Sam’s the man in round one
13 Sep 2011
MARK KEOHANE selects his all-star XV and match 22 after the first round of the World Cup and says none was better than Wales captain Sam Warburton. Only two Boks and one All Black make his team.
Keo’s RWC Form XV
15. Israel Dagg (NZ)
14. Vereniki Goneva (Fij)
13. Jaque Fourie (SA)
12. Jamie Roberts (Wal)
11. Digby Ioane (Aus)
10. Quade Cooper (Aus)
9. Ben Youngs (Eng)
8. Sergio Parisse (Ita)
7. Juan Martin Fernandez Lobbe (Arg)
6. Sam Warburton (Wal)
5. Paul O’Connell (Ire)
4. James Horwill (Aus)
3. Ben Alexander (Aus)
2. Bismarck du Plessis (SA)
1. Andy Sheridan (Eng)
Substitutes
16 Marius Tincu (Rom)
17 Martin Castrogiovanni (Ita)
18 Brad Thorn (NZ)
19 Schalk Burger (SA)
20 Will Genia (Aus)
21 Sonny Bill Williams (NZ)
22 Richard Kahui (NZ)
The positions in which there was most competition definitely in the centres and at loose-forward. Wales’ Toby Faletau had a huge game against the Boks, but Sergio Parisse is the most complete No 8 at this tournament. It was hard to leave Schalk Burger out of the Form XV but Lobbe was immense against England. Jerome Kaino, David Pockock, Heinrich Brussouw and Radike Samo also had huge games in round 1.
Sonny Bill Williams was also very good, but Jamie Roberts get the nod because of the quality of the opposition and the intensity of the match.
A selection that may surprise many is Ben Alexander at tighthead. I was at that game and those first 40 minutes were brutal. He stood up to the Italian pack who couldn’t get parity in those first 40 minutes. There was one magnificent shove that should have resulted in a pushover try, but all-round I think Alexander will end this tournament as the most talked about tighthead.
Fill up the thread with your picks of round one.
293 Comments
Pages: « 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 » Show All
13 Sep 2011, 10:23 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-43: quite frankly, i don’t get the obsession to “compare” a current player to one that retired a long time ago and the subsequent use of that comparison to pillory the current player.
o’connor to horan…
who cares if someone compared the two, o’connor is a talented player on his own merit. same thing with dagg.
13 Sep 2011, 10:24 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-38:
Just you wait, ‘enry ‘iggins, just you wait
You’ll be sorry but your tears’ll be to late
Your favourite team’ll be broken and my team’ll be sunny
Will I help you? Don’t be funny
Just you wait, ‘enry ‘iggins, just you wait…
13 Sep 2011, 10:24 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-48: his service to johnny was better than wiggleswhat-what
13 Sep 2011, 10:28 am
What did jaque fourie do to make this team?
13 Sep 2011, 10:28 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-50:
13 Sep 2011, 10:31 am
@Tacitus(Deucalion)-54: he broke the line once
13 Sep 2011, 10:32 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-53:
Did it change attacking momentum of the game overall though? It was the try kuphela.
Jonny is over the hill sbali,2 out 7 for him…Sheesh
Lawes is going to be a star sbali,mark my words.Unayonke into edingwa iLock and more..Mangayeka ukuba isibhanxa nje!
13 Sep 2011, 10:34 am
Keo still on about the Boks having the ‘best centre pairing in the world’? If they ever were, it was perhaps for one season, long gone now. Now they are merely experienced and solid.
13 Sep 2011, 10:34 am
@Tacitus(Deucalion)-54: Someone must have seen him play alongside Spies, and then he looked AWESOME.
13 Sep 2011, 10:35 am
@Tacitus(Deucalion)-54:
Exactly…..He has just become a staple for keo crew to put a 13,they dont even analyse games of other 13′s…
13 Sep 2011, 10:37 am
Katman
Ouch.
13 Sep 2011, 10:39 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-57: yeah momentum swung, can’t help if you’re playing with tindall @ 12 and johnny in the pocket.
johnny be good is on his last legs…
lawes is great but i just get fed up when watching northampton games and the way the Pom commentators go on and on and on about him. he’s the biziniz though.
13 Sep 2011, 10:44 am
FFS, surely John Smit must be there! Hahaha….
PDV to be the coach. Hahaha…..
13 Sep 2011, 10:47 am
http://youtu.be/FuZZFVzvToU
Die video bewys dat daai skop nie oor was nie. AB ondersteuners is regtig ‘n patetiese klomp mense. Lees bietjie op rugbyheaven al die kommentaar. Ek lees net vrees raak die heeltyd. haha
13 Sep 2011, 10:48 am
Frans Steyn’s performance on Saterday after I watched a replay last night really was not so flash after all. Unfortunately I only started watching when SA were already leading 10-3. I don know that FS scored a try by then and that he also made that monster clearance kick of some 70m.
The rest of the game he did the following:
15′: Not in position to catch a high up and under on the 22 of SA. FdP had to do it.
20′: Not in position to catch a high up and under. Morne Steyn had to compete with Hook for the ball. Hook won it back in the air.
24′: Let the ball bounce in the 22. Won about 20m with his clearance.
26′: Had to run back after the ball was kicked over his head. Knocked the ball backwards into the in goal area. Kicked it out on the 22.
32′: A clearance kick by Wales is fielded by FdP against the touchline. FS not in position.
36′: With FS not in the right position, Habana had to run back to field the ball after a kick forward by Wales. He gave it to FS who eventually arrived to lend support. He kicked it out between the halfway line and the 10m line of Wales.
40′: Together with JPP, he tackled Hook on Welsh 22 after an up and under by MS.
43′: Fielded the ball in Bok 22 and kicked it out on Bok 10m line.
45′: Went to ground with ball in Welsh half of the field. The ball came out the Bok’s way.
47. Out of position after a kick forward by Wales. Tried to shield the ball into touch but had to eventually kick it himself into touch 1m from Bok goal line.
52′: Got tackled to the ground with the ball after receiving it from Burger. Hold onto the ball and was penalised for holding.
54: Too late to stop Faleta (Welsh 8) from scoring.
58′: Tackled Roberts a few metres from the goal line. Saved a try.
60′: Missed a clearance kick after Bissy stole the ball with the Boks under a bit of pressure.
62′. Handled and passed the ball to Hougie who made some ground before being tackled.
65′: Joined back line and passed to Hougie.
68′: Out of position after an up and under by Wales. FdP had to run backwards to try and field the ball. He knocked it backwards before gathering it.
71′: Out of position after an up and under by Wales. FdP catch a mark. Give the ball to FS for the clearance which he missed. The Welsh FH kicked a grubber to within a few metres of the Bok try line. After a quick throw in by Hougie and some interplay between him and FdP, Hougie was eventually penalised for shielding the ball with his body. Hook missed what could have been a winning penalty kick.
76′: Made a tackle on the half way line.
So, to sum up:
1. He was caught out of position about 8/9 times and other people had to do the catching from up-and-under by Wales.
2. He joined the back line about five times. Scored a try once, recycled the ball once, was penalised once and passed twice.
3. He missed two clearance kicks trying to get distance on them. One of which could have indirectly led to the Welsh scoring the winning points from a penalty.
4. He missed the Welsh try scorer. (I mention this because people blamed RJ last year after he didn’t stop Read from scoring. Similar situation.)
The only positives I could find was the try, three 50m+ clearances and a tackle near the goal line of the Bokke. Other than that, he was ordinary to poor.
13 Sep 2011, 10:51 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-62:
Tindall plays 13 though isnt it? doesnt wear 13 due to superstition I think
But ya i hear u
13 Sep 2011, 10:53 am
“MARK KEOHANE selects his all-star XV and match 22 after the first round……”
Keo you dumb bast………d.
The first round ain’t over yet!!
8)
13 Sep 2011, 10:58 am
@cane(cane)-67:
Uh, actually it is. Samoa, Canada, Georgia & Russia weren’t involved in the first round.
There are 5 rounds, with each team playing 4 games. This Round Wales, France, England & Italy aren’t involved in. Their next games fall under round 3.
And the only team who misses 2 rounds but plays twice in 1 round is Romania. They miss round three and five but play twice in round 4.
13 Sep 2011, 10:58 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-66: tuilagi played 13, tindall @ 12
13 Sep 2011, 11:00 am
@cane(cane)-67: Crikey, you’re right Cane. If this were indeed the end of round one the AB’s would almost be at their traditional halfway mark. Say it ain’t so.
13 Sep 2011, 11:01 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-68:
Ooooops.
Keo,
You Brain Surgeon,
and part time Rocket Scientist.
13 Sep 2011, 11:04 am
@>^..^< katman(katman)-70:
Hello Katman,
(spoken in the manner in which Jerry greets Newman.)
13 Sep 2011, 11:07 am
@cane(cane)-72: Jerry? No offense, but you strike me more as Mr Costanza.
13 Sep 2011, 11:08 am
@cane(cane)-72:
Seinfeld-fan huh?
13 Sep 2011, 11:11 am
If there was a lesson to be learnt from Sundays game, I think it’s that we need to move away from the ‘pure finishers’ on the wing and look at the most talented players who can also finish when put into the right situations. With the defence being so tight at test level these days wingers need to do it all themselves. Australia don’t bother with ‘out and out’ wingers anymore either, with Iaone having played a lot of centre, and we all know about O’Connor. Toeava and Kahui were also an example of talented players who don’t score ‘wingers’ tries. They play like they’ve got an extra centre on the field…
We are still stuck with trying to make things happen in the midfield and then wanting finishers like Habana to get things done.
That’s why I cant’t agree with mshiniwami about Lwazi Mvovo being a good winger. For me it really is a case of what a winger can do anywhere in the backline. Mvovo doesn’t look for work. I wouldn’t trust him as a first receiver. He can’t kick. That pass he threw to Aplon against Australia summed it up for me. Needed to kick, but didn’t back himself so threw a hospital pass to Aplon who luckily made some space for himself.
We’d be best changing our perception of what a winger needs to be and look at getting the best backline players that SA has onto the wing if they aren’t locked into another position. If that means Hougaard at 11, or Johann Sadie at 14, then so be it.
13 Sep 2011, 11:11 am
@>^..^< katman(katman)-73: @Taahirah(Taahirah)-74:
I’m closer to Uncle Louie, but Frank Costanza is pretty close.
8)
13 Sep 2011, 11:19 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-75: lionel mapoe has also been great @ 13 for the lions but is very unlucky with injuries, barring bjorn basson’s defence, you really have no replacement for his pace, so you’re stuck there!
13 Sep 2011, 11:26 am
Jaque Fourie?? what the heck
13 Sep 2011, 11:31 am
@cane(cane)-72: LOL
13 Sep 2011, 11:31 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-77:
Basson is even worse then Mvovo. Can’t tackle to save his life and is extremely prone to mistakes. I like Mapoe but the Lions need to play good S15 rugby, and he needs to show us what he can do all-round before he gets near a Bok jersey. At the moment he feels like a development project. He also didn’t do himself any favours by moving around franchises abandoning his contracts.
13 Sep 2011, 11:36 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-80:
I think next year we need to get both Jaque Fourie and Johann Sadie into the starting team. I don’t mind which one plays on the wing, but one of them has to. Think it might be a good call going with Sadie on the wing. The space just isn’t there for these out-and-out wingers anymore. We need guys with a more rounded skill-set.
13 Sep 2011, 11:38 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-75: @Transformation(Transformation)-77:
Its all about the balance of your team.
But there is still a place for out and out wingers.Doing what wingers do.Which is to finish,use their speed as there is no substitute for speed and also cover at the back helping the fullbacks and chase up on offensive kicks etc.
The AB’s and even their media are at loggerheads with the same notion of these multitasking wingers. That can be a problem as they dont have out and out speed and arent specialists at knowing where to cover at the back etc Kahui also is an avg kicker,Iaone is terrible at it and at centre had to many defensive lapses.Many are questioning this Fullback/wing role that Henry has implemented. Remember that Henry went with the former specialist roles at wing with Sivi,Rokocoko,Gear,Howlett etc who arguably were more dominant that current AB class.
Its the job of the inside backs to create space.If they cant then thats their flaw.Pace must be held at a premium out wide,as well as great feet and finishing. (What you are envisioning is sort of like a trio of Adam Thompsons in the loosies)
13 Sep 2011, 11:40 am
Johan Sadie’s defence is also very suspect!! The Griquas centres opened him up like a can od sardines!!
13 Sep 2011, 11:40 am
od=of
13 Sep 2011, 11:42 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-81:
Digby iaone has played 80% of his rugby on the wing.
It was an experiment to move him to 13 which didnt work for both reds and aus.I think his straight running was what made him such an interesting prospect there but never materialised.At the Force he was always a winger,and at reds has been mostly a winger-filled in at 13 with Tirunui/Fainga the 13′s first.
13 Sep 2011, 11:44 am
@THE MAULER(Boks still my team)(THE MAULER)-83:
Exactly.He is small in build thus has to work on his technique & attitude towards defense.
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-81:
By the way: Habana was a 13…..JP a 15…..
But when they became SPECIALIST wingers is when they had MOST success.
13 Sep 2011, 11:44 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-82:
If you can find a player with a balanced skill-set who can play on the wing, I think you’re set.
NZ for example. They might well end up playing Dagg at fullback… but if Mils were still in the same sort of form as a few years back I’d have no problem making Dagg the starting 11. Scores lots of tries, runs excellent support lines, can kick… Out-and-out wingers have been suffering because they haven’t been offering much under the tightening defenses, especially not against the rush defense which pretty much cuts them off.
I don’t mind if we have wingers that are in excellent form, but if there are other players who are better, but not playing on the wing, we shouldn’t be afraid of playing them there.
An example: Jean de Villiers had some of his best games on the wing for the Springboks – at one stage he was scoring roughly a try per game. I’d expect the same sort of thing from Sadie, while Jaque Fourie is a proven finisher who averages roughly .5 tries a game and runs excellent support lines, cuts back inside, can break tackles etc.
13 Sep 2011, 11:45 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-80: look at his game and quit harbouring vendettas about irrelevant issues. last year everyone was conviced mapoe is not a 13, even himself. now he has played quite well for the lions.
@THE MAULER(Boks still my team)(THE MAULER)-83: don’t worry, this is the new pretext for the “return of the white wing”
we need more “footballers”!
13 Sep 2011, 11:47 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-75:
The best AB winger is an OUT and OUT winger: Sitiveni Sivivatu and second Hosea Gear…They may rue leaving those guys behind.because Guilford,Toeava arent inspiring confidence. Kahui played wing in 2009 and was ok/avg,then they shelved that.Now they bringing it back…tinkering
13 Sep 2011, 11:49 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-88:
Lol! SA has always had good wings be it black white purple…. Centre is what worries me…
13 Sep 2011, 11:49 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-86:
Habana was a 13 at U21 level. They made him into a winger as soon as he went to the Bulls because he doesn’t control the ball well and doesn’t run good lines. Poor off the ball on offense (but usually really good off the ball on defense).
I’m not saying don’t select a genuine winger anymore. Rather a different skill-set. Look at how Iaone scored against Italy. That’s the sort of line you’d expect from a centre, and something we’ve not seen from Habana for a very long time, and not seen from Pietersen ever. It’s the sort of try that we saw from Sadie vs the Blues…
Speed isn’t the best measure of a winger anymore, because defense has become so tight that you need someone who runs excellent support lines etc. I just don’t think we’ve got a winger in SA who currently warrants being selected for the Springboks after this WC.
13 Sep 2011, 11:50 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-87:
Guess we differ in principle/ideologies then.
I’d have Hosea Gear/Sitiveni Sivivatu at wing before Dagg even though he can do a very good job there.
13 Sep 2011, 11:50 am
At the End Of THE CUP.
It would be great to see an All-Stars selection play the Champs.
In the manner of the Barbarian spirit.
With at least 50% of the All-Stars being from so called Minnow Nations.
Attack, then attack, then when you are bored with attack, attack again.
13 Sep 2011, 11:54 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-88:
Vendettas? You really think Basson is a good player then? Him and Sarel Pretorius (who half of you think should be there) would combine to miss about half the tackles every game then. If scoring tries made you a good winger, then John Daniels should’ve been a 100 test Springbok. Basson is useless everywhere besides finishing.
I’ve got nothing against Mapoe, and never said anything about him playing centre. If he settles and has an outstanding season next year then sure, select him. But I don’t recall him having a good S15 this season? (or was he injured).
It’s not a vendetta. It’s an opinion.
13 Sep 2011, 11:57 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-89:
I agree to a certain extent msh.
Wings are the Positions that should be selected purely on form.
Confidence, luck and a positive outlook. All requisites of a finisher.
And you only get that with great form.
13 Sep 2011, 11:57 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-89: don’t worry, when mjekevu, sithole, mbovane get in the mix he’ll be hardpressed to hold off his stance.
13 Sep 2011, 11:58 am
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-92:
I would’ve had Sivivatu as well (but I don’t rate Gear as an All Blacks – brilliant S15 player though). Sivivatu was a strong runner who they used really well running into the 10-12 channel (which you know of course) because he broke tackles. Habana doesn’t have that same strength, and Pietersen definitely doesn’t. Our wingers don’t run the lines like these guys.
13 Sep 2011, 11:58 am
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-94: are you high? i’m talking about mapoe!
13 Sep 2011, 12:01 pm
@hendrikp(hendrikp)-91: rubbish!!, go and look up on youtube the 2nd british & irish lions test at loftus and see the tries scored by both habana and jpp of 2nd phase ball and 1st phase ball respectively.
13 Sep 2011, 12:02 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-96:
Look man. I’ve said I really like Mbovane and Mjekevu, and Sithole has also done very well at the Sharks. Mbovane is probably the more physical runner of the three, but mshiniwami himself named two players who are both big strong runners (Gear – referred to as the next Lomu when he was playing U21 rugby, and Sivivatu who’s got that Fijian strength of shrugging off tackles).
Mjekevu is a lean guy who operates well in space. Do I think he’ll be a Springbok? I don’t think so no. Hope he proves me wrong. I do think he should be starting 11 for the Lions though because he’s an excellent finisher, especially when there’s a bit of room to manouvre.
Pages: « 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 » Show All
Have your say
You must be logged in to post a comment.