Meyer admits Morne mistake
16 Sep 2012
Heyneke Meyer says he may have erred in keeping Morne Steyn on the field against the All Blacks in Dunedin.
Steyn, whose missed penalty kicks cost the Springboks wins against England in PE and Argentina in Mendoza, had a poor first half with the boot at the Otago Stadium and many expected him to be replaced by Johan Goosen at half-time. Meyer, though, kept faith in his No 10 and it proved costly as by the time he was subbed in the 59th minute he had been successful with just one attempt out of five.
‘Sitting here afterwards it is easy to make calls but it is a life and death situation for me and maybe I made the wrong call but Morne usually comes back and kicks well,’ Meyer told a news conference after the match. ‘Frans Steyn is a great goal-kicker and Ruan Pienaar can kick as well. You don’t just take a guy off for his goal-kicking.
‘I’ve always said that I am going to bring Johan Goosen through and give him game time. But Johan had struggled with his goal-kicking in training during the week and he is still only 20-years-old and he hasn’t played for almost three months. I thought he did superbly for the 25 minutes he was on the field.
‘But we could have changed the goal-kicker. We talked about it at half-time. I thought Morne would find his rhythm.’
378 Comments
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16 Sep 2012, 11:51 am
@blueboy-96: Correct
Deon Fourie at 2, Strauss or Ralapelle on bench
Brussow either at 6 or on bench if we start Louw at 6, but Louw can also play 7, same as Coetsee
Alberts hybrid between 4 and 7, start Vd Merwe 4 with Etzebeth 5 and have Bekker / Kruger on bench for 2nd row.
Vermeulen, Alberts, Louw, Coetsee, Brussow should be the loose trio contingent with Alberts able to swap to 2nd row enforcer if required.
16 Sep 2012, 11:54 am
The Steyn creature has been ineffective all year. As for Sideshow Bob, well what can you say? What you see is what you get. If Meyer is serious about winning, he needs to eliminate the Steyn creature, the Greyling beast and the non-existent fullback.
9. Hougaard
10. Goosen/Lambie
11. Habana
12. Serfontein
13. Jordaan
14. JPP
15. Frans Steyn
This would be a very competitive backline in a few years time.
16 Sep 2012, 11:54 am
@hsark-100: i would give FLow a crack, being a captain and fetcher means you will probably get away with a bit more too, he has experience captaining and i think could be good, would certainly offer more than jdv
16 Sep 2012, 11:54 am
@98 fitzfella: very good ponta you make.
Did you notice that for the habana try, morne was standing very flat and popped up the pass up only a couple of metres from the AB line? This was what created the try. However, it seemed a complete accident that he was so flat – he had run in to help tidy up a messy lineout.
What if he stood flat more often,???? Makes me think…
16 Sep 2012, 11:57 am
JdV is UNHAPPY.. he is having to fulfill a captaincy role in a setup which he KNOWS is contra to proper rugby decision making..
JdV can play 14 wing or he can play 13
EXCEPT the back line HAS to have pro active activity from 9 and 10
Play Hougaard at 9 and Goosen at 10 and the ENTIRE Bok back line will transform overnight with JdV at 12 or 13 or 14
and Frans Steyn is FAR too individualist.. he makes ground on his own but he is NOT a very creative inside channel midfielder, he is shutting JdV OUT the game altogether.
Perhaps Frans Steyn best position is actually Full Back.
16 Sep 2012, 12:02 pm
@corporal punishment-104: Err, Moroné wasn’t near that try, it was Flo who popped the ball.
16 Sep 2012, 12:04 pm
#98 Fitz1ella Skop Doc Craven used to say NEVER play a player out of position how true these words are coming true Hougaard MUST go back to fly half as HM is going to waste this guys talents at scrum half,JDV is shite at outside centre in fact he should not be playing bok rugby as he is by his sellby date,Habana if he has to play must go back to left wing as looks his more natural position.I also think F Steyn should be back at full back as he is not the same force at inside centre as he once was.
16 Sep 2012, 12:05 pm
Yes Louw made the pop up pass that put Habana away.. not Morne ..
was only Frans Louw who had the insight and rugby intelligence to make the break through
16 Sep 2012, 12:06 pm
I’m pretty sure Biks can win their home matches v oz and ABs if fourie, brussow, hougaard and goosen are picked – and etsebeth returns for flip – if elstadt and etsebeth were partnered the boks would be even better.
It’s tough being a flying particularly tge kicker but morne must go back to CC and try recover somE form – it’s now time to try Goosen and get the backline moving. Frans stem willl look a completely different prospect with two attacking halfbacks inside of him – kirchener must also go if he’s not going to deviate from the kicing game plan
16 Sep 2012, 12:08 pm
Where is the rest of the interview??
HM:
“But Morne has also shown in the past that he has mental toughness so it is great to have two flyhalves like that. It’s great that Johan is coming through. I will look at the video, take the emotion out of it and maybe make a few hard calls,” he said.
So IF HM makes some hard calls MS might and hopefully will be dropped from the squad completely. I hope Jantjies gets a call up, he’s been outstanding and has even shown his worth in a struggling Lions team in Super rugby. And he’s a great goal kicker!
HM better make some hard calls. He should know by now that some changes can make a huge difference! And hopefully he will look at the video and start to realise that this game plan will never make the boks the number one team in the world!
This game was there for the taking and the players cant be blamed for implementing a stupid outdated gameplan.
16 Sep 2012, 12:09 pm
If fourie is not picked and flip and jannie and Strauss start – I fancy even oz to upset us at home and ABs will win too
16 Sep 2012, 12:11 pm
Bok back line
Hougaard, Goosen, Habana / Rhule, Serfontein, De Jongh / Mapoe, JPP / Jordaan, W. Le Roux / F. Steyn
Bench: Pretorius / Pienaar, Lambie / Jantjies, A. Coetsee / F Steyn
16 Sep 2012, 12:13 pm
@106 nanashi: I stand corrected! Great thinking by flo then, the pass made the break.
I guess my point still stands – standing flat on attack is the way to create gaps, even if it is risky (intercepts) and vulnerable to a good rush defense.
16 Sep 2012, 12:15 pm
Ring some changes – put some fresh changes into the pack – what does fourie actually have to do to get picked? He is head and shoulders better than every hooker in sa (apart from Bismarck) and is actually better than virtually all of tge loosies in sa too – he was immense AGAIN yesterday – no wonder this talent is going to Europe with these fools in charge – get the halfbacks right, bring de Jong into attack and drop kirchener out of it.
16 Sep 2012, 12:16 pm
@cab 111: hard to see boks losing both home matches. Should beat ozzies, and about a 50% chance of beating abs based on the Dunedin game.
16 Sep 2012, 12:18 pm
@Jeez-110:
He has TO DROP Pienaar from 9 and play Hougaard..
that was the DUMBEST decision he has made almost all season and that is some dumb decision because he made a few VERY dumb decisions beside that one.
16 Sep 2012, 12:19 pm
Im seeing positive signs…this could be the first Bok coach to admit mistakes.
Now lets see if he acts on them.
16 Sep 2012, 12:22 pm
@fitz1ella-105:
Pienaars tactical kicking was awful, but it wasnt worse compared to Hougaard’s in the previous tests. And Pienaar will be better – he normally is a very good tactical kicker from the base. And has been in great form in Europe.
His distribution was a lot quicker and cleaner than Hougaard’s or didnt you watch the previous games? He deserved to be dropped out of position. And Pienaar deserves to get more chances. Hougaard played 5 **** games. His time for now should be up.
Then you can also blame the gameplan. Pienaar and MS didnt kick well, but they should never had kicked as often anyway. And that stupid traintjie thing the forwards set up behind the ruck before Pienaar kicks! They obviously learnt that from their coach.
Hougaard will never be a good 9 in this team with this gameplan. His strengths does not lie in a kick and chase gameplan. He will never be allowed the freedom to read the situation and that is exactly what makes him such a good and dangerous 9.
16 Sep 2012, 12:24 pm
HM must go. You cannot have a coach that takes forever to learn WTF works. The guy is stubborn dictator that has no business coaching the Boks.
16 Sep 2012, 12:24 pm
Corporal punishment
Boks go into home matches with same team and gameplan andcrgey will lose both – too a v average oz side who shoulda been beaten by pumas and a below par AB side too.
All he has to do is make a handful of changes and blast this kick kick kick **** into hyperspace and Boks can with both – if he persists, we will lose and I suspect the dropping of morne will not be enough.
16 Sep 2012, 12:27 pm
@fitz1ella-112: Where have you been? Hougaard had a terrible test season so far at 9. Absolutely terrible. It was in the news papers and Pienaar deserves a chance. Pienaars kicking was **** but he did his other scrumhalf duties pretty well.
You must really hate Pienaar, but i dont buy into your weak reasoning.
16 Sep 2012, 12:29 pm
Hougaard should have been the scrumhalf for tge last 2 years already and he’s natural strengths shouldve been encouraged – dynamic scrumhalf play to get go-forward – instead they’ve tried to mould a true worldclass weapon into a metronomic kicking robot and in the process completely emasiculated him and blunted one of the Boks few attacking weapons.
16 Sep 2012, 12:29 pm
How is it that these so called rugby geniuses are THAT THICK
WHO in their RIGHT mind plays Pienaar ahead of Hougaard
WHO Persists with a deep pocket kick chase archaic style fly half in Morne Steyn who has LOST Boks the last 11 tests from 14 starts.. WHO ???
WHO plays Potgieter ahead of Brussow or Louw.. WHO ??
WHO takes Beast off and puts Greyling on at a critical time of proceedings .. WHO??
WHO cries like a goddamn BABY pining like a love sick MORON for FdP and Matfield and Bakkies Botha ??
This THICK IDIOT of a coach is supposed to be next to God according some disciples YET he is having to LEARN what it TAKES to be a wide awake international coach at this level from SCRATCH… even armchair ARSEHOLES who NEVER coached any rugby in their lives could have TOLD him what is a Good call from a BAD one..
16 Sep 2012, 12:29 pm
@cab-120: Spot on, and he should get a backline coach with some decent credentials too!
Dropping MS and Kirchner ect. will only deny the real problem
16 Sep 2012, 12:38 pm
@Jeez-121: nope you are the idiot
Hougaard is 100% BETTER scrum half to ALL the FdP CLONES and wannabe’s
If Meyer had STUCK with Hougaard through the Argentina test and the last 2 tests against Aus and AB’s he would have won THEM all
I am100% CONVINCED about that..
Its all these MORONS who don’t know the BEGINNING of what actually WORKS on a rugby field and what Don’t
If Hougaard had played scrumhalf instead of that kick chase MORON FdP at WC 2011 then PdV would also have WON THAT..!!
along with playing Smit at 2 and Spies at 8 and Burger at first receiver ball carry DUNCE.. FdP at 9 was ACTUALLY what has KILLED Boks OFF the ENTIRE last 3 seasons..
So WHERE the FcK have YOU BEEN the PAST 3 Seasons watching this ARCHAIC DUMB as Trash rugby philosophy go from BAD to WORSE under Smit, FdP and every dumb moronic IMBECILE that thinks FdP style garbage rugby will STILL WORK
11 Losses from 14 Starts under FdP and Morne Steyn with Smit at 2 and Spies at 8 .. That is the ACTUAL result
Hougaard should have been at 9 since 2010 with John Smit and Spies GONE ( and Burger NOT at first receiver) .. and Boks would have CREAMED the opposition instead of this OUTRIGHT FdP style GARBAGE we been aiming at.
16 Sep 2012, 12:38 pm
Pumas are actually playing great rugby – got absolutely zero backline but are counterrucking tge big boys right off tge ball – Los Pumas are a fantastic addition.
16 Sep 2012, 12:43 pm
The Blue Bulls have tried to CLONE Hougaard into their premier god FdP
and Meyer is the BIGGEST culprit for that outright FCKUP of an attempt
Hougaard is head and shoulders a more dynamic courageous and street smart bust a gut rugby player / scrum half than FdP and Pienaar could EVER DREAM of ever wanting to be..
But Meyer and his BB ARSEHOLES have ALMOST killed all that..
Not Quite.. because Hougaard is first and foremost a die hard all or nothing type rugby player.. something Pienaar and the bang broek little chickenshit FdP could NEVER hope to ever emulate.
16 Sep 2012, 12:45 pm
yawn
16 Sep 2012, 12:49 pm
The dropping of morne is a good first step but there are too many mr average’s in the Bok side – you are not going to win test matches against oz and nz with so many mediocrities – meyer has actually managed to pick a mediocre side from one of the most talented groups of players SA have had since readmission
It’s horrifically bad – what is worse is that his one real strength – drilling forwards is being rendered completely ineffective by his very own ineffective mediocre selections. Pick Fourie and tell him to rip into it, pick brussow, pick elstadt and do the same and all of a sudden he’ll get tge kind of go-forward he’s looking for.
Put some decent attacking talent behind that and you are going to ask tge 2 top sides in the world problems, otherwise you won’t.
16 Sep 2012, 12:53 pm
@Jeez-128: yawn all you like you know fckall about what works and what don’t
Hougaard should be at 9 .. FULL STOP.. and M. Steyn should be dropped.. and Kirchner too
Spies is gone thank fck… so NEXT is play Hougaard 9, Goosen 10 and anyone ahead of Kirchner preferably Willie le Roux
But idiots such as you will persist with PIENAAR at 9
Says it all.. thicker than thick .. how many LOSSES you still aiming at..??
16 Sep 2012, 13:02 pm
W. Le Roux / (A.Coetsee / P. Lambie)
JPP / Jordaan)
JdV (c) / (de Jongh / Mapoe)
F. Steyn / (Serfontein)
Habana / (R. Rhule)
Goosen / (Jantjies)
Hougaard / (Pretorius / Van Zyl)
Vermeulen / (Coetsee / Daniel)
Alberts / (Elstadt / Coetsee / Louw)
Brussow / (Louw / Coetsee / Kolisi)
Etzebeth / (Bekker / Kruger)
Elstadt / (vd Merwe / Bressler) / Alberts)
Cilliers / (JdP / M. Vd Merwe)
Bismark / (Fourie)
Mtwarira / (Janse van Rensburg / Ooosthuizen)
This group would KLAP ALL comers and Oz and Ab’s would be destroyed without doubt.
16 Sep 2012, 13:04 pm
Meyer is the Steyn on an otherwise unblemished, innocent SA rugby team.
he is the beast, a goose wrapped in the flouw that Pacino states in scent of a woman
hooha. hooha
even fat Allberts flips the music Strauss preambles
and us kiwis await our spies
our Ruans (ruins)
for we are but lambies to the slaughter
and we would be inZane to think otherwise
in the land of the rainbow
49 odd percent is king.
and the judiciary
those men Greyling
16 Sep 2012, 13:06 pm
@poppa69-132: very good..
so who still thinks you’re … dumb?
put all these saffa halfwits to SHAME
16 Sep 2012, 13:06 pm
1. beast
2. Change (fourie)
3. Change (cilliers or anyone else)
4. Change (should be elstadt or alberts)
5. Etsebeth or kruger
6. Change (Brussow)
7. Alberts
8. Vermuelen
9. Change (hougaard)
10. Change (goosen)
11. Habana
12. Frans
13. Change (de Jong)
14. JdV/Jp
15. Change (aplon, viljoen, taute, le roux whoever)
16 Sep 2012, 13:11 pm
It is difficult, frankly, not to concur with the burgeoning school of rugby-lovers who feel that South Africa’s selection of a dour, formulaic flyhalf (ditto the fullback, Zane Kirchner?) and lopsided penchant for the hoist-and-hope principle, is somehow a copout, an act of virtual cowardice and a signal only of almost willing bankruptcy
Thats what I been saying,.Heyneke is fear filled…and that **** spreads…
16 Sep 2012, 13:14 pm
those men Greyling
Ashwin their features
stunned Mallets
camped easy
and falling under the Marshall’s spell
kmow that the night is always all black
just before the wrath of Dawn.
16 Sep 2012, 13:15 pm
Meyer has been found wanting. For every position we should be nurturing 2 players. Example…fullback. Taute / Lambie, flyhalf Jantjies / Goosen….etc. The trick in SA is to find a coach who knows how to select and bring out the best.
Or better yet get a foreigner to coach the boks…there will be no provincial bias and no baggage. Wayne Smith, Gatland, Mitchell etc.
And JDV is no captain. He does not give me confidence in interviews. Personally I would have gone with Joshua Strauss as captain. He has always impressed me as a player and captain.
16 Sep 2012, 13:15 pm
cheers Skop. just having a bit of fun
16 Sep 2012, 13:29 pm
HM is the classic micro manager when the job of national coach requires a macro manager.
The reason he chose so many BBs had nothing to do with loyalty towards them, but because he’d either trained them to do as he wanted, or in the case of Pottie and JJ he’d personally recruited them for the Bulls to be trained.
I reckon his comment that his job is to coach, not just select, is a telling one. He’s treating the players as if they’re inexperienced recruits who need to be moulded into his vision of the finished article to implement his game plan, rather than the experienced professionals most of them are.
16 Sep 2012, 13:36 pm
15. Lambie
14. JDV
13. Jordaan*
12. F Steyn
11. Habana
10. Goose
9. Hougard
8. Vermeelen
7. Alberts
6. Brossouw*
5. Etsebeth
4. Flip
3. DuPlesis
2. Strauss
1. Beast
Subs:
Coenie*, Liebenberg, Bekker, Coetzee, Pienaar, Jantjies, Taute*
* Hopefully back from injury
Injured:
Bismark, Schalk, Kanko, J Smith, JPP
16 Sep 2012, 13:39 pm
Very true David
oz at home is non-negotiable with the talent in sa at the moment – stormers came top, sharks into the final and bulls narrowly missed out in pkaoff spot.
If boks lose to a v ordinary oz side at home meyer must be sacked.
16 Sep 2012, 13:40 pm
@David-139:
And that is why JdV’s body language is reeking of disgust and outright distaste at the style of management .. / leadership that is being deployed by Meyer
In this capacity PdV is/was light years ahead of either Meyer or White in respect of player morale boosting and buy in decision taking management.. only PdV went too far the other way giving Matfield, Smit and FdP almost carte blanche on any and all decision taking on or off the field..
Meyer has tried his despotic my way or the highway approach and JdV is just TOO experienced and mature to buy into it.. and his response and body language is showing clearly he is NOT comfortable having to front up to the BULLSHIT as the captain / team spokesman under the archaic circumstances..
Meyer will have to LEARN and learn QUICKLY that this is NOT BB kindergarten style rugby philosophy he is trying to instill here otherwise his whole grandiose ambitious self centered vision is going to go BUST.. if it hasn’t started doing so already.
16 Sep 2012, 13:41 pm
@David-139:
My main concern is how HM mentors Goosen.
When Morne started his professional career he was a running flyhalf.
Goosen will do everything to please his Bok coach and that could be detrimental to his natural abilities.
16 Sep 2012, 13:41 pm
@blik-140: nice setup 10000 times better than the one picked by the national coach
where are all the Potgieter pundits disappeared to lately?
16 Sep 2012, 13:45 pm
@Jeraldjay-143: my biggest fear also he can destroy Goosen’s natural flair game as the BB hierarchy have almost already destroyed Hougaard with the SAME one dimensional goddamn IDIOCY.. trying to clone him into FdP
If Meyer tries creating a Liefling / M. Steyn clone out of Goosen I may actually take the goddamn distasteful neanderthal like rearguard reverse style action PERSONALLY
16 Sep 2012, 13:45 pm
@blik-140:
Not bad, I would move Frans to 15, select Brache at 12 (the best distributor in SA rugby) , Rule at 14, F Louw at 6 and Bekker for Flip wih Elstadt on the bench.
J Smith and maybe Schalk are history.
16 Sep 2012, 13:50 pm
Correct Jerald
and what is worse is if the same mediocre pack is picked and he suffers from the same stagnant ball – rung some gdam changes – what’s it going to take – a wooden spoon – Argentina are looking more competitive than the Boks.
16 Sep 2012, 13:50 pm
@Robzim-146: Smith and Schalk are history.. and we have WAY more able bodied replacements than both of them currently
Flip played a decent game at 4 enforcer yesterday.. put in big effort.. Our front 8 while Beast was on actually had the upper hand throughout and only Pienaar, Steyn and Kirchner fckd the entire game UP..!!
I always said Etzebeth to 4 enforcer was a WRONG choice.. Elstadt or Flip or Alberts or the kid Willemse going to Bulls from Lions must play 4 enforcer and etzebeth must share 5 with Bekker.
J. Kruger is more a hybrid No.5 lock / No.7 flank than a fully fledged 2nd row option, little like Elstadt or Alberts with less grunt.
16 Sep 2012, 13:55 pm
We’ve almost come full circle here – right back to laager conservative mindset
completely unbelievable. I thought HM was one of new breed , some of these comments re the players and apologies to mccaw are crazy.
16 Sep 2012, 13:57 pm
Flip is not the right choice, neither are Strauss nor jannie – watch oz beat boks even if goosen selected.
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