More grey matter at gainline
24 Sep 2012
Eddie Jones says Springbok players have the intellectual and technical skills to generate a quick turnaround of their sterile attacking play but stressed their tactics, particularly at the gainline, have to improve.
There has been widespread dismay at the Springboks’ perceived attacking conservatism. The bulk of the criticism has been aimed at predictable forward punches at the gainline and a heavy focus on tactical kicking.
There certainly hasn’t been a lack of time spent in the opposition’s 22m, but their play in that zone has largely been uninspiring and lacking a clear plan or consistently good option taking.
There is virtually no chance of the Springboks winning the Rugby Championship title, but there have to be significant improvements across the board, with their attack a focal point.
Jones speaks with authority on this subject given his success in his role as an attack consultant with the World Cup winning Springboks of 2007.
The team were the top try scorers at the tournament in France, winning many admirers with the fluent and potent style. There wasn’t a dramatic departure from their traditional strengths, but Jones refined and added subtle dimensions to their attacking play. The two combined to be a potent cocktail which the former Australia head coach believes this generation of Springboks can rediscover if they make some changes.
‘The basic problem at the moment is a lack of [a discernible] attacking philosophy in terms of how they want to play,’ Jones, now Japan head coach, told keo.co.za. ‘Their play at the moment is early 2000 Bulls forward attack – one-off runners that rely on brute strength to win the gainline.’
Meyer’s early Bulls teams (to whom Jones refers) were predictable and struggled as a result, losing heavily in their formative years. They gradually improved their attacking repertoire and became one of Super Rugby’s most prolific try-scorers, particularly in their three championship-winning campaigns.
Time, however, is not a commodity Meyer has in abundance. His team have lost two and drawn two of their seven Tests, testing the faith of even Meyer’s most ardent supporters. Jones, however, is optimistic. The improvements he was the catalyst for happened off the back of only a couple of weeks with the team. He said there has to be a purposeful shift towards adding greater variation though.
‘South African players are skilful and good learners, so a quick turnaround is there. [But] they need to get a cohesive attacking philosophy based on approaching and hitting the gainline with options. [If they do] the team’s attack will improve considerably.’
By Ryan Vrede
164 Comments
24 Sep 2012, 06:32 am
How to train your dragon.
24 Sep 2012, 07:33 am
‘[But] they need to get a cohesive attacking philosophy based on approaching and hitting the gainline with options. [If they do] the team’s attack will improve considerably.’
I dont think Loubscher has the credentials and experience to achieve this….
His appointment is becoming more and more ridiculous! The boks deserve the best. SARU is mostly to blame… HM couldnt really sign anybody else. But surely they should have handed Loubscher a ‘caretaker’/short term contract, until the right and best possible backs coach becomes available…
24 Sep 2012, 07:57 am
didnt eddy get a 96 pointvbutt drilled into him by heyneke
24 Sep 2012, 08:16 am
“Eddie Jones says Springboks players have the intellectual and technical skills to generate a quick turnaround of their sterile attacking play”
Don’t think he is talking about Morne and Kirchner.
24 Sep 2012, 08:27 am
@Jeez-2: Ja nuh? Single out the coloured guy. Loubscher might be the backline coach but van Graan doubles as the forward and attack coach. Which makes the highlighted qoute squarely van Graan’s baby. i don’t think van Graan has the credentials or experience to achieve this. Nor does Loubscher but that’s besides the point that it’s not his job to come up with the attacking philosophy. Back to the article tho, most of our problem actualy stems from continuing to let 9 make the decisions ala the FdP days. Pick a guy like Goosen, let him make the decisions which leave Ruan or Hougie to provide variation. Alberts and the rest of our ball carriers can still line-up the crash ball but that would/should be Goosen’s decision mainly. And all of a sudden the defense is asked a lot more questions from all sorts of angles, meaning the times Alberts and co do get the ball they will find getting over the adv line that much easier. And a Bokteam getting over the adv line with regularity is a different beast altogether. My take anyway…
24 Sep 2012, 08:28 am
“He said there has to be a purposeful shift towards adding greater variation though. ”
Here is the statement where Eddie hits the nail on the head. Once in awhile the forward runner should look to pass, just that slight variation will open up the holes.
24 Sep 2012, 08:56 am
@UptheGuts-5:
What does the colour of his skin got to do with anything? He just hasnt got the credentials you would expect a bok backline coach should have. He can be from Mars for all I care, its just an obvious assessment that the boks dont have a guy with decades of experience and proven success….even though it should be a no brainer when appointing a backs coach.
Van Graan covers the lineouts and forwards coaching and Van Graan was never the sole backline coach at the bulls. So the responsibility lies on Loubscher’s shoulders…
Perhaps a more creative and attacking flyhalf could have painted a different picture regarding their coaching… but even MS cant take all the blame… their skills dont seem too sharp and JDV isnt a threatening outside center…
Jones mentioned that things can be rectified pretty quickly, but you would expect that a bok backline coach with a fresh contract should not need a wakeup call or help to sort out the backs after a few games…
24 Sep 2012, 09:00 am
@UptheGuts-5:
I do agree its not up to him to lay down the attacking philosophy…
24 Sep 2012, 09:10 am
Ricardo Loubscher is utterly uselss, Morne Steyn is rubbish and so is Zane Kircher, I have no faith in Meyer, going to be another 4 years of mediocrity.
24 Sep 2012, 09:23 am
After watching the Boks underachieve for MANY years ….apart from those two good but somehat lucky RWC wins………I am of the opinion that SA players CANNOT change.
Such is the deep seated conservatism of South African rugby culture, dominated by Afrikaner philosophy, that new ideas and innovative ways of play are ultimately viewed with suspicion and abandoned.
SA has the greatest playing resources of any county and a fanatical support of rugby and a sound commercial base for the sport, but coaches and rugby thinking in general are hopelessly old fashioned.
For example:
-Players are taught to run at the man, not into space
- There is an absolute obsession for big players so much so that players like George Smith and Phil Waugh would never have played at a top level in SA, they would have been considered too small
- Individualism is shunned
- old as the hills stereotypes like “a good big man is better than a good small man’ are commonly used
- many coaches still distrust the openside flanking system used with such good effect in almost every other major rugby playing nation.
It must be incredibly frustrating to be an SA fan with nous, seeing the huge potential of the Boks being so poorly managed year after year.
24 Sep 2012, 09:26 am
@Jeez-2: That was always going to be the problem from the start. As soon as Meyer selected that all Bulls coaching staff including Van Graan, Koen, the fitness coach, McFarland the writing was on the wall. What a waste of our great player depth, especially with our RC rivals looking so out of sorts, apart from Argentina.
24 Sep 2012, 09:29 am
Well, as David Campese
24 Sep 2012, 09:39 am
It always fascinates me to see people critisize Ricardo Loubsher. He did not pick himself, Meyer did. If Heyneke asked me today to coach the backline you bet your *** I’ll pack my bags. If he is not qualified, that lies on Meyer. Meyer wanted people who will not challenge his philosophy. David Campese highlighted that a guy like Paul Treu is teaching kids to run into gaps at sevens level, yet he wasn’t considered.
24 Sep 2012, 09:40 am
@Delki-10: Great post. Coaching is our achilles heal, especially at the Boks. We could achieve so much with the right mix of professional, worldly and visionary rugby coaches. As it stands we just seem to be permanently bottle-necked . One ordinary coach follows another and our game stutters along carried exclusively by the talented players we produce.
24 Sep 2012, 09:48 am
@RugbyStudent-13:
Keep in mind that HM did not have the luxury to pick as he wanted (apart from all the other BB coaches)… His appointment was dragged out for far too long, by then no decent coach was available… SARU should take some of the blame…
Treu was considered but he decided to stay 7s coach due to the next Olympics…
Thats why I would question the appointment, it could have been short term. And HM is quoted as selecting only the best…What a load of ****.
24 Sep 2012, 09:50 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-3:
Dont know.
But its the same Eddie that saved JW a$$ in 2007.
24 Sep 2012, 09:54 am
It angers me whenever we have a 2 or three man overlap only for a player like JDV to crowd them out and to see another Bok attack to be wasted. Or using FS (the only starting Bok with a rugga brain) as a crash ball to set up first phase. It brings my piss to a boil. I agree a change of coaching personnel is need but a change of player personnel is also in order for us to be effective attacking team.
24 Sep 2012, 10:06 am
16….that,s right, heyneke drilled eddy a new butt at the reds who then canned eddy so jake could hire him.
This heyneke meyer really is genius,innit.
24 Sep 2012, 10:13 am
Be fantastic if Eddie was bought into the coaching mix – but don’t think he will gell with Meyer: the things is … if Morne had kicked like Morne the tactics would have been vindicated: the strategy relies on the kicker to put them over.
On that point still can’t understand why someone so accurate as Frans Steyn doesn’t do ALL the kicking.
24 Sep 2012, 10:13 am
Can’t wait for Saturday.
If Goosen starts…… (fark, please) we will finally get a glimpse of the future of Bok rugby.
It may sound a bit over dramatic but IMO Saturday’s game is probably the most import game for the Boks in the professional era.
Most might say the 1995 and 2007 finals were import games but these games were once off “against the run of play” games.
If we want to dominate rugby for the next decade it starts at Loftus on Saturday.
24 Sep 2012, 10:14 am
We all know what the problem is, yet there seems an unwilligness to change .. there is nothing to lose for the Boks now. May as well instruct them NO KICKING against Oz … if they lose then we can glean some experience.
Play Goosen and Taute now, there is no time to waste ..
24 Sep 2012, 10:21 am
@Doughnut-21: Well if Rassie says that HM will be tweaking the gameplan, especially if the Goose starts things just might look a bit more balanced…
24 Sep 2012, 10:23 am
Goosen will be playing under instruction no doubt. I don’t think the gameplan will change, I think Goosen may just execute better than Morne.
24 Sep 2012, 10:27 am
On form right now, I think the best scrumhalves are playing Currie Cup:
Louis Schroeder (WP)
Nic Groom (WP)
Cobus Reinach (Sharks)
The reason they are shining is becuase they haven’t been overcoached.
24 Sep 2012, 10:36 am
@RugbyStudent-23: Imo it will change dramatically in some ways… Goosen wont be as deep in the pocket and will have more options every time he receives the ball… He’ll probably kick most of the time in his own half…
24 Sep 2012, 10:37 am
23…what utter rubbish.
Goosen said the other day when interviewed himself that the coach encourages players to have a gowhen it is on.
24 Sep 2012, 10:38 am
Again, what shite, best scrumhalf on display this past weekend was vermaak.
24 Sep 2012, 10:39 am
@Jeez-22: I suspect HM knows that Goosen will use his instincts rightly or wrongly as the game goes on ..which scares him. There is a shift required and as we all guess its our coaches not our players who are holding back ..
Morne and to and extent Kirch are beyond help with heads up rugby, JdV has also lost his accumen .. boy do we miss JFourie these days !!
24 Sep 2012, 10:41 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-26:
If you think that high strung radio spitter sitting in the box will allow Goosen to start running from outside his 22, you’re mistaken. Heyneke has never admitted the gameplan’s wrong. All he said was the execution was off.
24 Sep 2012, 10:41 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-26: Have we seen any player barring Habs have a go yet ? even FH has been quiet ..
I suspect Goosen is looking after his coach as I dont beleive for one minute they play any unscripted moves .. as evidence by mindless kicks when the patterns are not set.
24 Sep 2012, 10:41 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-26: In which case Meyer simply isn’t selecting the players who can execute properly.
24 Sep 2012, 10:41 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-27:
Of course…
24 Sep 2012, 10:57 am
30, you are talking about a coach who historically has selected ettienne botha, an unknown brian habana,etc…
He rates players with x factor who can do the uncoachable, that is well documented.
29. And who the hell would wantnyour flyhalf to start running from their own 22.
Lions do is all the time and that is why they are not playing superrugby next year.
24 Sep 2012, 11:01 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-33: You can run from your 22 when it is on. What you want is a flyhalf who can sum up the situation correctly and not automatically put boot to ball even when there is an overlap.
24 Sep 2012, 11:02 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-33: Habana was known at the time he was snapped up by the Bulls. He signed after White plucked him from the Lions for the Boks.
24 Sep 2012, 11:02 am
@Doughnut-28:
Agreed, HM is letting himself down. He’s got everything going for him. The talent and ability is there…although he believes we are behind in the skills department- rubbish.
Selections and gameplan determines success… HM is getting it wrong so far… And he’s not a fast learner and thats worrying. He’s proving that we have a real problem with coaching… If you cant pick some of the best players on the planet (and you can still balance youth with experience) and coach them to play to win… Its a shame and disgrace to waste such talent.
The sad thing is its not just the SA supporters who complains about the utter waste of an opportunity to dominate… Super rugby shows all the world that we have unbelievably talented players than can adapt to an attacking/balanced gameplan… The boks are becoming a laughing stock all over again because the boks arent really playing to their full potencial…
One example to highlight the stupidity in SA coaching mindset:
For the first time EVER, SA has not only one but 3 talented young flyhalves, yet we select a has been out of form 10 ahead of them. That just doesnt make rugby sense… HM says he will support Steyn and help him to get back to his best… Why not guide the next 2/3 best youngsters to become the new elite at 10? Especially if they are more rounded players and will get him better results?
Blame the selections and gameplan, blame the coach.
24 Sep 2012, 11:03 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-33:
By implication, you said what Goosen said was if the opportunity is on even from outside his 22, he would run it. You just confirmed that he won’t. Conservative style.
Ettiene Botha and Bryan Habana were already scoring tries an creating havoc for Falcons and Lions respectively. The Bulls have the biggest budget of all the franchises and if they cannot get the best out of players, they are underperforming as is this case with their bottom of the table scrap in the Currie Cup.
24 Sep 2012, 11:06 am
@Jeez-36:
That’s what I don’t get. You don’t help a player buy giving him more pressure when he is off form. You take him aside and give him a rest, help to refine his shortcomings and see how he reacts. Heyeneke is doing Morne no favours. No player picks himself and Morne will try his best every game but if his game is off, someone needs to take him aside.
24 Sep 2012, 11:15 am
33, So why are the lions watching the telly next superrugby.
I see elton largely to blame for this as one of the chiefs decision makers on the field.
But at least it is entertaining,right.
24 Sep 2012, 11:18 am
Who needs 14 other men on a field if one has Elton, by the Brigs’ reasoning.
24 Sep 2012, 11:18 am
@J.B. Cowper-19: yeah Jones would want his side to use the ball, Meyer wants his to kick it
24 Sep 2012, 11:19 am
@Brigadier Van Zyl-39: So when the Bulls ran from their 22 sometimes in 2010 they were doing the wrong thing?
24 Sep 2012, 11:20 am
@Big Hit-41: Meyer needs to do what White did after White’s 49-0 thrashing and effect a clean-out. The result was a return thrashing of the Aussies.
24 Sep 2012, 11:31 am
@Delki-10:
Afrikaner mentality? So how does that gel with the very entertaining running rugby we see with Griquas and Cheetahs? Or the huge number of tries that the Bulls scored when they were doing well in the Super 14?
Would I be racist if I said that corruption in SA is due to the Black mentality? What does that make you?
Go f* yourself, bro. Hypocrits should be shot.
24 Sep 2012, 11:40 am
44. Youcannot apply any grown up logic to this blog, just do the ***-for-tat thing like the rest of us.
As for my opinion on this specific issue..as an english speaking whitey…..i see the kulerts and blecks being dumber on average than the afrikaaner boers who are only dumb sometimes.
Like willy the leeu for example.
24 Sep 2012, 12:04 pm
Any news on the Lions new tournament they are trying organise? It will be a pity if this group of players, who are playing brilliant rugby, gets scattered due to their super rugby relegation…
24 Sep 2012, 12:17 pm
Twice the Terror,
Double the D’s.
And here was me thinking they meant D Cups.
What on earth possessed me.
24 Sep 2012, 13:01 pm
Delki – The biggest problem in SA is that no former Provincial coach has ever been succesfull as a Bok coach, Du Plessis, Strauli and now Meyer, who may change that trend!!!
They eventually all go back to what they know when trouble hits, which is to get the Boks to play like the coaches respective provinces.
Christie, Mallet and White were not provincial coaches and were our best ocaches.
I belive think White was our best coach as i never saw the Boks play so well before or after. White showed SA what professionalism is all about and brought in outside help, eye to eye co-rd and then his masterstroke with Eddie Jones. We can all see White’s worth with the Brumbies turn around with virtually all unknown players, amazing coach!!
The jury is still out on Meyer, but his next 2 games will be the most important of his coaching career!!
24 Sep 2012, 13:08 pm
@race of tan-48: Christie coached Transvaal, and his Bok team was laden with Transvaal players.
24 Sep 2012, 13:11 pm
@race of tan-48: Neilie Smith (OFS), Cecil Moss (WP), Nick Mallet (Border) and Kitch Christie (Transvaal), just for starters.
24 Sep 2012, 13:14 pm
@mikeybrass-50: Nick was at Boland
24 Sep 2012, 13:19 pm
Eddie says this,
Eddie says that.
Well Eddie is good with WORDS.
For sure.
But as a Coach ………………………..at the Higher level.
He was craap.
He took Queensland to LAST.
Then jumped ship.
He inherited a champion Brumbies Team,
and took them nowhere.
The Wallabies were average under him at best.
As for Eddie helping SA win the Rugby WC.
A myth.
SA beat some dots on the planet so small ………………………..they cannot be seen from the moon.
They also beat Argentina…………………………………………..big deal. Arg had never beaten SA ever,
And merry old England of course.
At the time the 6th best team in the World. And the worst English Team in the history of English Rugby. EVER……………………………that’s a fact.
But you all love Eddie.
You are beguiled by his silver tongue.
And Eddie loves you Okes too.
Because you are the only ones that listen anymore.
24 Sep 2012, 13:34 pm
@52 cane
amysing… hehe
24 Sep 2012, 13:35 pm
amusing
24 Sep 2012, 13:42 pm
@willievz-51: Oops, meant Boland.
24 Sep 2012, 13:44 pm
@cane-52: The Brumbies won the Super under his coaching. As for the WC, get over it:-) You guys weren’t good enough then to make it through and we were the best.
24 Sep 2012, 13:51 pm
@cane-52:
he made it to a rwc final in 2003.
where were you guys then?
making up stories for your loss or busy perfecting the cheaters code?
24 Sep 2012, 13:55 pm
Naka Drotske on Heinrich
One mistake the Boks have made, according to Drotske, is not to pick Heinrich Brussow, and Drotske believes there is a fallacy that Drotske is a one-dimensional fetcher.
“I would always pick Heinrich. There is this fallacy that Heinrich can’t be a ball carrier and he can’t defend, and that he’s only a ball-stealer. But I think that isn’t true, Heinrich is an unbelievable ball carrier and nobody ever gets momentum on him on defence.
“In fact, he is the guy who gives us the most offensive hits week on week — because he drives players back in the tackle. I think the fallacy is there because he is smaller, and because of that people think he can’t be a ball carrier and can’t defend — but I beg to differ on that one. If you’re talking about a player who can only be a fetcher, and who suffers on defence, then I agree, but that isn’t the case with Heinrich — he can do all three well.”
24 Sep 2012, 14:00 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-57:
We had an off day.
This happens sometimes.
Us…… and Your lot, having an “off day” does not make Eddie some kind of Guru.
24 Sep 2012, 14:03 pm
@mikeybrass-56:
Correct,we were not good enough, too many injuries and playing the wrong players.
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-57:
2003,you were still suckling on titties, while your first two words were “refs fault”
No one cares what you have to say.
24 Sep 2012, 14:04 pm
@willievz-58:
drotske wishes he was a one dimensional fetcher.
he was a mediocre hooker, and thats being kind.
a fetcher he was not.
24 Sep 2012, 14:14 pm
@cane-59:
off day making a rwc final?
i’d say your lot have had rather an awful lot of those.
for us it was a case of being straeulied.
24 Sep 2012, 14:16 pm
Judas Jones’s had a 57% winning ratio with the Wallabies.
His predecessor Rod McQueen had a 79%.
John Connolly followed Eddie managed 64%.
Guru or big mouthed chump.
I’m staying with…………………………….chumpion.
24 Sep 2012, 14:17 pm
@cane-59:
agreed on ‘fast’ eddie though.
he built himself a reputation and nobody knows why.
@Hurricane-60:
i got something for you to suck right here…
and a top o the morning to you too, hurri old scum
24 Sep 2012, 14:19 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-61: Yes that was a typo from the website I copied it.
The focus should be on Heinrich.
24 Sep 2012, 14:20 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-62:
We have a 66% winning ratio of winning WC finals.
The exception was 1995.
When our team was poisoned.
While guests in your Country.
And it still took extra time for your lot to put us away.
24 Sep 2012, 14:21 pm
@cane-63: Given their resources and lack of proper rugby culture, and that they consistently play against the ABs and Boks, I’d say 60% for an Aussie coach is a good percentage.
For the Boks it should be around 75%.
For the All Blacks, it should be around 85%.
24 Sep 2012, 14:24 pm
steve erwin was one irresponsible farknut, pic of him feeding a croc while holding his infant son in the other hand.
the boy looks like a good lad though.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4553453/Steve-Irwins-son-Robert-follows-in-fathers-crocodile-feeding-footsteps.html
24 Sep 2012, 14:24 pm
@cane-66: Nope. You have a 50% winning record in WC finals.
1995
2011
24 Sep 2012, 14:24 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-64:
Eddie is great with the media.
Best there has been from a rugby perspective.
24 Sep 2012, 14:28 pm
@willievz-67:
They are a canny lot Willy. (that means they are smarter than your average rugby nation ………………….by far).
24 Sep 2012, 14:28 pm
@cane-71: No question about that!
24 Sep 2012, 14:34 pm
@willievz-65:
i know
@cane-66:
always fiddling things you kiwis.
nz in 7 apperances have only won two
sa in 5 appearances have won two.
dont make me convert the percentages.
24 Sep 2012, 14:36 pm
interesting thread, seems to be many SA fans who think the WC is the be all and end all..
wonderful, me, I prefer my team to go 14 tests without a loss, to be totally outplayed yet still win, to have ten year no loss records against places like England, to have never lost to Scotland or Ireland, ti be 4 from 4 in the RC, to have 10 3Ns titles compared to our closest competitors 3, to probably be the team that wins the INAUGURAL rugby championship, like the inaugural world cup..
thats what I want my team to be able to do, not manage a measly 47% record in 7 tests..
24 Sep 2012, 14:39 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-73:
Yes.
But WE are the current Champions of the World.
And have been the number One (1) ranked IRB Nation for so many years I cannot recall how many.
Your lot on the other hand finished 8th= in 2011.
24 Sep 2012, 14:39 pm
if only they could do it cleanly
shame
24 Sep 2012, 14:41 pm
@cane-75:
funny the reaction from around the world was muted.
24 Sep 2012, 14:41 pm
@poppa69-74:
That’s all good stuff Poppavitch…………………………………………….
but hey,
throw in a RWC.
And things a sweeter even still.
24 Sep 2012, 14:47 pm
If the ABs beat Argentina this weekend, then Soccer City may host the first time in the world that one player reaches the 100 test match wins
and it would be his 112th test..
thats an amazing stat, and explains why there is so much hatred for the man from our dumbed down cousins at the bottom or @rse end of Africa (seems fitting by the way)
24 Sep 2012, 14:49 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-77:
Mute all they like Bakkies.
It is etched in gold.
forever.
2011………….NZ.
2007………….The Republic of Eye Gougers.
2003………….Old Blighty.
1999………… The Cousins.
1995………….The Conspirators.
1991………….The Cousins.
1987………….NZ.
24 Sep 2012, 14:50 pm
a 100 wins in a 100 filthy ways….
blegh
no thank you
24 Sep 2012, 14:50 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-73: Actually, they have won 1 in 5 WC appearances.
There were mini-competitions in 1987 and 1991, where the world toyed with the idea of having many nations compete in a single tournament.
24 Sep 2012, 14:51 pm
@cane-80:
and rugby is the poorer, caner
which is sad really
24 Sep 2012, 14:52 pm
@poppa69-79: 100 test wins, in 112 tests.
That is an amazing statistic.
24 Sep 2012, 14:53 pm
@STBUR-44: Well done
24 Sep 2012, 14:53 pm
@willievz-82: hehehe if we invited you you guys would have probably tried to beat, kill and oppress the brown brothers in our and many other teams, it was your way at the time..
not our fault your knuckles were still dragging along the dirt road..
24 Sep 2012, 14:54 pm
@poppa69-86: forgot the smilie
24 Sep 2012, 14:54 pm
@willievz-82:
i mean seriously, the only remotely credible competition they had in 87 was maybe oz and france.
24 Sep 2012, 14:59 pm
@willievz-84:
nothing amazing about it, willy.
nothing amazing at all.
the level of filth they’ve gotten away with from about 2001/2 makes it pretty much a certainty.
24 Sep 2012, 15:00 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-88:
Oz and France are still the only competition we remotely have.
24 Sep 2012, 15:05 pm
@cane-90:
funny we’ve beaten you more times in the last 20 years than the two of em plus the rest of the world put together.
remotely credible indeed….
24 Sep 2012, 15:05 pm
47-33 is the only scoreline that counts, and thats been increasing too
24 Sep 2012, 15:06 pm
@willievz-84: and who said crime doesn’t pay?
Seriously, a great player. Had the pleasure of chatting to him a couple of times in the Shongololo Lounge at ORT and is a well pleasant bloke.
I he was a saffa he’d be the best on the planet (without cheating of course
)
24 Sep 2012, 15:14 pm
always fiddling things, typical….
its 35 – 47 isnt it or 34, since pe?
24 Sep 2012, 15:17 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-91:
In the last 20 years.
NZ’s winning record against:
Australia………….. 69.4%
France…………….. 65.4%
Eye Gougers……. 67.4%
The crucial factor, being the importance of the games France has won against us.
24 Sep 2012, 15:17 pm
@trupisero-93:
no, i would never have supported a filthy macaw led bok team.
i have nothing but the highest praise for john smit, an exemplary leader through and through.
24 Sep 2012, 15:18 pm
@cane-95:
And the Impotance NZ places on the Bledisloe Cup.
24 Sep 2012, 15:19 pm
@cane-97:
And the fact that France and Australia have never deliberately poisoned our team.
24 Sep 2012, 15:20 pm
@cane-66: Like they were “poisoned” after loosing the Bledisloe cup in 1994 too. Me thinks you can only cry wolf once.
24 Sep 2012, 15:23 pm
@cane-95:
we’ve beaten you 17 times since 89
how many times have oz and france together beaten you since then?
you play a mean fiddle…
24 Sep 2012, 15:25 pm
@blik-99:
No blik…………………………………………………I have only ever pointed the finger once.
1995.
What ……………………… did you Okes get different TV coverage from the rest of the world?
Was that part of the conspiracy.
24 Sep 2012, 15:30 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-100:
SA have beaten NZ 14 Times since 89.
For a winning percentage of 29%.
You are digging yourself into a deep dark hole here Bakkies.
24 Sep 2012, 15:32 pm
@cane-102:
17 times cane.
24 Sep 2012, 15:34 pm
since the advent of legalised cheating and fixed outcomes
naturally you have the wood over us.
24 Sep 2012, 15:40 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-103:
NZ vs SA…………………….1989 to 2012
Played 47
Wins 32
Losses 14
Draws 1
New Zealand’s Trophy Cabinet (at end of 2013)
24 Sep 2012, 15:42 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-104:
Since the advent of Neutral Referees,
naturally the playing field has been leveled.
24 Sep 2012, 15:47 pm
@cane-105:
yes, you’re right.
i was counting since 86 when you lost 3 from 4 against us.
so to correct 17 from 86 and not 89.
24 Sep 2012, 15:47 pm
@cane-106:
you wouldn’t know the first thing about neutral refs or level fields.
24 Sep 2012, 15:49 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-107: now whose cheating?
86 wasnt a sanctioned test series, apart from IN SA..
thats so laughable… like saying you would have won 87 because of those 86 results..
dumb delusional; knuckle dragging neanderthals like yourself should really just fck off from our game..
you ruin it for everyone..
24 Sep 2012, 15:50 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-108:
“ja listen boys you can go home after the series but I have to live here” Houston you’re looking foolish again.
24 Sep 2012, 16:00 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-108:
Level is my middle name.
24 Sep 2012, 16:09 pm
@cane-105: 14 tests in 23 years? considering how often we play each other that is embarrassing from a SA perspective..
24 Sep 2012, 16:09 pm
@cane-101: Quit your self importance. I am talking about Laurie Mains
24 Sep 2012, 16:18 pm
@poppa69-109:
your game..?.. haha that is larfable
say what you like they were here with your peoples consent, from top to bottom
you know it
@NZINCHINA-110:
honestly china, is there nothing to do in hainan province?
china’s such a wonderful sounding place, you should get out.
i for one would love to travel its countryside.
24 Sep 2012, 16:19 pm
@cane-111:
and whats your first and last..?..
‘fark’ and ‘fields’..?..
24 Sep 2012, 16:22 pm
@poppa69-109:
we would have beaten you shittless in 87.
god forbid we did’nt make it.
imagine that, the world would never be the same.
1 wc in 7 attempts…
24 Sep 2012, 16:23 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-114:
until you display some honesty and admit that the majority of tests played in SA were stacked with cheating refs like Gerty it will continue – goodnight
24 Sep 2012, 16:25 pm
cripes pops, is this you? you lot getup to strange things:
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10835890
24 Sep 2012, 16:32 pm
@NZINCHINA-117:
goodnight china,
and get out for a bit.
24 Sep 2012, 16:51 pm
Bakkied.
obviously showing you have no intelligence. I live in Susney idiot.
I think I’ll look for a rape bews story and insinuate that it was you and your homies
you’re really pathetic. the fact you go scouring NZ news sites continuously shows just how damaged your psyche ideally is
nothing like a sore loser, knuckle dragging dumb **** with a serious chip on his shoulde
are you the SA that got caught having *** with the bodies in the morgue? or do you go around giving people burning tyre necklaces?
24 Sep 2012, 16:54 pm
farking predictive text
24 Sep 2012, 16:56 pm
Jimmy Cowan got “Bakkied”
24 Sep 2012, 17:02 pm
@poppa69-120:
alweer dronk..?..
tiepies…
24 Sep 2012, 17:05 pm
predictive drinking more like it
24 Sep 2012, 17:06 pm
@poppa69-120:
did i touch you on your studio?
24 Sep 2012, 17:08 pm
I’m not a deluded ignorant fool like you Bakkies. you’re one useless fcked up mamparra.
have you raped anyone today?
24 Sep 2012, 17:09 pm
Eddie…………………………………..remember Eddie.
This is a thread about Eddie.
Lets not forget that.
Eddie was a loser.
Eddie is a loser.
Eddie now coaches Japan.
Eddie will remain a loser.
Saffas love Eddie.
Eddie loves Saffas.
See the pattern.
24 Sep 2012, 17:14 pm
Jonesy, have you forgotten you are an Aussie, mate?
Grey matter? Grey? On this Day of Heritage, do you not realise it is a colour that is fifty shades of grey too dark for the rugby ‘boertjie’? Poor fools only believe in the white stuff which they in their deluded fashion think is the “Right Stuff”.
Little are they aware that their preference, white matter, is really just fatty matter which is there to absorb all the shock their ‘stampkar’ rugby demands of them..
24 Sep 2012, 17:19 pm
@poppa69-126:
no, have you beaten the shitt out of your maori b i t c h ..?..
24 Sep 2012, 17:20 pm
you sound grumpy
is she not making the man some farking eggs..?..
24 Sep 2012, 17:22 pm
@poppa69-109: I believe we would have won 87 because of those 86 results.
24 Sep 2012, 17:25 pm
@cane-127:
god knows cane, if i could put all these kiwi lovers on a boat and pay their way over there tomorrow i would do it in a heartbeat. so many bitterbekkies and gatkruipertjies on thise site.
ja, eddie hey… i could say the same for john.
only without the losers.
24 Sep 2012, 17:26 pm
@cane-105: ’89? Seriously? ’89 was pre post-isolation bud.
24 Sep 2012, 17:29 pm
@poppa69-112: Less than 23 years considering we never played you in ’89 or 1990. While the results are embarrassing, remember recently under PdV it was virtually 50/50 and Meyer will correct his mistakes eventually. What is embarrassing too is you guys getting your dates hopelessly wrong
24 Sep 2012, 17:30 pm
@poppa69-126:
“have you raped anyone today?”
Good god. This is a new low, even for a scumbag like you.
24 Sep 2012, 17:31 pm
@mikeybrass-134:
considering the extent of their cheating on and off the pitch its a miracle we’ve won anything at all.
24 Sep 2012, 17:33 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-136: We’re our own worst enemies. By trying to bash over them all the time in a predictive fashion, we give them countless opportunities to cheat. We need to be smarter in our play.
24 Sep 2012, 17:36 pm
@mikeybrass-137:
the refereeing also needs to be fixed.
thank god those two dooses are out.
its small compensation i suppose now that they’re done ‘fixing’.
24 Sep 2012, 17:39 pm
@mikeybrass-137:
meyer’s approach is clearly to first establish a set level of playing execution and once perfected to build on this with little smart touches.
24 Sep 2012, 17:39 pm
We have to win at Soccercity otherwise they’ll break the winning streak record.
They’ll take it to 16 and probably win everything on their EOYT.
So that win is vital.
24 Sep 2012, 17:44 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-139:
Yes, you first have to get through the “wax on, wax off” phase before you get to the fancy part.
Problem is can he win during this teething phase.
24 Sep 2012, 17:46 pm
@Jeraldjay-141:
i will certainly be putting my money on my mouth at the bookies in this regard.
considering how hard and close the away squad pushed them i would say the home squad will win both tests, pretty or ugly but win it they will.
24 Sep 2012, 17:56 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-142:
I hope so. Bok teams shouldn’t lose on the highveld.
Next year I reckon we should do well in the Championship. Hopefully most of the senior players will be back: Schalk, Juan Smith, JPP, and FDP…..
An 80% win ratio in is non-negotiable.
24 Sep 2012, 18:01 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-139: The plan does array without winning and causes confusion when the same players demonstrate better degrees of skills back at their franchises. Meyer has made a mistake, particularly with his selections. Hope he corrects them.
24 Sep 2012, 18:04 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-138: Fixing the refereeing is a lost cause from the inside. We need to force our wins on other sides.
@Jeraldjay-141: They must beat the ABs, if only to stop Poppa from being even more insufferable than what he is now.
I doubt Juan Smith will be back at international level and even if he does, whether it will be for long. Schalk will return as will JPP. As for FdP, doubt it.
24 Sep 2012, 18:16 pm
@Jeraldjay-143:
agreed.
somehow i’ve got a feeling that meyer’s gonna build up momentum with the boks and go on a winning run similar to mallets.
@mikeybrass-144:
lets agree its a bit of both then, a few poor selections but also players not executing under pressure.
@mikeybrass-145:
agreed, but if we’re not going to fix refereeing from the inside like the kiwis did and instead are going to do it from the outside, then there’s only two ways to do that.
there’s the high road which requires moering the dirty inclinations out of opposition ala the bulls and there’s the low road which involves playing a filthy cynical game like the kiiwis.
i will only support the former and will never support the latter.
24 Sep 2012, 18:17 pm
@mikeybrass-144:
HM is only interested in ensuring that his forwards and halfbacks perfect his tactics with the centres providing 2nd phase ball if it manages to get to them.
24 Sep 2012, 18:32 pm
@Jeraldjay-143: I’d only agree with you if our teams had not done so well in S15 this year
Meyer has shown himself to be really thick in the way the team has reversed this year and I don’t buy into the school of thought that we’d play better if those players were not injured.
We dominated the aussies in S15 this year and shoulda shut them out 2 love this year, but for stupid selections!
24 Sep 2012, 18:58 pm
@David-147: HM needs to balance his need to be a coach and the fact that he’s now a manager!
PdV drifted too much into managing and inspiring his players to perform, HM is trying too hard to “coach” the warrior Morne Steyn back to from
Fark tht man
24 Sep 2012, 18:59 pm
@poppa69-126: Word of advice sunshine, and you’ve heard it before.
Carry on with this type of filth and you’ll find it starts becoming a little bit more personal, and you know exactly what i mean.
24 Sep 2012, 19:09 pm
Pops have a meltdown again?
24 Sep 2012, 19:11 pm
Bakkies have a meltdown again?
24 Sep 2012, 19:12 pm
@papaown-149:
I made the same point a while ago. Players at this level shouldn’t need coaching. HMs job is to coach tactics and moves, not bring players up to Bok standard.
24 Sep 2012, 19:15 pm
no, nothing of the sort.
only returned serve to that scummy polynesian vermin.
24 Sep 2012, 19:18 pm
@papaown-148:
Over the years our teams performances in the Super Rugby season had no bearing on the Boks performance in the Tr-Nations.
2010 is a perfect example. The Bulls played the Stormers in the final yet we had a miserable Tri-Nations that year.
24 Sep 2012, 19:23 pm
@Jeraldjay-155:
no, disagree.
2007 we contested the s15 and went on to win the rwc. same for 2009 with bulls and the 3n. 2010 was all about ‘getting the japies’ and no amount of anyting done on the field of play was gonna change anything in this regard.
it was a farce to attempt competing at all.
24 Sep 2012, 20:40 pm
127 NZinChina
hilarious bud. Where are you in that screwed up racist land?
There was not a single beautiful town I came across except the one the Germans have taken care of. Somewhere near the so called “deepest gorge” in the world, but it is not. Really stunning, but only the “old town” section.
Would you do me a favour bud and teach those Ching Chongs that wildlife is important. Since they have landed in Africa by the thousands some of the wildlife is under threat after years of restoring. Rhinos horns are flying out of here. Mozambiques sharks(shark fin soup) have plumeted drastically, Sea Horses are in dire need of protection etc.
114: I spent 6 months travelling about China extensively, I prefer India by a long long shot. Tibet was my favorite place, but I cant say what the Chinese have done to it in the last 10yrs. They had ruined Lhasa(capital of tibet) when i was there already with their crappy ugly buildings. They had built the “chinese town” adjacent to the famous Potala place, ruining Lhasa forever. Everything you see today, even the movie 7 yrs in Tibet have edited Lhasa drastically to what it really is today. Bejing was ****, nice to see the forbidden palace, summer palace and the nearby great wall. The wall you can drive a car on it is so thick and is filled with many things including dead people. I had my longest bus journey in China, 92hrs, non stop, stopped twice a day, once to pick up food, thee other for a piddle! 5 mins each stop. this journey happened when I was kicked out of Tibet because I refused to join a tour group which is obligatory. At the time It would have cost me 5 times cheaper to travel on my own. The Chinese then did not understand what travelling ment, or what some of you kids do similar today, call backpacking. The Chinese dont respect wildlife and in the 6 months I saw nothing, anywhere! They had eaten it all. Grasshopers are even caged in 10x10cm cages!!! In Nepal I went to a game reserve and met a group of Chinese tourists there. I went to check out the wildlife, they went to photograph the local people, had zero interest in the wildlife! Like the Tibetians, the Chinese go there to photograph them, and I mean sticking their cameras in their faces. They just have no respect. The tibetians arent even of Chinese descent, they are Mongolian. The food however is another story. No where in the world does Chinese food taste like it does in China. One factor could be that a poision is used in every dish called MSG which is forbidden in many countries. ummmmmmmm! The poision is noticable to taste and a chinese person wont be happy if they cant taste it, lol. I still cook with SMG myself when making some dishes.
One of my great moments was walking in some paddy fields in the middle of nowhere, totally off the beaten track and came across a mother and child beating their rice they just had harvested. With a large beard and the rest of me, they looked at me once and ran off screaming, and i mean — sprinting. They had offically seen their first White Man… I spead after them and discovered their little village. Was an enjoyable day….
24 Sep 2012, 21:16 pm
@Greenies-157:
thanks, sound amazing.
i really would love to go there sometime and see it extensively.
regarding the poaching, i am close to stripping my moer and taking these farking chinks out locally. seriously, i will farken take them.
24 Sep 2012, 22:05 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-118:
Where you surfing for eel up mans bottom again?
24 Sep 2012, 22:28 pm
@willievz-131:
Willie please.
Believe what you like, but there a few things that make your belief funny.
1) the RWC was played in NZ. Even now you guys struggle with leaving home.
2) Only 7-8 of the Cavaliers team you played in 1986 were part of the squad in 1987.
See these are 2 big differences.
Its like SA sending over a B team to NZ, we beat you guys and then say, yep we are going to the Boks in SA next year now, silly dont you think?
24 Sep 2012, 22:54 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-156:
2010 was about what?
Get the Japies?
What are you talking about
25 Sep 2012, 01:28 am
@Greenies-157:
the condescending white guy who knows better huh get over yourself mate
25 Sep 2012, 03:08 am
go for it trupisero
your. countryman continues to mouth off daily about kiwi filthy scum, so I will continue to highlight that with the present stats available, there must be a fair few bloggers who have contributed to the despicable society SA IS!!
they’re the filthy scum, in fact subhuman seems appropriate.
where’s this famous SA hospitality we here o? all we see is Bakkies continual racist hatred, so expect it back, you dumb knuckle dragging Neanderthals.
26 Sep 2012, 13:48 pm
Oh dear, poppadoos going off on a racist hate filled anti saffa tangent because a few bloggers get under his skin? you will never change you faarking drop kick. Pi ss off back to the sewer!
And hurricane, there were only 6-7 caviliers picked in 87 cause they needed a rebuild after getting smashed in 86, ask Gary knight if he still has nightmares about gert smals left! Put the poncy f uk on his arse.
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