What Bismarck’s loss means
21 Aug 2012
RYAN VREDE writes that Bismarck du Plessis is the most significant of all the Springboks’ injuries to date and further erodes the hope of them winning the Rugby Championship.
I wrote at the time that I didn’t believe the absence of Schalk Burger, Jaque Fourie, Danie Rossouw, Bakkies Botha and Fourie du Preez (who was courted for a Test return) among a clutch of uncapped players (Duane Vermeulen and Johan Goosen for example) would be terminal to the Springboks’ cause against England. There were competent replacements available who subsequently got the job done. Neither did I feel it would hinder them against Argentina last week, even with Pierre Spies and JP Pietersen added to that injury list.
It was their unavailability against Australia and New Zealand that most concerned me, although I still believed the depth was sufficient to beat the former and mount an appreciable challenge against the Blacks. But Du Plessis’ loss is a hammer blow. To understand it’s significance you have to take into account the tangible and non-tangible impact.
Technically he is the most complete hooker in the game. He is a brutal defender who has also grown as a breakdown scavenger in recent years. Indeed Heyneke Meyer highlighted this as amplifying his value, especially in light of the absence of a specialist openside flank. On attack he is a force at the gainline, a constant source of go-forward. His work-rate in both these facets of play is unmatched by any hooker on the planet (I know this because I’ve seen the Springboks’ analysis of all their competitors in this regard). Furthermore, his set piece work is excellent.
Away from the technical competencies, his game intelligence and temperament under pressure has improved markedly, as has his discipline, which was a point of concern early in his career. He has also become an accomplished leader. Meyer’s estimation of him in this regard has grown to the point where he had considered him for the captaincy. Finally, his experience will be sorely missed. Forty six caps into his Test career, Du Plessis’s presence at crunch times would have been a boon for a youthful and largely inexperienced Springbok pack.
Seldom will one player’s absence be decisive to the outcome, and I’m not suggesting Du Plessis holds such sway at this point in his career. He was, however, the heart and soul of the side and embodied every quality Meyer sought in his players. He has the capacity to galvanise those around him through the standard he sets. He is a match winner.
His replacement, Adriaan Strauss, is a fine player but he isn’t in Du Plessis’s class. That said, Strauss faces a decisive phase in his Test career, where his success or failure will have a significant bearing on the Springboks’ fortunes. In the context of their game plan he is an important cog. His lineout feeds will come under the microscope and with the Springboks’ rolling maul being one of their primary weapons, Strauss’s accuracy will be central to their ability to set this in motion. It is also a facet of play where the Springboks have traditionally had the edge over the Wallabies and Blacks.
In addition Strauss will have to rein in his fondness for lurking in the loose. It is a strategy that suits the Cheetahs’ approach but the Springboks will need him to get stuck in at ground zero in the coming Tests.
In Monday’s press conference in Mendoza Meyer described Strauss as world-class. That offering and other examples of his professed faith in him is not lip service. He has an extremely high regard for the player, whom he brought to the Bulls as a youngster and whose loss he deeply lamented when he returned to the Cheetahs. Strauss owes it to himself and Meyer to take the opportunity that now presents itself.
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579 Comments
21 Aug 2012, 10:52 am
Excellent player, he will not let us down…..luck has given him q shot in the big time that polotics excluded him from for quite a few seasons. In my opinion anyway. I still remember him covering for gary botha when injured seasons ago as a youngster regularly only to go to the junior wc and take a backseat to chilli. Ironically, chilli played the bench role for the bulls (sic) and strauss moved to the cheetahs.
21 Aug 2012, 10:53 am
I would consider Bismark’s loss a possible reason to start re-considering the inclusion of someone like Heinrich Brussouw again.
Depending on how Strauss can be made to duplicate Bismark’s role, and how our current loose forwards can improve their breakdown performance.
The fact remains, however, that Brussouw’s presence won’t improve our breakdown performance on our own ball, provided that the existing players can up their execution in that regard.
But Bismark is a vital cog in our breakdown game, nevertheless, and his loss is going to be huge.
One thing is for sure, though. With Bismark gone, there’s no way we can start with Keegan Daniel anymore. We simply are too short of physicality in our pack.
21 Aug 2012, 11:11 am
Bismark or no Bismark,Boks wouldnt have won Rugby Championship although his presence would have helped Boks be more competitive and keep scores down away from home.
Kick kick kick Execution over Innovation…..
21 Aug 2012, 11:12 am
Strauss is a dom player. Always looks for contact when he has the ball (to be fair, that is a South African problem, not just him) and loses it far too often in contact – see past Saturday in second half. In a 5 min period he twice took the ball while deep in Argentinian half, went into contact and lost the ball.
Of the current 3 hooker in the squad, I’d play Burden. At least with him aounr something might happen – and no, I’m not a Sharks supporter.
21 Aug 2012, 11:16 am
@Tacitus-2:
I agree on Daniels, but he does bring more to the table than Spies (in everything but the lineout).
Just in case you think Spies would be better
Personally, I think Coetzee could be used at 8, with Alberts at 7, with Brussow at 6.
21 Aug 2012, 11:16 am
@gecko-4: Strauss is a good player. He is often the first player to support the ball carrier and almost always gets over the advantage line. Loosing the ball at break down is also often due to the supporting players not arriving and cleaning out fast enough. Agree, he is no Bismark, but no other hooker on the planet is.
21 Aug 2012, 11:17 am
@mshiniwami-3: with Bismarck and Alberts in the same pack Meyer’s ‘bashing’ gameplan had a chance to succeed but Willem can not do it on his own. Should he get injured too then it’s curtains.
21 Aug 2012, 11:18 am
@gecko-4:
I am a Sharks fanm, I can tell you Burden is some way off being an international hooker.
His linesouts are good, but not great. And that alone is a major issue.
His scrummaging is also average (again, not bad, just not great).
21 Aug 2012, 11:18 am
I,m pretty sure carter kicked more than the boks did last weekend. It,s just that the ozzies missed takles and the argies did not. The argie defence was huge.
21 Aug 2012, 11:22 am
5. What game were you watching, daniels brings nada to a test like last week, anyone who honestly thinks that daniels offered more tha spies does even when not on form needs their head checked.
Daniels does some things well, but for me its from the bench for specific games.
21 Aug 2012, 11:23 am
@Big Hit-7:
I’m really worried Meyer believes he’s going to have 4 years to build a team. The bottom line is this.
If we don’t see results by the end of next year, he’s gone. PDV only kept his job because of 2009 3N and B&I Lions results, both of which were in the balance until the final minutes of both deciding mathes.
He can’t afford to ‘build’. We have a core group of players already (Bismark, Alberts, Bekker, Eben, JPP, Frans Steyn). I also think we don’t have the forwards (or the scrumhalf) to play our kicking game from 2009/10. For this reason, Morne cannot be in any long term plans. Lambie and Goosen are the 2 10′s we need to focus on.
I hope Meyer proves me wrong, it is very very early days
21 Aug 2012, 11:25 am
@Big Hit-7:
Thats a problem in its self when gameplan is so limited. Add the fact that with a gameplan SO attrictional with OVER emphasis on physicality(where players WILL GET INJURED MORE) and add the fact the forward pack absolute dominance theory is a FALLACY these days especially in test rugby.Its not sustainable not unless you produce the FREAKIEST physical athletes of the same class in THEIR DROVES because they WILL get injured.Alberts is injury prone as is,now Bismark is out,
Add Morne and Hougaard kicking down the throat of Beale,Oconnor,Dagg,Jane and co…was never gona work.Whichever way you look at it.Can sneak a test here and there.but 70-80% win ratio? Ppfffffttttt not a chance.Total rugby or BUST
21 Aug 2012, 11:27 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-10:
I disagree.
Daniels hits and cleans out more rucks than Spies. His defense is better (Spies slips a huge amount of tackles). His play with ball in hand is better. I could go on. Do I think Daniels should be there? Maybe not. Should Spies? Hell no.
Spies is however, brilliant in the lineouts.
If you had said,”Daniels doesn’t fit into Meyers gameplan’, then I would agree with you 100%.
21 Aug 2012, 11:29 am
Would play Brussow and Bismarck in tandem and scare the **** out the Aussies and Kiwis at the breakdown….
But that boat has sailed thanks to HM sizeist theory.
Best we get Brussow fit and back into Boks a sap…..
Just because Pocock out for 3 months doesent mean Hooper wont cause mayhem at the breakdown.
Amazing that Aussies squad contained 3 proper opensiders….Kiwis have 2 in theirs….Boks not 1 in sight…..
Is everyone else wrong and we right? Especially crazy when we have 1 of the worlds very best ….ask Sharks and Stormers who were drilled by Brussow a few weeks ago…
21 Aug 2012, 11:30 am
@londonshark-11:
Mate even that 2009 team kicking won but it was UNSUSTAINABLE. too limited,but even then under Pdv there was an emphasis on playing wider and converting,scoring tries…Especially after the exprience of 2008 where Boks played wider,mixed it up with success on EOYT.
in 2010,2011 PdV regressed,felt pressure and decide to bank on kicking up/unders and got duly punished.
21 Aug 2012, 11:31 am
@mshiniwami-12:
100% agree. I’m not sure we want to be kicking on Dagg and Jane.
Tactical kicking is vital in test rugby. We just don’t do it very well (Morne included). I’ll say it again. Without FDP, Morne is pretty average. In 2010.
21 Aug 2012, 11:31 am
@londonshark-11: Cant believe the belief that now the whole international season is lost now that Bismarck is gone …. Yes a good player but heck he isnt your flyhalf or key points scorer and imo Strauss is an excellent replacement … stop looking for excuses time to man up little Bokkies
21 Aug 2012, 11:33 am
@grant10-14: Apparently the world has gone back in time and you dont need a fetcher – wish somebody had told everyone else
21 Aug 2012, 11:34 am
@mshiniwami-15:
I’m with you. But what many people fail to realize, is how good FDP and Morne were at placing those bombs on a tee. That’s the only reason it worked. We also had Matfield to steal 50% of all opp ball. So we could kick more, and get it back.
But those days are gone. I would stick my neck out, and play Lambie at 10 this weekend. Why not?
21 Aug 2012, 11:34 am
Strauss, while not in Bismark’s class is a good player.
I’m more concerned about Strauss’ replacement.
21 Aug 2012, 11:35 am
Bismarck’s injury could lead to Deysel returning to the bok fold at 7.
Like Bismarck, he does contribute to the turnover. It could help offset this loss, while his form against the Lions was good.
Oz leg loose trio?
6: Coetzee
7: Deysel
8: Alberts
Maybe a tad bit on the slow side, but at least retains physicality while adding a bit of groundwork.
21 Aug 2012, 11:35 am
12….well, puff divies running game of 2008 with a vastly superior set of players in 2008 wasnt to flash was it. In fact, the only reason we stayed in the games in nz was because we kicked more in those games.sure we crushed the ozzies in our lat match but the ozzies already had their away win and were lining up the kiwis for the trinations decider the following weekend with us playing for pride. Teams playing for pride at the end of a tournament almost always get the win.
21 Aug 2012, 11:36 am
@stew-17:
Stew, I assume you just asking my opinion, because I never said Bismark was key to us winning anything.
Bismark is a huge loss. It’s like you guys losing McCaw.
21 Aug 2012, 11:37 am
@mshiniwami-12: mostly agree, I think the old school Meyer gameplan could maybe have worked if SA had all their best forwards available but as you intimate an injury-free pack at test level is unrealistic so it’s ultimately doomed to fail.
@londonshark-11: yeah bottom line is his gameplan has to change, but I’m not sure Meyer is capable of coaching in any other way.
21 Aug 2012, 11:38 am
this bok pack cannot get any smaller.
or rather should not.
21 Aug 2012, 11:39 am
@ali-21:
Heck no
We would get murdered on the deck, even more so with Bismark gone.
With the players we have in Arg, I would play Coetzee at 8, with Alberts and Kolisi on the flanks.
21 Aug 2012, 11:40 am
@stew-17: Intergral part of the tight five where one would like to dominate in order to create pressure and thereby creating oppertunities to score. So yes he is a big loss…..class dismissed.
21 Aug 2012, 11:41 am
@ali-21: Hooper will have a free lunch at the breakdown…
Players like Marcell Coetsee and Kolisi are wonderful prospects….at 7 or 8…
They are being used out of position at Boks, Stormers and Sharks….
Brussow, F Louw are ‘ real ‘ opensiders….1 of them should be in Bok mix at all times….regretfully Steggmann seemed to struggle taking the step up…
21 Aug 2012, 11:42 am
@londonshark-23: No was just stating the obvious – and imo i dont think Bismarck is as crucial to the Boks success as McCaw ( Bismarck has a long way to go) … I am sure he will get there god willing but at the moment you do have good replacements
21 Aug 2012, 11:43 am
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-27: But you have adequate replacements
21 Aug 2012, 11:44 am
@londonshark-26: @grant10-28:
Understand the distinction, and yes it would be a free lunch for the opposition at the breakdown. But in terms of Heynecke’s preferences, it could happen.
21 Aug 2012, 11:47 am
@stew-29:
Cool cool.
I think he is as important to us. He’s the best hooker in the world by a country mile, and effects more turnovers than most full time fetches.
Off topic, I’ve been very impressed with how McCaw has changed his game. He’s a much stronger runner with ball in hand these days. Should keep him in the side for at least a few more years.
21 Aug 2012, 11:49 am
And stop pining for Du Preez Matfield etc ITS F*CKIN OVER..They were well below their powers last year,and the fact Matfield didnt return and Fourie refused as well is tantamount to them KNOWING they arent good enough to recreate those performances.
So trying to recreate their “clones” in players with a COMPLETELY different skillset in Bekker & Hougaard is not only FLAWED,its downright COMICAL.
21 Aug 2012, 11:50 am
@ali-31: I am not sure what Brussow has done to warrant this ‘ shunning ‘ from HM…..HM always had Steggmann in the Bulls mix….not sure why he seems to have this new found Damascus Road experience that now seems to see him shying away from the classic opensider….especially when Hansen and Deans are going the exact opposite route…
I remember in 2009 when Deans said that the Boks were a completely new threat with Brussow there….
Also Brussow has won 4 matches he started against Kiwis….
Look at his impact against Sharks at the Tank…and in Bloem against Stormers….he murdered the opposition….never heard Marcelle or Kolisis name those games…..
Crazy to leave him out…..
21 Aug 2012, 11:51 am
Look so long as refs don,t blow pockcok or mccaw for any illegal play at the breakdown, as far as i am concerned….the debate concerning an out and out opensider is irrelevent.
People also forget that mccaw and now hooper sre physically large players, also an important consideration and a reason why brussouw may not be in favour. Few can deny that since the laws withregards to riding the tackle and releasing the player have change, brussouw has never been as effective as before.
21 Aug 2012, 11:51 am
@londonshark-32: I dont know how he keeps going , most mortal men would have died years ago. Yes very impressed and always makes yards which is crucial to getting on the front foot. I was also impressed with him at no8 – really does cover for Read in this position now
21 Aug 2012, 11:53 am
@londonshark-32:
McCaw is now effectively a hybrid more leaning on the side of a BLINDSIDE who is very good on the ground as well.
Tremendous ability and professionalism from him to realise his “gifts” at breakdown especially speed were dwindling either with age/change of game rules-nuances etc but he STILL is relevant as he added to his skillset.
Amazing feat.
21 Aug 2012, 11:55 am
@Big Hit-24: Indeed. Which is WHY Heyneke’s rather stubborn refusal to even contemplate a Plan B is infuckingsano. Tweak a plan to fit with the players available.
Shotputters don’t run the 100m’s for a reason…
21 Aug 2012, 11:55 am
@grant10-34: HM believes the law changes negate the role of a fetcher, unlike under the previous laws when he and Ludeke played an uninjured Steggies.
21 Aug 2012, 11:56 am
@Big Hit-24: I think he is, given he was in charge of the Stormers 1999 pack which played differently. It’s more that Meyer needs to evolve his mindset; he certainly is very intelligent for a rugby coach
21 Aug 2012, 11:58 am
@mikeybrass-39: I dont agree with HM at all….
Pocock out for 3 months….I bet the Aussies go with either Hooper…or Gill…both classic opensiders….and not bigger than Brussow…
21 Aug 2012, 12:03 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-35:
Current IRB Player of the Year Thierry Dusuatoir is 1.88m 100kgs.
This guy is 10 times the player 110-115kg behemoths falling over themselves in this Meyer self styled atrriction over innovation gameplan
Micheal Hooper is not LARGER by any stretch 1.82m 100kgs
Brussow 1.81m 104kgs (Pocock 1.84m 105kgs.Sam Cane 1.88m 104kgs)
3 to 4 cms is negligible
So please shelve that nonsense.
21 Aug 2012, 12:06 pm
@mshiniwami-37: Please get it right – McCaw is now effectively a god – bow down you lesser mortals.
Do agree with your analysis
21 Aug 2012, 12:07 pm
I have never seen Brussow bullied because of his ‘ inferior size’….
But hell I have seem do some bullying!
The guy turned the entire B Lions series on its head…..
And destroyed the Kiwis in 2009….
Anyway…I am sure HM will bring him back for the Aussies and Kiwi leg…
21 Aug 2012, 12:07 pm
@grant10-41: A classic loose trio consists of an annoying terrier at 6, a brute of a mamooth at 7 and a reasonable skilful yet strong-as-an-ox no 8.
That means Brussouw at 6, Alberts/Burger/Kolisi (depending on availability) at 7 and Coetzee/Duane/Daniels (again depending on availability) at 8.
21 Aug 2012, 12:08 pm
@grant10-34: Meyer never picked Stegmann. Stegmann made his Super rugby debut in 2008 when Heyneke was at Leicester. The first effective fetcher Meyer picked was Wikus van Heerden. He was probably SA’s first fetcher, but he was also a good carrier and also an extra lineout option.
Brussow in my mind is also a good carrier, good defender, but not a lineout option. Do not be surprised if Heyneke picks Brussow when he is back from injury as I think Bismark is the reason he was not picked. Bismark is not as good a ball carrier as Etzebeth, Alberts or Coetzee, but it is the best part of Strauss’ game. Now that you have a better ball carrier in the front row we can afford to play Brussow.
21 Aug 2012, 12:09 pm
@grant10-44: Give HM time. Brussouw will be back by the end of next year’s championship for sure.
21 Aug 2012, 12:10 pm
@Horings-46: Old Wahl Bartmann was our first fetcher in the post-isolation era.
21 Aug 2012, 12:10 pm
@grant10-28: First off, welcome back
Louw hasn’t played any rugby this NH season, he’s in pre-season, moreover he’s unproven at test level. Besides the Boks problem was losing possession on their own ball (due to inefficient clearing out) not winning possession – of which they won 60% against a strong Argentina pack.
21 Aug 2012, 12:11 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-9: the argie defence was prepped by graham henry to target our one-off runner who stupidly always want to islate themselves and crashball.
i wonder if our coaches actually watched the ab vs argie 14 final where the argies were fiery @ the breakdown and frustrated even the abs…
21 Aug 2012, 12:11 pm
@stew-43: That is certainly how the refs see him.
21 Aug 2012, 12:12 pm
@stew-43:
Hahaha he is a very good player and more so PROFESSIONAL
Umaga did it 3 times tho…from wing to 13 then to 12…All position he was WORLD CLASS.
Bow down
21 Aug 2012, 12:13 pm
@Horings-46: hey, agile-t.its told us that meyer CONVINCED stegmann to come to bulls from grey!
21 Aug 2012, 12:14 pm
@mikeybrass-45: Agree Mike….I have really enjoyed Kolisi and MarcelleCoetsee emergence this year….
21 Aug 2012, 12:15 pm
@grant10-54: Anyways, there is almost nothing better than seeing Brussel Sprout annoying the cr*p out of those sheep shaggers.
21 Aug 2012, 12:16 pm
@Transformation-50: No. Our coaches are only watching re-runs of the 2007, 2009 and 2010 Super rugby finals as points of reference.
21 Aug 2012, 12:16 pm
@Transformation-53: Probably true. Heyneke did have some fetchers in the junior set up, but he picked Wikus and Kuun as fetchers in 2007 before he left. Before 2007 we had loose trios such as Leonard, Pedrie and Wasserman. Wasserman also had the fetcher skills, but he was also a ball carrier.
21 Aug 2012, 12:16 pm
@Big Hit-49: Yes…I know …F Louw in same position as R Pienaar….and guess what???
Yes…Ruans there !!
21 Aug 2012, 12:18 pm
@grant10-54:
Kitshoff
Coenie
Etzebeth
Kolisi
Coetzee
Goosen
Rhule
Jordaan
Sithole
SA has some young freakish talent coming through
21 Aug 2012, 12:21 pm
Got to run.
If I was God:
With the players we have:
Ruan to 9.
Hougie to the wing.
Lambie to 10.
Coetzee, Alberts and Kolisi as our loose trio.
None of the above will happen though
21 Aug 2012, 12:25 pm
@mshiniwami-59: Absolutely….I attended both the semi and final of junior WC…brilliant talent ….we should have no excuses…
21 Aug 2012, 12:26 pm
@mshiniwami-59: PSDT
that you forgot him lol
21 Aug 2012, 12:26 pm
I was very mpressedmwith thenargies at the breakdown i think they will cause both the antipoden sides plenty of trouble.
Withregards to meyer…in layman terms he needs to get thisnsidemof mismatch newbies andinjury fillins to crawl and walk before they can run and fly. A simple plan well executed will get more mileageg
21 Aug 2012, 12:27 pm
@londonshark-60: Kolise never went on tour…will be playing for WP weekend…
21 Aug 2012, 12:30 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-35:more PORKERS!!!
“People also forget that mccaw and now hooper sre physically large players, also an important consideration and a reason why brussouw may not be in favour. Few can deny that since the laws withregards to riding the tackle and releasing the player have change, brussouw has never been as effective as before.”
1.82m 97kg michael hooper
1.81m 104kg heinrich brussow
1.84m 105kg david pocock
1.87m 106kg richie mccaw
so tell us again, why isn’t heinrich “riding tackles” well anymore, is it his SIZE?
21 Aug 2012, 12:31 pm
@sharks_lover-62:
Oops my bad yeah PSDT freakish too
Juan Smith reincarnation
21 Aug 2012, 12:32 pm
@Transformation-65:
Ungakhohlwa uDusuatoir
21 Aug 2012, 12:33 pm
@grant10-58: I would think it is more important for a forward to be battle-hardened and ready than a substitute back.
Meyer would need to see how Louw was playing before selecting him, he can’t make a blind pick in such a key position.
21 Aug 2012, 12:33 pm
@mshiniwami-66:
yup with more speed and height, eish
21 Aug 2012, 12:36 pm
@Big Hit-68: excuses….Ruan has been in SA for weeks now….F Louw could have been as well….
For me both Brussow and F Louw would be key players in my Bok squad….
with Brussow first choice…
21 Aug 2012, 12:41 pm
@londonshark-60: For the backs I 100% agree, Hougie is not cutting the mustard at 9 but hell he is a good player! With Pienaar and Lambie as halfbacks, Fransie and JDV as our centres, Hougie and JPP as our wings and possibly a Taute coming through in months to come, we have the makings of a seriously good backine! Throw Goosen and Englebrecht into that mix and the future looks bright
21 Aug 2012, 12:41 pm
Kepu , Aussie 3 , also out injured….
21 Aug 2012, 12:42 pm
@sharks_lover-69: He just needs to prove he is as hard! Juan Smith must be one of the hardest men to play for the Boks. If PSDT can apply that mongrel he will be a great
21 Aug 2012, 12:47 pm
Very interesting Ryan, I must say! Bizzie is a good hooker but at the same time has a penalty count higher than the empire state building as well as being a walking yellow card. So, having him in the team comes at a cost. Then you mention that though these injuries means SA won’t win the rugby championship. What a crock of ****? We were never going to win it! The strategy adopted by HM is old fashioned and easily read by the competition. The Boks need some centres and a quality fetcher before they can win anything.
21 Aug 2012, 12:49 pm
@greegs-74: Some centres? Presuming by this you do not rate Fransie and JDV?
21 Aug 2012, 12:50 pm
Make no mistake – Bismarck is a big loss. But Strauss is a more than capable replacement, as shown on Saturday.
Makes a lot of meters and good technique in protecting and presenting the ball in the tackle.
Good set pieces.
Very good discipline, does not give away penalties.
21 Aug 2012, 12:53 pm
@grant10-70: Flouw played in John Smit’s “Barney’s Army” team, how could he not be available for the Boks?
Barney’s Army:
15 Percy Montgomery, 14 Brent Russell, 13 Matt Banahan, 12 Marius Joubert, 11 Joe Maddock, 10 Butch James, 9 Mark McMillan, 8 Shaun Sowerby, 7 Francois Louw, 6 Julian Salvi, 5 Victor Matfield, 4 Jason White, 3 Faan Rautenbach, 2 John Smit (captain), 1 Martin Scelzo
16 Pieter Dixon, 17 Danie Mienie, 18 Rob Linde, 19 Hottie Louw, 20 Rory Kockott, 21 Stephen Donald, 22 Stefan Terblanche, 23 Heimar Williams
21 Aug 2012, 12:55 pm
@willievz-76: Only thing is the loss in terms of breakdown skills…Strauss is a good player and his first phase work and carrying skills are top notch but we will lose something in terms of the breakdown. This will affect the loose trio balance.
21 Aug 2012, 12:55 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-35:
Sien die manne EET jou vandag op hierdie post!
21 Aug 2012, 12:59 pm
@Transformation-77: yes….this when the damn useless Stormers Suits were unable to sort out a loan deal for F Louw….I was spitting mad!!
21 Aug 2012, 13:00 pm
@ Skeppie – I don’t rate either of the centres. We desperately need Jacque Fourie back in the mix and honestly not sure who else at this stage. In my opinion, both now are too slow and only area they OK at is defence… Can’t we bring Danie Gerber back? I’d also play De Jong before Frans….
21 Aug 2012, 13:01 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-35:
1. Review Brussouw’s last three matches against the Bulls, Stormers and Sharks;
2. Brussouw MOTM awards in 2 of his 4 matches played against the All Blacks.
In terms of these perspectives please re-evaluate your statements in terms of physicality and effectiveness.
21 Aug 2012, 13:01 pm
F Steyn
JPP
That is the best Bok centre pairing, if all fit.
21 Aug 2012, 13:02 pm
In fact, what we looking for is a Richard Kahui type player…
21 Aug 2012, 13:03 pm
@greegs-81: Phew I agree with Jacque Fourie…he is class but Frans and JDV for me are also great centres. Neither are slow, in fact they are probably two of the quicker centres in world rugby
21 Aug 2012, 13:03 pm
@Transformation-65:
Length and body mass says nothing of a players attributes: Judge a person by his performance on the field.
21 Aug 2012, 13:05 pm
@greegs-84: Minus all the injuries…if possible.
21 Aug 2012, 13:07 pm
@grant10-70: a player needs some game time to be test ready (not sure how you can dispute this?) – particularly a forward and Louw wasn’t eligible to play for any SA province.
Moreover since the RFU have to pay for player release the AP are tight about clubs releasing foreign players for test duty, the SARU would have had to pay for any early release.
21 Aug 2012, 13:09 pm
@willievz-79:
hy lieg!!!!!
21 Aug 2012, 13:12 pm
@Palooka-86: read my post in CONTEXT with what Brig van Zyl was saying which is this: “People also forget that mccaw and now hooper sre physically large players, also an important consideration and a reason why brussouw may not be in favour.”
he uses this rubbish as reasons why brussow is perceived as ineffective by heyneke meyer!
klomp kak if you ask me
21 Aug 2012, 13:13 pm
@grant10-72: Wobs are going to get well beaten at the weekend. Just on Brussow as your first choice, isn’t he injured? at least that’s what I read.
21 Aug 2012, 13:23 pm
@Big Hit-88: I accept it would be better if F Louw was actually playing….thats a bit of a no brainer….fact is I would have him in Bok mix, Brussow would be first choice but certainly now with Brussow out I would have F Louw ready to start….not ideal, obviously, but thats the price we pay for losing key staff to overseas clubs….
It is a money problem, for sure….
But that dont mean we [ Boks ] are the poorer for missing out on Louws services……again we are happy to make a plan for R Pienaar but not F Louw….I would try get both in the mix…
21 Aug 2012, 13:24 pm
@Transformation-90:
Agree- sorry for missing the CONTEXT.
21 Aug 2012, 13:27 pm
@Transformation-89:
apologetically….I don’t carry the latest android app for players height and weight stats on me.
never the less……does mccaw, etc ….not look physically larger to the eye or not?
does brussow still effect as many steals now as he did in 2009?
what is so difficult to understand? I rate brussouw and carrying an out and out fetcher definately does effect the mental confiedence of your backline in my opinion as I argued for many seasons before steggers at the bulls.
however, the fact that he does not effect as many turnovers (albeit he may well still slow down plenty of ball) added to the fact that not only is he not a viable lineout option but diminutive altogether in the lineup at the lineout and given our inexperienced and limited lineout options and the importance placed on this set piece facet, I hypothesize that the coaches feel that there is more value elsewhere.
not rocket science now is it?
21 Aug 2012, 13:34 pm
Barney is available.
21 Aug 2012, 13:37 pm
I would also ask….who do you replace in the match 22 to accomodate Brussouw.
To my mind, it would then be marcel coetzee who is playing 6. I’m sure everyone will shout Potgieter but that is not a straight replacement. If people were asking for Elstadt …then that would be something to consider.
and what has coetzee done to warrant being dropped/replaced?
and for me, bruossow/coetzee/alberts does not look a great combo. you are short of a heavy hitter somewhere as we saw with daniels last weekend.
also, I haven’t got the android app on me, but did alberts do the full 80 last weekend?
21 Aug 2012, 13:38 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-94:
So a fetcher’s role is only to make clean steals?
Ok, got it.
21 Aug 2012, 13:39 pm
Let them play the ghoulish lovechild of Wyatt Earp and Davey Crockett. I’d pay money to see the way he shakes his head in sheer disbelief every time the whistle goes at the end of a scrum collapse. That’s entertainment.
21 Aug 2012, 13:43 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-96:
You’re right. Coetzee has done nothing wrong. He is a very good player.
But Brussow is a world-class player.
There is a big difference between very good, and world-class.
21 Aug 2012, 13:45 pm
@greegs-74:
Rubbish. Bismarck’s discipline this year has been very good. He was antagonised by a lot of teams this year especially with defenders holding on to him around the rucks and he kept his discipline very well compared to other years.
21 Aug 2012, 13:48 pm
So, does HM have enough dark players in his squad (with Habana) out, to start with his customary 4 POC’s?
Beast
Mvovo
Kirchner
Who else?
21 Aug 2012, 13:48 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-96: The problem is at lock more so that at loosie, Lets take a good example, the best loose trio as we saw in the 2nd half of the super15 was Kanko,Daniel,coetzee, now no real biggies there right?
Things is the tight 5 hit the rucks, Yes i know the Sharks dont have the b est Locks in the country and so we keep hearing, but they do the hard wok of hitting rucks and collusion points, Bekker and Etsebeth didnt quite do that, not did Strauss for Bissy, our actual break down point master,
If noone is clearing out over the ball come ruck time you have problems, it’s that simple
21 Aug 2012, 13:49 pm
@sharks_lover-102: Amen to that.
21 Aug 2012, 13:50 pm
@willievz-97:
willy, stop being so obtuse.
it is hardly my fault the lions have been relegated.
….and they played with a fetcher.
In fact, I’d consider minnie ahead of brussow give the current grouping.
21 Aug 2012, 13:53 pm
@sharks_lover-102:
I agree 100%
watch our 2009 games and bakkies had a huge season.
so what you want to do…..drop bekker and etsbeth call back bakkies so we can make everyone happy and call up brussouw?
21 Aug 2012, 13:53 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-104: If you say so.
21 Aug 2012, 13:57 pm
@grant10-92: I don’t think one could start Louw at this point, maybe have him on the bench but I accept HM could have him in the mix. I do think player release could have been a problem, not now under the test window but back then in preparation.
@nama1-101: If true, it’s sad that he has to work his selection around that, international coaches should be given a free hand. I guess you could see a Kolisi debut with Alberts to 8 now.
Is Habana actually ruled out?
21 Aug 2012, 13:58 pm
@katman-98: Oops, wrong thread.
21 Aug 2012, 13:58 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-105: would call up Brussow if he wasnt injured
21 Aug 2012, 14:03 pm
Very few loose forwards in SA hits rucks like they should, thats why teams playing against us win so many turnover balls,
We tend to just go stand at the breakdowns points with a few attemps to win the ball, many of those teams protect the ball with their backline players, our backline players many times get driven off the ball.
21 Aug 2012, 14:03 pm
@sharks_lover-102:
Agree.
If you look back at the seasons where the Boks were most succesful, they had a fit Bakkies and/or Juan Smith hitting the rucks all the time.
We lack that currently.
21 Aug 2012, 14:08 pm
@nama1-101:
A real shame indeed
Such a wealth of Test quality players in Chilibooi, Maku, Johnson, Kolisie, Aplon, JdJ to name just a few
Would be great to see Kolisie and Aplon against the Gauchos!
21 Aug 2012, 14:08 pm
@Big Hit-107:
I’m just going by the selection of the teams so far under HM.I don’t think it is prescribed. It is probably how HM wants to prove his commitment to transformation in the Bok team.
May be totally wrong of course.
PS: Tac started with the 4 POC’s being the “magic number.”
@sharks_lover-110:
Once again, I have to agree with you.
21 Aug 2012, 14:10 pm
@nama1-113: I just had a look at the 26 man squad, the 4 you mention are the only 4 POCs in the squad. If Habana is out he would have to fly an alternative in.
21 Aug 2012, 14:11 pm
@nama1-111: Agreed Nama, and either HM must get bekker and Etsebeth to get stuck into the Rucks?? or he has to change his lock combo
21 Aug 2012, 14:12 pm
@sharks_lover-110:
and I would point out that that is why jaque potgieter is in the mix, you or anyone else may not rate him but he flys into rucks and contact in general like a scud missle.
if he could channel his aggression with more accuracy I’d suggest he’d could become awesome.
21 Aug 2012, 14:14 pm
Johan Goosen is back, will play for Cheetahs this weekend.
21 Aug 2012, 14:16 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-116: Mate if you want a flank to hit rucks you choose someone with more all rounded skills, a deysel?? who tackles properly and hits the rucks hard, he is not a fethcer yet wins many balls that way, and he is a demon in strength as a ball carrier. I am not saying he is the answer or our only answer,
Potgieter needs to be recoached , he flies into tackles in a bad way same a rucks, you have to stay on your feet, NOT saying he does not have the potential, he does, but he has a lot of rough edges to his game
21 Aug 2012, 14:17 pm
@PissAnt-117: great news
So now the useless Lambie can come back to the Sharks
21 Aug 2012, 14:19 pm
@PissAnt-117: Was not referring to you by the way, but as you know ? the most in here consider Lambie to be useless, Now we can make do with his useless player at the Sharks, imagine if we keep winning with this useless player at 10 ??
21 Aug 2012, 14:23 pm
@sharks_lover-115:
With Strauss not known for hitting the rucks as well, things may be a bit more difficult against the Argies than expected.
The combo of Coetzee and Alberts at flank, both being ball carriers and defensively orientated, will further prohibits us from “dominating the collisions.”
21 Aug 2012, 14:23 pm
@sharks_lover-120:
I know – no probs.
21 Aug 2012, 14:32 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-116:
“if he could channel his aggression with more accuracy I’d suggest he’d could become awesome.”
…and until he can do that, he should not be in the Bok team. The Bok team is not a place for apprentices. Ask Tac.
Let Potgieter complete his apprenticeship at the Bulls, get more accurate, then he can maybe stake a claim for a spot the Bok team.
21 Aug 2012, 14:33 pm
Just to keep myself busy, here is next years Springbok team, OOPS i mean Sharks team
15 Ludick
14 JPP
13 Jordaan
12 F Steyn
11 Mvovo
10 The Useless Lambie
09 Mcleod/Reinach
08 Kanko
07 Alberts
06 Coetzee
05 Bresler
04 PSDT
03 Jannie
02 Bismark
01 Beast
Reserves:
16 Burden, 17 Herbst, 18 Sykes, 19 Deysel, 20 Daniel, 21 WHitehead, 22 Reinach/Mcleod, 23 Bosman, 24 Odwa, 25 Viljoen, 26 Sbura, 27 Chadwick, Jandre Mare, 28, Peet Mare, 29 Cooper, Kleinhans, 30 Zeilinga, 31 Heimer Williams, 32 Gouws Prinsloo, 33 Mthembu, 34 Hadebe, 35 hoffmann, 36 Redelinghuys
Damn running out of names here, so many lol, and then Talks of one or 2 ex sharks playuers returning from the Lions
Cillier and one other 
21 Aug 2012, 14:35 pm
@nama1-123:
Well said. The Bok team is no place to learn your trade.
Potgieter should be no where near the Bok setup. Hell, he was hurt for half the year.
21 Aug 2012, 14:35 pm
@nama1-121: I agree, this is why a Deysel should have been there with Brussouw injured, or a Minnie, Its about combo’s, or seriously for now HM should think of bringing back Bakkies, i know some wont like me saying that but that was part of his job, Sykes does it for the Sharks with Bissy
21 Aug 2012, 14:36 pm
@PissAnt-122: YOU well mate??
21 Aug 2012, 14:36 pm
@nama1-121:
The sooner the Boks start hunting as a pack at the ruck-zone on both their own ball and counter-rucking as a unit on opposition ball… the sooner guys like Pocock/McCaw/Cane/Hooper will be less of a factor…
All this X player should be doing this and Y player should be doing that around the paddock is beyond ludicrous it’s a 22 man game…
21 Aug 2012, 14:37 pm
Parlement discussing the Marikana tragedy.
Lonmin not looking good.
This bucket will get passed around and around … Nobody will take responsibility for the happenings and the poor families, left behind, will be the real victims.
Of course, Apartheid is also mentioned as a cause for this tragedy.
21 Aug 2012, 14:37 pm
@londonshark-125: really? someone should tell your backs, they look like they are still learning what it is they are supposed to do..
one only need look at the 1/4 final last year, they couldnt catch a pass with the tryline open… eish..
21 Aug 2012, 14:37 pm
@sharks_lover-118:
Spot on.
Potgieter reminds me of Krige. Tons of heart, but nothing else to offer.
I’m sure he’ll grow as a player. But he must do that with the Bulls, not the Boks.
21 Aug 2012, 14:37 pm
Eish forgot about Botes in my squad
21 Aug 2012, 14:39 pm
@poppa69-130:
Easy now big boy. No need to push buttons. Don’t make me bring Suzi into this
21 Aug 2012, 14:42 pm
@poppa69-130: Always knocking someone elses team makes you feel proud and good about urself huh??
IS it a New Zealand thing?
21 Aug 2012, 14:43 pm
@londonshark-133: Suzie? hehehe Ive never ever prescribed to that theory, just so you know..
21 Aug 2012, 14:45 pm
@sharks_lover-134: someone seems a bit precious huh? shame, you werent here from 2007 to 2011? boy, did so many have to knock someone elses team to feel better about themselves then..
are you one of these saffa supporters who cant handle the mud being thrown back?
ag shampies
21 Aug 2012, 14:47 pm
@nama1-123: NO! when it comes to bulls players heyneke can “coach them back to form” HIMSELF! the likes of Brussow are UN-coachable and must prove that they can play to heyneke’s gameplan in the Currie Cup. Brig van Zyl says de Jongh has been “pants” the whole season and that’s why Engelbrecht is there as cover, then you ask yourself what the hell did JJ do that was soooo wonderful to warrant Bok selection, even as cover, ditto JANO VERMAAK!
21 Aug 2012, 14:49 pm
I would just like to say that Jaque Potgieter has already staked a claim for the boks, that is why he is there. skalk burger was an even more reckless player in the beginning albeit a very special one. I cannot understand this abuse that potgieter gets, I can only imagine that it is the fact that he is a bull.He played a very decent cameo this past weekend.
I also rate Deysel but is he not just recently back from another injury? I cannot remember but he has not set the scene alight the way he was doing in 2009? certainly he has had no more significant contributions for the sharks than what potgieter has had with the bulls in his first season.
the sharks are winning games with a fullback at 10, that they would still keep winning with lambie at 10 proves nothing.
however, imagine the sharks start losing games with Lambie at 10…what would that mean on your I-told-you-so barometer?
21 Aug 2012, 14:51 pm
Bok backs looked bloody clueless against Argies…..truly second rate….Have to improve in that area…..
and perhaps with Goosen coming back for Cheetahs is a step in the right direcion…
HM should start with Ruan Pienaar at 9 as well….
21 Aug 2012, 14:55 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-138:
No way boet.
Schalk was class, as well as being a lunatic.
You CAN’T compare the 2. Burger was the best player in the world in 2004 (his 2nd year with Boks), do you honestly put Potgieter in that category??
21 Aug 2012, 14:55 pm
@Transformation-137:
what did jj do that warrants selection?
well, as the coach and jean devilliers said…..he covers13 and wing as well.
12 was covered by frans steyn, devilliers himself and lambie.
dejong covers 12 and 13.
don’t try and be too smart. You know why jj is there.
dejong is still pants. maybe the magic number of 4 will see him get selected,who knows?
21 Aug 2012, 14:56 pm
@poppa69-135:
Good to hear.
21 Aug 2012, 14:57 pm
@londonshark-140:
I’ve already said skalk was special….but as if not more reckless. He got a few yellows in 2005/2006 if i remember.
PS:Transie, pull out your apple app and let me know for sure
thks
21 Aug 2012, 14:59 pm
@Transformation-137:
Ja boet.
The sad thing is, they actually believe it when they say it.
21 Aug 2012, 15:00 pm
@londonshark-142: after watching Invictus I knew it wasnt some waitress, it was an executive decision
21 Aug 2012, 15:00 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-141:
Yep, got no problem with JJ.
He’s a class player and one for the future.
21 Aug 2012, 15:02 pm
@grant10-139: even with goosen taking the ball flat, he will probably have to skip pass fransie to the outside backs to exploit overlaps…
21 Aug 2012, 15:02 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-141: JdV can cover wing too and JdJ 13, 12. JdJ is much better than JJ and is a proven international player. I’d be delighted if he was included in the next squad. JJ’s time will come but not against the big boys yet.
Potgieter is one of the worst brain-dead players I have ever seen.
21 Aug 2012, 15:02 pm
@poppa69-145:
LOL. On that movie. The rugby scenes were aweful!! Very disapointed. It really isn’t hard to create really rugby scenes with real rugby players (some of course were).
Joel was played by Clint Eastwood’s grandson!!! And Lomu was waaaay to small.
21 Aug 2012, 15:06 pm
@mikeybrass-148: jdv can no longer cover wing, he’s not the same pace as 2004 when he could outstrip nz wingers. jdj cannot pass and outside of side stepping props…and only off the left foot what exactly makes him so fearsome.
21 Aug 2012, 15:07 pm
@mikeybrass-148:
I think I also hate Potgieter so much because he straightens his hair.
Seriously, he looks like a 18 year old going to his ‘metro’ matric dance.
21 Aug 2012, 15:08 pm
@londonshark-149: I agree, was really disappointed in that aspect of the movie…I know it wasnt really about the rugby, but it detracted from the whole movie imo..
21 Aug 2012, 15:08 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-138:
“I also rate Deysel but is he not just recently back from another injury?”
Did you have the same reservations about Potgieter when he was selected for the English series after being out for six weeks with a injury?
Btw, I don’t rate Deysel as a Bok contender so the question is in no way meant to further his cause.
@Brigadier Van Zyl-141:
What exactly has JJ done to warrant a place in the Bok 22, let alone a starting spot?
Don’t give me the “he covers wing as well” excuse. From a playing/performance point of view this year, what has JJ done to deserve his place in the team?
…and no, this is not me punting for JdJ to be selected. I just want you to explain to me why JJ is in the team.
21 Aug 2012, 15:08 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-141: you are not answering the question, would JJ Engelbrecht be BOK “cover” if he was still at Province because none of his performances in a bulls jersey scream BOK BOK BOK…
the same with Potgieter, you ask if Deysel isn’t coming back from injury, meanwhile Potgieter was sideline for TWO or THREE weeks before he was called up to play in the England Series, he didn’t have to be match fit, be on form, contribute to his team or anything, just straight into the Bok bench.
ppffftt
21 Aug 2012, 15:08 pm
@poppa69-130: Hey Giulietta, are you ever anything more than a trouble stirrer, or is it your sole mission to log on to niggle? You seem to hit the threads running these days. No more “returning serve” it seems. Is that how absolutely and miserably sht you life has become? Do you need us to do anything for you? Like feed your cats when you crash and burn and get checked in again?
21 Aug 2012, 15:09 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-143:
We agree on Burger. But one question was, can you really compare Burger to Potgieter?
I just don’t think Pot is in the same league. Schalk was also the best ball poacher in the world for a year or 2. He has a very underrated skill set.
Like I said, Potgieter might prove me wrong. But is the Boks the place to do it????
21 Aug 2012, 15:10 pm
@poppa69-136: PLease dude show me where i sit here and throw mud at the Kiwi’s ??? would love to see, As for you?? its a daily thing here, people can be having a normal rugby chat and on entry by you it all changes,
Maybe a look at yourself first before pointing all those fingers??
21 Aug 2012, 15:12 pm
@londonshark-156: Lemme put it this way?? POtgieter was at the Sharks academy, he did not improve, they let him go
21 Aug 2012, 15:12 pm
@poppa69-152:
Yep, people kept saying ‘it’s not a rugby movie’. Well, it kinda was.
Mandela used RUGBY to bring a nation together. So the ‘rugby’ parts should have been given more attention.
When Joel started shouting ‘NO NO’ in slow motion just before he kicked the winning droppie, I almost started laughing.
21 Aug 2012, 15:12 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-150: I completely disagree on both counts.
JdV has shown his still has lots of pace. The Stormers were scoring tries at will in 2010 when “no pass” JdJ was at 12 and the tries were being scored by the backline.
21 Aug 2012, 15:13 pm
@katman-155: is this an example of “staggering wit”?
massive fail..
dont look now, but Londonshark and I are actually having a civil conversation..
but what to expect from a leeus-ers supporter now that he’s lost his sense of entitlement.. lol
21 Aug 2012, 15:13 pm
@sharks_lover-157:
Lol, you can’t bite when Poppa comes on here. Seriously.
21 Aug 2012, 15:14 pm
@londonshark-149: Hey, a friend of starred as one of the Bok players in that movie…..(one of my least faves if I must be honest)…
21 Aug 2012, 15:14 pm
@poppa69-136: Pop’s is it fair to say that since your AB’s won the WC last year you have been every bit as arrogant/belligerant as the Saffa’s you moan about post 2007?
21 Aug 2012, 15:14 pm
@nama1-153: Exactly. JdJ is much better than JJ and Olivier.
Watch the squad evolve over the next two years.
21 Aug 2012, 15:14 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-163: Oooops. A friend of mine.
21 Aug 2012, 15:14 pm
@sharks_lover-158:
I never knew he was with the Sharks!!?? He must have seen Marcell and realized he had no hope with us
21 Aug 2012, 15:15 pm
Please guys, don’t rise to the bait like I do sometimes against Poppa and let an otherwise interesting thread deteriorate down to his psychotic level.
21 Aug 2012, 15:15 pm
@nama1-153: snap!!!!!!!!!!!!
21 Aug 2012, 15:16 pm
@londonshark-167: LOL.
I didn’t know that either. I thought he came from the Eastern Cape and hadn’t touched the Banana Academy
21 Aug 2012, 15:16 pm
@mikeybrass-165:
To be honest, the Stormers backs (JDJ and Aplon in particular) should be blaming Robbie Fleck for their Bok exclusion.
How the heck does he still have a job????
21 Aug 2012, 15:16 pm
@londonshark-159: Hollywood, or Clint failed to grasp that aspect of how rugby was used as the primary vehicle, and by failing not to recognise it it lessened the whole impact of the movie imo..
it really was a defining moment in SA history, but you dont really grasp that fact from the movie
21 Aug 2012, 15:17 pm
@londonshark-162: Nah boet i have said my say to him, just wondering when a man his age would grow up, but again miracles to happen from time to time
21 Aug 2012, 15:18 pm
@sharks_lover-158: Potgieter is 26 years old. On the way to 27. Any loosie who hasn’t featured in a Big name franchise (Bulls) until he hits that age, is seriously lacking in something….
And if you don’t find that something before you hit 24 – you ain’t ever going to find it.
He is kak, and soon he will be OLD kak.
Look at some of the 18/19/20 and 21 year loosies coming through…..and then look at him at 26.
KAK.
21 Aug 2012, 15:19 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-174: Well like i said, he was at the SHarks academy, they let him go without a fuss
21 Aug 2012, 15:20 pm
@londonshark-171: Hmmm, I put the blame at AC’s door rather. The Stormers were scoring some wonderful tries in 2010 and Fleck was getting the credit. Fleck, however, can only operate within the gameplan and strategy set by the head coach, not to mention the head coach’s selections. The Stormers’ backline looked better this year on the occassion that JdJ had to move to 12. I am with Skoppie – 12 JdJ and 13 JdV for the Stormers with a different flyhalf plus a subtle change in the game plan emphasis and we would have scored more tries.
21 Aug 2012, 15:20 pm
@poppa69-172:
Yeah, I felt a bit cheated after watching it.
Small things too. Like when the Bok team jogged down the steet, right past a 2009 Hyundai Getz. Or how they left the Ellis Park roof in the film that was built for the 2010 WC (the above the boxes).
But, I guess the yanks liked it (kinda), and they were paying the bills. But still.
At least it had a happy ending
21 Aug 2012, 15:22 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-174:
HE IS 26!!!!!!!!!!?????????
WTF?? No man, I thought he was 22 or so.
That confirms it, shocking pick from Meyer (I thought maybe he was a bolter of sort, but at 26, if you never made it, you never will).
21 Aug 2012, 15:22 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-174: Some players come into their own later in life. Fair enough. I can think of a few such examples. I do not buy into the age criteria. However, Potgieter is bloody brain-dead on the field. Mules have more intelligence and finese.
21 Aug 2012, 15:23 pm
@Skeppie-164: yep, but do you think the penny has dropped with any of those who were as arrogant pre 2011?
do you think they get my point? nah, of course not, If SA beat us this year at all it will start again…
could they finally understand that what they had dished for 4 years is now coming full circle?
strange concept I know, but a simple one..
21 Aug 2012, 15:23 pm
@mikeybrass-176:
Fair point hey. Either way, someone in the Stormers setup is stopping that team from becoming truely awesome.
21 Aug 2012, 15:24 pm
I am more than happy with Bissy out and Strauss holding the fort.Strauss got the better skills set and is the better disciplined player.Don’t rush back Bissy.
21 Aug 2012, 15:25 pm
@mikeybrass-179:
Mmmm, props come to life in their late 20′s. But not flankers.
But ja, like he said, Potgieter just doesn’t have the head for international rugby.
21 Aug 2012, 15:26 pm
@londonshark-177:
yeah, guess the happy ending depends on perspective 
but it served a much greater purpose then just crowning the World Cup champs, and as such it was probably the right way for the tournament to end..
see, us spiritual guardians of the game were quite happy to assist in something much greater then the game itself
21 Aug 2012, 15:27 pm
@londonshark-178: Actually he is 27
21 Aug 2012, 15:28 pm
born 24 April 1986) ok this is his date of birth my bad
21 Aug 2012, 15:28 pm
@wnbb-182: SMOKING THE WEED AGAIN??
21 Aug 2012, 15:29 pm
@londonshark-183:
Jacques Potgieter (born 24 April 1986) is a South African rugby union player, currently playing with the Blue Bulls.[1]
He represented Eastern Province at the annual Craven Week rugby tournament in 2004 and then clinched a move to the Natal Sharks, whom he represented at various youth levels before playing in the Vodacom Cup for two seasons before moving back to the Eastern Province Kings for the 2009 Currie Cup First Division season.
In August 2011, the Blue Bulls announced that they had signed Potgieter for the 2012 season on a two-year contract.[2] An early release of his contract was secured and he joined the Bulls on 1 September
21 Aug 2012, 15:30 pm
@poppa69-184:
LOL, your kindness towards the Boks was much appreciated
But ja, I was only 11 at the time, so the true scale of what was at stake was beyond me.
Now that I look back, if the Boks had lost, a huge amount of country building never would have occured. Very important moment.
21 Aug 2012, 15:30 pm
@londonshark-181: We need a flyhalf who can create space and we need a coach who can create enough space in the gameplan to bring more balance to the attack-defense ratio. The structure of the Stormers is first rate as could be seen this season. The problem lays in how the backline is being selected etc, while the forwards are very very good as a collective unit and will keep growing together. To my mind, that is AC and not Fleck.
21 Aug 2012, 15:31 pm
@sharks_lover-188:
Meyer’s scouting abilities just took a dive in my books
21 Aug 2012, 15:32 pm
@londonshark-183: Pienaar, Teichmann and above all Danie improved with age and really came into their own later on.
Potgieter was well known and highly regarded in the EC. Meyer poached him.
21 Aug 2012, 15:33 pm
@londonshark-191:
21 Aug 2012, 15:33 pm
@londonshark-183: Btw. Coming into their own and coming to life are two different things
21 Aug 2012, 15:34 pm
@londonshark-189: agree totally, and some could say that it was indeed fated..
besides, we won the real tournament the following year…
21 Aug 2012, 15:35 pm
@londonshark-177:
thats back when rugby was hard and physical… but honestly contested in good spirit. not clean as a whislte sure, but at least it strived towards this.
its gone to the dogs since.
21 Aug 2012, 15:38 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-196: As if Richard Loe ever contested in good spirits!
21 Aug 2012, 15:38 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-196: hahaha cant help yourself, love it..
the 81 tour was hard and physical, and not just on the rugby field…. but you were probably still a laaitie on the teat at that stage huh?
21 Aug 2012, 15:39 pm
@poppa69-180: I hear you and I am sure a lot of “us” don’s see it as the circle turning but it’s been give and take…..some of the AB supporters on this site have been as bad as some of the saffa’s…..
21 Aug 2012, 15:40 pm
If you think Bismarks’s loss was big , imagine if Strauss gets injured and Liebenberg has to play.
21 Aug 2012, 15:40 pm
@capebull-200:
21 Aug 2012, 15:43 pm
@londonshark-178: how old was Aplon when he got his fisrt Bok cap?
21 Aug 2012, 15:45 pm
@mikeybrass-179: Props get better with age, and Juan Smith GOT better with age. Potgieter has shown no extreme promise or potential at all. The fact that he played Super rugby for the FIRST time this season, really does say it all IMHO.
No big union wanted him, until Meyer pulled him from the EC…..and fuckknows what he saw in Jaques.
21 Aug 2012, 15:46 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-203: We are all so glad you don’t coach the Bokke
21 Aug 2012, 15:46 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-203: A flying torpedo
???
21 Aug 2012, 15:47 pm
MAke that a black haired torpedo
21 Aug 2012, 15:47 pm
@mikeybrass-192: ja, as highly rated as gerrit-jan van velze or fudge mabeta @ the bulls.
21 Aug 2012, 15:47 pm
@mikeybrass-197:
that was the beauty of it. teams going at each other with just one or two malkoppies being naughty boys here and there. absolutely it provided a helluva spectacle when players did moer each other and the like but it was not the main focus of the occasion.
thats why you remember individual players for their naughty habits when looking back. sadly the same cannot be said for some teams in the modern era.
no sir, all you think of is the entire team and how negatively they played.
@poppa69-198:
just keeping the honesty in check pops, thats all
we dont wanna soil the facts of history now do we…
21 Aug 2012, 15:49 pm
Skeppie, strange that if you poke a dog with a stick he will eventually bite back… some of us bad kiwis (okay, I know everyone will refer to me, but thats cool,l I wear that badge with pride) just got sick of the continual lack of respect for NZ rugby, so threw it back…
what amazes me is that it is received exactly how we received it.. honestly, we have heard time and again for example that the 2007 1/4 final was the best reffed game, ever…. yet 2011 was rigged etc…
does this not strike you as strange? see, even though we hold the WC now, I’d still hand it over if it meant we kept our 80% win percentage, but many used our failure to win one for so long as some sort of noose, and devalued the whole AB/Bok rivalry..
since then, Ive done the same…and the reaction has been quite an eye opener…seems Saffas dont like it either, but again, it will be a lesson lost once your team beats us again..
21 Aug 2012, 15:50 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-208: the facts of history? lets not get into that bakkies, Im sure you dont remember any rugby pre isolation, so the whole facts of history you spout are only partially correct…
lets agree to disagree, ok?
21 Aug 2012, 15:50 pm
@Transformation-207: The Loosie showing promise at the Bulls is CJ Stander and Arno Botha
21 Aug 2012, 15:50 pm
@capebull-200:
people will blame the two props on either side of him.
because heaven knows it wont be the locks behind him.
21 Aug 2012, 15:52 pm
@poppa69-209: blah balh blah you big girl, grow up you sound like a whining child man.
ooh the saffas were nasty to me sob sob sob
21 Aug 2012, 15:52 pm
I just back the Boks so to be honest who ever is in the team come matchday?? i will supports
21 Aug 2012, 15:54 pm
GOOOOOOOO BOKKEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE KLap the ArgieBargies
GOOOOOOOO SHHHHAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRKSSSSSSSSSSSSSS Klap the BUlls
21 Aug 2012, 15:54 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-212: Are you talking about the locks that permanently stands in the backline and leave it up to Keegan to try and clean rucks, are they the same locks that could not win a single line out against from the Argies.
21 Aug 2012, 15:55 pm
@rangerman-213: I reAlly dont care what some poaching scumbag thinks of me..
or what he thinks of his countries president..
was a nice apology you offered though ranger…
he without sin may cast the first stone
21 Aug 2012, 15:55 pm
@sharks_lover-215: With the Bulls locks playing like a certain pair from the south, it could well happen.
21 Aug 2012, 15:57 pm
@poppa69-210:
fok off
i dont agree to nothing with you, ok
seeing as you’re on my side of the blog i would stay to ‘chat’ but i have work so cannot give attention. you can have it (by default).
21 Aug 2012, 15:58 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-219: I’ll always gracefully accept your admission of defeat..
run away then
21 Aug 2012, 15:58 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-219:
You have WORK???
That’s a first
21 Aug 2012, 15:59 pm
@Transformation-202:
Good point on Aplon. But the skills were always there.
I just don’t see it in Potgieter.
21 Aug 2012, 15:59 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-208: Just for you! more subtle admission by kiwis re RWC & bryce
IT’S not that long ago that any win at ANZ Stadium over Australia would have been cherished, no matter how it was achieved, so put in that context, the All Blacks 27-19 win over Australia was a good start to the Rugby Championship and the defence of the Bledisloe Cup.
They made hard work of it, bombing two or three clear try scoring opportunities that would have put the game out of reach of a Wallaby side that somehow kept itself in the game without ever looking good enough to win it.
To be fair the game suffered from a pedantic, officious and utterly unsympathetic performance from referee Allain Rolland, who refused to let a game between the two most attack oriented teams in the world generate any flow or rhythm.
But the players have to take the blame too, with countless handling errors, and maybe, just maybe, a reluctance to adapt to Rolland’s nit picking approach.
Chief culprit was Wallaby skipper David Pocock who must have thought he was back in Wellington in the World Cup under a ref who wasn’t prepared to penalise anything. His biggest crime might have been trying too hard, but he did his team no favours.
21 Aug 2012, 16:00 pm
@Dawn-221: more Dawn
does a squeegee and a plastic cup at the robots really constitute “work”?
21 Aug 2012, 16:00 pm
@sharks_lover-215: Although , with Burden also out, we have a chance
21 Aug 2012, 16:00 pm
@Transformation-223:
WTF happened to Fudge anyway
21 Aug 2012, 16:01 pm
@poppa69-224:
Is that “more” or “More” as in goeiemore
21 Aug 2012, 16:01 pm
@Dawn-221: Potgieter tackles well and he cleans rucks well , he runs well, what more do you want ?
21 Aug 2012, 16:02 pm
@capebull-216:
yip, that’s them
some okes easily forget the the basic arithmetic of their position
‘you are number 4 and i am number 5′….’what must we do?’…
21 Aug 2012, 16:03 pm
@capebull-228:
I didn’t mention Potgieter, but now that you ask …
He could do something about that greaseball hair
21 Aug 2012, 16:03 pm
@Dawn-227: “More” us security guards are usually the first to see the new day..
21 Aug 2012, 16:03 pm
Jacques potgieter is in the squad like it or not and so is any other bull that is in the squad…
My thinking is the team will read as follouw:
1-beast 2-adriaan 3-pat
4-eben 5-juandre
6-marcell 7-jacques 8-willem
9-francois 10-mornay
11-lwazi 15-zane 14-jj
12-frans 13-jean
There u have it…
21 Aug 2012, 16:04 pm
@capebull-216:
You guys now ambassadors for Keegan, who went saaaaaiiilllling on Saturday in the runaway rolling maul?
Bloody bullsharks
21 Aug 2012, 16:05 pm
@poppa69-231:
The day is dying here.
Almost chaila time
21 Aug 2012, 16:07 pm
@Dawn-234: its just become Wednesday here… not sure what chaila means?
21 Aug 2012, 16:08 pm
@poppa69-217: the only thing i poach is eggs poops.
now try going one day, just one day, without whining please.
p.s. every word i said about zuma i felt and believe, no apologies for that.
@Transformation-223: haha, kiwilands best ref circa 2011.
cheating hobbits.
21 Aug 2012, 16:09 pm
@poppa69-235: it means fokkoff.
21 Aug 2012, 16:09 pm
@poppa69-235:
Chaila – home time
21 Aug 2012, 16:10 pm
@rangerman-236: whose whining, was just responding to a question… but yeah, perhaps you could go one day without whining at my “whining”
21 Aug 2012, 16:10 pm
@rangerman-237:
21 Aug 2012, 16:10 pm
@Transformation-202:
Aplon apparently only took up rugby seriously when he was at varsity.
Potgieter on the other hand…
21 Aug 2012, 16:11 pm
@rangerman-237: hehe awwww whats the matter ranger, still upset your sharkies cant win a final?
what is it, 5 finals now? cough cough choke chokers…
21 Aug 2012, 16:11 pm
@poppa69-209: I would be happy if the Boks never won another WC, if they were winning 80% of their games against ALL opposition in between the ‘rugby festival’ that is the WC. I would be stoked if that ever happened.
@sharks_lover-206: A fuckingdoff flying torpedo with luscious black locks….. (In fact the only reason anyone notices him at all on the field is because of his Sunsilk locks)
Beyond me that someone like him already has a few Bok caps. Tragic.
21 Aug 2012, 16:13 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-243:
That’s grease not Sunsilk
21 Aug 2012, 16:15 pm
@Dawn-221:
ja
an important employee has taken his african goose (lovely girl, i like her a lot) home to europe to meet the parents (the hot chocalate makes them cuckoo for coco pops, hey. it is always happening).
nou vra die fokkenn direkteurs vir my oor die afgelope twee of drie dae vat die fok hier en daar aan gaan by die werk.
asof ek sal weet
@poppa69-220:
voetsek, and dont think i like you.
but like fern, i will be civil in my dislike
21 Aug 2012, 16:16 pm
@xtremebull-232:
Why do you have Pat ahead of Jannie? Is Jannie injured?
Pat on the bench because he can cover both sides.
21 Aug 2012, 16:17 pm
@Transformation-223:
shittfucks, transie
they have no shame and only gall these kiwis
the nerve i tell you… the farking nerve…
21 Aug 2012, 16:19 pm
@nama1-241: Correct. Huge diff between Appels and Potgieter. Appels was always talented,with skill to burn. His size (or rather what his size translated to amongst moronic coaches) kept him in the 7′s setup and on the fringes for a while, and the poor fellow had to prove himself over and over and over and over again, before he was ‘trusted’ to make any step up what so ever.
Potgieter on the other hand, had done fuckall, and barely registered on the rugby richter scale before Meyer ‘be having him’. And in this funny old world, his size propelled him forward, while Aplon’s held him back.
However, in the intelligence stakes, Aplon is about 275kg’s heavier than Gump.
21 Aug 2012, 16:19 pm
@Dawn-244:
21 Aug 2012, 16:20 pm
The only thing I poach is eggs.
Poopscoop’s egg was poached long ago.
21 Aug 2012, 16:21 pm
” who must have thought he was back in Wellington in the World Cup under a ref who wasn’t prepared to penalise anything”…??……???…
i cant farking believe it…!!..
i cant….
21 Aug 2012, 16:22 pm
@poppa69-239: you sound ever more girly.
a big maori wahine.
wake up.
@Dawn-240:
@poppa69-242: silly girl jy klink so lam soos jou coach by die blues.
translation: chaila
21 Aug 2012, 16:22 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-248:
Indeed.
Mallet set apples back years.
Called him the human speedbump.
******* coaches.
21 Aug 2012, 16:24 pm
@Dawn-233:
i larfed when keegan said to the ref afterwards “but if they lift me up, there’s nothing i can do” hehehe
eat your porridge, keegy… eat your porridge…
21 Aug 2012, 16:24 pm
@rangerman-252: you mean the Blues that have 3 super titles? that one? hahaha how many do the guppiegirls have? none you say?
keep going ranger, youve sure shown me today…
21 Aug 2012, 16:25 pm
@gunther-250: i watched a show where these “maoris” in nz were allowed to catch fish the “indigenous” way.
in boardshorts and with a bucket to lug their catch made with a spear and some gillnets made in china.
i think poops thinks i have invaded his ancestral fishing grounds or something.
21 Aug 2012, 16:28 pm
@poppa69-255: you looking for a scrap?
at least when you are fighting you arent whining so its a start.
now lets work on your manners.
Type:
i apologise for the millionth time for being myself, i will try harder to let this blog be an inspiration to me and my fellow rugby lovers.
repeat 1000 times.
i will check on your progress in the morning.
21 Aug 2012, 16:28 pm
@rangerman-256: I think you worry to much about what poppa thinks..
shampies, I seem to have you wanting so much to get one over me? hahahaha classic, you can join gunther and katman as those who are compelled to teach me a lesson..
pure poetry it is, provides me with so many laughs..
21 Aug 2012, 16:30 pm
Bissie is a major loss. Good enough ball carrier and a real menace at the breakdown. Strauss doesn’t relish the tight stuff. He’s more willing to stand off rucks to take the ball up. This worries me. Who’s gonna do the dirty work? Strauss needs to play tighter. Bissie is class!
21 Aug 2012, 16:30 pm
@poppa69-258: oh i am laughing too buddy.
your joy is so much better than your tears admittedly
the tears were sad (sadface).
i have to go and drink beer with my mates and have a laugh now.
get typing.
21 Aug 2012, 16:31 pm
@rangerman-256:
Poep also like to fish uses the front cannon on his waka.
21 Aug 2012, 16:31 pm
@rangerman-260: thanks for proving my point..
you have mates?
sure you do…
21 Aug 2012, 16:32 pm
@capebull-204: Yep, I am the only one on this blog who thinks Potgieter is a waste of loosie space of course……
Everyone else thinks he is fuckingmarvellous….
21 Aug 2012, 16:32 pm
@Transformation-223:
i’m still blow away by that.statement
is this on the herald?
21 Aug 2012, 16:33 pm
You gotta love Poppa.
In full pukana glory.
Now he just needs some tattoos and a tongue ring, and he is the complete article.
21 Aug 2012, 16:34 pm
@willievz-265: ohhh look, another fish ready to bite..
this really is too easy…
21 Aug 2012, 16:35 pm
if only you guys were as passionate on the rugby field as you all seem to be in trying to “get one over me”, your team might actually be half decent..
21 Aug 2012, 16:36 pm
Strauss will not let us down.
He will be hungry for action.
Better Strauss there then Chilli, Maku or that Burden
Tiaan off the bench is an able replacement
21 Aug 2012, 16:39 pm
@capebull-228: The 238kg ‘special needs’ fellow I spotted in the newspaper last week can run, tackle and defend as well.
He, like Jaques, would have a problem trying to put all those ‘things’ together, and make them count……as the most imporant skill of them all:The thought that goes behind when to run, tackle, defend or offload is where both of them come up short….
The grey stuff…
21 Aug 2012, 16:44 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-251:
Article By: Tony, Johnson
Monday, 20 August 2012
21 Aug 2012, 16:45 pm
@Transformation-223:
heheh i took a look at the herald to see for the article you mention and these are some of the comments made to an article on the nz-oz game:
Wolfman (Christchurch)
01:39 PM Monday, 20 Aug 2012
One day the whistleblowers will all be reading from the same rule book. At the moment they all seem to have their own version and stick to that, maybe it’s time for the useless referee’s boss Paddy O’Brien did something like resign. Ever since he has been the boss the standards have been garbage.
Ian (Kerikeri)
01:39 PM Monday, 20 Aug 2012
Can we not change this from “whistle blowing dominates test” to “players’ infractions dominate test”. The referee is there to keep the game within the rules. If the players decide to play so marginally that they regularly step over the line, don’t blame the ref, just play fair.
chris (New Zealand)
03:45 PM Monday, 20 Aug 2012
Good stats .now let the masters of this heavenly game count how much time is lost with 26 penalties! Lets see 26 @ 30secs each =13 minutues.Value for money I’m sure.
Then lets add the time for scrums at 40 secs each scrum.say 15 scrums per game? wow another 10 minutes lost! The game they play in heaven!
Rob ()
03:48 PM Monday, 20 Aug 2012
Wolfman
One day the whistleblowers will all be reading from the same rule book. At the moment they all seem to have their own version and stick to that, maybe it’s time for the useless referee’s boss Paddy O’Brien did something like resign. Ever since he has been the boss the standards have been garbage.
show more
Hi, I think you will find Paddy is or already has gone. Re the whistleblowers all reading from the same book, they are it is just the money providers dictating what they want from the media spectacle. If the Refs applied the Law to the letter you would have seen a lot more penalties especially at the ruck, if you can call it that. How to fix it, simplify the laws e.g.if you are on the ground leave the pill alone. And yes I am a ref with over 10 years experience at the grass roots level.
Gareth Scourfield ()
03:51 PM Monday, 20 Aug 2012
One of the problems is the blatant disregard for the rules by the players and referees during the Super competition to.”keep the game flowing”. The players then think what they are doing is OK as they are not being penalised in the super 15.One of the worst things now creeping into the game now is the “taking out” of players beyond the rucks.
Graham (Howick)
11:42 AM Tuesday, 21 Aug 2012
Usually they just give it alternatley to each side as they are only guessing most of the time. What really annoys me is this euphamistically called “cleaning out”. It is nothing but cheating. There is no intention of playing the ball. It is done with the clear intention of playing the man. Cheating full stop.
Yet all teams seem to be coached this way and the refs allow it as with the b/s sentinels standing on the side and to the front of rucks/malls to block the opposing players. Apparently as long as they are holding on to the ruck/mall they are onside and not being obstructive. B/s.
21 Aug 2012, 16:48 pm
@Transformation-270:
are you shitting me, transie..?..
get the fark out of here..?
wow
wow
farken wow
21 Aug 2012, 16:51 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-272:
easy now.
go and sit in the chillout room with poops.
21 Aug 2012, 16:53 pm
mikey z (Auckland Central)
11:49 AM Tuesday, 21 Aug 2012
Dont ***** about the ref- he has a law book, and must blow to it. Blame the players for not knowing the rules. Why should he let teams get away with infirngements? It will disadvantage the other team! Perhaps the AB supporters have forgotten that both teams should have an equal chance to win?
Dave (Northland)
11:49 AM Tuesday, 21 Aug 2012
The rule book (when I last read it) says that the ref WILL play advantage ,not “may” or “should”. Didn’t see much of it on Sat night anyhow!
mikey z (Auckland Central)
11:49 AM Tuesday, 21 Aug 2012
Gareth Scourfield
One of the problems is the blatant disregard for the rules by the players and referees during the Super competition to.”keep the game flowing”. The players then think what they are doing is OK as they are not being penalised in the super 15.One of the worst things now creeping into the game now is the “taking out” of players beyond the rucks.
show more
I agree – it is cheating plain and simple. Another thing that is creeping in is pre-determined moves where players move into an obstructing position (especially around scrums) to take out opposing loosies to create gaps (like the Chiefs v Sharks try from the scrum in the final- completely predetermined and trained hard into the Chiefs).
Dibby Auckland (Blockhouse Bay)
11:51 AM Tuesday, 21 Aug 2012
Probably for the same reason the Chiefs Kerr Barlow as not sighted for stomping on Fruen when asst refs were right on the spot. There was an awful lot of off side by both sides and what about the forward passes that the ABs got away with. I know refs are not perfect but Sat nights was appalling.
21 Aug 2012, 16:55 pm
@gunther-273:
you’re right
of course tony johnson would’ve said that
21 Aug 2012, 16:55 pm
in the EP Herald today:
Cheeky confirms they are talking to a number of Lions players, won’t mention names but Elton jantjies is highly sought after and price is no issue.
yoh!
21 Aug 2012, 16:57 pm
@Transformation-276:
Of course price is no issue.
They must have it.
If they were willing to offer Bash 3 bars jantjes must be worth at least 5.
21 Aug 2012, 17:02 pm
@gunther-277:
21 Aug 2012, 17:04 pm
@Transformation-276:
two questions:
1. where is the money coming from? (serious question)
2. do the lions have any chance of rebuilding in a years time?
21 Aug 2012, 17:05 pm
@Transformation-278:
Let me be your supersuper hero.
21 Aug 2012, 17:07 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-279: sponsors, duh
where do the bulls get the money to buy every schoolboy in the country?
21 Aug 2012, 17:11 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-279:
Robert Gumede’s tender pipeline has re-opened.
They be having it.
21 Aug 2012, 17:14 pm
@Transformation-281:
ok, big sponsors then.
the bulls historically have never paid big wages to players, transie. it did not matter your reputation. you are lucky to play for the bulls rather than the buls are lucky to have you play for them.
that and the firm belief in the legal sanctity of a lawfully agreed and signed contract. bakkies found out the hard way.
but recent times they have become wealthier through astute and honest hard work and business practise (coupled with low wage bills). no gravytraining and no dead wood. this gives them leg room to expand.
21 Aug 2012, 17:14 pm
@gunther-282: the bulls should get Patrice Motsepe on board, he supports them in any case.
21 Aug 2012, 17:15 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-203: He thinks he can mould Potgieter. Alan Solomons wanted him to stay and he rates him highly as well. Other unions have talented flankers as well. The timing was right and players can get overlooked easily enough. I have no problem with age – 26 is most certainly not old – and Meyer believes Potgieter can become a very valuable player. My problem is that he is not Bok material YET, imho. Meyer obviously thinks otherwise.
21 Aug 2012, 17:16 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-208: Like the Crusaders (what an unfortunate name imo).
21 Aug 2012, 17:17 pm
@Transformation-284:
Indeed.
We need the gravy train to pull into our station.
21 Aug 2012, 17:18 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-283: they gleefully take millions from BEE asset management firm Oasis – no gravytraining
“(coupled with low wage bills).” – putting Sadie on 1.4bar a year is considered “low wages” in pretoria heh?
21 Aug 2012, 17:19 pm
@gunther-282:
fark
not another IT tender contract?
this country cannot sustain this level of cheekiness by the business community.
how did the first one go again? he basically sold the SAPS a few cd’s with software on it for a few hundered mill?
21 Aug 2012, 17:20 pm
gym calls…
later mense
21 Aug 2012, 17:20 pm
@gunther-253: That was Paulse and not Aplon.
21 Aug 2012, 17:21 pm
or was it billion?
21 Aug 2012, 17:24 pm
@mikeybrass-286:
please, dont get me started on the crusaders.
@Transformation-288:
a overly high estimation which has since been hastily corrected. i would think they have performance clauses written in.
21 Aug 2012, 17:25 pm
@Transformation-290:
yip, i’m out too.
cheers folks
21 Aug 2012, 17:26 pm
@gunther-277: This means the Stormers won’t be getting Jantjies. We don’t have that class of $$$$$.
We are more the Checkers ‘Oddbins’ type shopper.
If money is no issue, I expect quite a trek to the EC…..
21 Aug 2012, 17:37 pm
@mikeybrass-291:
No it was Aplon.
Whilst Mallet was DOR at Province.
Didn’t rate him at all.
21 Aug 2012, 17:40 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-295:
Don’t worry.
Bash turned them down.
Someone like Elstadt will be a target though.
21 Aug 2012, 17:54 pm
@gunther-296: One would have thought Mallett would have learnt his lesson with Paulse before Aplon. Embarassed by two midgets with heart
21 Aug 2012, 17:57 pm
Indeed Mikey.
It’s seems not only Bulls coaches are obsessed with size.
21 Aug 2012, 18:17 pm
Just read abt the 1st roughly 130 comments.
For people to refer to Lambie as useless reflects once again how temperamental supporters are and 1 good game by a 17 year old in Currie Cup and I bet ya’ll be baying for him to start in the rest of the the RC!! So naive
21 Aug 2012, 18:21 pm
Is Brussouw still injured? While Coetzee has done nothing to warrant removal from a starting birth… Brussouw has time and time again shown he is world class by dominating NZ and Aus, amongst others!
21 Aug 2012, 18:27 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-263:
You are NOT the only 1 mate. The selection of Potgieter is really a disgrace as he doesn’t offer much.
Kolisi offers WAY more, especially on defence
I defended Meyer earlier on Sunday for trying out players like Pottie, nt knowing he was watching a different game to what we were,by dropping Kolisi from the touring squad!! What a joke
21 Aug 2012, 18:29 pm
@papaown-301: Out for another 3-4 weeks along with Oosthuizen.
21 Aug 2012, 18:30 pm
What annoys me soo much is…while I appreciate the importance of going into the ruck to slow the opposition recycle what you miss out is that a player like Kolisi is soo strong in the tackle that he drives ball carriers BACK or stops them dead in the tracks.
This allows time for his teammates to come in and form eg a maul of dislodge the ball. But his defence alone definetely slows down the time the opposition would have to recycle the ball as they definetely do NOT go forward!!
21 Aug 2012, 18:37 pm
@gunther-297: No. It is time for the WPRFU to put Andries Bekker out to pasture (wherever he wants). Then play Eben at 5, and Rynhardt at 4, until Quinn Roux reappears. Elstadt really is the Danie Rossouw type fellow – ESSENTIAL. Elstadt also a little injury prone due to his ‘focused and physical aggression’ tendencies, so playing him 80 mins is silly IMHO. He is a 35 minute smasher, basher and enforcer, who can replace a lock or flank. I prefer him at 4 lock, due to his wonderful work in cleaning the floors and taking out the trash at ruck time – which I do believe is a primary task of Numero 4.
No, we have to keep him. I will have to hold a fuckingcakesale to raise the necessary $$$$$. I can’t rely on my union any longer.
21 Aug 2012, 18:44 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-305: Is his lineout work up to scrath to be a lock, especially if Etzebeth plays at 5. I think Elstadt could be the next Juan Smith if he works on his lineout skills. A season at the Bulls with Matfield will do him good.
21 Aug 2012, 18:53 pm
@301 p_o Are you a ‘Tah? All of the Free State’s “name” players return over the next 3 weeks according to SS dotcom. Goosen (immediately) , Brussow & Coenie
21 Aug 2012, 18:56 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-305:
I noticed that the WP Union has at least succeeded to keep Niehaus in CT untill 2016 although am not sure whether they or the relative quality of life in CT in comparison to Snorcity (who indeed tried to lure him there) should take the credit.
21 Aug 2012, 18:59 pm
@papaown-300:
i was being sarcastic ,mate, you know many in here say he cant kick , he is slow blah blah blah, he has 1 bad game after being injured and all that travelling of the Sharks?? and they tore him to shreds in here
21 Aug 2012, 19:01 pm
@Horings-303: That’s such a pity.
What’s worse than this is Meyer is soo stubborn he wouldn’t pick Brussouw even if he was fit.
There are some selections he is VERY stubborn with and some where he’s flexible eg. Selection of Keegan Daniels.
But non-selection of Kolisi, his low view of some1 like JdJ and selecting Vermaak…sooo ridiculous!!
21 Aug 2012, 19:07 pm
@sharks_lover-309:
Never slate a player unfairly. While I don’t rate Lambie @ALL as a 15 I do rate him as a 10 and am impressed with him as a talent.
His injury not-withstanding, he was shown up quite a few times while playing@15 this season especially!
21 Aug 2012, 19:09 pm
Its a bit sad though that a year after PdV we are still talking about players and selection when the real issue is still gameplan and lack of variety and or options.
How can a national coach publically state he doesn’t believe in a Plan B?
That’s what seperates us from the All Blacks unfortunately!!
21 Aug 2012, 19:12 pm
@Robzim-308: the end result of this saga really leaves me wondering if Nienaber ever planned to leave of was using the Bulls as leverage to be paid his worth?
If his sick dad was making him think of moving to Pta, his dad was in Potch, which is not exactly next door.
The story in the beginning made me think this was a leverage play
21 Aug 2012, 19:14 pm
@papaown-311: YOu obviously not getting it, I am a big Lambie fan, not slating him, being very sarcastic to say the least lol
21 Aug 2012, 19:19 pm
@gunther-297:
Of couse Bash would have turned them down.
He is on a special dispensation at the Stormers.
Don’t have to kick the ball for futher than 30 meters, don’t need to have any tactical sense, don’t have to take the pressure passes in his own 25……and can jet off to Japan whenever he feels in need for good quality sashimi.
EP can’t beat that.
21 Aug 2012, 19:23 pm
@papaown-313:
It’s just that the sad sack jealous jillies in Pretoria like everything Cape Town has to offer.
One needs iron clad contracts these days. The okes in Pretoria think everyone in Cape Town is up for sale.
I think they were just testing the market. And trying their luck.
21 Aug 2012, 19:24 pm
@papaown-313:
It did take the Stormers about 4 months to get him to sign so you might have a point. Officially he said something about the job in CT not finished yet and that he would like to continue working with players he started with when they were still in the age group teams.Seems he is originally from Kimberley and came here via Bloemfonteyn.
21 Aug 2012, 19:24 pm
Being a big Lambie can sometimes cloud your judgment to his failings,sharks_lover.I have noticed that you get extremely agitated to criticism of Lambie.You exhibit the same defensive mechanism that Bulls fans have for Pierre Spies.
21 Aug 2012, 19:26 pm
@wnbb-318: Lambie fan.
21 Aug 2012, 19:32 pm
@Robzim-308: Niehaus
Would that be Carl? Fuckitman – even the ANC didn’t want him….and he comes with huge debt (webefucked yes indeed) 
I’m not sure if Nienaber staying for another 3 years is ‘that’ good a thing for our union (and it is not because I don’t think he is GENIUS, it is because I think he IS). As long as he is around, Fleck and co get to freeload. Until we evolve to a point where Nienaber’s ‘D system’ is not the Alpha and Omega of WP rugby…well….you know what I mean.
Now, if Fleck (or A N other backline coach…) can convince the Stormer’s senior players that ‘D’ is not the only arrow we need in our quiver, I’m not sure much will change.
21 Aug 2012, 19:35 pm
@Horings-306: Elstadt had a pretty good return rate in the lineout last season when he played 4. He is NOT the tallest, and I know many don’t think he is an international 4, but I think he COULD BE, in the scenario I described above (pure enoforcing impact).
Anyways, that is my little wish – doubt it will happen though, or that many here will agree with it.
21 Aug 2012, 19:44 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-320:
Maybe they must broaden Nienaber’s job description and make him defence AND attack coach as he seems to be the only guy they are listening to- the current attack coach can just as well talk to the wind.
21 Aug 2012, 19:44 pm
@I am a stormer-316:
I think you will find Nienaber was using the bulls to get province to pony up.
Sad sacks indeed.
21 Aug 2012, 19:49 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-321:
Agree 100%- according to the official statistics he is a cm taller than Brad Thorne and nobody ever complained that Thorne was too short for an international no 4 lock.
21 Aug 2012, 19:50 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-320:
Nienaber’s influence on the Stormers playing pattern is as clear as daylight. His record is the envy of most – including those pink blouses in Pretoria.
But I’ve yet to see the influence of Fleck on the coaching team – besides the backslapping and ^5′s in that tiny booth when a solitary try is scored. The WP/Stormers backline has pace to burn. And as Robzim has repeatedly stated, a backline without Peter Grant may well prove to be a revelation. The crabbing sideways, slow loopy passes has got to come to an end. It does my head in.
21 Aug 2012, 19:52 pm
@gunther-323:
Yeah, suddenly WPRU realised they had a valuable asset on their books. And weren’t ready for another fallout after the Pollard debacle.
21 Aug 2012, 19:58 pm
@I am a stormer-326: SO as a stormer supporter mate, tell us who got the better flyhalf between Pollard (Bulls) and Jean-luc Du Plessie(Sharks)?
21 Aug 2012, 20:12 pm
@sharks_lover-327:
I didn’t even get the privilege of casting my blue eyes on young Jan-luc in Province colours before those treacherous Sharks snaffled him.
Pollard, I hope, goes from strength to strength at the Bulls. And not like the unfortunate Sadie. And I hope he also comes right.
It just shows the powerbroking stuff happening with our young flyhalves. It is not pleasant losing a player from one’s own union but just illustrates the flyhalf talent coming through generally.
It’s going to be interesting to sit back and watch which guy makes it onto the big stage.
21 Aug 2012, 20:14 pm
@I am a stormer-325: Fleck’s influence can be seen at social gatherings, when the team get to relax a little
@gunther-323: It worked for Hougie
@Robzim-322: He who designs a ‘grantic wall of D’, would be the ideal man to plot the breach of other teams ‘less granitic walls of D’. Fleck can stick to party planning….
@sharks_lover-327: The Bulls did. Jean Luc is simply showing the WPRFU a ‘fuckoff’ for the way in which he was treated and sidelined due to Pollard being here. (Jean Luc, and the rest of the Cape, with the exception of the WPRFU knew Pollard was going yet he was given all the breaks). Jordaan coming to us, and the Bulls Craven week 10, Eksteen (who looked pretty impressive himself) I’m keen to see what Jordaan can do after being stuck in the kakkest Grey team in history this year…..
My fave buy though, is the Bulls Craven week 8, Meiring.
21 Aug 2012, 20:22 pm
I’ve had a problem with Nienabers defensive coaching for a while, which also includes ACs reliance on it. Our whole game seems to revolve around his defensive structures, which would be fine if it was gridiron where a separate defensive side and tactic comes on when possession changes hands. Unfortunately, this is rugby where defense needs to instantly change to offence, and this is where I believe he has his limitations. What is missing is balance and a defensive structure that doesn’t inhibit the ability to turn defence into attack.
21 Aug 2012, 20:23 pm
@sharks_lover-309: “and they tore him to shreds here” bwahhahahahahahahaha
clearly this affected you Sharkie, cos you’ve been trying to be “sarcastic” the whole day
HTFU!
21 Aug 2012, 20:32 pm
@papaown-312: meyer won super rugby in 2007 so you have NO RIGHT to question him!
21 Aug 2012, 20:33 pm
@David-330:
This is what we have been saying. Nienaber’s influence is evident. And involves the whole team when they encroach in our half. Fleck’s influence isn’t evident. I have yet to see any innovative backline move while Fleck has been there. He should be fired. But AC seems just too nice a guy to do the job. Fleck’s job as a top notch backline coach at this level is passed it’s sell-by date.
21 Aug 2012, 20:38 pm
@Transformation-331: Sharks_Lover has fathered 90% of the Shakrs squad. He is a proud and protective pappa, determined to boost his play-sta-SONS reputations where he can. He is the Bert le Clos of Sharks rugby, kak communication skills and all
21 Aug 2012, 20:39 pm
There is no guarantee that 18/19-year-old teenagers will become great players down the line.Why the back-slapping exercises on here by certain bloggers on the signing of these youngsters by their provinces?Rugby provinces are now becoming like professional soccer clubs who simply throw money at prominent youngsters who might simply disappear into the system in a few years time or will become disillusioned with playing time and decides to move on.Pogba,formerly of MU is a great example of this warped sense of buying up every available talent and not being able to fulfill their promises to said youngsters.Some on hear gleefully rejoice at these signings.Why?
21 Aug 2012, 20:42 pm
@David-330: We had it in 2010 though…..or rather we had a better balance. Somewhere post 2010, the coaches and senior players decided to focus purely on the ONE facet of their game in which they were the undisputed champs of the world.
Another example of what Wayne Smith said in the article someone posted here today: something about: when focusing on your strengths and ONLY your strengths, becomes a liability and shoves you backwards…
Stormers….Boks….
21 Aug 2012, 20:46 pm
Other than the first couple of pages quite clearly it has been farken idiot day today on this thread… What a lot of hogwash posted here.
21 Aug 2012, 20:47 pm
@wnbb-335:
That is the unfortunate sad reality of professional sport at such a young age. They still have to further their education.
I heard this week that a couple of the young Bulls – living in the Blue Bulls house – on junior contracts did not have their contracts renewed for next year. Youngsters must never ever depend solely on making it as a professional sportsman.
21 Aug 2012, 20:49 pm
@wnbb-335: Every union needs a few quality 10′s. A super rugby squad alone needs 2/3, never mind age group rugby, Vodacom Cup, Currie Cup etc. No-one knows this better than the WPRFU…..we used 6 I think it was last year in Super rugby alone.
Of the 4/5 young 10′s every union has, 2 might play at ‘senior’ level, or none of them will cut it.
The kids and the unions deserve the opportunity to at least try…..
In fact, with the distribution of young 10′s as it will stand next year, there is every chance that most will get game time, which is good for SA rugby is it not?
21 Aug 2012, 20:51 pm
@Heavens Game-337: And it has just reached new levels of idiocy with your entrance stage left…
G’night – over and out.
21 Aug 2012, 20:54 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-329: OK thanks, i have never seen Young Du Plessis play or the others, only Pollard of course, who is a good player
21 Aug 2012, 20:55 pm
@Heavens Game-337: Thats the norm aint it??
21 Aug 2012, 20:56 pm
@Transformation-332: Hey Mgodoyi, you hump elsewhere , ******* Msunu
21 Aug 2012, 20:58 pm
Whats that sound….?
the riffraff and roaches scuttling off….
21 Aug 2012, 21:00 pm
@sharks_lover-342: Yup… thank goodness I missed today’s new height’s of inane…
Outtahere for now… will be back later
21 Aug 2012, 21:02 pm
@Heavens Game-345: Me too cheers HG
21 Aug 2012, 21:10 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-339: I know,but I just can’t understand the gloating on here by,admittedly,certain short-sighted individuals.
21 Aug 2012, 21:18 pm
I’m starting to hope this dumb idiot Heyneke Meyer gets a very good walloping lesson to his overrated ego pretty much soon… like how about this weekend coming.
This twat is starting to show more and more he got absolutely no clue when it comes to either spotting talent or how to combine it into a winning formula.
1 lucky win vs England at home, 1 lucky draw and a 50-50 return against Argentina at home. That is his credit rating so far.
I reckon this idiot gets a good idea of how far off the real keen aspect of rugby relevancy he is when he meets either of NZ or Aussie pretty soon.
His lack of any real rugby acumen is already started coming screaming to the fore.. and i reckon he’s aiming for a huge smack to his overrated ego and it gonna floor him bad.. and I dunno if he’ll have the low down guts to get over it too easy either.
21 Aug 2012, 21:41 pm
@londonshark-191: Meyer is a goddamn moron and its starting to show.. real bad.
21 Aug 2012, 21:49 pm
PdV is starting to look like an absolute genius next to this thick goddamn idiot Heyneke Meyer
Strange how all the idiots in the world somehow succeed at this thick as two bricks game called rugby.. Jake the Moron Snake White, Clive the Connive Woodward, next up Heyneke the seinige Meyer.
21 Aug 2012, 21:53 pm
@fitz1ella-348:
You’re a hard man, skop. And unreasonable. How the hell can you hope the national coach gets a walloping just because he doesn’t tie in with your views.
As we stand right now, HM’s Bok team has yer=t to lose. Not a bad start to a career. I know for a fact that Meyer is passionate for the Boks. And he has stated that any player – be it a Bulls player or not – will be shown the door is he is underperforming.
I’m also disappointed that more Stormers players haven’t been included. Or this week excluded and here I think Kolisi and de Jong. That doesn’t mean the door has been slammed in the faces. It means that the current Bok players have to pull finger otherwise they will also be out.
Heyneke obviously realises what his waiting for him. That he will be judged on what happens against Aus and NZ.
Heyneke needs to be given more space and time to deliver. And people need to get off his back.
21 Aug 2012, 22:00 pm
@I am a stormer-351: I think he’s a moron and gonna get a fat smack to his fat ego pretty soon..
forget Stormers vs Sharks vs Bulls vs Cheetahs.. its down to his stuffed up rugby philosophy and his blind as a bat moronic idiocy that he’s gonna get whats coming and get it smack where it matters to his big fat non enlightened sense of stubborn stupidity.. that’s where.
21 Aug 2012, 22:04 pm
@fitz1ella-352:
Skop, the skittlesticks Proteas are ranked no. 1 in the world right now. Aren’t you proud.
That’s where Heyneke wants the rugby Boks. Be patient.
21 Aug 2012, 22:06 pm
always feel it says a great deal about the character of an individual who wilfully turns against his team to make a perceived statement about a coach or another individual such as a particular player.
the Springboks are more than the coach.
this is no real supporter, he has no allegiance or loyalty.
21 Aug 2012, 22:08 pm
whats this bullshit ‘needs to be given more time and space to deliver’.. so far Heyneke has been cocooned from stuffing up beyond compare.. by default he didn’t get his first wish Matfield, by default he didn’t get his second wish FdP, by default he was forced to select the better captain in the country De Villiers, by default he loses Spies, not by design..
So far Meyer has blundered onto a reasonable set of circumstances not by his first wishes or design but by circumstance only.. soon his lucky packet decisions are gonna smack him where he don’t wanna know.. wait till this goon Potgieter and his lack of fortification in the back bone of the pack comes unstuck.. lucky for him Pocock is now out and Aussie also struggling to put a decent team together without top locks and loosies, but Boks should be creaming the opposition with the CORRECT mix of players and abilities put together into a team / squad.
He’s going retrograde and everybody reckons we are forging ahead, when actually we going in reverse gear unbeknown to most fundi’s out there.
21 Aug 2012, 22:12 pm
@Humphrey-354: fck off wooden spoon come out your hidy hole big fat quack
since when I gotta wave my green / yellow bandanna and be another little skaap going baa baa white sheep please moron be my baaskap coach? The twat is an idiot and he dunno which way is up nor down.
21 Aug 2012, 22:14 pm
@fitz1ella-356: huh? seriously though, do you support the team or the coach? if you support the coach then I can see why you may be having such a hard time.
21 Aug 2012, 22:14 pm
if you support the team then no way will you ever want to see them lose.
21 Aug 2012, 22:16 pm
humpty fcking dumpty sat on a wall
humphrey fcking dumbfrey had a great fall
and all the little wishful thinkers and all the happy clappy’s couldn’t put humpty nor dumbfrey together again.
21 Aug 2012, 22:16 pm
@fitz1ella-355:
When I say he needs to be given more space and time, that is exactly what I meant.
He has been in charge of precisely 4 test matches. Watch my hands. FOUR.
Give the guy a break.
21 Aug 2012, 22:16 pm
no way can anyone call themselves a true supporter when they desire the team to lose just because the coach gets up their nose a little bit. only a small and limited man would think like that.
21 Aug 2012, 22:17 pm
that was funny fitz1ella. you’re a poet and you know-it.
21 Aug 2012, 22:20 pm
@fitz1ella-359:
Skop, how do you think I should go on superbru this weekend?
Boks by 15 should do the trick.
21 Aug 2012, 22:20 pm
kindergarten humour though. how old are you fitz1ella? i get the sense from your other posts that you may be a senior citizen.
21 Aug 2012, 22:23 pm
problem with supporting a team is you got to get lumbered with some goddamn moron’s who think they f’ng gifted by God or something equally insane to coach a rugby team to success… while back at the ranch these goddamn self anointing idiots dunno the first thing about what comprises a good decision from a bad one.. and the moron idiot supporters like me just got to lump all the bullshit and say thank you Mr. idiot keep making fuckups but I’ll continue supporting schmucks like you for better or for worse…
fck that I never asked to get lumped with this twat.. if he fcks up I’m gonna be the first to tell him and tell him what I think of his moronic self anointed grand style idiocy
21 Aug 2012, 22:28 pm
i dunno hey. when I see Meyer in the coach’s ox on tv he seems to possess a lot of passion and when he speaks on tv he is humble and well spoken, never rude and i don’t know where you get the vibe that he thinks he’s “god’s gift” or anything similar. i’m also sure he is trying his best.
no, i just think it is a bit weak not to be the better man and resort to name calling, castigating and wishing losses and misfortune on anyone. rather just go along with it all and you may actually enjoy yourself.
21 Aug 2012, 22:29 pm
@fitz1ella-365: you are already coming down on him though, arent you?
which coach have you ever actually enjoyed?
to be fair though, i was also quite unimpressed with our display vs the argies. meyer must sharpen up the game plan in short order.
21 Aug 2012, 22:32 pm
meyer is fine, but he’s gotta get rid of the bloubultrul blinkers quicksmart – there are at least 4 or 5 stormers players that should be promotoed to the 22 as well as Brussow, which is a gdam travesty. potgieter out, morne has to go to bench and they need to start playing with more variation, the collisions must be won that is fundamental and correct, but there are other attacking nuances that must be focussed on and they do not include morne sticking every hailmary into the air or hougaard becoming a halfback kicking general or picking players that are disciples mediocrities rather than offer some real impact as individuals.
21 Aug 2012, 22:35 pm
@cab-368: i agree with your post. Potgieter, Spies (when he returns from inj), M Steyn, Olivier (when returns from inj) and Zane Kirchner – not one of them are world beaters. and the Boks need to add some flair and attacking unpredictability to their kick and bash game. the kiwis and ozzies will eat us alive and outsmart us big time otherwise.
i wasn’t impressed at all with the game against Arg.
21 Aug 2012, 22:38 pm
you dunno.. that’s correct.. just like most the skaapies in the country also don’t know…
they dunno if they barking up the right tree or the wrong one.. that’s about as much as they know… long as it looks like its the right one.. then that’s goodly golly fine and dandy.. don’t come all baffled when right from wrong gets turned around, and what you thought was right turns out to be wrong.
21 Aug 2012, 22:40 pm
Boks could be in serious trouble this weekend with the pack being picked against argie in mendoza – alberts and beast are too little for meyer’s gameplan – pogieter will be toothless away from the tannies, daniels and coetzee will be too light for the gauchos, bekker is more at home in the centres, etsebeth is fantastic young promising talent which is too green and strauss is disctinctyly ordinary.
This touring squad could seriously be in danger of kakking off, Keo reckons the Boks never lose to the Argies, and that is obvious, well laat ons sien – this squad could get picked clean and they going to blame hougaard who will have nothing to do with it.
Elstadt, Kolisi and Brussow should go straight into the starting team and will make a v competitve Bok squad that could even take the ABs, though that would also need D Fourie and Vermeulen and JdJ and Aplon to be there. I’d also give Cilliers a start – shoulda got it at home. This squad is actually at least 7 or 8 players off its optimimum, and they going to pay i reckon.
21 Aug 2012, 22:41 pm
you are correct in that it is far far far too early to tell. lets wait and see, if he doesn’t stack up then we can all jump on his back but for the time being lets roll with it and enjoy the ride while we can. their is an inevitability with bok coaches which is that sooner or later, it all goes tits up. so make merry while the sun shines would be my advice.
21 Aug 2012, 22:41 pm
Skop, Heyneke understands Hougaard’s shortcomings but understand his strengths as well. By this I mean pushing Hougie out to wing when Ruan comes on. And with Ruan grabbing his opportunities, his starting position can’t be too far away. Maybe this weekend even with Hougaard in the number 14 jersey. Particularly with Habana on crutches.
21 Aug 2012, 22:42 pm
@cab-371: alberts and beast “too little” now i have heard it all! alberts and beast are the motors in that engine room.
21 Aug 2012, 22:51 pm
This okie is gonna go into a test match vs AB’s with
Kirchner
Engelbrecht
De Villiers
Steyn
Mvovo
Steyn
Hougaard
Daniel
Alberts
Coetsee
Kruger
Etsebeth
JdP
Strauss
Beast
Greyling, Liebenberg, Cilliers, Vd Merwe, Potgieter, Pienaar, Lambie
good luck Mnr Messiah.. I hope AB’s fck you up something chronic wake you from out your befuddled stupor.
21 Aug 2012, 22:53 pm
@Humphrey-374:
i mean they are the only engines, and two engines aint enough to fly a gdam superjumbo.
21 Aug 2012, 22:57 pm
Kolisi is very much similar to Coetzee. You pick the one or the other. Elstadt has been mediocre at best for the Stormers and may I add Coetzee, Alberts, Daniels and Kankowski absolutely demolished the Stormers a few weeks ago. Brussow is injured or am I the only one knowing that. Deon Fourie and Cilliers in the front row? Is jy ge*** in jou kop? Talk about provincialism at its absolute best.
Please put your starting pack on the screen!!!
21 Aug 2012, 22:57 pm
@I am a stormer-373: Hougaard is one position I don’t mess with… all these moegoes wanting to start Pienaar.. do so at their own peril… Pienaar don’t have a 10th of Hougaard’s tenacity or his fighting spirit.. AB’s will destroy Pienaar in 15 minutes flat.
Hougaard must stick at 9 and get to whip the ball out smart.. like he was doing fine last weekend for the first time since the English series. Pretorius should be back up scrummy not Vermaak, Pienaar only good as a backup on a 5-2 bench where versatility counts more than specialization.
21 Aug 2012, 23:01 pm
Strauss vs Deon Fourie. Strauss the more physical. Strauss the better lineout frower. Strauss the better with ball in hand. Fourie the better fetcher. Well in that case why dont we start with Stegmann at hooker and bring Brussow in at hooker when we play NZ. They can pack down with Cilliers at tighthead. Great, I will rather have Cab and some other supporters as the coaching team than Heyneke.
21 Aug 2012, 23:02 pm
@Horings-379: @Horings-377: directed at the idiot in @cab-371:
21 Aug 2012, 23:03 pm
if that team is picked they not only deserve to get thumped, they will get badly done, if not by argies by the ABs – i reckon the argies can take that team.
useless fools
got an entire set of like-for-like replacements waiting in the wings
Bismarck cant throw for tofee, is aggressive, strongballcarrier, strong fetcher, gets go-forward – you got a direct replacement in Deon Fourie and he’s not even in the squad.
There are no genuine enforcer locks in SA, apart from one who is still young himself, but has put Bakkies, Schalk and Alberts flat on their arse – and he’s not even in the squad.
Brussow is probably the best fetcher in the world and he is not even in the squad – its complete madness, now bismarck and coenie are out – now what?
They’ve Potgieter, Daniel and Coetzee who are all ballrunners on looser super rugby games- not test forwards who bang ppl back in the tackle – Kolisi has been doing this consistently the whole season – what the hell is the oke playing second fiddle to the other 3 for?
The sharks are utterly useless unless all 3 of Bismark, Alberts and BEast play – we’ve seen this happen this season where they got turned everytime these three werent around, and so what do they do but pick 6 of the 8 pack as sharks, when its the stormers who’ve actually got the players to replace and indeed add to the sharks 3 if one or two to go down, which is exactly the case here.
21 Aug 2012, 23:05 pm
Kolisi is not similar to Coetsee they would compliment each other far better than Daniel, Alberts and Coetsee
Coetsee is not an open side flank he is an 8th man… Kolisi can cover all 3 positions in back row WAY better than that one track idiot moron Potgieter…
If Brussow and Vermeulen were fit different scenario, but to play Daniel, Alberts, Coetsee and Potgieter.. like cab says it could happen and I’m almost hoping Argies fck these nincompoops up lekker this weekend.
Just what the doktor would have ordered for Herr Messiah to catch a mighty fine wake up on Sunday morning
Who is Heyneke going to rely on for his Steel man enforcer.. Young wet behind the ears Etsebeth,??. he going to fck the poor kid up before he gets out of puberty… or his next best option slow behemoth deluxe Vd Merwe ?
21 Aug 2012, 23:06 pm
@Horings-379:
strauss more physical than fourie?
kak man, in what universe?
21 Aug 2012, 23:07 pm
@cab-381: Brussow is injured!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
“Bismarck cant throw for tofee, is aggressive, strongballcarrier, strong fetcher, gets go-forward – you got a direct replacement in Deon Fourie and he’s not even in the squad.” Even comparing Fourie with Bismark? Hoe gesuip is jy?
Have you seen Coetzee play? He is not running loose. He is in the first channel time after time. Similar to Kolisi.
At least some of the players in this team can win high intensity finals. If you get to pick your team they will choke.
21 Aug 2012, 23:09 pm
@cab-383: I refer to Cheetahs vs Sharks where Bismark and Strauss had one huge battle. Bismark knocked Strauss out early on but he came back and played a monster game. I would like Fourie to replicate that effort. Deon Fourie is not a test match hooker. Finish and klaar!
21 Aug 2012, 23:11 pm
@fitz1ella-382: I agree with you on Potgieter’s selection.
21 Aug 2012, 23:16 pm
@Horings-385:
you’ve never seen fourie in a test match in any position so how can it be finish and klaar?
what i saw was a player picked to play no 8 who tore thru the balls completely and utterly at loftus to win MOTM (no mean feat for someone supposedly not physical or a test match player) – it was an amazing performance – strauss is dictinctly average, he does everything well and nothing brilliantly. Fourie breaks tackles, wins turnover, is supremely fit and agressive as all fk – he is bismark uitgeknip – and who they pick – teddybear and the red-faced character liebenberg who has some fire but not even remotely in the physical attributes of fouries strenght and fitness.
21 Aug 2012, 23:20 pm
Coetsee, Daniel, Potgieter and Spies are all ballruners – they are fast flankers, ideal for SA hard fields and super rugby where’s its candyfloss loose. By all means pick one of them, not all of them.
In test rugby, you need ppl that win the collisions, that is what getting go-forward momentum is all about and the above-mentioned ballrunners do not that – they get driven back in the tackle if there’s no-one to break the adv line. Alberts is not enough.
The pack balance is wrong. Lets see what happens this saturday.
21 Aug 2012, 23:21 pm
@cab-387: I do not have to see him in a test match to make up my mjind. I also know Hercu Liebenberg is not a test match hooker as well as Willie Wepener. They are pretty much in the same league as Fourie.
21 Aug 2012, 23:23 pm
@cab-388: Heyneke wrote the book on picking players for collisions! I think he has the rights for using the word collisions in a rugby context.
21 Aug 2012, 23:26 pm
@cab-387: correct
all these people use isolated provincial scenarios like Sharks got lucky 3 times to do in Stormers this year, once without Kolisi and all 3 times without Vermeulen, to second guess their educated assumptions on who is international caliber and who not.. so Daniel, Kankowski, Coetsee are supposedly international caliber loose forwards…
we already know who is not international caliber
but we have never seen Kolisi, Elstadt, or Fourie in a Springbok test match..
we have seen the likes of Olivier, Spies, Kirchner, Kankowski, Vd. Merwe, M. Steyn, and even Daniel, Strauss and Potgieter in green and gold.. but never have we seen Kolisi, Fourie or Elstadt..
so let Heyneke play that team at @fitz1ella-375: above vs AB’s he gonna see his gat so bad, I’m almost feeling sorry for him already.
I’m out to fetch a son…
21 Aug 2012, 23:28 pm
@Horings-390:
i dont think he’s got any rights over anything – ive seen one very good half of rugby against a young touring england side missing half their best players – since when does any bok coach get an easy ride without proving his worth?
he is not picking players to win the collisions, and the bulls no longer have the players to win the collisions, which is why they are losing – Danie, BAkkies and Gurthro – all gone, no-one left to win the collisions.
21 Aug 2012, 23:31 pm
Deon Fourie almost always beats his first man. Great player. Pity about his lineout throwing. Other than that we as WP and Stormers supporters have lots to be thankful for where Fourie is concerned. Great ball carrier and poacher!
21 Aug 2012, 23:34 pm
@fitz1ella-391: The Boks will probably lose against ABs and then you will come on this site and say “I told you so”. It is not to say your team would have done better. Vermeulen will make a difference. He is good enough and he would have been picked if fit. But he is not yet fit. Elstadt is very physical in defence and tall enough to be good in the lineouts, although he has not shown it yet. I like him, and I think he is a good prospect, but he will not be the difference. Let us pick the following team: Beast, Fourie, Cilliers, Etzebeth, Bekker, Kolisi, Elstadt and Alberts. Do you really think this team will stand a chance against NZ?
21 Aug 2012, 23:34 pm
@Horings-389:
You are wrong.. Fourie is test match standard through and through.. but Heineke got same fckup delinquency as White and some others its related to size vs ability … same reason White lost 49-0… same type outright stupidity which he now has learned the lesson and picks players like Hooper and Pocock first on his team sheet.
That why Heyneke ditched Brussow for Potgieter and why he goes Strauss and Liebenberg over Fourie..
You are all WRONG.. all of you…. pound for pound and guts for guts, physicality for physicality Fourie and Brussow SMASH the likes of Potgieter, Kankowski and even Daniel and Coetsee …
and so does Siya Kolisi.. but neither you nor Heyneke even know it….
and best enforcer 7 / 4 in the country is Elstadt.., to compliment and backstop behind Alberts… not Vd Merwe or Etsebeth, who should be at 5… next on the list is the young PSDT
21 Aug 2012, 23:35 pm
@W.P-393: “almost always”. Bwahaha!!!
21 Aug 2012, 23:38 pm
who you think will win the following collisions:
elstadt vs any of kruger, becker, etsebeth, flip
kolisi vs any of coetzee, daniel, spies, kankowski or spies
fourie vs any of strauss, liebenberg (rallapelle is better than both of these as well)
If Brussow is injured and Bismark and Oosthuizen is out – then the selection of Fourie makes even more sense – cos he wins an enormous amount of turnover ball – he did it all day vs the bulls, he ran through, stole the ball off of them and even out-fought them.
what more do you want? surely he’d make a proud bull if he was not in strepe?
21 Aug 2012, 23:39 pm
lots of whingeing coming from the Stormer brigade.
every year we hear from them how the Bok team should be made up of their precious Stormers… and they have the audacity to cry provincialism too!
21 Aug 2012, 23:40 pm
stormers are all hype and have been for over almost 2 decades now. when it comes to the business they implode in amongst all the hype.
21 Aug 2012, 23:40 pm
@Horings-394: that pack better than the one Heyneke going with this weekend… but I wouldn’t drop Coetsee I’d play him at No.8 and keep Alberts at 7 and play Elstadt either at 4 with Etsebeth at 5 or play Elstadt off bench as Alberts backup…
Beast, Fourie, Cilliers, Elstadt / (Etsebeth), Etsebeth / (Bekker / Kruger), Kolisi, Alberts, Coetsee
will donner
Beast, Strauss, JdP, Etsebeth, Kruger / Bekker, Coetsee, Alberts, Daniel..
I would bet on that…
21 Aug 2012, 23:40 pm
@fitz1ella-395: Wont agree on Fourie. Elstadt I agree with. Danie Rossouw in the making, although not as athletic, but he will probably not lose as many balls in contact.
You always talk up the youngsters. My question is, do you stand by them through the years?
21 Aug 2012, 23:42 pm
@Humphrey-398: @Humphrey-398: you’re a moron.. that’s why its you who are ACTUALLY the dumb fck provincialist here while others are looking at INDIVIDUAL talents and putting them to BEST use.. unlike schmucks such as you and Heyneke Meyer…
I’m out.. son is waiting.
21 Aug 2012, 23:45 pm
@fitz1ella-400:
that first side u picked could even give the ABs a run if they actually attacked them as well.
21 Aug 2012, 23:45 pm
@fitz1ella-402: check your post 391 and tell me you don’t have a provincial bias…
21 Aug 2012, 23:46 pm
@fitz1ella-400: Fourie in combination with Elstadt and Etzebeth means we will not win any lineout balls. Did they not play together for the Stormers against the Force or Reds this year, where the lineouts were terrible.
Beast, Strauss, JdP -scrums to them. Lineouts have been mentioned. Daniel adds some flair and skill.
I will take the second team and take your loose trio.
21 Aug 2012, 23:48 pm
@Horings-405: And I did not even mention my team has less choking ability. We are playing a “final” against the ABs, right?
22 Aug 2012, 00:05 am
My assessment of what the loss of the listed names in the article means, with 10/10 extremely damaging, and 1/10, um who cares:
Bismarck du Plessis 9
Schalk Burger 7
Jaque Fourie 7
Danie Rossouw 4
Bakkies Botha 5
Fourie du Preez 7
Duane Vermeulen 6
Johan Goosen 8
Pierre Spies 2
JP Pietersen 8
22 Aug 2012, 00:11 am
@hanneslom-407:
I would have given Spies a 1 and added Rattle Brussouw with an 8
22 Aug 2012, 00:19 am
@hanneslom-407: You should have given Botha and Burger a higher score, physical players like those two win you games. It’s questionable to give Goosen that a high a score whenever he has never even played test rugby.
22 Aug 2012, 00:27 am
@whatever-408: @Big Hit-409:
funny – did consider what both of you suggest…
to me, the 8 for goosen because it robbed us of the chance to blood him, then again, meyer was going to play it safe either way…
spies, ok, i can also settle for a 0
22 Aug 2012, 00:29 am
Shall we call this the Hurtimpacto meter?
22 Aug 2012, 00:30 am
or the SoreScore
22 Aug 2012, 00:55 am
@hanneslom-407:
2 for Spies or is it .2 ?
22 Aug 2012, 05:30 am
Come on guys get it right for Spies, its -2
22 Aug 2012, 05:59 am
After dominating SB teams for the last decade I wouldn’t pick any Bulls players in the forward pack. That’s the sad reality.
22 Aug 2012, 06:43 am
@hanneslom-407:
A fair damage assessment, here is a revised one:
Bismarck du Plessis 9
Schalk Burger 8
Jaque Fourie 7
Danie Rossouw 6
Bakkies Botha 7
Fourie du Preez 3
Duane Vermeulen – An unknown quantity at test level
Johan Goosen – An unknown quantity at test level
Pierre Spies 0
JP Pietersen – 5, flagged in 3 easy tries through by the Poms recently
J Smith -8, sadly is done with rugby
Brussouw – 6, he needs two big, beast loose forwards to operate effectively
22 Aug 2012, 06:50 am
@CoachPete-414:
A real bust, must be some medical reason he avoids contacts for so long?
A remnants of his blood clot in 2007?
22 Aug 2012, 07:12 am
@Hondo-417:
Amazing he has played rugby at such a high level?
Not sure whats wrong but never seems to go flat out
22 Aug 2012, 07:33 am
Lure of coaching too great for Graham Henry
DUNCAN JOHNSTONE
Last updated 16:38 22/08/2012
With the dust finally settled from his World Cup success, Sir Graham Henry admitted he couldn’t resist the chance to start coaching again and didn’t hesitate to answer Sir John Kirwan’s request to join the
Blues.
Henry’s position as technical
advisor was confirmed today in a powerful coaching lineup headed by Kirwan that also includes All Blacks skills coach Mick Byrne as the forwards coach and Australian Grant Doorey as the backline boss.
22 Aug 2012, 07:41 am
@Transformation-419:
Seems the Blues are acquiring some high profile big hitting coaching talent. Had to google this Grant Doorey fellow, seems he has the nous also to get the Blues back to where they belong.
22 Aug 2012, 07:44 am
@Transformation-419:
well there go the blues
expect the kiwis to play to script
he might struggle going against ws though
it’ll be a case of who sinks to the bottom faster
when filth meets filth…
22 Aug 2012, 07:46 am
…there’s only one winner… and it aint rugby…
22 Aug 2012, 08:30 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-422:
Who may I ask is this “only one winner?”
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-421:
It seems to me you are the lucky talisman of Nz Rugby, whoever you accuse of being filth usually go good……..hehe……keep it coming matey.
22 Aug 2012, 08:37 am
AB skills coach as forward coach. What a difference to what we expect in our forwards.
22 Aug 2012, 09:03 am
@Transformation-419: Very good news this.
22 Aug 2012, 09:03 am
@Te Rangatira-423:
negative cynical play is the winner. you know, the bad stuff… the bad guys… unsporting contests, rigged outcomes, empty hollow victories… in no way enjoyable to the vast majority of the rugby loving and watching spectators in the sh and probably the north too.
hehehe well i have been on the money with my filth calls havn’t i. i called it at the chiefs so expect the blues to come good too. only difficulty of course is gh going head to head with ws in the lowest common denominator stakes.
its anybodies guess who’ll come out tops there. add to this the ever and ever desperate blackadder and you’ve got your recipe for an unsporting spectacle supreme right there.
good thing i’m done with sr. who you do you support tr? if its the hurricanes or highlanders i wish you all the best going forward.
22 Aug 2012, 09:04 am
@Te Rangatira-420: And they will get there….happy days for the absolute and undisputed Kiwi franchise champions of my heart.
22 Aug 2012, 09:09 am
expect that litlle slug rene ranger to thrive under gh.
22 Aug 2012, 09:15 am
@Te Rangatira-420: It is about time the Blues are back to where they should be ( at least top 4) … So who is this Grant Doorey fellow … need to know my opposition !
22 Aug 2012, 09:17 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-428: Now that is a player that i hope reaches his potential next season .. exciting player
22 Aug 2012, 09:18 am
@Hondo-416: Has Juan smith now officially retired ?
22 Aug 2012, 09:20 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-426:
I will miss your unbiased opinions, Houston come Super Rugger time, the mighty Blues could do with your cheating filth calls next year, the more utterances of “hollow victories” from you would be music to my ears.
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-427:
Thankyou Pedigree……. Stormers v Blues final next year.
22 Aug 2012, 09:23 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-427:
i will say this, i respect the way in which the nzru / wider kiwi stakeholders / backroom boys / behind the scene people have acknowledged and identified the problems at the blues franchise and having now reached a turning point, have put in place measures and a rescue plan aimed at fixing it.
the blues have languished and this was a long time coming.
contrast this with our sorry arsed saru mini wigs / wider sa fakeholders / backdoor boys / behind the obscene people – and the way in which they have responded to the sorry lions saga.
they have languished… and the cavalry is a long time coming…
22 Aug 2012, 09:24 am
@stew-430:
oh he will
i do not doubt that
22 Aug 2012, 09:26 am
@Te Rangatira-432:
hehehe
so you’re a blues fan then.
enjoy it, tr.
22 Aug 2012, 09:29 am
@stew-429:
Some Aussie dude who seems to have a good resume. The Blues will need to find the right cattle now if they are to make top four, a first five would be the top of the list, decent locks, a no8 and bring back Nacewa.
22 Aug 2012, 09:34 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-435:
yep Houston, not counting my chickens yet the real business is done on the field, but good start with putting some decent coaches in the setup.
I hope your team does well too, Houston.
22 Aug 2012, 09:40 am
@Te Rangatira-436: Or Evans ????
22 Aug 2012, 09:43 am
I see that Goosen will be available for FS this weekend.
22 Aug 2012, 09:46 am
@stew-438:
I was thinking of poaching Horell from the Chiefs and one of those Highlanders first fives, I like Sopoanga. Nick Evans boat has sailed
22 Aug 2012, 09:46 am
@Te Rangatira-432: For me at least
, Super rugby is all about TWO teams….The Stormers (1) and the Blues (2). I couldn’t give a flying feckonfridays about the rest (but will always admire a good performance from any team – with the Cheetahs topping my ‘best of the rest’ charts)
I am keen to see any new player signings that ‘might’ still pop up in Auckland.
I must be honest, my best year of Super rugby ever, was 2011. Blues and Stormers in semi-finals, with the chance of a final between the 2 at Newlands – living the dream I was. (Until the Reds and Saders woke me up)
22 Aug 2012, 09:49 am
Lions upset with Coetzee
2012-08-22 07:44
Cape Town – Golden Lions president Kevin de Klerk is upset after Western Province and Stormers coach Allister Coetzee hinted he might look at luring a few Lions players for next year’s Super Rugby competition.
WP take on the Golden Lions in a Currie Cup clash in Johannesburg on Saturday and with the Lions out of the reckoning for next year’s Super Rugby, some of their players could be the target of other unions. Players like Elton Jantjies, Pat Cilliers, Franco van der Merwe, Josh Strauss, JC Janse van Rensburg and Jaco Taute could well be targeted.
http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/CurrieCup/Lions-upset-with-Coetzee-20120821
22 Aug 2012, 09:50 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-433: Don’t expect this to change anytime soon. In fact, expect the incompetence to reach NEW levels of the ‘totally absurd’ in the coming years. I know I am, which is why nothing the fools at SARU say, do or promise will upset or shock me any longer.
22 Aug 2012, 09:52 am
“I really like Allister a lot, but I’m absolutely stunned that he made such an opportunistic statement. Where is the spirit of sport and the respect between us? What’s going on here is not sport.
“What happened to us was not our decision.
“I’m asking politely that they (the other unions) just portray a little bit of etiquette,” said De Klerk.
22 Aug 2012, 09:55 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-441:
I appreciate good rugby, Pedigree, the hard stuff coupled with some exciting back play, can’t say I support any teams outside North Island of Nz. I lived down Hamilton for a bit and played in the local club comp there and went to school in the Counties region and played there also, so follow the progress of the Chiefs, but I live in Auckland and my family is from Northland so my heart is with the Blues.
22 Aug 2012, 09:57 am
@David-439:
looking forward to seeing him play
not expecting much though
he’ll need a few games to get up to speed
22 Aug 2012, 10:00 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-444: oh sherbert….now KdK is begging other unions to leave his players alone
it’s the professional era KdK etiquette is for AMATEURS…
22 Aug 2012, 10:04 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-446:
I’m looking forward to seeing him carve up too. The sooner he gets up to speed the better for the Bok. Heres hoping HM will give him free reign when he makes it in the test side…….I think I’m getting a bit ahead of myself.
22 Aug 2012, 10:05 am
@Te Rangatira-440: With coaches like Kirwin and Henry they got the feelin that they will want to play with an etablished first five – i expect they will be on the hunt
22 Aug 2012, 10:06 am
shame, De Klerk sounds like a beggar.
what is happening to the lions will go down as sarus biggest failure ever.
i welcome the kings and look forward to seeing fresh match ups but i am saddened that saru and the lions management let things get so bad.
actually, the lions management deserve to be publicly flogged for their part in allowing this union to hit rock bottom.
its defo not the kings fault, they want inclusion just like any other franchise would so i dont blame them at all and even though i trust cheeky not at all, i think he has been very smart and hopefully will build the kings into a strong franchise.
22 Aug 2012, 10:07 am
@stew-449:
Dan will look good in a Blues jersey then.
22 Aug 2012, 10:08 am
and lets be honest, if we can unlock even more talent from the EC then our rugby will be even healthier.
22 Aug 2012, 10:09 am
@Transformation-447:
‘its just not sport’ boet hehehe
what a way to sink with your ship. he reminds me of the italian captain coward who jumped ship off that cruise liner earlier in the year.
kevin was the captain when the lions ship sailed into rocks… now he wants to get all melodramatic and shift blame.
22 Aug 2012, 10:11 am
of course wp’s ‘dirty dealin player stealin’ is not lost on me.
take note pedigree and chums…
22 Aug 2012, 10:13 am
@Te Rangatira-448:
yip
although he should in the first instance accept and be happy with just being the incumbent (morne’s going nowhere soon), thats all. lots of bench warming and if he keeps his head up and sacrifices for the team cause then his chance will come.
22 Aug 2012, 10:21 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-455:
yep….sometimes you have to bide your time, listen and learn, but it would take a massive effort from Morne to keep young Goosen from unseating him at no10, probably the biggest challenge he has had to face in his career.
22 Aug 2012, 10:22 am
@stew-449: Oh there will be signings…..and good ones at that. A huge playmaker at 10 (they will be searching….) And I reckon they will be looking for ‘old school’ Blues type forwards, back to Blues basics.
This only bodes well for Blues rugby.
@rangerman-450: Spot on! de Klerk and his fools are looking for pity and respect in all the wrong places. Until now, I have yet to see ONE of them take even the slightest bit of responsibility for the fuckup that is, and has been Lions rugby for years………
It is always everyone else at fault, Gumede, Sponsors, The Pumas and Valke, Players, coaches, other unions, SARU blah blah blah blah blah.
Until they man up, and start shouldering at least 80% of the blame for this cockedupabortion – they deserve ZERO respect, and ZERO sympathy. I reserve all my respect for the loyal Lions fans.
22 Aug 2012, 10:24 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-454:
You say this when the Bulls has already taken Hattingg, Willemse and the other kid lock from the Lions? And if rumour is to be believed, quite a few Lions players are already packing their bags for Tshwane 
WPRFU will be left with the remnants my friend…..
22 Aug 2012, 10:30 am
However it is when you get to back-up that there are problems for the Sharks, and Plumtree has said that he will look for options overseas in his quest to fill the void left by the injury to Du Plessis and subsequent loss of Burden.
Be bold Plumtree….lure Schalk Brits home !
22 Aug 2012, 10:33 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-458:
low profile players with ‘pay as you go’ contracts can hardly be compared to dangling carrots for elton and josh tsk tsk… and the bulls were fishng them before the relegation.
besides, but this is all about ‘respect and etiquette’, my man
there is a good way and a bad way to do business, and wp’s not doing it nicely…. according to kevvie.
dont take cheap shots at wounded lions in public my friend….
22 Aug 2012, 10:35 am
i see tiaan and burden’s running neck and neck in the poll.
22 Aug 2012, 10:36 am
@grant10-459: Brits can’t scrum to save his life. As for his throwing, maybe he can hit the barn door now.
22 Aug 2012, 10:39 am
@mikeybrass-462:
my feelings too
he is a flank masquerading as a hooker
22 Aug 2012, 10:39 am
@mikeybrass-462: Sukkel om n perd se gwar met n beach ball raak te gooi……
22 Aug 2012, 10:41 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-463: Agree. Ball in hand he is quite usefull and defence is pretty solid. Any reason why he has.nt been tested there?
22 Aug 2012, 10:45 am
@grant10-459:
That would be an unbelievable signing.
But there is one problem and that is that Plumtree is dead set on developing Burden and Kyle Coopere as his future hookers.
Cooper is injured now but when he is fit and when Burden does return to the Sharks after Chilli returns to the Boks, he’ll be left with trying to rotate 3 classy hookers.(sounds a bit rude I know)
Also, if Brits does return, he’ll be looking for something longer term.
Methinks Plum will look for someone as a very short term stop gap.
22 Aug 2012, 10:46 am
@grant10-459: Yeah Grant plum does not have more options,
Bismark, Cooper injured, Burden now with Boks and Hadebe getting a start he is having to call up Marais the Junior Bok hooker from our already depleted under 21 squad
22 Aug 2012, 10:47 am
@mikeybrass-462: @i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-463:
This early in the CC, with all the Boks away, Brits would absolutely dominate.
But as I said above, it wont happen.
22 Aug 2012, 10:48 am
@sharks_lover-467:
Oh ya, forgot about Hadebe. Good player.
22 Aug 2012, 10:48 am
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-464:
22 Aug 2012, 10:50 am
Big news.
Johan Goosen starting for the Tahs against the Kwas this weekend.
Very happy bout that.
22 Aug 2012, 10:50 am
@John Galt-469: Good player, played SA Schools, just he is the last one left lol
we have 4 hookers away with injuries or Bok duty, the 5th one is to start, the 6th one is a junior bok and 19 years old
so yeah we scratchin the barrel here lol
22 Aug 2012, 10:50 am
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-465:
i suppose age really. he’s over 30 so its a question of teaching an old dog new tricks. that and maybe a bit more meat on the bones at 100kg?
22 Aug 2012, 10:50 am
@John Galt-466: Must say I quite like Burden. Always something happening when he gets ball in hand and has left a number of defenders for dead over the first couple of meters to score.
22 Aug 2012, 10:52 am
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-474: Very good impact player
22 Aug 2012, 10:53 am
@grant10-459: @John Galt-466: It will be difficult to find anyone in NH now that their season is about to start. They could make a deal with one of the French clubs for one of their backup hookers who might not get playing time, or send Straeuli to Georgia and find a beast who has not yet been signed up for a French club.
22 Aug 2012, 10:54 am
@Heavens Game-476: Smitty??
now that will get the typing fingers wagging 
22 Aug 2012, 10:56 am
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-474:
Yeah, great with ball in hand.
I must admit, while I was happy for the lad that he got the call up, I do think he needs alot of work on his pure hooking skills. Scrummaging and Throwing etc.
This watered down CC cup would have been perfect for him to hone his skills.
Now he’s going to travel around holding tackle bags.
22 Aug 2012, 10:56 am
@sharks_lover-477:
ja, COME BACK SMITTY, ONE LAST CHANCE hahaha.
he will also add some much needed bulk in our front row.
the faithful will be in raptures.
22 Aug 2012, 10:57 am
@John Galt-478: Exactly, was hoping he would’nt get called up, kinda selfish of me as every player dreams of playing for his country, but he does need a season playing and not being a bench warmer to improve his skills
22 Aug 2012, 10:58 am
@rangerman-479:
22 Aug 2012, 10:59 am
@sharks_lover-477:
Oh sh it!
You gone an’ done it now.
22 Aug 2012, 11:00 am
@John Galt-468:
good point, under those circumstances he would too. disruptions to wp and cheetahs at hooker, wepener the only real threat.
22 Aug 2012, 11:00 am
@John Galt-482:
22 Aug 2012, 11:01 am
@sharks_lover-480: I reckon by now he has perfected the silent fa rt routine on them plastic chairs. Quite a difficult thing to do actually as they normally sound like a 125cc at low revs.
22 Aug 2012, 11:02 am
hahaha
if john smit is playing well i dont see why not
in fact, i think it would be a smart move
22 Aug 2012, 11:03 am
@sharks_lover-477: Ja.
But I dont think Barney would come back. It wouldn’t be in keeping for a legend who has been there, done that with the Sharks.
Best would be to get Frenchie, Argie or Georgian on a short term one month contract from one of the French Top 14 teams. A player who might not get much playing time initially – Fred Michalak can confirm to the player that Sharks are the place to be and Voila!
22 Aug 2012, 11:05 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-486: Nou maak jy kak
22 Aug 2012, 11:05 am
@Heavens Game-487: lol true,
22 Aug 2012, 11:06 am
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-488:
, the Haters will soon let rip in here 
22 Aug 2012, 11:08 am
Maybe we should bring John Allen out of retirement?
22 Aug 2012, 11:08 am
i have always liked john smit. he is first and foremost a really good person through and through and was a good player throughout his career.
a shinng example of the qualities and characteristics the captain of a rugby team should have.
kiwis could learn a thing or two from him.
22 Aug 2012, 11:08 am
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-488:
22 Aug 2012, 11:10 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-492: Amen
22 Aug 2012, 11:10 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-460: It won’t be long before we see a loyal Lions fan, named ‘Jan Alleman’ up for assault. Someone is bound to klapthisdeklerkdoos right into the Super 18, whilst at the Rivonia Spur, Cresta Shopping centre etc.
The temptation will surely be too great to pass…
The Lions are wounded yes, but de Klerk and his crones are the dumbfucks who did the shooting….so unskilled and kak they are, they couldn’t even perfect a killshot. Wounded is all they could deliver.
22 Aug 2012, 11:12 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-492: Who doesn’t like John Smit? Just asking, as I can’t see any Bok fan having an issue with him?
22 Aug 2012, 11:13 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-495: a friend of mine who works in Jozi wore his Kings jersey to work on friday, needless to say, some of his colleagues didn’t speak to him the whole day
dik bek
22 Aug 2012, 11:13 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-492: Beyootiful
22 Aug 2012, 11:13 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-496: yeah we all like Plod
22 Aug 2012, 11:17 am
@Transformation-499: Liar
22 Aug 2012, 11:17 am
@Heavens Game-498: See told ya
22 Aug 2012, 11:18 am
@Heavens Game-487:
Agreed. The Frenchies love a bit of Durbs hey.
22 Aug 2012, 11:20 am
@John Galt-502: Maybe Freddy can organise one
22 Aug 2012, 11:21 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-492:
me too.
he is an honest down to earth guy.
a legend.
22 Aug 2012, 11:21 am
@rangerman-479:
squirrelhunter
22 Aug 2012, 11:23 am
so much bait on this thread…worm colony
22 Aug 2012, 11:23 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-496: grant10, the real one not the d oo s who impersonates him, HATES smitty.
seriously, there was a four year all out war on here that ended in gwantie retiring injured to the tub with his ducky.
22 Aug 2012, 11:24 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-495:
its sad really and i do feel for all the ‘special kinda fans, who wear their pride right on their bodies’… it will take a lot super gees from supporters going forward if the lions are to be saved from dying.
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-496:
are you joking?
@Heavens Game-498:
hehehe
just stating the facts… thats all…
22 Aug 2012, 11:24 am
@gunther-505:
@Transformation-506: haha, spearos dont use bait buddy, we shoot to kill.
22 Aug 2012, 11:27 am
@rangerman-507:
Ducky?
JR?
22 Aug 2012, 11:28 am
@Transformation-497: The true Lions fans are the only ones in this whole saga I feel genuinely gutted for. NO fans deserve the absolute chaos the clowns at the GLRFU have gleefully embraced, promoted and seemingly enjoyed for the last decade (plus).
I for one am delighted the Kings get their shot, as the Lions had theirs, and fuckeditupamazingly. I just wish this de Klerk fellow would stop trying to pull the age old, “I am incompetent and a totaldoos who couldn’t manage Justin Bieber, never mind a professional union – but I am a victim and will take no blame because it’s Apartheids fault, coaches fault, players fault, SARU’s fault, and Allistair Coetzee’s fault that things are so fuckedup”.
@Transformation-499: Plod? John Smit? Must be honest, I have only the greatest admiration for the man, as a leader, person and even as a player. Yeah yeah, the Bissie thing caused upset, but from my side, I am glad he led the Boks into the WC.I also know for a fact that without him leading many players would have seen NO leader on the field. There were a few in the team who did not see Matfield as their leader.
Nah, he was a great servant to Bok and world rugby. My fave Shark of all time – and always will be.
22 Aug 2012, 11:29 am
@Transformation-506: NO the worms are the ones who run around blogs trying to bait people, spineless to say the least, But then again most of us know this, so run along toad
22 Aug 2012, 11:29 am
@gunther-510:
22 Aug 2012, 11:30 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-511: Well there is a good side to you
22 Aug 2012, 11:31 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-511: Atleast you are giving credit where it’s due
22 Aug 2012, 11:31 am
@gunther-510: no, thats Woof.
Ducky is small and yellow, if he had fingers he would probably also be attacking Smitty
22 Aug 2012, 11:37 am
@Transformation-506: I will have bring myself up to speed on who likes and who doesn’t like certain players: past and present, as it is obviously a topic that is referred to quite a bit round here.@rangerman-507: Ah ok, so there were people round here who didn’t like him. I find that quite funny actually, as even in the WP fan dominated circles I live and move in, most of the ‘dislike’ was reserved for Pierre Spies, Morne Steyn and Fourie du Preez in the build up to the WC, not John Smit at all. That is why I asked, who doesn’t like Smit, just find it funny that’s all.
22 Aug 2012, 11:38 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-517: i agree, its funny.
the whole luke watson debacle and smitty’s comments in his book set some peoples pulses racing like teenage girls at a bieber autobiography signing.
22 Aug 2012, 11:39 am
@rangerman-516: whats your thoughts on our match against the bulls Sharks match?? we without 19 players now for various reasons, think we can win??
22 Aug 2012, 11:41 am
@sharks_lover-519: well i see the bulls may ask for a postponement as their players are all down with some kind of virus?
hectic.
i am not sure if its possible? (calling off a match)
but i think we can take em!
22 Aug 2012, 11:41 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-517: NOt a few but many WP supporters in here , and not all, and also some BB supporters too, JOhn SMit was trashed to no end in here,
Just so you know??? that is why the whole Sharks , WP Fight started in here.
John SMit was called the worst of names etc etc etc. anyhows atleast it has stopped
22 Aug 2012, 11:42 am
@rangerman-520: Yeah o saw thaT, and i hope we can win, so much disruptions man
22 Aug 2012, 11:43 am
@rangerman-504:
a legend indeed
i intend to use the two examples when teaching my sons what i want them to aspire to be as persons, when they grow up.
one the one hand i will list john and tell his life story and how he behaved and acted.
on the other i will list richie macaw and tell them of his story and how he acted.
and right there, you have the story of life.. good and bad… high roads and low roads to take… easy or tough decisions to make…
my hope is this will teach them what it means to be good, honest, hard working men who will give everything in what they do and strive to achieve the highest of goals but accept with good grace either success or failure, whichever comes their way, and yet will always… always.. walk away with their heads held high.
win or lose, my wish is for them to be good men… nothing more, nothing less…
(true story)
22 Aug 2012, 11:44 am
@sharks_lover-521: Stopped?……..John se knaters man………..hehehe
22 Aug 2012, 11:44 am
@sharks_lover-521: All those people who slated JS showed a huge ignorance for the game. Yes JS possibly should have been replaced a little earlier by Bissie but he didn’t pick himself and he was playing pretty well at the time. JS is a Bok legend and all real supporters regardless of where they are based should see this
22 Aug 2012, 11:46 am
@Skeppie-525: too true.
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-523:
you will coax a few out the woodwork with that one i tells ya.
22 Aug 2012, 11:46 am
@Skeppie-525: This is true, thats why i said not all WP suporters or supporters, but yeah was ,mostly WP supporters in here , and i dont know how loing you been coming here?? but everyday in here was a war zone
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-524:
Kwagga
22 Aug 2012, 11:49 am
@Skeppie-525: Skeppie i dont like the swearing of players no matter who they play for,
Yes i have called Fourie of the WP Scum, for throwing a ball with force into a oponents face for no reason, and i have seen him throwing punches in so many matches, so yes i am not totally innocent, but its not the norm with me,
22 Aug 2012, 11:49 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-523: Well done ou bul. Voel ek kan nou so iets hier deur die klier stoot.
22 Aug 2012, 11:50 am
@sharks_lover-528: adding to that, it ws a once off, i aint gonna sit here for 4 years and swear at fourie,
that was the case with Smitty
22 Aug 2012, 11:50 am
@rangerman-526:
they can fokkoff
its the truth, and i’m simply telling it
22 Aug 2012, 11:50 am
Actually much longer than 4 years
22 Aug 2012, 11:55 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-523: Or you can buy the movie The Good , the Bad and the Ugly and make them watch the dvd
22 Aug 2012, 11:55 am
@sharks_lover-521:
People can call Lard Arse Smit all the names they like.
They are expressing an opinion.
However FACTS outweigh OPINIONS………………………..always.
FACT,
John Smit is a WC winning Captain. More people have walked on the moon than can claim that honour.
And wherever he goes in the Rugby World. He will be respected like few others.
22 Aug 2012, 11:57 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-523: I respect and admire Richie as well, almost on the same level as John Smit. I feel the rugby world was privileged to have had both men leading teams at the same time.
@rangerman-518: I like Luke Watson as well, as a player and leader. Just because John Smit and Luke didn’t get on, doesn’t mean I have to like ONE or the OTHER.
I know Luke’s ship has probably sailed, but a few years back, I also felt he received a helluval raw deal all round. I’m keen to see him back in Super rugby.
22 Aug 2012, 11:57 am
@stew-533:
Or perhaps Dumb and Dumber.
22 Aug 2012, 11:58 am
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-529:
dankie kwagga
moet net nie emosioneel raak nie, i am not good in dealing with ‘the emotions’
22 Aug 2012, 11:58 am
@cane-534: agreed, Cheatie McCheat is the same though his world cup win will forever be tainted by bryce sadly.
22 Aug 2012, 11:59 am
@stew-533:
22 Aug 2012, 11:59 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-531:
You wouldn’t know the truth if it sucked you dry Bakkies.
22 Aug 2012, 12:00 pm
John Smit deserves our respect for his 2007 WC exploits,but at the end of the day his ego and pride got in the way.He should never have gone to the 2011 WC due to the fact that he was,at best,the fourth or fifth best hooker.His supporters would say that his selection was for leadership abilities but if you look closely to the quarter-final game,despite the antics of Bryce,you would see that leadership was surely missing in the frenetic end to that game.In his ego-driven quest for rugby immortality John Smit polarised the South African rugby fraternity.
22 Aug 2012, 12:00 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-535: ag it was a storm in a pukebag imo.
22 Aug 2012, 12:01 pm
@wnbb-541: no, pdv did the polarising as he selected smitty buddy.
wake up.
22 Aug 2012, 12:02 pm
@cane-536:
thats a white card for you buddy, i’m putting that on review.
now if i could just get a clean commisioner….
22 Aug 2012, 12:04 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-535:
Luke was a victim of many things Doggie.
His name certainly didn’t help.
Was he good enough to be a Bokke?
I’m not sure about being a Starter………………………………………..but MOST certainly good enough for any squad of 36.
22 Aug 2012, 12:06 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-535:
not an admirable way to behave as a human being. yes, he may have been a good player but his legacy will forever be tainted.
22 Aug 2012, 12:07 pm
@cane-545: he played for the boks cane.
wasnt bad, wasnt great.
then he got injured.
then he played for the boks again.
then someone tried to blackmail pdv with a *** tape and it ended in tears.
22 Aug 2012, 12:11 pm
@rangerman-538:
My understanding is that John “lard arse” Smit is also a pretty decent guy.
Black Panther told me so.
And he wouldn’t lie to me.
22 Aug 2012, 12:12 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-537: But you are brilliant when dealing with the ‘emoticons’. **smileys, rolling eyezies**
@cane-545: There was a time when at the very least, he deserved a fair shot to prove his fans right and his critics wrong or vice versa. But as I say, it will be good seeing him on the Super rugby stage once more. Just a pity his presence has always and will always lead to 1000000000000 debates – and not one of them related to what he does or doesn’t do on the field of play.
22 Aug 2012, 12:12 pm
@rangerman-547:
With all the shiit that came with Luke.
Do you think his heart was really in it.
I don’t.
A shame really.
22 Aug 2012, 12:14 pm
Great sportsmen know when it’s time to retire.Bradman scored a duck in his last test….but he knew it was time to go.He could have gone on and played another test to have advanced his 99.94 test average to the perfect 100 but he knew it was time to go.Smit knew it was time to go when PdV came calling,but his glory-seeking persona got the better of him.He should,in all essence,really have departed after the Lions series.
22 Aug 2012, 12:16 pm
@cane-545: SA super rugby player of the 2006 left out by White because?
“we have to be SEEN to be transforming rugby” BULLSHIT
22 Aug 2012, 12:18 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-549:
Luke was always good fodder for the Press as well.
A “LUKE” thread, here on Keo would get an minimum 400 posts. And goodness knows how many hits.
He was like Gold to Keo.
24 carrot gold.
22 Aug 2012, 12:19 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-549:
@cane-550:
true cane
and it is a shame really
22 Aug 2012, 12:19 pm
@cane-550: thats a loser mentality cane.
winners rise above adversity and dont blame externals for their performance.
22 Aug 2012, 12:21 pm
@wnbb-541: pdv should’ve stuck to his gy feeling and never picked smitty! hs mistake was that he listened to mark keohane who convinced him to go beg smit in france to come back…
pdv planned to build his team around matfield and fdp but keo was so in cahoots with jake and “Winning Ways” and wanted to pen smit’s autobio that he convinced dippy to go begging.
spineless of dippy to listen.
22 Aug 2012, 12:23 pm
@Transformation-556: keo didnt pen smittys auto did he buddy?
your post is pure k u k.
wake up.
22 Aug 2012, 12:29 pm
@wnbb-551:
John Smit was a Professional Rugby Player.
This is his chosen path in life.
This is how he made his living.
As long as people were willing to select him, and remunerate him (well), he continued to play. And why not.
I assume, he thought he had something to offer. The Selectors most obviously thought he had something to contribute.
Your problem is not with JS, but with your Selectors.
22 Aug 2012, 12:34 pm
@Dangerman-555:
I don’t think Luke was a loser,
only human.
Some of you pricks would have literally crucified the man, given half a chance.
22 Aug 2012, 12:34 pm
really transie,
do you homework and bring your A game.
22 Aug 2012, 12:35 pm
@Transformation-556: That might be the case,but at the end of the day Smit became a blotted copybook for his decision to continue,knowing full-well that he was out of shape(lard arse comes to mind),out of form and, at best ,the fourth or fifth best hooker in the country.
22 Aug 2012, 12:35 pm
@cane-559: i have no personal issues with luke.
old ground.
22 Aug 2012, 12:36 pm
@Transformation-552:
2006…………………………………………seems like yesterday Transie.
22 Aug 2012, 12:38 pm
@rangerman-557: ‘wanted’ is the cue for you.Wake up if you want to run with the big boys.
22 Aug 2012, 12:42 pm
@Rangerman-562:
I was not inferring YOU had issues with Luke.
When I said “you pricks” I meant the hoi polloi of keo.comedy.
Not the aristocracy.
22 Aug 2012, 12:54 pm
@cane-559: Well those who wanted to crucify him were those who probably felt a little twitchy with some of the things he said at the time. I know he was disliked by many (and for no reason, other than his name, and the fact that he broke the rules and was different….)
Even the most stubborn have to admit he got a raw and unfair deal fullstop.
I’m in the minority then I guess, as I really AM keen to see him back in action (and hopefully shutting a few of his haters up once again)
22 Aug 2012, 13:03 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-566:
Not sure how old Luke is now Doggie, but it is unlikely that he is in the full flush of youth.
Leadership might be his best contribution.
22 Aug 2012, 13:08 pm
@cane-558: spot on cane, a player has to believe in himself, whoever takes the field is down to the selectors.
22 Aug 2012, 13:19 pm
@Big Hit-568:
Ah ………………………………..Biggles.
I have a question only you can answer.
(if you are still here of course).
What was that…………………………… very tall squiggly thingy that looked like the roller coaster from hell, next to the Main Olympic Stadium. Twice as tall, and used for fireworks etc.
22 Aug 2012, 13:31 pm
Ok,so,when a player is fat,unfit,out of form and the fifth best player in his position he needs to believe that he can still win another WC?He should have done the right thing by retiring.I admired his leadership in 2007,but now I only will remember him as the ego-driven individual who completely lost the plot at the end of his career.What riles with me,even up to today,is the fact that he relegated a world class player like Bissy to the bench and a bit part player role.To put everything on the selectors is the easy way out and to exonerate him from all blame.If Bissy ever write a book it would be interesting to read his take on the John Smit WC fiasco.
22 Aug 2012, 13:34 pm
One of the bigger tasks is that somebody must take care of this Albacete issue
22 Aug 2012, 13:40 pm
@wnbb-570:
John was ASKED to be a Hooker, a Prop, a Captain, a bench player covering 2 positions, a starter, an after-match speaker, and the fall guy.
And he never shirked his responsibilities once.
I would imagine Bizzy would be quite complimentary regarding Smitty.
22 Aug 2012, 13:55 pm
You sure about that?He certainly wasn’t happy when he got carted off for Smit in a test on South African soil.I felt very bad for him that day knowing that an inferior player was running on to replace him.
22 Aug 2012, 14:02 pm
@cane-572:
well said, caner
add also the whole period in which he was being benched right through super rugby by his coach and not getting game time for his match fitness. even though the bok coach pleaded for him to get game time.
john soldiered on for the boks without match fitness regardless.
plumtree did his thing and where did bissy get them in the end anyway..?..
for that reason alone plumtree can go and fark himself.
22 Aug 2012, 14:07 pm
I really should not entertain this kiwi blogger.At best,mate,you are duplicitous in your assessment of John Smit’s selection for the Bok team.Kiwi supporters I spoke to during the WC and even before were perplexed at the Smit selection in favour of du Plessis.In the media,NZ greats like Fitzpatrick were dumbstruck by that decision.
22 Aug 2012, 14:25 pm
@wnbb-573:
We all have disappointment in life wnbb.
Bizzzy has his.
John has had more than a few, I should imagine.
It’s how we handle these moments that make us better people.
22 Aug 2012, 14:34 pm
@wnbb-575:
Sad that a Kiwi can show more respect to the bok captain than a so called South African.
22 Aug 2012, 14:52 pm
RYAN VREDE yea, i concur with Bissy absence. I would love to have the footage analised in this regard. It is a bit stange how his injury accured.
He was the best player in the team. Looking at the rest of the compo it is going to be about growing our depth with the amount of 1st choice players unavailable.
I disagree about remarks about Smit. The public do not know the “politics” that surround the inclusion of him exactly. We did not perform badly at the world cup because of him. The Ref that twat from NZ probably had a bookies bet waged on the match. Closed thing I ever saw in rugby to match fixing. The NZ public were so overwelmed by his actions that they felt he deserved a nighthood. that says volumes… Was it not Walsh who had a drinking disorder prior? He even has tatoos, looks disgusting on a ref, that also speaks volumes…
My guess about Smit is because of his loyalty and honour to his country, team and coach, he might have been asked or offered something that lead him to remain. Talking about him being fat, well then you cant know to much about rugby. The position he was forced to play requires more weight, very simple realy.
Do we forget the match against Somoa
( an extremely, extremely extremely passionate Allblack supporter as are the Fijians and Tongons.
Having been to Fiji and NZ myself and had many discussions with Mori’s, Fijians, Tongans and Samoans about rugby in genral. These tiny island nations are extremely poor, have very little infestructrer, all want to live in NZ- as NZ has jobs available and being a country with immigant Mori’s – pacific island people too- feel an affiliation to NZ more so than Oz.)
They said they would do the Allblacks proud and do what it takes. Who was the ref that day, Barnes was it? One of the most brutal games if seen where red cards were crying out and none were given let alone yellow. Half that team should have been playing. Dont you find it strange that straight after, again, very very very bad reffing at a point where the sectator can see the injustice.
You then ask who was the Allblacks biggest threat?
You then ask who are the biggest chokers in rugby WCs?
You then ask what would be the worst team that was not the AllBlacks that could win in New Zealand? Imagine the thought after. Remembering the WC will probably never go back to NZ because it is a loss finacially having it staged there(too far away and too small a population to sustain it by themselves)
So you then want to blame Smit, common on, yes Bissy was the better player by a long shot but it was not his fault for such disgusting refering the world has ever seen considering it was a world stage event. We did not loos the world cup because of Smit. We have to take into account racist South Africa. Theres this new word called transformation which is simply another word “installed” to be “politically correct” and prevent them been labled racist. But it is no different to Quota, and all that racist ****, transformation is the same shite. Basically a bunch of people who cant move forward, thats who they are. And if it continues one should wonder what was the point of the white people giving up the reigns in the first place.
A Springbok captain is not a captain like any other rugby nation in the world. He is a politition. Smit goes down in history as one of the best captains not just in SA but in the world. He was able to deal with all that political bullshite other captains have no idea about, zero. He delt with it so well it is admirable.
I believe Smit could have retained the WC, we could have beaten the ABs making Springbok rugby special. The problem was the superpowers of the world did not want that to happen.
Ever watched a movie like “Wag the Dog”.
Why can a dog wag his tail? Because he is smarter than the tail…
22 Aug 2012, 15:17 pm
@Mr Black-577: I supported the 2007 John Smit version but was not too happy with the 2011 one selected before more deserving players.I am glad that he didn’t got his hands on Bill.It would have been a travesty of justice and would only have inflated his ego even more.Cane can play up to the galleries here,but I would rather accept the views of great Kiwi legends like Fitzspatrick that it was a crazy selection to deny a world class player like du Plessis for an over the hill player like Smit.
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