208 Comments

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• 101.Transformation:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:32 pm

  @Oranjebliksemblou(Oranjebliksemblou)-97: all talk buddy, watch when the heat is turned up! pdv also started out talking bold plans etc then the vagaries of Test rugby became real even to an idealist like him. he’ll soon be complaining about how long the season is.

• 102.Sasuke:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:35 pm

  @Mr Black(Mr Black)-56: Add my name to that list.

  @John1976(John1976)-100: True but talent cannot be denied. I am personally conducted a campaign to get Willie Le Roux in the Bok squad. I think that boy is class.

  @Transformation(Transformation)-90: Transie did you see he took a few balls at 1st receiver against the Hurricanes he looked class there too. I think he will be able to play 15, 11, 14, 13 and 10. I also see he is a lefty. No wonder he is so skillful lefties are usually more skillful than there right handed counter parts.

  His defence would be exposed at 12 and it will be too cramped for him.

• 103.Transformation:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:42 pm

  @John1976(John1976)-100: well ryan vrede and keo were playing to the paranoid gallery. that said, how WP/Stormers ignored le roux while he was at Boland (scoring 16 tries) is beyond me and all we heard was that Bolla was training with the stormers

  admittedly le roux played mostly @ 15 for Boland.

• 104.John1976:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:44 pm

  @Sasuke(Sasuke)-102: Sasuke, it just shows you the bullshit that is disseminated on this website by the so called journalist. As you rightly pointed out, if an individual has talent and class, they will end up earning higher honours.

• 105.stormersboy:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:44 pm

  Aplon is the likely 15 IMO, leaving JPP at 14 and Brian at 11, with Mvovo and Bjorn knocking on the door. I expect them to get some chances in the not too distant future.

  13 is likely to be JDJ’s position for the near future, with Jaque possibly getting selected from overseas.

  12 belongs to Frankie

  10 belongs to Steyn, particularly with HM there, and 9 will go to either FDP or Hougaard (rightfully so).

• 106.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:46 pm

  Lots of talent in SA especially at present,young talent too.Thats why I think likes of Du Preez,Rossouw,Bakkies,Habana,Jacques Fourie etc we must call it a day with them at Bok level and only use in extended squad in case of emergency.They are only useful for 12-18 months tops.In that time the youngsters would have adapted to Test rugby in blooded now and will be heading to their PEAK for next 3-4 yrs instead of plateauing or worse.

  Kitshoff,Etzebeth,Kolisi,Marcel Coetzee,Jantjies,Goosen,Hougaard,de Jongh,Lambie,Taute,Juandre Kruger MUST BE BLOODED INTO TEST RUGBY THIS YEAR.

• 107.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:53 pm

  Why do we need Du Preez with Hougaard there?

  Why do we need Bakkies with Etzebeth & Kruger raising their hands?

  Why do we need Rossouw when he has have Alberts,Elstadt,Kruger who can play the hybrid lock/loosie role as well?

  why do we need Jaque Fourie when we have de Jongh,JPP,Sadie along hungry and YOUNGER?

  Why do we need Habana with Mvovo,Basson,Willie le Roux all raising their hands?

  Why do wen Need to start Morne with Goosen,Jantjes,Lambie all there?

  Lets for once embrace YOUTH!!!!

  If we have to have the old heads there,have them in extended squad as cover.

  NZ/Oz never afraid to play laaitites,watch Barrett play AB’s behind Carter this year-they will never say hes too young.

• 108.Michael:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:54 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-106: Rubbish. Fourie is young. Habana isn’t 30. Both have years left in them. Fourie has yet to peak.
  12-18 months for those two my arse.
  Fourie is the best 13 we have. JDJ is the next best.

  Do not chuck the baby out with the bath water.

• 109.Transformation:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:57 pm

  @Sasuke(Sasuke)-102: he made total of 18 passes with 4 being “playmaker passes”, the week before he made 17 total with 6 being playmaker, benjamin on the other wing made a total of 3 passes with non of them in a playmaking position.

  clearly he is under instruction to get in the mix & overload, creating overlaps.

• 110.stormersboy:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:57 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-107: Because Springbok Rugby is for the best, not the best up-and-coming.

  Simple as that.

  The youngsters will get their chance, some sooner than others.

• 111.seabiscuit:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:57 pm

  @stormersboy(stormersboy)-105:

  imo lambie at 15 rather with aplon and mvovo on the wings

• 112.John1976:
  3 Apr 2012, 12:58 pm

  @Transformation(Transformation)-103: That is always the case with WP; they simply act as though Boland is not part of the franchise. Last year they had a crisis at flyhalf but they continued to ignore Elgar Watts although he trained with them pre-season. It is absolutely ridiculous.

• 113.stormersboy:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:01 pm

  @seabiscuit(seabiscuit)-111: Aplon’s 15-14 debate is an interesting one. I don’t mind either way really. Lambie is solid at 15 and if you had to have him in the side then that’s where I’d play him.

  Mvovo has had a good couple of weeks, if he continues his form he’ll be knocking hard on the established players for sure.

• 114.Transformation:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:01 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-107: habana is like rokocoko or sivivatu needs to be put out to pasture.

• 115.pompies2:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:08 pm

  @Transformation(Transformation)-109: will be interesting to see how many of them were when he’s coming off his blind-side wing into the 1st receiver position? Could explain how they are able to get width on their play. It also has to be noted that their passing accuracy and pace onto the ball is probably the best in the competition, even better than the highlanders. The foundation skills of backline play needs to be sharp to give yourself a chance.

• 116.seabiscuit:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:08 pm

  @Transformation(Transformation)-114:

  agreed

• 117.KWAGGA ROBERTSE:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:09 pm

  Guys please not for the sake of an argument but Etzebeth’s name keeps popping up.
  Whilst I agree he certainly has shown glimpses, why the articles about him being the next enforcer and all that sh it? He has’nt empressed me to that extent yet.
  Good, yes but too early to stick him the big leagues imo.

• 118.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:09 pm

  @Michael(mikeybrass)-108:

  Fourie yet to peak? which Fourie have u been watching? He has lost a yard or 2 speed wise already. He is under 30,so is Habana but they have a lot of rugby theyve played in last 8 yrs. Joe Roff was 28/29 when he called it quits in Test rugby,same with Jeff Wilson-their abilities were dwindling and there were youngsters who were better athletes.. Christian Cullen was 28 when he was replaced with a young Mils Muliaina & Leon MacDonald.

  Playing Test rugby for 10 years takes its toll mate,age isnt always the differentiator.

• 119.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:12 pm

  @KWAGGA ROBERTSE(KWAGGA ROBERTSE)-117:

  Sam Whitelock was an All Black in his first full year of superrugby,had a similiar year to Etzebeth now-he is now premier no.5 lock in NZ…Juandre Kruger as well is ready-its his first year after a couple yrs overseas as well as Currie Cup.

  Let the youngens play.

• 120.>^..^< katman:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:14 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-107: I mostly agree with you, but I’d certainly keep Jaque Fourie and Bryan Habana in the mix. They’re both still young and good enough to outplay their rivals for their respective positions.

• 121.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:14 pm

  in SA had Muliaina(100 test veteran) been our 15,we wouldnt have had the balls to bench him for the obvious;y more talented Israel Dagg….We are b*tches like than.No balls to back the MORE talented,explosive youngsters

• 122.pompies2:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:14 pm

  @stormersboy(stormersboy)-113: Aplon would be my 15 all day. Decent enough boot. Good defender. We all know about his counter-attacking skills. His height could be seen as a problem, but if you have a taller wing, there would be some interchange of positions.

• 123.>^..^< katman:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:15 pm

  @KWAGGA ROBERTSE(KWAGGA ROBERTSE)-117: I disagree. He’s been a revelation. To me he’s been just about the best lock in the Super15.

• 124.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:16 pm

  @>^..^< katman(katman)-120:

  I agree,I said in my posts that i would select them in extended squad-keep them around in case of injuries and play them sparingly to keep competition in squad.But they wouldnt be unshakable starters as has been practice in SA for years.

• 125.Michael:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:16 pm

  @John1976(John1976)-112: Watts was injured too iirc.

  @KWAGGA ROBERTSE(KWAGGA ROBERTSE)-117: He has impressed me.

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-118: Lost a yard of pace? Really? I suppose you have the stats to back up your assertion? And since when does playing test rugby for a number of years not mean your best year or years are ahead. Witness Timmy Horan at WC ’99. If you want to go down the age route, there are many others who played into their 30s (which Fourie isn’t there yet anyways) who played fantastic rugby.
  It is you who brought up age, not me.

• 126.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:16 pm

  @pompies2(pompies2)-122:

  I agree 100% with that.

• 127.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:21 pm

  @Michael(mikeybrass)-125:

  Mate Horan was 29 at RWC 1999.After that he called it a day. Will be 29,I dont see him playing 13 for Boks for longer than next 12-18months. Younger guys are ready.Stop living in past glories.

• 128.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:25 pm

  15.Lambie
  14.Aplon
  13.JPP
  12.Steyn
  11.Mvovo
  10.Goosen
  9.Houggard

  8.Spies
  7.Burger(c)
  6.Brussow
  5.Bekker
  4.Etzebeth
  3.Cilliers
  2.Bismark
  1.Beast

• 129.wpstormerbok:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:25 pm

  @Transformation(Transformation)-114:

  That’s the best summary I’ve seen so far of the current Habana.

  I’ve made peace with the fact that he’s first choice at Stormers but if he gets Bok colours this again playing like he is now then Meyer will be heading same way as Div.

• 130.Michael:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:28 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-127: No, the question is, “Is someone like JDJ better than Fourie?” No.
  Timmy had played for many many years.
  So far I have seen: when challenged on age, you revert to number of years played; challenged on years played (re player’s performance), you revert to age.
  It’s like trying to nail jello to a wall.

  Whatever.

• 131.wpjoulekkading:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:30 pm

  Jaques Fourie is one of the premier, if not the premier 13 in the world.

  Yes, there are other contenders, we can talk about O’Driscoll or whoever. But he is up there for sure.

  And he doesn’t get injured often. So he would have a good few more years in him, probably enough for another world cup.

  I would keep him for sure, he was a rock for SA and the Stormers in the midfield defensively, and super exciting on attack.

• 132.Michael:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:30 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-128: Burger? The same guy who has played for more years than Fourie at test level and is basically the same age as Fourie? So you want to chuck Fourie but keep Burger. Consistency isn’t your strong suit.

  Over and out.

• 133.>^..^< katman:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:33 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-127: I’m sorry, mate, but you’re dead wrong on Fourie. He’s arguably the best outside centre in the world, and you want to ditch him for the sake of a complete Bok make-over? I know it’s tempting to replace everything, but no coach in the world would do this. And thank god Heyneke won’t either.

• 134.Oranjebliksemblou:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:34 pm

  @Transformation(Transformation)-101:
  I realise that winning all your games is damn near impossible but its the attitude towards the game of being unstopable that counts and it is something that Meyer brought to the Bulls, I dont like the Bulls at all but one thing I do admire is that when they take the field, win or loose that day, they go with an attitude that they are unbeatable and I believe that is what Meyer will bring to the Boks.

• 135.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:37 pm

  @Michael(mikeybrass)-132:

  There you go using amateur tactics.

  Everyone knows forwards have a longer shelf life than backs.Forwards reach their peak in their late 20′s,early 30′s coupled with their experience.Their play relies less on speed and explosiveness which is at its peak when younger which is what makes outside backs especially linebreakers like Fourie most valuable. Cant compare loose forwards to centre-three-quarters.

  Different criteria all together. So next your going to compare frontrow forwards to wingers? Consistency is your strong suit indeed.

• 136.stormersboy:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:38 pm

  @pompies2(pompies2)-122: Agreed on Aplon. For me I’d then play JPP at 14 and Brian at 11, best defensive wings out there.

• 137.Sasuke:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:40 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-128: JPP at 13? Seriously?

• 138.greentea:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:41 pm

  Two Tri nations since the turn of the century, it aint that deep.

• 139.wpjoulekkading:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:41 pm

  From the World Cup squad, some guys pick themselves:
  Brussow
  Bismark
  Spies
  Fourie
  F. Steyn
  Burger
  J. Smith (if fit)
  Bekker

  Then you have guys that should be in the squad at the least:
  JdV
  Jpp
  Alberts
  Lambie

  Maybe there are one or two more that I miss.

  The likes of
  M. Steyn
  Habana
  J. du Plesis
  Ralapele
  Pienaar
  J de Jongh
  Ndugane
  Aplon
  could have a place or not, depending on Meyer and their form for the rest of the S15.

  Who, in my view, there should NOT be
  F. du Preez (or maybe in the squad)
  D. Rossouw
  J. Muller
  G. Steenkamp
  B. Botha
  B. James
  CJ. van der Linde
  Some of them, like Steenkamp and du Preez still have a lot to offer. But they have able and experienced players to take their place, nevermind the young talent knocking on the door.

• 140.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:42 pm

  @>^..^< katman(katman)-133:

  Fourie while a very good midfielder-he was probably the best in world in 2009…the last 2 yrs or so Conrad Smith has arguably been the best 13 on the planet-the pattern the AB play along him to use his strengths as a playmaker(try assists,outside backs score hatloads of tries off him) and shut down defender-awesome deck player for a midfielder as well.

  By the way Im not saying Fourie is rubbish no,I just feel we need to build for the future….

• 141.wpjoulekkading:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:42 pm

  @wpjoulekkading(wpjoulekkading)-139:Bekker slipped in there, he wasn’t at the WC of course. But he would be on my teamsheet for sure.

• 142.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:43 pm

  @Sasuke(Sasuke)-137:

  Of the 13′s in SA conference Super 15,who has been the most enterprising best outside centre?

• 143.Sasuke:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:46 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-142: Probably Robert Ebersohn or JdJ. Dont get me wrong JPP has been good but he is still learning the position and he missed a few tackles over the weekend.

• 144.greentea:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:47 pm

  I see most are picking the same old backline that barely functioned at the world cup. ( Namibia and the other minnow didn”t count)

• 145.seabiscuit:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:50 pm

  i will never play jpp at 13 for the boks ever he is still fat, still uninterested, still jogs never commits, he needs a flippen cracker up his arse to make him move, i honestly never understand why everyone continues to rave about him since ’09 he has become useless and im my view doesnt show signs of improving, i think plum knows this and thats why they are trying this switch

• 146.seabiscuit:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:51 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-142:

  id go with robert, but when whitehead was there for a few weeks id count him close, and jdj is looking good as always

• 147.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:52 pm

  @Sasuke(Sasuke)-143:

  De Jongh has been quiet this season so far barring some flashes…Rob Ebersohn on defence is very very average and his lack of power/size in contact will always be a problem.

  Fair enough though on the “JP still learning bit”…very quick learner though.

• 148.mshiniwami:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:54 pm

  @seabiscuit(seabiscuit)-146:

  Whitehead had 1 good game vs a depleted Reds team @ 13,even Wynand Olivier looked like a world beater against them. De Jongh is improving true,started season slow but with injuries thats to be expected i guess.

• 149.greentea:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:54 pm

  At international level does JPP ever beat his man on the outside and score tries.

• 150.stormersboy:
  3 Apr 2012, 13:54 pm

  @mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-147: Hence Jaque is still the best option at 13.

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