469 Comments

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• 51.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:30 am

  @rangerman-48:
  Yeah i wonder whats happened to Andries hey.

  You look at past footage of the guy playing, maybe 2 or 3 seasons ago, you’d swear he would become one of the greatest ever locks.
  And now he’s nowhere.

  Suppose multiple niggly injuries will do that to you.

• 52.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:31 am

  @ Bakkies, dude you’re smoking hot today

  @Philou-47: Keo swings between WP-love and Bulletjies-love more than a hooker on steroids.

• 53.The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:31 am

  @KWAGGA ROBERTSE-44: It is. The thing is though, when Heyneke very publically and rather desperately started calling for the return of Victor Matfield, 30 minutes after he got the Bok coaching job, he already phuckedup any sort of brilliant relationship with Bekker from the getgo. (Ditto for Hougaard with the du Preez obsession, 4 weeks into the S15 or thereabouts…)

  Meyer made it clear from day 1 that he had little faith in Hougaard and Bekker as starters in their relevant positions…..and if the pesky IRB hadn’t put a stop to a comeback after retirement, Victor would have been 1st choice in any event…..as would du Preez, if he hadn’t told Meyer he wasn’t up to standard at the time.

  So, ANY hope of working any psychological magic on Bekker (or Hougie for that matter) will be a waste of fuckingtime if coming from Meyer himself.

• 54.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:31 am

  @John Galt-51: Yes. Played into the ground

• 55.Robzim:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:32 am

  @rangerman-48:

  You feel about bekker as I feel about frans.
  I can start with something like :

  Frans

  Ja he can kick a distance

  But he is overweight and overhyped

  Slow, very slow

  and so on………

  Or I can do the same to Alberts.. or Beast
  And you can hit back and have a go at Jean..

  Ag man, we can write something like that about any player we dont like or rate (or play for our Franchise

• 56.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:34 am

  @mikeybrass-54:
  I see he’s definitely going to be playing against the ABs next week though.

  He’s just been given an extended break now for his ankle and back to heal even more.

• 57.rangerman:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:34 am

  @John Galt-51: @mikeybrass-52: well you can lay the blame squarely on the wp management and coching staff, ac specifically.

  when bekker played against the sharks in durbs it was clear his back was farked but ac played him anyway.

  disgusting.

• 58.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:36 am

  @rangerman-57: Exactly.

  @John Galt-56: Personally I feel Bekker needs to take 6 months out of the game. He has been dodging robust contact ever since he got injured halfway through the Stormers 2011 season, never mind this year.

• 59.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:38 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-53:
  No bugger. You’ve got it all wrong.

  HM only intimated at recalling Matfield when there was a small locking crisis in SA S15 sides.

  Bekkers back and ankle were farked, Kruger was also injured and there was one other 5 lock who was injured.
  That was the only reason HM looked at Matfield. Its not his fault that ACs player management is non existant.

  And Bekker is only being rested further this weekend.
  He’s definitely starting against the ABs next week.

• 60.RL:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:39 am

  Bekker should retire from test rugby and focus on superrugby only because Ruan Botha will be after his jersey which he will take with ease. Bekker just does not posses the mental and physical hardness to play at the highest level.

• 61.The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:40 am

  @rangerman-57: Look, you have to feel for both Bekker and Hougaard, as by my reckoning they are in the same position.
  Both sadly playing behind the almost mythical figures of du Preez and Matfield.
  Both waiting for 2012….both knowing full well, that everything they do will be compared to the 2 superheroes of SA rugby.
  And then Meyer goes on his: I need du Preez and Matfield rant….

  The mind is a fuckertoclean when it has been filled with all sorts of filthy doubt and questions that just won’t go away

• 62.gunther:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:42 am

  @mikeybrass-52:

  He’s certainly smoking something.

• 63.Brigadier Van Zyl:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:42 am

  I find this support of bekker somewhat bizzarre. Which is not to say that i am not supportive of anyone who pulls on the green jumper.

  but perspective wise….
  I can never remember bekker dominating a test match or a superrugby knockout game.
  On the other hand, Morne Steyn has done both, in fact he holds superrugby records over dan carter and has 31 points on his own against the all blacks. A record that I do not believe will be broken anytime in the next 100 years.

  perspective and provincialism…..very strange really.

• 64.Robzim:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:43 am

  @RL-60:

  How good is Ruaan Botha?
  Is he more of an enforcer or is he more the athetic type of lock or is he an all rounder like Etsebeth. He certainly gave the WP under 21 team a hell of a lot of troubles in the lineouts last saturday but he comperition was not really that good.

• 65.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:44 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-61:
  Oh please.
  Spare me the violins.

  You’re implying Bekker and Hougaard have the mental fortitude of 13 year old girls.
  Bekker was injured at the time of Matfields calling and Hougaard is under no illusion that he is second best at all aspects of scrummy play.

• 66.The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:44 am

  @John Galt-59: As far as I recall…..the Matfield rumours started a few hours after Meyer was appointed. In fact, Victor’s first soundbite on the subject took place the very next day, and I see the Rapport headline from the next Sunday in front of me as if it were yesterday.

  I believe Meyer’s 1st choice Bok captain for this year, was indeed Victor Matfield. 2nd Choice, Fourie du Preez….
  3rd choice Schalk Burger.

• 67.rangerman:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:45 am

  @Robzim-55: its not that i dont rate him Rob, i do.

  but he is in no shape to be playing at present and should be given proper rehab until he reaches full fitness.

  if he doesnt ever make it back i will be bleak as he could be such an asset to the boks.

  as for frans, i really cant take you seriously as i feel like you are simply being provincialistic in your counterattack

  p.s. did you hear about my garrick i shot the other day? 19kgs. i got it off sheffield beach in durbs. i pickled most of it cape malay style and also made fish curries debben style.

  delicious.

  no trawler will get my support.

• 68.Robzim:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:47 am

  @Robzim-64:

  One thing that stood out is that he is massive. Probably at least 6 feet 8 or taller.

• 69.The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:47 am

  @John Galt-65: So you agree with the way Meyer has handled his players mentally/emotionally thus far?
  Lambie, Bekker, Mvovo, Daniel, Hougaard and co?

  You buy into the cowboys don’t cry and the easiest way to motivate a player is to fuckhimup physically and mentally until he runs through walls and does not deviate off course?

  Then, we will have to agree to disagree…….

• 70.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:50 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-66:
  All I saw in your response was…

  ‘As far as I recall…’ ‘…rumours…’ and ‘…the Rapport…’

  Not exactly smoking gun stuff there Pedigree.

• 71.The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:51 am

  @John Galt-65: So tell me friend. At the time of Matfield’s calling (sometime in February/March), Meyer magically already knew that Bekker would return to play, and then re-injure himself in June just in time for the tests? He knew this in March?
  He really is the Messiah.

• 72.RL:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:51 am

  @Robzim-64: he was the starting no. 5 for the baby Boks that won gold this year. Very atheletic and mobile and is the second tallest lock in SA, after Bekker. He is a good buy for the WP.

• 73.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:54 am

  @RL-60: No physical hardness? Let’s see how any other lock fairs played into the ground, played when injured, not given sufficient months off injured, being played again when not fully recovered, etc etc etc. The man has been playing through unbelievable pain. No physical hardness, my arse.

• 74.The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:56 am

  @John Galt-70: I’m no google expert, but I managed to find this, dated January this year….
  The speculation has started, by Matfield’s own statements, before Meyer was even confirmed as Bok coach…JANUARY.

  http://www.citypress.co.za/Sport/News/Matfield-could-return-if-Meyer-is-made-Bok-coach-20120126

• 75.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:56 am

  @Brigadier Van Zyl-63: 2010 semi, dominated. 2010 final came up against Matfield.
  2011, Saders while basically a cripple
  2012, played while terribly injured
  Bekker has stood no chance. Cudos to him for being able to even perform to the extent he has through the pain.

  He needs a lengthy break of at least 6 months imo.

• 76.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:57 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-71:
  Bekker wasnt the only 5 lock injured at the time. Thats my point. Its not about your perceived Matfield/HM vs Bekker mumbo jumbo.

  Schalk, HMs preferred captain choice had also just been injured.

  You telling me, with your captain out for the season and a locking crisis, you wouldnt turn to someone as experienced as Matfield?

• 77.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:57 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-69: Whether one agrees with his selections or not, Meyer is upfront to his players and that’s a good thing.

• 78.shooter:
  6 Sep 2012, 10:58 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-71: straight forward…. what’s wrong with HM wanting in Matfield in his set-up?

  It was no secret anyway. Guess what. Bakkies is also on the fringes still. And surely he’s had a phonecall or two already.

  The same as many people still wanting Juan Smith to come back.
  Nothing wrong with that or any other moves HM are planning.

  You don’t like HM do you?

• 79.Big Hit:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:00 am

  Has this been posted yet?

  British & Irish Lions coach Warren Gatland is expecting a full scale assault both on and off the field when his side tackle the Wallabies next year – but his claims have been laughed off by Australian Rugby Union (ARU) boss John O’Neill.

  Gatland, whose side will face the Wallabies in a three-Test series in the climax of their 10-game tour, is ready for a war of words and has launched pre-emptive strike by suggesting O’Neill, the ARU’s managing director and chief executive, influenced New Zealand referee Bryce Lawrence during last year’s Rugby World Cup.

  In the wake of Australia’s shock loss to Ireland in the pool stages, Gatland has suggested that O’Neill’s criticism of Lawrence’s performance contributed to the Wallabies’ subsequent quarter-final victory over South Africa.

  Lawrence, who admitted to mistakes during the game with Ireland, was widely criticised for his handling of the latter clash due to a perceived bias towards Australia at the breakdown with Gatland believing that O’Neill’s complaints were pivotal in proceedings.

  “They are masters at it and possibly the best one was John O’Neill, as a master of influence in certain things,” Gatland said. “I don’t see any better example than how the (World Cup) quarter-final between South Africa and Australia was influenced. It was a master stroke.

  “I’m not 100% sure, but I think that after Ireland beat Australia in that pool game, certain complaints were made about the referee (Lawrence), subtly and tactfully, and I think that had an impact on the quarter-final.

  “We’ve got to be aware about what sort of things are going to be done on and off the field. I’m not decrying it – what he (O’Neill) did was absolutely outstanding for his nation.”

  Gatland is no stranger to such headline-grabbing outbursts himself notably lighting the fuse ahead of Wales’ Six Nations clash with England last year by goading hooker Dylan Hartley with the suggestion he was a coward.

  “I’ve got a huge amount of respect for what John O’Neill has done in terms of leading Australian sport – he’s a master at what he does,” added Gatland. “We’ve just got to be aware of what sort of things might be happening behind the scenes to put us off.”

  O’Neill has since rejected any suggestion that he influenced the result of a game and that he only made “inquiries about interpretations at the breakdown” following the Wallabies’ defeat to Ireland.

  “It’s quite flattering for Warren to give us credit for influencing referees but the reality is we all know referees are beyond reproach,” O’Neill told Australia’s Daily Telegraph. “I would say we were a bit taken aback that Bryce Lawrence was given so many Wallabies games but ultimately, he did an outstanding job in the game against the Springboks.”

  The Lions’ last visit to Australia in 2001 was also witness to such off-field jousting, with O’Neill behind an attempt to counter the ‘sea of red’ generated by thousands of fans supporting the tourists by handing out gold scarves and hats to Australia fans and Gatland is expecting more of the same.

  “We’re aware of the things off the field – giving out hats, jerseys and t-shirts, there’s going to be an orchestrated campaign in Australia to build them up and potentially make things difficult for us,” Gatland said.

  O’Neill added further fuel to the flames by suggesting there may be a few surprises in store for the Lions. “The forthcoming Lions tour wouldn’t be the same with a few theatrical distractions and the odd ambush. That’s the nature of these Lions tours,” O’Neill joked.

• 80.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:00 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-74:
  ‘Let’s wait and see what happens, we will see, we will talk. Everything has consequences. Playing? I don’t know but we will see.

  “It depends if he wants me. I really don’t know, it is difficult to say,” Matfield said.

  Fk me Pedigree. This would hardly count as being anything but horrible rumours and heresay.
  Do you think this proves that he was picked to play? or perhaps as a lineout consultant? Or some other position?
  That article says ablolutely nothing. may as well have been in the Huisgenoot.

• 81.RL:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:00 am

  @mikeybrass-73: well then you have to blame a) the player cause all players choose to play with injuries and through pain – not his fault he has weak genetic makeup b) the mediocre AC for not managing his players and taking care of them c) the WP medical staff for not doing their job.

• 82.The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:05 am

  @John Galt-76: But he was seemingly ‘returning’ to Matfield before the S15 season had even started……
  That is the point I am making. In January this year, Bekker and Schalk had not even kicked a ball in anger…

  Whether he or Matfield stoked the fires, fact was, before Bekker had even taken one lineout ball in the S15 this year, Matfield was talking about coming back.

  If you think that had no effect on Bekker at all – then so be it. I happen to believe otherwise.

  @shooter-78: No I don’t. And I didn’t like him as a potential Bok coach before he was appointed either. And nothing the man has done since, has given me any reason to change my opinion of him. At least I haven’t been flip flopping like other have….they like him one day, don’t like him the next.

• 83.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:08 am

  @RL-81: Medical staff are not god. Players always want to play. The side-swipe “weak genetic makeup” is unwarranted and plain mean-spirited. No, the fault lays with the Stormers management team and AC as the head.

• 84.trupisero:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:08 am

  @John Galt-80: Who actually gives a shite? He aint playing. End of.

  But Meyer spins more bullshi.t than Divvy and at least Divvy was entertaining.

  HM not so much.

• 85.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:10 am

  I love how some people think they know the mind of those who they have never met

• 86.xtremebull:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:10 am

  Meyer has panic written all over his face… You can see it his eyes and throat… Divvy handled the pressure for 4 years so I believe hm will do it to…

  I think at the eoyt we would get a better understanding on what he wants for the boks… But the likes of spies,daniels,strauss,bizzy,chilly,burger would be the core as they all brings leadership to the front…

• 87.Big Hit:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:11 am

  @stormersboy-21: yeah I was gonna say, some awful imagery. I think he intended to allude to Meyer giving Bekker a boot up the backside but ended up with Meyer’s finger instead.

• 88.The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:11 am

  @John Galt-80: You believe one thing, I believe another. The truth 100% might not be the way I’m preaching it, or the way you are preaching it…it could lie somewhere in between.

  I won’t convince you otherwise, and you won’t convince me.

  So let’s leave it at that.

  Bottom line for me: Meyer’s man management and mental approach towards them, sucks. And while they won’t be saying it publically…..I’m guessing anyone of Keegan, JDJ, Lambie, Bekker and the like will agree.

• 89.grant10:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:12 am

  Excuse me, Mr Meyer, sir… but I’m very confused.
  Let me elaborate. I’m confused because I can’t understand the way you treat players in (and out of) your Springbok squad. The hallmark of any good coach, I’ve been told, is the relationship he is able to build and the trust he is able to garner among those playing for him. A lot of that, surely, must be built on fairness and honesty and while I’m the last one to accuse anyone of dishonesty without evidence, I’m struggling to see the fairness in your most recent selections…
  Let’s start with the thorny flyhalf issue, one that has been debated a lot already. We all know that you see Morne Steyn as your first choice, yet we’ve also been forced to watch him bumble his way through an entire Super Rugby season – and four of the last five tests – without giving anyone even the vaguest glimmer of evidence that he is the best flyhalf in the country. You’ve had two other flyhalves in your squad, in Pat Lambie and Elton Jantjies, yet the former never gets off the bench (supposedly because you “see him as a fullback”) while the latter has been dragged into and out of more Bok squads than he has had hot dinners without ever being given the opportunity to play. In comes Johann Goosen, though, straight into the squad and into the match 22 based on one ropey Currie Cup performance after four months injured, while the other two are out in the cold. Where’s the fairness in that?
  Let’s look at your loose forwards, then. You steadfastly refused to pick Heinrich Brussow when he was available, insisting instead on using Marcell Coetzee out of his normal position (this is a trend we’ll pick up on later) in a loose trio that has a very one-dimensional look to it. About the only player in your squad who ever offered something different – Keegan Daniel – amazingly gets dropped (after a test in Argentina when he was one of the few players to look like anything) in favour of Duanne Vermeuelen, another who, while talented, has only just come back from long-term injury. Even more baffling, though, is the decision to bring in Francois Louw from the middle of nowhere when Brussow was so close to availability that you could have chosen him instead. It’s not like you can argue that Louw is any closer to match fit than Brussow, by the way, because the UK season hasn’t even started yet. Why is Louw there, though, unless his selection is your tacit way of admitting that you got it wrong and we do need a fetcher after all? In that case, why not pick the best one we have? And please explain why, having opted to bring in yet another big ball carrier in Vermeulen, when we already have Willem Alberts and Coetzee playing that role, you opted to retain the incredibly similar Jacques Potgieter in your squad, rather than the more versatile Daniel? Did Potgieter really do anything in his test appearances to date to make him worthy of another chance, but Daniel not?
  Talking of chances, though, I wonder how Francois Hougaard gets away with still being in the starting lineup? I mean, he’s had plenty of chances to show what he can do in his preferred position of scrumhalf and has cocked up every one. So now he gets a chance – a free ride – to establish himself at wing at the expense of Lwazi Mvovo, who has done nothing wrong in his showings to date and has been performing as a specialist wing for the last three seasons. What makes Hougaard so special that he gets more chances, whereas Mvovo does not?
  Maybe it’s about experience… could that be it? Do you want to keep Hougaard in the team, regardless of form, because he’s an experienced player? Pity that the same logic didn’t apply to Andries Bekker, then, an experienced player dropped from a dizzy height after one bad test. Funny that the man who replaces Bekker, Juandre Kruger, has a weird thing in common with Steyn, Potgieter and Hougaard. I’m not going to point out what it is, because surely you, Mr Meyer, would be above anything as petty as actual provincialism, right? It’s also interesting, though, that a lack of experience doesn’t prevent Vermeulen or Goosen from being brought straight into the side, Again, one rule for some, a different rule for others.
  Let’s get back to this positional mucking about, though. We’re told – repeatedly – by your bevvy of tame journos that Pat Lambie cannot possibly be picked at flyhalf for the Boks because, shock horror, the Sharks occasionally play him at fullback. If you had bothered to actually talk to the Sharks coaches, who have known Lambie a lot longer and better than you do, you could very quickly have worked out that the Sharks actually do see Lambie as their best flyhalf and could have explained the quite tactical reasons that he was deployed at fullback for a few games. Asking those questions and getting those answers, though, may have detracted from the agenda to keep Lambie away from Bok 10, so probably safer to stick with the easy answer of “I can’t possibly play him out of position”. What, then, makes it ok to play Coetzee, Hougaard or even Jean de Villiers in positions other than the ones they’ve filled for their franchises in Super Rugby this year? Different rules for different players, I guess.
  Lots of changes, lots of theories, lots of explanations, in other words. But of consistency and fairness, Mr Meyer, I’m seeing

• 90.grant10:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:15 am

  @grant10-89: This from Sharksworld….

  HM better pray the Boks win at least 2 of next 4 games….

  He wont be getting much sympathy away from Pretoria….

• 91.RL:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:15 am

  @Big Hit-79: biggy we made an example of Brycie, do not s.crew the Boks over or it is over with your career.

  @mikeybrass-83: Do you think I was being harsh on AC? I mean it is not his fault that there was a lack of lock depth at the WP forcing him to flog the camel to death.

• 92.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:21 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-88:
  Fair enough.

  I do think that HM is going to take time to work out his best combo’s though. Especially with so many injuries. JP, Bissie, Schalk, Bekker etc
  It was always going to happen with so many experienced players now retired or moved on to greener, more japanese pastures.

  I think its up to the players to bounce back now. Look at how Daniel played against the Cheetahs.
  The rest need to man up as well.

• 93.RL:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:23 am

  @grant10-90: well if it is from sharksworld it explains everything.

• 94.John Galt:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:25 am

  @The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-88:
  And I do think that the Bekker issue is not as important as the M Steyn issue.
  That is something we would agree on.

• 95.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:25 am

  @RL-91: AC deserves the criticism he gets for not having afforded Bekker the appropriate rest. We saw this season how fit but lesser players offered more than a crocked Bekker.

  @grant10-89: Meyer met with all players before the start of the season and made it clear where they stand. Goosen would have been there from the start if he hadn’t been injured. Meyer is staying true to his word.

  Meyer thinks he has enough loose-forward cover. I don’t like Pottie but then again I don’t like Daniels either at test level. I’d have brought in Flo and Joe.

  Meyer’s thinking evolves. Embrace that.

• 96.mikeybrass:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:26 am

  @RL-93: LOL.

  @John Galt-94: Yes.

• 97.Brigadier Van Zyl:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:29 am

  @mikeybrass-75:

  mickey brass…..Bekker is perrenially injured and out of rugby.
  In fact, Matfield played 4-5 seasons missing, well, I cannot remember matfield ever not being there.

  ….and Bekker needs more time off?
  come on, he’s off injured and resting so often in another line of work he’d be considered, “a casual”.

• 98.katman:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:32 am

  I reckon it doesn’t matter how much respect the players say they have for Meyer, if he’s gonna go putting his finger up their arses he’s going to get donnered. That’s not on.

• 99.gunther:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:34 am

  In other news it looks like Gwantie has learned the art of Cut and Paste.

  Has transie been giving him lessons?

• 100.grant10:
  6 Sep 2012, 11:35 am

  @mikeybrass-95: I certainly am pleased that HM has . seemingly , changed his perspectives about the fetcher….and I hope he will walk his Damascus Road Talk when Brussow proves his fitness….I also believe Goosen will become a superstar….

  My concern is why he ditched Brussow in the first place….

  and why he has clung onto a dismal M Steyn for so long when he had ample talent in Lambie and Jantjes in reserve.

  The reason I posted the Sharksworld excerpt is that the tone seems to be a reflection of a large number of fans outside of Pretoria……

  I hope HM comes through…..some of his calls I have found absurd…..but hell I dont want to have to go through a 2010 and 2011 ever again so am praying HM sees the light…

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