What Bismarck’s loss means
21 Aug 2012
RYAN VREDE writes that Bismarck du Plessis is the most significant of all the Springboks’ injuries to date and further erodes the hope of them winning the Rugby Championship.
I wrote at the time that I didn’t believe the absence of Schalk Burger, Jaque Fourie, Danie Rossouw, Bakkies Botha and Fourie du Preez (who was courted for a Test return) among a clutch of uncapped players (Duane Vermeulen and Johan Goosen for example) would be terminal to the Springboks’ cause against England. There were competent replacements available who subsequently got the job done. Neither did I feel it would hinder them against Argentina last week, even with Pierre Spies and JP Pietersen added to that injury list.
It was their unavailability against Australia and New Zealand that most concerned me, although I still believed the depth was sufficient to beat the former and mount an appreciable challenge against the Blacks. But Du Plessis’ loss is a hammer blow. To understand it’s significance you have to take into account the tangible and non-tangible impact.
Technically he is the most complete hooker in the game. He is a brutal defender who has also grown as a breakdown scavenger in recent years. Indeed Heyneke Meyer highlighted this as amplifying his value, especially in light of the absence of a specialist openside flank. On attack he is a force at the gainline, a constant source of go-forward. His work-rate in both these facets of play is unmatched by any hooker on the planet (I know this because I’ve seen the Springboks’ analysis of all their competitors in this regard). Furthermore, his set piece work is excellent.
Away from the technical competencies, his game intelligence and temperament under pressure has improved markedly, as has his discipline, which was a point of concern early in his career. He has also become an accomplished leader. Meyer’s estimation of him in this regard has grown to the point where he had considered him for the captaincy. Finally, his experience will be sorely missed. Forty six caps into his Test career, Du Plessis’s presence at crunch times would have been a boon for a youthful and largely inexperienced Springbok pack.
Seldom will one player’s absence be decisive to the outcome, and I’m not suggesting Du Plessis holds such sway at this point in his career. He was, however, the heart and soul of the side and embodied every quality Meyer sought in his players. He has the capacity to galvanise those around him through the standard he sets. He is a match winner.
His replacement, Adriaan Strauss, is a fine player but he isn’t in Du Plessis’s class. That said, Strauss faces a decisive phase in his Test career, where his success or failure will have a significant bearing on the Springboks’ fortunes. In the context of their game plan he is an important cog. His lineout feeds will come under the microscope and with the Springboks’ rolling maul being one of their primary weapons, Strauss’s accuracy will be central to their ability to set this in motion. It is also a facet of play where the Springboks have traditionally had the edge over the Wallabies and Blacks.
In addition Strauss will have to rein in his fondness for lurking in the loose. It is a strategy that suits the Cheetahs’ approach but the Springboks will need him to get stuck in at ground zero in the coming Tests.
In Monday’s press conference in Mendoza Meyer described Strauss as world-class. That offering and other examples of his professed faith in him is not lip service. He has an extremely high regard for the player, whom he brought to the Bulls as a youngster and whose loss he deeply lamented when he returned to the Cheetahs. Strauss owes it to himself and Meyer to take the opportunity that now presents itself.
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579 Comments
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21 Aug 2012, 21:53 pm
@fitz1ella-348:
You’re a hard man, skop. And unreasonable. How the hell can you hope the national coach gets a walloping just because he doesn’t tie in with your views.
As we stand right now, HM’s Bok team has yer=t to lose. Not a bad start to a career. I know for a fact that Meyer is passionate for the Boks. And he has stated that any player – be it a Bulls player or not – will be shown the door is he is underperforming.
I’m also disappointed that more Stormers players haven’t been included. Or this week excluded and here I think Kolisi and de Jong. That doesn’t mean the door has been slammed in the faces. It means that the current Bok players have to pull finger otherwise they will also be out.
Heyneke obviously realises what his waiting for him. That he will be judged on what happens against Aus and NZ.
Heyneke needs to be given more space and time to deliver. And people need to get off his back.
21 Aug 2012, 22:00 pm
@I am a stormer-351: I think he’s a moron and gonna get a fat smack to his fat ego pretty soon..
forget Stormers vs Sharks vs Bulls vs Cheetahs.. its down to his stuffed up rugby philosophy and his blind as a bat moronic idiocy that he’s gonna get whats coming and get it smack where it matters to his big fat non enlightened sense of stubborn stupidity.. that’s where.
21 Aug 2012, 22:04 pm
@fitz1ella-352:
Skop, the skittlesticks Proteas are ranked no. 1 in the world right now. Aren’t you proud.
That’s where Heyneke wants the rugby Boks. Be patient.
21 Aug 2012, 22:06 pm
always feel it says a great deal about the character of an individual who wilfully turns against his team to make a perceived statement about a coach or another individual such as a particular player.
the Springboks are more than the coach.
this is no real supporter, he has no allegiance or loyalty.
21 Aug 2012, 22:08 pm
whats this bullshit ‘needs to be given more time and space to deliver’.. so far Heyneke has been cocooned from stuffing up beyond compare.. by default he didn’t get his first wish Matfield, by default he didn’t get his second wish FdP, by default he was forced to select the better captain in the country De Villiers, by default he loses Spies, not by design..
So far Meyer has blundered onto a reasonable set of circumstances not by his first wishes or design but by circumstance only.. soon his lucky packet decisions are gonna smack him where he don’t wanna know.. wait till this goon Potgieter and his lack of fortification in the back bone of the pack comes unstuck.. lucky for him Pocock is now out and Aussie also struggling to put a decent team together without top locks and loosies, but Boks should be creaming the opposition with the CORRECT mix of players and abilities put together into a team / squad.
He’s going retrograde and everybody reckons we are forging ahead, when actually we going in reverse gear unbeknown to most fundi’s out there.
21 Aug 2012, 22:12 pm
@Humphrey-354: fck off wooden spoon come out your hidy hole big fat quack
since when I gotta wave my green / yellow bandanna and be another little skaap going baa baa white sheep please moron be my baaskap coach? The twat is an idiot and he dunno which way is up nor down.
21 Aug 2012, 22:14 pm
@fitz1ella-356: huh? seriously though, do you support the team or the coach? if you support the coach then I can see why you may be having such a hard time.
21 Aug 2012, 22:14 pm
if you support the team then no way will you ever want to see them lose.
21 Aug 2012, 22:16 pm
humpty fcking dumpty sat on a wall
humphrey fcking dumbfrey had a great fall
and all the little wishful thinkers and all the happy clappy’s couldn’t put humpty nor dumbfrey together again.
21 Aug 2012, 22:16 pm
@fitz1ella-355:
When I say he needs to be given more space and time, that is exactly what I meant.
He has been in charge of precisely 4 test matches. Watch my hands. FOUR.
Give the guy a break.
21 Aug 2012, 22:16 pm
no way can anyone call themselves a true supporter when they desire the team to lose just because the coach gets up their nose a little bit. only a small and limited man would think like that.
21 Aug 2012, 22:17 pm
that was funny fitz1ella. you’re a poet and you know-it.
21 Aug 2012, 22:20 pm
@fitz1ella-359:
Skop, how do you think I should go on superbru this weekend?
Boks by 15 should do the trick.
21 Aug 2012, 22:20 pm
kindergarten humour though. how old are you fitz1ella? i get the sense from your other posts that you may be a senior citizen.
21 Aug 2012, 22:23 pm
problem with supporting a team is you got to get lumbered with some goddamn moron’s who think they f’ng gifted by God or something equally insane to coach a rugby team to success… while back at the ranch these goddamn self anointing idiots dunno the first thing about what comprises a good decision from a bad one.. and the moron idiot supporters like me just got to lump all the bullshit and say thank you Mr. idiot keep making fuckups but I’ll continue supporting schmucks like you for better or for worse…
fck that I never asked to get lumped with this twat.. if he fcks up I’m gonna be the first to tell him and tell him what I think of his moronic self anointed grand style idiocy
21 Aug 2012, 22:28 pm
i dunno hey. when I see Meyer in the coach’s ox on tv he seems to possess a lot of passion and when he speaks on tv he is humble and well spoken, never rude and i don’t know where you get the vibe that he thinks he’s “god’s gift” or anything similar. i’m also sure he is trying his best.
no, i just think it is a bit weak not to be the better man and resort to name calling, castigating and wishing losses and misfortune on anyone. rather just go along with it all and you may actually enjoy yourself.
21 Aug 2012, 22:29 pm
@fitz1ella-365: you are already coming down on him though, arent you?
which coach have you ever actually enjoyed?
to be fair though, i was also quite unimpressed with our display vs the argies. meyer must sharpen up the game plan in short order.
21 Aug 2012, 22:32 pm
meyer is fine, but he’s gotta get rid of the bloubultrul blinkers quicksmart – there are at least 4 or 5 stormers players that should be promotoed to the 22 as well as Brussow, which is a gdam travesty. potgieter out, morne has to go to bench and they need to start playing with more variation, the collisions must be won that is fundamental and correct, but there are other attacking nuances that must be focussed on and they do not include morne sticking every hailmary into the air or hougaard becoming a halfback kicking general or picking players that are disciples mediocrities rather than offer some real impact as individuals.
21 Aug 2012, 22:35 pm
@cab-368: i agree with your post. Potgieter, Spies (when he returns from inj), M Steyn, Olivier (when returns from inj) and Zane Kirchner – not one of them are world beaters. and the Boks need to add some flair and attacking unpredictability to their kick and bash game. the kiwis and ozzies will eat us alive and outsmart us big time otherwise.
i wasn’t impressed at all with the game against Arg.
21 Aug 2012, 22:38 pm
you dunno.. that’s correct.. just like most the skaapies in the country also don’t know…
they dunno if they barking up the right tree or the wrong one.. that’s about as much as they know… long as it looks like its the right one.. then that’s goodly golly fine and dandy.. don’t come all baffled when right from wrong gets turned around, and what you thought was right turns out to be wrong.
21 Aug 2012, 22:40 pm
Boks could be in serious trouble this weekend with the pack being picked against argie in mendoza – alberts and beast are too little for meyer’s gameplan – pogieter will be toothless away from the tannies, daniels and coetzee will be too light for the gauchos, bekker is more at home in the centres, etsebeth is fantastic young promising talent which is too green and strauss is disctinctyly ordinary.
This touring squad could seriously be in danger of kakking off, Keo reckons the Boks never lose to the Argies, and that is obvious, well laat ons sien – this squad could get picked clean and they going to blame hougaard who will have nothing to do with it.
Elstadt, Kolisi and Brussow should go straight into the starting team and will make a v competitve Bok squad that could even take the ABs, though that would also need D Fourie and Vermeulen and JdJ and Aplon to be there. I’d also give Cilliers a start – shoulda got it at home. This squad is actually at least 7 or 8 players off its optimimum, and they going to pay i reckon.
21 Aug 2012, 22:41 pm
you are correct in that it is far far far too early to tell. lets wait and see, if he doesn’t stack up then we can all jump on his back but for the time being lets roll with it and enjoy the ride while we can. their is an inevitability with bok coaches which is that sooner or later, it all goes tits up. so make merry while the sun shines would be my advice.
21 Aug 2012, 22:41 pm
Skop, Heyneke understands Hougaard’s shortcomings but understand his strengths as well. By this I mean pushing Hougie out to wing when Ruan comes on. And with Ruan grabbing his opportunities, his starting position can’t be too far away. Maybe this weekend even with Hougaard in the number 14 jersey. Particularly with Habana on crutches.
21 Aug 2012, 22:42 pm
@cab-371: alberts and beast “too little” now i have heard it all! alberts and beast are the motors in that engine room.
21 Aug 2012, 22:51 pm
This okie is gonna go into a test match vs AB’s with
Kirchner
Engelbrecht
De Villiers
Steyn
Mvovo
Steyn
Hougaard
Daniel
Alberts
Coetsee
Kruger
Etsebeth
JdP
Strauss
Beast
Greyling, Liebenberg, Cilliers, Vd Merwe, Potgieter, Pienaar, Lambie
good luck Mnr Messiah.. I hope AB’s fck you up something chronic wake you from out your befuddled stupor.
21 Aug 2012, 22:53 pm
@Humphrey-374:
i mean they are the only engines, and two engines aint enough to fly a gdam superjumbo.
21 Aug 2012, 22:57 pm
Kolisi is very much similar to Coetzee. You pick the one or the other. Elstadt has been mediocre at best for the Stormers and may I add Coetzee, Alberts, Daniels and Kankowski absolutely demolished the Stormers a few weeks ago. Brussow is injured or am I the only one knowing that. Deon Fourie and Cilliers in the front row? Is jy ge*** in jou kop? Talk about provincialism at its absolute best.
Please put your starting pack on the screen!!!
21 Aug 2012, 22:57 pm
@I am a stormer-373: Hougaard is one position I don’t mess with… all these moegoes wanting to start Pienaar.. do so at their own peril… Pienaar don’t have a 10th of Hougaard’s tenacity or his fighting spirit.. AB’s will destroy Pienaar in 15 minutes flat.
Hougaard must stick at 9 and get to whip the ball out smart.. like he was doing fine last weekend for the first time since the English series. Pretorius should be back up scrummy not Vermaak, Pienaar only good as a backup on a 5-2 bench where versatility counts more than specialization.
21 Aug 2012, 23:01 pm
Strauss vs Deon Fourie. Strauss the more physical. Strauss the better lineout frower. Strauss the better with ball in hand. Fourie the better fetcher. Well in that case why dont we start with Stegmann at hooker and bring Brussow in at hooker when we play NZ. They can pack down with Cilliers at tighthead. Great, I will rather have Cab and some other supporters as the coaching team than Heyneke.
21 Aug 2012, 23:02 pm
@Horings-379: @Horings-377: directed at the idiot in @cab-371:
21 Aug 2012, 23:03 pm
if that team is picked they not only deserve to get thumped, they will get badly done, if not by argies by the ABs – i reckon the argies can take that team.
useless fools
got an entire set of like-for-like replacements waiting in the wings
Bismarck cant throw for tofee, is aggressive, strongballcarrier, strong fetcher, gets go-forward – you got a direct replacement in Deon Fourie and he’s not even in the squad.
There are no genuine enforcer locks in SA, apart from one who is still young himself, but has put Bakkies, Schalk and Alberts flat on their arse – and he’s not even in the squad.
Brussow is probably the best fetcher in the world and he is not even in the squad – its complete madness, now bismarck and coenie are out – now what?
They’ve Potgieter, Daniel and Coetzee who are all ballrunners on looser super rugby games- not test forwards who bang ppl back in the tackle – Kolisi has been doing this consistently the whole season – what the hell is the oke playing second fiddle to the other 3 for?
The sharks are utterly useless unless all 3 of Bismark, Alberts and BEast play – we’ve seen this happen this season where they got turned everytime these three werent around, and so what do they do but pick 6 of the 8 pack as sharks, when its the stormers who’ve actually got the players to replace and indeed add to the sharks 3 if one or two to go down, which is exactly the case here.
21 Aug 2012, 23:05 pm
Kolisi is not similar to Coetsee they would compliment each other far better than Daniel, Alberts and Coetsee
Coetsee is not an open side flank he is an 8th man… Kolisi can cover all 3 positions in back row WAY better than that one track idiot moron Potgieter…
If Brussow and Vermeulen were fit different scenario, but to play Daniel, Alberts, Coetsee and Potgieter.. like cab says it could happen and I’m almost hoping Argies fck these nincompoops up lekker this weekend.
Just what the doktor would have ordered for Herr Messiah to catch a mighty fine wake up on Sunday morning
Who is Heyneke going to rely on for his Steel man enforcer.. Young wet behind the ears Etsebeth,??. he going to fck the poor kid up before he gets out of puberty… or his next best option slow behemoth deluxe Vd Merwe ?
21 Aug 2012, 23:06 pm
@Horings-379:
strauss more physical than fourie?
kak man, in what universe?
21 Aug 2012, 23:07 pm
@cab-381: Brussow is injured!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
“Bismarck cant throw for tofee, is aggressive, strongballcarrier, strong fetcher, gets go-forward – you got a direct replacement in Deon Fourie and he’s not even in the squad.” Even comparing Fourie with Bismark? Hoe gesuip is jy?
Have you seen Coetzee play? He is not running loose. He is in the first channel time after time. Similar to Kolisi.
At least some of the players in this team can win high intensity finals. If you get to pick your team they will choke.
21 Aug 2012, 23:09 pm
@cab-383: I refer to Cheetahs vs Sharks where Bismark and Strauss had one huge battle. Bismark knocked Strauss out early on but he came back and played a monster game. I would like Fourie to replicate that effort. Deon Fourie is not a test match hooker. Finish and klaar!
21 Aug 2012, 23:11 pm
@fitz1ella-382: I agree with you on Potgieter’s selection.
21 Aug 2012, 23:16 pm
@Horings-385:
you’ve never seen fourie in a test match in any position so how can it be finish and klaar?
what i saw was a player picked to play no 8 who tore thru the balls completely and utterly at loftus to win MOTM (no mean feat for someone supposedly not physical or a test match player) – it was an amazing performance – strauss is dictinctly average, he does everything well and nothing brilliantly. Fourie breaks tackles, wins turnover, is supremely fit and agressive as all fk – he is bismark uitgeknip – and who they pick – teddybear and the red-faced character liebenberg who has some fire but not even remotely in the physical attributes of fouries strenght and fitness.
21 Aug 2012, 23:20 pm
Coetsee, Daniel, Potgieter and Spies are all ballruners – they are fast flankers, ideal for SA hard fields and super rugby where’s its candyfloss loose. By all means pick one of them, not all of them.
In test rugby, you need ppl that win the collisions, that is what getting go-forward momentum is all about and the above-mentioned ballrunners do not that – they get driven back in the tackle if there’s no-one to break the adv line. Alberts is not enough.
The pack balance is wrong. Lets see what happens this saturday.
21 Aug 2012, 23:21 pm
@cab-387: I do not have to see him in a test match to make up my mjind. I also know Hercu Liebenberg is not a test match hooker as well as Willie Wepener. They are pretty much in the same league as Fourie.
21 Aug 2012, 23:23 pm
@cab-388: Heyneke wrote the book on picking players for collisions! I think he has the rights for using the word collisions in a rugby context.
21 Aug 2012, 23:26 pm
@cab-387: correct
all these people use isolated provincial scenarios like Sharks got lucky 3 times to do in Stormers this year, once without Kolisi and all 3 times without Vermeulen, to second guess their educated assumptions on who is international caliber and who not.. so Daniel, Kankowski, Coetsee are supposedly international caliber loose forwards…
we already know who is not international caliber
but we have never seen Kolisi, Elstadt, or Fourie in a Springbok test match..
we have seen the likes of Olivier, Spies, Kirchner, Kankowski, Vd. Merwe, M. Steyn, and even Daniel, Strauss and Potgieter in green and gold.. but never have we seen Kolisi, Fourie or Elstadt..
so let Heyneke play that team at @fitz1ella-375: above vs AB’s he gonna see his gat so bad, I’m almost feeling sorry for him already.
I’m out to fetch a son…
21 Aug 2012, 23:28 pm
@Horings-390:
i dont think he’s got any rights over anything – ive seen one very good half of rugby against a young touring england side missing half their best players – since when does any bok coach get an easy ride without proving his worth?
he is not picking players to win the collisions, and the bulls no longer have the players to win the collisions, which is why they are losing – Danie, BAkkies and Gurthro – all gone, no-one left to win the collisions.
21 Aug 2012, 23:31 pm
Deon Fourie almost always beats his first man. Great player. Pity about his lineout throwing. Other than that we as WP and Stormers supporters have lots to be thankful for where Fourie is concerned. Great ball carrier and poacher!
21 Aug 2012, 23:34 pm
@fitz1ella-391: The Boks will probably lose against ABs and then you will come on this site and say “I told you so”. It is not to say your team would have done better. Vermeulen will make a difference. He is good enough and he would have been picked if fit. But he is not yet fit. Elstadt is very physical in defence and tall enough to be good in the lineouts, although he has not shown it yet. I like him, and I think he is a good prospect, but he will not be the difference. Let us pick the following team: Beast, Fourie, Cilliers, Etzebeth, Bekker, Kolisi, Elstadt and Alberts. Do you really think this team will stand a chance against NZ?
21 Aug 2012, 23:34 pm
@Horings-389:
You are wrong.. Fourie is test match standard through and through.. but Heineke got same fckup delinquency as White and some others its related to size vs ability … same reason White lost 49-0… same type outright stupidity which he now has learned the lesson and picks players like Hooper and Pocock first on his team sheet.
That why Heyneke ditched Brussow for Potgieter and why he goes Strauss and Liebenberg over Fourie..
You are all WRONG.. all of you…. pound for pound and guts for guts, physicality for physicality Fourie and Brussow SMASH the likes of Potgieter, Kankowski and even Daniel and Coetsee …
and so does Siya Kolisi.. but neither you nor Heyneke even know it….
and best enforcer 7 / 4 in the country is Elstadt.., to compliment and backstop behind Alberts… not Vd Merwe or Etsebeth, who should be at 5… next on the list is the young PSDT
21 Aug 2012, 23:35 pm
@W.P-393: “almost always”. Bwahaha!!!
21 Aug 2012, 23:38 pm
who you think will win the following collisions:
elstadt vs any of kruger, becker, etsebeth, flip
kolisi vs any of coetzee, daniel, spies, kankowski or spies
fourie vs any of strauss, liebenberg (rallapelle is better than both of these as well)
If Brussow is injured and Bismark and Oosthuizen is out – then the selection of Fourie makes even more sense – cos he wins an enormous amount of turnover ball – he did it all day vs the bulls, he ran through, stole the ball off of them and even out-fought them.
what more do you want? surely he’d make a proud bull if he was not in strepe?
21 Aug 2012, 23:39 pm
lots of whingeing coming from the Stormer brigade.
every year we hear from them how the Bok team should be made up of their precious Stormers… and they have the audacity to cry provincialism too!
21 Aug 2012, 23:40 pm
stormers are all hype and have been for over almost 2 decades now. when it comes to the business they implode in amongst all the hype.
21 Aug 2012, 23:40 pm
@Horings-394: that pack better than the one Heyneke going with this weekend… but I wouldn’t drop Coetsee I’d play him at No.8 and keep Alberts at 7 and play Elstadt either at 4 with Etsebeth at 5 or play Elstadt off bench as Alberts backup…
Beast, Fourie, Cilliers, Elstadt / (Etsebeth), Etsebeth / (Bekker / Kruger), Kolisi, Alberts, Coetsee
will donner
Beast, Strauss, JdP, Etsebeth, Kruger / Bekker, Coetsee, Alberts, Daniel..
I would bet on that…
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