Relegation threat forces Coetzee’s hand
10 Oct 2012
The possibility of WP dropping out of the Currie Cup Premier Division has contributed to the decision to push fatigued Springboks to play this Saturday.
Allister Coetzee was the Bok assistant coach between 2004 and 2007 before he linked up with the Stormers and Western Province in 2008. He is well aware of the manner in which rugby is administrated in South Africa, having been involved with the Boks and a provincial union, and knows how the contracting system is such that the provinces dictate how much rugby the Boks play over the course of a season.
On Wednesday, Coetzee explained his decision to include all seven returning Springboks in the starting line-up for the final Currie Cup league match against the Cheetahs.
Flanked by a visibly exhausted Jean de Villiers, Coetzee admitted that it was a not an ideal situation if one looked at it from a Bok perspective, but as a coach of a province that pays the players’ salaries, his hands were tied.
‘It’s the way the contracts work in this country, the players belong to the province,’ said Coetzee. ‘Unless there is a change to the structure, that is the way it’s going to be.’
WP are currently in third place on the Currie Cup log, but if they lose this weekend and the other two results go against them, they could finish in last position.
This would see them playing a promotion-relegation series against the Eastern Province Kings to determine who will feature in the 2013 Currie Cup.
It is therefore in WP’s interest to play all of their available Boks, no matter their state of fatigue. If there wasn’t such a risk of dropping down to the First Division, Coetzee may have given a few of the top players a much needed break.
‘If you look at what we are all facing, the reality of being relegated, well you have to have your Boks at your disposal,’ he said.
‘That’s what unions are going through right now, nobody wants to get relegated. If we were different position on the log, then maybe I wouldn’t have played all the Boks. Now we have to play our best team.’
It was thought at the beginning of the season that the Boks would be excused from the Currie Cup given their extensive workload in the Super Rugby competition and heavy Test schedule. But De Villiers suggested last week that the Boks would return for domestic duty at the conclusion of the Rugby Championship, and when he said it, you got the feeling that he wasn’t happy about it.
Coetzee confirmed on Wednesday that the thought process of using the Boks in the Currie Cup had changed recently because of the prospect of relegation.
Indeed, it is not only WP who have loaded their team with Boks. The Bulls have stacked their team with returning Boks and it’s likely that the Sharks will do the same when they name their side later in the week.
De Villiers is currently nursing a hamstring injury and will only train at WP’s captain’s run on Friday. It is a situation that highlights the faults of the South African system, and WP can’t be blamed for working within the given parameters.
If the South African system was similar to that of New Zealand, a country that centrally-contracts their players so that they are managed accordingly, they wouldn’t be in a position where a fatigue-related injury is a probability rather than a possibility.
De Villiers said that he wasn’t happy with the situation and, more damningly, suggested it wasn’t likely to change. It’s the rugby player’s lot in South Africa to simply get on with it.
‘It’s not really relevant what the players feel, it’s a decision that the administrators need to make,’ he said. ‘When you are needed, you need to step up. As long as the decision lies with the unions, it doesn’t matter what we as players feel.
‘We might gain more from something like central-contracting,’ admitted De Villiers. ‘Maybe we need to sit down and come up with a model that works for everyone.’
By Jon Cardinelli
251 Comments
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10 Oct 2012, 14:15 pm
Kak man.
If if they came last (and that’s a big if), they would murder the winner of the 1st division.
Not matter who it is.
Unless they scared of the Kings???
10 Oct 2012, 14:15 pm
Dragons!!!!!!
10 Oct 2012, 14:25 pm
Saru needs to emulate, the nzru’s central contracting policy, or the boks will continue to be owned by the All Blacks.
10 Oct 2012, 14:28 pm
Good article form SS saying exactly what Jean suggests
Time we put Bok rugby first
by Brenden Nel
It was never more apparent than during Saturday’s Castle Rugby Championship test victory by the All Blacks over the Springboks that they are simply a class above the rest of the world at the moment.
And while we can look to place blame at someone’s doorstep – whether it be the coach, players, Saru, the weather or even the stadium – which now boasts a 0-2 record against the New Zealanders – there are certain things that cannot be argued.
For not only are the All Blacks a better side at the moment, but there is little argument that their central contracting system has done wonders for the way they condition their players, and their depth is a strength that few nations across the world can match at the moment.
Of course it was disheartening to see the Boks fail to stop the World Champs in the second half, but we can carry on demonising players and coaches, living from victory to victory, or we can actually do something about matching the best team in the world on a consistent basis.
Saturday was a reality check. It was the cold light of day and sobering dusk at a magnificent stadium to remind us that we aren’t all we think we are. Our rugby is not as strong as we believe it to be.
Those who argue this point should remember we have twice – in Jake White’s era and Peter de Villiers’ – sent a B-team on a Tri-Nations journey and have twice been handed massive hidings. While both those trips were masked by the bigger picture of a World Cup later in the year, they were also constant reminders that our depth in player ranks is not as good as we believe it to be.
South African rugby has survived over the years because every now and then we get things right. We manage to stumble onto success every few years because we simply cannot shoot ourselves in the foot that often.
We have a massive pool of talent, but we rip into players at the first sign of weakness, not to mention the fact that virtually every single provincial coach in this country has not done enough to develop the vast untapped resources of up-and-coming black talent in the country.
Instead, we think along provincial lines and complain about those South Africans who wear All Black jerseys and abuse our Springbok players who they see as the enemy, but feel nothing when our own fellow Bok supporters do the same to the players they claim represents them on the field.
Every test defeat is treated as the end of the world, and virtually every single Springbok coach is on his way to being fired the day he is appointed to the job.
Compare this to New Zealand who have just seen Graham Henry hand over the coaching reigns to an assistant who has been with the team for more than 100 tests, after an eight-year reign himself.
Compare this to the legacy of success which runs through the veins of New Zealand rugby, where the central contracting system allows for coaches and players to be supported by their peers.
There is a sense in New Zealand that everything flows upward, that every decision or movement, every game-plan, is used to benefit the All Blacks. Everything is done for a singular goal.
Of course there are failings in every system, and of course there are some examples of where they get it wrong, but when last did you hear a provincial coach complain about an All Black coach the way John Plumtree did this weekend about the Boks?
Never mind the way Jake White savaged Peter de Villiers during his reign, or the way White was subjected to a panel of ex-Bok coaches when he was trying to see the Bok squad through a difficult time.
And before you accuse this column of wanting to stifle dissent, let me state clearly that criticism is indeed part of the game, and – where warranted – always has a place. All I’m trying to say is that you never seem to see it in New Zealand rugby.
There will always be those who will disagree with me, and will believe the fault lies with a coach/player/administrator, and will blindly believe we are better than the All Blacks at the moment and it was our own failings that cost us victory.
We can carry on like that for years to come and no matter who the coach is, they will face the same barrage of abuse and criticism. They will find it difficult to move in a system that doesn’t put the Springboks first. And inevitably, they will fail.
But this is also not advocating self-defeat. Because there is a load of light at the end of the tunnel, if we choose to use it wisely.
We need to admit that on Saturday we were not good enough. We weren’t on the same level as the All Blacks. But then we need to do something about it. The South African rugby community needs to do something about it.
Provincial administrators need to help Saru find a way of implementing a central contracting system that will benefit all provinces AND the Springboks, and help keep our best players fresh.
Provincial coaches need to help and support the Bok coach, whoever he may be, and not offer public help while behind the scenes working against his every move.
Players need to be backed to succeed, given the right amount of game-time and not played into the ground. They also need to be developed according to a national plan, with the whole system moving in the same direction.
Lastly, fans need to be patient. To learn that not every defeat or victory is the be all and end all of rugby life. To learn that there is a process in every team, a cycle that they build on and if they get it right, the Boks will be able to consistently challenge for the number one spot in the world.
And national administrators need to fight harder for competitions that won’t kill off our chances because players are injured, played into the ground or mentally exhausted, just so we can add more dollars to the bottom line.
South African rugby needs to find a common vision. One that can be backed and one which has a succession plan.
We have an enormous amount of young talent coming through – especially if you look at the SA under-20 squad that took the IRB Junior World Cup and the six under-21 players in the current Bok squad.
The chance is there to draw a line in the sand and work together across the board to make the Boks the most feared team on the planet.
Or we can simply carry on waiting for every team, every player, and every coach to fail.
10 Oct 2012, 14:34 pm
@mpundulu-3:
Won’t happen. The Unions bring in the money. In NZL it works because the AB’s rake in the cash (the brand itself).
I actually wouldn’t want it any other way. I like the fact that a Bulls/Stormers/Sharks match can bring in 50 000 people.
10 Oct 2012, 14:39 pm
Said it before.
SARU couldnt organise a pissup in a brewery.
Look no further than the Kings debacle for proof of this.
And now we expect them to be in charge of player distribution and maintanance?!
Can you imagine the carnage.
No thank you.
10 Oct 2012, 14:39 pm
@londonshark-5: I would prefer to regularly beat the AB’s than have sold out CC games
10 Oct 2012, 14:46 pm
Surely a simple solution to the issue of central contracts is that as soon as a player is selected for a Bok squad, his contract and payment of his salary are transferred to SARU. That way the national coach and his provincial coach can reach an agreement on how often they play and when they are rested, being on the bench shouldn’t count as being rested.
10 Oct 2012, 14:47 pm
@John Galt-6: Well, they could probably organise the piss up…..but would wake up the next morning with helluva hangovers, hands tied behind their backs wondering justhowthefuck John o Neill and Steve Tew managed to not only steal all the beverages, women and wallets at the piss up, but also how they managed to transort it all back to Oz and Kiwi…..
@Atreides-7: I would happily see WP go another 11 years without winning a CC, if it was for the benefit of the Boks.
10 Oct 2012, 14:52 pm
@John Galt-6: Teeheehee!
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-9: @Atreides-7: Ditto!
10 Oct 2012, 14:53 pm
Also in regards to the article, the fact that the Bulls and WP are just about forced to rush their Boks back to save their arses demonstrates that they appear to be falling in behind in terms of player development. If the Lions and the Sharks can maintain their standard of play in the CC, granted the Lions only had a few players off on Bok duty then why cant the Bulls and WP do the same?
10 Oct 2012, 15:02 pm
@londonshark-5: Correct. Over 1 000 000 people watched the Super Rugby clash between the Bulls and Stormers this year.
Only a paltry 250 000 watched the biggest NZ derby of this year, the Blues vs the Saders.
10 Oct 2012, 15:05 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-9: Can just imagine Tew & O’Neil at said bunfight standing around their own little “barbie” waiting for their boerewors to cook. Conversation would go something like this: Tew: “Come John, let’s get these Japies again & this time we don’t even have to use email.” O’Neil: “Ooooh, you good thing you, Steve!”
10 Oct 2012, 15:08 pm
@John Galt-6: hehehe you’re thinking like Tacitus
Tac said, once you centralise the palyer distribution, how will you prevent the “AA appointments” from running SARU and thus hijacking the player resource?
s.hit like sadie earning twice the salary of akhona ndungane won’t happen though…
10 Oct 2012, 15:08 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-13:
10 Oct 2012, 15:09 pm
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-9:
10 Oct 2012, 15:16 pm
“Flanked by a visibly exhausted Jean de Villiers…”
Really, JC? Was he nodding off? Did he have bags under his eyes? Did he have trouble getting to his feet?
I know you’re trying to make a point here, but the melodrama doesn’t really aid your cause. He’s been chilling for five days solid. I think he’s okay for a press conference. The type of exhaustion he’s suffering from does not manifest in slumped shoulders and a far-away look.
10 Oct 2012, 15:21 pm
@Transformation-14:
The salary issue is a seperate debate Transie. Salary discrepancies are going to happen regardless. As with any role in society.
I doubt very much whether a municipal manager with no education but with friends in high places should be paid triple(maybe more) that of a nurse but s.hit like that happens.
Im talking about actual organisation and control of this ‘centralised distribution’. Tacs concern is very real if that is indeed what he said.
I just dont think SARU has the necessary skills to do it. Nor are they backed up by an entirely organised and ethical sports ministry.
10 Oct 2012, 15:23 pm
Super rugby is the big culprit… They should limit the tournament to 5 months, nothing more! The players just play too much rugby and if youre a bok even more so. Up to now the boks are over played anyway, even if they didnt play Currie Cup it wouldnt make a difference.
The Kiwis central contracts keeps their top players from playing too much rugby during the super rugby season… SARU wouldnt go that far…imo. They should step up for the players, stop being so damn greedy and go back to a single round robin super rugby tournament in 2013 when the new broadcasting contracts are renewed!
Like that will happen!
10 Oct 2012, 15:28 pm
@John Galt-18: oh yeah…like paul jordaan can sommer demand twice what botes, deyzel & odwa are getting?
10 Oct 2012, 15:38 pm
@Transformation-20:
The Sharks will pay him what he wants if they want to keep him, knowing that our centre stocks are actually quite thin.
Is this fair? Who knows. Time will tell.
Jordaan now has to make sure he performs. He has to ensure he holds his side of the deal. If he doesnt, its only a 2 or 3 year contract and then he’s outa here with no one banging down his door for his signature.
Added to this, Botes and Odwa are in the twilight of their careers with plenty youngsters coming through in those positions.
10 Oct 2012, 15:39 pm
Sharks only playing Lambie
10 Oct 2012, 15:42 pm
That a bit of a kick in the nuts for the other players, he is like telling them he has no confidence in their ability
10 Oct 2012, 15:43 pm
10 October 2012 (14:53) – Aside from Pat Lambie’s inclusion in The Sharks starting line-up to face Griquas at Mr Price KINGS PARK on Friday evening, a host of Boks have been included to play off the bench.
Coach John Plumtree has had no hesitation in throwing five of his returning Springboks into the match 22, but the players who have taken The Sharks to top of the log get rewarded for their efforts this time in a team that shows minimal changes to the side that beat Free State last weekend.
A rotational change at scrumhalf sees Cobus Reinach and Charl McLeod swapping roles with Lambie named at flyhalf in place of Meyer Bosman who will play off the bench in the only two changes to the backline.
Amongst the forwards, the only change is enforced with Pieter Dixon out with a broken arm and Kyle Cooper starting where he ended off last week with Craig Burden providing back-up off the bench. Tighthead prop Jannie du Plessis adds further depth for the front row while Marcell Coetzee and Lwazi Mvovo are two more returning Boks to be included.
With The Sharks in the healthy position they find themselves, the potential is exciting. They do, however, face a tough encounter against a fired-up Griquas’ side and the addition of experienced players to boost the Durban side will no doubt be valuable.
“JP was massive for us last week in Bloemfontein and having some of that experience back at this crucial time is fantastic,” coach John Plumtree admits.
“We’ve looked at every individual’s different situation, obviously we have some who have played more than others. We’ve had long conversations with our Boks and we’ve got to make sure we do what’s best for the team, so we have chosen our side accordingly.”
The Sharks
15. Louis Ludik
14. Odwa Ndungane
13. Paul Jordaan
12. Tim Whitehead
11. JP Pietersen
10. Pat Lambie
9. Cobus Reinach
8. Keegan Daniel (Capt)
7. Jean Deysel
6. Jacques Botes
5. Anton Bresler
4. Jandre Marais
3. Wiehahn Herbst
2. Kyle Cooper
1. Dale Chadwick
Replacements
16. Craig Burden
17. Jannie du Plessis
18. Peet Marais
19. Marcell Coetzee
20. Charl McLeod
21. Meyer Bosman
22. Lwazi Mvovo
10 Oct 2012, 15:44 pm
@Mr Black-22: @Treehugger-23: The Sharks are playing Lambie and 21 other players
10 Oct 2012, 15:46 pm
It would be a dream come true if WP relegated
10 Oct 2012, 15:46 pm
Sharks resting most Boks, Only Lambie starts and 3 present Boks off the bench. Gives the youngsters confidence
10 Oct 2012, 15:47 pm
@Sharksgirl-25:
M
10 Oct 2012, 15:49 pm
@sharks_lover-27: Just saw that. Really pleased we have our flyhalf back for the CC. Pleased for Pat that he will get to start at 10. Great to see Reinach back at scrummie as well. Feel for Burden, was it really necessary for him to be with the Boks? He has now also had no game time for a long time.
10 Oct 2012, 15:49 pm
@Sharksgirl-25:
Good one!
10 Oct 2012, 15:50 pm
@sharks_lover-24: Excellent team. Now hope the rain stays away. Rain almost everyday here this week.
10 Oct 2012, 15:51 pm
@sharks_lover-24:
Good side.
Healthy looking bench too.
10 Oct 2012, 15:51 pm
ja, asif confidence will do chadwick a f.uck load of good
10 Oct 2012, 15:52 pm
The Sharks are so fecking awesome!!!
Topping the CC Log with so many players doing Bok Duty.
While other teams face relegation battles
10 Oct 2012, 15:52 pm
@sharks_lover-24: So Beast and Alberts get a much needed rest. Thought Jannie might have got a rest too. All have been playing non-stop rugby since Super Rugby.
10 Oct 2012, 15:53 pm
@Mr Black-34: LOL ..
10 Oct 2012, 15:54 pm
@Atreides-4: jakeys boks outplayed the blackies in 2007 but a burst of three tries in the last ten minutes made the scoreline flattering but not realistic. they also were down after 40 minutes against canada and then boom reality check in tha world cup. so, meh, i dont buy this shiiit we dont have depth we do but we are rebuilding and new zealand never needs to do that. meyer has four years of developing to catch up on for fukkk sakes!!!!
10 Oct 2012, 15:54 pm
@Transformation-33:
Your team looking the bussiness this year aswell.
10 Oct 2012, 15:55 pm
So Lambie will be taking the kicks then. Hope he has not caught the Boks woeful kicking bug?.. lol
10 Oct 2012, 15:55 pm
@Mr Black-34: Oh hell with the, words the likes of Transie and hiw WP cronies will now come out of the woodwork to tell us we sayinf we gonna win the super 15 etc etc etc, how dare you say something positive about the Sharks
10 Oct 2012, 15:56 pm
@Puma-31: I know its depressing me!!! Enough already! KZN has had almost 3 times its annual rain fall these last few months. Coming from a colleague who has nothing better to do with his time than keep a record of rain fall
10 Oct 2012, 15:56 pm
@Mr Black-38: Like i said
lol
10 Oct 2012, 15:58 pm
@Puma-39: I am sure his kicking will be fine boet, the Bok coaching staff never saw him as a player but a bench supliment
so they didnt try stuffing up his kicking too
10 Oct 2012, 15:58 pm
@Sharksgirl-41: Yeah we have had a lot of rain recently and still are having plenty.
10 Oct 2012, 15:58 pm
@Mr Black-38: Pumas are a well coached team, jimmy stonehouse not to be taken lightly…
10 Oct 2012, 15:59 pm
@sharks_lover-40:
Who cares what they say, they all secretly love the Sharks.
Ok Cheers, of to the Gym
10 Oct 2012, 16:00 pm
@sharks_lover-43: Hope not. Read Plum saying Lambie done a lot of training with the Boks and a hell of a lot of kicking training? That don’t sound good… LOL. Most of the kickers for Boks were awful. So hope our flyhalf don’t come back with the same problem all the other kickers had while at the Boks.
10 Oct 2012, 16:01 pm
@Mr Black-46:
this is true , cheers tc mate
10 Oct 2012, 16:02 pm
@Mr Black-46: LOL ..
10 Oct 2012, 16:07 pm
Lambie’s kicking wasn’t flash even before he went to the Boks, last year too
2011 SR
1. Peter Grant 84.7%
2. Aaron Cruden 80%
3. Sias Ebersohn 79.3%
4. Morne Steyn 79%
5. Matt Giteau 78.9%
6. Pat Lambie 76.7%
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