567 Comments

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• 51.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:36 am

  With SARU’s record – read backstabbing of Meyer to get Snor appointed – it looks like no quality coach wants to touch them with a bargepole..

• 52.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:36 am

  @wooden spoon(wooden spoon)-49:

  Sad, but probably true. “No Cups Conservative Coetzee”

• 53.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:38 am

  Allistair Coetzees appointment will actually be a double blow for me.

  In one fell blow it will reduce the Boks chances for the next 4 years and at the same time increase WP’s chances in the next 4 years, what with them getting rid of yet another mediocre coach…

• 54.once more just take a break on the beach, dear springboks, once more...:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:38 am

  until i hear heyneke meyer say he does not want the job from his own lips i will refuse to believe it.
  everybody seems to be talking for heyneke now, like they’re all his flipping agent.
  nothing is cast in stone.

• 55.wooden spoon:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:38 am

  If it was a choice of John Kirwan or even that arrogant Warren Gatland over No Cups Coetzee, I’d take the kiwis.

  Boks need 80%.

• 56.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:40 am

  Damn, I hoped Mitchell would have been interested.

  Let me tell you guys how it will probably play out….

  IF professional and previously successful coaches apply for the job, for example: HMeyer and Mallet. Alistair Coetzee will still get the go.

  Why it wont be good for our rugby:
  HMeyer has a Super rugby title under his belt, with 4 currie cup titles.

  Mallet has the best winning % of any bok coach AND he led Stade Français to two consecutive French domestic title wins in 2003 and 2004. He has done well with Italy, considering their limitations.

  Alitair Coetzee: No Super Rugby Title, No currie cup title. As an assistant coach with the boks, what did he do exactly? There were more talk about the influence Eddie Jones had on the boks game than Coetzee ever did.

  If he gets the job it will just showcase the fact that SARU has once again failed to appoint a truly qualified and professional coach, with proper rugby credentials. They made the mistake by appointing Strauli in the same way. He helped the sharks get to the Super 12 final. Did they win it… No. But hey SARU gave the guy the top rugby job in the country anyway. I hope it doenst pan out this way, but it probably will.

  Lets face it Mallet and Heyneke wont apply.

  So unless SARU really wants to make the best decisions for bok rugby, they’ll look further than Coetzee and find a coach who have had success (titles under his belt) with proper rugby credentials. But to appoint Coetzee as a consolation coach will not be the best rugby decision.

  Professional coach = successful coach, with results to prove it. AC does not have those results.

  If SARU wants to learn from their mistakes, they needs to appoint a professional coach and not a consolation coach.

• 57.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:45 am

  @Jeez(Jeez)-56:

  Deja vu or have I already read that?

• 58.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:47 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-57: haha sorry, i just hate it when i write a big post (for a change) and it ends up being the last post of the previous page… my apologies

• 59.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:50 am

  @Jeez(Jeez)-58:

  I do the same.

• 60.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:52 am

  Where Snor was utterly useless, Coetzee is simply mediocre.

  And the Boks deserve better than mediocre. They deserve as good a coach as the All Blacks has.

  The danger is that due to the incredibly low standard set by Snor’s appointment, Coetzee will actually be seen as better than he actually is.

  Why can’t we have the best of the best? Why must it be a situation where no one of any standing is even interested in the job?

  Thanks, SARU.

• 61.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:53 am

  @Jeez(Jeez)-56:

  When Nick Mallett took over from Carel Du Plessis in 97′…What titles,championships etc had he won??? (Boland??Stint in Europe???)

  What pedigree did he have prior to leading Boks to 17 straight wins?

  And in 97′ there were plenty of coaches who had better credentials,titles,championships etc that Boland Cavalier Mallett surely???

  These are the facts no??

• 62.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:55 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-60:

  Tac who will take the job,who is available,who would please you and your ilk?

  Because one can only play cards they have been dealt.

• 63.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:58 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-62:

  The pertinent question is why are the top coaches not lining up to coach one of the top teams in the world?

  If coaches of sufficient quality aren’t available, you have to sort out the root cause of that rather than just appointing “whoever is left”.

  We deserve better.

• 64.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 09:59 am

  For all those pushing for Gert Smal,he has also won NOTHING.Has a worse off record with Stormers than Coetzee. ANd the Bok forwards werent really dominant when he was in charge under Jake. He led a mini revival of Ireland who ultimately were easily beaten by Wales in quarter final.

  So what championship credentials does Smal have?

• 65.Bismarck Burger:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:00 am

  Morning all. I see Kirwan has quit after Japan’s performance at the WC. Would he be an option?

• 66.Bismarck Burger:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:02 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-64: I don’t think you can judge a coach only on win ratio or trophies. We have to take into account what pool he had to his disposal. I’m not sure, but what was Jakes’s CV like prior to coaching the boks?

• 67.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:02 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-61: He was a coach for 7 years in France before he started coaching in SA. If you have the best winning % as a bok coach that should be more than enough. Denying that Mallet is a great coach says a lot ….

• 68.once more just take a break on the beach, dear springboks, once more...:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:03 am

  @Bismarck Burger(Bismarck Burger)-65:
  no

• 69.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:03 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-63:

  Yes I agree we deserve better.

  BUT

  How do we get to the bottom of the situation NOW? Because its unlikely that will we change perceptions of the administration before the time we have to appoint bok coach for upcoming 2012 season.

  Root cause along with the perception will not be a quick patch up job that will be rectified by appointment time.

  Again I ask,what do we do? Enough with the moaning.solution because any of the one that are ACTUALLY feasible at present many like you are dissatisfied with.

  Then what now?

• 70.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:03 am

  On another note, I see Brussouws loss is being noted as a critical reason for our loss against Aus.

  So I’d like to know what Francois Louw’s supporters have to say about that?

  Guess he wasn’t able to fill the gap, then.

• 71.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:04 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-61: but here you go

  Between August 1997 and December 1998, under Mallett’s guidance, the Springboks went on a record winning streak of 17 consecutive test wins. As part of the unbeaten run the Springboks won the Tri Nations Series undefeated and beat several teams by record margins, including a 52–10 against France in Paris, a 68–10 win over Scotland in Edinburgh, a 33–0 defeat of Ireland and a 96–13 against Wales.

• 72.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:05 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-64: who gives a damn about Smal, he’s not applying for the job, he’s contracted with Ireland until 2013

• 73.Bismarck Burger:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:05 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-63: That’s the right question…I had a brief chance discussion with Jake in 06 in a lift at the SARU offices. He looked almost bewaten-up, eyes bloodshot, tired of the fight – so much so that he spoke to a stranger in sharing his frustration and already confirming then that win or lose at WC07 he was quitting.

  I think we would be shocked in we saw the level of incompetance in handling o f rugby matters in SA

• 74.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:06 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-69:

  Depens on who “WE” are that you are referring to.

  If “WE” are the presidents council, then they go to Heyneke, hat in hand, promise him the job based on his superior presentation back in 2008, and negotiate a settlement with the Bulls union to compensate them for his loss.

  They promise to give Heyneke free reign to appoint his own support team and basically give him Carte Blanche to make the Boks the best team in the world.

  They then keep begging until he says yes.

• 75.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:09 am

  @Jeez(Jeez)-67:

  no no no mate,prior to his appointment in 97′ did Mallett have credentials befitting of a world class coach? 7 years in France is all good but doesnt say much as he returned to SA to coach Boland who won nothing really. Not discrediting him and his achievements BUT im bringing perspective especially at period of his appointment as Bok coach.Many are lambasting AC yet he probably has a better record that Mallett at the point in time/prior to Bok appoinment.

• 76.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:10 am

  Solution is not to appoint a mediocre coach. We are all speculating> No coach who might be interested will let the media know about it until they can officially start to apply for the job. Who would want all that attention from the media before the application date has even been set? So who knows, maybe some properly qualified coaches with past success might still apply…

• 77.wooden spoon:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:11 am

  Look, I see no reason why we need to continually hark back to previous coaches. The fact is, NONE of them were able to achieve anything like the All Blacks win ratio. Are you saying that is OK?

  Are you so accepting of mediocrity that you say the next coach to be appointed only has to meet the appointment criteria of the previous (mediocre) coaches?

  Or do you see the bigger picture, and say “enough is enough, only the best – proven winners – are good enough for the Boks.”

  We need to start hitting 80%.

  Jeez, with some of these attitudes, it’s no wonder the Boks are now a 65% team and seem set to stay that way

• 78.Bouts:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:12 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-75: You have a point, but I don’t want AC. Personal dislike of a defensive orientated strategy. Only reason.

• 79.Helen:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:12 am

  …things could be worse, you know?

  Head Coach: Chester Williams
  Assistant: Hugh Reece-Edwards
  Backline: Andre Markgaaf
  Forwards: Robert Fleck
  Fitness: Os du Randt
  Defense consultant: Earl Rose
  Kicking coach: Rory Kockott

• 80.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:14 am

  @Bismarck Burger(Bismarck Burger)-66:

  Jeez in his earlier posts in proclaiming those percentages & trophies should determine coach appointment

  yet he doesnt want to answer question about that same criteria for Mallett in 97′ which he didnt meet yet he still led boks to 17 straight wins.Who is to say AC cant do the same? He has an extensive coaching record in SA,Boks,Superrugby etc Or is coaching Boland & in 7 years in “France” more prestigious and a better determining factor as it did for 97′ Mallett

• 81.Helen:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:16 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-80:

  Good point, but bear in mind that Mallet’s personality immediately ensured respect from players and nation.

  Alister will have to earn respect with a superior track record

• 82.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:20 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-75: Well the point is were looking at credentials now arent we? The point is he has the credentials now. Back then Rugby was hardly a professional sport, it all basically started after 1995. And no coach back then was fulltime rugby coaches. SARU made mistakes by appointing coaches with no real rugby success, Mallet might have been one of them, but he’s not one anymore. Whats the point anyway he’s not applying. But TODAY we can sure as hell avoid the mediocre coaches and choose from coaches with decent track records… dont you agree?

• 83.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:21 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-74:

  That will never happen at any organisation. Such free reign is only but a myth in modern day professional sport. And the begging part is even more of a fable.

  Whats even more telling is that if Meyer DOESNT succeed he would have built a system that only responds to his coaching imprint ONLY. Also means if he starts going wrong or is guilty of incorrect decision making,hubris etc he would effectively be a law unto himself with such Carte Blanche.

  That no matter the situation isnt healthy neither. That is effectively running Bok National rugby with Draconian characteristics.

• 84.Sean:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:22 am

  Side for 2012 and beyond …………….1)jannie 2) Bizz 3) Steenhaump 4)Mostert 5)Bekker 6)Brussouw 7)Jean 8) Skulk capt 9)Hougaardt 10) Goosen 11) ? 12)Frans 13)Fourie 14)Pieterson 15) Lambie

• 85.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:23 am

  @wooden spoon(wooden spoon)-77: I agree no more mediocre coaches. SARU must hunt guys with the best success rates and nothing less!

• 86.Tacitus:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:23 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-83:

  No, but you hold him to a strict performance clause. Give him everything he wants but then expect a 70% win ratio in first two years, and 80% in second two years, once his systems are in place.

  Then he takes full accountability for his own success or failure.

• 87.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:24 am

  @Helen(Helen)-81:

  WTF does that mean? His personality?? Please explain.

  AC has the respect of many a player,Matfield a Bok legend has lent his opinion supporting AC,Brendan Venter one of the most astute minds in the game has only supported AC getting the job etc Same with Jake WHite.

  So what are you indeed talking about?

• 88.>^..^< katman:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:26 am

  @Helen(Helen)-79: And add to that Director of Rugby: Rudolf Straulie.

• 89.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:26 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-80: you cant take that gamble anymore! id pick mallet purely because he had succuss. Its just moronic to pick a coach because he MIGHT be as successful as Mallet or whoever. WOuld you like to gamble with another coach without no real success rate?

• 90.stormer in a teacup:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:31 am

  @Tac. The boks of 2007/2008 were not mostly bulls and an even smaller minority were juniors with the Bulls.

• 91.Transformation:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:31 am

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-87: Mallet went St Andrew’s College, Oxford educated blah blah blah, players just automatically respect him.

  AC on the other hand is a wally from gelvandale, was a teacher etc meaning no respect from players hehehe

• 92.hendrikp:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:32 am

  @Sean(seanbokpool)-84:

  I like your thinking. Jannie is of course a 3 and Steenkamp a 1. Also Gerhard Mostert is not an experienced enough player or such a stand-out to warrant being picked as an overseas player.

• 93.once more just take a break on the beach, dear springboks, once more...:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:32 am

  for what its worth the keewis report on bryce never getting to ref again:

  http://www.nzherald.co.nz/rugby-world-cup-2011/news/article.cfm?c_id=522&objectid=10758694

• 94.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:34 am

  For the record I would back mallett for the job purely for these reasons:

  -He has been there and done that.
  -Will not be bullied by media,agents,administration in influencing selections
  -Can withstand character assassination from media etc Keohane and co have tried with him and FAILED
  -He is his own man,astute & erudite.
  -Is not affiliated to any province or union or player group(split acrimoniously with WP after DOR disaster)
  -Is not a proponent of any real conservative or ultra liberal/expansive style of play.Not a romantic nor a verkrampte. Will formulate gameplan in accordance to our strengths AND what we NEED to expand on/skills base.

  I am not a big fan of Mallett and his personality.Have lambasted him on here plenty of times BUT he might be the right type of person not the take the SH*T that happens when one is appointed Bok coach. He has been there and wont make the same mistakes again.

  Also knows the dynamics of SA rugby as well as the country itself.

• 95.grant10:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:35 am

  @Tacitus(Deucalion)-9: LOL

  It makes life interesting

  but on a serious note….it is a crucial decision….

• 96.Jeez:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:36 am

  Mshiniwami is prepared to go with AC because……? Why would you appoint him? Has he won a currie cup? Super rugby title? Is the style which he incorporates the style of play that will help the boks beat NZ and Auz? What is it ? Why are you so anti
  achievement. WOuld you feel comfortable with a coach that has had previous success? Or would you rather hope that the coach gets it right with the boks, when he did not have any real success with other provincial/club teams?

  Share your wisdom please.

• 97.Helen:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:38 am

  Is Plum in the running?
  He has the character and no-nonsense approach to rugby and knows the local market well

• 98.mshiniwami:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:41 am

  @Jeez(Jeez)-89:

  So what it would be moronic to give the job to AC?? What criteria do you base that assertion?

  I can also tell you that Mallett really hasnt done much since he left Bok post,WP DOR disaster,diluted French14 wins with Stade but fails to win Heineken Cups even with a massive player budget at the time,Italy much of muchness as John Kirwan had a similiar record to Mallett yet unearth a lot more talent there and built structures.Look at what he’s doing with Japan.Mallett only real success there is a Livriemont coaches france win-who got beat by Tonga so really what is special about that??

  Come now.Can put an angle of my own and make your assertions as “moronic” as any.

• 99.Transformation:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:43 am

  @Helen(Helen)-97: but he is a kak head coach, very limited. at best he is a forwards coach

• 100.grant10:
  13 Oct 2011, 10:46 am

  @Jeez(Jeez)-47: I agree…

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