Lambie gets his break
7 Nov 2012
RYAN VREDE, in Dublin, reports Pat Lambie will start at flyhalf against Ireland, while Morne Steyn is still in the mix.
Lambie emerged as a strong competitor for the flyhalf berth with an impressive Super Rugby campaign and commanding performances in the Currie Cup. Initially seen primarily as a fullback, Lambie now has a chance to advance his cause to play in his preferred position at pivot.
With Heyneke Meyer committed to settling on a deputy for Johan Goosen for the 2013 season onward, Lambie will know he has been handed the inside lane in that race.
Steyn comes onto the bench in what can only be ascribed to Meyer’s fears around Lambie’s tactical aptitude. Steyn was dropped from the match 22 for the home leg of the Rugby Championship, with Meyer saying he didn’t have the attributes to warrant his retention as an impact player.
However, Meyer has made consistent references to Steyn’s tactical prowess, and was forthright in his reasons for picking Steyn ahead of Elton Jantjies.
‘I don’t believe in a pecking order so I won’t say Elton was second behind Johan Goosen [from the Soweto Test]. I believe in horses for courses,’ Meyer said.
‘I just felt I didn’t want to be in a position like we were in Soweto when Goosen went off injured in the first 10 minutes and then have to replace him with a youngster who is inexperienced. Morne has 40-odd Tests and has played on the year-end tour before, so he is an insurance policy. Elton will get his chance at the right time. As far as Pat goes, I want to see what he can do. He has really impressed me recently and his goal-kicking has been superb in difficult conditions, he is in the zone, which is what ultimately got him the start.’
Elsewhere Jean de Villiers and Francois Louw have overcome injuries to start, but this is not the case for Gurthro Steenkamp, who picked up a knock playing for Toulouse at the weekend.
Hooker Schalk Brits is involved in the match 22 for the first time in four years, edging out Chiliboy Ralepelle. ‘Chili has been injured a lot this year. Scrummaging is so important here and Schalk Brits has been in superb form. Chili will never let you down, but you want an impact from the bench and with most of the games being won in the last 10 minutes, we’ve really lacked someone who can come on and make the difference. Schalk is just a better impact player,’ Meyer said.
The bench has a dynamic look about it with the industrious and abrasive Flip van der Merwe and Marcell Coetzee included, while Juan de Jongh and Lwazi Mvovo have the aptitude to exploit the space that will open up in the final quarter.
The forecast is for cold but clear conditions at kick-off on Saturday. Ireland announce their team on Thursday and are expected to name skipper Paul O’Connell and experienced prop Cian Healy in their run-on side.
Springboks – 15 Zane Kirchner, 14 JP Pietersen, 13 Jaco Taute, 12 Jean de Villiers, 11 Francois Hougaard, 10 Pat Lambie, 9 Ruan Pienaar, 8 Duane Vermuelen, 7 Willem Alberts, 6 Francois Louw, 5 Juandre Kruger, 4 Eben Etzebeth, 3 Jannie du Plessis, 2 Adriaan Strauss, 1 Beast Mtawarira.
16 Schalk Brits, 17 CJ van der Linde, 18 Pat Cilliers, 19 Flip van der Merwe, 20 Marcell Coetzee, 21 Morne Steyn, 22 Juan de Jongh, 23 Lwazi Mvovo
569 Comments
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7 Nov 2012, 15:36 pm
Taute is overrated imo… He’s slow and dont really have a great kicking game…Id rather have Aplon…
7 Nov 2012, 15:36 pm
@willievz-140: @willievz-140:
I may cede on Goosen, but am not yet sold on Coetzee..
Personal preference as in Streauli selecting Jorrie Muller I guess.
7 Nov 2012, 15:37 pm
@Jeez-151: I’d rather have Le Roux or Coetzee at fullback than Taute.
7 Nov 2012, 15:37 pm
@Horings-142:
I think you may be right regarding Coetzee especially.
That oke has played a whole lot of rugby this year.
I like that Botha bloke, as a number 8 mainly though. He’s poison at 8 and I reckon in line for the Bok captaincy at some point in the future.
7 Nov 2012, 15:37 pm
JDJ has had way more opportunities than Taute. And to be brutally frank, he hasn’t really used them. Until a couple of weeks ago, people couldn’t stop talking about how he a.) never passes, b.) can’t pass to the right and c.) can only step properly off one foot. I don’t agree with all those statements, but that was certainly a running theme here. All that has changed now is that he has scored one cracking try in the CC final, and now the entire keo yoefleeg can’t stop whining about the injustice of him being on the Bok bench. As I said, you girls are beyond silly.
7 Nov 2012, 15:38 pm
@Pot Blou Gevaar-152: “Personal preference as in Streauli selecting Jorrie Muller I guess.”
Or you mean Heyneke selecting JJ Engelbrecht
7 Nov 2012, 15:39 pm
@Spiesisworthless1-153:
Let see how they do in Super rugby…
7 Nov 2012, 15:39 pm
@Jeez-151: I dont know how true this is, but Heyneke Meyer reckons Taute runs the 100m in 10.7 seconds.
7 Nov 2012, 15:39 pm
@katman-155:
a) Never passes – not true
b) Can’t pass to the right – not true
c) Can only step properly off one foot – certainly not true
How many tests have De Jongh started for the Boks?
7 Nov 2012, 15:40 pm
@katman-155: Couldn’t have said it better myself.
7 Nov 2012, 15:40 pm
@Spiesisworthless1-153: Coetzee is a loosie, dumb fcknut
7 Nov 2012, 15:40 pm
@Jeraldjay-141: The problem with PdV is he did not drop players when they were out of form. The balance between loyalty and playing the best is a difficult one.
Meyer gave Steyn a very good run. At least 3 games too long a run in my opinion and now he is out of the starting team for the last 3 tests. Sure, he is back in the 22, but Jantjies had a shocker against WP under perfect conditions.
At least Meyer is not letting loyalty come in the way as we have seen with PdV, but he is also not chopping and changing like Straeuli did.
He simply does not rate de Jongh, nor do I, so I understand his stance.
7 Nov 2012, 15:40 pm
@willievz-156:
7 Nov 2012, 15:41 pm
@Finfan-161: Andries Coetzee you bladdy wingnut
7 Nov 2012, 15:41 pm
@willievz-159: Seldom see JDJ passing to be honest. He prefers to attack the line but because he does it so often, he is becoming predictable.
He also lacks a kicking game.
7 Nov 2012, 15:41 pm
@katman-139:
You didn’t just ask a question. You made references of Herchell and Kallis who made bad starts to their international careers and then became great as if somehow Taute will also become a great after a kak start. Now will you answer my question: Will Taute become a world great at outside center?
On your question: TWO test matches.
One vs Aus (debut) and one vs the AB.
He was kak in both and should not be in the team for this game on Saturday.
7 Nov 2012, 15:43 pm
@Horings-162: Well said Sir.
7 Nov 2012, 15:43 pm
@katman-155:
What it basically boils down to is that we are all crying out for a world class 15 and 13.
We’re are all fighting over the best of a bad bunch at the moment.
7 Nov 2012, 15:44 pm
@Spiesisworthless1-164: No, his name is Marcel, stoopid idiot and I doubt he’d be effective at fullback
7 Nov 2012, 15:44 pm
@willievz-159: Don’t know how many he’s started, but he has had 12 caps.
7 Nov 2012, 15:45 pm
@Jeez-151: Interesting how WP supporters always want Aplon in the mix at 15 and recently Fourie at either 2 or 6.
The problem is they do not even start in those positions for their Province when everyone is fully fit. I dont get it.
I must say I think Deon Fourie’s position is at flank where he is not only one of the best fetchers in the country, but also a very good defender and ball carrier.
7 Nov 2012, 15:45 pm
@nama1-166: You don’t get to make that call, buddy. So you’ll watch from your sofa and you’ll cheer for him, and you’ll like it.
7 Nov 2012, 15:47 pm
John Gait – #168 – Hear hear sir. Well said. Currently the Boks are rebuilding so we have to take the hits i am afraid.
The fact is we don’t have a great fullback at the moment in SA, so one has to be developed.
HM could use JP Pieterson(played there before) but he is the best wing in the world so not a good idea. Therefore we are stuck with Kirchner.
We also don’t have great avaialable 13 in the country, JF is unavailable, so on has to be developed.
7 Nov 2012, 15:47 pm
why pick De Jongh? the quota is allready filled with Zane playing!
7 Nov 2012, 15:47 pm
@Kaizan-165:
You will not see him pass a lot from 13, because 13s don’t pass a lot in the modern game.
It doesn’t mean that he can’t do it.
And do you need a kicking game at 13? It is not even necessarily a mandatory requirement for a 12 (see JDV, Nonu, etc).
I posted yesterday that there are several ways for a 12 to be a playmaker / creating opportunities. Passing and kicking are only some of those ways.
JDJ proved effective at 12 for the Stormers in 2010.
7 Nov 2012, 15:48 pm
@katman-155:
Do you, Katman, HONESTLY believe that Taute is a better outside center than either JdJ or Mapoe and that he deserves to be selected ahead of either of them?
Serious question.
7 Nov 2012, 15:48 pm
@Finfan-169: Even Marcell would tear shi t up at fullback compared to our current crusty cretinous critter in the position.
7 Nov 2012, 15:48 pm
@willievz-159: You must be one of those okes going to the practise sessions of WP, because I do not see JdJ’s passing skills in any televised games.
7 Nov 2012, 15:50 pm
JDJ only passed once in his life! that was grade 1 …
7 Nov 2012, 15:50 pm
@Horings-178: See 175.
I’m sure you’ve seen him play 12.
Also, have another look at the CC semi against the Lions this year.
7 Nov 2012, 15:50 pm
Anyway, if nothing else, this thread is an interesting little social observation – watching a largely enthusiastic but nevertheless clueless crowd exaggerate and create facts (about both players in question) to bolster their arguments. A couple of hundred posts later, and it is written in undeniable stone that Taute is slow, can’t tackle and is the beneficiary of a racist conspiracy to keep coloured players sidelined.
7 Nov 2012, 15:51 pm
@katman-172:
So, can you answer the question now?
7 Nov 2012, 15:52 pm
@nama1-176: JdJ is undeniably the best dancer, not only in the match 23, but the squad as a whole. Now there is something to celebrate, so please stop complaining.
7 Nov 2012, 15:53 pm
JdJ has scored some fantastic tries at S15 level. So have the men on his outside Habana & Aplon. Oh and lets face it the Stormers game has not been condusive to scoring tries. JDJ is a rock solid defender, he carries the ball well and he is deadly in some space. In essence HM’s message is – I’m playing Taute come hell or high water and I’m not dropping Nik Naks to make way for him. I say this because Taute has absolutely zero credentials in a number 13 jersey. In fact he was embarrassing against the AB’s
7 Nov 2012, 15:55 pm
@katman-181: Strange that if Taute is at fullback and de Jongh at centre most people will be satisfied, but the number of non-white players will be the same. Is Provincialism the underlying monster?
7 Nov 2012, 15:55 pm
Stormtrooper …. 2 seasons ago habana was boo’ed at Loftus. Free State Stadium & Coca Cola park – because he was hond kak .. kakker than Earl ever was… this year he was player of the year … so why judge taute on 1 average game?
7 Nov 2012, 15:56 pm
@nama1-176: I believe a coach picks a player after watching him for anything up to a season. Not because of one moment of brilliance. I rate all three of them – Taute, De Jongh and Mapoe – very highly and would have all three in my squad. I also know that the coach was looking for a similar type of player to Fourie at 13, and that Taute’s name had been linked to this for almost a year now. Five seconds of hotstepping isn’t going to change this. But 5 seconds of hotstepping is all it takes to sway a herd of gullible girls on a blog, that’s for sure.
I would have preferred Taute at 15, but I’d have him at 13 any day of the week. And yes, ahead of De Jongh and Mapoe.
7 Nov 2012, 15:56 pm
@willievz-180: I wonder how Sadie made his name playing next to JdJ. He must have magically received the ball form nowhere. This braaivleis talk can be a *****, some simply can’t think or see for themselves.
7 Nov 2012, 15:57 pm
@suffer_guy-174:
That’s the truth. Speak it.
Does not make it right though.
@katman-181:
“…and is the beneficiary of a racist conspiracy to keep coloured players sidelined.”
Explain then WHY he is selected in your opinion.
7 Nov 2012, 15:57 pm
The sooner Taute and Jantjes arrive in the Cape the better….
Taute will be relieved as he will be playing where he prefers…..
And Jantjes is rated by AC…..
HM better hope the selections come off…..because he aint gonna get much sympathy …
7 Nov 2012, 15:58 pm
@willievz-175:
> You will not see him pass a lot from 13, because 13s don’t pass a lot in the modern game.
All positions on the field have to pass. Whether or not a player passes is not decided by the position they play, it’s decided by the context of the situation and game plan…. Of course outside centers have to pass. Juan De Jongh just backs himself individually too often and is becoming predictable.
> And do you need a kicking game at 13? It is not even necessarily a mandatory requirement for a 12 (see JDV, Nonu, etc).
You seem to think all positions on the field are uniform across teams… 13′s need to do that; 12′s don’t need this etc… Again, what matters is context, not the number on your back. If the situation calls for it, sometimes kicking is the best option regardless of what number you have on your back… A player who brings more skills to the table is usually a more valuable player to the team. Frans Steyn is a brilliant kicker and this takes pressure off the flyhalf… Doesn’t mean 12′s ‘have to kick’… It’s just a valuable skill to have. Juan De Jongh doesn’t bring this to the table, whilst other centers do.
Juan is a good player, don’t get me wrong, but he is not perfect. As I said before, he is a bit individualistic and he lacks a kicking game.
7 Nov 2012, 15:59 pm
@Stormtrooper-184: I remember Habana scoring great tries at super rugby level…but not at the Stormers. In fact I remember him scoring those tries with Wynand Olivier, Jaco Pretorius and JP Nel on his inside.
7 Nov 2012, 16:02 pm
@Kaizan-165:
lacking a kicking game never stopped jaque fourie… or made anyone not rate him either…
so why is it important for juan de jongh to have a kicking game…?
7 Nov 2012, 16:02 pm
@nama1-189: Get the fck out of here – I’m not even going to entertain your whacky racist conspiracy theories with an answer. That sht is all in your fcked up head. Deal with it away from this forum.
7 Nov 2012, 16:02 pm
@katman-187: Taute should be showing some form in the domestic competition or SR in the 13 position first before being considered for SA in the 13 position. He was simply kak in his two outings for SA thus far, if you are happing or satisfied with that then I don’t know.
7 Nov 2012, 16:02 pm
@Finfan-183:
That does not answer the question.
What do YOU think? Is Taute a better outside center than JdJ or Mapoe?
How about “merit selections?” A phrase that was bandied around much on this site in the past. Do you think all the players in this team are “merit selections?”
7 Nov 2012, 16:03 pm
@John1976-195: should be happy and satisfied
7 Nov 2012, 16:03 pm
@grant10-190: And if HM picks Jantjies and Taute at 15 with de Jong at 13 where will your focus go to next. Hougaard on wing is my guess.
7 Nov 2012, 16:04 pm
On the plus side…..
Our loose forward combo should be a huge success in the NH…
7 Nov 2012, 16:05 pm
@ufo-193:
Look I rate Juan De Jongh, but he is starting to become a touch over-rated with some people on here calling Heyneke Meyer racist for not selecting him.
I’m just pointing out that he is not the perfect player and there are other reasons he may not have been selected to start other than racism.
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