Scrum calls under scrutiny
13 Mar 2012
The penalty that handed the Brumbies victory over the Cheetahs on Saturday will be investigated by Sanzar.
With the siren having sounded referee Keith Brown adjudged the Cheetahs to have deliberately and illegally rotated the scrum. Christian Lealiifano subsequently kicked the penalty that gave the Brumbies a 24-23 victory.
Lyndon Bray, SANZAR’s refereeing boss, told the Beeld that three scrum specialists – former Bok prop Balie Swart, New Zealand scrum coach Mike Cron and former Wallaby prop Patricio Noriega – will review that decision as well as two other calls to determine their legitimacy.
‘Keith may not have been very sharp with the early engagement of the scrums and therefore it wasn’t a pretty sight throughout the game. But, concerning that last decision, we’ll have to determine if the teams firstly scrummed forward and then lawfully swayed the scrum with momentum. When it sways immediately without force, it may be unlawful,’ said Bray.
32 Comments
13 Mar 2012, 08:26 am
shocking really that the anzacs even care enough to save face with us as regards this sort of shirt. patently obvious their usual nationalistic bias again got the better of one of their own, as usual.
some of the scrum penalties against the cheetahs were beyond laughable.
scrutinize the dirty dragons…
13 Mar 2012, 08:36 am
What will be the consequence if the penalty was adjudged to be wrong?
Penalty reversal & will this change the outcome of the game?
I dont suspect that they will reverse the decision, so in all honesty, unless the ref will be fined match fees for incompetence & he will be demoted, whats the point!
13 Mar 2012, 08:39 am
@BULLET(BULLET)-2:
its their usual insincere attempts at saving face and acting like they care and are shocked at what transpired.
13 Mar 2012, 08:42 am
Waste of time.
This might be the only one he got right.
13 Mar 2012, 08:45 am
SWart was overrated as a scrummager
13 Mar 2012, 09:17 am
@greatest13gerber(greatest13gerber)-5:
Yup. And anyone who starts every sentence with “Jy weet…” has to be overrated as a scrum specialist.
BTW, why has Watson not addressed the Steve Walsh penalty/lack of penalty? I still don’t know if he made the wrong/right decision.
He was very quick to condemn the Greyling try the previous week, and rightly so.
13 Mar 2012, 09:31 am
@welcome to my life, hugh…(i_love_u_bakkiesbotha)-1:
Well one minute you complain cos nothing gets done and then when they try and fix
something you complain even more.
There really isnt no way some of you will ever be happy.
13 Mar 2012, 09:32 am
@Hurricane(Hurricane)-7:
Oh she complains about everything. Just scroll past.
13 Mar 2012, 09:41 am
Problem with refs at moment is the governing body keeps changing the rules every second year… just when they start to get the hang of things. With the number of games truley scrutinised each year is perhaps less than a half dozen per ref (and i don’t mean by other refs, but thru blogs and media) it would take 2-3 yrs for refs to truly work out the rules as pertaining to the game. IE which teams flout which laws and which teams disguise misuse of others. or how front rows time their contacts. Until the refs get to grip with the laws during rugby games and not just theory the better the game will become.
13 Mar 2012, 10:05 am
@Hurricane(Hurricane)-7:
i just want things to be right in the world, hurricane
13 Mar 2012, 10:07 am
@ratel(ratel)-6:
thats one worth looking at to. But do these reveiws of ref decisions affect the result??
thats bottom line.
13 Mar 2012, 10:17 am
steve walsh was incorrect in not awarding a penalty to restart the game after basson had scored.
the referee shall not blow his whistle for full time or half time when the ifringement for a stoppage results in a penalty.
13 Mar 2012, 10:20 am
@greatest13gerber(greatest13gerber)-11: I hope it does. Cheetahs dserved to win that game.
13 Mar 2012, 10:34 am
Cheetahs were right royally rogered by the ref. at the end every scrum was a guaranteed penalty for the Brumbies.
13 Mar 2012, 11:30 am
‘Keith may not have been very sharp with the early engagement of the scrums and therefore it wasn’t a pretty sight throughout the game. But, concerning that last decision, we’ll have to determine if the teams firstly scrummed forward and then lawfully swayed the scrum with momentum’ Ok, I may not be the brightest light bulb around, but Lyndon Bray is admitting that Crooked Keith got it wrong on the early engagement throughout the game, so surely that is what they should be addressing and not just one incident at the end of the game?
And then what happens if they determine that he got it wrong? Another I’m sorry and then spend a few weeks in ‘rehab’ to recover from the awful game like they did with good old Bryce?
Personally I think the whole IRB should be called up on corruption. It’s so blatantly obvious it’s not even a joke any more.
13 Mar 2012, 12:07 pm
@greatest13gerber(greatest13gerber)-11:
No, result stands.
Referee might just be dropped from the panel.
13 Mar 2012, 12:41 pm
Anyone explain this one to me?
Why penalize a player when he put his hand on the ground preventing the scrum going down and then afterwards binding on the opponent? Did he gain an advantage?
13 Mar 2012, 14:02 pm
HAHA!!!
Mark Keohane, there you were saying that the Cheetahs loss had nothing to do with the Browneye!
Even the referees note that it was all fishy.
It is time that you started to join the war against the SANZAR oppressors who choose to keep the greatest rugby nation down. LIke I said before, you are a typical South African who gratefully bends over while the bully spanks you while laughing at you.
We all need to break out of this “dankie meneer” mentality.
13 Mar 2012, 14:11 pm
…
All that it does is to exacerbate the inner turmoil and angst that we feel when we are being cheated, AGAIN.
How does that roll out?
We act out in ways that are inappropriate like Pieter Van Zyl and that idiot over the weekend.
More constructive yet aggressive action against these people will see results that will do two things:
1) They might consider treating us with more respect.
2) We will be satisfied that our grievances are being alleviated and will no longer carry on like whiny adolescents.
13 Mar 2012, 17:36 pm
The New-Zeeland rugby Mafia will intervene. The statement by Bray shows that the
issue has already been prejudged. He is totally out of order. If only an independent panel
of experts was given the chance to evaluate Brown’s performance, he would be exposed as a dishonest fool.
13 Mar 2012, 18:14 pm
Referees in general are clueless about the scrum and only spot the very obvious infractions, it’s aggravated even more by _some_ referees system of just favouring what they think is the dominant team – which results in that team getting away with collapses etc as the other side is penalised.
I’m hesitant to label a referee as dishonest when it comes to scrums simply because the majority are incompetent in this area.
13 Mar 2012, 18:50 pm
@Tartan(Tartan)-21:
Not all referees are clueless. Quick question: Since 1995, in every RWC final that the Boks have not played in, who has been the referee?
Yes, it was a South African. The truth is that we are spoilt by an immense quality of referees in the Republic. The only exception being Marius Jonker.
When our teams play against foreign teams we are shocked by the pisspoor quality of foreign referees. The biggest offenders being New Zealanders, Irish and Stuart Dickinson.
Why is it that the Kiwis seem to have a stranglehold on decision making when it comes to refereeing: Paddy O’Brien, Keith Lawrence and Lyndon Bray? (the latter was actually a good ref)
It just smells.
13 Mar 2012, 20:27 pm
http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Super15/Ref-did-wrong-Cheetahs-Bray-20120313
Read it Keo, you half Kiwi mother.
13 Mar 2012, 21:12 pm
@YoMama(YoMama)-22:
ok big shot.
Most referees can get it wrong when wheeling the scrum or pulling down is involved.
It is a silly part of the game where a penalty can go the wrong way. Do you think this only happens to SA teams?
Get your mind out of the conspiracy gutter.
So you have a problem with Kiwis in the ref panels. Would you pefer all Souht Africans to run the refs?
You guys cant even run your own teams properly yet now you want the refs panel as well.
13 Mar 2012, 21:54 pm
Get over it inept refereeing will always be a thorn in your back side over the years South African refereeing have always been incontroversal situations as much this present lot thats going around the world its not New Zealanders Irish and Australian the biggest offenders we have also officials on the side line who should be watching for law breakers this game of ours is a fantastic sporting product pro rugby hasnt been with us that long but we have made hudge in roads on the world stage.
13 Mar 2012, 22:12 pm
@YoMama(YoMama)-22: And then I recall Watson constantly penalizing dominant English scrum vs Australia in WC03 final, just like now much hated Bryce Lawrence somehow thought The Beast is better scrummmager than Phil Vickery in the BIL series.
OK, I like SA refs (overall), just let’s keep feet on the ground a bit.
14 Mar 2012, 01:02 am
Refs have been rubbish for a few years now.
Bryce Lawrence is by far the worst – but he screws a lot of teams (except NZ teams).
The Aussies hate him just as much as we do – just look at the last few games the Tahs have had under him.
The ONLY difference between us and the rest is that we seem to complain louder and scream bias when it happens to us. This would all be fine if it changed something but it wont.
14 Mar 2012, 01:14 am
@jeest(jeest)-27: “just look at the last few games the Tahs have had under him.”
If Tahs hate any ref, it’s Kaplan. 2 wins from at least 16 games.
14 Mar 2012, 01:23 am
@YoMama(YoMama)-22: “The truth is that we are spoilt by an immense quality of referees in the Republic.”
I can only wonder why okes so dislike Joubert after WC final. No, of course, I don’t.
And speaking about WC finals, I mentioned Watson in ’03. He was even more notorious in ’99 when Eales even threatened to walk Aussies off the pitch if Watson does not stop until then ignored Frogs dirties.
And guess why Kaplan got his reffing “holiday” last year. Something to do with the immense quality, I presume.
@jeest(jeest)-27: “Bryce Lawrence is by far the worst”
I agree. He should have sent off unrepentant eye-gouger Burger twice – in BIL series and WC quarter. That alone is enough.
14 Mar 2012, 03:33 am
@Nils(Nils)-29:
Mate, don’t you get tired of sucking keewee d ick?
14 Mar 2012, 11:03 am
@whatever(whatever)-30: I’ll try just for a change ignore typical insults. So what are you saying, it never ever happened and all I said there was lies. Or what?
By the way, neither Watson nor Kaplan in my examples have had any Kiwi teams involved. Nor Bryce, for that matter.
I understand, it was a knee-jerk reaction from you, just like animals like tapeworm do – no brains involved at all.
15 Mar 2012, 00:27 am
@Nils(Nils)-28: Correct – Aussies also hate Kaplan. Both their National and state teams have poor records under him. A fact that has been highlighted in a piece done on stats at Green and Gold Rugby.
I also don’t condone eye gouging so if you are trying to have a dig at me it didn’t work. Burger should have been sent.
The fact remains that Bryce Lawrence is appalling and should not be allowed to referee. The only thing that keeps him on the register is the fact his father is highly regarded in NZ and that your mate Paddy runs the refs.
There really is a win at all costs attitude in NZ.
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