Sharks snub Tri-Series
8 Jan 2012
The Sharks have declined an invitation to play the Stormers and the Lions in a pre-season Tri-Series at Newlands at the end of January.
The Durban-based franchise has competed in the tournament in recent years, but said a long upcoming Super Rugby campaign meant it wasn’t ideal to play tough warm-up matches beforehand.
‘We will play Boland and the EP Kings over two weekends early in February,’ Sharks assistant coach Hugh Reece-Edwards told The Witness newspaper. ‘Playing in the Newlands triangular involved playing two games [against the Lions and the Stormers] in four days at the end of this month.
‘We think it will be more beneficial to our planning and preparation to spread the games over two weekends, particularly this early in the season and with a long year ahead of us.
‘I believe the Cheetahs are taking our place in Cape Town,’ he added.
The Sharks kick off their 2012 Super Rugby season with a match against the Bulls at Loftus on 24 February.
348 Comments
8 Jan 2012, 15:47 pm
Ahh. The Plascon triple velvet.
You can’t win it if you ain’t in it.
And declining tough warm-up matches.
Enough said.
8 Jan 2012, 16:05 pm
Playing against easier opposition makes sense. Trying out moves and finding structure will be easier to accomplish against weaker teams… Two games before the season starts should be more than enough- less chance of injuries etc. Smart move sharks.
8 Jan 2012, 16:06 pm
Go Boland (Stormers reserves heh heh heh):D
8 Jan 2012, 16:09 pm
According to the news reports I heard, they were in fact complaining about the fact that the matches would be played at Newlands, giving the Stormers lots of gate revenue while the Sharks wanted to host some games in Durban to share in the loot.
When that request was ignored, they pulled out.
8 Jan 2012, 16:17 pm
@Tacitus-4:
This is not exactly the first year that this tournament has been played.
If the Bulls had enough gumption, they would’ve organised a similar tournament to this one. And it could’ve been done on an alternate hosting basis.
There are still question marks about tough opposition early in the season but I reckon it is the way to go.
Anyway all the best to you and yours for 2012.
8 Jan 2012, 16:57 pm
@IAAS-5:
I’d rather sacrifice the “fast start” to the competition in exchange for a team that can go the distance.
In other words, it’s not the end of the world if the team is a bit underdone when the S15 kicks off. The competion is just so absurdly long that protecting the players from burn out is of paramount importance.
So no, I don’t believe in a tough pre season anymore. Not with the extended format of the competition.
8 Jan 2012, 17:07 pm
@Tacitus. That was always the Bulls’ plan, but given that there is a 3 week break in the middle of the series and the Bulls will only have a couple of Boks (Hougaard, Steyn, Spies, Chilliboy) they can use that period as a mini rest period, while some other unions will get 7 or 8 burnt out Boks back. They should therefore look to start the super 15 on fire and make a statement.
8 Jan 2012, 17:21 pm
@Tacitus-6:
But the Stormers have been known to play against the Maties and Ikeys as well in pre-season. It’s all about giving some of the lesser known in the squad a run as well. Prior to the Plascon triple velvet.
It’s all about hitting the ground running from the word-go. You would want a tough game or two before taking on the best of NZ.
And being a long tourney, I would like the size of each squad increased. To at least 35 if not 40.
8 Jan 2012, 17:59 pm
Just finished Vic’ book.
Interesting read.
8 Jan 2012, 18:09 pm
Good day Tac.
8 Jan 2012, 18:10 pm
May your year be filled with Bulls’ victories.
8 Jan 2012, 18:11 pm
@Dawn-10:
Hallo Dawn.
@Dawn-11:
Dankie.
8 Jan 2012, 18:14 pm
Plesier. Soos ek altyd se, dunno how to do kappie, anybody but Sharks.
8 Jan 2012, 18:15 pm
@Dawn-13:
Ja ek dink ek gaan hierdie seisoen nogal geniet. No high expectations, so I can only be pleasantly surprised.
8 Jan 2012, 18:54 pm
As long as everyone gets those Sheepshagger teams I’m happy.
8 Jan 2012, 19:26 pm
So the Sharks declined the Warm Up in Feb, did they?
Makes sense, would give their exhausted stars JP, The Beast and Ndungane some more time to recover from their inhuman, strenuous efforts at the RWC
Fair enough
8 Jan 2012, 19:44 pm
i would rather go watch cheetahs anyway
8 Jan 2012, 20:14 pm
Where is jockbok
It’s alarming when someone disappears off the face of keo suddenly.
8 Jan 2012, 20:44 pm
@grant10-17: Me too.
8 Jan 2012, 20:58 pm
@Dawn-18:
agree – hopefully he is in some dodgy african country with no internet.
@grant10-17: @stormersboy-19:
ja, sharks are boring anyway…..8)
8 Jan 2012, 20:59 pm
Old news and that excuse by HRE is a load of croc! No decent coach will select the same match 22 for the warmup matches, no, usually 30 players will be given a run.
Why does Keo publish these lies from the guppy tank – why not just write the truth and say that the guppy pullout was financially motivated?
8 Jan 2012, 21:30 pm
Sharks. Who needs ‘em.
8 Jan 2012, 21:40 pm
Sharks got too many kop to issues.. now they praying like hell that Fransie comes and saves their sinking ship… as if Freddie Michalak and pretty boy Lambie Pambie gonna be their rising messiahs..
Still got no back line to talk of … so only hope for Sharkie Varkies is if Frankie Steyn comes does a resurrection act.. but I doubt he gonna fall for the same ruse twice.. he either go to Cheetahs or Stormers…
8 Jan 2012, 21:49 pm
the sharks management must be a pretty delusionsl bunch if they expect decent gate revenue for friendlies when they can’t even fill up that ‘tank’ for a currie cup semi-final.
8 Jan 2012, 21:50 pm
@Dawn-22:
the whole world sister…
the most famous brand on the planet…
@ashampoopaloo-23:
skoppie, talking kuk again. your stormers are the perennial wannabees of the sa rugby roundabout.
8)
8 Jan 2012, 21:52 pm
Meyer Bosman, Ross Cronje, Conrad Hoffman, Adrian Jacobs, Marius Joubert, Patrick Lambie, Louis Ludick, Charl Mcleod, Freddie Michalak, Lwasi Mvovo, Odwa Ndungane, JP Pietersen, Jacque Louis Potgieter, Gouws Prinsloo, Jacobus Reinach, Mark Richards, Sbura Sithole, Stephan Terblanche…
Now which one of those would strike any fear into their opposition strike runners…?
Only ones I find vaguely interesting are…
Sbura Sithole, Lwazi Mvovo, Jacobus Reinach (Jaco Reinach II if anything remotely like the previous version), and where is Paul Jordaan, the new Danie Gerber..??
8 Jan 2012, 21:55 pm
This year the:
Sharks will have a strong pack, but a mediocre backline, the
Stormers will have good skills across the park, but lack depth in crucial positions, the
Lions will lack both quality and depth, as will the
Cheetahs, and the
Bulls will have a well balanced team across the park, but will lack experience.
The shootout for the top 3 positions in the SA conference will be between the Sharks, Bulls and Stormers, with any of those three capable of ending top of the conference.
8 Jan 2012, 22:00 pm
Too soon to say what the teams will do. As long as we’re knocking the snot out of the people from the back end of nowhere and their cousins then I’m moer happy.
8 Jan 2012, 22:02 pm
ok, boys and girls…
here is a movie quiz for a sunday evening….
“what we have here….
is a failure…
to…
communicate”
what movie and which leading acor?
8 Jan 2012, 22:03 pm
acor?????
actor!!!!
8 Jan 2012, 22:06 pm
Paul Newman but I forget the movie. Some prison type flick. I remember the one scene where he had to eat a lot of eggs.
8 Jan 2012, 22:10 pm
@Great White Shark-31:
yep, half a mark.
the quote comes from the prison warden with the mirror ray-bans
8 Jan 2012, 22:16 pm
Stormers must ditch Schalk Burger as golden eye kapitano…
Sharks don’t seem to have progressed much with any new blood apart from Coetsee, Daniel and Alberts at loose forward
and Deysel and the Du Plessis broers to give them the hard edge they require in the driving loose, their forwards again will be their platform but they toothless at back unless Riaan Viljoen, Sithole, Mvovo, and Jordaan perform some magic.. Viljoen will need to be their trump card cos they don’t have much else unless they thinking Lambie and Michalak gonna produce some miracles on their own..
Bulls have got the best mix of young blood coming through
with Arno Botha, CJ Stander, Jacques Potgieter, coming into play along Spies and Stegmann..
and in backs they have the 2 Stormers escapees Engelbrecht and Sadie to create something out wide…with Hougaard and Steyn providing the platform for attack and Flip and Juandre providing the engine room dynamics behind Greyling and Kruger is a formidable unit… new exciting combo’s to look forward to..
Cheetahs and Lions a little light in depth.. though Lions have definitely turned the corner in terms of quality of performance and team ethic and their loosie combo’s of Strauss, Minnie, Whitely, Rhodes still exciting proposition along Franco vd Merwe at 2nd row
Bulls got the driving seat in terms of new energy definitely.. and Stormers gonna be picking up where they left off… same old same old Rassie / AC dead duck strategies all revolving around chief cook and bottle washing dynamo Schalkie the Hulkie…
Our strength going to have to come from loosies and half backs because up front we aint got much happening and if Bekker goes down injured again nothing much at 2nd row either
Hopefully Duvenhage and Van Aswegen can provide some dynamics behind scrum with old man JdV and De Jongh in the middle but I ain’t enamored with the prospects .. no sirree..
8 Jan 2012, 22:22 pm
so Charo you back in the land of the long green mamba … and here to stay this time.. no more hop skip and jumping across the continent looking for a new ostrich egg to whisk into an omlette??
8 Jan 2012, 22:23 pm
so Charo you back in the land of the long green mamba … and here to stay this time.. no more hop skip and jumping across the continent looking for a new hornets nest to dive into??
8 Jan 2012, 22:24 pm
double deluxe post… one too many mornings on Bakersfield avenue…
8 Jan 2012, 22:27 pm
Cool Hand feckin Luke
8 Jan 2012, 22:53 pm
fokkol happening here.. here some lekker muziek to get some nostalgic ears into momentary elation… better than ou tydse Paul Newman movies how about some ou tydse musiek to get the goose flesh rising…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48K5Y0421Ig
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=lTi3bRKohQU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Go9aks4aujM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPK9kr4_imM&feature=related
8 Jan 2012, 23:13 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ckv6-yhnIY&feature=fvwrel
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10ith_otis-redding-i-ve-been-loving-you-t_music#rel-page-4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BKRt010H3k
8 Jan 2012, 23:33 pm
@ashampoopaloo-39: @Dawn-37: skop, while you’re at it check out our boy trevor noah killin it on jay leno’s tonight show
http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=FGbwbFeIucM&sns=fb
8 Jan 2012, 23:52 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBE3vAfYj0M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jGSiaDj_fw&feature=list_related&playnext=1&list=AVGxdCwVVULXeYQfzQp62J7ikaISpg2lqf
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djuu9uvyBNs&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60OwtIio8LM&feature=related
9 Jan 2012, 01:16 am
@ashampoopaloo-33:
harsh
schalk burger is one fo the best loose forwards ever to come out of SA, and he’s evolving his game and getting better.
9 Jan 2012, 05:07 am
@Tacitus-27: Hi there Tac.
).
I just noticed on the Lions thread that the Bulls have picked up Jano Vermaak for this season. A fantastic buy, if he is fully fit.
But do you think it is an indication that they are going to use Francois Hougaard as a utility player again? Or perhaps more just shows his dissatisfaction with the Lions (RedLion et al, feel free to jump in on that one too
It just seems an odd career choice for someone looking to get back into national contention to move to a province who has not only the incumbent Bok scrumhalf, but an incumbent who is several years younger than yourself.
9 Jan 2012, 06:25 am
@DonutDunning-43: at the time of the move i think everyone would agree that leaving the broke Lions was the right thing for jano.
re the bulls, jano should substantial game time as hougaard’s 2nd in charge. hougaard though not ‘injury prone’ will need to be managed properly if he is going to last the whole season.
jano can actually force his way into the Bok team if he performs well as a kak ruan was the 3rd option at scrumhalf after fdp & frankie hougaard. plus a rapport with morne, who by most accounts will still feature for the boks at 10, will be advantageous.
9 Jan 2012, 08:13 am
Pre-season prediction, Sharks to fly the flag for SA, Bulls to sneak in at 6th place in the end.
9 Jan 2012, 08:14 am
Morning all… Great week ahead to everyone…
Bit rich this form the Sharks…
This comp was organized and run by Stormers for the last few seasons… (amidst much derision from fans and other unions…) So why should WP rugby suddenly have to ‘share’ it and any income with the Sharks…?
If the Sharks had put it all together, does anyone think they’d be willing to ‘share’ anything with any other unions…? I doubt it…
Also a bit rich when we consider the fact that the Sharks have not been able to fill their own stadium recently for such important matches like semi-finals… so what makes them think they’d actually make any income from hosting pre-season warm up matches…?
Thing is… these matches practically fill up Newlands due to the massive support the Stormers have in Cape Town… and WPRU can make something from the gate as well as broadcast rights… So why mess with it…?
Seems the Sharks are displaying an extremely self-centered self-serving agenda here and they’re no loss to the series… Let’s see how many fans pitch up to watch them play the Kings and Boland…
Also don’t see them offering to play any games in Wellington or PE…
Nuff said…
9 Jan 2012, 08:18 am
@PissAnt-45:
that is a big prediction.
i certainly would nt put money on it.
9 Jan 2012, 08:22 am
@ufo-46:
probably a bit of both.
one they wanted the money and two they know its gonna be a meat grinder now that the lions are also looking competitive.
9 Jan 2012, 08:30 am
@ufo-46:
Sorry ufo, but the only thing that is a bit rich here is your post that is in poor taste. Nowhere in this article does it say that it is for financial reasons, so your speculation that it is so is just rubbish. The fact that one or two bloggers mention that as a reason does not make it true.
Could finances be part of the descision? Yes! Is it the only reason? Not according to this article. So pipe down and show some common sense please, you are better than this. This something i would expect from Transie
9 Jan 2012, 08:32 am
@au revoir mon tout noirs, au revoir…-48:
possibly ARMTNAR…
but me thinks that ‘long season’ is a smoke’n'mirrors face-saving exercise…
Stormers first week bye put them behind the 8 ball at the start of last season… and i think proves that getting off to a running start is more advantageous than trying to ‘build’ into the season.
As we all know… winning… and losing… is a habit… and you don’t want to get into a losing habit while working into the season… especially in the s15… arguably rugby’s toughest competition…
9 Jan 2012, 08:32 am
@PissAnt-45:
Hey PA… trust you’re well…
Despite all the hassles in Cape Town…
My prediction will be the Stormers to lead the SA conference again…
This is hardly a big or brave prediction as I’m a lifelong WP supporter, I’ll always back them to be the best…
(whether they deliver or not… well… that’s another story)
If AC remains as coach I think we’ll build on and from last year… if there are disruptions caused by AC becoming Bok coach… well… I guess anything could happen then…
My pick for the sa conference…
Stormers
Bulls
Sharks
Lions
Cheetahs
9 Jan 2012, 08:33 am
@au revoir mon tout noirs, au revoir…-48: Plus they are probably sick and tired of getting their as ses handed to them by the Stormers each pre-season.
That would be my guess….
9 Jan 2012, 08:34 am
50
9 Jan 2012, 08:36 am
Good on the Sharks for pulling out,this little circus of a tournament is beneath them.Let the minnows play amongst themselves.
9 Jan 2012, 08:37 am
@ufo-51:
It is not a happy camp, guys are not playing for each other any more. I fear the Stormers will implode badly today.
Sharks have the best pack in SA and possibly in the competition. Their backline is not flash but solid – my only concern with them is who they pick as captain.
Bulls are my wildcard pick. I think we will see an exciting brand of rugby from them – and although inexperienced at Super Rugby level, they have some good depth in their ranks who are now quite experience at CC level.
If Pierre and Wynand can pull the players together and form a tight unit, they will upset quite a lot of teams I reckon.
9 Jan 2012, 08:38 am
@PissAnt-55:
Today = this season…
9 Jan 2012, 08:43 am
@Mr Black-49: hey bugger off!
9 Jan 2012, 08:44 am
@ufo-50:
Wrong again.
You say, and I quote:
“Stormers first week bye put them behind the 8 ball at the start of last season… and i think proves that getting off to a running start is more advantageous than trying to ‘build’ into the season”
Yet they topped the SA conference?
Makes no sense.
Each to their own, rather respect that the Sharks have a choice on how to prepare for their pre-season, and they might feel that playing in the plascon cup did not bring them any super rugby success in the last two years, so why would it this year?
Try something different i say.
9 Jan 2012, 08:44 am
@PissAnt-55:
always respect your opinion and input… but will still back the stormers…
foolish i know…
@Mr Black-49:
hehehe…
clam down bud.. hardly in poor taste…
just following up on tactius’ post at #4… and speculation last week when grant10 broke this news… when a couple of other posters intimated they knew it was about the cash…
so just adding my tuppence…
anyway outta here…
work calls…
9 Jan 2012, 08:44 am
Stormers will probably take this trophy again.
This series reminds me of a game that was played last year (15 Oct 2011).
Made all the supporters wet and got them all pumped up just to be properly klapped 2 weeks later.
@ufo-51: I predict the Stormers to be at the bottom half of the SA Conf this year. I think the Sharks are SA’s best bet, back line still a concern tough.
9 Jan 2012, 08:45 am
@Mr Black-58:
no not wrong bud…
they had a slow start… a quicker start may have seen them do even better…
wind it it now…
and have a good one…
9 Jan 2012, 08:47 am
@Transformation-57:
Couldn’t resist to take a swipe.
Did it connect?
9 Jan 2012, 08:50 am
@PissAnt-55: sharks have had the makings of the “best pack” for a whil now but without any guile and a gameplan that goes beyond crashballing, i don’t see any improvement to championship status.
Plumtree, Grant Bashford, Hugh Reece-Edwards are clueless, every pre-season they make the same noises about the sharks giving the ball more air and next thing they go buy donkeys like meyer bosman or marius joubert.
9 Jan 2012, 08:50 am
@ufo-61:
Enjoy work buddy, i forgive you.
9 Jan 2012, 08:51 am
@Mr Black-62: not a chance, i’m to slick for ya
9 Jan 2012, 08:53 am
@Transformation-63:
Agree wrt the coaches.
Sometimes i’m shocked when seeing what they are up to. We need a decent SA coach at the Sharks.
9 Jan 2012, 08:56 am
@Transformation-65:
Come on Transie, i know you better than you think. I’ve seen you face to face, and you are only internet slick.
9 Jan 2012, 08:57 am
@PissAnt-55:
They may yet implode today still.
9 Jan 2012, 08:59 am
Ok cheers, chat later.
Go Sharks!!!!!
9 Jan 2012, 09:00 am
@Dawn-68:
That true.
9 Jan 2012, 09:10 am
@Mr Black-67: you’ve seen me face to face, bwahahahahahaha
9 Jan 2012, 09:15 am
How is it that the guppies have the “best pack” in the competition when they have no decent locks? Let’s face it, Skeate in general play has the hands of a soccer player and his buddy Hargreaves the psychicallity of a netballer.
No they will be much weaker without Sykes and Mostert and their engine will be pap.
9 Jan 2012, 09:22 am
My engine is pap.
9 Jan 2012, 09:32 am
@Dawn-73: you need a tune up?
9 Jan 2012, 09:34 am
@Transformation-74:
Lol!
Pap tyres!
Battery flat!
9 Jan 2012, 09:39 am
@RL-72:
We have decent locks Rooi Luis.
Not good, just decent.
9 Jan 2012, 09:41 am
bulls, and lions looking the better more exciting prospects with new energy and new ideas and combo’s, cheetahs too thin on the ground but will try manfully though not enough depth where it matters, sharks and stormers same old same old conservative krapp going round in circles one season to the next.
sharks got the forwards, but bulls will bully them with their youngsters coming through and lions may do same as the did to them in the cc… Sharks got good backup in Coetsee and Alberts at back row and a decent front row but poor second row….Stormers going to have a rough season they have hardly invested any new ideas or players and the couple good ones they had they let go to bulls… still thinking they can trade on Burger, Jdv, Habana, Fourie (flown the nest), Grant with a pap broek front row and a skittle stick 2nd row enforcer in Bekker who gets chopped down at the knees before game 6… Stormers going to have a rough season this year. Also because their captancy succession planning has been downright diabolical and going to blow up in their face.
Bulls the team to watch with Lions maybe carrying their cc form through in spite of their lack of depth. Stormers and Sharks mid table between 4th and 7th… Cheetahs bringing up the rear.. Lions might struggle like before and struggle to tour with their lack of real depth where it counts at front row and second row.
9 Jan 2012, 09:43 am
if you’d have listened to my ou doos music collection I put up for you, you’d be full of life today… too bad too sad… never mind just find someone who’s turning and you will come around.
9 Jan 2012, 09:45 am
Etsebeth and Elstadt better stand UP !!!
9 Jan 2012, 09:51 am
@ashampoopaloo-79: did you check trevor noah’s 6 min stand up spot?
9 Jan 2012, 09:55 am
@ashampoopaloo-77:
Good and sound annalysis.
WRT the Lions i have 2 points.
1. CC and Super rugby miles apart in quality
2. Depth is crucial in such a long tournament.
Clever coaches is needed to rotate without weakening the team to much, and chose when to play the top players at the right time. Very difficult prospect.
9 Jan 2012, 09:58 am
All the best to everyone in 2012!!!
Looking forward to Superugby. Cannot predict who will top the SA Conference, but just hope that SA teams don’t end up at the bottom (Cheetahs & Lions), like every season before.
Stormers IMO are the favourites to top the conference. Have few weakness (tight five and depth at centre) but have experience in key positions that will pull them through, especially on the overseas leg.
9 Jan 2012, 10:01 am
@ashampoopaloo-79: no need to rush Etsebeth.
9 Jan 2012, 10:03 am
@Mr Black-81: who is going to be the guppy captain? Can’t seriously expect Daniels to lead the guppies – he who cannot fetch will weaken the pack some more.
9 Jan 2012, 10:07 am
@Transformation-83: big need to get him in as Bekker is a walking sick note leaving ex flankers like Elstad and Lobberts there in the light 5 engine to do all the work.
9 Jan 2012, 10:11 am
@Transformation-83:
knowing acsie, they will do something stupid.
9 Jan 2012, 10:12 am
@PissAnt-45: EISH !!!!!!!! Dont say that, every one is going to say the Sharks are bragging about their team again like last year, when in fact last year All Sharks supporters didnt think our team was going to do to well at the beginning of the season.
9 Jan 2012, 10:14 am
@Mr Black-81: the Sharks only managed a drw with the Lions in the 2nd match of super rugby where the Lions led most of the game and were a blocked drop goal away from victory, then in the currie cup the Lions moered y’all.
9 Jan 2012, 10:14 am
@RL-84: Dont know if i am to keen on Daniels as Captain, but who else is there.
9 Jan 2012, 10:17 am
@Transformation-88: The Lions had an exceptional season.
9 Jan 2012, 10:18 am
2012 will be an interesting Superugby season because the season will run for 15 weeks to 2 June after which there will be a three-week break for in-bound tours to Australia, New Zealand and South Africa.
Aus play Scotland then 2 tests vs Wales
Blacks play 3 tests against Ireland (hope the Irish can win one game)
Boks play 3 tests against the Poms (3-0)
The season will resume on the weekend of 29 and 30 June with the a further three rounds before the playoffs. The bulk of these matches will be local derbies.
9 Jan 2012, 10:19 am
@RL-84: Keegan is kakker fetcher than Stegmann.
9 Jan 2012, 10:19 am
If I was the Sharks I’d play Alberts at nr.4 lock, cause their locks are a pair of girls.
That would bolster the only weakness in their pack.
9 Jan 2012, 10:23 am
I see the Sharks want to limit their 2012 season record against the Lions to a respectable 0 from 4.
9 Jan 2012, 10:25 am
@>^..^< katman-94:
Hi Katman.
Do you know if the Lions are getting any of the gate money from this series?
9 Jan 2012, 10:26 am
@Treehugger-89: make Alberts the captain.
9 Jan 2012, 10:28 am
@Tacitus-95: Howzit Tac.
I don’t know. But I went to the Newlands Wall & All trophy 2 years ago, and they weren’t exactly raking in the cash there. Fair turn-out, but not staggering, and the tickets were dirt cheap. Not sure if this has changed.
9 Jan 2012, 10:31 am
@Tacitus-95: doesn’t matter – the match will be broadcast on tv
9 Jan 2012, 10:32 am
The Sharks success this year depends on how they structure their backline.
If they insist on playing Joubert at centre this year or Odwa on the wing, the backline wont get going and they’ll struggle against everyone.
Its also key, in my opinion to start Lambie at 10 and Viljoen at 15.
With Lambie at 10 and a decent 13, Bosman will get back his form of 2010. His defence and distribution have always been his strong point, bar last year where he had a geriatric on his outside.
@Tacitus-93:
While I agree with your ‘pair of girls’ analogy, I dont agree with putting Alberts at 4. He is the perfect 7 right now, strong ball carrier and massive in the tackle. I think playing him at 4 will only limit his abilities.
I reckon they should keep Deysel at 4, turn him into a Brad Thorne type lock. He is limited in the skill department anyway so to have him putting his head down and hitting rucks all day would be great for the Sharks.
9 Jan 2012, 10:33 am
@RL-98:
Do you know what time and when?
9 Jan 2012, 10:35 am
@>^..^< katman-97:
I think the Lions have a good chance of winning the Double Velvet Cup this year. The Lions will be strong in the first half of the tournament, and chomping at the bit after their Currie Cup success.
It is once they lose 3 or 4 key players to injury later in the season that the backup isn’t quite there yet to keep up the momentum in the latter part of the tournament.
9 Jan 2012, 10:47 am
@John Galt-99: you’re sadly mistake!
“Bosman will get back his form of 2010. His defence and distribution have always been his strong point”
13 April 2011
GAVIN RICH, writing in SA Rugby magazine, says Meyer Bosman has added a new dimension to the Sharks backline.
Bashford has been impressed by the work ethic that Bosman has brought with him from the Cheetahs.
‘He was honest with us and admitted that his defence had let him down a bit when he was with the Cheetahs. He has worked really hard on his defensive game.”
9 Jan 2012, 10:49 am
@Transformation-102:
Dang. Do you file every electronic news report as it is published, under some type of Dewey system? You must be the quote king on this site.
9 Jan 2012, 10:51 am
@Transformation-102: mistaken
9 Jan 2012, 10:53 am
@Tacitus-103: no, it’s all in my mind Tac…
compliments of the season to you.
9 Jan 2012, 10:53 am
@Transformation-105:
Same to you.
9 Jan 2012, 10:57 am
@Tacitus-101: If we do win it (what is the trophy, by the way – a bronzed 20L paint can?), we’ll loan it to Province to help boost morale. Apparently the echo in the trophy room is very upsetting.
9 Jan 2012, 11:03 am
@>^..^< katman-94: cheeky !!!!!
@RL-96: does he have leadership qualities ? I know Lambie does but is still to young and has to earn the respect of all his older team mates first.
9 Jan 2012, 11:13 am
@Treehugger-108: when no suitable candidate is around choose your best player.
9 Jan 2012, 11:17 am
@RL-109: you want Bissy to be Sharievarkie cappie?
9 Jan 2012, 11:39 am
@Transformation-102:
Dont be a c ock Trannie. You completely missed the point of my post.
You know as well as I do that Bosmans defence has traditionally been a strong part of his game. So he says his defence wasnt great in 2010 either. Big deal, I missed a season.
9 Jan 2012, 11:46 am
@John Galt-111: not in 2010, “in the past”. iyou’re probably ine of the few who has ever rated meyer as being defensively sound even at the cheetahs. how was meyer’s defence last year?
2 successive years of kak defence in super rugby?
your assertion is misguided.
fallback.
9 Jan 2012, 11:51 am
What on earth is everyone going on about with regards to the Plascon Cup, or all these references to paint?
The tri-series is and always was sponsored by Neo Africa, who are a consulting and IT company… absolutely nothing to do with paint.
But I suppose paint is easier to make fun of… why let facts get in the way of that!
9 Jan 2012, 11:54 am
@Dazzler-113: get with the program…Neo Series aka The Plascon Velvet Cup. the prized jewel of Newlands
9 Jan 2012, 12:06 pm
@Transformation-114:
Transie what team will you support in the Superugby competition 2012.
And to use a UFO phrase ” NO FENCE SITTING”.
9 Jan 2012, 12:06 pm
@Transformation-110: hell no, I don’t dislike them that much
9 Jan 2012, 12:08 pm
@Dazzler-113:
thats farking funny if its true it has nothing to do with plascon paint.
9 Jan 2012, 12:18 pm
@Jeraldjay-115: i don’t support any teams in super rugby, always been that way.
9 Jan 2012, 12:23 pm
@Transformation-118:
I’m sure Lukey and Solly will change your mind in 2013.
9 Jan 2012, 12:24 pm
@Transformation-118: A man who stands for nothing will fall for anything…
9 Jan 2012, 12:25 pm
i really thought plascon were the sponsors.
9 Jan 2012, 12:26 pm
@>^..^< katman-120:
he who holds on too tightly, lets everything go…
9 Jan 2012, 12:26 pm
@Transformation-118: tell them that you are a closet CapeSader.
The team with the best pack in the whole competition. mr PA
9 Jan 2012, 12:29 pm
@au revoir mon tout noirs, au revoir…-117: it is true…the moniker of Plascon Velvet Cup is a Keo.co.za construct. most here know onw is talking about the Neo Africa Tri-series when they mention the Plascon Velvet Cup which involved the Stormers, Sharks & Force in 2010, then Stormers, Sharks & Lions in 2011 and soon to be Stormers, Lions & Cheetahs.
9 Jan 2012, 12:30 pm
@Transformation-118:
Kakstorie, you support anyone who plays against the Sharks.
9 Jan 2012, 12:30 pm
@>^..^< katman-120: hey, i support the EP Kings, so save the trite sayings..
9 Jan 2012, 12:34 pm
@Mr Black-125: you’re paranoid.
9 Jan 2012, 12:37 pm
@RL-116:
::lol: 
That is the nicest thing you have ever said about the sharks, careful you mellowing in your old age. 
9 Jan 2012, 12:37 pm
@Transformation-124:
poor neo africa, trying so hard to build a powerful brand identity by associating themselves with three ‘top’ teams in rugby and they get hijacked by plascon…go figure haha
silly keo.co.za…
9 Jan 2012, 12:37 pm
saw jongi nokwe at the gym late last year, he’s left the cheetahs and signed with the Kings…
9 Jan 2012, 12:39 pm
@Mr Black-125: true
9 Jan 2012, 12:43 pm
@Transformation-130: Good luck to him.
9 Jan 2012, 12:46 pm
@Treehugger-131: hi Tree
9 Jan 2012, 12:47 pm
@Transformation-127:
Say something good about the Sharks.
I dare you!
9 Jan 2012, 12:48 pm
@stormersboy-132: will be interseting to see how much pace he still has left if he plays against the sharks in the warm ups. he seemed to be running well considering a knee injury sidelined him.
9 Jan 2012, 12:50 pm
@Mr Black-134: i must’ve said it to you before “face to face”
9 Jan 2012, 12:52 pm
@Mr Black-134: The sharks scored the 5th(3rd in SA) highest points with 407 and the stormers 7th(4th in SA) with 400.
The sharks were 6th(2nd in SA) with 40 tries and the stormers 9th (5th in SA) with 33 tries.
Making the Stormers the worst attacking team in SA.
9 Jan 2012, 12:54 pm
@Transformation-136:
Even that day you where talking kak all day long. Ask Miss P, she agreed with me.
9 Jan 2012, 12:56 pm
@Transformation-135:
What happened to Fabian Juries. Is he back with the Kings.
Spoke to Paul Treu about why Gio Aplon developed as a 15 man player after playing 7′s and players like Juries who have fell off the wagon.
Treu told me, its all about work ethic and the will to succeed.
9 Jan 2012, 12:57 pm
@Transformation-137:
Ha ha
Thats not a compliment for the Sharks, thats bashing the Stormers mr slick.
9 Jan 2012, 12:58 pm
@Mr Black-138: what day?
9 Jan 2012, 12:58 pm
@Transformation-130:
well good luck to him. i cant say its gonna make it any easier for him get back into the bok side if he’s playing for the kings. i remember he scored 4 tries against the ozzies but wasn’t all that flash against the british lions.
an interesting story article for the keo writers is to see how many non super rugby players have made the bok side in recent years, coming instead from cc and junior bok sides..?..cant say there has been many..?.
9 Jan 2012, 12:59 pm
Well its been all but confirmed I see – Gert Smal the favourite to be appointed as Bok coach.
9 Jan 2012, 13:03 pm
@PissAnt-143:
Whats your opinion on Smal?
9 Jan 2012, 13:04 pm
@Transformation-137:
also, he must be about as old as aplon now, i think?
having said that, i’m sure there are a lot of 30 year old wingers out there.
9 Jan 2012, 13:06 pm
@PissAnt-143:
its a tragedy, really.
9 Jan 2012, 13:12 pm
@Mr Black-144:
Solid without being spectacular – I believe we needed something a bit more spectacular.
Smal is very experienced, very disciplined and knows SA Rugby inside out. He won’t rock the boat much when it comes to approach and selections. The Springboks will do well under him and perhaps that is needed since it will almost be a whole new generation coming through – for me this appointment is all about who his assistants will be…
If we get some flair in the assistant ranks I will be pleased.
9 Jan 2012, 13:18 pm
@PissAnt-147:
Does he have a choice in his assistants, or is it given to him?
Would be better if he could get people to fill where he feels he is a bit short on knowledge.
9 Jan 2012, 13:26 pm
@PissAnt-143:
So Schalk Burger for Bok captain then.
With some WP guy in the backline the vice captain.
9 Jan 2012, 13:35 pm
150
9 Jan 2012, 13:38 pm
smal a better choice than Meyer imo
9 Jan 2012, 13:43 pm
@Mr Black-148:
Well they approached him, so I would assume he will only accept on his own terms. Only reason he will leave a cushy job in Ireland.
9 Jan 2012, 13:43 pm
This is not the ideal time for Meyer in any case.
His opportunity was 4 years ago – when the players he had developed from junior level were at their peak. And it will be his opportunity again 4 years from now, when the new crop of players he is developing are at their peak.
Smal is coming in in the trough between these two peaks, and will have to make do with a very mix and match bunch of players.
9 Jan 2012, 13:44 pm
will be very intersting to see who he chooses as assistants
9 Jan 2012, 13:46 pm
i wonder if smal will get 4 year contract…..i hope only 2 with options and performance clauses
9 Jan 2012, 13:53 pm
@Tacitus-153:
for the sake of our win / loss ratio i would have more faith in meyer or mallet seeing out must win games than i would smal.
if we did as badly as we have during a ‘peak’ period with a mediocre coach how much worse could things get with a mediocre coach during a ‘trough’ period.
9 Jan 2012, 13:55 pm
@au revoir mon tout noirs, au revoir…-156:
Snor could only dream of being a mediocre coach.
And Small is probably a bit better than a mediocre coach.
9 Jan 2012, 14:02 pm
Everyone was asking for Smal, now he’s in the running, people are complaining.
Buncha big girls’ blouses.
9 Jan 2012, 14:02 pm
@Tacitus-157:
Hoesit vandag
9 Jan 2012, 14:04 pm
I’d rank the coaches in question as follows:
Poor: Snor
Mediocre: Coetzee
Good: Smal
Excellent: Meyer
9 Jan 2012, 14:07 pm
Not that I think Smal is a poor coach, but I do shudder at the thought of four more years of WP laden Bok teams, based on little more than the PR hype around their so-called stars.
9 Jan 2012, 14:07 pm
@Dawn-159:
Nee voorrie wind dankie.
9 Jan 2012, 14:08 pm
@>^..^< katman-161:
My sentiments exactly.
9 Jan 2012, 14:08 pm
this is not good. i wanted heineken to at least get the job if SARU were insisting on a saffa coach. smal was last a head coach in 2001 it is 2012 now.
9 Jan 2012, 14:14 pm
@Tacitus-162:
Bly om te ****.
9 Jan 2012, 14:14 pm
h o o r!!!!!
9 Jan 2012, 14:17 pm
@Tacitus-163: Yep, for reasons that cannot be explained by anyone we are going to have to make space for some lock called Elstadt or Etsebeth or Engelbert. And Brock Harris. And Dewald Duvenhage.
And Burger’s captaincy is going to restrict us far more than Smit’s ever did.
9 Jan 2012, 14:17 pm
@>^..^< katman-161: @Tacitus-162:
The only WP players that consistently featured in the last 4 years were Schalk, Jean and Andries.
Gio, Juan joined the fray in 2010 but never really held starting positions for long.
Jaque also joined in 2010 but we all know where he came from as was the case with Bryan (both established Boks before they joined WP).
The last 4 years saw the Bulls and Sharks dominate Bok selections.
9 Jan 2012, 14:23 pm
@PissAnt-168:
Hence Gert’s Titus-given mission to rectify that..
9 Jan 2012, 14:24 pm
Keo fire up a new poll on who will be the kakkest captain this season.
Is it;
A) steroid muscles Spies
B) bonehead Burger
C) plain kuk Daniels
I am going of option B as in B for bonehead
9 Jan 2012, 14:27 pm
@Tacitus-160:
yip, pretty much spot on although i’m going to hold out on labelling smal a good coach just yet. he may in fact, after all this time, prove to be woefully behind the curve come the four nations.
@>^..^< katman-161:
its just a tragedy really.
another four year period of mediocrity and pretty soon we’ll be referred to as ‘like wales of the 70′s’ we will be known for a golden age of prosperity lasting a period of time and nothing more.
this is the death of springbok rugby.
9 Jan 2012, 14:29 pm
@PissAnt-168: And Flo.
And of a Province backline of Duvenhage, Grant, De Villiers, Fourie, Habana, Aplon and Jantjes, with De Jongh on the bench, it’s only Duvenhage who isn’t capped. And I suspect we may see that change too.
9 Jan 2012, 14:30 pm
@PissAnt-168: why spoil the pity party?
9 Jan 2012, 14:31 pm
I seen Smal in Pick ‘n Pay once
He is bigger than all youse put together
Say all that to his face.
9 Jan 2012, 14:35 pm
@Dawn-174: Did he tip you, or did he pack his own bags?
9 Jan 2012, 14:36 pm
@Dawn-174:
did you contemplate his navel?
9 Jan 2012, 14:37 pm
heyneke would have been the death of bok rugby
9 Jan 2012, 14:40 pm
@>^..^< katman-172:
Flo featured in the beginning of 2010 and was dropped after that – his call-up was very late to the RWC last year – I think he played 5 or 6 times.
Jantjes played his last game in 2008 for the Boks – he has left for France now too.
Grant last played in 2008 as-well, and it was capped initially under White and came off the bench on all 4 times he was in the 22.
As mentioned, Habana and Fourie were both capped at other unions.
9 Jan 2012, 14:42 pm
@grant10-177: Spies & Timotei for Bok cappies
9 Jan 2012, 14:43 pm
@PissAnt-178: Don’t get technical with me now. I still have Slaptjips, Fleckie and Breyton to haul out.
9 Jan 2012, 14:43 pm
@>^..^< katman-175:
I did the checkout.
Aslam did the packing!
9 Jan 2012, 14:43 pm
@PissAnt-178: why you letting facts get in the way of a good whine? blaady agent!
9 Jan 2012, 14:46 pm
@>^..^< katman-172:
and bekker
9 Jan 2012, 14:48 pm
@>^..^< katman-180:
and tricky ricky
9 Jan 2012, 14:49 pm
@>^..^< katman-180:
and cj
9 Jan 2012, 14:50 pm
@PissAnt-178:
I hope you’re not thinking to strengthen your point by throwing White’s name into the argument.
Everyone knows White was a WP fanboy like no other.
9 Jan 2012, 14:53 pm
@Tacitus-186:
Think Eddie Andrews, Bolla Conradie, Hanyani Shimange, Quintin Davidz to name but a few.
9 Jan 2012, 15:00 pm
@Tacitus-187: please, just think wacko jaco and your whole point become moot
9 Jan 2012, 15:02 pm
@Transformation-188:
Jaco vd Westhuizen was an excellent player in his prime. If you have issues with his personality off the field, well, that’s your problem.
In his book Vic says that seeing Jaco on the crossbar at King’s Park after the 2007 S14 final was the most beautiful sight he had ever seen.
9 Jan 2012, 15:04 pm
@Tacitus-186:
White is a self-confessed Bulls supporter.
9 Jan 2012, 15:04 pm
@Tacitus-186:
White is a self-confessed Bulls supporter.
9 Jan 2012, 15:05 pm
@>^..^< katman-180:
Don’t be surprised if one of those names joins Smal….
@Transformation-182:
Ja neh…
9 Jan 2012, 15:06 pm
@PissAnt-191:
I was at a dinner event where White was the guest speaker back in 2005 and when someone at my table asked him which team he supported he himself stated WP.
You only have to look at his Schalk Burger/Jean de Villiers infatuation to understand the truth of that.
Not to mention Bolla Conradie ahead of Fourie du Preez, or Hanyani ahead of Gary Botha.
9 Jan 2012, 15:06 pm
@Tacitus-187:
corne krige…
9 Jan 2012, 15:07 pm
@PissAnt-192:
I know about the stories of them trying to rob us of our backline coach at the Bulls.
May they fail miserably.
9 Jan 2012, 15:08 pm
@au revoir mon tout noirs, au revoir…-194:
From the Strauli era. White ditched him immediately.
9 Jan 2012, 15:08 pm
bob skinstad
9 Jan 2012, 15:08 pm
@Tacitus-187:
We can list mediocre players till the cows come home. Not really interested in that. Pointed out a flaw in a statement above that WP somehow dominated selections in the last 4 years (even more). In 2009 there were some games where there weren’t even a WP player in the match-day 22…
9 Jan 2012, 15:10 pm
@Tacitus-196:
ok, different province players from different coaching eras.
9 Jan 2012, 15:10 pm
@Tacitus-189: tl tl tl and as the sycophant you are, anything vic says you lap up as gospel.
any discerning person knows that was cringe-worthy and crass.
9 Jan 2012, 15:10 pm
@Tacitus-193:
Strange, said the complete opposite in an interview (when asked about his apparent WP bias).
9 Jan 2012, 15:11 pm
@PissAnt-198:
I dont’ know who stated that WP dominated selections in the last 4 years, but it was most certainly not me.
In fact, the last 4 years have seen a welcome absence of WP Boks.
But I refer back to the White era, when a definite WP infatuation existed.
And in the era around the turn of the century as well.
9 Jan 2012, 15:11 pm
***** teeth man…..
how on this planet can we entrust the bok head coach job to someone who okays the Spies and Timotei appointments…
fark me man!!!
9 Jan 2012, 15:12 pm
luke watson
9 Jan 2012, 15:13 pm
@PissAnt-201:
Not strange at all. White would say whatever served him best in an interview.
And in an interview where he gets put under pressure for his clear WP bias, well, what better to get him off the hook than making the ridiculous claim that he supports the Bulls?
This when Vic’s book makes it clear that White disliked Vic, disliked the Bulls habit of keeping themselves seperate from the rest of the Bok group, and hated th fact that Meyer was seen as a better coach than himself.
9 Jan 2012, 15:13 pm
@Tacitus-202:
The era when we won a World Cup?
Schalk Burger was the only starting WP player in the World Cup final.
9 Jan 2012, 15:14 pm
heyneke lost any support he may have had from me with that Spies appointment….
I still dont know whether to laugh or cry…
9 Jan 2012, 15:15 pm
tonderai chavangha
9 Jan 2012, 15:15 pm
peter grant
9 Jan 2012, 15:16 pm
@PissAnt-206:
That’s not how White started out. Compare his teams in 2004 and 2005, with the team that got forced onto him due to the Bulls and Sharks domination of Super Rugby in the latter part of his tenure.
Compare the World Cup 2007 team with the one that contained Bolla Conradie, Eddie Andrews, Shimange, Davidz etc. etc. etc.
White was forced to change due to the the excellence of the Bulls and Sharks teams of the time.
9 Jan 2012, 15:16 pm
meyer a better coach than White…..?
Have to agree wholeheartedly with that….
9 Jan 2012, 15:20 pm
Saracens coach at a loss for words over turbo reverse tendencies against Bath…..
Perhaps he needs to scan the Keo archives
9 Jan 2012, 15:20 pm
@Tacitus-202: 161.>^..^^..^< katman-161:
My sentiments exactly.
convinient amnesia
9 Jan 2012, 15:21 pm
schalk will be next bok cappie as well….
9 Jan 2012, 15:23 pm
@Transformation-213:
Yes, 4 more years as in added to previous years where that was the case. Not necessarily the last 4 years.
9 Jan 2012, 15:24 pm
@grant10-214: bonehead cappie
9 Jan 2012, 15:27 pm
@Tacitus-210:
Bolla was a Bok since 2002. He played a couple 3 games in 2004, 1 in 2005, not selected at all in 2006 & 2007 and played his last game under PDV as reserve against NZ in 2008.
Quinten Davids made his debut in 2002 too, played two games in 2004 (after being kicked out of RWC in 2003) and 3 off the bench – last represented in July 2004 against NZ.
Eddie Andrews was one of the few that lasted – but even 3 of his 5 games in 2005 were off the bench, 2 out of 5 off the bench in 2006 and two games off the bench in 2007.
He had to retire because of injury which plagued him since the end of 2004.
Shimmie was capped as a Cheetah in 2004, in all his 9 tests he started off the bench in each one of them.
9 Jan 2012, 15:27 pm
@Tacitus-210: this is one of the tactics Heyneke learnt in the US recently, Bulls players are said to be using it extensively this pre-season.
P_orn Gets You Up For Game
Published: Wednesday, 4. January, 2012 in category U.S.Tweet
It’s official! P_orn gets you up for the upcoming rugby matches.
And if players did not know this was true a UK study has stepped in to hand out the answer. The study followed 12 Aviva Premiership players and findings suggest that watching porn (or aggressive videos) can boost a player’s physical performance.
The Premiership test subjects were shown 4 minute clips of erotic dancing or UFC fight and they subsequently saw a peak in testosterone level that rose during physical conditioning when compared to watching sad or control videos.
The study must be far from conclusive, however. The England team admitted to watching UFC fights during the Rugby World Cup and they definitely did not rise to the top.
The study, which will be published in the journal Hormones and Behaviour.
9 Jan 2012, 15:27 pm
@RL-216: seems a fait accompli….
9 Jan 2012, 15:28 pm
@grant10-212:
Perhaps it’s because one of their front rowers got sent off.
9 Jan 2012, 15:30 pm
the point of this is that those bulls and sharks players forced their way into the springbok team in spite of the provinces they played for.
can the same be said of the wp players? i think not. the only palyer who comes close to that is schalk during 2004 maybe and the wc 2007.
9 Jan 2012, 15:30 pm
@Tacitus-189:
You kidding.
9 Jan 2012, 15:30 pm
@Transformation-218:
Whatever.
9 Jan 2012, 15:32 pm
@grant10-219:
how do you feel about it?
9 Jan 2012, 15:35 pm
@Transformation-218: The Bulls players prefer to page through the John Deer catalogue 5 minutes before kick-off.
And don’t mock Wacko Jaco. He was up on that crossbar for your sins.
9 Jan 2012, 15:37 pm
@Tacitus-163:
Kitch Christie devised a formula: Altitude based forwards, multi skilled backs who are big and strong!
A physical scum half who operates as the 9th forward when needed!
9 Jan 2012, 15:39 pm
@PissAnt-217:
Did you know that Bolla is still part of the Stormers 50 man playing squad. Now that is amazing ‘depth’ that AC has at his disposal.
9 Jan 2012, 15:40 pm
@>^..^< katman-225: bwahahahahaha on wacko jaco!
9 Jan 2012, 15:41 pm
@RL-227:
Indeed I did.
He is currently captain of Boland, they won the 1st Div last year.
9 Jan 2012, 15:47 pm
Okay its been fun, I am off.
Ciao all.
9 Jan 2012, 16:01 pm
@PissAnt-229: LOL I forgot the
AC can’t be serious having Bolla in his squad – pray Stormer boys that Duvenage stays fit and that the u21′s tried last year can step up.
Now this whole depth thing puzzles me – why is it that HendrikP got such a hard on when AC announced the Stormers sqaud?
I mean they are thin at prop, buying Carstens who was a complete failure in Europe. No locks ‘depth’ at all, Bekker the only one over 2m tall and the rest all former flankers.
Is Burger going to steal the blindside spot or will it go to that sensational softie Kolisi?
How about centre, JDV is on his last legs and those Currie cup centres, Brakkie and the one that looks like that predator creature are ordinary but not to worry …. the Stormers can score tries like no other team … It’s true!
So why does this HendrikP rave so much about the Stormers depth and at the same time rubbish the “depth” of other teams.
9 Jan 2012, 16:09 pm
@au revoir mon tout noirs, au revoir…-209:
The centres too were from WP early 2003 to 2005, they were terrific as a combo and scored tries, Marius Joubert, De Wet Barry, JdV, what’s fair is fair
9 Jan 2012, 16:13 pm
@au revoir mon tout noirs, au revoir…-224: not good….he is a bit dof…
9 Jan 2012, 16:16 pm
@RL-231: only fetcher in that squad is ruhan kitshoff
if schalk plays at openside I dont go watch…and I hardly miss a game…
seen that boring old movie too many times….
9 Jan 2012, 16:16 pm
perhaps Nizaam Carr can do the openside role…
Kolisi is a blind sider….as is Schalk
9 Jan 2012, 16:17 pm
@RL-227:
Economics dictated a 30 players’ Super Rugby squads in 2012
Bolla is merely a token to make up the numbers, he will not make the squad. There are other tokens out there who will make the Sormers’ squad to enhance entertainment
9 Jan 2012, 16:17 pm
I am not a thug – Botha
Toulon lock Bakkies Botha has called on French officials to judge him on his actions, not his supposed reputation for being a dirty player.
The Springbok veteran made his Top 14 debut last weekend in Toulon’s 25-6 defeat to relegation-threatened Biarritz having arrived in France following the World Cup to start a three-year deal with RCT.
Despite his colourful disciplinary record, the 32-year-old insists that his love for the physical side of the game does not necessarily make him a villain.
“I am not a thug. I love the battle, that’s all,” the 76-test cap second row told Midi Olympique.
Botha used two anecdotes from his past to illustrate how his reputation has a habit of proceeding him.
“I was given a three-week suspension a few years ago for pushing [Australia flanker] Phil Waugh at a ruck,” he explained.
“When it came to the disciplinary hearing, the judge asked me how many times I had been cited in my life. I told the truth – once. He did not believe me, asked me if I had personal problems, if I hit my kids…It was ridiculous.
“People are wrong about me. I do not eat children. (WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!MUST BE A TYPO)
“In the Currie Cup my opponents use to target me. One day, (Sharks lock) AJ Venter was trying to make me use my temper. At every scrum (referee) Craig Joubert was saying to me: ‘Stay with me, Bakkies. Nothing will happen to you.’”
Botha has made helping Toulon qualify for the Heineken Cup his primary target and hopes to repay the faith put in him by club president Mourad Boudjellal.
“I want Toulon to qualify for the Heineken Cup next year. I want to be part of that success,” he explained.
“Four years ago, I was on the verge of signing with Toulon. We could not break my contract with the Bulls and it ended in court where I lost.
“So I was delighted when Mourad Boudjellal came after me again two years later. That tells me that he is a man of his word. Last year, I had other contract offers in Europe but I chose Toulon out of respect for him.”
9 Jan 2012, 16:23 pm
@grant10-235: Carr can do the job much better than Burger can – the question is will cappie give up his jersey for a more competent fetcher.
9 Jan 2012, 16:24 pm
maybe… possibly… could it be…
that gert will coax carel dup back as our ‘bokline’ coach…?
well… i can dream can’t i…!!
9 Jan 2012, 16:29 pm
@ufo-239:
Slappes will definately be a strong candidate for backline coach under Gert.
9 Jan 2012, 16:30 pm
@grant10-234: bwahahahahaha @ “if schalk plays openside i don’t go watch”
are you giving AC an ultimatum? you know schalla will be wearing the 6 jersey mos and standing at 1st receiver the whole game.
9 Jan 2012, 16:35 pm
@grant10-235: Hey G10. Happy happy and all that. I’m afraid to say that Carr won’t be able to fill the openside role. If you’ve watched his defensive game closely, you’d have noticed that he doesn’t compete for breakdown ball. he is a good tackler and recovers, to get back into the defensive line very well, but he doesn’t compete for ruck ball. It takes a special kind of courage to drop you head when competing for the ball in a ruck, because you can’t see anyone coming to clear the ruck. Nizaam hasn’t developed that aspect of his game yet and i’d not like him to do that because he would sacrifice and important strength to his game and that his his ballskills. he’d be far more suited to being a receiver or ball carrier off turnover ball. because he’s not very tall, if you played a short fetcher, it could affect your lineout strategy if you only have 1 loose-forward lineout jumper.
9 Jan 2012, 16:38 pm
@Jeraldjay-240:
yes, i agree with you…
he is after all a carel student…!!
9 Jan 2012, 16:49 pm
@ufo-243:
Gert’s back 3 combo in 2000/01 was Breyton, Slappes and Percy.
So Slappes understands Gert’s mindset.
9 Jan 2012, 17:07 pm
@pompies2-242: i agree with you mate
9 Jan 2012, 17:10 pm
personally I see Carr as a skilful 8 ….
we will miss Flo more than anyone….
AC and Rassie are bloody fools to let him go…..nuts…
9 Jan 2012, 17:16 pm
@grant10-246: Correct, but again, because of his lack of real height, the balance of the line-out might be affected. Flo will be missed, but if the tight 5 can build momentum and keep going forward, it would make it easier for another openside to play the “fetcher” role. The great open-siders can do that regardless of the pack going forward or back. Like you’ve been saying, an animal tight-head and a good backup hooker and things will be much better.
9 Jan 2012, 17:21 pm
@Hondo-232:
i will always have a soft spot for de wet barry.
@grant10-233:
thank you grant, your honesty is apreciated.
9 Jan 2012, 17:21 pm
@grant10-246: Players aren’t property and shouldn’t be treated as such, imo. Keeping someone against their will runs the risk of destabilising the squad.
@Tacitus-210: The Stormers were the strongest SA team at the start of the 2000s. The make-up of the Bok squads reflected it. The make-up changed as other sides took over. Don’t go looking for conspiracies where none exist.
9 Jan 2012, 17:27 pm
@RL-231:
Nor worries I got what you were saying I also suck at the smileys. You won’t see Bolla unless they have a serious bad run of injuries.
9 Jan 2012, 17:28 pm
I think if you don’t have a world class fetcher then go with your best hybrids.
i don’t see a world class fetcher in WP. AC will go for Burger, Duanne and Kolisi.
And for most games that will do fine.
Who do the sharks have at fetcher? The only fetcher they have is Bismark and Botes really. Botes isn’t getting a lot of 1st team game time.
So it’s Bismark. The rest are hybrids. Diesel can do a bit of fetching, so can Daniel, but they are hardly fetchers by definition.
The only 3 we really have are Minnie, Steggies (who is effective for the Bulls) and Ratel.
If one of those get injured for their teams they’ll use a hybrid in their place (Potties in the Bulls case) IMO.
For WP it will come down to roles. Burger will alternate with Kolisi and Duanne, depending on who gets to the tackle point first,
9 Jan 2012, 17:29 pm
WP also have Koster who will be a Daniel type clone, so will Carr.
9 Jan 2012, 17:32 pm
@au revoir mon tout noirs, au revoir…-248: only way I roll mate
@Michael-249: was he unhappy?
9 Jan 2012, 17:36 pm
class fetchers are rare….bravest farkers on the planet…..Flo loss is monumental…..those players are gifted…..like real tightheads….
Stormers better pray Kitshoff comes through….and I believe he has the potential….
all in all I believe the Stormers and Bulls will struggle this year…..Stormers have bled badly in centres and are confused about 10 option….and are a world class prop short and without an opensider.
Pains me to say it…..but we in trouble imo
9 Jan 2012, 17:37 pm
@grant10-246:
to be honest, the jury’s still out wrt louw.
no real sustained rampaging performances.
a few stand out games here and there.
but then again a few forgetable games too.
and lets not forget the ever occasional brainfarts are not a conspiracy… they are real…
9 Jan 2012, 17:43 pm
@grant10-254: Flo’s a big loss for sure, what makes it particularly damaging is how well he worked with the other 2, they had a great understanding, which isn’t always there with loosies.
9 Jan 2012, 17:43 pm
@grant10-253: I don’t know if he was unhappy. He wanted a change of environment though for whatever reason. Forcing him to stay would have made him unhappy in all likelihood and that is never a good thing.
9 Jan 2012, 17:45 pm
@grant10-254: Another centre will come through. Sadie hardly set the world alight outside of the few Super chances he got. Maybe he’ll flourish at the Bulls or maybe he’ll turn into another Olivier. The loss of him is another centre’s gain.
9 Jan 2012, 17:56 pm
@stormersboy-256: stormers had great loosie combo….now it is gone
had real class centres…..now no depth at centre
dicey front row options as well….
a 10 that is farkeing about in Japan
player management a joke
we turn strengths into weaknesses in no time
9 Jan 2012, 17:57 pm
@Michael-258: sadie is a massive massive loss in light of JF leaving
so is JJ Engelbrecht
No matter how we slice and dice it
9 Jan 2012, 18:00 pm
@grant10-259: True, except for Grant. Don’t think he;s the answer at 10 in the same way that you don’t think that Schalk is the answer at 6
9 Jan 2012, 18:02 pm
@grant10-260: I always rated JJ higher than Danie, but them’s the breaks.
9 Jan 2012, 18:16 pm
@grant10-259: Who is to say that Flo’s successor won’t turn out to be better.
No one had heard of Sadie before the very few matches he played in the last Super compo. Someone else will come along. It’s not like Sadie is yet massively experienced.
As for JJ, yeah it’s a pity.
Still, man management does not equate giving whatever sums of money demanded by players. Rassie and ACdidn’t give in to effective ransom.
9 Jan 2012, 18:16 pm
@stormersboy-261: ja…pop gun pete….but the other pretenders are unproven and appear a bit soft….time will tell …i like van aswegen…when he is uninjured that is…
9 Jan 2012, 18:17 pm
@grant10-259: Our replacement flyhalves did just fine last time round. I expect them to do better providing they stay free of injury.
9 Jan 2012, 18:17 pm
@Michael-263: rassie and ac are not getting the player management right imo…
9 Jan 2012, 18:19 pm
@Michael-265: van aswegen maybe….
not too keen on the rest personally…all limited imo
9 Jan 2012, 18:20 pm
@grant10-266: Fourie messed them around. P Grant, well others can step up.
No player should be forced to stay against their will – Flo.
JJ and Sadie – no player should be allowed to dictate how much money they get and whether they are guaranteed a starting place.
So how are they not getting the man management right?
9 Jan 2012, 18:21 pm
my wish list
elton Jantjes
wp nel
brussow
sadie
bobs your aunt
9 Jan 2012, 18:23 pm
@grant10-269: MY mouth’s watering at the prospect of Elton flourishing this year
Not impressed with Nel.
Sadie’s attitude stinks. He belongs with the Bulls – they aren’t team players outside of their little bondage group.
9 Jan 2012, 18:26 pm
@Michael-268: succession planning screwed……Grant dictating Japan stint…..Sadie goes as JF supposedly staying
Flo goes because Brussow a done deal…..
JJ Engelbrecht goes and Habana offered a 3 year contract….
Joe Pietersen was allowed to walk away mid contract
should I continue?
9 Jan 2012, 18:27 pm
@Michael-270: i rate Elton highly
9 Jan 2012, 18:29 pm
cheers gym calls
outta here
9 Jan 2012, 18:29 pm
@grant10-271: JF went back on his word.
Flo would have been released anyways – no one wants to force a player to remain when they don’t want to, unless one is the Bulls (re Bakkies) of course.
Habana has proven his worth. JJ and Sadie tried to dictate terms which is unacceptable.
Joe is back.
Players move on. The man management has been good.
9 Jan 2012, 18:30 pm
@grant10-271: i’m glad Joe’s back though.
I’d be tempted to play him at 10.
9 Duvenhage
10 Joe
11. Brian
12 JDV
13 JDJ
14 Hekkies
15 Gio
Could actually be a good backline
9 Jan 2012, 18:30 pm
the loss of Flo is felt more by the disruption to the combination of loosies… they worked well together and varied their individual rolls according to the situation and who got to the breakdown first…
sadie ran laterally too often cramping the space for everyone outside him and didn’t pass when he should… hell have to fix both problems if his career is to go further…
the biggest loss and centre IMO… and biggest gain… for the sharks… was whitehead. He often made sadie look great… I hope he is not wated and messed around at the sharks.
jj was out biggest loss of a young gun imo…
244 JeraldJay
Quite correct… and Carel was the backline coach.
9 Jan 2012, 18:38 pm
@michael OK, I have heard it all. The Bulls is characterised on this site as average players that came out on top, because of their team character. Kirchner, ndungane, pretorius, olivier, steyn, spies, potgieter, stegmann, kruger, g botha have all been branded average to poor.
Now you come onto this site and tell us players with poor attitudes belong at the Bulls. I can’t remember once that there was a possible players strike before a semi in the Bulls history. Then players such as fourie, habana, joe van niekerk, januarie, jantjies, brits, etc were all worse when at the stormers than before or after.
Let me tell you one thing. Heyneke Meyer has an eye for talent, like all coaches, but he picks those out with the correct attitude like none other.
Did you guys ever win a super semi with the talent of pretorius at 12 and delport at 13?
9 Jan 2012, 18:42 pm
@grant10-269: the problem with the Stormers is that they have too many good youngsters to choose from, but end up picking the wrong ones and buying overrated ‘name’ players … with the talent in the region Rassie should never ever buy any player.
I do not like the fact that brokeback coaches and administrators gift the blue smurfs fine youngsters year after year.
9 Jan 2012, 18:50 pm
@RL with that I have to agree. If only the Bulls, Lions or Sharks had the schoolboy talent of WP and Grey. I always thought why did Rassie, who came from the Cheetahs and won a CC using 4 props not invest in front row players. It is not as if they are playing a Blues type of gameplan. They are probably playing the most boring gameplan of all the teams in the super 15.
9 Jan 2012, 18:51 pm
@ufo-276:
Finally someone got it right RE Sadie & Tim…
9 Jan 2012, 18:52 pm
@Horings-277:
Just on the strike, you just need to go back to the turn of the century to know how Joost and whole host of his cadre’s threatened to walk out on the union.
Strangely enough also the time when Heyneke made his entry into the union…
9 Jan 2012, 18:53 pm
@stormersboy-275: Hurdles is better than JJ, imo.
@Horings-277: I was implicitly referring to the tendency of the Bulls players to form their own cliche traditionally within the Springbok side,something brought up earlier in this thread. I have no doubt it is a friendly brotherhood inside the larger.
9 Jan 2012, 18:54 pm
@RL-278:
Stormers so-called ‘talent scouts’ cannot spot rugby talent if it wore neon-lights around their jersey’s.
9 Jan 2012, 18:56 pm
@Michael-282:
They need to play shadow at fullback – he will need a season to get his positional play right and work on his out of hand kicking but he could develop into a class 15.
9 Jan 2012, 18:57 pm
O maybe the Sharks just felt they would be better served if they had an easier run into the Super 15 this year? Would be my starting 22 for the Sharks…..
15. Riaan Viljoen.
14. J.P. Pieterson.
13. Marius Joubert.
12. Francois Steyn.
11. Lwazi Mvovo.
10. Patrick Lambie.
9. Frederic Michalak.
8. Ryan Kankowski.
7. Willem Alberts.
6. Jean Deysel.
5. Alistair Hargreaves.
4. Ross Skeate.
3. Jannie Du Plessis.
2. Bismark Du Plessis.
1. Tendai Mtawarira.
16. Eugene Van Staden.
17. Craig Burden.
18. Keegan Daniels.
19. Marcell Coetzee.
20. Charl McLeod.
21. Meyer Bosman.
22. Wandile Mjevuka.
9 Jan 2012, 18:58 pm
@PissAnt-283: Rassie and AC aren’t the problem, imo. It is the higher management structure around them which they have no control over.
9 Jan 2012, 18:59 pm
280 Pissant…
Thanks bud…
Yeah whitehead VERY underrated by management and supporters… is very good on defence too… and can be seen(live if not on tv) marshalling the backline ala jf…
Our loss is sharks gain… hope they use him… he could make their backline improve dramatically
9 Jan 2012, 19:00 pm
@Michael-286:
AC I will buy, Rassie is directly responsible for contracting players though.
9 Jan 2012, 19:01 pm
@PissAnt-284: I have a feeling they will play Hurdles at 14, Gio/Joe at 15 and Gary at 10.
Gut feeling. You’re right that it would be nice to see a speedy, skiful 15 in the form of Hurdles…
9 Jan 2012, 19:02 pm
@ufo-287:
I feel the same and saw it 18 months ago. Timmy has a great rugby brain on him and is a brilliant distributor. I always judge a 10 and 12 on their ability to ‘pass’ players around them into space (other than ‘running’ them into space) – Timmy has this ability.
9 Jan 2012, 19:02 pm
@PissAnt-288: How much direct control does Rassie have though? The high performance academy seems to be doing a good job.
9 Jan 2012, 19:05 pm
@Michael-289:
Yes you are right, I have a feeling he would have played 15 more at the Bulls under Pieter…
9 Jan 2012, 19:06 pm
@Michael-291:
Rassie makes the final call on who is contracted and who not.
9 Jan 2012, 19:08 pm
@Pissant. That is true, but I think we will all agree that the Bulls management were not up to standard and Joost, who had the union’s matters at heart, felt that that will be the best to turn things around. The Stormers were on top of the world and Krige may play innocent, but they screwed it up. I can remember two times where I supported the Stormers in the same way I would support the Boks. In 1999 and last year and both times they messed up. Last year I can forgive them. Bad performance on the day, but in ’99 they had themselves to blame.
9 Jan 2012, 19:10 pm
@Horings-294:
You should have seen how pissed WP supporters were in ’99.
Bulls turned that around under Meyer though. Only point I was trying to make was that it’s not unique for players to get pissed at management.
9 Jan 2012, 19:11 pm
@PissAnt-293: Personally I like the way things are being handled with players. I think they are making the best of what is an exceptionally terribly run administration.
Where I have an issue is with certain players being overplayed, ala Bekker.
9 Jan 2012, 19:11 pm
290 Pissant
Absolutely… a big longterm loss for us…
Speaking of strikes and obnoxious behaviour… Wasnt it also the bulls as a union that threatened to strike/walk out as they tried to force jake white out of the Bok job…???
9 Jan 2012, 19:13 pm
@Michael-296:
My problem with WP is they get it more wrong than right. Where they make a couple of good calls on players they make twice as many bad ones.
WP rugby in general, (including coaches) lacks real leadership and respect for leadership.
9 Jan 2012, 19:14 pm
@ufo-297:
Those were ex-Bulls players doing their own thing – not really the union.
9 Jan 2012, 19:16 pm
@PissAnt-298: Excluding Tim, I think they got it right for the coming season. Whether they will get the selection right is another matter.
9 Jan 2012, 19:16 pm
@Michael-300: on-field team selection
9 Jan 2012, 19:17 pm
And before everyone says I am a one-eyed Bulls supporter. I respect Province enormously. They have the most loyal supporters base. They have a brilliant history going back decades. They have always played an entertaining brand in which they believe in, except under AC. Every time the Bulls are in a dip, they should control southern hemisphere rugby, but since the 80s they have gone backwards as a union. I just think their player recruitment strategy and top level management is at the core of their problems.
9 Jan 2012, 19:18 pm
299Pissant
Oh okay… wasn’t sure of the who how and why
9 Jan 2012, 19:19 pm
Flo should have been kept and groomed for captaincy.. a thousand times better captaincy prospect than Burger in a thousand light years…
A mix n match combo of Carr, Flo, Kolisi, Vermeulen, and Koster is actually far more promising and inventive than the negating stuff up of Burger ******** every momentum to hell…
With Elstadt and Etsebeth, Steenkamp and Bekker covering 2nd row, Elstadt could fill in at 7 if need be.
Burger is actually the odd man out… go back to WP/Stormers run of games under Burger in 2009 before Watson took over the captaincy with a young Flo and Pieter Louw and Vermeulen in tandem,.. Under Burger WP / Stormers SUCKED and were losing games hand over fist till Watson took the young Stormers / WP over by default and suddenly they rocked and got within a whisker of upsetting the almighty 2007 S14 champ Bulls in CC semi till Nakalakuki fckd it all up on full time… otherwise that was a far better setup than the one under the current Burger and Rassie/AC confederacy of confusion.
Scrum half / Fly half is also fine, glad we got rid of the Gaffie reincarnation L. Cronje, Duvenhage / Van Aswegen have got the goods alright, and so does Schreuder and Elgar Watts albeit without a kicking game…little like Grant in that respect.
Stormers can come good… but I gotta say Burger is the problem in the middle of the cookie jar.. get him out the middle of every goddam facet and strategy and see the immediate difference.
Pieter Louw had to sacrifice his place because of this, likewise Flo… and Rassie still intent on creating this bullshit strategy of a marauding upright floundering link man from first receiver who cannot pass or create squat as was so painfully obvious in that dismal 1/4 WC exit where Burger was the chief cook and bottle washer go to man…. going going GONE.. OUT the WC due primarily to THAT.
9 Jan 2012, 19:23 pm
Maverick Rassie got sweet fanny fokol clue… Coetsee little more pragmatic and collectively reserved,.. but between the two of them its a veritable recipe for disaster… two diametrically opposed nincompoops pulling in directly opposite directions.. and neither calling anything remotely close to any expedient accuracy..
9 Jan 2012, 19:24 pm
@Horings-302: Yeah the Stormers went backwards in playing style in 2011. They were entertaining in 2010. I hope they regain. Time will tell.
Till tomorrow guys. See ye.
9 Jan 2012, 19:29 pm
WP produces more rugby talent than the rest of the country barring Free State at Grey Bloem
otherwise 50% of Bulls star players are WP born and bred and another 20-30% at Sharks..
WP should be creaming it every year and flying high… and yet in spite of all the home grown talent they suck to high heaven because they cannot spot emerging talent and sell it off to highest bidder due to hanging on for dear life to fading burnt out stars… and then buying the young talent back again when its on the wrong side of the parabola curve…
9 Jan 2012, 19:31 pm
@Michael-300:
I must disagree Michael.
Over the last couple of years their management of players like Brits, Joe, Grant, Lionel, Sadie, Fourie, Hoffmann, Timmy, and some guys now in Europe most will probably not even know leaves a lot to be desired.
In most cases it’s simple communication which is the most disheartening.
9 Jan 2012, 19:32 pm
@skopskiet. You can get uncle Fester back. What is his name again? Kobus iets? Reading Matfield’s book, It will come as no surprise if Rassie and Matfield team up in future.
9 Jan 2012, 19:35 pm
@PissAnt-308:
In short, WP lost it’s identity over the last decade. One just has to read Jan Pickard’s book on how this culture was created in the 80′s (similar to what Heyneke did at the Bulls in recent years).
9 Jan 2012, 19:36 pm
Pity Frik Du Preez and co didn’t succeed in forcing White out.. he was so far full of himself and getting it so fundamentally wrong during his blind man bluff stint of 49-0 and the rest that he had to hire an Australian to fix his blindness and even then needed a gimme one way ticket WC to fluke his star struck spangled resurrection in spite of himself.. any decent coach with half a clue could have caked walk that pantomime in the Parc de Princes
9 Jan 2012, 19:40 pm
So is Vic coming to join Rassie in Slaapstad… two foreign aliens..? .. because I still dunno wtf Bulls are doing using the services of Pieter Roussow, Heyneke Meyer, Francois Hougaard, Johann Sadie, Gurthro Steenkamp, Juandre Kruger, Liefling, and a few more when they are all WP born, educated and bred rugby pedigree..
9 Jan 2012, 19:43 pm
Fester (Kobus) Vd Merwe was Nick Mallets brain explosion.. that was the lowest point in WP history.. lets hope we don’t succumb to those forlorn depths of despair again any time soon…
9 Jan 2012, 19:50 pm
@Skopskiet. Ja, when reading Matfield’s book it differs to other books in one way. Every other former player’s book I have read the coach who succeeds gets only praise and no critism and the one that failed got only critism from the player. Matfield praised Meyer, Joubert, Pdiv but he critisized Jake the most. Even though Jake got the success.
It always bothers me how guys will follow a success recipe to the finest detail and the opposite when failure, but sometimes the bounce of the ball or the ref on the day or the fixture list can also play a part. Jake always irritated me with his only way to win a world cup and he followed the ’95 recipe exactly. Surely there are more ways than one to achieve success?
9 Jan 2012, 19:57 pm
@Horings-314: Busy reading Vic’s book at the moment. It’s taking longer than I expected to be honest, struggling to really get into it.
I have the Bear Gryls book as well. Tempted to drop Vic and get stuck into the bear.
Last Christmas I read the Stig’s book and Andre Agassi’s. Agassi’s was much much better.
Which was disappointing in a way because I hadn’t been a fan of his *until I read the book) but was a big Top Gear fan.
I have a huge amount of respect for Big Vic and was hoping to enjoy his book more.
9 Jan 2012, 19:57 pm
Jake also pissed me off with his numbers theories. I can’t remember if it was his lucky number 42 or something. We won the 2007, because we had the form team and the luck of the draw. Our best rugby year since 1998 was in 2009 where we won against the All Blacks 3 times in a row. That should be the aim of any coach.
9 Jan 2012, 20:00 pm
@Horings-316:
Jake is a statistician, worst type of individual to debate rugby with.
9 Jan 2012, 20:01 pm
This from news 24:
Cape Town – The Stormers returned to official training on Monday at the HPC (High Performance Centre) in Bellville and immediately underwent post festive-season fitness tests.
And the results impressed fitness and conditioning coach Stephan Du Toit.
“The bulk of the players tested exceptionally well against the fitness and conditioning targets set for own training over the festive season, with a number exceeding the targets set,” Du Toit told the Stormers’ website.
“Overall we were very pleased with the progress made by the group. Competition for places is tough and the boys are pushing each other hard. You can see that despite the time off the players trained hard.”
The players now embark on a pre-season rugby specific training camp to Hermanus.
They will host an open session at 10:00 on Wednesday at Hermanus Primary School. The team will train and then host a signing session.
9 Jan 2012, 20:02 pm
PS saw Brian Habanna at the gym last week. He was looking lean and fit.
9 Jan 2012, 20:04 pm
@stormersboy. Agree, his book is as entertaining as his post match interviews, but you do get insight into how he thinks about the game. He is not going over the top and has a realistic view. That is not very entetaining, unlike Jake who mesmerized us with the stars that fell into a Springbok formation that night in Paris and how 6 times 7 is amazingly also 21 times 2 and more amazingly the same number of days it took for him since birth to realise that he is a d… And that is the true reason the Boks won the World Cup.
9 Jan 2012, 20:07 pm
@Horings-320: Never read JW’s book, doesn’t really appeal to me.
John’s was ok, but also didn’t really blow me away either.
9 Jan 2012, 20:07 pm
@Horings-314:
100% – success is not always the lucky packet charm that the lucky packet coach managed to pluck out the bottom of the lucky packet even though he may have had little to do with the actual success which was bestowed on him through some benevolent forces outside his immediate control.. success can also sometimes be couched from within failure.. Matfield knows this.. that success is not won at the cost of integrity and honor.. and where that comes from those like PdV and Meyer and some others got about 2000% more of those commodities than Snakey White could ever hope to fathom from the depths of his self centered soul…
I can see Victor respects PdV because he put his players ahead of his own ambitions and even though he dearly would have loved to have won the WC he valued loyalty and honor even above his own driving desire for ambition.. almost to a fault where he allowed his seniors to influence strategy and selection perhaps beyond what was practically required..
eg. Smit should have stepped aside for Bismark.. that was one unforgiving mistake that had a bigger psychological dysfunction than anyone can vaguely realize the extent.. that one decision alone cost at least 20% Bok potential at the final hurdle…
The other flaws and faults are more strategic based like Burger playing wrong ball carry role.. and FdP starting ahead of Hougaard etc.. also not starting Alberts ahead of Spies.. but the big criteria of the psychological misalignment of focus was leaving Bismark on the bench for Smit.. which ALMOST resulted in a loss against Wales in first pool game… and then DID result in the 1/4 final loss vs Australia.
9 Jan 2012, 20:07 pm
@Horings-320:
If you are a Bulls supporter you will love Vic’s book. I will suggest Dan Retief’s one though as a good read.
9 Jan 2012, 20:11 pm
http://www.thestormers.co.za/article.asp?id=1193971 Stormers website, good pic of the youngster Stephen Kitshoff doing some squats. Looks to be about 280kg’s there.
9 Jan 2012, 20:11 pm
@stormersboy-315: self torture that … hell man Vic is very boring and yoy choose to read his book … LOL @ you.
Rather get a hold of Gibbs’ book … now that is not boring.
9 Jan 2012, 20:13 pm
@ashampoopaloo-304:
Constructing high rise buildings?
Tailoring suits?
Or perhaps it’s just a schluck or two too many from the the dream pipe?
Under AC the Stormers will be their usual disappointmet minus few exceptional skilled players they have lost and the aging SB as a captain courage, under PdV -if AC’s appointed a Boks coach as expected – it will be a mayhem, granted
Only Marius Jonker will save them
9 Jan 2012, 20:13 pm
@RL-325:
9 Jan 2012, 20:15 pm
@RL-325: Ja man it was a gift. From my mom.
Beats the soap on a rope that she used to get me.
Hersh’s book is like the You magazine. I’d read it if it was lying around and I had nothing better to do but I wouldn’t go and buy it.
9 Jan 2012, 20:16 pm
will be interesting to see how long Brumbies and White manage to keep their tempestuous love affair afloat.. it took Keohane about 15 months if I can recall before screaming headlong for the divorce courts…
9 Jan 2012, 20:20 pm
Anyway, gym becons. Cheers all.
9 Jan 2012, 20:20 pm
Anycase gents I am out – Tuna steaks tonight, need to get a cooking.
Ciao.
9 Jan 2012, 20:26 pm
@Hondo-326: you talking Bobba Meises again.. as usual..
Burger was and is the culminating point of the fallout… not many realize this but its the truth.. Nothing wrong with Burger the rugby player.. for daredevil guts and courage and blitzkrieg mayhem Burger (used) to have that stuff in spades.. now there are many more young bucks with far more power zest and krag ready willing and able to put their bodies on the line..
the last remaining problem.. is Burger is NOT a decent enough linking game reading midfield creative rugby brain who can ‘create’ some little bit of magic through his forays towards or into the advantage line.. all he knows is fokmavoort and bust it up and go to ground… and the momentum of the impetus was long ago lost the first moment whoever the brainchild was who designed this foolproof idiotic strategy in the first place orchestrated that he should be the one to get the first bite at the second phase ball..
9 Jan 2012, 22:13 pm
NOW THIS IS INTERESTING.
FROM NEWS 24
Cape Town – Rassie Erasmus has shocked the Western Province Rugby Union (WPRU) by resigning from his position as director of coaching.
Erasmus’s lawyer, Frikkie Erasmus, confirmed the news to Die Burger newspaper on Monday.
“Rassie is looking at other options. There are other choices, especially overseas,” said Frikkie Erasmus.
Rassie Erasmus has already informed the Stormers’ management team of his decision to quit.
He was last year mentioned as a possible candidate to become the next Springbok coach after he assisted them as a technical adviser at the World Cup in New Zealand. However, the South African Rugby Union (SARU) will only comment on the new Bok coaching team on January 27.
Heyneke Meyer and Gert Smal are apparently the two strongest candidates for the Springbok head coaching position.
Die Burger further understands that clubs in England and France are after Erasmus’s services.
He started his tenure at the WPRU in late 2007. He then coached the Stormers to fifth position in the 2008 Super 14, just missing out on a semi-final spot. But he struggled to handle the constant media pressure and was appointed in his current role as director of coaching with Allister Coetzee taking over the coaching reigns.
9 Jan 2012, 22:15 pm
As usual the Keo okes asleep….
Bueller….?
Bueller….?
Bueller….?
9 Jan 2012, 22:24 pm
@ashampoopaloo-332: harsh, no one else is doing the hard yards up the guts. its burgers job and he doesnt shy away from it. he’s not supposed to score tries every time he carts it up he just has to make the advantage line and give his team front foot ball. the rest if up the rest of the loosies to build on what burger started.
i dont see spies making any descernable yards against a top 6 side, in fact u kinda wonder if he’s on the field at all some times.
i agree that burger is not a 7 but the way the boks play it doersnt matter. boks play a left right flanker as oppsed to open and blind.
also burgers picking up an off loading game. when jerryCollins did this it added a huge dimension to his game. burger started experimenting with it last season and though its a huge learning curve he’s getting better and better at it.
cannot believe your picking on burger. there were loads of other players (including smit) who should be under the microscope before burger (habana, FDP). burger has heart and works tirelessly all day. what burger has you cant coach and the boks are a better side with a work horse like burger doing his thing with no flashy bs.
9 Jan 2012, 23:09 pm
@man1a-335: yeah I’m harsh on Burger because he kills off most promising movements with his solo runs to never never land
But I’m way worse harsh on nonentity of a has been loser captain John Smit or mama’s baby bunting FdP… try me..
9 Jan 2012, 23:18 pm
@ashampoopaloo-336: yes i’ve heard how u feel about smit, didnt realise u had it out for FdP as well. totally agree there on smit and FdP. though i’m not so sure that the WC losses was entirely smits fault.
from reading between the lines of one of matfields interviews and it was the seniors players who decided to go back to the kicking game. only FdP and steyn would’ve pushed that game plan and of those two i’d have to say that it was most probably FdP who spear headed it. good game plan if FdP had his kicking game right. but he was putting up meaningless bombs and didnt have another game plan to fall back on.
burger was coached to be a battering ram. i like burgher as he’s always willing to put his body on the line for his team and does it every game. I wathced the boks aus game again in the weekend. sure burger was stopped but at least he tried and was never avoiding work. he carried the ball up more than any other forward, and i point out that as he was first reciever so that the defence was always waiting for him. burgers defence in that game was a lso immense, putting in a try saving tackle.
once burger gets his off loading game going he’ll be even more of a handful for world rugby.
9 Jan 2012, 23:20 pm
@ashampoopaloo-336: how do u feel about spies?
in my book he’s over rated. does well vs minnow teams but disapears in the top tier games.
like SBW a great athelete but only an average rugby player
10 Jan 2012, 00:39 am
@man1a-337:
Burger is no play maker, non creative with the ball in hand and predictable.
10 Jan 2012, 00:58 am
@Te Rangatira-339: but u need those kind of players that do all the dirty work.
its not burgers job to be flashy. sure he may be predicatable but thats a 6 and 8′s job to cart it up and punish the defensive line.
what about burgers defence? phenomenal tackler and pulls off a try saving tackle almost every game.
10 Jan 2012, 01:18 am
Yes correct, Burger has a big motor and is excellent on defense, but he becomes too predictable as a first receiver, as he lacks the off loading skills nor does he possess a smart short kicking game. I think he should try to position himself as a runner not a ball distributor.
10 Jan 2012, 01:35 am
@Te Rangatira-341: chur teRanatira
he’s learning to off load. started last season and at first he passed too much but as the WC apporached he got a bit more selective and better. still a couple of passes he should’ve held onto but the guys at least learning and improving his craft.
forwards dont kick and shouldnt unless they’ve logged at least 100 hours practising them.
in the aus game burger was predominantly the ball carrier/basher up the guts. didnt see a helluva lot of other boks forwards putting their hands up or contributing as much. thats what i like bout burger. he does his job without any whinging and does it well. sure its predictable but theres one thing knowing what is going to happen and another thing being able to stop it.
and defensively burgers the man. offence wins games but defense wins championships
who else would u have ahead of schalk?
10 Jan 2012, 02:21 am
I wouldn’t have anyone ahead of Schalk, he is a great player. I think his role as monotonous first receiver is more an indictment on the players around him. They did not have a first five who could take it to the defensive line, actually they had no one who could perform this role. As for forwards not kicking, well Zinny is my favourite player, say no more.
10 Jan 2012, 02:44 am
@Te Rangatira-343: zinny was a freak and he could kick but he always kicked intelligently and he was never the first choice kicker. a kicking forward is a nice to have but not the main attribute i’d want in my loosies.
yeah i feel the same that burger has been more guilty by association than an actual breakdown of his own skill and contribution.
i agree he was coached to be first reciever but he was told what to do and he did it. didnt ask if was such a good idea but got inot his job and did it with passion.
ps wayneShelford was my pick of 8′s, zinny had more skill but buck had mana. Zinny i’d pick if i had to bet all my money, buck i’d pick if i had to bet my life.
10 Jan 2012, 03:07 am
@man1a-344:
Yeah Great Respect for Wayne too. Zinny for me evolved into a complete package. When he was dropped by Laurie Mains for Aaron Pene, he worked hard on his defense and tight play and came back a stronger player with all the skills.Being able to kick a ball skillfully is not a prerequisite for a forward, but it is a skill a top player should practice and be able to pull out when required
10 Jan 2012, 03:14 am
@Te Rangatira-345:
aaron pene was a default choice. zinny was injured. snapped his achilles and no one, even zinny, thought he’d make it back in time for the wc. but zinny being zinny rehab’d and trained real hard and defied the odds and made it back to drop kick that 3 points from the half way line vs england. audacious.
zinny was a great player and a massive loss to the AB’s and auckland when he retired
10 Jan 2012, 03:26 am
YES Zinny was unique. Have to go make some money now,all the best.
10 Jan 2012, 03:45 am
@Te Rangatira-347: chur chur kia kaha
Have your say
You must be logged in to post a comment.