Henry suspected match fixing after RWC 07 exit
29 Jul 2012
Graham Henry believes the All Blacks were victims of match fixing during the 20-18 quarter-final loss to France in the 2007 World Cup.
In his biography, ‘Graham Henry Final Word’, Henry revealed that he contemplated match-fixing as the only logical explanation for the All Blacks’ upset 20-18 loss to Les Bleus.
Henry analysed the game on video for his report to the NZRU and found Barnes had awarded only two penalties to New Zealand during the game. His analysis was that France deserved to be penalised up to 40 times.
His gut feeling, according to his biography, was that the video ‘would confirm that referee Wayne Barnes and his touch judges, Jonathan Kaplan from South Africa and Tony Spreadbury from England, hadn’t exactly covered themselves in glory at the Millennium Stadium, that they had missed an obvious forward pass when France scored its match-winning try – a pass so forward everyone in the stadium had witnessed it except the referee – and that Barnes had been pretty lenient on the French at the breakdowns, probably costing the All Blacks the game’.
Henry’s video had three different angles and featured statistical breakdowns of lineouts, scrums, penalties, tackle counts, territory and possession. On those statistics, the All Blacks dominated. They had an overwhelming 73% territorial advantage, winning 166 rucks to France’s 42 and making only 73 tackles compared with France’s 331.
A mind-boggled Henry was so stunned by his findings, he told the NZRU it should pressure the IRB to institute an inquiry. He also said it was ‘incomprehensible’ that the IRB did not have strategies in place to investigate bizarre matches.
The NZRU chose not to push for an investigation.
188 Comments
29 Jul 2012, 09:44 am
Joke Article.
CTRLC – CTRLV
Thanks Supersport
29 Jul 2012, 09:46 am
So 5 years ago
29 Jul 2012, 09:50 am
Hahaha, yeah right Ted
Faa king whinger !
29 Jul 2012, 10:09 am
This should get him some publicity in SA. Sales of his book to soar
29 Jul 2012, 10:48 am
What a load of tripe. The more skilled, more physical, more astute, more talented All Blacks just could not win. They were a far better team and just didn’t do enough to win. It’s a similar situation with SA vs AUS. Boks should have killed Aussie dead but couldn’t capitalise, despite Lawrence’s poor reffing. All Blacks, with all the **** they got from Wayne Barnes, should have had it in them to have won the game and they just didn’t.
29 Jul 2012, 10:50 am
Wottacock. His AB’s, with their Crusaders-style ruck defense involving two or three offsides forwards at every breakdown, are as deserving of an IRB investigation as this match. They got away with it week in, week out for years, and now he’s moaning about one game? And besides, the general consensus world wide is that Bryce’s SA/Aus abomination was the low point of rugby officiating in the modern era. Not the Great Choke in 2007. So suck it up, Graham. And find a proper angle with which to sell you book.
29 Jul 2012, 11:12 am
Holiha
Bleating kiwis anybody?
Priceless.
A shame a distinguished coach has to s.hit his pants in public like this.
Guess he needs to sell his book.
29 Jul 2012, 11:14 am
Ha! Funny thing is the they barely beat the french in the wc final in nz….that must have been fixed to!!
29 Jul 2012, 11:24 am
@ossewa-8:
That’s all it takes mate, 1 point is enough.
Fact is Barnes had an absolute shocker in this game, but who cares, it’s done and dusted.
29 Jul 2012, 11:30 am
How ironic that the country that gave the world POB should start crying about match fixing.
Rich indeed.
Foie gras rich.
29 Jul 2012, 12:46 pm
Ted will one day sit among angels.
Barnsie will **** among demons.
And as for you lot…………………………………………..Hell would be too good for you.
29 Jul 2012, 12:49 pm
I’m convinced the Chiefs/Crusaders semi was fixed too. I mean, Joubert blew McCaw up for ruck infringements. Surely that’s not in line with the IRB rules? I want an investigation.
29 Jul 2012, 12:50 pm
Yep only explanation could be match-fixing in 2007, Suzie in 95, a butterfly farted in siberia in 99 and there were political troubles in Liberia in 2003.
29 Jul 2012, 12:57 pm
Match fixing? He must have latest RWC final in mind.
29 Jul 2012, 13:08 pm
@cab-13:
95 was a new low in Sports Depravity.
True.
29 Jul 2012, 13:20 pm
@cane-15: Lemme guess, the world’s best caddie, Steve Williams, was also cheated out of the Open Championship caddie title by that dirty Saffa?
29 Jul 2012, 13:24 pm
@>^..^< katman-16:
You calling Ernie a dirty Saffa????
The Big Easy is a giant of the game.
I congratulated him here.
A more gracious sportsman, SA has never seen.
29 Jul 2012, 13:26 pm
I whole-heartedly agree with Graham Henry.
There NEEDS to be a proper system of appeal and review during- and after rugby matches to ensure that the referee doesn’t become a 16th player.
There have been FAR too many potentially brilliant matches marred by incorrect decisions and missed/ignored errors, many of which could have simply been corrected in-game if the TMO’s authority was expanded.
It’s about time!
It
29 Jul 2012, 13:27 pm
is
29 Jul 2012, 13:35 pm
cane 15 – sacriledge.
Titty – where is steggies these days? When are u playing for the bulls again?
29 Jul 2012, 13:42 pm
@cab-20:
Building a fire, Cabby, building a fire.
I’m not gonna be playing for the Bulls any time soon man, I’m too stuffed-up for that by now.
29 Jul 2012, 13:51 pm
larf
29 Jul 2012, 13:52 pm
barf
29 Jul 2012, 13:52 pm
Victims one year beneficiaries the next. What an absolute Jackass!
29 Jul 2012, 13:52 pm
****
29 Jul 2012, 13:56 pm
f a r t
29 Jul 2012, 14:00 pm
@cane-17: What about Uli Schmidt….are you nuts…….
29 Jul 2012, 14:02 pm
” ‘incomprehensible’ that the IRB did not have strategies in place to investigate bizarre matches.”
hahahahaha
hahahahaha
hahahahahaha
hohohohoho
hehehehheehe
hahahaha
is there a single game the cheats play which isn’t ‘bizarre’..?..
love their obstructive blocking, holding on, pinning down, offsides, entering rucks from the sides…on and on ad nauseum….
i suppose it is bizarre they sometimes are called out on it
29 Jul 2012, 14:04 pm
I’m waiting for the all those accusing Lawrence of corruption to come on here and agree with Henry. Where are the hordes?
29 Jul 2012, 14:07 pm
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-27:
“Doktor Schmidt, jou pasiente wag daar vir jou in die voorry” :p
29 Jul 2012, 14:19 pm
@gonzo-29: Bryce se ma se epos man
29 Jul 2012, 14:22 pm
How ironic, Pieter de Villiers could say the exact same thing about the Boks 2011 Quarter final exit. Those Wobblies were pummelled to pieces and kept going backwards and backwards, yet no penalties to the Boks and Pocock was an absolute angel…
29 Jul 2012, 15:07 pm
I like to think that Bryce Lawrence was just incredibly incompetent, and well, maybe just a bit keen to see the boks out of the WC, but hopefully not corrupt. If we sart get corruption and match fixing in rugby then it isn’t worth watching. I honestly don’t believe that international refs are accepting bribes to blow games one way or the other.
29 Jul 2012, 15:23 pm
@mako-33: I’d say, as he was referee of the year, that he was made to blow the game like that.
A stitch up through and through.
29 Jul 2012, 15:26 pm
Can’t believe Henry would go there and ignore 177 French tackles – given that Barnes makes a big mistake per game and the 2011 Final at Eden Park was the most disgraceful piece of referee cheating the world has ever seen; that it was reffed by a South African is neither here nor there – would Henry care to comment on that ruck in kickable distance in the closing minutes where there were FOUR penalizable Kiwi offences – that’s right, FOUR in the one ruck ignored by the ref who even told Jerome Keino, lying on his stomach playing the ball to let go of it – and all the rest of it in the other games – Henry is out of order to write that.
29 Jul 2012, 15:30 pm
@J.B. Cowper-35:
No, that was 76′ at Ellis Park – ” listen boys you can go back to your own country I have to live here”
29 Jul 2012, 15:34 pm
@NZINCHINA-36: “get those jarpies’ email, circa 2005. Bryce’s daddy… no more proof needed who the cheat is
29 Jul 2012, 15:36 pm
“The referee who awarded that penalty [against Bush] came and saw us off from the airport the following day,” Williams remembers. “We had him on about not only that decision but a lot of them he made throughout the tour.
“He said to us, ‘listen boys, you can go to your home, I have to live here’.
“I wasn’t aware at the time that Billy was targeted but generally the decisions went against us because apartheid was at its height back then and the Afrikaaner nation had to be seen to be superior.”
They certainly couldn’t lose to a side that contained Maori.
29 Jul 2012, 15:37 pm
No intelligence here. The opening paragraph is a lie and borders on libel. Read what Lord Ted actually said..
The Israeli is still an awful referee and the worst tj of all time.. Constantly flags non-events to get on TV and generally robs rugby of fair contests. Was the siren introduced because of his incompetence or partiality?
As for Barnes, why he didn’t stay at the Bar, eludes me. The Bokke should have lost two games in the pool during the 2007 Cup, but were saved by his refereeing.
This RWC 2007 will live in infamy as a sus tournament, along with 1985 where the visitors were clearly seen to spew their hearts out at the breaks.
As for 2011, are you telling me that if you had beaten Oz you could have given the AB’s a contest? You barely beat their B team at home. The Wannabes beat you three times in one year.
Winning has become much more difficult for the Bokke since neutral referees were introduced. For South Africans to complain about referees is a bit galling after the hospitality of South Africa in times prior to neutral referees. You were so scared of NZ you would not allow some of their stars to tour and your referees were appalling.
Much of the ignorance above is clearly countered by anyone with a knowledge of the rules. As SA continues to disbelieve the worth of the fetcher and then whinges when the opposition produces one, I have no sympathy for you. Get a life, a fetcher, and like the Shorks, an intelligent coach!
29 Jul 2012, 15:38 pm
@goyougoodthing2-34:
Nah, I don’t think the Kiwi’s would resort to cheating to win the WC. They are good enough to win it fair and square. Brycie got the ref of the year award because there was nobody else to give it to. When Steve Walsh left NZ for Aus, there were no more international quality refs in NZ. A bit of an embarrasment having your ref of the year last year being dropped from the elite panel this year…
29 Jul 2012, 15:40 pm
So JB the worst piece(s) of reffing were in SA in 76′.
29 Jul 2012, 15:42 pm
1949?
29 Jul 2012, 15:44 pm
@mako-40: I beg to disagree.
@AiDoc-39: Yes, I am saying that the Boks would have beaten the chokers in the final, no doubt in my mind.
Pretty irresponsible of the so called Sir Graham, clearly a cry baby at heart.
Both titles are in the past, like his career.
29 Jul 2012, 15:48 pm
Ref bashing after games is a pointless exersize, it isn’t going to change the result. Teams need to adapt to the ref’s interpretation of the rules on the day. Teams that do that best will win. Sure there will always be times when we feel hard done by eg 2011 semi, or 2007 NZ/FR game. No question the refs should be made to answere for shocking performances and they are. Look at Bryce, back to reffing schoolboy rugger…
29 Jul 2012, 15:52 pm
@mako-44: Indeed. To be quite honest, I don’t think either ‘cheated’ but their performances were terrible.
It’s just nice winding people up.
29 Jul 2012, 16:00 pm
@goyougoodthing2-45: He he, you got that right!
29 Jul 2012, 16:06 pm
@mako-46: It’s quite easy, things not to say, in no particular order:
To Kiwis:
Anything about Ritchie laying offside, Crusaders in general, Sir Graham, 1995
To Saffas:
More complicated, it depends which province they support
Sharks: are mercenaries
Bulls: hide under their mother’s skirts
WP: haven’t won a cup
‘Stralians:
Pretty much everything but much more fun when Gregan was around
29 Jul 2012, 16:30 pm
@J.B. Cowper-35:
It looks like ‘Sir Graham’ old age caught up with him, he must have mixed up year 2007 with 2011
Disgraceful indeed it was the 2011 refereeing of Joubert, heir apparent to Tapa Henning, Andre Watson, and that Gert Bezuidenhuit from 1976.
Two of the ABs tries in 2007 exit came actually from double forward passes by McAllister and Carter, a fact which that “wagon load of ******* screaming and yelling” as Phil Kearns once describe them failed to acknowledge
29 Jul 2012, 20:16 pm
He should do an analysis of the 2011 Final and see how many penalties France were not awarded which NZ should have been penalized on..
29 Jul 2012, 20:30 pm
@AiDoc-39: waaa haaa haaa ha ha…ha haaaa haaaaa hhhaaaaaa, whaa haaa ha, ha ha , haaaaa haaa haaaa haaaaaaaaa….ha ha,…..whaaa ha ha aha haaaaaaaa.. sorry…ha…sorry…MWHAAAA HAAA HAA ha ha HAAAAAAAA ha haaaa ha haaa……….
29 Jul 2012, 21:25 pm
@Guns-49:
do you mean like the last kickable penalty of the Final, awarded and missed, that would won France the RWC ?
Amazing how quickly Sth Africans buy in to any and every conspiracy theory going, but only when it excuses their own teams ineptitude, but then laugh off the only irregularties that are actually based on fact (1995 poisoning, 2007 no-penalties QterF) because they serve the opposition.
Its almost as lame as always referring to negative opiinions held by
@>^..^< katman-6:
“the general consensus world wide” as if everyone was as bitter and twisted and conspiracy obsessed as Sth Africans and shared their innate inability to simply acknowledge the opposition as better.
Couldnt score ONE try in 80mins vs Aus and yet the Safas would have us believe that “the general consensus world wide” was that they were robbed. Actually the general consensus, World wide in places like Wales & Samoa, is that SA were lucky to escape their pool and were bundled out in 8th place and not before time.
29 Jul 2012, 21:52 pm
@J.B. Cowper-35: You don’t know yet what Henry wrote about the 2011 final. If his book is consistent with his comments after the game, he’ll probably acknowledge that NZ should have lost in 2011 but should have won vs France in 2007. That’s sport.
His comments in the press release seem to be past tense – his initial reaction was match fixing. I’m sure he’s moved on by now but needs to put it all out there in his book. Not sure about you lot but I’ll be reading it – I quite enjoyed Woodward’s and White’s books and can’t wait for Henry’s
29 Jul 2012, 22:43 pm
Henry loses any dignity he once had with these claims especially in light of how his team ‘won’ last year’s final, doesn’t he realise most outside NZ say the same thing about that game? he would have been better advised to keep his counsel, but the bitter old boot can’t help himself.
29 Jul 2012, 22:56 pm
haha, whattajoke.
the kiwis scored off a forward pass vs france in 2007 and act all p i s s ed that france did the same like its only a nz privelege?
its quite silly but when its all you got i guess you use it.
29 Jul 2012, 23:47 pm
@AiDoc-39:
Good post. Some of these dipsticks wont get it.
@kyer-50:
Oh here is one of those dipsticks.
@Big Hit-53:
Shhh your team, drinks,take drugs, swap balls illegally and field 16 players at RWCs. You have no say.
29 Jul 2012, 23:49 pm
@rangerman-54:
Again you seem to have forgotten that France infringed most of the game and didnt get penalised or one free kick against them. The same reasons you guys are crying about over 2011. So pull ya old wrinkle face out ya a$$ and read what is exactly said here
30 Jul 2012, 01:24 am
@Big Hit-53: “but the bitter old boot can’t help himself”
That just seems a bit Pot & Kettle
30 Jul 2012, 02:43 am
@AiDoc-39:
Poorly disguised anti-Semitism, just itching to call Jonathan Kaplan a ‘Jew’, weren’t you, AiDoc? Please take your rubbish and racism elsewhere, you sad little individual.
@gonzo-52:
I guess the jury is out on Henry and his ‘consistency’, we’ll just have to wait and see, but I’d be amazed if he commented on the poor refereeing that gifted NZ the Eden Park final in 2011.
30 Jul 2012, 03:11 am
Would be interesting to hear what Henry has actually said. If all he has said is that he considered at that time that match fixing might be a possibility, then you couldn’t blame him given that the statistics (the things you can’t argue with) make that game almost unique in modern international rugby history. If that was a cricket match the international board would have had people studying every ball afterwards to look for evidence of match fixing. I don’t think it is that crazy for Henry to have reviewed the match in detail and question what happened. It might be more crazy for us all to assume that match fixing could never happen in rugby.
Given the way Henry normally handles himself in the public arena, it is quite possible that the media spin is not truly representing what he has recently said, or at least putting the most controversial spin on it that they can.
30 Jul 2012, 03:20 am
I love threads like this, it gets all the neanderthals frothing and fuming about the injustice of the fact their team was NOT good enough to advance past the 1/4 finals, so it must have been a conspiracy.
hilarious… the poor wittle Saffas, no one likes them
guess if your backs cant pass and catch the rugby ball with the tryline open, then you dont deserve to win…
but you can always blame cheating, coulrophobia (doot dooot doodle oodle doot doot do), travel disadvantage, POB, Sir Bryce, Global warming, crowd attendances, the price of oil, terrorists, Jihad, crusades, the invention of aeronautics, the cold weather, anything really, except the fact your talent isnt all that, and you dont have a thinking man behind your team..
all is good in the land of the Gold Yellow Cup AND an almost 80% all time win record…
30 Jul 2012, 04:30 am
@SA rugby is k@k-60:
hahahahahaha…………..did you just read what your “sir” Ted….(Now theres a faaking joke….why do kiwi’s want to knight everyone when they dislike things English ?) … just complained about???
Faaaak me, conspiracy, biased ref’s, so-called fwd passes, food poisoning, crime, alcohol, saffa chicks, jeez the list goes on with your whinging.
Prime doos’s
30 Jul 2012, 04:31 am
oh yeah, have you check out how the world loves you c ock suckers?
30 Jul 2012, 04:51 am
@whatever-62:
Strange, we still have so many South Africans coming over, like yourself.
Oh and dont for one minute think you guys are the most loved in the world.
30 Jul 2012, 05:08 am
Anyway this is a biography.
This is what they suppose to be like, its what Henry thought and went through.
I would feel ripped off if i bought his book only to find out the RWC 2007 part was skipped in his book or lied about. Its what he felt and it was a major part in his life, so Henry has bought it up in his book, which he is entitled to do.
One thing he did was approach NZRU about was the fact that refs can call a bad game against a team and not get looked at. He asked NZRU to go to IRB and ask the questions and give facts that refs should be judged on games etc. NZRU did pi$$ all with it really. Now if they did do something, maybe Bryce would not have called such a **** game but then you would have probably lost the British and Irish lions games as Bryce did you guys a huge favour in those tests.
Point is refs should be judged. Refs should be warned to pick their game up or lose out on the big internationals.
Refs need to be held accountable for shocking calls.
30 Jul 2012, 05:13 am
@whatever-61:
So you guys dont complain about crime, Bias refs, cheating, conspiracies, Kiwi girls, Australia, The English, The weather, Other countries stadiums, Peoples Biographies , Kiwi player leaving for money or different career……. you think you have a list, i only just pulled this list from the last 3 days blogging here.
30 Jul 2012, 05:58 am
@Hurricane-64:
“Refs need to be held accountable for shocking calls.”
Too right, Hurricane, but I don’t recall a flurry of NZ complaints when kak calls went against the French in WC Final 2011 and basically cost them victory.
Which suggests you lot are no better than any other ref whinging nation, whinge when calls go against you and your team, offer deafening silence when you and your team is the beneficiary.
So, why don’t you step down from your holier than thou pedestal as your hypocrisy slip is showing?
30 Jul 2012, 06:36 am
@Joe Maher-66:
Joe you are way of course here with your allegations against me.
Nowhere did i mention that we have NEVER complained about refs.
But you do have a point about complaints against a ref from a winning team.
Yet your post suggests we are the only one that dont complain when we win,. even after the ref somewhat giving us the rub of the green.
But we can go on forever here but as i recall no one complained about Bryce when he botched up the reffing against the British and irish lions,actually in the boks favour. How about the TMO calling on a call that TMOs are not allowed to, that was fair according to you guys.
You should have seen 2007 RWC on here after the ABs lost. Barnes had a cracker of a game according to the Bok fans.
So Joe, practice what you preach with the pedestal mate
30 Jul 2012, 06:55 am
@Hurricane-67:
If you’d care to read my post before getting all defensive, I did not suggest Bok fans were any better. I said “…which suggests you lot are no better than any other ref whinging nation, whinge when calls go against you and your team, offer deafening silence when you and your team is the beneficiary.”
Those ‘other nations’ include ALL nations. South Africa, too.
Sorry. I was probably wrong to have a go at you, my emotions fired up by your compatriot AiDoc’s anti-Semitic bullshite directed at Jonathan Kaplan. Kaplan’s religion has nothing to do with his reffing, unless your mate AiDoc is suggesting – as I supect he is – that Jewish people are conniving cheats.
If you know him personally, tell him he’s a prize tool, living in the dark ages of Shakespeare’s Merchant of Venice. Tell him, too, that his dim-witted anti-Semitic and racist comments are best kept to himself and his fellow rednecks.
30 Jul 2012, 07:06 am
How precious are all the Kwee’s now! This is hilarious; a wind up even. The bitter old clown can’t keep his gob shut after having all sorts of games handed to him by that poisonous weasel PoB. Even scuttling to his hotel to apologise about poor reffing of the AB’s in a game they won! How precious is that? He should just shut up and get on with playing the game – oops that is how NZ plays it – refs on side and all.
30 Jul 2012, 07:18 am
@AiDoc-39:
You sound like you have issues with Jews my little kiwi bigot?
Your boy should keep very quiet about match fixing and redding comspiracies.
It’s the only reason you have a world cup right now.
If the IRB had any balls POB and his chums would be answereng some very unpleasant questions right now.
Schtum.
30 Jul 2012, 07:54 am
what is anti semitic?
what do you call people who dislike italians ot porras?
no need for the jews to get special terms
they are humans just like the rest of the people
30 Jul 2012, 07:56 am
This story from Graham Henry sounds very plausible as the same thing happened in 2011.
Match fixing could be a genuine problem in rugby World Cups, it happens in cricket why not rugby.
Both games (NZ vs France ’07 and SA vs. Aus. ’11) the best team lost because the ref had more influence on the game then what should be the case.
30 Jul 2012, 08:05 am
@Hurricane-67: It is only your sick mind that would insist on a try given to you when that pass was 1 meter forward and everyone saw it . Is Sean Fitzpstrick your dad?
30 Jul 2012, 08:58 am
@BreakdownBoy-72: Comment of the year.
Well said.
30 Jul 2012, 09:06 am
Watched an interview with Henry about the comments in his biography.
After the loss his analysis pointed toward something rather odd and went to the NZRU and even sounded out some IRB officials over whether there was any mechanism to review the game, like there is in Cricket.
The answer he got was no, and he was urged to let it go.
This he did, and he is thankful he did so, because he accepts if he had bitched to the media like Laurie Mains did, he would not have been re-appointed AB’s coach.
This is his biography, surely the vehicle to express his honest opinions, or should he make up new opinions based on what is politically correct.
30 Jul 2012, 09:15 am
@BreakdownBoy-72: SA /Aus there was no match fixing – how many times did SA drop the ball over the line – they just could not finish ( simple )
30 Jul 2012, 09:29 am
@stew-76:
Danie Rossouw cost SA the lead in that match through a reckless lineout infringement.
Had Semo fallen badly after having his legs taken out from under him jumping for the ball, Rossouw would have been marched.
The penlty was kicked and Aus managed to hang through to the end.
30 Jul 2012, 09:45 am
seems henry and PDV have more in common than I thought…. I have immense respect for what he has achieved, but I do not believe there was any considered effort to deny the ABs, and I do not believe bryce lawrence intended to influence the outcome of the SA Aus match either.
Henry’s admittance is actually a blight on him i think, Just as PDV should just shut up and forget about it too.
30 Jul 2012, 09:46 am
@Brads-77: Our general inability to finish with so much possession cost us the game. That doesn’t mean it wasn’t also the most flagrantly awful reffing I’ve ever seen.
I wonder why Henry doesn’t question the multitude of instances where the AB’s have benefited from their own forward passes being missed?
30 Jul 2012, 09:50 am
@Brads-77: Nah we lost it because of not being able to put the Aussies away with that amount of possession we should have buried them. Cant lay the blame at Danie’s door even though what he did was stupid.
30 Jul 2012, 09:53 am
So which was it?
A His analysis?
B Or his “gut feeling”?
C Or is he full of s.hit?
I’ll take C please Bob.
30 Jul 2012, 09:57 am
@Atreides-79:
NZ have lost before and won as well due to marginal or outright misses by the ref and his assistants.
However, what got Henry’s goat is summed up by the observation of French rugby journalist Ian Borthwick. “Sports journalist, Ian Borthwick says it was extremely bizarre how suddenly France became the most disciplined team in the history of international rugby.”
30 Jul 2012, 10:00 am
@the artist formerly known as gunther-81:
I am not saying he is right, I am saying he is expressing his memories of what went through his mind at the time.
30 Jul 2012, 10:02 am
@stew-76: true. in all instances one can argue, the players could still bring it back from wherever. Breakdown Boy is making the point – what the point is being made about. apart from the rest of the issues. we need to big brother the refs. watch them day and night and report all of them if they’re wearing leather jackets.
30 Jul 2012, 10:03 am
@Brads-82:
French Journalist?
you fibbing tosser.
He’s a kiwi who writes for a French newspaper (L’Equipe).
What a lag.
30 Jul 2012, 10:04 am
@Joe Maher-68:
All Good Joe.
Your points are spot on really. Refs need to be better.
Better ref, better game.
@the artist formerly known as gunther-81:
There is a D.
D : we dont care what you think.
30 Jul 2012, 10:04 am
last i checked rugby is still considered a sport…
these things happen…
sometimes teams play above themselves and sometimes teams have the perfect game…
any time south africans have complained about reffing… and shown video evidence of bad calls, we’ve been labeled whingers and told to suck it up…
oh the irony…
all this proves to me is the arrogant sense of entitlement that graham henry possesses…
30 Jul 2012, 10:04 am
@Brads-82: Don’t get me wrong, Barnes performance was woeful! But it happens to ALL teams eventually.
A lot of posters here are quite comfortable holding 2 opposing viewpoints simultaneously ie: when it happens to their teams, there’s fury and outrage and heads must roll, but when it happens to the opposition, suddenly ‘that’s just how it goes’, ‘stop whining’ and ‘suck it up’ etc…
30 Jul 2012, 10:06 am
@Skeppie-80:
I agree with your view, however I like to throw that snippet in when ever I read comments that Lawrence was the entire reason for SA losing.
Just like RWC07. New Zealand failed because we lost our mojo. The AB’s of 2006 would have destroyed France.
30 Jul 2012, 10:07 am
south africa will be trialling the extended use of the TMO in our currie cup this year…
hopefully this will be the beginning of the end of the wrong calls being made…
30 Jul 2012, 10:08 am
@Hurricane-86: Hurricane, top of the morning. What do you make of all this?
30 Jul 2012, 10:09 am
@Brads-89: I agree 100%, I suppose when you are playing such a vital game sometimes that killer instinct to attack get’s supressed and you end up letting a team that has no posession and has had to make 5X the tackles in.
30 Jul 2012, 10:10 am
Let’s not forget that SA were well used to losing to Aus by the time they got to the tournament. I seem to remember that it was their 4th consecutive loss to the Aussies, so it was hardly a result that no one expected.
30 Jul 2012, 10:10 am
@Brads-83:
No buddy.
First he talks about “careful analysis” then he talks about “gut feeling”.
Which is it?
Because they are very different things.
he felt he had enough to institute an enquiry, he talks about opne collusion between ALL THE MATCH OFFICIALS.
This goes much further than anything Divvie moaned about.
He should share the fruits of his analysis.
Or go down in history as a cracker.
30 Jul 2012, 10:14 am
@aliboy-93: What bearing does gthat have on anything? All that matters was the game itself, are you saying that because they beat our C team in the Tri Nations prior to the WC they deserved to beat us in the QF?
30 Jul 2012, 10:16 am
@Skeppie-91:
Well Skeppie its done and dusted in my opinion. People on here need to realise that this is what GH went through at that stage of his life,it called Biography.
But refs need to be sorted out as well.
Not because of NZ and France or SA and OZ games. There have been alot of others that just not good enough.
Its scary mate cos the game you loved for so long and followed comes crashing down with reports of match fixing.
We all know refs are human and make mistakes but too many mistakes that benefits one side needs to be reviewed and if found out to be suspect…..ban ref for 3 months or some sort of punishment.
Lets fix this game of ours and actually fix the rules to help refs as well.
30 Jul 2012, 10:28 am
@the artist formerly known as gunther-94:
What are you on about? I never compared Henry to PdV.
You are making up scenarios.
He did the analysis, as he and every half decent coach does after a game and based on those stats, his gut feeling was the only explanation was match fixing.
That said, there was next to no way of proving that at the time, and even less now.
So as I said in an earlier post, these are his memories of how he felt following the loss to France. Surely honesty is what you should expect from an authorised biography, not some pale sanitised version of what is politically correct.
I doubt very much that he has stated anywhere in the book he still firmly holds the view that Barnes, Kaplan and co are corrupt.
30 Jul 2012, 10:33 am
@Brads-97:
“I doubt very much that he has stated anywhere in the book he still firmly holds the view that Barnes, Kaplan and co are corrupt.”
well what exactly is he saying by opining that he suspects matchfixing and going on to say barnes should have pinged the french 40 times…?
i reckon barnes should lawyer up…
30 Jul 2012, 10:35 am
@Brads-97:
no.
analysis and gut feeling don’t go together at all.
if he did all this analysis where is it?
surely this is the time to share?
tell me more about this frenchman Ian Borthwick?
@Hurricane-86:
you obviously do care or you wouldn’t waste your time telling me you don’t
30 Jul 2012, 10:35 am
@Hurricane-96: That’s my worry….I can accept that rugby will always have that human reffing element and at one time or another everyones team is going to get the rough end of the stick but GH’s comments paint a scary picture. I never noticed that Barnes was that rough on the kiwi’s, to me it was only really the forward pass but I guess it went quite a bit deeper than that. I would love to know his thoughts on our QF with the Aussies.
30 Jul 2012, 10:38 am
also…
how are henry’s allegations of match-fixing not bring rugby into disrepute…??
players get nailed for bringing rugby into disrepute…
wonder if the same rules apply to knighted ex-coaches…
30 Jul 2012, 10:39 am
Henry’s problem boils down to the fact that he has two different definitions of game manipulation. If he perceives it to have happened to the detriment of his team, he describes it as match fixing. But if it happens to the benefit of the AB’s, it is considered to be the inevitable fulfilling of destiny. And therein lies the problem, not in the so-called penalty count or forward pass.
30 Jul 2012, 10:40 am
@the artist formerly known as gunther-99:
hahaha
Damn he seeing right through me.
30 Jul 2012, 10:42 am
@ufo-98:
he doesn’t blame Barnes only.
But all the match officials.
They will certainly be examing their legal options with a view towards relieving the Hobbit Cracker of a large portion of his World Cup Bonus.
I expect the IRB to have a look too re bringing the game into disrepute.
And if we are going to have a match-fixing tribunal then POB will be in the spotlight.
With any luck Henry will be developing the game in Guam by the time this has played out.
30 Jul 2012, 10:43 am
This thread is juicy enough to bring Blackpanty out of purdah.
30 Jul 2012, 10:45 am
@Skeppie-100:
exactly skeppie…
a keo blogger… can’t remember who now… did just such an analysis on the Bok/Aus game and detailed 29 (i think) incorrect or missed calls… he wrote it up and even gave the time of each call…
at the time not a single AB supporter on keo accepted it… all went on about saffas just being whingers and unable to accept defeat…
so it’s fascinating now to see henry’s comments… which strongly echo the saffa comments then… being defended now…
ironic indeed…
30 Jul 2012, 10:46 am
@ufo-98:
So – you have read the book and he still says he “suspects” as distinct from at the time “suspected” or some other similarly.
30 Jul 2012, 10:47 am
@Skeppie-100:
Actually today i was listening to sports talk back at work and this was bought up about GH bringing up match fixing.
Alot of the listeners actually mentioned the Bok and Ozzie game as despicable .
So there are alot of Kiwis that are not happy with the game as well.
A fix need to happen quickly
30 Jul 2012, 10:48 am
@the artist formerly known as gunther-104:
yeah… i suspect barnes, kaplan and co will retiring to the caribbean shortly…
30 Jul 2012, 10:51 am
@ufo-106: You know how it goes, when your team is on the back end of a kak reffing display you “see” everything but if you watch a game as a neutral sometimes you don’t really notice the bad calls. I didn’t think the 2007 was that bad but clearly Barnes did a lot worse than missing just one forward pass. Same with our QF, the problem was the consistency of the bad calls as opposed to just one or two bad ones. Geez I really hope it’s all just down to a bad day for the refs and not something else…
30 Jul 2012, 10:51 am
@ufo-106:
Absolute rubbish.
You are embroiling me in your accusation that I believe the match was fixed.
Point to my post please..
30 Jul 2012, 10:51 am
@ufo-106: That man was a referee and he ONLY DID THE FIRST HALF of that game, and gave up with the analysis.
Which was, and remains, spot on.
Henry may or may not be right, the point is the SA guys have just as much room to moan, however neither side will admit it – especially not Sir Graham.
Pity he ended with such a poor biography, if I had bothered to read PDVs I could compare them
30 Jul 2012, 10:53 am
@ufo-106:
Listen to the garbage you are spewing out.
So you think not one Kiwi believed Bryce had a shocker.
You sure you want to run with that?
OK so in 2007 when we were told stop crying, we lost fair and was told that Barnes had a good game.
So 2007, you made the bed. 2011 time to sleep in it.
30 Jul 2012, 10:53 am
@Brads-107:
of course i haven’t read the book… neither have you i ‘suspects’…
but when when you’re delving into semantics to bolster your case… well… …?
fact is… as reported… henry has said the abs lost due to matchfixing… period…
he’s always looked like a sourpuss…
now he’s proved it…
30 Jul 2012, 10:58 am
@Hurricane-113: you think the french should take their “fair play award” from GH in light of these mumblings about him thinking their team might’ve won through “match fixing”?
30 Jul 2012, 10:58 am
@ufo-106:
But Henry brings the linesmen into it.
With talk of conspiracy and match fixing.
This is a new level.
30 Jul 2012, 10:59 am
In future Henry shall be referred to as Dame Graham Henry… for being such a girl
30 Jul 2012, 11:01 am
@ufo-114:
Wrong again.
He doesn’t say anywhere that he believes (present tense) the games was fixed.
You can piss and moan as much as you like about symantics, but that is what is at issue and I am supremely confident than my take on what is written is closer to the mark than anything you insinuate
30 Jul 2012, 11:03 am
@Transformation-115:
Yep and suppose they should give it Barnes or how about Bryce?
What do you think?
30 Jul 2012, 11:04 am
Basically, if you want to publish allegations of match fixing – if you even want to use the word – you’d better have a hefty dossier of evidence at hand, with another copy lying on a police captains desk with a big fat case number on it. Otherwise you deserve to be kicked in the nuts in a civil law suit and publicly castrated by the IRB.
30 Jul 2012, 11:04 am
@Brads-118:
kak.
he said he believed the game was fixed.
NZRU told him to drop it and he did to keep his job.
where does he say he has since changed his mind?
30 Jul 2012, 11:06 am
@Hurricane-108: Well either way I just hope it is what it is and we don’t have something more nefarious on the go. It does seem a bit of a stretch that match fixing would be at play in a rugger game.
30 Jul 2012, 11:06 am
@the artist formerly known as gunther-121:
You find the comment where he says he still believes it and send it to Barnes, Kaplan and co.
There will be a reward!
30 Jul 2012, 11:07 am
@>^..^< katman-120:
I am sure match fixing was published last year as well.
So keep still while i kick you in the V@gina
30 Jul 2012, 11:08 am
@Skeppie-110:
exactly skeppie…
funnily enough at the time… and now still… i don’t blame our loss on bryce…
we were ahead and danie stuffed up in the line out.. which JoC converted… that and a few other mistakes cost us the game… despite bryce… we still could and should have won…
@Brads-111:
you’re getting paranoid bud… the only thing i said about what you believed is that at the time all kiwi bloggers believed saffas were just whinging with no grounds to do so…
i did not say you believed the match was fixed… i did say it was ironic that you’re all defending henry for exactly what you castigated us for…
and that IS ironic… no…?
@Hurricane-113:
hehehe…
read what i said bud… you all said we were whinging… not one of you said ‘well… maybe you guys have a case here…”
@goyougoodthing2-112:
yeah… i have long said that reffing is simply not up to standard… and something should be done… most matches i post beforehand that i hope the ref doesn’t have an overbearing influence on the result… it’s the ame for all teams…
but henry belated like a stuffed sheep is alleging that the all blacks are the victims…
if henry wanted to raise this subject with any credibility and dignity why did he not showcase other matches such as the SA/Aus game f=to make the point that generally reefing is bad…
but he’s so intent on being the victim instead of the using his ‘vast knowledge and experience’ to try and sort the problem out…
30 Jul 2012, 11:11 am
@Brads-123:
nononono.
that’s not how it works.
he left the match fixing accusation hanging in the air like a **** in an elevator.
unless he specifically says he believes it not to be the case anymore it still stands.
Are you really this thick or are you just pretending?
30 Jul 2012, 11:11 am
@Skeppie-122:
I can’t lend myself to believing rugby at the RWC level could be fixed.
30 Jul 2012, 11:14 am
@the artist formerly known as gunther-121: to think Sanzar formed a commission of enquiry when pdv suggested alain rolland & barnes were handing victories to new zealand to promote their world cup…i wonder what the IRB would’ve done to Ted for these allegations.
30 Jul 2012, 11:14 am
@the artist formerly known as gunther-126:
Of course he still believes it, why wouldn’t he, nothing has happened to change his mind.
But he doesn’t say that anywhere, so no law suit.
How hard is that to grasp.
30 Jul 2012, 11:15 am
@Brads-118:
now you’re looking really silly…
henry has accused the people of match fixing… spin it any which way you can till you fall over… them’s the facts…
@the artist formerly known as gunther-116:
this really is funny…
for years the ABs and Aus fans have mocked saffa fans for pointing out bad calls as believing in conspiracy theories… now the most famous AB coach of all time has allegedly stolen our alleged songsheet… and is bleating a very unbecoming tune…
30 Jul 2012, 11:16 am
@Transformation-128:
Teddy has let the cat out of the bag.
@Brads-129:
he made the accusation.
it’s there in black and white.
30 Jul 2012, 11:17 am
@ufo-125:
lol
Match fixing….no i believed there was no match fixing. But maybe i am hoping there is no match fixing. Do we really want to be cricket and not believe the outcome was real?
Scary stuff
Useless refs…. yep i believe in those.
I here about useless refs every week on here so they must exist
30 Jul 2012, 11:18 am
@Brads-123:
well.. if this is all untrue and such words never passed the lips of graham henry… or are printed in his book… he should lawyer up… and nail the news agencies for making false allegations about him…
BTW… have you read the book…?
yes/no
30 Jul 2012, 11:18 am
@ufo-125: You know the funny thing is…ask me what games I remember when the Boks go the smooth end of the reffing stick and I won’t remember one. I sure as hell know it’s happened but would never pick it up….do they call those blinkers?
30 Jul 2012, 11:19 am
@Transformation-128:
That was to sanction a current SANZAR official who was making a jackass of himself bringing the game in disrepute.
Henry is no longer directly linked to SANZAR and I doubt very much we will hear support fro his view from the NZRU.
Hansen for one has distanced himself. Albeit, using the phrase “I have moved on” much favoured by Henry.
30 Jul 2012, 11:20 am
@Brads-127: I agree, I just don’t think rugby is an easy sport to fix. If Brycie actually had been bought at the end of the day if the Danie incident at the lineout had not happpened the boks would still have won. It just does not seem feasible to me.
30 Jul 2012, 11:21 am
@Hurricane-132:
yeah… we don’t wanna go there…
so what are our choices here bud…
1 useless refs…
2 match fixing…
3 everything’s perfect…
30 Jul 2012, 11:25 am
@Skeppie-134:
hahaha…
we’re all the same bud…
30 Jul 2012, 11:28 am
@ufo-137:
I pick #1
30 Jul 2012, 11:29 am
and guys…
let us not forget that after bryce’s horrific performance against the boks last year…
new zealand rugby awarded him the referee of the year trophy…!
so lets not kid yourselves than anyone in new zealand really believed he had done a less than perfect job…
30 Jul 2012, 11:30 am
@Hurricane-139:
me too…
sanzar really needs to address this…
hopefully this extended TMO duties in the CC will start sorting this out…
30 Jul 2012, 11:31 am
@ufo-140:
Lets not forget the perfect job he did for the Boks that not one of you guys ever mention against the British and irish lions.
30 Jul 2012, 11:33 am
@Hurricane-142:
Oh smiley face
Cos i only heard he gave you guys the rub of the green in that series…….. i really cant remember
30 Jul 2012, 11:33 am
@ufo-133:
Read the book – no.
but don’t I believe it possible, irrespective of what he may still think happened, that Henry would have allowed his biography to go out with “specific” words which actually accuse Barnesetc of match mixing..
30 Jul 2012, 11:34 am
@Hurricane-142: It’s like I was saying earlier I never really pick up on refs when they blow teams playing against the Boks out of the water, I think I just get too caught up in the game. (Although it obviously happens) I didn’t really notice Brycie helping us during the BL tour?
30 Jul 2012, 11:36 am
@Brads-123: Are you claiming that he used to believe the match was fixed, but no longer does? If so, where is the quote or evidence of this apparent change of heart? Because without that, his original accusation still stands. Doesn’t take a legal genius to figure that out.
@Hurricane-124: Yes, by emotional fans on online forums, you nincompoop. Not by the coach of the All Blacks in a book. Must I explain the difference to you?
30 Jul 2012, 11:38 am
Old Gerty = Barnsey
30 Jul 2012, 11:42 am
@>^..^< katman-146:
And a legal genius our Bradley is not.
I’d like a match fixing tribunal personally.
Paddy O’Fuckwit will be the first on the stand.
30 Jul 2012, 11:44 am
@Brads-144:
so you’re just like us bud…
pissin in the wind…!!
allegations/accusations/insinuations… semantics… seriously…
ask yourself what you’d think and feel if your name was barnes or kaplan…?
“And I still can hear him say:
You’re all just pissin’
in the wind
You don’t know it but you are.
And there ain’t nothin’
like a friend
Who can tell you
you’re just pissin’
in the wind.” – neil young…
30 Jul 2012, 11:44 am
Of all the cheating refs old Gerty is still my favourite, he’s the only one stupid enough to admit it.
30 Jul 2012, 11:51 am
@Skeppie-136: You’d possibly need to bribe more than the ref…perhaps a captain who turns down shots at goal in a kickable position during knock-out rugby. Perhaps a coach who substitutes his captain after 50 minutes.
30 Jul 2012, 11:55 am
@>^..^< katman-146: I’m pretty sure I saw an article where Henry said the match fixing was what went through his mind first but he since decided it probably wasn’t the case. I’ll have a hunt for the link.
I half wish he hadn’t brought it up but let’s there’s less racism, political interference, or administrative bumbling in NZ so Henry’s bio would be a little dull without some controversy. I hope this doesn’t get dragged out like Suzie for 20 years
30 Jul 2012, 11:58 am
In perspective, Walsh gets the final this week and I am glad. Not because he is a great referee who picks up mistakes, forward passes, knock-ons and such, it’s because he misses all of them, equally.
In 2007 he managed to miss the skullduggery which lead to Habana’s try which ripped out my heart and many will say he also managed to see a try at the other end some minutes before which was not a try.
He is just human. So, I’d rather go with his rubbish than an efficacious, whistle-happy Barnes, Joubert and the like. All of whom seem to bow to local pressure.
I just hope he blows equally poor or good both ways on Saturday, I don’t think he’s a cheat.
I cannot say the same for Bryce, as kiwis can’t say the same for Barnes.
30 Jul 2012, 11:59 am
@gonzo-151: Yeah exactly it’s not really feasible. In cricket they can easily manipulate the side bets for no balls or wides etc but it doesn’t seem possible to fix an entire rugby match
30 Jul 2012, 12:30 pm
@>^..^< katman-146:
Not quite clear if this is a direct quote or paraphrased. Or if the last part if tacked on for legal reasons.
“He momentarily let the thought of match-fixing enter his mind before dismissing it.”
Henry solely blames the ref but i think most of NZ accept we were unlucky with injuries, rotation/resting were overdone, and we choked to some degree
http://tvnz.co.nz/rugby-news/referee-barnes-thorn-in-graham-henry-s-side-4992772
30 Jul 2012, 12:47 pm
The more I think about this the more I think we should insititute a board of enquiry.
Lets start with “Get the japies” and Crooked Paddy and work our way down to Brycie and last years World Cup.
30 Jul 2012, 12:48 pm
@the artist formerly known as gunther-156: And we might as well chuck in Bakkies and his silly ban against the Lions.
30 Jul 2012, 13:03 pm
And dont’t forget the rampant drug abuse in South African schools…
30 Jul 2012, 13:09 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-158: Don’t genaralise mate.The problem is mostly confined to Afrikaner-based schools in the Free State and Gauteng areas with Pretoria and Bloem leading the way in this regard.
30 Jul 2012, 13:15 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-158: Fark me, to sit through the last couple of seasons of Brumbies rugby, drugs might have been the only option…………
30 Jul 2012, 13:31 pm
What’s all the fuss about. There were dozens of accusations of match fixing on this very forum after the 2011 RWC (some even repeated in this thread), so why is it such an issue that Henry mentions that the same thought crossed his mind in 2007 after a game that is statistically unique in modern rugby history?
Was funny listening to the radio earlier today when they were interviewing one of the selectors from the referees selection panel for the 2007 RWC. After saying how wrong Henry is with his comments, and praising Barnes as a fine referee and all around good guy, he finally had to admit that their own post match ‘audit’ showed that there definitely was a forward pass for the French try and that there were multiple off sides by the French that should have been penalised. Sort of leaves the question as to why Barnes didn’t get the same treatment as Lawrence (who I agree should not be reffing internationals)?
30 Jul 2012, 13:53 pm
@stormerforlife1-159: Yeah, that we know of. Would not be at all surprised if it’s not all over other areas as well.
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-160: Yeah, yeah, yeah if it wasn’t my birthday today I’d take exception to your comments, mate!
30 Jul 2012, 13:54 pm
@stormerforlife1-159:
He’s talking slab out the Tik abuse at your Alma Mater.
30 Jul 2012, 15:37 pm
@the artist formerly known as gunther-156:
Not that it will ever happen – because the very people who would control such a thing are the guilty parites themselves – but I agree with your sentiment 110% – and let’s make a clean sweep of it starting with Clive Norling’s 1981 handover of a win to the All Blacks in 1981 in the 8th minute of injury time with a 10-yds x 3 penalty that put them in front of the posts for a “winning” kick – if they did it then they could do it now … anbd they did and everybody knows it including Richie and the other protected players wearing black.
30 Jul 2012, 16:34 pm
JB should we go back to 76′ with old Gerty and the 70 tour?4
30 Jul 2012, 16:50 pm
Shame ol’ Bullfrog Henry. I think you will find that 4 years later the Ref was equally “lenient” on the ABs at the breakdowns that allowed them to win the RWC 11 (by 1 point).
While I do agree the missed forward pass in 07 was shocking, Henry cannot complain about refs! His Ab team won a few games they shouldnt have due to Refs missing infringements and the apparent blindness that refs have for McCaw.
Now Henry knows how the rest of the rugby world feels most of the time! Should we go back to 3Ns 2010 where the Boks and Wallabies were averaging 6 & 7 penalties per yellow card, and the ABs something like (I dont want to exaggerate) over 20????
McCaw getting a “final warning” in the “red zone” 3 times?!
Good to know at least one Kiwi knows the feeling of wondering if a match is fixed.
30 Jul 2012, 16:59 pm
@bokfan1-166: How many times should someone be penalised for headbutting before they are yellow carded?
30 Jul 2012, 17:01 pm
@J.B. Cowper-164:
should we include the 76′ tour and Gertygate in your clean sweep ” ja listen boys you can go back to your home I have to live here”
30 Jul 2012, 17:04 pm
@bokfan1-166:
no we all know the feeling all tours to the republic pre 92 were fixed, no brown skin and cheating refs just ask old Gerty.
30 Jul 2012, 17:12 pm
Let’s get Paddy under oath sharpish.
And Papa Lawrence.
Could be looking at some time here.
30 Jul 2012, 17:15 pm
@the artist formerly known as gunther-170:
dont forget old Gerty
30 Jul 2012, 17:16 pm
Nothing worse than a bent ex copper.
30 Jul 2012, 17:19 pm
Its only fair that Gerty would start the proceedings.
30 Jul 2012, 17:31 pm
They always do the hardest time.
The ex coppers.
Them and the kiddy fiddlers.
30 Jul 2012, 17:46 pm
Something that I do remember from that NZ / France game was that Barnes had the balls to referee Richie McCheat et al appropriately in that game.
It destroyed the All Black game plan because they knew no other way. They should have adjusted and made an attempt to play within the laws. They were too good individually and collectively than the bunch of confused looking shell-shocked All Greys, that day.
I do agree that
*Barnes and his assistants missed the forward pass (when has a game involving Kiwis never involved a few?)
*The penalty count was unfairly and unjustifiably stacked against the All Greys that day (now they know how it feels)
With all of that being said, the Kiwis did not dominate. They were just confused and plained old fashioned choked.
30 Jul 2012, 17:48 pm
@NZINCHINA-168:
Yep – include Gerty if you like – SA refs don’t have a spotless record (arguably) … but it pales in comparison mate to NZ favouritism, particularly in the McCaw era – unbelievable double standards managed by Paddy, Graeme and company.
And Henry complaining about it is like Joe Stalin getting on his soap box and shouting the odds about human rights – just ridiculous.
New Zealand rugby is so magnificent and so is its history – but this is a blemish.
30 Jul 2012, 21:03 pm
I think we should take heed from what all the Sth Africans say about match-fixing and cheating referees.
They are, after all, the experts.
Every Sth African I know still praises Hansie Cronje, whilst calling the greatest rugby player of the modern era ‘a cheat’.
30 Jul 2012, 22:24 pm
@The Donkeys Egg-177:
South Africans respect the following:
Dan Carter
Mils Muliaina
Kieran Read
The Franks brothers
Wyatt Crocket
Tana Umaga
Jonah Lomu
Jeff Wilson
Christian Cullen
Frank Bunce
Ian Jones
and many other great All Blacks.
Ritchie McCaw, like his ancestor Sean Fitzpatrick, brought nothing but shame to the pride of the black jersey.
It’s good and well to love yourself, but if everyone else in the world thinks you’re a worthless cheat, then perhaps you’re not “the greatest player of a generation”.
31 Jul 2012, 01:54 am
@The Donkeys Egg-177: You definetly do not know a lot of South Africans! Your cohort is extremely small!
@YoMama-178: Good post. How did he get IRB player of the year in 2009. Was totally overshadowed by a very young Brussow. I do not say Brussow should have gotten it , but certainly not McCaw
31 Jul 2012, 03:08 am
@Brads-82: the funny thing is the French WERE the most disciplined team of the last decade, it all changed under Laporte where France became a disciplined rugby nation and had fewer red and yellow cards than any other team.
If Henry had bothered to check that he would have found that out, but no, it’s easier to go with his bias and the idea he had been cheated. Well he’s only cheating himself now, he’s gone in a lot of people’s estimations.
31 Jul 2012, 04:41 am
@YoMama-178:
Why bother making the distinction between who “Sth Africans respect” and “everyone else in the World”, when we all know theyre one and the same.
Go select your team of gougers and then try and tell us the one about the 2 most successful players EVER vs Sth Africa having “brought nothing but shame” on the AB jersey.
31 Jul 2012, 05:34 am
Quite interesting to note that Kiwi coaches will hold the World Cup, Tri Nations, Six Nations,Super Rugby, Currie Cup, ITM Cup, Heineken Cup.
Nz produces the best coaches and this is one of the main reasons that gives Kiwis that edge.
31 Jul 2012, 05:40 am
@the artist formerly known as gunther-156:
I think you skipped something.
How about starting at poisoning and gold watches.
@YoMama-178:
So you dont respect two players which of one is probably the most successful captain ever, but you will wear armbands for head butting and eye gouging. How about your old coach, he like eye gouging, we all know its not ballet and they dont wear tutus. You think McCaw has bought shame to the AB jersey lol. Jealous much. You guys would love to have him in your team.
Now we will tell you who has bought shame to the AB jersey cos guess what….its our jersey, not yours. Look at your own team before judging the rest
31 Jul 2012, 05:46 am
ah big tittys. funny that the French conceded 10+ penalties per game during the 2007 WC yet inexplicably only conceded 2 vs NZ in that 1/4, and then in the semi against your side were back out to 10plus?
that 1/4 is only matched by SAs semi final cheating in 95.
we’re world champions, all you sour fckers can complain all you like, its sweet irony, and Im loving it.
31 Jul 2012, 05:50 am
@Big Hit-180:
You crawl out your hole and expect us to listen to that??
You seem to be protecting Barnes here. Ask how useless he was when the Boks lost in Ozzie a few years after the RWC 2007.
The guys here called him pathetic.
Barnes reffed badly, although i think he is alot better,still loves being center of attention.
But strange you have made your way onto Keo when its a kiwi that is in the spotlight….the bad spotlight, then in wanders BH.
31 Jul 2012, 05:52 am
@SA rugby is k@k-184:
2007 RWC was rigged.
Are we allowed to say that or is it too close to the copyrighted version of the South African song…The RWC 2011 was rigged?
31 Jul 2012, 05:58 am
Hurri
no we can’t suggest it, only those who lived off that 1/4 for four years are able to do that
funny now that they feel aggreived it’s somehow different? lol sweet justice I say, couldn’t happen to a nicer mob really.
why didn’t they go for the drop kick? why couldn’t they catch the ball with the tryline open?
I think they choked, like their cricket team normally does.
lmfao though, the level of paranoia these poor, conspired against Saffas have make Roswell look normal.
31 Jul 2012, 07:29 am
@SA rugby is k@k-187: LOL. You are enjoying this,aren’t you.
Have your say
You must be logged in to post a comment.