SA linked to rebel league
14 Nov 2011
South African franchises have been a linked with European plans to create a global rugby tournament in the near future.
According to The Guardian, there are secret plans being made among Europe’s richest clubs to establish a breakaway tournament, which would include South African franchises. The UK newspaper also confirmed that there are separate proposals to create a world club championship, which would include the champions of the English Premiership, Pro12 and French Top 14 and European Cup, as well as the winners of Super Rugby and the respective Australian, New Zealand and South African logs.
It is believed that only money is the issue stopping these plans. The European Cup is run by the European Rugby Cup Ltd, which acts on behalf of the unions involved. The tournament’s turnover has doubled in five years to just over €50m (about R545m) but there are many who believe the competition is capable of generating far more.
Frustrated clubs are aware the existing five-year ERC accord ends in June, although any stakeholder wishing to exit the tournament is still required to give two years’ notice. All the tournament’s major TV contracts expire in 2014 and Heineken’s title sponsorship deal runs until 2013. The strict salary cap in England remains a further bone of contention for millionaire club owners who, despite the economic turmoil across Europe, are seeking to expand.
‘From an English and French clubs’ point of view the European Cup is a growing competition but it is essentially controlled by the unions and played by the clubs,’ said an anonymous prominent club figure. ‘There are some English and French clubs who do not regard that as an ideal situation. There is also a growing weariness in South Africa with Sanzar [South Africa, New Zealand and Australia Rugby]. They feel they’re at a playing disadvantage by constantly having to travel and, despite having more commercial pulling power, do not get a proportionally bigger share of the revenue. They feel South Africa is subsidising Australia and New Zealand, which are relatively small markets.’
In a recent interview with SA Rugby magazine, Saracens CEO Edward Griffiths echoed the same sentiments. Saracens will take their European Cup tie against Biarritz to Cape Town in January.
‘I’’m not sure if that will be possible and whether the IRB will allow it [a global club competition], but I do believe new competition structures need to be implemented. The English clubs are suffering major losses. There was a total loss of R300 million from all clubs after last season, so there needs to be some changes made,’ said Griffiths.
‘It would be a positive step for South African franchises to join forces with European clubs. The time zone is similar and it’s easier to travel to London and Paris than it is to Sydney or Auckland. This would make it easier for all clubs and franchises to earn a profit while it will also create a fresh and appealing spectacle for fan.’
161 Comments
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14 Nov 2011, 21:42 pm
test tours to nz and them to us would be restored to the event they should be instead of a yearly fixture.
whattapleasure.
14 Nov 2011, 21:47 pm
Now can you guys imagine if Munster plays the Lions at Soccer City in the Final. How many supporters from Europe will watch the Final. Compare that to the number of kiwi supporters that watched the Bulls Chiefs final. It will be like a mini Lions tour. And for those of you that think it will be bad for our players as the greater exposure would make them easier to buy. Our teams will not deal in Rands anymore, but we will be earning Pounds through TV rights. The greater speed at which our games will be played in let’s say feb and march will make SA games the more watchable and our players will become the best equipped to play in different circumstances. I tell you what, some of our props will be knocked down to earth if they go and play in muddy conditions in England.
14 Nov 2011, 21:56 pm
@rangerman(rangerman)-48:
I’m not relegating the NH sides to also ran status. My complaint is that our reaction seems to be based on the fact that we were out negotiated by NZ and Oz.
@Horings(Horings)-49:
NZ dominated rugby before the 3N, and Oz won 2 RWCs. Our participation in the 3N in no way diminishes those achievements. In fact, other than financially, we languish at the bottom of the SANZAR ladder.
14 Nov 2011, 21:59 pm
NZ and Aus need SA more than SA needs Europe.
The kissing cousins NZ and Aus better wake up soon and realise this… SA has been looking north for a while now…
In my personal opinion, going north would lead to a slip in standards. The best of SA remain at the top because they play the best.
14 Nov 2011, 22:03 pm
I’m off to bed.
14 Nov 2011, 22:04 pm
@David(David)-53: i have to disagree with both yourpoints David.
point one: its not a simple case of being out negotiated, even though we are the nation whish will always suck the hind t it when it comes to negotiating with the tacit anzac alliance. Its more a case of geography omo and thus any suggestion to move north for me is simply based on two things, revenue (pro game nowadays) and ease of travel. the north ticks both boxes and like i said, we will play against teams packed with superstars of rugby (and increasingly so as nz and aus are bled dry). it will not be a tier one vs tier lower scenario David.
point two: we dominated both aus and nz statistically befor the 3n and in fact it took about 7 years of the 3n for the nz’s to draw level with us so that is not true. yes, we languish of late but thats even more reason for us to try something new surely? or shuld we do the same old and expect a diferent result?
14 Nov 2011, 22:07 pm
@David the fact of the matter is if no one will watch a provincial NZ Aus game then there will be no money and their players will play where the money is. The same money that SA teams will have a hand in, which will go back into our rugby. Past experience and history will not convince me as this will be a new ball game. You will need to convince me by arguing a logical point.
14 Nov 2011, 22:08 pm
@David(David)-55: me too, sleep well David and i dont thik we will ever move north but its great to chat about the possibilities, thanks.
14 Nov 2011, 22:15 pm
I think overall, from a South African rugby supporters perspective I’m not too sure about it. Fixture numbers and player burnout crop up as a potential issue. But from a world rugby perspective I can see it benefiting the players and teams up North to have more contact with a more forward-thinking Southern Hemisphere style of rugby.
14 Nov 2011, 22:34 pm
Money talks, more & more games every year something’s got to give. Guess I’m just an ouballie hankering for the test series of my youth…
14 Nov 2011, 22:34 pm
@David(David)-55: tata chipman.
14 Nov 2011, 22:35 pm
@nikoli(nikoli)-60: I’m already at breaking point. There’s far too much rugby already.
14 Nov 2011, 22:35 pm
The S15 format is incredibly boring.
14 Nov 2011, 22:37 pm
@Horings(Horings)-57: @Yetirat(Yetirat)-59: @rangerman(rangerman)-56:
all very well said and true
boks will be missed….and it maybe the death knell for superRugby, but to be honest superRugby is getting boring. enforced local derby games are tiresome and i cant be bothered watching them.
yes boks leaving will weaken the comp but it maybe just what it needs for the admin to realise they need to be more creative than just adding more teams.
boks will be exposed to different rugby. diversity is the key.make sure the currieCup is protected and all will be well.
NZ and Aus will survive, it’ll just mean that some smarter more creative people will need to step up.
this will not be the end of SH rugby
14 Nov 2011, 22:37 pm
Ya wooden, kinda loses it’s meaning when playing each other so much
15 Nov 2011, 00:00 am
this will sound really g-ay…but the thought of watching those poor lilly white munster blokes huffing and puffing their way around Loftus on a scortching hot afternoon at altitude…..is giving me a hard-on.
on a more serious note, kiwi and oz rugby would survive…barely, but they would be forced to relax their laws withregards to players playing outside of nz otherwise they’s be left with not much else to select.
15 Nov 2011, 01:55 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl(Brigadier Van Zyl)-66: laws to change overseas players eligibilty should never change. thats the only thing stopping a mass exodus of players.
new comp can encompass having the argentinians and a new team based in asia. i like the idea of having a pacific rim team, ie the teams that play in the pacific comp can all contribute players but be based in hongKong or japan. they wouldnt be the calibre of the boks (no team is) but it would be something different as well as promoting rugby to the asian market
15 Nov 2011, 02:08 am
Look North!! Time to liven things up.
Ideally that would just lead to a bigger portion of the broadcasting revenue. SANZAR isn’t working. SARU are being taken to the cleaners every time a new deal is made.
But how I’d love to see us ditch Super rugby. It just isn’t working out. At the moment our sides are competing against themselves for a play-off spot. The better the overall standard, the less likely you are to get home-field advantage.
The Reds won the 2011 SR competition because they played in the Australian conference, and had home advantage throughout the play-offs. Complete bullsh1t.
Maybe start a tournament where all SA sides compete (including the Kings) against 10 other teams from Europe.
15 Nov 2011, 03:53 am
South Africa are a great Rugby Nation, no doubt about that. If they were to go north, good luck to them. Will it improve their standard of rugby? Do’nt think so.
15 Nov 2011, 04:39 am
Would love to see what John O’Niel has to say about all this? I suspect if it actually got really serious loads of U-turns and arrrrse kissing towards South Africa! One thing that nobody has thought about…… What will happen to all the Cape Crusaders if this takes off? Who will they support?!?!?!
15 Nov 2011, 04:46 am
If the shoe was on the other foot, would the Aussies and Kiwis hang around for the South Africans???? Doubt it, they would be off at the first smell of cash!
15 Nov 2011, 04:54 am
@HongKongSlong(HongKongSlong)-71:
No proof in anything you just said, like the rest of the comments on here.
Only thing worth saying is go for it, leave. We have heard about it so many times before so it was only a matter of time.
Shame but rugby is about money now and is getting worse. Which makes you think how Samoa comes close to beating SA so many times and beat Ozzie. Samoa, a team that travelled on a loan to get the the RWC, no money but passion.
We will soon see English rugby clubs running around with 10 international players like their football sides.
And the teams that dont have the money of those clubs will be left with the left overs.
15 Nov 2011, 05:18 am
SA was missing from proper test rugby from 1984 for a whole decade. Nobody missed them. Nobody cared. The two top teams are NZ and Oz — both operating in first-world economies with eight times or more the per capita GDP than the Africans. Bledisloe and NPC will do nicely. And lucratively.
15 Nov 2011, 05:44 am
69
Te Rangatira(Te Rangatira) Says:
When this subject comes up… Most kiwi posters ask the rhetorical question “will it improve Bok rugby”, and then answer “no” or “they doubt it”.
Most of these kiwis are too one-eyed to see that is a double-edged sword… So I will ask rhetorically… “will the ABs not playing the Boks improve AB rugby?”
To which I must answer… “I doubt it!”
If you guys think playing a pacific league where you beat every team by cricket scores will be good for kiwi rugby you guys are more deluded than you know…
The truth is that not only will NZ an Aus lose the revenue that SA brings to the party but the quality of your rugby would also slip by not having the Boks to test your teams al the time…
Fact is… any way you slice this pizza… NZ will lose the lekker toppings… and be left with plain cheese to feed their already ambivalent fans…
Even if you have the best cheese… after eating so much cheese kiwi people are gonna get bored with that diet…!
But you carry on up the khyber… It will be fun to watch…!
15 Nov 2011, 05:46 am
@rangerman(rangerman)-56:
It actually took NZ 4 years of tri nations to surpass Sth Africa head to head Keeping it real.
15 Nov 2011, 05:54 am
With no Super rugby a boat load of players from Auz and NZ will move to go and play in Europe. They wont get paid as much without SA in the super rugby comp. So imo the standards will rise soon enough, so I dont really fear the falling in standards or SA falling behind nz and auz. NZ and Auz coaches will probably be appointed too…
15 Nov 2011, 06:01 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-73:
Then enjoy the viewing ……….. should be fun year in year out………..not
15 Nov 2011, 06:02 am
@ufo(ufo)-74:
Spot on bru
15 Nov 2011, 06:04 am
@ufo(ufo)-74:
The rhetorical question is if NZ were to head North would it improve our rugby? I do’nt think so..
15 Nov 2011, 06:05 am
@JohnPaul(JohnPaul)-30:
Well enjoy playing with yourselves you f uk head!
15 Nov 2011, 06:28 am
sing a song of sixpence a pocket full of rye every year we hear the same nursery rhyme with jingle bells on the horizon and nobody with the balls to cut the umbilical cord so who the fck thinks they’re fooling who?
15 Nov 2011, 06:39 am
@Hurricane(Hurricane)-72: The reason why the Premier League soccer teams have so many foreigners in them is because of European legislation law allowing freedom of movement. So you can’t limit clubs to only having a certain number of foreigners in a team at any one time. I think they are only allowed 2 non Europeans on the pitch at any one time. Granted quite a few Aussies and Kiwis have ancestral European passports, but it can’t be as crazy as soccer, because there aren’t enough Europeans to dilute the English clubs that much. You may actually see some South African Provinces getting cheap Kiwi labour on board as well if this all goes through.
15 Nov 2011, 06:54 am
when they gonna face the fact that pro sport is not the diamond studded fairy godmothers wand they still think it might be, how much revenue loss can any one ore more franchise take before the half wrecked ship runs aground or goes belly UP…anyway ?
Ain’t gonna work.., pie in the sky hairbrain schemes remain just that, pie in the sky hairbrain schemes..
15 Nov 2011, 07:24 am
@David(David)-46: stick your disgust where the sun dont shine David!
Historically we have far stronger historic links with France and Britain than Aussies or Kiwis….that is a fact!
Like it or not it is a fact!
Saying that makes me less ‘ African ” ?
WTF are you talking about??
15 Nov 2011, 07:28 am
@David(David)-53: I have been against Sanzar from day 1 my man….day farken 1 !
You owe me an apology mate!
My being in favour of a NH deal has you implying I am unpatriotic?
Fark you David……that is very judgemental of you…..
I have strong Irish and English ancestral roots…..of course I farken prefer and alighn myself with them more than the kiwis and aussies! Where is the farken crime in that!??
Bloody arrogant of you mate!
15 Nov 2011, 07:40 am
@grant10(grant10)-84:
True that. South Africans have a much stronger link to the north than those strange Australasians. My genetics are all linked to the north and I bet so are about 80% of bloggers on keo.
My family are over there too. It makes perfect sense to take our rugby over there.
Let the ANZAC’s continue their incestuous relations as only they can do it…..*bleat*
15 Nov 2011, 07:41 am
Got to raise a question – if the S15 is so boring and unattractive , why do so many top Heineken cup players have the wish to one day play in the S15 ???? Maybe because it is the best comp in the world ?
I would also like to know how many bloggers on this site would be b-i-t-c-h ing to go north if their franchise had won last years S15 ? As a Sader supporter this years comp for me was the best , even though we didnt win , but showed that there is still passion in rugby ….. SA supporters need to focus more on the playing abitilites of their players or their passion( SA franchises were **** this year ? – i dont think any true supporter would wish for their team to play in a lesser league so they can win – at the moment S15 is still the premier comp in the world and the old story goes … you only become the best if you play against the best.
15 Nov 2011, 07:41 am
finally!
some admin poosies growing a bit of balls.
why be dishonest about our relationship with the anzacs?
they think we’re are a bunch of cuntss, we know they’re a bunch of ccunts, why act like its not the case?
they can keep their bullsshit cheating filth to themselves and have fun with that.
for bragging rights and to settle it, we can host tours with them every 2nd or 3rd year just to prove who’s who in the zoo.
for the rest lets go north.
15 Nov 2011, 07:43 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-86: We are all colonialists at the end of the day – some of us just got on the wrong boat !!!!
15 Nov 2011, 07:49 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-86: 1 and 2 in the world, pilgrim.
15 Nov 2011, 07:50 am
@stew(stew)-87:
For the reasons mentioned above. Cheating, biased refereeing, lopsided travel schedules and a rugby union that does not support their players against the kissing ANZAC cousins.
The Australasians clearly feel threatened by South Africa and will resort to any measures to get us.
I’d personally rather my team played in a proper competitive sporting environment where the emphasis is on playing the game rather than trying to win any any and all costs to “get the Yarpies”. The ANZAC’s need to grow up.
15 Nov 2011, 08:00 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-86:
I thought you were cullart ?
15 Nov 2011, 08:01 am
@stew(stew)-87:
i noticed some of these ‘s15 is boring’ comments coming from some of your compatriots…
i enjoy the s15… but that’s not the point…
as much as you guys can be disingenuous about it… and i don’t expect a single NZ or Aus blogger to be onset about it on keo…
the point is… saffas are gatvol of being screwed by NZ and Aus… and i’m not talking about the world cup…
we bring the most money to the SANZAR party and get less, pro rata than both NZ and Aus back… plus you guys are always voting as a block against SA to ensure things don’t go our way…
before you scream blue conspiracy… one case in point you guys voted that it must be a saffa team that must have a by on the the first weekend on the S15… it was the stormers last year and the sharks this year… it definitely is a disadvantage to the team having the by on the first weekend… why not rotate it among all three countries who can rotate it among all franchise to ensure that each team is only disadvantaged once each in 15 years…? but no… NZ and Aus vote that it must be a Saffa team… and only a saffa team… that has a by on the first weekend of the comp…
now i ask you to be honest here… Is that fair and right…? No sarcasm please… just honesty…?
And it is the continual ‘little’ things like this that add up over the years and make us think… why must we take this continual back-handed two-upmanshiop from you guys…? we bring most of the cash to the table and you guys can’t even see your way to treating us as equals…? says a lot about the psyche of both your countries that you have to continually feel the need to put one over us and ‘gang-up’ to ensure south africa always gets the short-end of the rugby ball…?
so we say… why the fark should we accept that…?
let’s take our money elsewhere where they also have money money and are not as nationalistically fragile and won’t see the need to ALWAYS try and put one over south africa…?
and don’t say it’s because our administrators are weak (which may be true…) the point is even if they were strong, you guys ALWAYS voting together means the strength of our administrators is moot….
i don’t expect any reason from you guys… seems you’re emotionally incapable of being objective…
but just be honest if you can for a few minutes and ask yourselves if either of your nations would accept the **** your rugby unions deal out to us all the time…?
15 Nov 2011, 08:01 am
@stew(stew)-87: With SA in there, it wouldn’t be a lesser league, it would be the greatest of all time, because the cream from Australia and New Zealand as well as the rest of the world would all be in it. There would also be real passion from the fans and huge stadiums completely full, travelling support and not just the players sharing in a truly great rugby experience, but also THE FANS, something you Antipodeans don’t have many of.
15 Nov 2011, 08:02 am
Can we once and for all take the TRAVEL equation out of the scenario now – the Saders this season proved that even without home advantage that a team playing well can still perform
15 Nov 2011, 08:03 am
@Gunther(gunther)-92:
hehehe…
you’ve caught him with his genes down…
15 Nov 2011, 08:04 am
@stew(stew)-87: seems a lot more south players heading north ?
15 Nov 2011, 08:04 am
@stew(stew)-89:
You mean the nasty English judge told you to get on the wrong boat?
15 Nov 2011, 08:05 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-90:
At any cost? A game played where there is no controversy would be a welcome change from the norm. No allegations of biased refereing, silly childish remarks from Kiwi and Aussie commentators, players getting preferential treatment because they ‘play somewhere between the border of the offside line’….just an even playing field with dollops of sportsmanship for the sake of the game.
South Africans are too honest and it counts against us. We need to play the game of rugby with like minded players in the north…guys that get down to business and play hard uncompromising rugby for the love of the game…no whining about dirty South Africans ‘eye gouging’ or wearing armbands.
To play the Kiwis in a proper three test series every odd year is a much more tantalising proposition.
Are you gonna take another 24 years to get the next trophy? Just asking.
15 Nov 2011, 08:07 am
@ufo(ufo)-96:
Indeed the genie is out the bottle.
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