Africa
  Saturday, July 07 2007 Australia 25 – 17 South Africa
  Saturday, June 30 2007 Australia 20 – 15 New Zealand
  Saturday, June 23 2007 South Africa 21 – 26 New Zealand
  Saturday, June 16 2007 South Africa 22 – 19 Australia

  Now come on guys!!!
  O yes and then ther was this one in 2006:
  Saturday, July 15 2006 Australia 49 – 0 South Africa

• 170.Zinto:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:49 am

  So plan? The plan is to WIN the world cup using people that has done it before, like White did with Os. He just have more world cup winners available.

• 171.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:52 am

  @mpundulu(mpundulu)-167:

  jingoism by definition?

  by whose definition?

  yours?

  

  I suggest some extended research and a period of quiet introspection.

  Don’t be sad, there is nothing wrong with the second tier, there are many below it after all.

• 172.willievz:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:52 am

  @Zinto(Zinto)-170:

  Exactly.

  I honestly don’t understand the fuss about this.

  Our media should make better use of their time, like telling us (and the Kiwis!) why NZ will choke yet again…

• 173.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:54 am

  @Dusky(Dusky)-168:

  

• 174.Dusky:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:55 am

  @Zinto(Zinto)-170: I cant blame Pieter De Villiers for going with virtually the exact squad that Jake White used in 2007.

  Those players still remain the best in their positions – none of the players that have been capped in De Villiers have become anything to write home about (and there have been MANY – almost triple the number than during Jake Whites tenure).

  So, in his 4 years, De Villiers has achieved exactly nothing with regards to development of new Springboks. If we win this world cup, I think we can say a word of thanks to Jake White.

• 175.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 10:58 am

  @willievz(willievz)-172:

  that’s enough jingoism from you.

  thangyaverymuch.

• 176.mpundulu:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:00 am

  Dusky: thanks for your note, I used the word because it’s meaning just would make my typing quicker, I’m using my phone.

  Choice on fullback is Gio Aplon. Francois Steyn did not play well at all during the last trinations, and I’ve never thought much of him. He refuses to pass the ball to anyone in space or anyone period. He’s short on pace, and his big out of hand kicking game will be detrimental against teams with counter attacking prowess. His famed long range still ball and drop kicking ability, has a low success ratio, and therefore can’t be seen as a legitimate threat. Steyn’s defense one on one is good but within a structured format lacks clear understanding.

  Aplon on the other hand, is excessively fast, finds players in space, and creates his own space. He is attuned to the modern game, and could be the initiator of the Boks counter attacking platform, the attack plan involved that. His kicking is passable perhaps not great and his defense one on one and within a structured format is solid, as is his positional play.

• 177.mpundulu:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:04 am

  Gunther: drinking before 12 again…..

• 178.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:05 am

  @mpundulu(mpundulu)-177:

  indeed.

  I’ve just demolished a superb flat white.

• 179.munkiboi:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:06 am

  @mpundulu(mpundulu)-176:

  aplon should be played off the bench with lambie and ruan.

• 180.Die_Valk:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:06 am

  @Zinto(Zinto)-169:

  Brussow was initially left out by your beloved eunuch and only got the call after injury to Burger and mass public outcry. Smith isn’t being dropped for mr. pump by die dam pump either, but don’t let insignificant things like facts spoil a good argument.

• 181.Die_Valk:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:12 am

  These simplistic theories and comparisons are getting on my nerves. Makes football analysts seem intelligent.

• 182.mpundulu:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:16 am

  Munkiboi: actually, I’d put Lambie ahead of Francois Steyn at fullback, though I think he provides the Boks with a good option at flyhalf. He attacks the line very well, I’m still not fully convinced of the butch James option but James definitely meets with PdV’s experience standard. What concerns me most with James is his place kicking, I know it’s said he has a 83% success rate, but over how many seasons, certainly not at international level, so you’d have to find a place for Morne Steyn somewhere.

• 183.Treehugger:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:17 am

  @Zinto(Zinto)-170: and a damn fine plan it is to, winning the RWC lol.

• 184.BullDog15:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:17 am

  @Dusky(Dusky)-165: I will answer your question, but let me start by saying I do not believe Steyn is “clearly” better than anybody else. If that really was the case, we may as well draw a name from a hat and hand him the 15 jersey. Steyn has done nothing since playing 12 at WC07. On the last EOYT he was very poor. Slow and did not offload once. Defended well, but that is it. I have never seen him join the line on attack, and perhaps draw and offload, or stab a grubber through, or whatever a 15 often does in order to work the extra man over. He is not the answer at 15. I do think he will be a very good 12.

  Looking at world wide trends we see the most successful teams have game breakers at 15. We have not had such a player since Andre Joubert. Brent Russel came close, but was moved around and lost confidence.

  Now, to answer your question, turning the argument around. What can Steyn do “clearly” better than Kirchner, the example you provided? Don’t tell me 60m dropped goals. Those are a bonus if you get it right, and he has a less than 50% success rate with these long range drops. I still think Kirchner has more pace. On defense they are equal, with Steyn perhaps 5% better. Hell, I’ll give you 10%, but not “clearly”.

  How is Steyn “clearly” better than Riaan Viljoen, who has not actually been in the Bok plans? Viljoen also kicks the ball to the moon and back, and has some decent pace. Nothing wrong with his defense.

  Steyn is similar to Daniller IMO. Nice steady FB, kicks well, defends well, doesn’t do anything special. Except occasionally I’ve seen Steyn have a brain explosion, so perhaps Daniller shades him by 5% to 10%??

  Aplon offers more than Steyn on attack, but his positional play is not great and he doesn’t instil confidence as last defender, although he has heart. Don’t see him stopping Nonu or a big flanker…

  Lambie is possibly a better option than any of those mentioned above. Certainly only Aplon beats him for pace, but Lambie offers additional skills in terms of solid defense and kicking.

  Personally, I’d like to see somebody take Gerhard van den Heever and work on his defense and turn him into a FB over the next year. There was actually not much wrong with it until he got cited for a spear tackle about 18 months ago. After that he lost confidence, which is perhaps 80% of individual defensive abilities.

• 185.willievz:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:20 am

  @BullDog15(BullDog15)-184:

  I rate Viljoen, my type of 15 for a Bok team.

  Even though I rate Christian Cullen as the best rugby player I’ve seen.

• 186.willievz:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:21 am

  @Gunther is an agent for white capital(gunther)-175:

  Oh I’m just getting started.

  Growing a pair and hardeningthefuckup.

• 187.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:22 am

  @mpundulu(mpundulu)-182:

  Indeed. you can’t go into a WC without a front line goal kicker.

  Which the Butcher certainly is not.

  Furthermore, he has limited range.

  Which means your 15 has to be a reliable kicker with a boot on him.

  Frankie Steyn is not really reliable.

• 188.Gunther is an agent for white capital:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:26 am

  @willievz(willievz)-186:

  good man.

  just don’t go to far and embraboer yourself.

  thank you for providing us with an example to help mpundie out.

• 189.willievz:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:28 am

  @Gunther is an agent for white capital(gunther)-188:

  I can take it on the chin, I will be the first guy to congratulate the Kiwis if they take it.

  I might actually support them in the final should they get there.

• 190.mpundulu:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:34 am

  Gunther: at last you understand jingoism, now we can start talking seriously, however, before that happens take back what you’ve said about St. Andrew’s forthwith!

• 191.madvillain:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:38 am

  **** sapiens with their short memory spans amuse me. In 2009 we lauded PdV as a great because he did the impossible, he beat the Lions and won in NZ. Grante, he has lost his way.

  All Springbok coaches lose their way, only Kitch did not. He only coached the boks for an 18 month period i think.

  The suave bourgeois from Newlands tried having the boks play with a flyhalf without kicking the ball. Percy did that for 40 minutes and later kicked against Argentina. Viljoen later ditched his plans of attacking rugby because the need to win as a bok coach is always greater.

  Jake will always be seen in a good light because he won the world cup and he had a clear plan of developing players. He is also responsible for some of our worst losses.

  Nick Mallet did quite well and were it not for Larkham’s drop goal his record would have been the best for any rugby coach.

  Pieter has lost his way. He admitted to that. We need to play like the defending champs that we are and after we win the WC his record will have a Lions series, 3N, 3-0 smackdown for the all blacks in one year and a WC. It wont be such a bad record, in fact it will be better than Jake’s.

  Jake needs to shut it. Nick Mallet is one of the quieter coaches you’ll have.

  Having him again would not do us any harm either. I know we have lined up Rassie and Heineken but Nick would not do any harm to our cause though i suspect he would not be keen on the offer.

• 192.madvillain:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:39 am

  homosapiens

• 193.>^..^< katman:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:46 am

  I say nationalise the Springboks.

• 194.mpundulu:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:48 am

  Madvillain: your post is sensible but I think that SA should look for an overseas coach and commit to him for at least 8 years. Our coaching ranks are very poor in quality from school boy level upwards, we need to focus strongly on developing our coaches and this at least will allow SA to get the most out of the talent pool, and teams. Perhaps, SA will start playing a more modern game, and more importantly win with that gameplan.

• 195.Zinto:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:49 am

  Jake Whites 2007 squad:

  SA squad: Fullbacks: Percy Montgomery, Francois Steyn.
  Wings: Bryan Habana, Ashwin Willemse, Akona Ndungane, JP Pietersen. Centres: Jean de Villiers, Jaque Fourie, Wynand Olivier.
  Flyhalves: Butch James, Andre Pretorius.
  Scrumhalves: Fourie du Preez, Enrico Januarie, Ruan Pienaar.
  Loose Forwards: Pierre Spies, Juan Smith, Bob Skinstad, Danie Rossouw, Schalk Burger, Wikus van Heerden.
  Locks: Victor Matfield, Bakkies Botha, Albert van den Berg, Johann Muller. Props: CJ van der Linde, Os du Randt, BJ Botha, Gurthro Steenkamp. Hookers: Gary Botha, John Smit(captain).

  Pieter de Villiers probable 2011 squad:
  Fullback: Gio Aplon
  Wings: Lwazi Mvovu,Bjorn Basson
  Centres:Juan de Jongh
  Flyhalves: Patric Lambie, Morne Steyn
  Scrumhalves: Francois Hougaard
  Loose Forwards: Willem Alberts, Heinrich Brussow, Ashley Johnson
  Locks: Andries Bekker(now out), Flip van der Merwe, Gerhard Mostert
  Props: Beast Mtawarira
  hookers: Bismark du Plessis, Chiliboy Rallepele

  Now 16 players that was not in the Whites World cup squad. Now is that facts enough for you white people?

• 196.madvillain:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:54 am

  http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/ancient-all-blacks-to-face-wallabies-20110804-1ic9o.html

  It appears the All Blacks will be fielding a much older squad. What say we about that? Our Dad’s have a WC trophy and can do it again. What of these ABs?

• 197.stormer in a teacup:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:56 am

  @>^..^< katman(katman)-193: or at least put them out to tender.

• 198.Zinto:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:59 am

  And have a look at this:
  2003 WC squad:
  Backs: De Wet Barry (Western Province), Gcobani Bobo (Lions), Thinus Delport (Falcons), Neil de Kock (Western Province), Jaque Fourie (Lions), Werner Greeff (Western Province), Derick Hougaard (Bulls), Louis Koen (Lions), Ricardo Loubscher (Sharks), Jorrie Muller (Lions), Breyton Paulse (Western Province), Stefan Terblanche (Sharks), Joost van der Westhuizen (Bulls), Ashwin Willemse (Lions).

  Forwards: Richard Bands (Bulls), Christo Bezuidenhout (Pumas), Selborne Boome (Western Province), Bakkies Botha (Bulls), Schalk Burger (Western Province), Danie Coetzee (Bulls), Corne Krige (Western Province, captain), Victor Matfield (Bulls), Faan Rautenbach (Western Province), Danie Rossouw (Bulls), Dale Santon (SWD Eagles), Hendro Scholtz (Free State Cheetahs), Juan Smith (Free State Cheetahs), John Smit (Sharks), Lawrence Sephaka (Lions) and Joe van Niekerk (Lions).

  I count 8 players from Struili’s 2003 world cup squad, 3 form the 1999 world cup squad in Percy Montgomery, Albert van den Berg and Bobby Skinstad and 1 from 1995 in Os du Randt. So, 12 players in all came from other coaches, so WHAT!!!

• 199.madvillain:
  5 Aug 2011, 11:59 am

  Spot on Zinto.

  The “white people” thing will sully your input chief!

  Just the rugby facts.

• 200.>^..^< katman:
  5 Aug 2011, 12:00 pm

  @stormer in a teacup(stormer in a teacup)-197: I’d say the last two games have tenderised them enough.

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