Lambie gets his break
7 Nov 2012
RYAN VREDE, in Dublin, reports Pat Lambie will start at flyhalf against Ireland, while Morne Steyn is still in the mix.
Lambie emerged as a strong competitor for the flyhalf berth with an impressive Super Rugby campaign and commanding performances in the Currie Cup. Initially seen primarily as a fullback, Lambie now has a chance to advance his cause to play in his preferred position at pivot.
With Heyneke Meyer committed to settling on a deputy for Johan Goosen for the 2013 season onward, Lambie will know he has been handed the inside lane in that race.
Steyn comes onto the bench in what can only be ascribed to Meyer’s fears around Lambie’s tactical aptitude. Steyn was dropped from the match 22 for the home leg of the Rugby Championship, with Meyer saying he didn’t have the attributes to warrant his retention as an impact player.
However, Meyer has made consistent references to Steyn’s tactical prowess, and was forthright in his reasons for picking Steyn ahead of Elton Jantjies.
‘I don’t believe in a pecking order so I won’t say Elton was second behind Johan Goosen [from the Soweto Test]. I believe in horses for courses,’ Meyer said.
‘I just felt I didn’t want to be in a position like we were in Soweto when Goosen went off injured in the first 10 minutes and then have to replace him with a youngster who is inexperienced. Morne has 40-odd Tests and has played on the year-end tour before, so he is an insurance policy. Elton will get his chance at the right time. As far as Pat goes, I want to see what he can do. He has really impressed me recently and his goal-kicking has been superb in difficult conditions, he is in the zone, which is what ultimately got him the start.’
Elsewhere Jean de Villiers and Francois Louw have overcome injuries to start, but this is not the case for Gurthro Steenkamp, who picked up a knock playing for Toulouse at the weekend.
Hooker Schalk Brits is involved in the match 22 for the first time in four years, edging out Chiliboy Ralepelle. ‘Chili has been injured a lot this year. Scrummaging is so important here and Schalk Brits has been in superb form. Chili will never let you down, but you want an impact from the bench and with most of the games being won in the last 10 minutes, we’ve really lacked someone who can come on and make the difference. Schalk is just a better impact player,’ Meyer said.
The bench has a dynamic look about it with the industrious and abrasive Flip van der Merwe and Marcell Coetzee included, while Juan de Jongh and Lwazi Mvovo have the aptitude to exploit the space that will open up in the final quarter.
The forecast is for cold but clear conditions at kick-off on Saturday. Ireland announce their team on Thursday and are expected to name skipper Paul O’Connell and experienced prop Cian Healy in their run-on side.
Springboks – 15 Zane Kirchner, 14 JP Pietersen, 13 Jaco Taute, 12 Jean de Villiers, 11 Francois Hougaard, 10 Pat Lambie, 9 Ruan Pienaar, 8 Duane Vermuelen, 7 Willem Alberts, 6 Francois Louw, 5 Juandre Kruger, 4 Eben Etzebeth, 3 Jannie du Plessis, 2 Adriaan Strauss, 1 Beast Mtawarira.
16 Schalk Brits, 17 CJ van der Linde, 18 Pat Cilliers, 19 Flip van der Merwe, 20 Marcell Coetzee, 21 Morne Steyn, 22 Juan de Jongh, 23 Lwazi Mvovo
569 Comments
7 Nov 2012, 13:45 pm
Kirchner at 15 and Taute at 13…lol
7 Nov 2012, 13:47 pm
Farkit man….
damn, moer and bliksem!
no JDJ….criminal
7 Nov 2012, 13:47 pm
Ja whatever, this guy clearly doesn’t understand backline play at all.
Boks by 4
7 Nov 2012, 13:47 pm
Hougie getting a free ride at wing. Taute has shown he is not a 13 and will make his name totie again. Play him at fullback HM and give JDJ his chance ffs. Morne Steyn leaped frogged Jantjies again? ****** LOL ek se.
7 Nov 2012, 13:48 pm
Can someone explain to me the whole 23 players in the squad thing?
7 Nov 2012, 13:49 pm
4 and 5 combo the one to take us forward. Like the bench as well but not to keen on the backline. This backline will beat the Irish but battle against Aus NZ
7 Nov 2012, 13:50 pm
@Bagel-5: extra prop forward so that they don’t have to do uncontested scrums.
7 Nov 2012, 13:50 pm
Should have been De Jongh at 13 and Taute at 15. and Jantjies on the bench. Boks by 1. **** you Meyer.
7 Nov 2012, 13:51 pm
De Jongh’s name has beem left out Ryan !!@Bagel-5: A whole frontrow needs to be on the bench
7 Nov 2012, 13:52 pm
@CharlesM-9: been left out
7 Nov 2012, 13:52 pm
@Bagel-5:
There’s a mistake. No 20 is missing. There should be another backline player with the 5 forwards.
7 Nov 2012, 13:52 pm
sheesh…
juan not even on the bench…!!
no man… heymaker is just plain wrong…!!
he’s messing with the minds of players who don’t deserve to be messed with…
hope jaco has a good game though…
7 Nov 2012, 13:53 pm
The fact that HM give players a chance that are out of form to play themself “into form” is farking ridiculous. JW did the same with De Wet Barry and Marius Joubert and only injury opened the door for Jaque Fourie (the rest is history). HM pluk ‘n lat vir sy eie gat.
7 Nov 2012, 13:53 pm
@CharlesM-10: Ja man he’s gone and done it again. Taute at 13. Don’t know what his problem is with JDJ.
7 Nov 2012, 13:53 pm
@CharlesM-9: Okay so Ryan has corrected his mistake.
Did HM not say that Steyn is not regarded as an impact player ? Will Elton carry tackle bags during the rest of the tour ?
7 Nov 2012, 13:54 pm
APOLOGIES….!!!
didn’t see t…
7 Nov 2012, 13:54 pm
The return of Morne Steyn, I bet Lambie wont even finish the 1st half
7 Nov 2012, 13:55 pm
@stormersboy-14: SIZE as always. I suppose he did not watch the Currie Cup final !! (neither the video of the test with Taute at centre).
7 Nov 2012, 13:55 pm
M Steyn on bench?????
Nee Vok ek raak mal!
7 Nov 2012, 13:55 pm
@CharlesM-15:
oh… phew…!!
thought i was going crazy…!!
7 Nov 2012, 13:55 pm
I give up on this twit.
7 Nov 2012, 13:58 pm
The fear of JdJ scoring and dancing like doos a behind the post must’ve cracked Taute the nod
7 Nov 2012, 13:58 pm
gotta feel for young jantjies too…!!
7 Nov 2012, 13:59 pm
@grant10-19: Very disappointing !! I hope Lambie isn’t moved to 15 to accommodate Steyn in the 2nd half. He should move Taute to 15 and sub Zane with JdJ in the 2nd half: let’s hope it is not for the last 5 minutes only !!
7 Nov 2012, 14:00 pm
Liefling’s going back to the Bulls next year. Expect him to also jump ahead of Jantjies in the queue…
I’m just hoping De Jongh gets more than 5 mins and Lambie gets his kicking spot on. All we need is one off-form performance for Meyer to stick Steyn back in.
7 Nov 2012, 14:00 pm
@ufo-23: Absolutely !!
7 Nov 2012, 14:02 pm
Jantjes???
No Man HM…i am doing my best to try and find some logic….but you not making it easy my man…
7 Nov 2012, 14:03 pm
I have two questions some of you saffers could answer
Has Lambie spent any time at inside or outside center?
Does Pienaar prefer 9 or 10? I remember him complaining about being played out of position a few years back but can’t remember which one it was
7 Nov 2012, 14:03 pm
@ufo-23: Somehow see him playing second fiddle for some time to come unless Goosen really buggers things up and whilst Morne is there he will not crack the starting line up.
7 Nov 2012, 14:04 pm
@gonzo-28: Lambie played centre at the Sharks I believe and Pienaar prefers 9 hence his move accros the water.
7 Nov 2012, 14:04 pm
@gonzo-28: Lambie has played at 12; Pienaar prefers 9
7 Nov 2012, 14:05 pm
@gonzo-28:
Lambie has played a bit of CC rugby at 12. Pienaar wnts to play 9 although I still believe with the right temperament he could have been a great 10
7 Nov 2012, 14:05 pm
@CharlesM-24: So strange with Taute making it clear he prefers 15 and JDJ in such great form
baffling….
7 Nov 2012, 14:05 pm
Heinke v d Merwe has joined the side as cover for Guthro
7 Nov 2012, 14:06 pm
@grant10-33: yes Grant it does not make sense !! HM said earlier this week that Taute’s future is at 15
7 Nov 2012, 14:07 pm
Excellent side, although I would’ve liked to see Morne Steyn starting. Meyer is favouring Sharks players – Steyn totally outperformed Lambie when the Bulls played the Sharks in the CC.
Pleased to see that he retained Taute at 13. Give Taute another 20 to 25 tests and he will be the best international in this position.
7 Nov 2012, 14:07 pm
And still the useless Steyn creature manages to find a way into the team, alongside the pathetic Kirchner critter. If Meyer really can’t trust De Jongh and can continue to trust Kirchner at Fullback at the expense of playing Taute out of position, well, somethings gotta give. Fantastic to see Lambie in the pivot position. He’s got his chance to prove himself and I hope he does. With the long rugby season, two good flyhalves are needed (Goose n Lambs). I’ve also been impressed with Schalk Brits, who is mobile enough to get some continuity going in the last 20 minutes. Cmon Boks. Steamroll those Irish dreamers.
7 Nov 2012, 14:09 pm
@Finfan-36: lmao
7 Nov 2012, 14:09 pm
seriously. Give heyneke a break. Elton had his chance. The moment goosen was injured we couldn’t come back. So jantjies although good isn’t the answer. Heyneke is now giving. Lambie a chance. Something most wouldn’t have expected. Give him a chance. Also get rid of Ricardo lobster what a wanker.
7 Nov 2012, 14:09 pm
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-29:
yeah… you are most probably right…
but i think goosen (unfortunately) is going to have a career dogged by injury… i said before s15 that he was not robust enough yet and needed a year (or two) to toughen up… but the indecent haste by naka and heyneke to rush such a prodigious talent has hurt his career too…
said at the same time i would let lambie and jantjies fight it out for the starting spot and let goosen come off the bench, when fit, for the next year or so until he is more robust…
7 Nov 2012, 14:11 pm
In the series against England:
Morne at #10, Jantjies reserve.
In the RC:
Morne at # 10, Jantjies reserve
Goosen at # 10, Jantjies reserve
On EOYT against Ireland:
Lambie at #10, Jantjies not on the bench
What the hell is Jantjies suppose to think?
Now, you guys can try and steer away from it if you want to but imo the only plausible reason for Jantjies and JdJ not being selected is because Meyer believes in a MAXIMUM quota for players of colour. That maximum being THREE. He will select a bunch of them in his squad but when it comes to the 15 players on the field, there are usually only three.
Watch JdJ and Mvovo having to wait until the 77th minute before they go onto the field on Saturday.
This coach id driving a moerse wedge between Bok supporters.
7 Nov 2012, 14:12 pm
@ufo-40: In Naka’s defence, he said at the time that Goosen should not tour with the Boks to NZ and Aus but Meyer ignored his wishes.
7 Nov 2012, 14:12 pm
@the_rugby_guru-39:
so please explain why does jantjies only get one chance….?
and morne gets unlimited chances…???
7 Nov 2012, 14:12 pm
@nima boohoo why do you have to look at race you little girl.
7 Nov 2012, 14:13 pm
Morne Steyn should not even have been selected to tour – let alone have a place in the match day 22.
Typical ******** loyalty – he wants his chum to get paid and earn match day & touring fees. Baantjies vir boeties is well and alive….
7 Nov 2012, 14:13 pm
Good team. Lets hope Lambie get the full 80 minutes. Out of all the flyhalfs we got at the moment he is by far the best. Goosen and Lambie will contesting for Number 10 for many year. Elton is good but no way near in the same league as Lambie and Goosen.
7 Nov 2012, 14:13 pm
is the word ” bonehead ” allowed ?
7 Nov 2012, 14:14 pm
@CharlesM-42:
true…
but he didn’t exactly give him time to recover fully for the cheetahs… had he rested goosen it would have been very hard for heymaker to select him…
but point taken…
7 Nov 2012, 14:15 pm
@ufo morne has proven himself in the past more than jantjies. Let’s not forget 09. But I agree. I don’t think steyn should be in he side full stop. I also don’t think jantjies is the answer. Also I think jantjies will feature later on in the tour.
7 Nov 2012, 14:15 pm
@ufo-43: HM loves Morne and doesn’t like Jantjies’s hairstyle. What is there to explain??
7 Nov 2012, 14:16 pm
@nama1-41: I really hope you are wrong but JdJ (especially) and Elton may think so too. Like I said in 15 above, HM said that Morne is no impact player: he is contradicting himself. If JdJ did not score that try in the final of the CC, he might not even have been on the bench. IMO JdJ should be in the starting XV, Nama
7 Nov 2012, 14:17 pm
I would have played;
Taute to 15
JDJ to 13
Coetzee to 7
Alberts bench
Jantjies bench
Mapoe bench
Kirchner out
Steyn out
7 Nov 2012, 14:17 pm
Meyer is trying to outdo RS.
7 Nov 2012, 14:18 pm
@the_rugby_guru-49: Brilliant post!! Like HM, we should never, ever forget how well Morne kicked in 2009.
7 Nov 2012, 14:20 pm
No I just think it’s mornes last chance. He won’t play after this tour
7 Nov 2012, 14:20 pm
@the_rugby_guru-39:
“seriously. Give heyneke a break. Elton had his chance. … Heyneke is now giving. Lambie a chance.”
How long did Elton’s chance last. Would you be OK with it if Lambie gets the same amount of minutes and then thrown to the scrap heap if he does not win the game for the Boks all on his own self?
Taute and Morne should not be in the match 22 even
Hougaard and Alberts should’ve been on the bench.
Ireland to moer this Bok team on Saturday.
7 Nov 2012, 14:21 pm
Jantjes and De Jongh……
sad business I tell you.
7 Nov 2012, 14:21 pm
15 aplon 14 pietersen 13 mapoe 12 jdj 11 rhule 10 kantjies
7 Nov 2012, 14:22 pm
@the_rugby_guru-49:
if he’s gonna be used later in the tour… give him some game time before then to ‘acclimatise’ … he’s not gonna get any time… then get a start under more pressure than he needs to… it alsmot suggests he’s being set up to fail…
heyneke really needs to start being more clear and consistent in his utterances and selections… almost seem that he’s saying whatever people want to hear to shut them up and then just goes and does the opposite…
@Finfan-50:
neither of which should come into an objective selection…
7 Nov 2012, 14:24 pm
agree Lambie was given less playing time than jantjies. I don’t agree with meyers selections completely. But at least give him credit for trying Lambie. Oh wait Lambie is toO white
7 Nov 2012, 14:25 pm
Taute to 15
JdJ to 13
Bench looks a bit iffy as well. Certainly not the strongest bench Ive seen.
7 Nov 2012, 14:25 pm
@the_rugby_guru-60: Shut up troll
7 Nov 2012, 14:26 pm
Piss poor selection that excludes JDJ and keeps Kirchner.
The man is love sick on north men ruggas.
JDJ is a better player at 13 than any player currently in SA.
This is pathetic. Boks will still win, but poor selection continues to be HM second biggest enemy, that and his re tardedly outdated game plan!
7 Nov 2012, 14:27 pm
@nama1-41:
7 Nov 2012, 14:28 pm
Keep your fcken panties dry, people. This team is going to obliterate the potato mashers.
7 Nov 2012, 14:28 pm
anyway… good luck to the players selected… not their fault…
go bokke…!!
7 Nov 2012, 14:28 pm
@katman. Yes they will.
7 Nov 2012, 14:30 pm
@KWAGGA ROBERTSE-22: ja, he’d rather have taute fake tackles in midfield
7 Nov 2012, 14:33 pm
BoK xv.
1 beast
2 duplesis(c)
3 duplessis
4 etzebeth
5 Pete Steph dutoit
6 burger (vc)
7 flouw
8 vermeulen
9 dupreez
10 lambie/goosen
11 habana
12 steyn
13 pietersen
14 rhule
15 taute
Bok xv 2013
7 Nov 2012, 14:33 pm
@katman-65: Yes, but does not bode well for the future when HM cannot see what is sitting on his face!!!!
7 Nov 2012, 14:34 pm
I’ve just realised why JdJ hasn’t been getting game time at 13. He’s on the bench as backup to Jean in case of injury. HM isn’t seriously considering him as a starting 13 option, hence the practice with Kirschner moving to 13.
7 Nov 2012, 14:34 pm
Kirchner over Ludik??? Taute over Jordaan??? Where is young Reinach??? And Daniel???
HM is clearly unaware that The Sharks got the Team of the Year award.
Sad.
7 Nov 2012, 14:34 pm
Taute’s defence at outside centre against New Zealand was shocking. Difficult to believe Meyer sees him as a better pick than De Jongh…actually forget that, it’s not all that difficult to believe.
7 Nov 2012, 14:35 pm
taute in the centres again? what a fing joke
7 Nov 2012, 14:35 pm
Watch Earls ghost past Taute at least three times tomorow.
Sjo, HM must be thanking his stars that BOD isn’t there to show Taute for the Apprentice he is.
7 Nov 2012, 14:36 pm
@David-71: lol it just wouldn’t do to play him in his natural position and Taute in his.
7 Nov 2012, 14:37 pm
@goodstuff-63: Good grief, get over yourself. Its not exactly if there is an abundance of talent to go around. If he sticks in a whole team of younsters and untried players and we loose, I bet you will be the first to ***** about that too. Its a well balanced team, we will do well
7 Nov 2012, 14:37 pm
Match 23 is made up of:
Sharks: 7
Bulls: 5
WP (CC champs): 4
Lions: 3
Overseas players: 3
Cheetahs: 1
Vokkit, the Bulls and the Lions have double the amount of players WP, the domestic champions, have in the side.
Hahaha…what a farken joke!!!!!!!!!!!!!
7 Nov 2012, 14:38 pm
@CharlesM-51:
How else do you explain Hougaard on the wing or Taute/JJE at 13. I don’t buy into this “they are there because they are bigger” kak. There is something else at work here.
We can’t shy away from it forever.
7 Nov 2012, 14:39 pm
@Big Hit-73: HM must have issues with JDJ’s dance choices, obviously Taute is more of a sakkie sakkie man so there you go.
HM is either:
A: A racist selector!
B: Favouring Transvaal rugby players!
C: ******* stupid!
D: A unapreciated genius who confounds us all!
F: A, B and C (D is false)!
7 Nov 2012, 14:39 pm
WTF, sideshow bob at 15 and Taute at 13, come on Meyer, are you really that in love with steyn that you’d put a rookie international out of position in the 13 channel when you have JDJ available, for fork sakes, pick players in their correct positions and stop ******** around
7 Nov 2012, 14:40 pm
@the_rugby_guru-55: hi, you must not take your nick (self assigned) that seriously, please relax, you don’t know everything regarding HM’s intended plans for his squad.
Morne in the coach’s opinion still has a lot to offer looking at his latest comments.
7 Nov 2012, 14:41 pm
@nama1-41: I am starting to think the same thing.
7 Nov 2012, 14:41 pm
@nama take of your racial tinted glasses. What a complexed individual you are little girl.
7 Nov 2012, 14:41 pm
@Mr Black-64:
What else am I to think?
His record in the previous 9 test matches speaks for itself.
7 Nov 2012, 14:41 pm
@nama1-79:
white is right
7 Nov 2012, 14:42 pm
@goodstuff-80:
7 Nov 2012, 14:43 pm
@nama1-78: Rather use Excel when calculating ratios. You got that all wrong boy.
7 Nov 2012, 14:44 pm
The centre combination of JDV and Taute is not effective, Taute is best suited at fullback not outside centre, although i still prefer Aplon to be at fullback. I am surprised De Jongh isn’t in the starting 15 lineup, I believe he has progressed to a higher level and definitely deserves to be there at outside centre. I don’t think this backline will function so well in terms of the centre combination and the fullback.
Schalk Brits is on the bench, one of the best hookers in the premiership certainly better than Strauss, im not sure why hes on the reserves.
7 Nov 2012, 14:45 pm
@nama1-79: It is his subconcious, it does not trust players of colour. Its like what PDV said about the mechanic.
7 Nov 2012, 14:46 pm
Capebull…Capebull kom in…Capebull …Capebull kom in…
I told you earlier in the week or over the weekend that the Bulls contingent in the team will be more than that of WP.
Now you can see for yourself.
Heyneke Meyer is a freakin joke of a coach.
7 Nov 2012, 14:48 pm
HM’s decision making process (also known as the “horses of courses” method):
Yes = 10
No = 0
1. Is he a Bull? Y/N
2. Is he big? Y/N
3. Is he white? Y/N
4. Is he my type of player? Y/N
5. Was he ever a Bull? Y/N
6. Has he never played for WP? Y/N
7. Is he possible love child? Y/N
Note: Exceptions dependent on feelings day before selection announcement.
7 Nov 2012, 14:49 pm
taute is a quota
7 Nov 2012, 14:50 pm
WHITE IS RIGHT- thats why heyneke is there
regardless of ‘transformation’
regardless of gameplan
regardless of selection
REAGRDLESS OF RESULTS
he will be backed from the hierarchy till the bitter end
its gonna be bitter, brace yourselves
7 Nov 2012, 14:51 pm
@the_rugby_guru-84:
Not as complex as you with all your different nics.
Quota_Sux…. Suffer_Guy…… the_rugby_guru…. etc, etc.
At least I stick with one nic to try and work through my complexities. You are only confusing yourself with all this different names.
7 Nov 2012, 14:51 pm
You girls a beyond silly. Get it together, ffs.
7 Nov 2012, 14:51 pm
@nama1-85: keegan got dropped for arno botha, how do you explain that?
7 Nov 2012, 14:54 pm
@the_rugby_guru-84: Nama is a man.
7 Nov 2012, 14:54 pm
@Finfan-88:
Come again!!!
@Sasuke-90:
Maybe that. That’s more acceptable than, “he likes bigger players.”
7 Nov 2012, 14:54 pm
@nama1-95: tomatoboy_ralepelle, wynand_killed_elton, boo_habana
7 Nov 2012, 14:54 pm
Not every descision made by a white person that does not suit a black person is racist. Dumb choices? Yes!, Racist? No!
7 Nov 2012, 14:55 pm
Heyneke Meyer has obviously made his mind up about Jaco Taute and Zane Kirchner. If it works out eventually then good on him, but should it fail (which it already has) then he doth be on his own.
7 Nov 2012, 14:58 pm
@Transformation-93:
I’m trying to find another word to describe these white players who are not deserving of their place in the team. “Quota” is reserved for the players of a darker hue who do not deserve their places in the team.
Hougaard, Taute and Morne will be the first to be called that.
Now if I can only find a word to accurately describe them.
7 Nov 2012, 15:00 pm
I will be interesting to see if Lambie takes the shots at goal.
7 Nov 2012, 15:01 pm
@nama1-103:
You can probably call Hougaard and Morne Blouta’s.
But leave Taute alone, his a Stormer.
7 Nov 2012, 15:02 pm
@Transformation-97:
Keegan had a kak game so Meyer is looking for somebody else. A white player replaced by a white player. No problem there.
Taute/Hougaard had kak games, Meyer keeps playing them because the only alternatives he has, are dark players.
7 Nov 2012, 15:03 pm
Ryan, why do you have 23 players in your match 22?
7 Nov 2012, 15:06 pm
@nama1-103: Yes, a player from the majority in the team certainly can’t be called a quota. I can understand if you find it confusing as this logic doesn’t apply in the broader South African environment where the majority is protected against the minority through Affirmative Action legislation.
7 Nov 2012, 15:06 pm
@Mr Black-101:
If you keep on making the same “dumb choices” at the expense of one and to the advantage of another, there surely must be another reason. You can’t just keep on calling them “dumb choices,” not when the person has a record of making the same “dumb choices” over and over again.
7 Nov 2012, 15:07 pm
@nama1-106: Your racial paranoia is disturbing. And pretty stupid too.
How many games has Taute played for the Boks?
Were you one of the ijits clamouring for Kallis to be dropped after his first game, or even his first 10 games? Or perhaps Herschelle?
Just as well the public doesn’t have a say in these matters, because there are too many people like you who would fck it up royally.
7 Nov 2012, 15:09 pm
@Jeraldjay-105:
“Bloutas” might work while HM is there…but then only for players from the Bulls.
7 Nov 2012, 15:09 pm
Look, I would have gone for S.Brits on the bench too, but I think it is clear that Heyneke does not rate Chilliboy at all.
Played both Gary Botha and Derick Kuun (a converted flanker) ahead of the young Chilli.
And now S.Brits leapfrogged him all of a sudden.
Also, how does Lambie / Steyn suddenly leapfrog Jantjies?
And Taute / JJ leapfrog De Jongh?
And Coetzee leapfrog Kolisi from junior level?
7 Nov 2012, 15:10 pm
@willievz-107: I think it’s a new thing they’re trying to prevent uncontested scrums.
Should see the Aussies drop to 9th on the IRB world rankings.
7 Nov 2012, 15:11 pm
@willievz-107:
Ryan is still writing in 2011
7 Nov 2012, 15:12 pm
@katman-113: I think Willie was refering to the error in the text where Ryan refers to the match 22 when in fact it should be the match 23.
7 Nov 2012, 15:14 pm
@willievz-112: Agreed. Chiliboy should be on the bench.
Schalk Brits even said he would be happy just carrying tackle bags.
7 Nov 2012, 15:15 pm
Got to admit I am surprised JdJ didnt crack it with Taute on the bench .. Kirtchner to be fair has been solid so maybe the only way HM can keep Taute in the run on 15 is in 13 berth where JdV and JF (when avail) will work away outside FS (when fit ..)
No way MS should be near the team at this stage, EJ is way ahead ..
The RC win ratio has put HM in his kraal …
7 Nov 2012, 15:16 pm
@katman-110:
I agree Nama’s paranoia is a bit over the top but the fundamental issue is that Taute is not a 13 and by him being selected there does the Boks a disservice because his future is at 15.
7 Nov 2012, 15:16 pm
I just can’t see HM lasting as the Bok coach with this match 22. HM as a Bok forwards coach would be great, very good pack, but not as head coach!! HMs backline just doesn’t make sense at all!!
However am very pleased for Lambie, i hope he has a humbdinger of a game!!
7 Nov 2012, 15:17 pm
Coming from a Bulls supporter……..
Watch the Stormers smack everybody left, right and centre come the Super Rugby, 2013. Best lock combo, in Vermeulen / Kolisi & Burger, probably the best loosies combo…. AND, see how Jantjies performs behind such dominance. Jdj and Habana both set to have stellar seasons come next year.
HM’s selections smack of “Broederbond” ideologies – he’s driving a wedge between Bok supporters.
It all leaves a bitter taste in the mouth.
7 Nov 2012, 15:17 pm
@Big Hit-76:
I’m not joking. It seems to be the only explanation. We don’t have any other uncapped 12s available other than JdJ and HM is still looking (hoping) to find another JF type at 13.
7 Nov 2012, 15:18 pm
@katman-110:
It would have made more sense to play Jdj @ 13, and Taute @ 15…
7 Nov 2012, 15:19 pm
@Finfan-108:
Wrong. When you have a quota system in place, it goes both ways. A minimum quota and a maximum quota.
For example, Meyer has a maximum quota of THREE players of colour in his run on team. That means his minimum quota of white players is TWELVE. That is why you have some white players in the team who do not deserve their place but he has to fill the quota of 12 white players, that’s why he selects them.
When he turns his quota ratio around ie a MINIMUM of 3 players of colour and a MAXIMUM of 12 white players…that is the day when we will see more than 3 P’sOC in the run on team and a player like JdJ will be selected with three others. For now, Meyer is satisfied with his three players of colour in the run on team
7 Nov 2012, 15:19 pm
@Sasuke-116: Nope, when last did Chilly start a competitive match? Has he built up any form? Schalk B is a better player at this stage.
7 Nov 2012, 15:21 pm
I rest my case…
Morne on the bench farkingridiculoussmiley and Niknaks still at fifteen – Taute at 13 – man it is hard to be humble…
7 Nov 2012, 15:21 pm
Pot Blou Gevaar – Kind of agree.
HMs pack selections are good but his backline is shocking, 2 players out of position Hougie/Taute, when he has Mvovo & JDJ to choose.
I kind of agree with M Steyn on the bench, coz when on song M Steyn is very good!! M Steyn should have been on the bench v the last game against the ABs, as Jantjies was a bit stunned!!
7 Nov 2012, 15:21 pm
I believe most people would be happy with this team:
Springboks – 15 Jaco Taute, 14 JP Pietersen, 13 Juan de Jongh , 12 Jean de Villiers, 11 Lwazi Mvovo, 10 Pat Lambie, 9 Ruan Pienaar, 8 Duane Vermuelen, 7 Willem Alberts, 6 Francois Louw, 5 Juandre Kruger, 4 Eben Etzebeth, 3 Jannie du Plessis, 2 Adriaan Strauss, 1 Beast Mtawarira.
16 Schalk Brits, 17 CJ van der Linde, 18 Pat Cilliers, 19 Flip van der Merwe, 20 Marcell Coetzee, 21 Elton Jantjies, 22 Ludik , 23 Francois Hougard
7 Nov 2012, 15:22 pm
HM probably sees MS as some insurance if the youngsters fail to perform… experience BS… Hopefully MS will eventually be replaced by Jantjies on the bench…
7 Nov 2012, 15:22 pm
@katman-110:
So what are you saying? Taute will become a world great at outside center?
The boy does not even want to play there. What’s wrong with you? He does not belong in the team. Not at full back, where Mitchell rated Coetzee as better than him, nor at center where he was absolutely kak against the All Blacks.
7 Nov 2012, 15:22 pm
@katman-110:
Despite abundance of talent, Hersh had to be forced into the team thru political pressure
Sure you read this past weekend’s paper where Ntini even spoke about the sentiments he had to deal with.
Reckon Ntini despite having shown himself to be world class player also has (d) racial paranoia issues
Hell, even humble Hashim has spoken out about it
7 Nov 2012, 15:22 pm
@nama1-103:
a square peg … (as in a round hole)
7 Nov 2012, 15:23 pm
@Doughnut-117: Taute would of been a great bench option because of the positions he can play (15, 14, 13)
7 Nov 2012, 15:24 pm
@goodstuff-127:
The team most expected… Either those are his love children or sing in the church choir with him. Other than that I see no reason why he would be so up their arses when they are clearly not up to standard…
7 Nov 2012, 15:25 pm
The whole Taute – JDJ matter throws the “all we want is merit only” brigades argument totally out the window
7 Nov 2012, 15:25 pm
@goodstuff-124: Probably true but HM knows Chiliboy from his Bulls days and Chiliboy is more experienced than Brits.
7 Nov 2012, 15:25 pm
I believe the best (when fit) backline the Boks can field would read;
9. Pienaar
10. Jantjies
11. Habana
12. F. Steyn
13. De Jongh
14. JPP
15. Taute
With Hougaard, Goosen, Ruhle, Lambie, Serfontein, JJ, Aplon, etc. all capable replacements in the wings. Niknaks is solid, but pales in the company of Beale, Dagg, Kearny. And the less said about Morné, the better.
7 Nov 2012, 15:28 pm
@Sasuke-115: Ah, ek sien.
7 Nov 2012, 15:28 pm
I hope Lambie has an excellent game and nails all his kicks!
7 Nov 2012, 15:29 pm
@nama1-129: I asked you a question: How many games has Jaco Taute played for the Springboks.
Just the short answer, please.
7 Nov 2012, 15:29 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-136: Change Taute with A.Coetzee, and Jantjies with Goosen, and you have yourself a deal.
7 Nov 2012, 15:30 pm
@willievz-112:
Good post Willie.
In any team there has to be a pecking order which forms the foundation for man-management and trust between the coach and player. It is also serves as a motivating factor for the players to keep pushing to be the best inany positions.
You have to earn your stripes within the team environment and when there is an injury or bad form you the next in line ’cause the coach told you so.
But when a player gets leapfrogged that bond is broken which deflates the player which ultimately has an effect on his confidence.
PDV understood that concept.
7 Nov 2012, 15:30 pm
I would have made two changes
1. JdJ ahead of Taute and Taute at 15. Not because I rate JdJ, but I hate Kirchner.
2. Arno Botha ahead of either Coetzee or Alberts. Reason for this is not because I rate Botha more, but Coetzee and Alberts are both tired and they rely heavily on their energy to be effectively
3. Jantjies ahead of Steyn. Meyer’s plan is to play Lambie for 240 minutes on this tour, so hopefully no injury to Lambie.
Having said that I think we should roll past Ireland with ease as they are without Ferris and O’Brien.
7 Nov 2012, 15:31 pm
How I wish we had a proper gifted fullback at 15 to grow into his role and become a future star. So many great fullbacks from all the other rugby nations. Foden, Kearney, Dagg, Halfpenny, Masi, Hogg, Beale but we’re still stuck with the lobotomized tetraplegic Kirtchner aka The Niknaks Man aka Krusty the Klown aka InZane.
I dont care how many people say how solid he has been (whatever that means, catching a high ball?) or that he hasn’t screwed up so badly yet (he has to my mind, with his chronic defensive positioning lapses and causing Habana to botch a certain try against NZ) .
Le Roux, A Coetzee, Taute all superb prospects at 15, but still yet to get a taste of the action at fullback for the Boks.
7 Nov 2012, 15:32 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-136: Fourie du Preez, Jaque Fourie and Goosen/ Lambie better than Pienaar, JdJ and Jantjies.
7 Nov 2012, 15:32 pm
@race of tan-126:
Agreed…, it’s just that Morné is very jaded. At the end of the day, these players do not select themselves. Morné needs time away from the game – in the same breath, SA Rugby needs a change in mind set when it comes to backline play.
I always admire the Cheetahs backline in full flow – running smart lines at pace, good distribution, and support runners all over.
What HM has done, as in PDivvie’s case, was to surround him with under-par assistants. A coaching panel which would have included;
Mallett - Tech Director / forwards
Hawies - Backs
Nienaber - Defence
7 Nov 2012, 15:32 pm
@Horings-144: Agreed
7 Nov 2012, 15:33 pm
@Spiesisworthless1-143: “How I wish we had a proper gifted fullback at 15 to grow into his role and become a future star.”
We have.
Andries Coetzee.
7 Nov 2012, 15:33 pm
@Spiesisworthless1-143: Oops. SideShow Bob one of his more famois nicknames I left out.
7 Nov 2012, 15:34 pm
@willievz-147: Agreed 100 %, but it means nothing if he’s not in the Springboks fold.
7 Nov 2012, 15:35 pm
@nama1-41:
“Now, you guys can try and steer away from it if you want to but imo the only plausible reason for Jantjies and JdJ not being selected is because Meyer believes in a MAXIMUM quota for players of colour. That maximum being THREE.
This coach is driving a moerse wedge between Bok supporters.”
@nama1-79:
@CharlesM-51:
I don’t buy into this “they are there because they are bigger” kak. There is something else at work here.
@Pot Blou Gevaar-120:
HM’s selections smack of “Broederbond” ideologies – he’s driving a wedge between Bok supporters.
Not much different from what I’ve been saying, is it?
7 Nov 2012, 15:36 pm
Taute is overrated imo… He’s slow and dont really have a great kicking game…Id rather have Aplon…
7 Nov 2012, 15:36 pm
@willievz-140: @willievz-140:
I may cede on Goosen, but am not yet sold on Coetzee..
Personal preference as in Streauli selecting Jorrie Muller I guess.
7 Nov 2012, 15:37 pm
@Jeez-151: I’d rather have Le Roux or Coetzee at fullback than Taute.
7 Nov 2012, 15:37 pm
@Horings-142:
I think you may be right regarding Coetzee especially.
That oke has played a whole lot of rugby this year.
I like that Botha bloke, as a number 8 mainly though. He’s poison at 8 and I reckon in line for the Bok captaincy at some point in the future.
7 Nov 2012, 15:37 pm
JDJ has had way more opportunities than Taute. And to be brutally frank, he hasn’t really used them. Until a couple of weeks ago, people couldn’t stop talking about how he a.) never passes, b.) can’t pass to the right and c.) can only step properly off one foot. I don’t agree with all those statements, but that was certainly a running theme here. All that has changed now is that he has scored one cracking try in the CC final, and now the entire keo yoefleeg can’t stop whining about the injustice of him being on the Bok bench. As I said, you girls are beyond silly.
7 Nov 2012, 15:38 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-152: “Personal preference as in Streauli selecting Jorrie Muller I guess.”
Or you mean Heyneke selecting JJ Engelbrecht
7 Nov 2012, 15:39 pm
@Spiesisworthless1-153:
Let see how they do in Super rugby…
7 Nov 2012, 15:39 pm
@Jeez-151: I dont know how true this is, but Heyneke Meyer reckons Taute runs the 100m in 10.7 seconds.
7 Nov 2012, 15:39 pm
@katman-155:
a) Never passes – not true
b) Can’t pass to the right – not true
c) Can only step properly off one foot – certainly not true
How many tests have De Jongh started for the Boks?
7 Nov 2012, 15:40 pm
@katman-155: Couldn’t have said it better myself.
7 Nov 2012, 15:40 pm
@Spiesisworthless1-153: Coetzee is a loosie, dumb fcknut
7 Nov 2012, 15:40 pm
@Jeraldjay-141: The problem with PdV is he did not drop players when they were out of form. The balance between loyalty and playing the best is a difficult one.
Meyer gave Steyn a very good run. At least 3 games too long a run in my opinion and now he is out of the starting team for the last 3 tests. Sure, he is back in the 22, but Jantjies had a shocker against WP under perfect conditions.
At least Meyer is not letting loyalty come in the way as we have seen with PdV, but he is also not chopping and changing like Straeuli did.
He simply does not rate de Jongh, nor do I, so I understand his stance.
7 Nov 2012, 15:40 pm
@willievz-156:
7 Nov 2012, 15:41 pm
@Finfan-161: Andries Coetzee you bladdy wingnut
7 Nov 2012, 15:41 pm
@willievz-159: Seldom see JDJ passing to be honest. He prefers to attack the line but because he does it so often, he is becoming predictable.
He also lacks a kicking game.
7 Nov 2012, 15:41 pm
@katman-139:
You didn’t just ask a question. You made references of Herchell and Kallis who made bad starts to their international careers and then became great as if somehow Taute will also become a great after a kak start. Now will you answer my question: Will Taute become a world great at outside center?
On your question: TWO test matches.
One vs Aus (debut) and one vs the AB.
He was kak in both and should not be in the team for this game on Saturday.
7 Nov 2012, 15:43 pm
@Horings-162: Well said Sir.
7 Nov 2012, 15:43 pm
@katman-155:
What it basically boils down to is that we are all crying out for a world class 15 and 13.
We’re are all fighting over the best of a bad bunch at the moment.
7 Nov 2012, 15:44 pm
@Spiesisworthless1-164: No, his name is Marcel, stoopid idiot and I doubt he’d be effective at fullback
7 Nov 2012, 15:44 pm
@willievz-159: Don’t know how many he’s started, but he has had 12 caps.
7 Nov 2012, 15:45 pm
@Jeez-151: Interesting how WP supporters always want Aplon in the mix at 15 and recently Fourie at either 2 or 6.
The problem is they do not even start in those positions for their Province when everyone is fully fit. I dont get it.
I must say I think Deon Fourie’s position is at flank where he is not only one of the best fetchers in the country, but also a very good defender and ball carrier.
7 Nov 2012, 15:45 pm
@nama1-166: You don’t get to make that call, buddy. So you’ll watch from your sofa and you’ll cheer for him, and you’ll like it.
7 Nov 2012, 15:47 pm
John Gait – #168 – Hear hear sir. Well said. Currently the Boks are rebuilding so we have to take the hits i am afraid.
The fact is we don’t have a great fullback at the moment in SA, so one has to be developed.
HM could use JP Pieterson(played there before) but he is the best wing in the world so not a good idea. Therefore we are stuck with Kirchner.
We also don’t have great avaialable 13 in the country, JF is unavailable, so on has to be developed.
7 Nov 2012, 15:47 pm
why pick De Jongh? the quota is allready filled with Zane playing!
7 Nov 2012, 15:47 pm
@Kaizan-165:
You will not see him pass a lot from 13, because 13s don’t pass a lot in the modern game.
It doesn’t mean that he can’t do it.
And do you need a kicking game at 13? It is not even necessarily a mandatory requirement for a 12 (see JDV, Nonu, etc).
I posted yesterday that there are several ways for a 12 to be a playmaker / creating opportunities. Passing and kicking are only some of those ways.
JDJ proved effective at 12 for the Stormers in 2010.
7 Nov 2012, 15:48 pm
@katman-155:
Do you, Katman, HONESTLY believe that Taute is a better outside center than either JdJ or Mapoe and that he deserves to be selected ahead of either of them?
Serious question.
7 Nov 2012, 15:48 pm
@Finfan-169: Even Marcell would tear shi t up at fullback compared to our current crusty cretinous critter in the position.
7 Nov 2012, 15:48 pm
@willievz-159: You must be one of those okes going to the practise sessions of WP, because I do not see JdJ’s passing skills in any televised games.
7 Nov 2012, 15:50 pm
JDJ only passed once in his life! that was grade 1 …
7 Nov 2012, 15:50 pm
@Horings-178: See 175.
I’m sure you’ve seen him play 12.
Also, have another look at the CC semi against the Lions this year.
7 Nov 2012, 15:50 pm
Anyway, if nothing else, this thread is an interesting little social observation – watching a largely enthusiastic but nevertheless clueless crowd exaggerate and create facts (about both players in question) to bolster their arguments. A couple of hundred posts later, and it is written in undeniable stone that Taute is slow, can’t tackle and is the beneficiary of a racist conspiracy to keep coloured players sidelined.
7 Nov 2012, 15:51 pm
@katman-172:
So, can you answer the question now?
7 Nov 2012, 15:52 pm
@nama1-176: JdJ is undeniably the best dancer, not only in the match 23, but the squad as a whole. Now there is something to celebrate, so please stop complaining.
7 Nov 2012, 15:53 pm
JdJ has scored some fantastic tries at S15 level. So have the men on his outside Habana & Aplon. Oh and lets face it the Stormers game has not been condusive to scoring tries. JDJ is a rock solid defender, he carries the ball well and he is deadly in some space. In essence HM’s message is – I’m playing Taute come hell or high water and I’m not dropping Nik Naks to make way for him. I say this because Taute has absolutely zero credentials in a number 13 jersey. In fact he was embarrassing against the AB’s
7 Nov 2012, 15:55 pm
@katman-181: Strange that if Taute is at fullback and de Jongh at centre most people will be satisfied, but the number of non-white players will be the same. Is Provincialism the underlying monster?
7 Nov 2012, 15:55 pm
Stormtrooper …. 2 seasons ago habana was boo’ed at Loftus. Free State Stadium & Coca Cola park – because he was hond kak .. kakker than Earl ever was… this year he was player of the year … so why judge taute on 1 average game?
7 Nov 2012, 15:56 pm
@nama1-176: I believe a coach picks a player after watching him for anything up to a season. Not because of one moment of brilliance. I rate all three of them – Taute, De Jongh and Mapoe – very highly and would have all three in my squad. I also know that the coach was looking for a similar type of player to Fourie at 13, and that Taute’s name had been linked to this for almost a year now. Five seconds of hotstepping isn’t going to change this. But 5 seconds of hotstepping is all it takes to sway a herd of gullible girls on a blog, that’s for sure.
I would have preferred Taute at 15, but I’d have him at 13 any day of the week. And yes, ahead of De Jongh and Mapoe.
7 Nov 2012, 15:56 pm
@willievz-180: I wonder how Sadie made his name playing next to JdJ. He must have magically received the ball form nowhere. This braaivleis talk can be a *****, some simply can’t think or see for themselves.
7 Nov 2012, 15:57 pm
@suffer_guy-174:
That’s the truth. Speak it.
Does not make it right though.
@katman-181:
“…and is the beneficiary of a racist conspiracy to keep coloured players sidelined.”
Explain then WHY he is selected in your opinion.
7 Nov 2012, 15:57 pm
The sooner Taute and Jantjes arrive in the Cape the better….
Taute will be relieved as he will be playing where he prefers…..
And Jantjes is rated by AC…..
HM better hope the selections come off…..because he aint gonna get much sympathy …
7 Nov 2012, 15:58 pm
@willievz-175:
> You will not see him pass a lot from 13, because 13s don’t pass a lot in the modern game.
All positions on the field have to pass. Whether or not a player passes is not decided by the position they play, it’s decided by the context of the situation and game plan…. Of course outside centers have to pass. Juan De Jongh just backs himself individually too often and is becoming predictable.
> And do you need a kicking game at 13? It is not even necessarily a mandatory requirement for a 12 (see JDV, Nonu, etc).
You seem to think all positions on the field are uniform across teams… 13′s need to do that; 12′s don’t need this etc… Again, what matters is context, not the number on your back. If the situation calls for it, sometimes kicking is the best option regardless of what number you have on your back… A player who brings more skills to the table is usually a more valuable player to the team. Frans Steyn is a brilliant kicker and this takes pressure off the flyhalf… Doesn’t mean 12′s ‘have to kick’… It’s just a valuable skill to have. Juan De Jongh doesn’t bring this to the table, whilst other centers do.
Juan is a good player, don’t get me wrong, but he is not perfect. As I said before, he is a bit individualistic and he lacks a kicking game.
7 Nov 2012, 15:59 pm
@Stormtrooper-184: I remember Habana scoring great tries at super rugby level…but not at the Stormers. In fact I remember him scoring those tries with Wynand Olivier, Jaco Pretorius and JP Nel on his inside.
7 Nov 2012, 16:02 pm
@Kaizan-165:
lacking a kicking game never stopped jaque fourie… or made anyone not rate him either…
so why is it important for juan de jongh to have a kicking game…?
7 Nov 2012, 16:02 pm
@nama1-189: Get the fck out of here – I’m not even going to entertain your whacky racist conspiracy theories with an answer. That sht is all in your fcked up head. Deal with it away from this forum.
7 Nov 2012, 16:02 pm
@katman-187: Taute should be showing some form in the domestic competition or SR in the 13 position first before being considered for SA in the 13 position. He was simply kak in his two outings for SA thus far, if you are happing or satisfied with that then I don’t know.
7 Nov 2012, 16:02 pm
@Finfan-183:
That does not answer the question.
What do YOU think? Is Taute a better outside center than JdJ or Mapoe?
How about “merit selections?” A phrase that was bandied around much on this site in the past. Do you think all the players in this team are “merit selections?”
7 Nov 2012, 16:03 pm
@John1976-195: should be happy and satisfied
7 Nov 2012, 16:03 pm
@grant10-190: And if HM picks Jantjies and Taute at 15 with de Jong at 13 where will your focus go to next. Hougaard on wing is my guess.
7 Nov 2012, 16:04 pm
On the plus side…..
Our loose forward combo should be a huge success in the NH…
7 Nov 2012, 16:05 pm
@ufo-193:
Look I rate Juan De Jongh, but he is starting to become a touch over-rated with some people on here calling Heyneke Meyer racist for not selecting him.
I’m just pointing out that he is not the perfect player and there are other reasons he may not have been selected to start other than racism.
7 Nov 2012, 16:06 pm
@Finfan-161:
Howzit Fin.
I see you once again shooting your load without digesting what the poster has said.
He is talking about Andries Coetzee not Marcell.
7 Nov 2012, 16:06 pm
@ufo-193:
Look I rate Juan De Jongh, but he is starting to become a touch over-rated with some people on here calling Heyneke Meyer racist for not selecting him.
I’m just pointing out that he is not the perfect player and there are other reasons he may not have been selected to start other than racism.
7 Nov 2012, 16:07 pm
@grant10-199: For sure. In the end the selections up front is most important. For example, Gerhard vd Heever has a super rugby winners medal and a Currie Cup winners medal at two different Provinces.
7 Nov 2012, 16:08 pm
@katman-187:
“I would have preferred Taute at 15, but I’d have him at 13 any day of the week. And yes, ahead of De Jongh and Mapoe.”
Well, you must go and coach the Lions then because clearly Mitchell knows vokkol.
Selecting Coetzee ahead of Taute at full back.
Selecting Mapoe ahead of Taute at outside center.
Maybe you are the missing link in the Lion’s coaching staff.
7 Nov 2012, 16:08 pm
@Horings-171:
Im not a stormers supporter… I just dont know why Taute is rated so highly at 15 and he’s no better than De Jong at 13 either… Aplon even as a utility back offers more at 15 than Taute imo.
But that being said,I dont believe SA has a world class 15 at the moment, so even though picking Taute, Aplon or Ludik could be an improvement, its nothing to get excited about…
SA havent produced a great 15 since Andre Joubert…
7 Nov 2012, 16:10 pm
@Jeraldjay-201: Andries Coetzee is somewhere in Johannesburg or probably tanning on a beach in Plett, so can’t be considered as a replacement for Zane. Marcell is in Ireland but IMHO won’t be a good choice as a replacement for Zane either.
7 Nov 2012, 16:10 pm
@Kaizan-200:
i don’t think anyone is calling him a perfect player… but he is a better centre than jaco and is in better form at 13 at the moment too…
when heyneke was appointed he said the main criteria he would select on is ‘form’…
yet he picks jaco who is a fullback and did not have a good game when he did play 13 for the boks… over the form 13 in the country…
strange ways indeed…!!
7 Nov 2012, 16:10 pm
@Horings-198: I would of retained Kirchner at 15…..Taute needs to do more to crack that starting position imo….
JDJ should be a shoo in at 13….It actually makes no rugby sense to me at all to not start with him…..in fact it is highly confusing to almost everyone across the board…..
As for Hougaard at 11…..Rhule is still very inexperienced and Mvovo has had an up and down season…..so I dont have issues with that selection….anyway, Habana will be back….
I am not happy with Taute at 13…..
And why the fark M Steyn…..the mot bloody unlikely impact player possible….
7 Nov 2012, 16:11 pm
@nama1-196: I think that HM is too stubborn to acknowledge his errors in previous selection unless he can somehow twist things in the media and take some credit for the previously ommited player’s improvement ala Lambie.
7 Nov 2012, 16:12 pm
@Jeez-205:
I would say Percival was a vital component to our success in France 2007.
7 Nov 2012, 16:12 pm
@katman-194:
You don’t have the authority here, boy.
“Get the fck out of here” nogal…
You are funny…
I take it you don’t really have a good rugby reason WHY he is in the team.
I’ll stick with my theory then.
7 Nov 2012, 16:16 pm
@Kaizan-202:
When you compare super rugby and cc form a youngster and relatively small player like Jordaan would make the squad ahead of de Jong, but thats not to say De Jong could offer the boks more at 13 than Taute… Taute is picked for all the right reasons, but he’s not living up to the expectation as a international 13 at the mo imo… and after de jongs squad selection for the past few years probably deserves a shot with his provincial center partner…
I hope Frans Steyn and JOrdaan combines well next year… as a pare they could be knocking hard to become the next settled center combination… In the long run I cant see HM being satisfied with the JDV FS combination…JDV is terrible at 13… As for JDV and De Jong… theyve got more to prove imo…
7 Nov 2012, 16:19 pm
@Kaizan-202:
The only reason you’d select Taute and De Villiers as a combo, is when they compliment each-others strengths.
Fact is, De Jongh has been the form 13 in RSA this year, like Etsebeth has been the form lock. Now, the only reason you don’t select form is when a solid partnership was formed – think Andries Bekker’s form in 2010, yet still having to play from the bench because of Matfield and Bakkies’ combination. Matfield I rate as the best no. 5 lock in the modern era, but that’s besides the point.
De Villiers and Taute is anything but a solid combo. FACT. De Villiers is hopelessly out of form, nearing John Smit’s proportions, and Taute is a 15. Now, like Etsebeth deserves to be there at 4, De Jongh deserves to be there at 13.
7 Nov 2012, 16:20 pm
@Kaizan-202:
How on earth does JdJ “become a touch over-rated” just because people question HM’s motives for not selecting him?
7 Nov 2012, 16:20 pm
@ufo-207: I definitely agree he should be starting ahead of Jaco. I think Meyer has started Taute for size and defensive reasons, especially when you consider they will soon be up against Manu tuilagi…. I would still prefer JDJ, but I don’t think Meyer is racist because he doesn’t share my view.
Some posters on here (skopdiekan and a few others) were saying pretty much that JDJ was the perfect player yesterday.
Personally I prefer Jordaan to De Jongh.
7 Nov 2012, 16:21 pm
At least our loose trio is better than the one selected in 2006.
SA team vs Ireland in 2006:
South Africa: B Fortuin; J Pretorious, B Habana, J de Villiers, F Steyn; A Pretorious, R Januarie; L Sephaka, J Smit (capt), CJ van der Linde; J Ackerman, A van den Berg, D Rossouw, J Smith, P Spies.
Replacements: C Ralepelle, BJ Botha, J Muller, J Cronje, R Pienaar, W Olivier, JP Pietersen.
7 Nov 2012, 16:21 pm
@nama1-211: There is simply no merit in selecting a fullback, who on previous 2 occasions were really kak games at outside centre, ahead of an experience outside centre. HM is really destroying Jaco’s confidence by playing him out of position at the highest level. Jaco can’t be feeling confident given the ease with which he was beaten by the outside backs of the ABS.
7 Nov 2012, 16:23 pm
@Jeez-212: Couldn’t agree more… I think Frans Steyn and Jordaan may end up becoming the center combo for the boks one day. (If Meyer gets over his fear of selecting small players that is)…. Either that, or maybe even JP at 13, with Jordaan moving to the wing.
Jordaan is something special. The new Danie Gerber… There are excerpts in the bible that spoke of Jordaan. His coming was foretold.
7 Nov 2012, 16:23 pm
Ok fine HM do your thing
i just hope it works out this time cause it hasnt so far
goosen as our first choose fh is still the only thing u cant reali justify
i can see why you’d want tuate over jdj but i dont agree with it
i would have had jantjies on the bench as well
but goosen as talented as he may be should not be starting at test level at this moment in his career
looks like poor resource management to me
7 Nov 2012, 16:24 pm
@nama1-214: Some people were saying that JDJ is so good, that the only possible explanation for his non-selection was that Meyer must be a closet racist.
7 Nov 2012, 16:25 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-213: I completely agree mate.
JDJ is a good player, but his non-selection is NOT down to racism. That is nonsense.
7 Nov 2012, 16:25 pm
@Jeez-212:
“I hope Frans Steyn and JOrdaan combines well next year… as a pare they could be knocking hard to become the next settled center combination…”
Wouldn’t that make a mockery of the claim that JdJ is “too small.”
Jordaan ain’t no Taute, is he? (in terms of size)
7 Nov 2012, 16:25 pm
@nama1-214: Dry your panties, Nama. Your boy’s on the bench. That’s not worth stoning trucks for.
7 Nov 2012, 16:28 pm
HM has been quite the destroyer of confidences lately:
Jantjes, JDJ, Lambie, Vermeulen, Deon, Pat, Bresler, Willie, Andries – Bekker and Coetzee, Hougaard, Pienaar, Mvovo and maybe a few others. Shame, I think we’re screwed.
7 Nov 2012, 16:28 pm
@Kaizan-218: This reminds me of every young Argintinean forward being given the “new Maradonna” label. I have seen Jordaan’s pace, but I cannot see him given the space to use it at international level. I still think Serfontein is the real deal. He outshone Jordaan, Rhule and others at U20 level (although he is U19). Just a pity he did not get his chance in the Currie Cup this year.
7 Nov 2012, 16:29 pm
@Horings-216:
2006: Danie Rossouw @ 6?
That’s round about the time Jake send Luke Watson to fetch beers… We’ve come a LONG WAY,
7 Nov 2012, 16:30 pm
Mxhosa said it,
JDJ just there to keep the politicians off HM’s back … for the time being
According to HM’s utterances and selection, the nr 13 ranking
1. J. Fourie
2. JdV
3. JJ
4. Taute
5. JDJ
Hell, who needs to improve an already poor defence by selecting super rugby’s best defensive 12 (jdv), 13 (jdj) and wing (habs) combo
It more logical to select Die Groot Sterk Seun at 13, whom is not even provincial 1st choice in the position. Merit indeed
Call me Dawie, steek my met ‘n steroid en HM sal my keus
7 Nov 2012, 16:31 pm
JdJ is the best uninjured centre who can wear a Green and Gold jersey …
But I still chuckle at the naked hypocrisy of the sudden Cape clarion calls for JdJ to be included in the Boks from the same set of supporters who seemed to have forgotten that he actually existed after his breakthrough 2010 season playing at 12…
These same supporters crying racism and conspiracy against the brown man always preferred the blonde munster reject…
7 Nov 2012, 16:31 pm
@Jeraldjay-210: Especially as a goal kicker, its interesting to note that not one of the 15s in the mix is an established goal kicker….
7 Nov 2012, 16:32 pm
@shooter-224: Die olie prys wat so styg is seker ook sy skuld.
7 Nov 2012, 16:33 pm
@John1976-217:
Exactly. The effect another kak game at outside center might have on Taute, has not even come up yet. Meyer is playing a dangerous game with the boy’s future.
Maybe he, Taute, should’ve declined the opportunity and insisted that the better player be selected. Like Langes did when the cricket people selected him ahead of Andre Nel.
7 Nov 2012, 16:34 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-226: Ja, I think he only selected Rossouw to show Watson how low in the pecking order he is.
7 Nov 2012, 16:34 pm
@nama1-214: There’s a difference in questioning his motives and outright calling him a racist.
I would probably have JDJ there, because of his alleged form and mainly the confidence – Jean’s injury concern is so-so, maybe he’ll have to replace him anyway anytime in the game. Then who would you have had to come on? Taute from the bench? Not ideal either.
Calling some-one a racist is a pretty strong statement. So if Taute has a bad day, and gets replaced in the next game by JDJ… is HM then unracist-ised?
7 Nov 2012, 16:36 pm
@nama1-222:
As I said earlier, I finally realised that JdJ is only there as cover for JdV. HM does not consider him as either a first choice 13 or a long term option. He doesn’t fit his mould for the position.
7 Nov 2012, 16:36 pm
@nama1-231: Ek wil graag keo sien die dag as Meyer Spies, Fourie du Preez en Morne Steyn saam kies. Julle gaan uit freak.
7 Nov 2012, 16:37 pm
Would have had De Jongh at 13
Taute at 15
Aplon on bench instead of Mvovo
Francois Hougaard lucky.
Strongest bok team
15 Taute
14 Pietersen
13 De Villiers
12 Steyn
11 Habana
10 Goosen
9 Pienaar
8 Vermeulen
7 Burger
6 Louw
5 Bekker
4 Etzebeth
3 Du Plessis
2 Du Plessis
1 Mtawarira
16 Strauss
17 Cilliers
18 Van Der Linde
19 Willem Alberts
20 Marcell Coetzee
21 Francois Hougaard
22 Patrick Lambie
23 Juan De Jongh
24 Chilliboy Ralepelle
25 Coenie Oosthuzyen
26 Flip Van Der Merwe
27 Juandre Kruger
28 Siya Kolisi
29 Cobus Reinach
30 Elton Jantjes
31 Paul Jordaan
32 Gio Aplon
7 Nov 2012, 16:38 pm
@nama1-231: see 224.
7 Nov 2012, 16:38 pm
@nama1-231:
me prediction,
win 1 match on this tour – scotland
poor early season next year & carry on with this “”questionable”" man management
rugby bossess will start calling for results
politicians will start asking questions re “questionable” man management
mediocre season will continue … say a tad over 50% win ratio (moerse improvement for HM)
gone by end of 2013
devotees will scream it was due to evil ANCEEE
7 Nov 2012, 16:39 pm
@Kaizan-221:
Buddy, HM’s treatment of certain players of colour is despicable…
Example;
- I can understand Gurthro being called up after Coenie’s injury and McGyver’s constant brainfarts. Calling him up being based in Europe was due to injury.
- I do however not agree with Schalk Brits leapfrogging Chilliboy. Chilli, together with other local upstarts represent the current and future, his form has been desirable, and to make way for a 31yr old who wont make up the future face of Springbok ruby does not make sense. These tours provides the ultimate opportunity to settle players into the Bok way – it’s a smack in the face for players like JDJ, Jantjies, etc.
7 Nov 2012, 16:39 pm
@katman-223:
Answer the questions I posed to you, Scatman.
Stop trying to be funny. Now is not the time.
We are busy with serious issues here. Bok selection and such.
Undeserving Lion’s player being selected ahead of a WP player. If you can’t make an input I suggest you “Get the fck out of here.”
7 Nov 2012, 16:40 pm
@Horings-225: Serfontein is a great 12 and will definitely be a Springbok one day, but Jordaan is also a fantastic player. He’ll get space at test level if he plays outside Frans Steyn and a creative flyhalf, but even if he doesn’t, he’s just a really good all-round player.
He’s very quick, brilliant step, huge of defense and has a solid kicking game. He is however an inch or two too short for the South African rugby fraternity, so he will struggle to establish himself in the Boks set up.
7 Nov 2012, 16:40 pm
@David-234: Three tests to go…. and then another 300 games in S15 next year…
The door is never closed… HM said… If at first you don’t succeed,, then you try again.
7 Nov 2012, 16:41 pm
@shooter-233: Heyneke prefers size over skill.
And he is looking for a Jaque Fourie clone at 13.
That is the bottomline.
7 Nov 2012, 16:42 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-239: Schalk Brits is regarded as the best hooker in the northern hemisphere and many former players have hailed him as the best hooker in the world due to the fact he gives away fewer penalties than Bissie.
He knows the northern hemisphere conditions and to be honest is light years ahead of Chilli.
Sorry mate – you’re looking for racism, but it aint there.
7 Nov 2012, 16:43 pm
@nama1-240: I answered you way back in post 187, you blunt fcken tool. Are you going to blame me or apartheid now for the fact that you can’t read for toffee?
7 Nov 2012, 16:43 pm
@Kaizan-244: I’m with you on this.
Bismarck and S.Brits are the best hookers in the world.
7 Nov 2012, 16:43 pm
@Horings-232:
Too true – Pakslae Rossouw had a commendable Springbok career, one of my favourite players. Not a guy to shy away from the dirty work, tough as nails, and could easily slotted into 4, 5, 7 & 8. One of the really few utility players who had successes in various positions.
7 Nov 2012, 16:44 pm
@nama1-240: What a sad littlebrowncock you are. And yes, get the fck out of here.
7 Nov 2012, 16:45 pm
@Kaizan-241:
I think it is fairly safe to assume that many of the young talent the Bulls buy will become Springboks in due course.
7 Nov 2012, 16:47 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-247: Certainly, a very commendable career. Good choice of vocabulary.
He never complained if he was picked out of position, because he was rarely the first choice. He was just hungry to play and gave his all.
If only he could protect the ball better in contact, he could have become a Springbok great.
7 Nov 2012, 16:47 pm
If the boks had a B team
15 Zane Kirchner
14 Raymond Rhule
13 JJ Engelbrecht
12 Tim Whithead
11 Lwazi Mvovo
10 Morne Steyn
9 Jano Vernaak
8 Ryan Kankowski
7 Dewaldt Potgieter
6 Heinrich Brussouw
5 Franco Van Der Merwe
4 Jean Deysel
3 Francois Malherbe
2 Deon Fourie
1 JC Janse Van Rensburg
16 Scarra Ntubeni
17 Werner Kruger
18 Dean Greyling
19 Anton Bresler
20 Pierre Spies
21 Sarel Pretorius
22 Peter Grant
23 Bjorn Basson
24 Bandise Maku
25 Steven Kitshoff
26 Rynhardt Elstadt
27 Keegan Daniel
28 Nic Groom
29 Louis Fouche
30 Lionel Mapoe
31 Robert Ebersohn
32 Louis Ludik
still seriously strong.
Shows the great depth in South Afrian rugby.
7 Nov 2012, 16:48 pm
@Kaizan-244: How ironic will it be if Heyneke Meyer is the reason for two old Province boys to establish themselves for the first time after playing for WP. Surely his hatred towards WP is so deep that he will not even select a player with a WP history.
Even more ironic: The one is a fetcher and the other too small.
7 Nov 2012, 16:49 pm
@Kaizan-244:
@willievz-246:
On Bissie I can agree – head and shoulders the leading no.2 both south and north of the equator.
But it’s poor contingency planning from HM elevating Brits ahead of Chilli IMO. I don’t foresee Brits featuring again in 2013 (given a successful rehabilitation from Bissie). And I doubt he’ll swop pounds for rands, and be a tackle-bag holding, 3rd in the pecking order hooker behing Bissie and Strauss. For those reasons, I’d rather develop and expose Chilli further.
7 Nov 2012, 16:50 pm
@capetown-227:
“According to HM’s utterances and selection, the nr 13 ranking
1. J. Fourie
2. JdV”
Hellsteeth thats no different to the ranking of AC and 90% of WP supporters…
WTF you in a huff about…?
7 Nov 2012, 16:50 pm
@Rhys7-251: Louis Fouche and Deysel at 4 contradicts your conclusion. If they are anywhere near a Bok team then it shows a lack of depth.
7 Nov 2012, 16:50 pm
Pot Blou Gevaar…
You made several excellent posts this afternoon… reasoned, rational and not one iota of bias…
Respect…
7 Nov 2012, 16:51 pm
@shooter-233:
I don’t think I’ve called him a racist.
I did say that “imo the only plausible reason for Jantjies and JdJ not being selected is because Meyer believes in a MAXIMUM quota for players of colour. That maximum being THREE.”
This is the gist of what I’ve been posting. At times I had to make reference to colour to better make my point. I people construed this as me calling HM a racist, then I can’t help it.
@David-234:
David, we’ve been through this…this whole season. Trying to look for some logic behind some of Meyer’s decisions. Most of our “logical conclusions” were shown to be wrong.
My logical conclusion is that Meyer has a MAXIMUM quota of three P’OC in his run on team. I come to that conclusion after studying the teams he has selected since JPP’s injury against England.
7 Nov 2012, 16:51 pm
@willievz-250:
Agreed
7 Nov 2012, 16:52 pm
@Horings-252:
Certainly, it is poor player management. Jeralday and I posted about this earlier.
I think Heyneke does not rate Chilli.
7 Nov 2012, 16:52 pm
@Heavens Game-254: And then he puts JJ 3rd, although he has not featured apart from a couple of minutes in Capetown. Surely Taute and JdJ is ahead of JJ.
7 Nov 2012, 16:52 pm
Nice chatting peeps. Gotta go.
Until next time…
7 Nov 2012, 16:54 pm
@capetown-238:
Don’t be surprise if we only come away with a draw against the Scots.
Yeah, they’ll blame outside forces for HM’s demise if he is kicked out. He was quite clever insisting on a 4 year contract.
7 Nov 2012, 16:54 pm
@ufo-256:
Thanks bro..
7 Nov 2012, 16:54 pm
Personally I can’t see why Goosen should be HM’s first choice flyhalf. Lambie should be 1st choice, with Goosen as his young understudy, being brought in slowly as a sub in the second half.
7 Nov 2012, 16:55 pm
@nama1-257: So, wrt “players of colour”, you find it quite alright to use the word “quota”?
Wonder if Zane, JPP, Beast appreciate being part of a “quota” as you put it…
Makes you wonder who is actually racist here…
7 Nov 2012, 16:55 pm
I never comment on this site, but read (the comments mostly) for insights..just have to say WTF??
No Juan de Jongh? He is the best centre we have available! And Steyn over Jantjies?
Seems like Meyer has not so hidden agendas.
7 Nov 2012, 16:55 pm
I would far rather have JDJ in the team than JDV….without a doubt…
7 Nov 2012, 16:56 pm
Its worrying that HM rates Taute as the long term answer at 15…
It just emphasizes the big problem at establishing a settled center combination…
It shows he has no confidence in JdJ and dont consider JDV as a longterm answer at 13 either… The only sure selection is FS at 12 and HM would pick him ahead of his captain…
So when Taute moves to 15 (when Fransie comes back) JDV will go back to 13…
In that case the ranking for 12 is:
1. Frans Steyn
2. JDV (surely not longterm)
3. ??
At 13:
1. Stop gap JDV at the mo…
2. ?? Its currently clear that its not JdJ
3.???
HM sang the praises of JJ Engelbrecht and Sadie, but after not convincing at super rugby level, they surely cant be considered anymore…
All these question marks could be filled with small and potentially great players, but considering HMs ideology regarding size its not likely to see a settled center combination with the likes of JdJ or even Jordaan. The only outside chance is to convert JJP to 13…
Depth at 12 is even more worrying. JDV has chronicle rugby fatigue that can only be cured by retirement and FS wont stay injury free…
7 Nov 2012, 16:57 pm
@willievz-259: No I would say it contradicts most believes people had about Meyer from the start. “He does not believe in fetchers” (Wikus van Heerden was the first out and out fetcher for the Boks). “He does not pick small players” (Ettienne Botha scored a record number of tries at centre with Meyer at coach).
Meyer’s non selection of JdJ is simply because he does not rate him. He does not create play for others and is not as effective as Botha to score tries himself.
7 Nov 2012, 16:57 pm
@Kaizan-165: a 13 with a kicking game, WTF?
7 Nov 2012, 16:58 pm
@Rhys7-251: Your selectorial abilities are clearly on a par with Heyneke Meyer…
7 Nov 2012, 16:58 pm
ja well no fine…..
dissapointing….
M Steyn still in the 22….
enough to give me heartburn…
7 Nov 2012, 17:00 pm
@willievz-243: you think?
Taute has plenty skills. Ok – so he is big, is it his fault the next guy is small?
What happened to coaches prerogative. Maybe HM sees him as a player who could become a great 13. He is already a great rugby player.
7 Nov 2012, 17:01 pm
@Horings-260:
@Heavens Game-254:
have no issue with Fourie and JdV above JDJ
do have great issue with JJ and Taute above JDJ
Horings, lets not forget, JJ got selected ahead of JDJ at the start of the season
7 Nov 2012, 17:01 pm
@Jeez-268: JPP is actually the best potential permanent conversion to 13…
At 13, he’s much better and has more potential than any 13 in SA… Problem is, he is probably the best wing on the planet…
7 Nov 2012, 17:01 pm
I am surprised Meyer did not pick Basson for the tour as I am sure he mentioned Basson a few times when he referred to injured players during the RC.
7 Nov 2012, 17:02 pm
@nama1-240: Suddenly the katman got your tongue? Poepol.
7 Nov 2012, 17:03 pm
@capetown-274: JJ is fit, so why did Meyer pick JdJ for this tour when JJ is ahead of him?
7 Nov 2012, 17:03 pm
@Horings-235:
Hahahaha…..
If they’re on form and the best at that stage, good on them.
@Pot Blou Gevaar-239:
Now you see, if that was me saying that I would be accused of calling HM a racist.
You are not calling him a racist, I believe.
Good post btw.
@Heavens Game-265:
Hahaha…
Stupid!!!
7 Nov 2012, 17:04 pm
@capetown-274: And that is a problem… Preferring JdV above JdJ… Other than his supposed leadership, missing and apparently not needed for WP to gain their 1st proper trophy in more than a decade, why do you prefer JdV above JdJ?
Is it his blonde hair… or physique… or relatively large stature?
7 Nov 2012, 17:04 pm
@Transformation-270: Maybe you can get some quotes from your database of Meyer quotes to get one where Meyer complains about injuries and mentions Basson.
7 Nov 2012, 17:05 pm
@Transformation-270:
The same kicking game (and handling skills that initially turned over the ball) who did not clear the line and led to the AB’s try
coaches perogative, kicking game, handling skills (despite tautes mandatory 4 knock ons per game), duck and weeze
7 Nov 2012, 17:06 pm
@Horings-269: “He does not create play for others and is not as effective as Botha to score tries himself.”
why can’t meyer COACH jdj to do all these things like he suggested with MSteyn and he is trying to do with Taute?
in your mind can Taute do all this stuff, how is his defence?
Why is Taute being allowed to LEARN a position at Bok Level that he doesn’t even have FIVE caps at Super rugby in?
7 Nov 2012, 17:07 pm
@shooter-273: saying that. he did say he sees him as 15
7 Nov 2012, 17:08 pm
@Transformation-283: Because Meyer believes Taute is potentially more equipped to handle the pressures of international rugby. He will rather COACH Taute to be a better player than JdJ can ever be.
7 Nov 2012, 17:12 pm
@katman-248:
“What a sad littlebrowncock you are.”
Oh, did you put it in there just for me? Do you want me to accuse you of being a racist? Do you feel left out?
Don’t worry.
7 Nov 2012, 17:13 pm
@Horings-269:
If that is the case, why does he constantly select him for the Bok squad?
@katman-277:
You have my tongue? Give it back…right now!!!
Answer the questions I posed to you.
@Horings-278:
Window dressing
7 Nov 2012, 17:14 pm
@Heavens Game-275:
Yep the lack of quality 13′s is a big problem…time to look at the youngsters and start to develop some great 13s… JJP adds great value at wing, why move him this late in his career… and 12s for that matter! Its a pity all the promising young centers have with the bulls… I wouldnt mind if they could be developed under the guidance of a great kiwi coach… Why dont SA rugby franchises invest in some kiwi backline coaches? Just for 5 years to get the backline training camps up to standard….?
7 Nov 2012, 17:15 pm
@grant10-267: Good solution
7 Nov 2012, 17:16 pm
- If Taute is seen as the long term option at 15 why not just play him there now and see what he can offer there.
- De Jongh and JP in the centres would be my first choice combo too.
- Hougaard hasn’t been too good this year, but just like Habana and JP he has the X-Factor so hopefully he finds some form.
Not a bad team , hopefully Lambie can cement his place in the team with a good game as I don’t wanna see Morne’ Steyn get another chance anytime soon.
Morne’ Styeyn should have had a break now , bounce back in Super Rugby and make the squad BASED ON FORM.
7 Nov 2012, 17:20 pm
@Horings-285:
“Taute is potentially more equipped to handle the pressures of international rugby.”
Well, he showed us thus far that he is way more equipped…NOT.
7 Nov 2012, 17:21 pm
Jaco will be free from all criticism next season
7 Nov 2012, 17:22 pm
Juan on the bench AGAIN? Did Heyneke not watch the Currie Cup final? That try was magical.
7 Nov 2012, 17:24 pm
@wp_boytjie-290:
That will be next year when Habana is back. (Taute to FB)
Then he can still have his 3 darker players on the park when he drops Kirchner.
7 Nov 2012, 17:27 pm
@Horings-269:
Wikus was actually a 7, who Jake converted to 6.
7 Nov 2012, 17:27 pm
@nama1-279:
Thanks buddy..
7 Nov 2012, 17:28 pm
@ryecatcher-292:
Not when he fails to kick the ball out or kicks it out directly after it had been taken back into the 22… and the opposition score a try from that possession.
7 Nov 2012, 17:40 pm
@nama1-297: Was trying to be ironic.Obviously unsuccessfully.
7 Nov 2012, 17:41 pm
@nama1-297: WP should only select JT if he in the pre-season shows that he has lowered his error rate otherwise they have capable players to perform in that position. In other words he must earn his starting berth otherwise they must bench him.
7 Nov 2012, 17:50 pm
@John1976-299:
Jip. I agree.
Joe and Aplon served us well at FB the last couple of years. Taute has to earn his place if he wants to start.
7 Nov 2012, 17:53 pm
HM does note rate JdJ, might be that he’s too small? he’s not mentally strong enough? he’s not suited to the gameplan? or as some believe, he’s racist?
Whatever the reason, it’s clear he does not believe that he’s good enough to start… He’d rather play JJ, a guy who wasn’t good enough to play wing for WP, and Taute a 21 year fullback with only a handful CC games at centre before he will consider him.
HM is on record saying he would’ve loved to give Taute a run at fullback on this tour, but because he believed we do not sufficient quality at outside centre, Taute will continue at 13.
Get over it and support the team! It’s been picked it ain’t gonna change.
7 Nov 2012, 17:57 pm
@mxhosa-301:
Does not mean that you can’t express how you feel about it.
Will still support the Boks for the 80 minutes on Saturday. In the mean time, I give myself permission to criticize HM for his kak selections.
7 Nov 2012, 18:01 pm
@David-295:
It was HM who coverted Wikus. Jake picked him on the strength of his performances in the 2007 super 14.
7 Nov 2012, 18:02 pm
@nama1-302: . He has every right to make his selections the way he sees fit, but should also take responsibility when it bombs. His excuses about inexperience and the like should not be tolerated IMO.
7 Nov 2012, 18:35 pm
@John1976-304: How long has HM been the national coach?.Of course he will make mistakes and has aready
done so.I think that barring injury his current selections are spot on.
Except that I would swop JDV with JDJJ is as good as people are saying.
7 Nov 2012, 18:35 pm
An ‘if” missing
7 Nov 2012, 18:37 pm
@shooter-273: For a moment there I thought you were my dad.
My dad is a massive Taute fan (13 or 15, mind you), and does not rate De Jongh.
He uses a similar argument than the one you used – he states that Taute can become a Bok great, and that De Jongh has a ceiling, if you take into account future potential. In fact, he does not even rate De Jongh as a Bok.
Now I do listen to my dad when he talks about rugby – he knows his onions. And just between you and me, he has convinced me that Taute’s best position, in the long term, is at 13.
However, at the moment, I am strongly against Taute been anywhere close to the Bok jersey, be it at 13 or 15. I don’t rate him, at current. He is too rough a diamond.
At the moment, the best player to play 13 for the Boks is De Jongh. (I would, however, pick him at 12, but that is a different argument for another time).
What I’m trying to get across is that we should stop picking players based on potential of what they might become. That is focusing on the RWC again. Pick the best available players – reward them for their excellence, and win every test.
When you play a 21-year old 15 out of position at the highest level, where he has struggled to date but you see potential for him there, it is an insult to other players who fit the bill better at current.
7 Nov 2012, 18:50 pm
Some revealing comments here
7 Nov 2012, 18:51 pm
eish people are upset!
i see nama wailing about black representation endlessly.
he would have made a good broeder lmao!
watch taute have a blinder and shove it to all you whiners.
oh, yebo yes, super pat!
7 Nov 2012, 18:55 pm
@Dawn-308: i agree hello Dawn.
7 Nov 2012, 18:57 pm
Things that will never happen #1 – History replacing Math as the most important subject at school.
#2 – every agreeing on a Bok team selected – ever.
7 Nov 2012, 18:57 pm
Taute is picked ahead of JdJ as he has displayed more MENTAL TOUGHNESS for HM
7 Nov 2012, 18:57 pm
personally i think JdJ is a fine player.
but the hype machine that is on overdrive here reminds me of the hype about meyer bosman after that cc win vs the bulls.
how quickly you all forget that JdV and JdJ formed the most sterile center combo in south african rugby over the last few seasons.
if anything, i would like to see JdJ at 12, not 13.
7 Nov 2012, 18:58 pm
every1
7 Nov 2012, 18:59 pm
a bit of provincial bias stirred with a bit of racial bias makes a potent brew it seems.
7 Nov 2012, 19:00 pm
I really wonder how the players feel about playing for HM?
He’s told us he has honest conversations with them so 1 can only imagine the long list of things he’s given JdJ, Jantjies, Lambie and Keegan to work on.
Taute, JJ, MS and Potgieter I’m sure he just gave them a thumbs up. That’s it
7 Nov 2012, 19:02 pm
@PissAnt-314: haha, true PA true.
the break from the angry mob around here has really made it seem like stepping onto an alien planet full of angry faced bowling balls with tiny legs and arms all jumping up and down screaming to be heard.
in short, i missed you guys
7 Nov 2012, 19:02 pm
Im not a JDJ fan and definitely not a stormer but I would have had no problem with him starting at 13.In fact,our backline looks a bit sterile and JDJ would have added a bit more oomph!
7 Nov 2012, 19:02 pm
@The Rangerman-317:
I haven’t been around much either, but nothing has changed that’s for sure.
7 Nov 2012, 19:03 pm
I wonder how long it’ll take before the vociferous voices on this site against HM’s perceived bias away from certain type of players (POC) reaches the mainstream ?
Hell even I wanna start an FB page to get rid of him
7 Nov 2012, 19:04 pm
Why is Hougaard a starting player for the Boks?
Did no 1 see his last performance in a Bulls jersey in Currie Cup?
7 Nov 2012, 19:04 pm
@The Rangerman-317:
In fact, never thought this would happen, but News24 comments are making more sense than the **** I read on here in the last 6 months.
7 Nov 2012, 19:05 pm
Juan de Jonge at 13 and Taute at 15 would have been better options.
HM really is making life hard for himself by not selecting his best available 15!
Best of luck Bokke, see you at the Aviva!
7 Nov 2012, 19:05 pm
Still at least a laugh a minute when in the mood though.
7 Nov 2012, 19:09 pm
@PissAnt-324: certainly is amusing but with the whittling down of sharks fans it seems the brain quotient is diminishing daily.
what i find amusing is the absolute certainty with which many posters state their views.
7 Nov 2012, 19:10 pm
@Rangerman-313:
JdV and JdJ have only had an extended run this season, as a combo. In fact the Stormers have had 3 different centre combinations in the last 3 seasons… JdJ and JF in 2010, JdV and JF in 2011, JdV and JdJ in 2012.
7 Nov 2012, 19:14 pm
Joh!
Some very unhappy bunnies.
7 Nov 2012, 19:18 pm
@Jaybok-323:
This is the best available VX, according to HM.
7 Nov 2012, 19:18 pm
Let me throw a random question in here just to piss everyone off.
Can any person highlight a specific game, or even a moment in which Zane Kirchner has been absolutely, disgracefully **** in 2012?
7 Nov 2012, 19:20 pm
@The Rangerman-325:
I am currently so chilled its not even funny. Loving writing down opinions and thoughts if only important to me – still loving it.
7 Nov 2012, 19:23 pm
@PissAnt-330: me too bud, life is good.
@mxhosa-326: whats your point, they couldnt find their way to the tryline bud.
they were in fact, more “bulls” than the bulls.
tekkel tekkel tekkel.
yawn.
7 Nov 2012, 19:25 pm
@The Rangerman-325: the guppys threw their toys during the RC when keegan cullen got dropped unceremoniously
now the stormers are feeling the wrath of meyer.
7 Nov 2012, 19:27 pm
@PissAnt-329:
He should have backed himself against the AB’s in Dunedin and not passed to Habana with the try line 10 metres away.
I think this happened 5 mins into the game.
7 Nov 2012, 19:32 pm
@Transformation-332: who are the guppy’s?
are you generalising?
nice.
so i can say the black bok fans are having a hissy that JdJ isnt starting?
7 Nov 2012, 19:33 pm
@Transformation-332:
I think it’s the other way around.
Nama is making a little blue voodoo doll as we speak.
If Heyneke chokes in his walkie talkie the we’ll all know why.
7 Nov 2012, 19:36 pm
SA Unavailable XV:
15.
14.
13. J Fourie
12. F Steyn
11. B Habana
10. J Goosen
9. F du Preez
8. S Burger/Kankowski/Spies
7. J Smith
6. H Brossouw
5. A Bekker
4. B Botha/G Mostert
3. C Oostehuisen
2. B du Plesis
1. G Steenkamp
Throw in some promising youngsters:
15. A Coetsee/L Ludik
14. JJ Englebregt
13. P Jordaan
12. J Serfontein
11.
10.
9. J Reinach/P van Zyl
8.
7. P Steph du Toit
6. S Kolisi
5. P Wilimse
4. R Botha
3. M vd Merwe/ F Melherbe
2.
1. S Kitshoff
Now that’s a lot of experience and talent that will probably be available next year that can be added to the current squad.
15. Zane Kirchner
14. JP Pietersen/Lionel Mapoe/Raymond Rhule
13. Jaco Taute/Juan de Jongh
12. Jean de Villiers
11. Francois Hougaard/Lwazi Mvovo
10. Pat Lambie/Morne Steyn/Elton Jantjies
9. Ruan Pienaar/Jano Vermaak
8. Duane Vermuelen
7. Willem Alberts/Marcell Coetzee
6. Francois Louw
5. Juandre Kruger/Franco van der Merwe
4. Eben Etzebeth/Flip van der Merwe
3. Jannie du Plessis/Pat Cilliers
2. Adriaan Strauss/Schalk Brits/Chiliboy Ralepelle
1. Beast Mtawarira/CJ van der Linde
Here is my pecking order in 2013 (subject to availability):
15. Jaco Taute/A Coetsee/L Ludik/Zane Kirchner/Gio Aplon
14. JP Pietersen/Lionel Mapoe/Raymond Rhule
13. J Fourie/P Jordaan/Juan de Jongh/JJ Englebregt
12. F Steyn/J Serfonteyn/Jean de Villiers
11. B Habana/Lwazi Mvovo
10. J Goosen/Pat Lambie/Elton Jantjies/Morne Steyn
9. F du Preez/Ruan Pienaar/Francois Hougaard/P van Zyl/J Reinach/Jano Vermaak
8. S Burger/R Kankowski/Duane Vermuelen/A Botha/P Spies
7. P Steph du Toit/J Smith/Willem Alberts/Marcell Coetzee/S Kolisi
6. Francois Louw/H Brossouw
5. A Bekker/Juandre Kruger/Franco van der Merwe/P Wilimse
4. Eben Etzebeth/Flip van der Merwe/R Botha/G Mostert/B Botha
3. Jannie du Plessis/C Oostehuisen/M vd Merwe/F Melherbe/Pat Cilliers
2. B du Plesis/Adriaan Strauss/Schalk Brits/Chiliboy Ralepelle
1. G Steenkamp/Beast Mtawarira/S Kitshoff/CJ van der Linde
We have depth in most positions except 6/11/14/15
7 Nov 2012, 19:38 pm
its all a storm in a teacup really imo.
JdJ will get gametime and like taute, he better perform or there will be red faces all round.
7 Nov 2012, 19:41 pm
@PissAnt-329:
I’d say he’s the best SA fullback when it comes to fielding kicks. You hardly ever see him drop an up n under and he is usually strong enough to stay on his feet , take the contact and retain possession for his side.
7 Nov 2012, 19:43 pm
@Rangerman-331:
“how quickly you all forget that JdV and JdJ formed one of the most sterile center combo in south african rugby over the last few seasons”
7 Nov 2012, 19:47 pm
@The Rangerman-337:
Looking forward to seeing Lambie play on Saturday.
CC games and test matches are two completely different animals but I think his got the temperament to make the position his own.
7 Nov 2012, 19:55 pm
@The Rangerman-337:
If you read my earlier comment, you’d see that I believe HM sees JdJ as providing 12 cover for JdV until FS returns. I don’t think he’s in the 13 frame at all.
7 Nov 2012, 19:58 pm
paul o connell out
7 Nov 2012, 20:18 pm
@The Rangerman-309: hello pal.good to see you here.
7 Nov 2012, 20:22 pm
@PissAnt-329: absolutely not
7 Nov 2012, 20:27 pm
as nama said….HM is polarising SA fans…very dissapointing imo
Select derserving black players: Mantashe
——————————————————————————–
07 November 2012, 19:56
Black players should be selected for the Springboks if they are good enough to play at international level, ANC secretary-general Gwede Mantashe said on Wednesday.
“The situation is the coaches select the basic minimum black players in the team and relax thereafter and overlook good players,” Mantashe said.
“Why do we wait until there are no other players? The attitude is that coaches think this is a white sport and they meet the basic amount of players.”
Mantashe, an ardent rugby supporter, said it seemed like Springbok coach Heyneke Meyer was reluctant to select black players that deserved a place in the side.
“My view is that the new coach is not keen on putting black players in the team, even those that have proven they are the best.”
He said there were enough talented black players that Meyer could select on merit alone, and there was something wrong if players such as talented flyhalf Elton Jantjies were relegated to the bench.
Sharks wing Mwazi Mvovo and Stormers flanker Siya Kolisi also deserved a spot in the team, according to Mantashe.
Jantjies made his debut for the Springboks in their Rugby Championship match against Australia in Pretoria in October.
The young pivot had been part of the national set-up since 2010 but had to wait almost three years to get a run in the green-and-gold.
He was given an extended run against New Zealand at FNB Stadium, in their final match of this season’s southern hemisphere competition, after he replaced first-choice flyhalf Johan Goosen early in the match.
Jantjies was nevertheless overlooked for this weekend’s clash against Ireland for the first match of their end-of-year tour.
In-form Sharks player Pat Lambie will now wear the number 10 jersey while Morne Steyn was selected on the bench.
Mantashe said he believed Meyer had too much confidence in Steyn, with talented youngsters waiting in the wings.
Meyer could also do better by selecting younger players to take his team forward to the 2015 Rugby World Cup in England.
Western Province coach Allister Coetzee demonstrated what could be achieved, according to Mantashe, when faith was placed in younger players.
“Look at the Western Province team that won the Currie Cup,” he said.
“He (Coetzee) showed faith and confidence in young players and they delivered. The national coach must do the same.”
Meyer would help the country if he gave these players an opportunity to play for the Springboks
7 Nov 2012, 20:38 pm
HM must be living in some sort of cuckooland…..He seems oblivious to the realities of SA…..
He is setting himself up for a tremendous fall……by snubbing players like JDJ , Kolisi, Aplon , to name but 3, and playing players like JJ Engelbrecht, Taute , J Potgieter, etc…..he is either extremely dof or even worse simply and blatantly showing the middle finger to the real need to transform.
Bloody foolish…..
Kudos to him for trying to sort out the Mujati situation, but it is always 1 step forward 2 steps back with this oke…
7 Nov 2012, 20:44 pm
@grant10-345: Knew it wouldn’t take too long. The tip of the iceberg I tell.
Meyer’s dug his own grave!
7 Nov 2012, 20:46 pm
The reality is we could easily have a truly representative SA Team based on merit…opportunities missed HM…
Try this in 2013…
15 Kirchner
14 JPP
13 JDJ
12 F Steyn
11 habana
10 Jantjes
9 Pienaar
8 Vermeulen
7 Alberts
6 Flo
5 Bekker
4 eysebeth
3 Mujati [ sort the s hit out man ]
2 Bissy
1 beast
16 Guthro
17 kolisi
18 chilliboy
19 jannie dup
20 aplon
21 lambie
22 Rhule….
All merit based….and truly representative.
Use this in June and see how the boys do….
7 Nov 2012, 20:52 pm
WTF !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! A coach doesn’t choose POC then gets called a racist…..that is fecking astounding.
Every one has always known his preference is larger players, just cos JdJ has had a couple of good games does not make him a rock star, Taute (sp) might not be better than him, but just maybe the coach see’s more potential in him. Who knows.
This race card cr*p in this country is getting out of control and down right embarrassing. Politicians now butting in as well. We are a bl00dy laughing stock. Suck it up !!! He is coach, he is not playing to try lose. He might be making a wrong/right choice, but one thing is for sure, he is a professional and would not have a personal agenda.
7 Nov 2012, 21:02 pm
@grant10-348: Not too bad,although I would replace Alberts with Kolisi or Burger in the run on team.Alberts has been exposed as too one-dimensional this season.He tends to disappear in games far too often.
7 Nov 2012, 21:02 pm
@Treehugger-349:with all due respect, this is not because of 1 selection but HM’s consistent lack of faith in POC.
Its his prerogative since he’s the coach to select whomever he wants that he believes will allow him to win. BUT then…we must be able to call him out when he consistently doesn’t give a consistent group the same chances he gives others!
7 Nov 2012, 21:07 pm
@grant10-345: WP should be used as the blueprint for transformation and development of young players in this country.Still remember the lily white Sharks teams of last year which was quite embarrassing to SARU.
7 Nov 2012, 21:07 pm
@grant10-348: Ag buy yourself a dry pantie man.
Mujati is neither an SA citizen, nor a resident – why the fark should he be eligible?
7 Nov 2012, 21:08 pm
@The Rangerman-334: bwahahaha look at you being precious
“generalising”
7 Nov 2012, 21:09 pm
@wnbb-352: Kinda like the Kings team of this year hey?
7 Nov 2012, 21:16 pm
HM will be under scrutiny now….he has dug a deep hole for himself….I bet he wont handle the heat for long….he will fold…..and to be honset the way he has treated some players I reckon there may be a collective sigh of relief….
7 Nov 2012, 21:17 pm
The USA elections should be a real eye-opener for SA society.We had one party that absolutely believed that the white male section of society would get them over the line .How wrong were they!History will judge the Republicans harshly from today onwards.In their total disregard or contemp for minorities,the youth and poor they absolute committed political Hari Kiri.Heyneke hanging on to his deep centred beliefs that the white SA male is the far superior specimen on a rugby field will also be his downfall on the rugby field.We should embrace diversity and stop excluding people based on deep rooted prejudices.
7 Nov 2012, 21:19 pm
@wnbb-350:
Agreed , Alberts would be best off the bench imo , running at the tired legs in the last 25-30min as he was doing on last year’s Europe tour. Higgenbotham also came on for the Aussies against us and made a impact. I like the idea of a big ball carrier for the last 20 – 25min.
7 Nov 2012, 21:21 pm
@grant10-348:
Awesome team. But also agree with wnbb on Kolisi as starter. Burger on bench. He is from now on an impact player and will be phenomenal.
7 Nov 2012, 21:23 pm
@wnbb-357: Agree with your last sentence.Why is every conversation with you about colour.?
7 Nov 2012, 21:32 pm
@ryecatcher-360: Colour or the politically correct word,race,will always be a factor or talking point on SA society.The selection of today’s Bok team clearly created huge consternation in SA society today,from politicians to bloggers on media forums.The non-selection of form black players like Mvovo and Juan created that.To be brutally honest,Meyer basically shot himself in both feet when he selected lesser players in Taute and Hougaard.
7 Nov 2012, 21:33 pm
It’s easy to see where the keo yoofleeg get their “if you don’t do as I say you’re a racist” drivel from. Just look at Zuma’s Nkandlagate spin doctor, the slimy Bigmac Maharaj. If you ask questions and demand to see documentation, it can only be because you’re a racist. Forget that the questions might be pertinent and pressing. We’ll just go with the “you’re a racist” approach, thangewverymuch.
Ditto for little poepols like Nama here. If the coach doesn’t pick his coloured dream team, he’s racistkont.
It’s tired, people. And it doesn’t stick in the long run. And by using it so often in such a short space of time, you’ve completely worn it out. So what the fck are you going to use next?
7 Nov 2012, 21:33 pm
@wnbb-361: in SA society
7 Nov 2012, 21:39 pm
Nama is a well-respected contributor to this forum.Calling people names just because you can’t come up with a better argument doesn’t lend itself to healthy debate.Rather take a timeout and return later with an improved civilised response.Just saying.
7 Nov 2012, 21:40 pm
@papaown-351:
Good point. It’s not so much the fact that Meyer isn’t selecting a player of colour but the fact that he is inconsistent in his selections, favouring less experienced and arguably less talented white players (JJ, Potgieter) over black counterparts (JDJ, Kolisi for example).
Why on earth Steyn over Jantjies?
Taute is a great player but has proven nothing at 13. JDJ has performed at the highest levels (CC, S15, Boks – 2 tries on debut) and brings a different dimension than the same old bash into the opposition kak, at least he can step (and dance)
It just doesn’t add up and stinks to high heavens. So call a spade a spade.
7 Nov 2012, 21:43 pm
I don’t agree on the politics guys and it’s not a topic I enjoy but gonna throw my 10c in the mix tonight.
There are so many more players of color today that have great potential than there were 5- 10 years ago. Don’t you guys remember the days you had a player of color on the wing and that was it. Well all 3 Top SA Rugby franchises now have forwards of color that are there on merit like Chilliboy , Scarra , Kolisi , The Beast.
Rather give me the talents of today than Owen Nkumane , Solly Tybilika (RIP no disrespect) , Shimange , Khaya Malotona.
Bottom line , players of color today are there on merit. Can’t think of a current Super Rugby player of color that I could call a “quota”.
Things are moving in the right direction.
7 Nov 2012, 21:46 pm
@papaown-351: It is not a skin colour thing.
It is a size thing.
7 Nov 2012, 21:48 pm
@grant10-345:That’s exactly what I warned about last week. Rugby people must get it right before the politicians start to dictate to them.
@katman-362:
Blah, blah, blah…
I saw a Pot Blou Gevaar expressing exactly the same kind of sentiments that I did, Nobody said that he was calling HM a racist. Why do you assume I did?
Am I not allowed to criticise the white coach or what?
7 Nov 2012, 21:48 pm
@katman-362: Hi Katman.After last night
a blues quiz.
SOUTHERN TREES BEAR A STRANGE FRUIT
BLOOD ON THE LEAVES AND BLOOD AT THE ROOT
BLACK BODIES SWINGING IN THE SOUTHERN TREES
STRANGE FRUIT HANGING FROM THE POPLAR TREES
PASTORAL SCENE OF THE GALLANT SOUTH
THE BULGING EYES AND THE TWISTED MOUTH
SCENT OF MAGNOLIAS,SWEET AND FRESH
THEN THE SUDDEN SMELL OF BURNING FLESH
HE RE IS FRUIT FOR THE CROWS TO PLUCK
FOR THE RAIN TO GATHER AND THE WIND TO SUCK
FOR THE SUN TO ROT AND THEE TREES TO DROP
HERE IS A ST RANGE AND BITTER CROP.
QUIZ.WHICH SINGER MADE THIS FAMOUS.GREATEST BLUES SINGER OF
ALL TIME?
TITLE?
WRITER?COME ON SKOP.ONE OF THE TRIBE A JEWISH TEACHER IN N.Y.
CONTEXT/
7 Nov 2012, 21:49 pm
@wnbb-357: Think you’re right.
7 Nov 2012, 21:49 pm
@bok-storm-365: Quite correct.Bloggers unhappiness at the non-selection of form players like Juan etc etc are jumped on by rabble rousers as one of calling Meyer a racist etc etc which certainly wasn’t the case.
7 Nov 2012, 21:52 pm
@wnbb-364:
Thanks WNBB.
I guess Katman’s true colours are coming to the fore. Not much of a joker if you scratch through the thin coat of varnish, I guess.
7 Nov 2012, 21:55 pm
@nama1-372: Crazy,mate.In any case,got to run.Time to catch up on a team that actually believed in the development of young players.
7 Nov 2012, 21:56 pm
@wnbb-361: tKS FOR YOUR SWIFT ANSWER.wILL PONDER BEFORE REPLYING.JUST TO SAY THAT I THOUGHT
THAT AFTER MORE THAN 20 YEARS,WE WOULD HAVE EXHAUSTED
THIS NARRATIVE.IF NOT THEN WHEN?ANOTHER 20,30,40YEARS
7 Nov 2012, 21:57 pm
??? MISSING
7 Nov 2012, 21:59 pm
@nama1-368: Look Nama it just an effort on their part to silence you, I think the points you are raising are making those who respond so harshly a bit uncomfortable, I think. The “chip on the shoulder” chirp has now been drop since it does not deter you from given your opinion, so guest the uncomfortable bunch had to up the ante.
7 Nov 2012, 22:02 pm
@willievz-367:
A size thing?
That’s just as daft. When will we get over the fact you don’t need bigger players in all positions to beat the opposition? Skill levels are way more important. We should learn from the Oz and ABs players like Giteau in his prime, Carter, Conrad Smith, O Connor, Beale, Dagg etc not the biggest guys around but agile and skillful.
You don’t need to bash your opposite number farking neanderthals! You just need to get past them and smaller, more agile players are able to do this and at least add some variety FFS.
This is one of the reasons we will continue to lag behind ABs and Oz.
7 Nov 2012, 22:05 pm
I think Meyer is trying to compensate for something by choosing BIG players.
7 Nov 2012, 22:06 pm
@369…..is it Billy Holiday
7 Nov 2012, 22:06 pm
@bok-storm-377:
Don’t shoot the messenger. I agree with all the points you raised.
But, HM has stated, and on more than one occasion, that JDJ and Aplon in particular are too small for test rugby.
7 Nov 2012, 22:11 pm
@willievz-380: Willie, than he should not select them at all. He is a weakling, for choosing JdJ, if that is his belief and therefore not fit to be the coach.
7 Nov 2012, 22:11 pm
@willievz-380:
Apologies, the rant wasn’t direct at you personally, just the general mindset of SA coaches and large number of fans.
7 Nov 2012, 22:14 pm
I’m rooting for Ireland to fck this moron up.. I had enough of his garbage
pity is the players will carry the brunt of this moron’s fck ups while it is he alone who should walk the bloody plank he is setting for others.. the stupid self ingratiated punk..
7 Nov 2012, 22:15 pm
@John1976-381:
I think HM seems very confused on what he really wants.
Fooled a few with his so called invincible game plan yet his pickings of players seems oddball if you ask me.
7 Nov 2012, 22:15 pm
HM has just made his life very uncomfortable….He really has been extremely shortsighted….since the 1 st 40 or 45 man squad already.
7 Nov 2012, 22:16 pm
@John1976-381: Well, initially he selected neither JDJ nor Aplon for the English series, before drafting in the latter as 3rd choice fullback for the dead rubber test.
I honestly believe he picked them ever since due to political pressure.
That is my personal belief, and because it cannot be established as fact, this needs to be read as a normative statement.
By the way – Elton Jantjies – how do you explain his sudden departure from the match 23?
7 Nov 2012, 22:17 pm
@bok-storm-382: No worries bud
7 Nov 2012, 22:19 pm
@Hurricane-384: He is clueless when it comes to selection and has found a nice phrase to hide namely “horses for courses”.
7 Nov 2012, 22:20 pm
@ryecatcher-369: Billy Holiday sang this song.. and Nina Simone adopted it as almost her gospel refrain.
I not sure who wrote it perhaps a Jewish somebody or other I go check.. I remember reading about its origins as a poetic attack on southern states indiscriminate hangings of black slaves and Holiday taking it and making it a song of deep seated anxiety, which Nina Simone carried through.
7 Nov 2012, 22:23 pm
@Treehugger-379:
Y ES SANG SEVE RAL GREAT SONGS INCLUDING “LOVE FOR SALE.
DIED OF HEROIN ADDI CTION AND LIVER FAILURE
TITLE =” STRANGE FRUIT”
CONTEXT.3 BLACK TEENAGERS ARRESTED IN INDI ANA FOR MURD ER OF
A WHITE MAN AND RAPE OF HIS GIRL FRIEND.
MOB BROKE INT O JAIL AND SEIZED 2 OF THEM.
LYNCHED THEM AND WHEN ONE USED HIS ARMS TO BREAK FREE
FROM THE NOOSE,THEY BROKE BOTH OF HIS ARMS
THIS TOOK PLACE IN AMERICAN HEARTLAND.NOT DEEP SOUTH.
GRUESOME PHOTOS PUBLIS HED OF THE LYNCH VICTIMS
AND A DISPASSIONATE CROWD OF ONLOOKERS.MALE & FEMALE.
GIRL LATER RETRACTED ALLEGATIONS OF RAPE.
NOT POSTING THIS GRATUITOUS LY,BUT THOUGHT IT RELEVANT
ON BO RE-E LECT ION TO SHOW JUST HOW FAR AMERICA HAS COME.
“THE GREAT BILLIE HOLIDAY FIRST TO SING SONG 1939
7 Nov 2012, 22:24 pm
@skopdiekan-389: song performed most famously by Billie Holiday. Written by the teacher Abel Meeropol as a poem, exposing American racism, particularly the lynching of African Americans.
7 Nov 2012, 22:26 pm
@willievz-386: Currently it seems as though he has decided well in advance which players he wants to work with. That why those who are on form, but not preselected, are given limited opportunity, in order to prevent them establishing themselves as part of his first choice players, and are also discarded easily.
7 Nov 2012, 22:28 pm
@willievz-386:
This HM is a closet racist.. and specifically a stupid rugby analyst and coach who is obsessed with the size above talent phobia… its clear as daylight.. and all his glorified groupie heilige HM singers are blind as bloody bats to the absolute reality of his closed minded prejudices.
7 Nov 2012, 22:32 pm
Boks should lose on Saturday.. that is the damn criminal pathetic state of the situation…the only way this thicker than thick plank is going to learn his stupid lesson is to lose and keep losing till he either gets it right or else walks the same gang plank he expects his players to.
7 Nov 2012, 22:33 pm
I really do not understand the love affair with Krusty the clown?? Put Taute at 15 and play De Jong FFS? Jeez Meyer you really are a doos sometimes, but then you bring in Britz which is a masterstroke……..then you have the sick note CJ in the squad (Bench as well)………..another doos move (When has this bloke played more than 5 mins of rugby?) …………….try shy away from the doos moves boet!!
7 Nov 2012, 22:34 pm
LETS HUMANISE IT.THE 2 BOYS WERETHOMAS SHIPP AND ABRAM SMITH
HAPPENED IN 1930.MEEROPOHL.A JEWISH TEACHE R WROTE LYRICS
IN 1939.
SKOP.IMPRESSED BY YOU
7 Nov 2012, 22:34 pm
oh ja the other dooooooooooooooooos move is having Steyn anywhere near the bus………….!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
7 Nov 2012, 22:35 pm
Personally I have no problem with who HM picks. What I have an issue with is the contradictory statements he makes…
21 year old Marcell Coetzee – after an impressive season in SR, playing as a blindside flanker – is deemed old enough and good enough to play for the boks as an openside flanker. While 21 year Siya Kolisi – who also had an impressive SR season, playing openside flanker needs to prove himself some more… But it takes another 21 year old, Arno Botha a few CC games to prove he has what it takes to be a bok.
Elton Jantjies collects splinters on the bench against England, Meyer cites inexperience for his lack of gametime. Yet a 20 year old Johan Goosen, after only a few CC and SR games is deemed good enough to play agaisnt the two best teams in the world… He also had no problem playing a 21 year old fullback at outside centre against Aus and NZ.
At the start of the international season Chilliboy was deemed to be the third best hooker in SA. He got injured, upon his return he made three substitute appearances off the bench to prove his fitness is subsequently included in the bok squad. With Bismarck Du Plessis unavailable, he does not make the match 22 for the game against Ireland. Reason given, he hasn’t much game time. Yet it took Goosen, Vermuelen and Oosthuizen less than 80 minutes to prove they were ready for bok rugby.
Pat Lambie was deemed not good enough to play flyhalf for the boks. He spent most of the games on bench covering fullback… After 3 CC games, where impressed at flyhalf – including one where he outplayed the man who had been constantly picked ahead of him, he gets his first start in his preferred position… On the other hand, when JdJ does well in the CC – including a game where he outplayed the man picked ahead of him in the last two tests, we’re told that the CC is not enough to gauge a player’s aptitude for test rugby. Three CC games are enough for Lambie but not JdJ.
7 Nov 2012, 22:36 pm
If Meyer is “racist” can anyone explain why he has Kirchner starting at fullback EVERY game?
7 Nov 2012, 22:36 pm
@skopdiekan-393:
A racist just like you ne?
7 Nov 2012, 22:37 pm
Lol the words “racist” and “racism” have lost all meaning in SA. They get hurled about practically everyday by all and sundry.
7 Nov 2012, 22:38 pm
Skopskiet is a racist
Nama is a racist
wnbb Capoturd is a racist.
Ooooooh what ya gonna call me back?
7 Nov 2012, 22:39 pm
@katman-362:
“It’s easy to see where the keo yoofleeg get their “if you don’t do as I say you’re a racist” drivel from. Just look at Zuma’s Nkandlagate spin doctor, the slimy Bigmac Maharaj. If you ask questions and demand to see documentation, it can only be because you’re a racist. Forget that the questions might be pertinent and pressing. We’ll just go with the “you’re a racist” approach, thangewverymuch. Ditto for little poepols like Nama here. If the coach doesn’t pick his coloured dream team, he’s racistkont. It’s tired, people. And it doesn’t stick in the long run. And by using it so often in such a short space of time, you’ve completely worn it out. So what the fck are you going to use next?”
GREAT POST
7 Nov 2012, 22:39 pm
@ryecatcher-396:
In case the booze eyes have not noticed, your caps lock is on………
7 Nov 2012, 22:40 pm
@whatever-400: who’s your racist scmuckyface.. kiwi hater who lives on their doorstep yet loathes the same people who extends him occupancy in their country.. you don’t know what a racist is you stupid imbecile.. you stupid moron are it.
7 Nov 2012, 22:40 pm
@whatever-404: Totally sober pal.
Satisfied???
7 Nov 2012, 22:40 pm
Meyer has selected Kirchner pretty much every game.
Same goes for Beast.
Same would be true for Habana and JP if they weren’t injured.
But jirrefok Meyer doesn’t choose Nama’s 2 favourites and allofasudden Meyer is a Nazi?
7 Nov 2012, 22:42 pm
skopskiet is a racist
RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST RACIST KONT
7 Nov 2012, 22:43 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-399:
He has to keep the politicians happy so he makes sure he has the minimum number of black players required.
And even if he isn’t racist he is still a numbskull for choosing 2nd tier players (JJ, Potgieter, Taute at 13) over in form and sometimes more experienced players (JDJ, Aplon, Ebherson, Jordaan, Kolisi when he was fit, Brussow, Deon Fourie)
7 Nov 2012, 22:43 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-402: what are you stupid schmuck a libertarian humanitarian peace loving equal rights activist..you gonna tell me that is who you stupid pathetic self righteous prat are?
7 Nov 2012, 22:45 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-402:
Try this: F@ck you
7 Nov 2012, 22:45 pm
@whatever-404: IKn case you have not noticed it f.face correct grammar is “YOUR CAPS LOCKS ARE ON”
no “is” on
Grade 2 English Grammar.
7 Nov 2012, 22:46 pm
Seems our new Bok-Storm friends wants to join the racist crew of skopskiet, Nama and Capoturd.
By all means.
Are you a bruin ou too?
7 Nov 2012, 22:47 pm
@ryecatcher-412: no = not.
7 Nov 2012, 22:48 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-402: They could call you a dom HM groupie.
or should that be a Katman groupie. Please give me your opinion on HM’s selections.
7 Nov 2012, 22:48 pm
Seems clear to me that HM’s top agenda is to prove that HE is in CHARGE, and will spite anyone who tries to give him advice. Like a bitter and twisted headmaster who has lost control of his staff.
7 Nov 2012, 22:48 pm
Erm. Actually it is “your caps lock IS on.”
How embarrassing.
7 Nov 2012, 22:49 pm
@John1976-415: neither.
fantastic team.
I would have Taute at 15. and de Jongh at 13.
Other than that, we are good to go.
Cooking good looking.
7 Nov 2012, 22:50 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-413: you are a fuckwit through and through you stupid dumb idiot .. trying to pretend he’s not a racist when every oozing thought slithering out his brain is riddled with racism as thick as soot.
7 Nov 2012, 22:50 pm
Alright you racists, my work is done.
Lose the chips, mmmkay?
7 Nov 2012, 22:51 pm
@skopdiekan-405:
Don’t hate Kiwi’s mate, never have, just dispise some of the arrogant a-holes who support them and the arrogant media who spin their bullshit. Very big difference……………..so get your facts straight you deluded mind freak. Read Chris Ratuues collumn in the NZ Herald to get an idea of where I’m coming from and stop being a doos all the time!
7 Nov 2012, 22:51 pm
@whatever-404: Were you born a doos
or have you actively pusued becoming one.Shame man
If so you have succeeded.
7 Nov 2012, 22:52 pm
@skopdiekan-419: I’m a racist. You’re a racist. Everyone is a racist in SA these days.
The race card is overplayed. The word racist means nothing any more.
But for the record…………… you are a racist. Authentic racist twit.
7 Nov 2012, 22:53 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-413:
You don’t know a thing about me. And what does it matter what colour I am?
I am just stating what’s plain to see regarding selection of players. Black players are not given the same amount of scope in Meyers team compared to non-black players.
Here’s the thing: white players know how to bash and donner from generations of practice on blacks. Black players are more agile and can dodge better because of their history of running away from a crime scene and from white oppressors
7 Nov 2012, 22:53 pm
@ryecatcher-412:
No ar sehole…………caps lock , not caps locks………..whose the d ickhead now?
7 Nov 2012, 22:53 pm
SA rugby is cursed with a goddamn sickness.. they better fix it fast or else it going to self destruct.. this coach is gonna blow cause he can’t see past his own ingrained prejudice.. the pity is the players and the team have to suffer under his brain dead blinded idiocy… all of them, whichever ‘race’ they represent.. bloody thick as three planks moron.
7 Nov 2012, 22:53 pm
Ireland by 5. Midfield trounced.
7 Nov 2012, 22:54 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-417: Not going to argue about ****.Would be construed as racist.
7 Nov 2012, 22:55 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-418: So you also agree with Nama1 and others that JdJ is a better option at No. 13 than Taute. Are you satisfied with the selection of CJ van der Linde and Morne Steyn on the bench?
7 Nov 2012, 22:56 pm
@whatever-425: Ultimately you are for
your petty points.Feeling grand now?.Ego satiated.?Doos
7 Nov 2012, 22:56 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-423: do you actually know what the definition of a racist is.. do you have any idea? Now tell me again that you are not one.
7 Nov 2012, 22:59 pm
@ryecatcher-430:
Think you are the doos…….go check the mirror, if you can see through the bloodshot eyes……….
7 Nov 2012, 23:00 pm
Heyneke Meyer’s claim to fame was actually brought about by an Australian Tod Louden.. he is the one who actually put the Bulls team of 2007 together and pretty much coached the players at how to play enterprising and winning rugby.
Heyneke Meyer on his own surrounded by his ja baas yes men is perhaps the thickest coach on the planet…. and the pity is it only going to dawn on everybody after the damage gets seriously done.
7 Nov 2012, 23:06 pm
@skopdiekan-433:
Ag skop, go to bed……….
7 Nov 2012, 23:07 pm
@whatever-432: Listen doos.I overdid it one night last week as a result of a loss of tension.Not a daily ocurrence.
So keep your stupid judgements to your self .If as you say you
were merely notifying me,then it could have been done in a less insulting
and personal way.Epic Fail??My 18 year old uses this phrase.How old a
are your?
7 Nov 2012, 23:07 pm
@katman-362:
1st test vs Eng:
Beast
Habana
JPP
Kirchner
2nd test
Beast
Habana
JPP
3rd test
Beast
Habana
Aplon
1st test in RC: vs Arg
Beast
Mvovo
Habana
Kirchner
2nd test in RC: vs Arg
Beast
Habana
Mvovo
Kirchner
3rd test in RC: vs Aus
Beast
Habana
Kirchner
4th test in RC: vs All Blacks
Beast
Habana
Kirchner
5th test in RC: vs Aus
Beast
Habana
Kirchner
6th test in RC: vs All Blacks
Beast
Habana
Kirchner
Now, what I see is that Meyer selected just three run on P’sOC in the last four test matches after selecting four consistently at the beginning of his tenure.
But then, I saw that he did not use Jantjies off the bench in the 3rd test against England despite Morne playing utterly kak. I also saw that Meyer rushed Goosen into the team the moment he thought Goosen was over an injury despite the warnings of Naka, leaving Jantjies on the bench again.
I also saw Meyer selecting a young FB (who is not even the 1st choice FB for his franchise) at outside center for the home leg against Aus and NZ although JdJ (an established outside center) toured with the Bok squad in Australasie and lost 4 weeks of playing time in the process. Now he selects Taute yet again ahead of de Jongh this after Taute was utterly kak in his two chances while de Jongh was on of the stars for WP in the CC final just the other day.
Nowhere did I say HM is racist. All I said is that imo, HM now has a policy that a MAXIMUM of THREE players of colour must be in the run on team and that that maybe the reason why de Jongh is not selected ahead of Taute.
I obviously don’t agree with it and said as much.
For the record. I don’t care what you say about me.
Another thing, It is only whities who know that they can’t win an argument or don’t have facts to back them up that bring the kak of the current government into the argument. The argument was about the selection of the Bok team, not about Mac Maharaj or Zuma or Inkandla. So, you lose this round.
7 Nov 2012, 23:09 pm
@ryecatcher-435:
aaah, don’t get your knickers in a knot, no real offence meant, was just winding you up…….sometimes its to easy here!
7 Nov 2012, 23:11 pm
@ryecatcher-435: My 18 year old grand daughter.
7 Nov 2012, 23:11 pm
Imagine it was Dippy De Villiers ******** up like this.. this haven of rugby intelligence would be a hive of over zealous activity..
seeing its heilige Heyneke doing all the goddamn damage.. its got every convenient excuse all neatly tailor made in his defense mechanism.
I got f’all faith in this pathetic punk.. now far less than ever, when he started out I was ready to give him a measurable benefit of the doubt.. but he’s proved it over and over again.. this moron don’t know the beginning of what actually works on the rugby field or in any rugby team context.. in simple language this bloody dunce is THICK.!!!
7 Nov 2012, 23:13 pm
CJ vd Linde???????
Heinkie vd Mewere, Wiaan Du Preez are better.
Schalk britz can covr any position in backline and hooker. Expect him to cause damage in closing 20minutes. It Great to See him back in Bok Mix.
Best All Round Hooker IMO since Uli
7 Nov 2012, 23:13 pm
Ag please Nama one only needs to go back and read your posts through the annals of Keo history to realise you bring an exceedingly briun-ou-centric view on all things.
Some accuse Meyer of having blue tinted glasses but you are just as bad with your bruin tinted ones.
Your 3 player “theory” is kakakakaka anyway because if Habs was fit you’d have your 4 POCs to celebrate and then you’d be singing Meyer’s praises.
7 Nov 2012, 23:13 pm
@whatever-437: Sorry.Just a bad day which i was hoping some good humour woul alleviate.We all have those days.Regards.
7 Nov 2012, 23:14 pm
Lwazi Mvovo??
whee is JJ Engelbrecht??
7 Nov 2012, 23:14 pm
Everyone is a racist.
I see racist people.
Racist people see me.
7 Nov 2012, 23:15 pm
@ryecatcher-442:
7 Nov 2012, 23:17 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-441: WTF is a bruin-ou you stupid pathetic idiotic moron..? Who the fck gives you this grandiose opinion of your non racist self you stupid imbecilic outright racist f’ng idiot
this right here is the curse inflicted on SA rugby.. it is white racism entrenched and inflicted so far to the hilt it will take mammoth steps at redressing this fckup of a pseudo smoke screen self righteous supremacist bent.
7 Nov 2012, 23:18 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-444: so just because you are a self confessed racist every one else has to be one too… nope piddle de dee.. it ain’t such you idiot.. id don’t work like that… you are the racist in this case, and there are plenty people who are not.
7 Nov 2012, 23:21 pm
@skopdiekan-447:
A racist is also someone who uses race to critisize or putdown………..you skop do that all the time and as such you have to be one of the biggest on Keo.
So shutthefukup you doos!
7 Nov 2012, 23:22 pm
God here we go again with Skop’s nonsense rants, as if anyone actually cares what he thinks.
First it’s the heyneke meyer racism conspiracy.
Next it’s how he will support Ireland (like anyone cares).
Then he’ll finish with his favourite musicians (again, as if anyone cares).
Someone somewhere did half a job raising this little brat… Too much carrot, not enough stick if you ask me.
7 Nov 2012, 23:23 pm
@whatever-448: agreed.
7 Nov 2012, 23:24 pm
@skopdiekan-447: ek is ‘n pienk-ou!
skop, you’re racially pathetic. do you dribble pee in your pants too?
7 Nov 2012, 23:26 pm
@whatever-448: so tell me again schmuckaluk your definition of a racist is actually what?.. you reckon you are not a racist.. but I am.. that your definition of who or what a racist is..
shows how confused in the brain you actually are.
@poltergeist-449: who the fck cares about you pathetic little fuckwit prat.. you the kind of arsehole little groupie who climbs up pseudo supremacist nincompoop backsides looking for a cream cake hand out.
7 Nov 2012, 23:29 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-444: I see dead people.
A lot of them were racist too.
I am now 73 and if I lived for another 70 years and said sorry to all of the
people I have consciously been racist towards,I think that I may make
it.Point is,try and be non racist now.Agree.I think that Skop is a racist.
I am just tired of all of this self flagellation expected of me.
Did I benefit from apartheid?Yes.But I was living the life(No better,no worse)
of people in Australia,UK Usa and E urope
My wif e works with Aids babies.She loves them,feeds and nurtures them.
The bulk of the people doing this work are(oh horror)the nasty whites.
I too am getting mightily pissed off (not necessarily)on this site at
being called a racist by peopler who disagree with me.The term is the
coinage of the stupid,and is ca st about with careledd abandon.
I could give countle ss examples,but time is fleeting.
7 Nov 2012, 23:31 pm
@skopdiekan-452: haha more grammatically incorrect nonsense.
Try constructing a sentence with only one adjective next time. Maybe people will understand you a bit more. They still wont give a shi.t though.
7 Nov 2012, 23:32 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-451: what is that to dribble pee? sounds like something you quite familiar with, first I ever heard of such a condition, is it common in your family tree?
you called someone by a derogatory handle.. a bruin-ou like a condescending little pienk-ou prat that you are.. and you STILL wanna come pretend around here that you are so bloody kosher and non racist in your enlightened intelligent demeanor.. maybe some you morons fool yourselves but your words and thoughts come screaming out your brains faster than you can even catch them blazoning your real impressions out on the big movie screen in the sky..
like this pathetic little fuckwit piffle arsed punk poltergeist here.. sometimes the levels of intelligence on this blog seriously show the state of SA rugby and precisely where it is at.
7 Nov 2012, 23:33 pm
@skopdiekan-452:
Whats it like being Katman’s b.itch?… Does he treat you well?
7 Nov 2012, 23:34 pm
@skopdiekan-455: skop you are the village idiot.
7 Nov 2012, 23:35 pm
@poltergeist-454: wtf for you stupid imbecilic nonentity moron..?? since when do I have to construct anything to suit you and your dumb ingrained idiocy you pathetic little fckwit moronic self deluded prat.
7 Nov 2012, 23:38 pm
@poltergeist-456: @poltergeist-457: dream on schmuckaluck .. wouldn’t you just love to believe it… stupid little fuckwit idiot that you are.. climbing up that other fuckwit little idiots arsehole like the fuckwit little groupie idiot you are.
7 Nov 2012, 23:39 pm
@skopdiekan-452:
Show me one post where I have made a derogatory comment towards anyones skin colour or in fact brought that into a conversation? You won’t find it…………………………so you are basing the “fact” on what? The fact I’m white and therefore must in someway be racist?……………….what a complete and utter dooooooos you are!
7 Nov 2012, 23:40 pm
@whatever-460:
You on the other hand ………there are thousands of racist posts……..
7 Nov 2012, 23:40 pm
Goodnight all.Never known a thread as toxic
7 Nov 2012, 23:41 pm
@ryecatcher-462:
Cheers bud
7 Nov 2012, 23:43 pm
Skop you are a joke.
I pisss on your face.
7 Nov 2012, 23:43 pm
@ryecatcher-453: do any of you actually have a clue what a racist is.. do you consciously understand what it is to be racist?
I somehow don’t think most people here even have a foggy clue about what it is.. it is either a mental condition or it isn’t.. now search inside and answer yourself if you are or are not, its actually not a very difficult question to answer.. but most won’t.
7 Nov 2012, 23:44 pm
@skopdiekan-455: you have some issues.
seriaas
7 Nov 2012, 23:45 pm
@skopdiekan-465: Youre a farking racist. We’ve all read your posts. One of the biggest racists on here. Not to mention one of the biggest dumbasses.
7 Nov 2012, 23:46 pm
@poltergeist-464: haha
7 Nov 2012, 23:46 pm
@The Rangerman-466:
Understatement of the year
7 Nov 2012, 23:46 pm
@skopdiekan-465: you are the biggest racist round these here parts geezer.
you have problems.
7 Nov 2012, 23:48 pm
@whatever-469:
overcompensation is such a sad sight.
at least he calls a spade a spade unlike nama who whines incessantly about the number of black/ cullart players in the bok team due to meyers selections then throws his hands up and says “i didnt say he is racist!” when confronted about it
7 Nov 2012, 23:48 pm
@skopdiekan-465:
Jeez like your parents really didnt do wonders on you did they?… A good f.ucking backhand is what you need. That’ll do the trick.
Your father needs to up his game because as it stands, he’s raised a little worm.
7 Nov 2012, 23:51 pm
@ryecatcher-462: shame.. the truth a little bit tough to handle.. now its toxic to be honest about recognizing whats what.
@poltergeist-464: try your luck fckface.. you a pisswilly little piece of trivial trash… low life garbage is precisely what you are.
@whatever-461: yeah I fight the scourge of racism with the very sickening low common denominator repercussion it warrants,… you wanna sit there in your handy little ivory tower of contempt at who you reckon is a racist.., you far from understanding the very root of the disease you stupid far removed alien in outa Mongolia.. you think you in the clear, perhaps that what you think, I reckon you ain’t.
7 Nov 2012, 23:53 pm
79.nama1: Reply to this comment
7 Nov 2012, 14:38 pm
@CharlesM-51:
How else do you explain Hougaard on the wing or Taute/JJE at 13. I don’t buy into this “they are there because they are bigger” kak. There is something else at work here.
We can’t shy away from it forever.
106.nama1: Reply to this comment
7 Nov 2012, 15:02 pm
@Transformation-97:
Keegan had a kak game so Meyer is looking for somebody else. A white player replaced by a white player. No problem there.
Taute/Hougaard had kak games, Meyer keeps playing them because the only alternatives he has, are dark players.
7 Nov 2012, 23:54 pm
@skopdiekan-473:
I hope you’ve got Katman’s permission to be up so late… You dont want him to punish you again now do you?
7 Nov 2012, 23:55 pm
@The Rangerman-470: come again fuckwit.. another one that thinks he’s not when he is… all the racists coming out for desert.. come again fuckwit.. you another one that reckons he knows what a racist is.. little limey self righteousness twat
@poltergeist-472: I give you that backhand you deserve you little fuckface, you the little punk that needs it most you little piece of trash skunk
7 Nov 2012, 23:56 pm
some of the nama greatest hits.
no innuendo, no insinuation there right?
just good old questions about racial make-ups of the team.
what next, the post office, the school, the police…….uhm….nah he is probably a happy chappy there.
nama is a racist.
skop is not a real racist, he simply hates his own skin and thats sad because if you take off your skin, you die.
biology 101.
7 Nov 2012, 23:57 pm
@the authority-475: @the authority-467:
here we go the more the merrier.. more fuckwits to fuckuop… or are these fuckwits all one and the same using different ID’s.. poltergeist and Authority are the same little fuckwit prick with katmankunt and rangerfuckwit prude tagging along…
7 Nov 2012, 23:57 pm
about time someone called Nama out for his blatant whiny racism.
7 Nov 2012, 23:58 pm
@skopdiekan-476: what is this “come again” phrase you are using?
i have a mental picture of you hopping around the room swearing at your nokia right now.
settle down, i was trying to help you.
7 Nov 2012, 23:59 pm
skop has all the questions but does he ever answer hem? skop has the magical question to determine a racist but can he answer it? would love to know if skop thinks he is or isn’t a racistkont because it appears everyone else says he is……………………………….
8 Nov 2012, 00:00 am
@skopdiekan-476:
I’ll give you my address and you can come backhand me…
Here it is. 31 Indlaba, L Section, Sowetho.
Just come and knock on the door. Im waiting for my backhand.
8 Nov 2012, 00:00 am
@skopdiekan-478: having those persecution feelings again?
looks like you have caught what namas got.
thats awful, go have a lie down.
8 Nov 2012, 00:01 am
@the authority-475: Are you Katman’s lover?I have never seen a blogger exhibit so much man love for another.
8 Nov 2012, 00:02 am
@skopdiekan-478: haha yeah me and poltergeist are the same person… In fact all of us who disagree with your silly little rants are the same person.
8 Nov 2012, 00:02 am
@skopdiekan-476:
ag skop you could’nt even fukup your own shadow, so stop trying to be all heavy !
8 Nov 2012, 00:02 am
@The Rangerman-477:
Listen rangerfuckwit.. let me tell you what a racist is..
you and your bumchum china.. you know that pseudo little cleverdick prick that thinks its so intelligent and enlightened.. you know the one…. and these other smarmy little white snooty fuckwits in here like this prick authority and his alter ego poltergeist are outright racists through and through
you just a slightly more conventional and sophisticated racist than some of these other scum like poltergeist and authority.. but if you search deep down you will discover that you not so bright and bushy tailed free of any racially indignant superior traits which I seen plenty times come oozing from out you suave little suburbia consciousness.. try hide it,, you almost do a good job at that., but if you look real careful.. yup.. its still there.. even unbeknownst to you.
8 Nov 2012, 00:02 am
@Liewe Luiperd-481: Put a sock in it Woody.
8 Nov 2012, 00:03 am
@wnbb-484:
Katman and skop are Keo’s biggest rivals.
I support katman when they clash heads. It pisses skop off, which amuses me.
8 Nov 2012, 00:04 am
@Liewe Luiperd-481: ag please dont get him going on what a racist really really REALLY is!
he will have cab here in 2 minutes (not a bad thing).
8 Nov 2012, 00:05 am
@the authority-489: Whatever.
8 Nov 2012, 00:06 am
@wnbb-491:
Yes?
8 Nov 2012, 00:06 am
@skopdiekan-487:
Why dont you tell them the truth skop.
You and me are the same person.
I think its time we (I) came clean…
I am skop.
8 Nov 2012, 00:08 am
@poltergeist-482: aha a bra from Soweto.. and a bra that reckons he knows whats what.. a bra that reckons all kiwis are whats the term you used ‘incestual’ or some such garbage.. and you reckon you in a position to dish out backhands.. I probably thrice your age you clever little twat.
8 Nov 2012, 00:08 am
@skopdiekan-487: ” smarmy little white snooty fuckwits”
buddy you are so racist its frightening.
funnily enough you are probably compensating for something you did or something you feel.
your behaviour is abnormal and that indicates problems to me buddy.
8 Nov 2012, 00:10 am
Well, it’s been fun peeps. I always enjoy a good skop roast, but I must be off.
Catch you next time.
8 Nov 2012, 00:11 am
@wnbb-491: hey fkface
8 Nov 2012, 00:11 am
@The Rangerman-495:
Well said. I agree.
8 Nov 2012, 00:12 am
@Liewe Luiperd-481: do you know what a racist is … you got some kind of clue?
you reckon you and rangerprude and katmankunt are free of it.. think again
8 Nov 2012, 00:13 am
@skopdiekan-494:
Youre probably thrice my age are you?… And youre still so dumb?
Jeez, poor you.
8 Nov 2012, 00:14 am
@skopdiekan-499: youre the racist skop… I have my doubts whether youre actually white.
8 Nov 2012, 00:14 am
@The Rangerman-497: heita bottom feeding pond life scum.
8 Nov 2012, 00:15 am
@poltergeist-498: sadly i dont think snoeky has vibrated to the plane needed for self realisation yet.
hope he gets there one day, truly.
8 Nov 2012, 00:16 am
@The Rangerman-495: now this pseudo intellect is also a psychologist.. over compensating for something I did .. aha light bulbs flickering everywhere .. I must have been a real bad white supremacist racist to feel so strongly about this.. Neh?
Yeah you so clever its frightening how goddamn genius clever you are at recognizing the obvious.. stupid little schmuck.. how about recognizing that you are inherently still stuck in some superior tangent of intelligence that thinks its more enlightened or less racist than others.. the clue actually is lurking for you somewhere inside there.
8 Nov 2012, 00:17 am
@wnbb-502:
congrats on the cc bud, hope you and your mates enjoyed the party.
8 Nov 2012, 00:19 am
@poltergeist-500:
He’s a 62kg whisp of a man with a scraggly goatie.(Like the trainer in Karate Kid 1) He seriously would not be able to box himself out of a box of tissues! But faaak me the on-line bravado is huge………………as ranger said………..making up for a lack of something
8 Nov 2012, 00:19 am
@skopdiekan-504: i never said over compensating in that post snoeks.
you need to look into your soul.
deep.
deeper.
almost there.
tell the ranger what you see?
8 Nov 2012, 00:20 am
@The Rangerman-503: Sadly,your self righteous act is quite amusing.I know that you are better than that rangerboy
8 Nov 2012, 00:23 am
@poltergeist-501: I have my doubts too.. I reckon I’m a black man born to a white mother.. or else I got black man sanskaras .. do you know what that means.. nope I guess you wouldn’t.
and maybe you are the reverse..
the issue is not what is clothing the mans bones.. what color epidermis covers his skeleton.. the issue is what color is his mentality and his heart.. that is the difference between someone who is a racist or who is not.
8 Nov 2012, 00:23 am
@wnbb-508: ag it was bait
guess that makes you the fishy
8 Nov 2012, 00:24 am
@The Rangerman-505: Thanks.Ag,you know us Capeys don’t need to win a CC to party.
8 Nov 2012, 00:25 am
@whatever-506: since when have you met me to try give a description.. who giving you false impressions of who I am and what I look like..?
8 Nov 2012, 00:26 am
I did read on here that skop is a tiny titch of a man.
8 Nov 2012, 00:26 am
@skopdiekan-509: what a load of sh i t man
see i knew you hated your skin.
so you reckon that the nats got it wrong, they should have developed a psychometric test and a heart scanner to check for who shouldnt live with who?
more expensive than a pencil.
both the nats and you are fcked in the head.
8 Nov 2012, 00:27 am
@wnbb-511: haha, must be why i always leave capetown with a headache.
8 Nov 2012, 00:27 am
@skopdiekan-512:
The description was given a few years back by one of the Keo bloggers who actually met you…………..tell me honestly that I’m wrong…
8 Nov 2012, 00:29 am
@The Rangerman-507: what do you see when that little defenseless fishy is looking you straight in the eye and saying.. please mr. big bad white flesh eating hunter man.. please do not spear me.. what do you see ranger fishy vreter.. what exactly in that little fishy’s eyesight do you actually see?
think about it big bad Rambo warrior.. think about exactly who is seeing who.. imbecilic ain’t even the word for some you clever little dickiebirds thinking you so goddamn smart.
8 Nov 2012, 00:30 am
@The Rangerman-510: That’s what the smiley is for.Your baiting of G10 still fresh in the memory.Glad to see that you are cutting the oke some slack .
8 Nov 2012, 00:31 am
@skopdiekan-509: i reckon you been eating the masende wembuzi (do you know what that means……nope i guess you wouldnt) somewhere up on the mountain eating too many mushrooms for too long.
8 Nov 2012, 00:31 am
@whatever-506: haha true
8 Nov 2012, 00:33 am
@wnbb-518: ag he baited back just as hard man.
i have no problems with grant though he stopped talking to me years ago
8 Nov 2012, 00:33 am
@The Rangerman-514: you still a Nat.. only you changed your badge.. the difference between you and me is I was so far from ever being anywhere close to being associated with any of that trash.. while you are clothed in it from head to toe…all you changed was your fake facade.
same as this prick here @Liewe Luiperd-513:
8 Nov 2012, 00:33 am
@skopdiekan-517: skop its almost time for your music comments… you know, the posts where you tell us who your favourite musicians are and we dont give a s.hit
8 Nov 2012, 00:34 am
@skopdiekan-517: what are you on about now man?
spearfishing?
really?
8 Nov 2012, 00:34 am
It used to be a great laugh here in the evenings…..
Grant10 and the fridges, Soda Joe and the music, Jinx and the poems, Skop and the sharks, Puma and his Sharks, Robzim and his kayak, Rangerman and his snorkel……. and lots more bloggers with a great sense of humour all here because they loved the game of rugby.
I could go on, but life moves on………..!!
8 Nov 2012, 00:36 am
@skopdiekan-522: you are a nat buddy, you fought in their army.
not me.
sorry, you were hunting “terrs” in their homelands not me.
the apartheid regime was propped up by your complicit support.
now compensate away
8 Nov 2012, 00:37 am
@skopdiekan-517: shut up skop. No one here cares about your opinions.
Racist little rat.
8 Nov 2012, 00:39 am
@whatever-506:
Mr Myagi would kick your a$$ whatever
8 Nov 2012, 00:39 am
@poltergeist-527:
Little ray of sunshine you are!!
8 Nov 2012, 00:40 am
@carol-525: times have changed carol.
the trek of gbs and his crew left a void here and of course we all miss jinx (RIP music man).
and with that i am off to bed.
tjorts all.
8 Nov 2012, 00:41 am
@whatever-516: you mean somebody told you I weighed 62 kg.. how the fck would anyone know what I weighed? perhaps I weigh 52 kg or else 82 kg.. now which one is correct?
so what is my height and weight and color of my hair and color of my eyes and is my hair curly or straight, is my skin light or dark, do I have a beard or mustache or both or clean shaven.. which is it.. and if by chance you get somewhere remotely close to assuming whether I weigh somewhere between 52 and 82 kg, how does that in any way affect your assumed accuracy of what my character or psychological make up is?
8 Nov 2012, 00:41 am
@poltergeist-523:
Dont knock a man about his music.
Music is more popular than any sport.
8 Nov 2012, 00:42 am
Heres my impression of skop:
Fck you you little fuckwiturd pathetic excuse for a ******’s arsehole. You the type of fuckwitidiot eho thinks he knows whats what about rugby but cant see his own ego oozing through his brown stained pantaloons. Heyneke and his goddam army of nat supremesists gonna get fcked up this weekend and then maybe he’ll realise the error of his ways thanks to his own white racist demise. Bob Dylan is the greatest.
8 Nov 2012, 00:44 am
@poltergeist-527: you are a fckng idiot you pathetic dunce whether you a bra living in Soweto or a schmuck living in Sandton don’t make no difference.. you are one stupid ignorant idiotic dunce.. and those tirades of garbage you spewed out about Kiwi’s shows in no uncertain terms what a stupid imbecile idiot you actually are…
8 Nov 2012, 00:44 am
@carol-525: Heita tannie Carol.I hoped that you and your BNP mates learned the lesson this morning.Romney learned the hard way that the world doesn’t exist in a white bubble.Something to pass on to your mate ,Nick.
8 Nov 2012, 00:46 am
@The Rangerman-530:
Lots of different folks, with different ideas and opinions who also enjoyed a laugh!
The constant sniping currently is frankly tedious! However I live in hope of some fun Keoing once again in the not too distant future.
Night Ranger
8 Nov 2012, 00:46 am
@The Rangerman-524: look in the morror idiot… look straight inside that little fishies eyes and see who you are.. you stupid moron that can’t think straight.
8 Nov 2012, 00:47 am
@wnbb-535:
Another little ray of sunshine, talking complete and utter bollock$ once again!!
8 Nov 2012, 00:48 am
@skopdiekan-537:
Hi and Bye Skop….Catch you another night!!
8 Nov 2012, 00:48 am
@carol-529: forget what this prat thinks about me.. you should see what he got to say about Kiwi’s .. how much love he got pouring through his black as soot soul.
8 Nov 2012, 00:50 am
@carol-539: yip its tough times these days Guinevere… its sword baring time.. no time for play acting and smooth talking.. these days its all about war.
see you round lass
am also out
8 Nov 2012, 00:51 am
@skopdiekan-541: good riddance
8 Nov 2012, 00:53 am
@poltergeist-542: too bad for you.. you don’t get the last say arsehole…
8 Nov 2012, 00:53 am
@skopdiekan-543:
lol
8 Nov 2012, 00:54 am
@skopdiekan-543: bed time skop… Off you go.
8 Nov 2012, 00:55 am
@Hurricane-528:
hehe, reckon?
8 Nov 2012, 00:57 am
@whatever-546:
IF he does not kick your a$$ you will have the cleanest car in the North Island.
Waxa on Waxa off
8 Nov 2012, 00:59 am
@The Rangerman-530: cheers fry hunter.
8 Nov 2012, 01:00 am
@skopdiekan-543:
Don’t have any nightmares now, have a glass of horlics you old fa rt!
8 Nov 2012, 01:01 am
@Hurricane-547:
I’ll run with the cleanest car bit
8 Nov 2012, 01:01 am
So Hurri, whats your take on Chris Ratue’s collumn re the Scots?
8 Nov 2012, 01:05 am
@Hurricane-547: Can’t you arrange a job interview for ‘whatever’ with the Mongrel Mob?
8 Nov 2012, 01:12 am
@wnbb-552:
Prefer the ***** Angels. I have a dop with them most Sat’s at the Pohoi Pub
8 Nov 2012, 01:13 am
Sorry Puhoi…….
8 Nov 2012, 01:15 am
@wnbb-552:
Tell me dude, you a 69, 68 or a 67? ie do you bend, cause judging by your comments you do alot of that
8 Nov 2012, 01:29 am
@wnbb-552:
lol
Would be nice
8 Nov 2012, 01:45 am
@Hurricane-556:
hehehe, but it won’t happen cause you keeping a wide berth due to owing then too much money hey?
8 Nov 2012, 01:58 am
@whatever-557:
lol
They owe me
8 Nov 2012, 02:47 am
@whatever-553:
You party with the Angels….Whatever? Had a few family in with them, an uncle in 61 when they were formed, hes passed on and a cousin who was patchedup in the seventies and eighties….. . Its interesting that the Auckland H.A were the first chapter formed outside California in fact I think they were the sixth charter.
8 Nov 2012, 04:25 am
@willievz-367: just so you know…..Mvovo is bigger than Hougaard
8 Nov 2012, 06:26 am
@j59-560: Bigger?
8 Nov 2012, 06:52 am
Ag kak why can’t we ever have a decent coach in charge of the Boks. Heyneke is an idiot. Go back to the Bulls with your neanderthal approach. I expect big things from Taute, he is a special player. Why play him in a position he doesn’t specialise in – you’re setting him up for failure. This is even more frustrating when you consider we have Kirchner at fullback. We haven’t had had a coach persist with such a kak player since Straeuli’s fascination with Jorrie Muller. Heyneke please get rid of Kirchner at fullback, put Taute there, give JDJ a deserved run in the 13 jersey and put Mvovo on the wing. Hougaard to come on as an impact player. Give Morne a one way ticket back to SA and hand in your resignation. Thank you.
8 Nov 2012, 09:23 am
@skopdiekan-473: get stuffed.
8 Nov 2012, 09:52 am
I’d have selected this team with the available players.
1. Beast
2. Brits
3. JDP
4. Alberts
5. Etsebeth
6. Deon Fourie
7. Louw
8. Vermeulen
9. Hougaard
10. Lambie
11. Habana
12. JDJ
13. JP
14. Rhule
15. Taute
8 Nov 2012, 10:00 am
Those that deserve and those who suck HM’s coock
15 Zane Kirchner – Sucker of HMs testies
14 JP Pietersenv – Deserving
13 Jaco Taute – Deserving, but Zane sucks best.
12 Jean de Villiers – Captain sucker
11 Francois Hougaard – Deserving
10 Pat Lambie – Deserving
9 Ruan Pienaar – Deserving, but may not kick
8 Duane Vermuelen – Deserving
7 Willem Alberts – Deserving but out of position
6 Francois Louw – So deserving
5 Juandre Kruger – Useless, even as a nut sucker
4 Eben Etzebeth – Deserving
3 Jannie du Plessis – Has become deserving
2 Adriaan Strauss – Likes to suck HM’s left ball.
1 Beast Mtawarira – Deserving
16 Schalk Brits – Deserving, but should start
17 CJ van der Linde – Likes to cup HM’s balls
18 Pat Cilliers – Undecided
19 Flip van der Merwe – HM’s ball findler
20 Marcell Coetzee – Not done anything… yet
21 Morne Steyn – He must be blackmailing HM or have pictures of his balls
22 Juan de Jongh – Deserving, but needs to suck HMs balls to play
23 Lwazi Mvovo – Not convinced, but may one day make an impact.
8 Nov 2012, 11:12 am
I do believe that Heyneke is prejudice against player of colour but you could say the same thing about smaller players and players who dont wear light blue rugby jumpers i certainly do not think that its something his aware of i just dont think Heyneke is coping with the pressure assoicated with the job when this happens u tend to go with ppl your comfortable with. The best example of bias is the Home test against new zealand, Taute battled all game on defence, heyneke hadnt criticised a single player by name all season and that includes Dean Greyling after the test in nz, heyneke does the post match interview and is asked about the boks defensive frailties and what does he say? “Its not Elton’s fault he hasnt played in a while” Yes HM we realise its not his fault but you werent asked about Elton. So after watching a terrible bok performance with countless missed tackles and mistakes all HM saw was the fact that elton failed to drift on defence once. Eish you see what you want to see i guess
8 Nov 2012, 11:23 am
Chances are that HM is a racist. He is Afrikaans and he is from Pretoria were it is generally indoctrinated into kids.
8 Nov 2012, 12:36 pm
@whatever-551: I know this was posted last night so you’ve probably left for the day but…
Don’t judge NZ by our journalists and especially not this Chris Rattue. He published the most arrogant article about the Welsh early in Henry’s tenure, calling them village idiots. Henry called him out on it and from that day on he’s been anti-Henry, anti-Hansen, anti-AB. In 2008 he publicly announced he would support Deans’ Wallabies rather than a Henry ABs and gloated when we lost our first game. He’s been a little quiet since then! But three days after the world cup win, had the cheek to criticise the ABs again and claim Henry got his selections wrong and the backs were below par.
Chris Rattue is the one of the reasons I stopped reading the NZ Herald. Hence, I haven’t seen the Scotland article but I can imagine it’s not worth reading
8 Nov 2012, 12:47 pm
@gonzo-568: And I should add, having now read the pathetic article in question, all of the comments below it tear Chris a new one. Which is rare for NZH posters as they are usually worse than the worst on Keo
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