Goosen bides his time
20 Sep 2012
Johan Goosen says Heyneke Meyer has clearly communicated his reasons for delaying giving him a Test start but says that he feels ready to go.
Goosen has shifted into the national consciousness in recent weeks in light of Springboks’ flyhalf incumbent Morné Steyn’s poor form. Meyer had identified Goosen as a successor to Steyn from the outset of his tenure, but injury prevented him from using him earlier. However, with Goosen fit and showing glimpses of his potential in two cameos off the wood against Australia and New Zealand, there are mounting calls for him to replace Steyn for the home leg of the Rugby Championship.
Meyer has held his cards close as far as Steyn’s immediate future is concerned but he certainly has a sense of the pressure he is under to cut the player. He has consistently explained his rationale for holding Goosen back, stressing that how he is introduced into that Test fold will be decisive in shaping the player he will become.
Goosen said, having been briefed on Meyer’s reasoning, he was content with his role at present.
‘The coach has been great in how he has dealt with me. I’ve always known his plans and I believe those plans are in my best interests,’ Goosen told keo.co.za. ‘He has been very careful, especially in terms of my exposure to the media and so on. I’m patient. I know what the purpose of the plan is. But I also feel like I can make the step up to start if the coach asks me to. I feel ready.’
Meyer is unlikely to veer from his kick-chase approach for the Loftus and Soccer City Tests, which brings into question Goosen’s aptitude in executing the skills necessary to succeed within this framework. He is a player who enjoys standing flat to the line, taking that line on himself or keeping ball in hand in a bid to create opportunities for those on his outside. Goosen reckons that he will have to temper his natural instinct slightly if he starts, but scoffed at the notion that Meyer is conservative.
‘Of course you have to be a little more careful about your attacking play in Test rugby, defensive systems are so good and teams punish small errors. But that doesn’t mean the coach doesn’t encourage me to run the ball when it is on,’ he said. ‘I work hard on my tactical kicking, even though we don’t kick that often at the Cheetahs. I feel I can fit into the plans from a kicking perspective. But of course my strength is running the ball. There’s a lot of room for that with the Springboks and the coach encourages us to express ourselves. It is about assessing the opposition’s defensive set up quickly and taking that split second you have to go wide. I think that is the biggest adjustment you have to make from Super Rugby – the time and space you have is so much less.’
Asked what he thought of the vitriol that has been aimed at Steyn in the last week, Goosen said: ‘I feel deeply sorry for him. He is a great guy, so humble and he works so hard in training. He has won many, many Tests for the Boks. He is going through a difficult time now, we all do, and he deserves better than what he is getting from some people and the media.’
By Ryan Vrede
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118 Comments
20 Sep 2012, 10:31 am
Poor poor Elton…
20 Sep 2012, 10:34 am
His comments on Steyn are spot on.
I support anyone against the Bulls and think Steyn should have been dropped awhile ago, but the vicious comments and attention he’s receiving are completely unjustified to a player that has performed admirably for the Boks in his career.
It’s despicable that way we Saffas lynch our players when they hit bad form.
He doesn’t pick himself either…
20 Sep 2012, 10:36 am
this goosen sounds like he has a solid head on his shoulders.
on the whole he comes across as a well brought up young man but time and pressure will reveal all.
20 Sep 2012, 10:40 am
More “shifting into the national consciousness” from Vrede. All sounds terribly tra-la-la. I’ll be honest, I don’t know much about national consciousness – assume it has to do with crystals and chai tea – but when Fransie fights Sunni Bin, the Kiwis are going to learn a thing or two about national unconsciousness. Float like a butterfly, fall like a cow pat.
20 Sep 2012, 10:46 am
@katman-4: haha, we are all looking forward to that fight immensly!
20 Sep 2012, 10:54 am
@katman-4: hahahaha
20 Sep 2012, 11:04 am
“Meyer is unlikely to veer from his kick-chase approach for the Loftus and Soccer City Tests, which brings into question Goosen’s aptitude in executing the skills necessary to succeed within this framework”
Well, he can hardly be kakker than Stain at it…..
20 Sep 2012, 11:05 am
Credit where credit is due… Heyneke Meyer is right for delaying Goosen’s starting debut for the Boks. The player is young and needs to be brought in gradually so that he becomes comfortable with test rugby. Opposition teams would love the opportunity to target him on defense and ruin our hopes for him. It is therefore crucial he gets some caps under his belt and learns more about test rugby before he is thrown into the deep end.
That being said, Morne Steyn is a liability.. I would prefer Lambie to start in the interim and Goosen to come off the wood. The roles can be reversed after 10 or so caps.
I would also like to see Elton Jantjies get a chance. We are in danger of losing him to an overseas club and possibly even and overseas national team.
20 Sep 2012, 11:10 am
@Kaizan-8: you couldnt be more correct.
20 Sep 2012, 11:14 am
@Kaizan-8: Bollocks. If you’re good enough you’re old enough.
How many tests were Schalla and Frans Steyn “eased” into?
20 Sep 2012, 11:18 am
@Kaizan-8: you are easily impressed. the only reason heyneke is delaying goosen is only for him to brainwash johan like he did morne and turn him into a kicking robot that is rooted in the pocket…
oh, it is true!
‘I can improve a lot as an attacking flyhalf,’ Steyn said, before theorising about the root of his struggles. ‘When I arrived at the Bulls in 2003 I was more of an attacking flyhalf, but coach Heyneke Meyer explained to me that if I wanted to take the step up I needed to improve my tactical kicking game.
‘It’s the kicking that’s doing the job at the moment. The Bulls and Boks play more of a kicking than running game, so it required me to adjust accordingly. But having said that, my running game has suffered as a result. I know I have to grow that area of my game.’
20 Sep 2012, 11:18 am
Between Goosen and Jantjes we have the no.10 jersey well and truly covered. Both offer real attacking play, lots of variation, decent defense and good goal kicking. In other words, both are COMPLETE flyhalfs, not some kind of in-the-pocket kicking specialist.
20 Sep 2012, 11:18 am
@kaizan-8 my heart bleeds for EJ, the guy is brilliant in the CC, dismantling the bulls and then cheetahs almost single handedly.
I also feel for Lambie, he single handedly won the CC final for the sharks at FH 2 seasons back, if he had been given an extended run in the 10 jumper surely he would be world class by now. Look at how the chiefs and ABs have persistently selected cruden, and how confident he is now, sure he is no DC but the ABs dont loose much when he starts
20 Sep 2012, 11:20 am
@rangerman-5: If they don’t change the dates, I am going to be in Durbs to watch the fight, Can’t wait.
20 Sep 2012, 11:21 am
@Transformation-11: how does “improving my tactical kicking game” equate to being a purely kicking flyhalf transie?
methinks you are attempting to lead people here buddy.
20 Sep 2012, 11:22 am
@trupisero-10: Cant compare 10 to 6/7/8 at all. Asking a young guy to start at 10 and basically run the show is very different to asking a tearaway flanker to start.
20 Sep 2012, 11:23 am
@2k3-13: Lambie is the key for me. If we can find a home for Lambie (presumably 15) then we can bring EJ onto the bench and get him game time, then Goosen and him can fight it out for the next 10 years.
20 Sep 2012, 11:24 am
@Zandberg Jansen-14: is the fight in durbs????
i didnt know that, not really being a boxing fan.
where is it being held? i am sure my mates would also like to go haha.
20 Sep 2012, 11:25 am
@Skeppie-17: lambie to 15 and elton on the bench to alternate with goose.
we are blessed to have these three players and should use them sharpish.
20 Sep 2012, 11:26 am
@rangerman-18: They said the 17th Nov. We are waiting for the other details….
20 Sep 2012, 11:28 am
@Zandberg Jansen-20: cool man, please let me know on here if you find out.
20 Sep 2012, 11:28 am
@rangerman-21: Will do.
20 Sep 2012, 11:29 am
@rangerman-19: Agree Jantjies is underrated.
15. Lambie
10. Gooseneck\Jantjies
Morne can play CC.
20 Sep 2012, 11:30 am
@Zandberg Jansen-22: shot.
@blik-23: its great to see most bok fans agree on this.
20 Sep 2012, 11:30 am
@Skeppie-16: Too some extent, but the 10 has the advantage that he can be protected to an extent by his loosies.
The chap coming in at 6/7/8 has nowhere to hide and will certainly be introduced to some skullduggery – the question in both scenarios is how they would handle it?
In Eben’s case, a half-arsed kopstamp – but that won’t affect him mentally other than to remember to put the ******* down next time
20 Sep 2012, 11:34 am
Yes, goose, you tell them….
meyer has a coherent plan on how to develope and introduce his players to the greater squad.
@Transformation-11:
What bollocks….improving one aspect of your game is not an excuse to neglect another. You need to be able to attack and kick, sure a player has a specific strengh but that does not mean another aspect should become a specific weakness.
20 Sep 2012, 11:36 am
@trupisero-25: haha, i think sharpe is quite happy he will probably never play etsebeth again.
that kid is a scary b a s tard, he should come play for the sharks and get some silverware.
20 Sep 2012, 11:36 am
@rangerman-19: Agreed 100 % Three important, dynamic players for the Boks . Jantjies should have come off the bench in the PE test already but Meyer cant ignore him forever. Steyn to Currie Cup or France or Japan. He had a great early Bok career with seasoned, legendary players all around him.
20 Sep 2012, 11:37 am
@trupisero-10:
schalla played a handful of games in 2003 worldcup as a supersub if memory serves correctly.
Frans Steyn likewise as a supersub on the Wing?
Both of those players had more game time accumulated than Goosen before getting full starts.
So, basically….kak examples in this instance.
20 Sep 2012, 11:37 am
If Lambie feels he is more suited to flyhalf then he needs to move to a franchise where he can play flyhalf, even if htat means a move overseas!!
20 Sep 2012, 11:38 am
@rangerman-15: i think comprehension is failing you
why are you asking me and not wondering why morne would give that answer when asked why he never attacks the line or play flat?
leifling never attacked the line, morne never attacks the line, francois brummer while at the bulls never attacked the line, the only thing in common with all these players is they were brainswashed by heyneke meyer!
look at brummer now at griquas, the boy is flourishing, back to his Baby Bok best attacking play, inter-changing with willie le roux cutting fools up!
20 Sep 2012, 11:38 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-26: transie is just stirring as usual
20 Sep 2012, 11:41 am
@trupisero-25: Its more the mental pressure than anything physical. Schalla was always a huge talent and could come in and throw himself around from day one. But asking a new 10 with very little senior rugby experience to come in and run the game, direct play, make calls etc is very different. That said I would still start him next weekend.
20 Sep 2012, 11:41 am
@Spiesisworthless1-28: and no fdp to make decisions for him anymore.
“why are you asking me and not wondering why morne would give that answer when asked why he never attacks the line or play flat?”
why why why
its no wonder i am battling with you.
your post is a lot of emotional nonsense. think about it for a while and return with a cogent argument.
20 Sep 2012, 11:41 am
@race of tan-30: you need to keep up with the press mate,
LAmbie played 15 because of the Boks request and also he played there at the Sharks as he was injured a lot this season, Freddy had great form and Ludik and Viljoen at the time were not playing well, Plum felt the need to have both Freddy and Lambie on the field at the same time,
Since then Freddy has moved on and Plum has come out stating Lambie is a 10 and at the Sharks will only be playing there
20 Sep 2012, 11:44 am
@rangerman-27:
He’s already got a conference trophy, which is a step up from the CC.
20 Sep 2012, 11:46 am
@Transformation-31:
and yet Brummer will not make a superrugby squad? And the spears prefer to sign a greek even?
maybe playing rugby for the griquas isn’t quite the calibre we are looking to guage players at.
20 Sep 2012, 11:46 am
@David-36: haha, a conference trophy a step up from the cc?
only in CT buddy
20 Sep 2012, 11:47 am
@Transformation-31: I agree, remember what happened to Derick Hougaard!
20 Sep 2012, 11:47 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-37: hahahaha, transie got owned there.
20 Sep 2012, 11:49 am
Lambie will play 10 for the Sharks… HM can jump… He prefers sideshow bob anyway…
20 Sep 2012, 11:50 am
@sharks_lover-35: The sharks have destroyed alot players with their shuffling them around all the time, best example Brent Russel
20 Sep 2012, 11:53 am
@rangerman-38:
So if the S15 conference is inferior to the CC, that makes the Lions a superior side to the Sharks, doesn’t it?
20 Sep 2012, 11:53 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-37: The same Griquas that owned the Blue Bulls this past week
20 Sep 2012, 11:54 am
@2k3-42: didnt brent go to the stormers where he was shuffled more than a deck of cards in a casino?
what about gio? wing or fullback?
peter grant, center or 10?
lets not talk about schalk brits or the wp backrow shall we?
wake up and stop the braai talk please.
20 Sep 2012, 11:57 am
@David-43: lol david i knew you would pursue this mindless grasping reasoning.
pat pat (on your head) dont worry davey, you have silverware ok?
even if it isnt silverware for winning an actual competition
20 Sep 2012, 12:02 pm
Luke Watson to skipper Kings
2012-09-20 10:24
SARU names Blitzbokke squad Bok boost for Sharks Police v Rovers in club final Cape Town – Southern Kings coach Alan Solomons has confirmed that flank Luke Watson will be the first-choice captain when the team makes their Super Rugby debut in 2013.
Watson currently captains the EP Kings in the Currie Cup First Division.
According to the keo-co.za website, Watson missed the opening rounds of this year’s Currie Cup competition due to a shoulder operation and a quad strain, but he has shown tremendous form in his four appearances, scoring eight tries.
“Luke is a player that will score plenty of tries for your team,” said Solomon. “But it’s his general play that has been very impressive. He’s been in great form since coming back from injury.”
Solomons went as far as to say that Watson could add value to the Springboks, especially seeing as there’s currently no consensus regarding South Africa’s loose forward trio.
“Luke has proven he is a quality player and he can make an impact at a higher level, but it’s up to (Springbok coach) Heyneke Meyer to decide on who he wants to use in his team.”
20 Sep 2012, 12:04 pm
@rangerman-46:
If it wasn’t a competition, there wouldn’t be a trophy, would there? The fact that the Sharks didn’t win it doesn’t make it go away. Don’t worry Ranger, I understand the perpetual inferiority complex you guys in KZN battle with, even when you win something.
20 Sep 2012, 12:06 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-37: after years of brainwashing pote has to rescucitate to boy…let’s bet brummer will be back up to goosen next year S15!
20 Sep 2012, 12:07 pm
@rangerman-45: Black and White, nothing else matters *yawn*
20 Sep 2012, 12:08 pm
@Kaizan-8:
Yeah, that is the whole issue, isn’t it; there are other better candidates than Steyn who are ready and have proved themselves over and over.
I see a future backline with Goosen at 10, Lambie at 12 and F Steyn at 15. The other positions can be filled by a myriad of talented, strong and fast youngsters who are knocking on the door.
My frustration is therefore not aimed at Meyer for not selecting Goosen; it is for sticking with Steyn when guys like Lambie and Jantjies do not get a look in – that is criminal
20 Sep 2012, 12:11 pm
@2k3-44:
the bulls are superkak at the minute. I have no idea why. I would hypothesize that the lack of a defense coach at the moment is telling for them.
oh, and our locks are playing supershit.
and double oh….the CC is not over yet.
20 Sep 2012, 12:13 pm
@Transformation-49:
maybe, but that smit oke also looks pretty decent for the cheetahs. So he is fighting it at for backup flyhalf in the cheetahs superrugby squad.
again, not quite the calibre that will win you a superrugby medal. Like the 2 Morne has anyway.
20 Sep 2012, 12:19 pm
Please let this be the team:
15 Francois Steyn 14 Gio Aplon 13 Juan DeJongh 12 Jean de Villiers 11 Bryan Habana 10 Johan Goosen 9 Francois Hougaard 8 Duane Vermeulen 7 Marcell Coetzee 6 Francois Louw 5 Andries Bekker 4 Flip Van Der Merwe 3 Jannie Du Plessis 2 Tiaan Liebenberg 1 Tendai Mtawarira
16 Adriaan Strauss 17 Pat Cilliers 18 Juandre Kruger 19 Willem Alberts 20 Ruan Pienaar 21 Pat Lambie 22 Lwazi Mvovo
20 Sep 2012, 12:24 pm
@Rhys7-54:
Oh dear, even as a WP supporter I can’t agree with that backline.
20 Sep 2012, 12:24 pm
@Brigadier Van Zyl-53: riaan is a wing that dabbles with flyhalf…why was naka playing tewis de bruyn on saturday?
20 Sep 2012, 12:25 pm
Goosen and Jantjies, that’s the future…
Say, is Elton staying behind on the sinking Bismarck (GLRU)? Could really just pop over the Jukskei, and form a half decent partnership with Francois Hougaard.
20 Sep 2012, 12:25 pm
@Rhys7-54:
I tell you what – I will take on anyone with that team. You can play any kind of game with them as well. Defense will be well organised in the backs because of the centre combo.
Frans at the back can attack with his strength or can make opposition pay with his big boot.
Brilliant loosie combo. Locks won’t stand back for anyone.
20 Sep 2012, 12:28 pm
@Rhys7-54:
De Villiers @ 12? Nah…
Rather keep Fran Steyn there, De Jongh on 13 and either Aplon or Taute @ 15.
She’ll come together nicely.
20 Sep 2012, 12:28 pm
@David-55:
Any centre will battle with Grant standing still when receiving the ball. The only option left to the centres is to crash ball. The same happens when your flyhalf stands too deep ala Steyn. Neither scenarios commit the defense.
20 Sep 2012, 12:30 pm
Good news - Etsebeth should be available for the Aus clash @ Loftus.
Better news - Greyling is not available for the Aus clash @ Loftus.
20 Sep 2012, 12:31 pm
@David-48: so the conference cup is a competition?
haha, like i said, only to the desperate buddy
20 Sep 2012, 12:43 pm
@Transformation-11: I am certainly worries about that. It would be criminal to force Goosen into the same ultra-conservative mould that Steyn plays. I hope it doesn’t happen, but Heyneke has shown himself to be a limited coach in many aspects and I think turning Goosen into a Steyn-clone is a very real concern… You couldn’t be more right.
My point earlier was simply that Goosen needs to be eased into the Bok set up. Meyer has made a lot of mistakes, but at least he is not hitting the panic button and throwing the Goose in the deep end.
Steyn should have been dropped ages ago. Meyer should be held accountable for that, no doubt, but there should be a contingency plan with Goosen. He is too special to be thrown in the deep end.
@trupisero-10: “Old enough is good enough”… A lot of people parrot that same chant, but I would suggest that not all players are the same and a ‘one-size-fits-all’ approach is never a good way to manage players. Don’t forget, players are human beings, not commodities. Schalk Burger was brilliant when he hit the scene and so was Habana, but they play different positions. Flyhalf is a KEY position which demands much more technical precision and mental strength. For this reason, I would say we should ease young flyhalves into the Bok set up…. It’s just my opinion.
20 Sep 2012, 12:44 pm
@Kaizan-63: Haha meant to “Good enough is old enough”.
20 Sep 2012, 12:45 pm
Was Eben banned for 2 weeks or 2 matches?
Ie after this weekend will he have served his ban or must he sit out the Aus game as well?
20 Sep 2012, 12:57 pm
@rangerman-27: You sharkies want to have a bunch of players waisting their prime years on the bench! Nah, Estebeth is fine where he is, thank you.
20 Sep 2012, 13:01 pm
@rangerman-38: The lions won the CC and was last in the SR, so yes CC is nowhere near an achievement compared to toping the Super rugby log!
20 Sep 2012, 13:03 pm
@GI POT-58:
When was the last time you actually saw Frans attack effectively from the back?
20 Sep 2012, 13:04 pm
@John Galt-65:
2 weeks.
20 Sep 2012, 13:06 pm
@goodstuff-66: he would start for the sharks bud.
@goodstuff-67: its not a competition bud, sorry.
no matter how hard you wp fans want to punt it.
20 Sep 2012, 13:12 pm
@David-68:
A counter question: When was the last time you saw F Steyn distribute the ball with any intelligence, break the line at pace, create opportunities for his outside backs?
We are talking about potential here buddy. We are talking about what people are capable of when they are coached properly and the structures are put in place for them to fulfil their potential. That is what I want to see from a coach. All I see in Heyneke at the moment is that he is banking on certain players to take the lead on the field and do something extraordinary just to ease the pressure on him as coach. He has no proactive plan.
My suggestion that F Steyn plays at 15 is partly because I believe he has the potential to be a great 15, and partly because I want him out of the backline because his distribution, vision and creativity in that channel is about as good as Morne’s kicking. He has never had it. He at least showed some moons ago that he can be dangerous from the back on attack and defense.
20 Sep 2012, 13:13 pm
SAD DAY.My all time favourite commentator,Murray Mexted has retired.
20 Sep 2012, 13:18 pm
@rangerman-70: You said silverware, last I checked we have a two trophies in our cabinet, where is the Sharks silverware?
Also, what I ment by having players waste away on the sharks bench is your bloated teamsheet, and the sharks fans wanting every player to kom to durban and get screwed around. Deysel would start for any of the S15 teams, but is now on the bench more often than not. Riaan or Ludik would start for any number of S15 teams but either one is on the bench see Bosman etc. But that is not enough for you sharks fans.
Sorry, but Etsebeth was descovered by Oom Bekker and nutured at WP, so no, he’s no sell out ALberts.
20 Sep 2012, 13:18 pm
@GI POT-60: Preach the gospel my man.Some people just do not understand that a deep lying flyhalf affects
the entire back line..Have been say this ad nauseam.Glad that you have taken the baton.Good post.
20 Sep 2012, 13:22 pm
@Rhys7-54: Nevermind the backline, what the hell is Flip doing there? Ysterbeth is the future not 5 penalties a match Flip.
20 Sep 2012, 13:22 pm
15.Lambie
10. Gooseneck
5. Etzebeth
4. Flippie
Jantjies on the bench
Bekker on the bench
20 Sep 2012, 13:26 pm
@ryecatcher-72: Justin MArshal is the best comentator. He says it as he sees it. He is very unbiased, unlike most aussie & kiwi comentators.
Murray Mexted and Laurie Mains complained about food poisoning in 94 when Greegan tackled Jeff Wilson in the corner to win the Bledisloe cup. You tube it. … can only cry wolf once haha
20 Sep 2012, 13:26 pm
@ryecatcher-72:
Why would he retire?
Also like his commentary.
20 Sep 2012, 13:28 pm
@GI POT-60:
I agree. As an ex 10 myself I always wanted the ball as flat as possible on attack, to be able to hit it at almost full speed.
20 Sep 2012, 13:29 pm
@blik-77: yeah I didn’t like Marshall as a player but he is an outstanding commentator, a breath of fresh air from other sneering one-eyed nitwits.
20 Sep 2012, 13:29 pm
@GI POT-71:
Some of Fran Steyn’s “frailties” are……;
1. Morne Steyn
2. Lack of dominance at the tackle point post 2011.., think Bakkies, Matfield, Schalk, Guthro
3. Poor Backline coach / or backline coach confined to Heyneke’s gospel.
4. Impotent 13 in Jean De Villiers
All of these can be remedied.
20 Sep 2012, 13:33 pm
@ryecatcher-74:
Not the case w.r.t. Peter Grant and Dewaldt Duvenhage at the Stormers.
Grant, still playing flat could not create anything of substance – this is the exception to the rule though.
20 Sep 2012, 13:33 pm
@blik-77: I agree! I must admit I never liked him as a player and running into him at 80′s after games at KP never left me with a great view of him but he really does seem unbaised and fair. Listening to him he also seems like a top guy.
20 Sep 2012, 13:47 pm
Holy Kak, Morne has about 50% winning with Boks ne?
vokken Goosen klapping the Meyer Koolaid big time.
Listen Mense, did u know Meyer said Morne was GORGEOUS sometimes?
Did you know he vraaged “Heaven or ***?” into the Walkie Talkie?
Did you know he tryd order Nando’s in OZ test?
If you did not kno this, and much more terrible stuff – here is an entjie (small smoke)
for you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U38cRToxkSI&feature=vmdshb
20 Sep 2012, 13:48 pm
SsEeXx – hoooooo waaaa
20 Sep 2012, 14:01 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-81: That post is dumb on so many levels.
20 Sep 2012, 14:05 pm
Would also pick Etzebeth at 4 but I thought he was injured & I had not been impressed with Flip until last week when he had a good match
20 Sep 2012, 14:06 pm
@PielNeus-84: hahahaha, thats very funny even if it is ****** offensive
20 Sep 2012, 14:08 pm
@stormer in a teacup-86:
The floor is yours young man?
20 Sep 2012, 14:09 pm
@Rhys7-87:
4. Flip
5. Etzebeth
Bench: Bekker
That’s a very physical combination which allows you to have a faster lighter looseforward like Heinrich Brossouw and still have the physical dominance HM is looking for.
20 Sep 2012, 14:23 pm
@Mr Black-78: So did I.Cannot stand
that other twit (Not JM) with the perpetual sneer in his voice.
20 Sep 2012, 14:29 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-89: Frailties are inherent All of those factors are other people. Of all the outside backs Fran’s is probably best suited to the gameplan HM is employing. We were fine at the tackle point against the ABs last week….what we need is a change in mindset and we will see talents of all our players being utilized better. I agree about Morne though. I still feel Fran’s offers us his best value at fullback.
20 Sep 2012, 14:30 pm
@blik-77: The most unbiased commentator ever. He’s the best.
20 Sep 2012, 14:32 pm
@GI POT-71:
“When was the last time you saw F Steyn distribute the ball with any intelligence, break the line at pace, create opportunities for his outside backs?”
Good question.
His supporters will just blame Morne, on his inside and JdV, on his outside for him not doing any of the above.
Btw, he is not the answer at 15 either. Apart from the odd booming clearance, he offers nothing special…definitely not as an attacking FB.
Play him of the bench ekse.
20 Sep 2012, 14:45 pm
@nama1-94: francois steyn is more hype than action these days! all this poppycock about a deep-lying flyhalf is just excuses…
the guy is taking the wrong options lately. i was at newlands and he BASHED & BASHED & BASHED the entire game…last week he wanted to steamroll over aaron cruden instead of taking the big gap next to the puny pivot and voila, he got tackled and turned over…dom dom dom!
20 Sep 2012, 14:55 pm
@Big Hit-80: The sneering nitwit is Grant
Nisbett.Some classic Mexted one liners.
LIKE A BLIND M AN IN A BROTHEL.JUST GROPING.
“ANDY eLLIS”THE 21 YEAR OLD WHO TURNED 22 LAST WEEK.
I HAVEN,T HAD A KNEE OPERATION ON ANY OTHER PART OF MY BODY.
HEY ED,CAN YOU GET THAT ****** A D WITH THE FUCCIN SH.T RAVE
MUSIC TO SHUT UP.i CANT HEAR THE RUGBY.
hE,S LOOKING BFOR SOME MEANINGFUL PENETRATION IN THE BACKLINE.
SPENCERS RUNNING ACCRO SS THE FIELD CALLIN OUT”COME INSIDE ME,
COME INSIDE ME”
THE ALL BLACK SECOND ROWERS ARE HUGE MEN BOTH OVER 1 METRE TALL.HANG ON THAT WOULD MAKE THEM MIDGETS.
TAKEN FROM MURRAY MEXTED. FRIDAY FUNNIES
20 Sep 2012, 15:05 pm
@ryecatcher-96: MEXTED QUOTES
http://WWW.RUGBYDUMP.COM
20 Sep 2012, 15:08 pm
I would play Frans at Full back. In the current setup he doesnt add any value at 12. Al least at Full back he can join in on the kicking frenzie or perhaps score 1 or 2 lucky drop kick from half way.
20 Sep 2012, 15:13 pm
@Transformation-95: Still Transie it’s not fair to judge any 12 playing outside MS, I would rather judge FS after a few games playing outside Goosen.
20 Sep 2012, 15:20 pm
@stormer in a teacup-92:
Understand, although last week was probably the first game of the RC 2012 (and even the English series) where we had notable stability at the tackle point; clearing effectively, turning over possession, and providing Ruan with clean phase ball. Hell, Pienaar looked like the 2007 player we admired.
Fran offers more at 12 IMHO, like his strong performances hints to during RWC’s 2007 & 2011 – similar to Aaron Mauger next to Carter, he also offers another kicking option.
Like M Steyn, De Villiers also has to go. Offers nothing on attack (chronic from his Stormers performances for a while now), and is slipping tackles at an alarming rate.
With a dominant pack, I’d change the backline as follows;
10. Goosen / Jantjies
13. * De Jongh at the moment.
15. Aplon / Taute
*** we can look to bring through any of the emerging talents, like Serfontein, Venter, Jordaan, in the midfield.
20 Sep 2012, 15:23 pm
Only the Bull supporters wants Morne Steyn in the Bok 15. Only reason being they don’t want Heineke to release Morne back to the bulls team.
20 Sep 2012, 15:30 pm
@Transformation-95:
F Steyn is playing to the game plan as well.
HM clearly wants him to line up the opposite 10 and try bulldoze him and get quick second phase ball. Which isnt happening.
Justing Marshall mentioned this exact thing when looking at the replay.
He wasnt playing like this for the Sharks.
Different game plan under HM.
20 Sep 2012, 15:31 pm
FS has done very little for a very long time. He was decent in the 2007 WC, but since then he’s been a hype machine. I’ve never been impressed with him in anything he has done.
Players like Goosen, Jantjies etc are all far more talented. Frans Steyn is indicative of what is wrong in SA rugby. We’ll always pick size over substance.
20 Sep 2012, 15:50 pm
@John Galt-102: this is not just against opposite 10s it doesn’t mate what phase it is…check the 1st argie game in cape town to see what i mean…
20 Sep 2012, 16:01 pm
@Skeppie-99: “Still Transie it’s not fair to judge any 12 playing outside MS, I would rather judge FS after a few games playing outside Goosen.”
surely you can see this is excuse-making of the highest order
francois steyn played 12 outside of MSteyn the bulk of the Welsh game, against Samoa and Fiji and most here were gushing about how fantastic his distribution is and how the bok backline flourished with him on for “DONKEY” de villiers blah blah blah.
nothing was said about how JdV can’t be expected to fire with MSteyn sitting in the pocket, that was never offered as part of the reason why JdV was perceived to be kak.
20 Sep 2012, 17:03 pm
Anyone playing next to Morne will look average, think of how Morne makes average Meise Kind” below-average at the Bulls. Kinda like how Sonny Bill Williams makes people around looks good.
Goosen will unleash F.Steyn
20 Sep 2012, 17:15 pm
@Sir Watson-106: At last.
20 Sep 2012, 17:26 pm
@Transformation-105: No… You embarrassing yourself now…
Who was the scrummy in those games… with a pass that more often than not found Frans Steyn as first receiver?
Farken irritating when “experts” who have never thrown a ball in anger reckon they can pinpoint discrepancies when they can’t even see the whole picture…
20 Sep 2012, 17:33 pm
@rangerman-3: Despite the fact that he used steroids in matric.
20 Sep 2012, 17:49 pm
@GI POT-71: I can answer that… 1, Sharks vs Bulls, 2nd Super Rugby game… no I lie, the game a week later… No, I lie again silly me… The 1st test against England…
Seems I may have a better memory than most here…
20 Sep 2012, 18:31 pm
@Heavens Game-108: jeepuz sweepinh statements about who the scrumhalf was…ffs that scrumhalf was terrible at the world cup clearly playing with a hurt shoulder! francois played outside morne & we can go review the world cup games & dispel the “steyn at 1st receiver” claims…pfffft!
20 Sep 2012, 23:03 pm
Penn in ‘I am Sam’, hoffman in ‘Rainman’, even stiller(simple jack) in ‘Tropic Thunder’- take your pick, any of them would have looked good coming on for steyn.
Golden Goose my g*t! What has this boy achieved that gives everyone plus their oom piet, on this site and elsewhere, a visible throb in their pants? The kind that just shouldn’t go to waste! CC? Nope. Voda cup? Hell no! About 2 decent(didn’t f*** up much) performances in S15 and he’s die nuwe groot wit (whatever ‘hope’ is in afrikaans).
The answer is, has and always will be Elton Jantjies at flyhalf. But wrong union, unfortunate skin pigment and being a fraction smaller than his counterparts means he’s “not what we’re looking for to execute our game plan”. There should be a “shoddy” in that sentence somewhere.
The day Goosen kicks 2/6, back to morne we go. I joke but this is disheartening. We’re talking about young careers here that ALL deserve a chance. They each bring something different to the game, simply for HM to vicariously live out his dream of being Igusends goalkeeper coach for Bafana.
21 Sep 2012, 00:20 am
@fishdish-112: Jantjes will come to the Sharks and he will get another chance with the Boks.
21 Sep 2012, 02:59 am
Frans Steyn could be more than the hype he is given if allowed to play his way, ie play whats in front of him and have the freedom to choose. But typically like all coaches, they are control freeks in SA. Perhaps Francios will be able to deversify when Meyer settles into his position. Unfortunately with idiots like Dippy PDV putting his nose where it dont belong this backward stoneage mentality may keep Meyer unsettled for longer.One wonders if its a deliberate strategy by these backward stoneage people.
21 Sep 2012, 10:38 am
I am worried that the treatment Pat Lambie is receiving could result in him following the path of Brent Russel. He is way better than Kirchner and led The Sharks to a Currie Cup win 2 years ago and Meyer thinks he is no good??!!
21 Sep 2012, 10:42 am
@fever-115: lambie must improve his tactical kicking!
21 Sep 2012, 11:30 am
Not so sure his tactical kicking is so bad – but give him as many matches as Morne has had and let’s see if he is any better!!!
21 Sep 2012, 22:32 pm
I see Rassie says that the kick and chase has worked well for us over the last couple of years with wings like Sivivatu. Rassie, rather shutthefuckup! That worked well for half a season 4 years ago. The only reason the kick and chase can benefit us is because we select backs with limited creativity and skill, their go to option is always gonna be kicking. Aimless kicking should never become your game plan. Bok management seem to be living in a totally different era to the rest of the planet.
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