Lions pivot training with Stormers
22 Nov 2011
Burton Francis ran with the Stormers when the Cape franchise began their pre-season training schedule on Monday.
Francis, who recently parted ways with the Lions, was in Cape Town on Monday running through drills with the Stormers. Officially, the Stormers have contracted only three new players in Joe Pietersen (Bayonne), Deon Carstens (Saracens) and Gerhard van den Heever (Bulls), but Francis could potentially provide further cover for the Stormers in the problematic flyhalf position.
The Boland trio of Bolla Conradie, Elgar Watts and Clemen Lewis also trained with the team on Monday. Having a player of Conradie’s experience in the greater training group will be a boon for the Stormers, and no doubt Watts’s performance in Boland’s title-clinching First Division campaign may have given head coach Allister Coetzee food for thought.
The Stormers recently lost promising flyhalf Lionel Cronje to the Bulls, and aside from Peter Grant, are lacking in experienced No 10s. Kurt Coleman has been exposed to Super Rugby while Demetri Catrakilis and Gary van Aswegen have played Currie Cup rugby, but none of the three, nor Watts for that matter, are established at Super Rugby level.
774 Comments
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23 Nov 2011, 13:12 pm
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-542:
23 Nov 2011, 13:13 pm
@Upho(ufo)-543:
Dont know to be honest but the last time a book was pushed on this site-Monty’s one a couple years back-had something to do with Keo in its production whether co writer,editor etc blah blah
But since prior to wc,the Butch back in Boks campaign along with book on site etc has been on overdrive.
23 Nov 2011, 13:14 pm
As I understand it – if you trust the government, the bill is good. If you don’t, then it’s bad. I think that some people forget that, in a democracy, government members are servants, employees of the people, paid for by our taxes to run the country the way we want it to. They are not our leaders, nor are they are rulers. If they try desperately hard to keep secrets from us, under the guise of “protecting National Security” (yeah right!), then I can’t help but feel suspicious. Our government members have made it clear, via their actions, (remember Tony Yengeni being carried to prison on the shoulders of his comrades) that they condone corruption, hence they are not to be trusted, hence we should be very worried about the bill.
23 Nov 2011, 13:14 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-548: Hehehehe, clearly we fit the mould. Lol
23 Nov 2011, 13:14 pm
@Upho(ufo)-549:
The DA governing Western Cape.
23 Nov 2011, 13:16 pm
@Gunther(gunther)-545:
Ahhhh thats more like it…Good to know you still around gunther,loud & clear.
23 Nov 2011, 13:20 pm
@Upho(ufo)-549: What is everyone really saying that ordinary south Africa must have access to all manner of documents that are sensitive to the country’s protection and advancement? This is ludicrous, every country has a classification process, why shouldn’t SA?
23 Nov 2011, 13:20 pm
@Upho(ufo)-549:
Its our turn to eat.
Nom nom nom.
Enemies of the state can be anyone who wants to take pork off the menu.
Also the Israelis.
But not the Chinese (who should really scare us) because they just have to ask us an we tell them.
They’re giving it to us with a horsecock and we don’t even know it yet.
23 Nov 2011, 13:20 pm
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-552:
thanks bud… i think it’s been quite funny that whenever any of the keo writers or keo himself have been on the blog… i have asked the question and been studiously ignored…
but i agree with you and think it must be written by keo…
23 Nov 2011, 13:21 pm
I think I just received an email from Highbury (HSM) about a Butch Book signing. Hopefully this will all be over soon.
Keo: If I buy one of his books will you email me a patch for your website that lets me block out his evil grin?
You won. I give up.
23 Nov 2011, 13:22 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-557:
why now…? why not back in 1994…
what has changed…?
23 Nov 2011, 13:24 pm
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-556:
would you like to sign it?
you can be “Concerned from Cresta”.
I will be “Outraged from Oudtshoorn”
23 Nov 2011, 13:25 pm
Ashampoo: maybe we should give the veto to our most trusted public representative, who exhibits the moral constitution to uphold our ambitions for our government and the development and safety of our country. Helen zille should have sole authority to determine as to what’s classified and what remains in the public domain! Lol
After thats done I can assure you the media and “others” certainly won’t complain at all.
23 Nov 2011, 13:25 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-557: You keep referring to the best parts of the bill, which we agree with, without realising that the issues that we have with the Bill is not the principal of the bill but the practical application of certain aspects thereof.
I don’t want the Bill removed. I want certain clauses amended to allow for the appropriate protection against abuse measures to be inserted.
23 Nov 2011, 13:26 pm
Simply post ‘classified state secrets’ (read corruption details) to Wikileaks… spread around a few international sites and then quote them as source in the public domain in any forthcoming forensic whistle-blowing articles… problem solved…
23 Nov 2011, 13:27 pm
@Taahirah(Taahirah)-404: Interesting. Thanks Taahirah. So, scope for abuse, but not the end of press freedom by any means.
23 Nov 2011, 13:27 pm
@Gunther(gunther)-558:
hehehe…
and not even using lubricant…
23 Nov 2011, 13:27 pm
In other news I see the Media have been thrwon out of the CSA probe.
Apparently Gerald Majola’s wine cellar is a matter of Nationa Security.
nom nom nom.
23 Nov 2011, 13:29 pm
‘State Secrets’ my lily white arse.. no such f’ng thing in this country.. same as their was NONE during the height of the Verwoerd – Vorster era… which ****** gevaar are we afraid of NOW !!?
The only gevaar these moguls are kak bang scared of is losing the grip of all encompassing power politics which enshrine their dictatorial ability to go forth and abuse or manipulate power without any transparency or accountability to public scrutiny – and that is all this bullshit baffles brains smoke screen legislation is all about..
Maintaining and attempting to legislate massive overwhelming power and manipulative control with scant attribution to the very freedom from corruption and power abuse that the ANC cadres and freedom fighters fought for they are now reversing their stance in order to enshrine their own longevity in power and non accountability to the public at large..
23 Nov 2011, 13:29 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-563:
The Arch would be the perfect person for the job… One of the very few people to criticize without fear or favor both pre and post 1994…
23 Nov 2011, 13:31 pm
@Upho(ufo)-561: Laws are promulgated over many years it’s a continuous component of democracy, the state security apparatus may feel that sensitive information is readily available in the public domain and this is a threat to national security and as such there’s a requirement to protect such information as is the purview of the state.
23 Nov 2011, 13:31 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-557: sensitive to WHAT.. who is the arch enemy of the people here.. which debased and destabilizing force of corruption is the arch enemy of the people of SA .. Please name this invisible force we need legislation to protect the state security and its interests from…
23 Nov 2011, 13:33 pm
@Gunther(gunther)-568: @mpundulu(mpundulu)-563:
now that gunther mentions cricket…
another person i would have absolute faith in for the role…
is Mtutuzeli Nyoka… a man of pure integrity IMO…
23 Nov 2011, 13:34 pm
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-564: Ok now you are talking, which aspects would you like amended and what would be the new wording or meaning?
23 Nov 2011, 13:35 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-571:
c’mon mpundulu…
for 15 years no one in government or the anc even thought about such a bill…
so why now…?
23 Nov 2011, 13:37 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-563:
So there you have stated it open – as far as you and Jacob Z and Julius M are concerned Helen Zille represents public enemy No.1
So THAT is who or WHAT you are so fundamentally sh’t scared bang to open up and declare state secret information to.. Now we know that little lady from the Burbs of C.T. is your new public arch enemy No.1
She ain’t my champion if that is what you are intending insinuating .. but it seems its pretty clear from where I’m sitting this whole smoke screen ‘State Secret’ protection Bill bullshit is designed to muzzle ANY form of free opposition and governmental scrutiny.
23 Nov 2011, 13:39 pm
@Upho(ufo)-567:
The South African Government is self-lubricating.
23 Nov 2011, 13:39 pm
@ashampoopaloo(joel1yahoo)-569: Ok so for you states have no secrets, and certainly not SA, all information should be sent straight to etv to be made public? Obviously we have to abolish the all state security services, so no police, military, intelligence apparatus. Ok now I know you are troubled.
23 Nov 2011, 13:40 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-574: Read my posts up to now and the answer will be a plain as day.
Because you obviously haven’t been paying proper attention, you’ve been too busy defending the company position.
23 Nov 2011, 13:41 pm
@Upho(ufo)-570: That charlatan would find some way to monetize his position!
23 Nov 2011, 13:42 pm
I see Keo has better sense than to try and self this Butch Wankfest amongst the good citizens of Cape Town.
23 Nov 2011, 13:45 pm
@Upho(ufo)-575: So if the government did not think of a law in 1994, then you can’t bring it up now! In your country are laws allowed to be amended?
23 Nov 2011, 13:46 pm
@Gunther(gunther)-577:
ain’t that the truth…
the lubricant has a special name…
gravy..
23 Nov 2011, 13:47 pm
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-497: Very farken good point. The media are no bambi eyed innocents.
23 Nov 2011, 13:48 pm
Hawu?
Tutu monetizing his position?
The irony is achingly beautiful.
The entire ANC is monetizing it’s position,
But Tutu is a charlatan.
Keo, seriously we need to bring back the post rating system.
Because we have a hall-of-famer here.
23 Nov 2011, 13:48 pm
@ashampoopaloo(joel1yahoo)-576: Ok you got it, and I think we should abolish government as well now! Lol
23 Nov 2011, 13:50 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-571:
but WHO would be such a threat…?
who is this nouveau nemesis from whom the government must protect our interests…?
and let’s be frank here… there is nothing that needs that sort of protection… we have fallen behind the world in terms of technological advancement and innovation…
only south africa wasted billions on pebble bed technology which had been discredited by the nuclear fraternity… who would want to steal ‘our’ nuclear secrets..?
only south africa insisted that aids was not real and showering was a prophylactic.. who would want to steal our medical secrets…?
militarily we have fall en by the way side and the scientists in the denel and other parastatals… have been forced out of the country into the military of other countries… who would want to steal our military secrets…? if the government wanted to keep pour military secrets they should have kept military scientists…
i could go on but you get the gist…
so what is there that is so vital that needs protecting…?
and from whom are we protecting it…?
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-582:
in my country…? south africa is my country… africa is my continent…
of course they can amend and update laws… and even introduce new laws… no shame or blame in that…
but the reasons and needs for changes or new laws are apparent and transparent and rational people across the board would recognize the need to do so…
but when they do so against the voice of reason from many quarters… white black colored and indian… and from all sectors of society business, religious, political… then there is cause for grave concern…
23 Nov 2011, 13:52 pm
@Gunther(gunther)-585: I assure you the man is nowhere near innocent in his money grabbing schemes, an utter charlatan.
23 Nov 2011, 13:52 pm
@John Galt(John Galt)-510: “No good can come of muzzling the media.” – but some good can come from making media being more accountable as the UK has found with the phone hacking scandal. The feral pack nature of media needs to have some checks.
23 Nov 2011, 13:53 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-578:
Nope you are pretending the state has these huge high security secrets that require protection from public scrutiny (same as the Vorster – Verwoerd – Botha regime bullshitted the public that we needed protection from such Tokoloshe’s hiding under their beds at night) – and whereby you now have a state controlled discriminatory vehicle of legislation that can divert and avert ALL and ANY level of transparency away from Joe public or any voice of free scrutiny .. hence you are simply advocating State controlled manipulative governance .. absolutely no different from the power mogul abusers of the past.. you have fallen straight into the very same trap you were so vehemently anti and against in all your years of freedom politics you fought for while in exile..
23 Nov 2011, 13:55 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-535: Oh, so you DO use “Rhodesian” as an insult??! You farken apologist….
23 Nov 2011, 13:57 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-580:
that ‘charlatan’ is THE single biggest reason that freedom came to south africa…
when did he become a charlatan in your opinion…?
when he criticized the anc…?
23 Nov 2011, 13:57 pm
@Upho(ufo)-587: Laws don’t merely prepare for the present they also have to anticipate the future and provide breadth for those possible eventualities.
There being opposing views doesn’t mean that the bill is intended to facilitate nefarious activities on part of the government, in actual most people agree on most of the points but the disagreement is one clause which speaks to the public interest concern.
23 Nov 2011, 14:02 pm
Here are my two cents’ worth on the Protection of State Information Bill:
The Bill is not as bad as many people claim, and much better than the first version that was tabled last year.
It is still problematic that it does not include a “public interest” defense.
Section 14(3) provides an out to theoretically classify information that does not have anything to do with national security.
There is still a safeguard in section 32 that you can apply for access to a classified document. This requires an application to court.
The penalty (25 years in prison) for possession classified information is harsh. That being said, whistleblowers are still protected by the Protected Disclosures Act.
Ultimately the Bill depends on how it is implemented – there is scope for abuse by the State. If we trusted government enough to believe that the officials in our security agencies will always act honestly and in the national interest, then there would be no problems with the Bill. Unfortunately, that is not the case.
Another issue is that the Bill, once again, marginalises the lower income groups. The media has money and access to attorneys and can afford to utilise the section 32 safeguard to go to court to demand access to classified documents.
The poorer segments of our society can’t afford this route, so are ultimately left with no safeguard.
23 Nov 2011, 14:02 pm
@Upho(ufo)-587:
iGovernment’s top National Security threats
Helen Zille
Bleddy Agents
The French (in case they spill the beans about the arms deal and we have to give the money back)
Ze Germans (ditto)
The Poms (ditto)
Steve Hofmeyer (culturally subversive)
Patricia Lewis (ditto)
The Americans (because they are imperialists and cannot be trusted)
Shrien Dewani ( because those apes mustn’t think they can ****** around in Mzansi)
The Botswanan Government (woops)
Tiger Woods (for pretending he isn’t black)
Switzelrand and Bermuda’s banks (in case they let slip where all our money is)
White Capital (need we say more)
Israel ( they are Jewish and should not be trusted).
Joh.
it’s worse than I thought.
We got this sucker just in time.
23 Nov 2011, 14:04 pm
@Upho(ufo)-592: He is not the single biggest reason freedom came to south Africa, hehehe, certainly not! He became a charlatan well before 1994, well before. I know it’s hard to believe but we all have ambitions and potential to behave in nefarious ways, men of the cloth are definitely not immune to that no matter how short they are!
23 Nov 2011, 14:05 pm
so mpundulu…
in a village on the banks of the crocodile river downstream from pelindaba the water begins to taste strange… and begins to glow at night… and the mielies don’t produce any cobs… and the chickens start to grow extra legs and heads… and the children are still-borne… and the villagers start to get ulcers on their skins… and then die in large numbers…
you say they should have no recourse to question or investigate pelindaba because it is not in the national interests to do so…?
are you serious bud…?
well that will be the case under the secrecy bill as it stands…
please explain to me ho what is a good thing…
oh right…
it must be a good thing if the president’s nephew, the ex-presidents grandson and assorted charlatans, fraudsters, thieves and murderers don’t have to explain why the water of jozi is laced with acid..?
okay… i’m with you now…
viva secrecy bill viva…!!
23 Nov 2011, 14:07 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-593:
of course bud… IF it is done with transparency and in consultation with the people…
which this has not…
23 Nov 2011, 14:07 pm
@mpundulu(mpundulu)-596:
tell me more.
how is he a bigger charlatan than your average ANC member?
23 Nov 2011, 14:08 pm
@Upho(ufo)-597:
Exactly – and those poor villagers would not have the ability to protect themselves because they can’t afford litigation.
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