Lions set for chop?
11 May 2012
Saru has confirmed its plan to relegate the last-placed South African franchise at the end of the season.
This proposed solution was made by Saru’s executive council at its special general meeting in January. The top four teams on the SA conference log would therefore join the Kings in 2013. As it stands, the Lions would drop out.
Saru said a promotion-relegation play-off would then take place after the 2013 and 2014 campaigns.
However, the franchises requested that a decision on the mechanism of qualification be postponed to allow them time to make alternative proposals. The officials at the general meeting accepted the request. Saru CEO Jurie Roux asked for it to be recorded that this delay was at the franchises’ request, therefore precluding the franchises from criticism of late decision-making.
A final decision will be made after meetings with the SA Super Rugby franchises on 17 May, the Saru executive committee on 24 May and the Saru general council on 13 July (21 rounds into the 2012 Super Rugby tournament).
‘Rugby has been consistently united in supporting the Kings’ place in Super Rugby in 2013,’ said Roux. ‘Our focus has been on finding a rugby answer to the questions that flow from that that’s fair, transparent in its mechanism and will strengthen South African rugby in the long run. Those discussions continue.
‘Until a final decision is reached, the franchises and the Saru presidency are agreed that it would be unhelpful to the competing teams to publicly debate the pros and cons of different scenarios. When a decision is announced we will be able to report back to rugby supporters in full.’
305 Comments
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11 May 2012, 23:08 pm
I work with and know plenty of Lions supporters and they understand the reality of the situation. And that they are going down. That is the reality of professional sport. Sad but true.
11 May 2012, 23:09 pm
@Meerkatte(phil72)-247: you sold your Super 15 to the Sharks
No ticket anymore
You will get hammered like no other team
Thank you
11 May 2012, 23:15 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-245: Your smileys show your ignorance
3 MILLION RAND PER YEAR!!!!!! You do your homework a bit old Transie as my source is not Tacitus
Question? Tomorrow the Falcons start a Super Rugby Team, shall we let them in?
11 May 2012, 23:16 pm
@ufo(ufo)-249:
The promotion/relagation issue from end Super 15 2013 still has to be sorted out. So the Kings might have a short shelf life. I don’t see any guarantee that they are in it for 3 years. There are still many things to conquer.
By the time time 2016 comes around, we could have a Super 20!
11 May 2012, 23:26 pm
Bloody politics at work! Lions or Transvaal are rugby institutions. Who the f….k are Kings?
11 May 2012, 23:27 pm
Meerkatte you half wit.
Why are you giving me the numbers of supporters at one Lions game in 2010? How does one game have any meaning here? The average support numbers compared to all other 14 franchises over the last few years. That is what I asked you to look at before talking about market numbers in the franchise region.
Was jy by die skool daar onder in die Oos Kaap?
Yes TRANSFORMATION exactly how I wrote that no transformation has taken place that is acceptable.That is exactly why there is an urgent need to transform the largest urban region in the country. One that is sustained by a genuine and sizeable established support base.
To include the Kings does not automaticaly mean the Lions must be taken outside and shot in the head, or do you understand Transformation the way Stalin did?
The current deal as written above allows the bottom placed team to playoff every year with the one that has just gone down. If you carefully think about how the players and teams will be unsettled in this scenario, the disaster is obvious. But you never thought of that did you? When the Kings lose to the Lions in the 2013 playoff, after finishing last in a season of shame and pain, what will you say then/
This deal is a lemon.
11 May 2012, 23:28 pm
@JL1(JL1)-251: get it right, they sold ‘hosting rights’ and when the fifth franchise became available decided to team up – border, ep & swd – to form the spears.
you reckon swd also “sold their super rugby status” to the stormers?
i tell you now, the leopards & pumas should’ve “sold their super rugby” affiliation to the GLRU anyway, seeing that they haven’t been paid a lousy CENT since 2007!
this fact seems not to bother you but i bet you if cheeky & anele were to pocket all of the R6.6 million SARU pays to the franchises you’d be making a stink about it…hypocrite much?
11 May 2012, 23:30 pm
@JL1(JL1)-252: you’re concerned about smileys? oh goodness me
11 May 2012, 23:31 pm
@Napier(Napier)-254:
R75mil in the red, loosing 6 games for every 1 they win…….. Quite an institution…. a bankrupt woeful institution never the less!
The KINGS have a positive balance sheet… enough said!
11 May 2012, 23:31 pm
@JL1(JL1)-252: the valke are already benefitting from super rugby, since 2006!
11 May 2012, 23:32 pm
@JL1(JL1)-252: please reveal your source then i will fall back, no issues.
11 May 2012, 23:33 pm
No TRANSFORMATION, JLI pointed out that you put pretty smileys on your posts. You are therefore, you are ‘concerned’ about Smileys.
11 May 2012, 23:35 pm
If I have to explain that financial loss I will be branded a racist. Things certainly have chanced in my old country. Anyone want to buy the old national flag? Have one
11 May 2012, 23:37 pm
Transvaal club rugby is weak and that speaks volumes. Wits aren’t represented in the Varsity Cup. Club rugby in Tvl was a strongold. Those days are now gone. The Lions are basically a cheque book side and soon the cheques will start bouncing.
11 May 2012, 23:37 pm
@hensopper1(hensopper1)-255:
Which stat would the LIONS not be last in at super rugby for the past 11 years clever one?
What exactly are you arguing? Yes the LIONS has been the worst supported team in super rugby over the past 11 years. Even the stadiums in NZ without seating arrangement have been better supported! Go and do your homework plonker!
11 May 2012, 23:38 pm
i seem to recall that the spears are guaranteed 2 years of super rugby. that means in 2013 the playoff to get back into super rugby will be lions against 4th placed SA side – so probably cheetas. this makes sense as it was considered kings would need the certainty to attract players, and the time to develop as a super rugby team.
so kings will play their first relegation match in 2014 if they finish last in SA conference.
sorry for lions fans, but that union is a joke. could the kings really be any worse by 2014?
11 May 2012, 23:39 pm
@IAAS(I am a stormer)-263:
Well said!!!
11 May 2012, 23:42 pm
MEERKATTE
The Kings have a ‘positive balance sheet’, If you ask me their balance sheet has been unbalanced since the border wars. How exactly do you think they have recently cleared up their unpaid depts? By professional excellence throughout their rugby structures?
They are not self sustainable. The Lions are, unless you buy into the media generated misrepresentation of the Guma group attempted takeover under the guise of well meaning investment.
Let the Kings concentrate 1st on winning in the Currie Cup, or even the Vodacom cup. Pointing to the onfield performance of the lions is ridiculous when you look at the true state of EP/Kings
11 May 2012, 23:44 pm
Meerkatte, the support numbers [average crowd and pay tv customers] for the Lions are not the lowest. Check.
11 May 2012, 23:48 pm
We not talking about vodacom cup or currie cup… LIONS will keep there currie cup status… we are talking about super rugby where the LIONS have proven without any shadow of a doubt that they are not capable of playing at that level!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now the LIO)NS being self sustainable?????????????? They are 75mil in the red, they are BANKRUMPT !!!!!!!!!!!!! wake up. How stupid are you?
11 May 2012, 23:53 pm
@Napier(Napier)-254:so they’re an ‘institution’ you say, so i guess they’re entitled to play super rugby indefinitely?
@hensopper1(hensopper1)-261: i’m sure i also wrote words before & inbetween the smileys but he, like you seem to be drawn to only the smileys
11 May 2012, 23:55 pm
@hensopper1(hensopper1)-268:
And i FEEL for Loosing LIONS and There supporters… will unfortunately have to trek to loftus to watch some rugga>>>>>
11 May 2012, 23:58 pm
@hensopper1(hensopper1)-255: do you think in 2006 if the cheetahs had finished last and thus were the team to ge relegated SARU would’ve spent R30 million to destroy the the Spears like they did to save the lions?
R30 million, money that could’ve been used for rugby development was used to corrupt the system & wangle justice, seemingly this type if conduct sits well with you unless it is done by politicians.
12 May 2012, 00:03 am
@hensopper1(hensopper1)-267: please man, their OWN accountants Pricewatershouse said the Lions were R73 million in debt. GumaTac just took that report & presented it in court as EVIDENCE! they did not write the audit themselves!
12 May 2012, 00:03 am
The LIONS without a super rugby budget will never play super rugby again!!!!! there is no way that they would beat the KINGS after 2 Years of super rugby!!!!!!! The only way would be a Super 16. Am afraid this could be the end of the LIONS.
12 May 2012, 00:18 am
The Kings vs The Lions.
Why not combine and make it The Lion King(s)?
Dis amper soos die Kaapse skollie vir die cherie gese het terwyl hy ‘n mes teen haar keel hou en sy gulp aftrek: Choose your weapon, ek gaan jou in elk geval steek.
Six of the one and a half dosen of the other.
12 May 2012, 00:31 am
@nama1(nama1)-275:
Unfortunately, sad times. Some proud Lions supporters still wore their Lions jerseys to work today. And put on a brave face.
As long as they don’t go and support those skollies in Pretoria now.
12 May 2012, 00:47 am
It’s OK. Most (ex) Lions fans are now Sharks fans anyway.
12 May 2012, 00:51 am
@nama1(nama1)-275: and where would they play their matches?
the golden lions, pumas, leopards, swd eagles, border bulldogs & ep kings would have to share the R6.6 million super rugby stipend while the guppys gorge themselves on their own!
12 May 2012, 00:53 am
@wooden spoon(wooden spoon)-277: no.1 is racist darren.scott
12 May 2012, 00:58 am
@wooden spoon(wooden spoon)-277:
The Lions fans I know have better class than that!
12 May 2012, 01:27 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-278:
Maybe we can ask Walt Disney to build them a new stadium.
12 May 2012, 06:19 am
@Meerkatte(phil72)-264:
I don’t think he is making himself a plonker you are !
LAST YEARS HOMES GAME NUMBERS !(PLEASE DON’T ASK FOR THIS YEARS AGAIN AS THEY ARE BETTER EXCEPT SHARKS FIGURES ARE DOWN)
1.Stormer 41,850
2.Reds 33,600
3.Bulls 32,105
4.Sharks 29,140
5.Lions 22,351
6.Waratah 20,493
7.Cheetah 20,187
8.Blues 17,301
9.Rebels 17,141
10.Force 16,201
11.Saders 15,010
12.Brumbies 13,110
13.Canes 10,143
14.Hlands 9,413
15.Chiefs 7,766
12 May 2012, 06:28 am
The problem with these figures is the Lions have been doing bad, and still have decent numbers, there is room for improvement the Cheetas have reached their ceiling. The cheetas cannot improve even if they were winning the super15- that is fact.
12 May 2012, 06:51 am
@umkhonto(umkhonto)-283: the cheetahs can always implement a “BUY ONE GET ONE FREE” ticket sale drive too & they’d push their ‘ceiling’.
12 May 2012, 09:35 am
UMKHONTO.
Nice one. Facts. These morons [transformation and Meerkatt) have no grasp of the facts.
The Lions form a massive proportion of the entire super rugby market. How good would it be if they were even half good? People with no concern for Rugby in SA are making far reaching decisions and these people actively support them. Best to leave them with those numbers to digest, explaining things slowly to these ‘kenners’ is tiring at this time of the morning.
I think the numbers speak for themselves.
12 May 2012, 09:40 am
Transformation.
That is a contradiction in terms. The whole point of spectators is that they are paying customers.
Or do you favour a more North Korean solution. You could also get the supporters you bus in to wave o-ordinated banners.
You are now turning your intelligence towards the Cheetahs Franchise. Leave them alone, they know what they are doing.
12 May 2012, 10:26 am
@hensopper1(hensopper1)-285:i haven’t called you names at any point, but now i’m a moron…good debating skills buster
12 May 2012, 10:36 am
@hensopper1(hensopper1)-286:if all teams slashed their ticket prices like the lions their numbers would look much more rosier too. it’s not rock science!
Lions slash ticket prices
View 81 comments | Comment on this story
2012-03-20 14:08
Johannesburg – Coca-Cola Park will be the place to be on Saturday,
March 24 when the Lions take on
the Stormers in their Vodacom
Super Rugby clash at 19:10.
Tickets have been priced as
follows for the North and
South stands:
Adults:Two-for-one special. Buy
one ticket for R60 and get one free
Students:Two-for-one special.
Buy one ticket for R30 and get one
free
Scholars:Tickets cost R10 each
Tickets are available at the Coca-
Cola Park Ticket Office between
08:00 and 16:00 from Monday to
Friday.
On Saturday at the stadium,
scholars will pay just R10 and
students R15 each behind the
poles.
For those who prefer to sit higher
up in the stands, tickets are priced
at just R35 each – a 50% discount
per ticket for tickets in the East Upper stand.
12 May 2012, 12:50 pm
Transformation.
I apologise for calling you a Moron.
I have a genetic disposition towards Ellis Park.
You are sinking to new lows with the attached ticket promotions. I get your point but please look at the bigger picture here.
My point is that no team should be left ut. Simple. And I have not read one single good reason why this should not be so. It is always easier to break things than to build them in sunny SA.
Cheers, work to do.
12 May 2012, 14:14 pm
@umkhonto(umkhonto)-282:
Super 15 postions
2012 –15th Last
2011 .. 14th 2nd last
Super 14 positions
2010 .. 14th last
2009 .. 12th 3rd last
2008 .. 14th last
2007 .. 12th 3rd last
2006 .. 13th 2nd last
Super 12 positions
2005 .. 11th 2nd last
2004 .. 12th last
2003 .. 12th last
2002 .. 11th 2nd last
Most defeats – Super 14: 13, Lions (2010 might better it this year
Worst points difference – -315, Lions (2010)
Most points against – 585, Lions (2010)
Least attended game:
3,527 for the Lions v Blues at Ellis park (I’m also sure this counted the cleaning, vending and security staff)
Lions on average fill 20 % of their stadium, 50% worse than their closest rival
Home game stats 2010
1. Stormers – 7 at home. Total: 296,674. Average: 42,382. Stadium: 83%
2. Bulls – 7 at home. Total: 240,035. Average: 34,290. Stadium: 66%
3. Sharks – 6 at home. Total: 152,002. Average: 25, 333. Stadium: 46%
4. Waratahs – 6 at home. Total: 145, 227. Average: 24, 204. Stadium: 59%
5. Reds – 7 at home. Total: 159,707. Average: 22,815. Stadium 43%
6. Crusaders – 7 at home. Total: 150,068. Average: 21,438. Stadium: 59%
7. Blues – 6 at home. Total: 106, 400. Average: 17,733. Stadium: 29% *
8. Force – 6 at home. Total: 102, 121. Average: 17,020. Stadium 83%
9. Brumbies – 7 at home. Total: 106,797. Average: 15,256. Stadium 62%
10. Hurricanes – 6 at home. Total: 89,157. Average: 14,859. Stadium 43%
11. Cheetahs – 7 at home. Total: 101,384. Average: 14,483. Stadium: 32%
12. Chiefs – 7 at home. Total: 81,400. Average: 11,628. Stadium 42%
13 Lions – 6 at home. Total: 66835. Average: 11,139. Stadium 19%
14. Highlanders – 6 at home. Total: 35,060. Average: 5,843. Stadium 29%
No tell me again…. Why are they getting chopped???????????????????????????????????????
12 May 2012, 14:20 pm
Forgot
Worst performing team of the decade
2000 unanswered points past 11 seasons
R75 mil in the red
Do you need any more reasons? plonker!!
12 May 2012, 14:21 pm
@Meerkatte(phil72)-291:
And these are all time super rugby records!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
12 May 2012, 14:23 pm
@Meerkatte(phil72)-290:
In any first world country they would have been chopped 5 years ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
12 May 2012, 17:00 pm
The past five years LIONS have managed to win 11 games…. that is averaging 2 a season>>>>>>>>>>
12 May 2012, 17:02 pm
@Meerkatte(phil72)-290:
Your figures are wrong these are the correct ones- Home game averages
.Blues – 24564 (17,301)
Saders – 17501 (15,010)
Canes – 12284 (10,143)
Chiefs – 12013 (7,766)
Hlands – 16063 (9,413)
Waratah – 21858 (20,493)
Brumbies – 13199 (13,110)
Force – 14688 (16,201)
Rebels – 13560 (17,141)
Reds – 33056 (33,600)
Lions – 23599 (22,351)
Stormer – 40315 (41,850)
Bulls – 34343 (32,105)
Sharks – 21571 (29,140)
Cheetah – 23766 (20,187)
12 May 2012, 17:13 pm
@Meerkatte(phil72)-294:
Sorry you only one 10 in the past 5 years before you get to excited and in the same time frame lost 53 games
An Plonker umkhonto, my figures are 100% correct
Ellis park only full when playing soccer. But there will be a lot more of that, because there ain’t going to be no RUGBY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
12 May 2012, 17:53 pm
@Meerkatte(phil72)-296:
Show where you sucked the figures from plonker ?
12 May 2012, 22:31 pm
Sad to lOse a team with so much history but they are pretty awful. That game against the blues they made 1.4 mistakes per min when they had possession. Don’t think kings will do much better. But easy points for sa teams next year as we will get to play them twice so may actually be to our benefit
13 May 2012, 18:11 pm
i think its about time that the eastern cape can get some super rugby cash and maybe keep some players. how its been done has been shocking and that goes to the Lions as well as the Kings. but only a truly myopic supporter could honestly argue that the Lions deserve a S15 spot.
i do think people will be surpised at how the locals will support the team. and the nice thing about the eastern cape is that everyone supports rugby.
the comments about people being bussed in is as insulting as it is misguided. before i moved to the eastern cape and understood how deep the rugby culture runs here i may have made similar comments.
They will get pumped at first, but how will that make them different from the Lions at the moment? Will we give them a decade to “rebuild”?
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