Halfback horror hampers Boks
24 Nov 2012
JON CARDINELLI writes the poor execution of the kicking game as well as indecision with ball in hand contributed to another disappointing Springbok attacking performance.
Even if the weather was fair, you wouldn’t have bet on defence-oriented teams like England and South Africa playing an adventurous brand. What would have been expected was a high level of accuracy, and a degree of consistency that may have allowed either team to build some defence-compromising momentum.
It was not to be, as England and South Africa delivered attacking performances of the lowest order.
Only one try was scored in this contest, and even that was down to luck rather than sustained pressure. The Boks enjoyed many a venture into English territory, but their poor hands, lack of accuracy at the breakdown, and shocking decision-making culled many a promising movement.
Ultimately, it was a ricocheting ball that fell favourably for the try-scorer Willem Alberts. It was a big moment in the game, with Pat Lambie converting the try to extend South Africa’s lead to 10 points.
But just as the Boks had struggled to build and finish their opportunities, they made a pig’s ear of closing out the match. Their halfbacks put them under pressure with some territory-costing mistakes, and the visitors were fortunate that this very poor England team was not able to capitalise.
Ruan Pienaar had one of his worst Tests in a Springbok shirt. Some may argue that the conditions made it difficult to control the ball or kick tactically with any great accuracy. But it wasn’t just Pienaar’s execution that was at fault, but his decision-making as well.
Pienaar’s first attempted clearance was charged down by the English. Why he didn’t pass the ball to Lambie, who was safely back in the pocket, only the scrumhalf will know.
Pienaar struggled to recover from that early blunder. He made another mistake when a subsequent clearance failed to find touch, and England were allowed to counter-attack given nobody had chased the kick. The end result was a penalty goal for Toby Flood.
The Bok scrumhalf would miss touch again after an England kickoff, and again this handed the hosts possession and territory. It has been a successful tactic in the past, but on this occasion, Pienaar battled to get sufficient hang-time on his box-kicks, and the chasers were rarely given an opportunity to compete and reclaim possession.
Pienaar was consistently poor, while Lambie was just inconsistent. The conditions weren’t conducive to throwing the ball around, but there were several attacking opportunities deep in English territory where Lambie made the wrong decision to grubber, chip and skip pass.
Things didn’t go the Boks’ way at scrum time, but the lineout was in fantastic form. While the forwards blew hot and cold at the attacking ruck, there was enough momentum created in English territory for the Boks to have scored several more tries.
England were not only poor with ball in hand, but in front of goal as well. Flood missed two kickable opportunities early on, and that ensured that they didn’t get full reward for their territorial dominance. It also ensured that a couple of Pienaar’s errors went unpunished.
The Boks overplayed the kick-chase tactic. There was a clear example where Pienaar unleashed Francois Hougaard down the left hand touchline, and then followed in support. When Pienaar collected a pass from Hougaard, he then decided to launch the garryowen. It was but one of many instances where the Boks surrendered possession cheaply, and another example of their lack of synergy.
Lambie produced some neat touches in the second stanza, with some well weighted probes earning the Boks good field position. Unfortunately, the Boks could not keep the ball for more than a couple of phases before knocking on or conceding a penalty.
Unsurprisingly, England’s best try-scoring opportunity was from the counter-attack. Pienaar collected one of the many wayward England lineout feeds and found Lambie in support. Ruck ball was recycled quickly, but the Boks failed once again to make this chance count.
Instead, a pass landed in the clutches of England centre Manu Tuilagi. The Boks were fortunate that England’s skills let them down later in the movement.
England enjoyed more and more chances as the clock wound down, and again, Pienaar and Lambie were guilty of a brain explosion apiece.
The Boks had a scrum on their own 22, and Pienaar showed a poor appreciation for the laws by kicking the ball dead. Lambie then contributed with an elementary error, sending a kickoff into touch.
There were other players who underperformed and lost their concentration at key moments of this contest, and not all of the blame can be laid at the halfbacks’ door. However, the Boks are fortunate that England did not capitalise on the majority of Pienaar and Lambie’s mistakes.
It was a performance that would have done little to advance either player’s cause for a permanent starting position.
Follow JC on Twitter
Follow SA Rugby magazine on Twitter
146 Comments
24 Nov 2012, 19:11 pm
Great game I lore it
24 Nov 2012, 19:14 pm
However, the Boks are fortunate that England did not capitalise on the majority of Pienaar and Lambie’s mistakes. It was a performance that neither player should be proud of, and a performance that would have done nothing to advance their cause for permanent starting positions.
Exactly how I saw it…Don’t think Lambie or Pienaar were too hot…
24 Nov 2012, 19:14 pm
Yip siener Vd skopdiekan warned you don’t play Pienaar at 9 but most the dose knew better including the dumb doos coach. Lucky for everyone concerned England played as thick as we did otherwise this was England’s game to lose, Boks got lucky and Robshaw and Flood couldn’t capitalize on the useless SA half back performance.
Vermeulen, Etsebeth, Louw and De Villiers were the Boks heroes today, all the WP boys carried the bokkie cause, what would these other morons do without them?
24 Nov 2012, 19:21 pm
Jon, I disagree that lambie had a poor test, I thought he grew in stature markedly and should now be considered the man in possession of the ten shirt.
Great defence, kicked all his goals, managed the game well and showed some promising touches on attack.
Pienaar had a mixed game with some mistakes, but overall, a pass mark.
24 Nov 2012, 19:22 pm
@skopdiekan-3: you should leave and kill yourself, you won’t be missed.
24 Nov 2012, 19:25 pm
@Brendope-5:
Problem is Pienaar does not trust Bambie and now Pienaar has to make the decisions………But Pienaar is also ****… Big problem there!
24 Nov 2012, 19:25 pm
@skopdiekan-3:
24 Nov 2012, 19:37 pm
@Brendope-5:
Not before I kill you first you miserable little piece of snot nosed trashfaced arsehole fuckface moron
24 Nov 2012, 19:46 pm
Lambie had a mixed up game, his place kicking was good his out of hand kicking was poor his passing was non existent his kick offs were weak, his general play was so so. Brendan Venter was correct Jantjies would provide more go forward from pivot.
Between Pienaar and Lambie Boks Backline is pretty much reduced to a line of defend only practitioners.
Brendan Venter should be drafted in as Boks Backline coach,
The WP boys saved the day today Vermeulen, Louw, Etsebeth and JdV, without them Boks would have lost hand over fist. WP players the backbone of this team carrying Meyer on their lone shoulders, and he knows it only too well.
24 Nov 2012, 19:48 pm
@LoanShark-6:
I feel for the man. Pienaar really had a shocker! Lambie had a better game, goal kicking was good, but general flyhalf play not to good…. Pienaar has to clear himself as we all know that Lambie cant clear effectively and the poms was well aware of this.. No wonder Alberts or Etsebeth always the first receiver?
24 Nov 2012, 19:52 pm
Jon,
Verstaan jy regtig waaroor die rugby game gaan met die opmerkings in die berig?
Ek twyfel!
24 Nov 2012, 19:55 pm
@skopdiekan-8: lol, I think you’re getting delusions of adequacy there.
You know nothing about rugby. We all know that. You may as well leave and kill yourself. Go on…
24 Nov 2012, 20:00 pm
Another disappointing performance for those of us who are able to look towards the future. Right now Springbok rugby is surviving from one week to the next.
24 Nov 2012, 20:02 pm
Absolutely agree with you on Pienaar.Take note and learn Hondo,you farking tool.
24 Nov 2012, 20:03 pm
3@Skop…Alberts and Lambie scored all our points (Sharks)..not to shabby.
24 Nov 2012, 20:05 pm
I agree on Pienaar, don’t agree on Lambie. Thought he had a decent game – not great, but also not bad – only real mistake was the kickoff which was very close to not out. Tactic obviously was to pin England close to the sideline. You cannot blame 1 player for the absolute sterile attacking display by the Boks. Boks just don’t back themselves to hold onto the ball (and with good reason)- therefore the only way to attack is with kicks. Thought Lambie put in more good kicks than poor ones.
Does not matter who we have at 10, nothing will change until this Bok team gets a decent backline and attack coach. Most innovative move involved the loop behind move by Lambie and Jean. Apart from that forwards bashing it up one by one.
24 Nov 2012, 20:07 pm
We keep seeing this poor performance by Pienaar
Get rid of him. He has had many opportunities at 9 and 10 as a bok and has not done anything
Play Hougaard or another 9 there and lets have a real wing instead of Hougaard there
24 Nov 2012, 20:09 pm
Pienaar is hampering any attack by the boks He is so slow poor kicking and when he does get the ball out the defense is on top of our backs so they Have to kick
Plus he cant defend
24 Nov 2012, 20:09 pm
SA has a serious problem at 9. Pienaar is not cutting it, and Hougaard also not convinced this year – 1 good game and then very inconsistent.
24 Nov 2012, 20:13 pm
@Bokhoring-19:
Agreed
HM need to address 15 which could be taute
wing lets play a real wing there please
hopefully Goosen stays fit
and lets find a decent 9
24 Nov 2012, 20:18 pm
Without exception ,the whole universe agrees that Pienaar had an absolute shocker.Then how on earth can Lambie be rated poorly?In the circumstances he was quite brilliant.Can you imagine how he would perform with a half decent service.
24 Nov 2012, 20:21 pm
Pienaar thinks he’s fly half.
24 Nov 2012, 20:22 pm
Kirchner actually had a good game based on what you’d expect from him. No counterattacking genius but solid. Then again last running fullback to play for the Boks was probable Andre Joubert. Aplon when playing for the Boks played it safe.
Personally think the jury is out on 10. Did not really see anything special from Goosen when playing for the Boks. I reckon next year hopefully one of the three prospects will stake his claim. Hopefully Goosen will have a full season, Lambie play at 10 for the Sharks and Jantjies use his opportunity at the Stormers. Best flyhalf playing for an SA team this year was a Frenchy – sad to say
24 Nov 2012, 20:23 pm
I think Hougaard could be a really good scrummie, but he needs to play more Joost style than Fourie style, think it would suit him better.
24 Nov 2012, 20:24 pm
France not liking the physical style of Samoa
Close game
24 Nov 2012, 20:25 pm
Personally I think that Lambie had a fair game .Did a few good things in terms of his tactical kicking.Playing next to a poor scrummie…..I am not going to crucify him here.
24 Nov 2012, 20:28 pm
Just watch Aaron Smith for the AB’s.With that sort of service a flyhalf has a chance.The root of the Boks problems is at the base.Everything starts there.
24 Nov 2012, 20:29 pm
@Treehugger-24:
Anyone but him
How many chances has he had at both 9 and 10 and even 15
lets move on he is not the future either
24 Nov 2012, 20:32 pm
Some of us have been saying for a while now that Pienaar is a problem at 9.
Today he was guilty of the following:
- charged down kick
- Missed touch from penalty (unforgiveable sin)
- threw intercept pass to Tuilagi
- Took too long to get the ball out the ruck. Eventually the ref blew the whistle.
- 5 Missed tackles (completely and utterly unacceptable)
- Very, very slow to recycle the ball from the rucks
- Kicked the ball when we had overlaps.
This is a very serious problem. Scrumhalf is a key position.
Last weekend, Ruan had a shocker as well. He was charged down against the Scots, gave away penalties and threw sloppy passes.
He is a flyhalf who thinks he’s a scrumhalf. Simple as that.
We need a better scrumhalf. I like Hougaard personally (although he is not without his flaws either)…. I am also interested by this kid Piet Van Zyl.
24 Nov 2012, 20:32 pm
@SDT-27:
Correct
We were talking about pienaar and how slow he is at rucks
ABs dont slow the ball down at rucks they speed it up
24 Nov 2012, 20:34 pm
@SDT-27: There is an elephant in the room here.
In SA, the 9 is the primary decision maker, and protecting the 10.
In NZ, the 9 is servicing the 10.
24 Nov 2012, 20:34 pm
@Brendope-12:
What you think you know about rugby I forgotten already. You just another stupid little moronic piece of sharkshit trash that don’t know fckall about this game which I played long before your mummy dreamed little snotnose garbage like you up.
Lambie kicked the points his place kicking was good, his passing game was non existent, his little lobbying kicks over the Backline are stupid and could cause big danger if they land in wrong hands. Pienaar is outright atrocious useless like I been saying from day one. Meyer is thick to have persisted with Pienaar at 9. He has effectively ruined Hougaard as a threat playing him out of position. If Meyer had kept Hougaard at 9 since beginning of the year he’d have a settled scrum half with far more attack threat by now… Alberts the only other player alongside Vermeulen Louw and Etsebeth to be effective though his ‘try’ was pure fluke and had blow all to do with him, lucky the Botha’s knock went backward and Englands No.8 knocked it straight into Alberts lucky mittens.
24 Nov 2012, 20:35 pm
@Kaizan-29:
Yes many of us were talking about this in the mid week.
Yes he has been doing what you listed for some time
He is not even a 10 either
24 Nov 2012, 20:36 pm
Samoa letting france off the hook with penalties
24 Nov 2012, 20:37 pm
It’s really weird. Some players get persecuted unfairly whilst others escape criticism game after game after game.
Pienaar is the latter. He has been a liability for the Boks every time he has played.
In 2009, he was our flyhalf and he couldn’t get his kicks for posts.
In 2010 he was our scrumhalf and was plain awful. We lost every game in the trinations when he played at 9. The only game we won was the solo game which Hougaard played 9.
And now in 2012, he has replaced Hougaard and again been terribly slow at recycling the ball. Is it any wonder we are struggling to score tries. Is it any wonder our backline struggle for synergy?? They are forever attacking an organised defensive line because the recycle is so slow the opposiiton has a chance to re-set.
For GOD’s sake, the coach needs to see this and make amends.
Pienaar is the Morné of scrumhalves.
24 Nov 2012, 20:37 pm
@willievz-31: 100% agreed. Well said sir!
24 Nov 2012, 20:38 pm
Wales cant score because the keep knocking the ball on
24 Nov 2012, 20:38 pm
@CoachPete-33: Agreed… How are you Coach? Hope all is well.
24 Nov 2012, 20:42 pm
@Kaizan-38:
Yes thanks how about you
I agree with you
9 is such an important position and is primary there to service his backs fast, and well, and the link with the forwards
Like Smith
Pienaar is an average player and has proven he cant step up to test level
HM needs to move on without him
24 Nov 2012, 20:43 pm
@willievz-31: That’s fine if you have a scrumhalf who can do it.
24 Nov 2012, 20:44 pm
And give Skoppie credit here he has been saying this (like some of us)
for some time now.
24 Nov 2012, 20:45 pm
@SDT-40:
We will find someone I am sure
We just have to tell HM about it
24 Nov 2012, 20:45 pm
can anyone detail what Mallet spoke about after the Bok game?
24 Nov 2012, 20:47 pm
@wnbb-26: If not Pienaar then who.BTW
hello
24 Nov 2012, 20:48 pm
@papaown-43: Excrement
24 Nov 2012, 20:49 pm
I said from the beginning don’t play Pienaar at 9, how many times I warned about it now the reality strikes home. I warned loud and clear Pienaar is the root cause of Bok Backline woes but all the dumb know it all idiots including the dumb national coach know better.
Hougaard should have stayed at 9 from the beginning of the year and his backup on bench should be Pretorius or Groom with a proper wing at No.11
Lambie is middle of the road OK, got the temperament but dunno if he really got the pace or the skill to take Bok fly half position to new heights, though far better than Morne Steyn
Meyer should draft in Brendan Venter for Backline consultant but he won’t because Venter knows far more than he does what’s wrong and Meyer only wants ja broers in his stable
24 Nov 2012, 20:49 pm
@ryecatcher-45: Excrement????
24 Nov 2012, 20:50 pm
It was great to see how the Stormers’ experience in tight games really came to the rescue of the Boks on this European tour.
24 Nov 2012, 20:50 pm
@ryecatcher-44:
AN yone
AN other
SO meone
24 Nov 2012, 20:51 pm
I actually thought the chips over the line was a good tactic. They always fell in open space and once even worked when JPP actually collected the ball. Pity nothing much worked after that.
Pienaar passed most of the ball forwards when he did not kick it away. I saw Lambie taking the ball up, put JPP into some space with a lovely floated pass, doing a loop around with Jean. Not great but much better than last week.
24 Nov 2012, 20:52 pm
@skopdiekan-46:
You did skoppie you did
24 Nov 2012, 20:53 pm
@skopdiekan-46: i respect your calls fromt he beginning to not have Pienaar at 9 and i know you’ve also opposed having JdV at 12.
the challenge was that Hougaard wasnt so flash at 9 either. his box kicks were horrendous and you could see he lost confidence once the talk came through about FdP being touted for a return as Springbok captain. his game at the Bulls also suffered.
HM really shouldnt have shafted Hougaard to wing cos it killed his development this year. HM’s view of a 9 is that that is where the decision maker should be, while as we watch now, the All Blacks believe the decision maker is 10!
24 Nov 2012, 20:55 pm
See now as soon as Weepu comes on for ABs things change
No tries
24 Nov 2012, 20:56 pm
@ryecatcher-44: Hi bud.I think I’ll have to go with Skop’s rugby knowledge here and go for Hougie.I am glad he wants to be only considerd as a scrummie for the bulls this year.I really respect him for his honesty as to where he wants to play in the future.
24 Nov 2012, 20:56 pm
@Bokhoring-50: Lambie had an ok game, hampered by Pienaar’s poor poor service today. i am not of the opinion that he should be thrown out of the Bok setup after this poor game, just that he musnt start the next test, honestly.
Lambie showed today though that using kicking as an attacking strategy can at times provide dividends if there is variation. chip kicks, grubbers, kicks into space ANS Gary Owen’s. the whole artillery was on display today. BUT we really do use the kick as an attacking option FAR too much as a top tier rugby nation. FFS
24 Nov 2012, 20:57 pm
@wnbb-54: next year.
24 Nov 2012, 21:00 pm
@papaown-55: That’s because of the game plan.Watch Lambie playing for the Sharks.Totally different.He is playing to HM’s instructions and he is battling a bit to adapt to it.HM is making everyone think before they do anything.The only players comfortable with this are the Bulls.
24 Nov 2012, 21:01 pm
Other teams including the ABs look at us and say wow look how hard the bok forwards work for ball
Good lineout work decent scrums they challenge the tackle ball well (flow)
And then wonder why player\s like Pienaar Steyn Lambie kick it away
and centers just crash the ball up. Yes I know its HMs game plan
Anyway
24 Nov 2012, 21:01 pm
@SDT-40: Indeed.
We were blessed with FDP but it is futile practice to try and clone him.
All the 9s in SA – Pienaar and Hougaard included – can play a fast-servicing game like A.Smith.
They just need the freedom, and the licence, to do that.
24 Nov 2012, 21:05 pm
ok there perfect example Wales plays the ruck ball very quickly and scores Vs ABs
Pienaar, HM are you watching??????????
24 Nov 2012, 21:05 pm
Jeepers Jon- Lambie had a pretty decent game. Was easily one of the better players in the team. And maybe if the game plan didn’t revolve so much around our forwards standing in the first receiver position in the backline then Lambie would have more decent ball and space to work with.
Agree Pienaar didn’t have a great game. Would love for Fourie DuPreez to step back into the fold next year.
24 Nov 2012, 21:06 pm
Actually Dan Carter kicks more than SA 10′s. It is not the kicking the issue, but the type, position from and and timing of the kicks. Boks do only the up and under and the box kick. Today Lambie showed nice variation of all the kicks. He can definitely improve his game a lot, but I feel he has made a lot of progress from last week.
24 Nov 2012, 21:07 pm
@Charging Rhino-61:
Is Fdp the future? will he make it to 2015?
We need to find some younger 9/s now
24 Nov 2012, 21:08 pm
@Bokhoring-62:
Exactly
Nothing wrong with kicking as you say its decision making and execution
Neither of which we are getting right
24 Nov 2012, 21:17 pm
It is really about not being predictable on attack. The Bulls won 3 Super titles through very predictable but effective rugby. This can work in the CC and Super levels, but at international level it only works if your forward pack can absolutely dominate the other team. Problem is that rarely works at international level as the top team’s packs are rarely bludgeoned into submission.
The Bok attack is easy to defend against as the other team’s defence can predict three moves ahead what we will do. We are more in need of proper coaching than just trying the next best thing at 10 or 12 or wherever we dislike a player because he is not our personal favourite
24 Nov 2012, 21:18 pm
Good afternoon everyone. It is with pleasure that I address you all today. My name is Mr Gambino. I am many things, but for the purposes of this website, I am a rugby expert.
I don’t get involved in discussions about race, religion, music or anything else. I talk rugby.
I don’t do replies or follow ups. I express my views verbally and my associate types and posts these views for your benefit. You are free to agree or disagree with what I have to say although it would be in your best interst to agree more often than not. An ex-associate of mine made the mistake of disagreeing with said views too often until he tragically fell off a building. New Jersey is a dangerous place and unfortunately people very sadly fall off buildings with more regularity than one would hope.
Introductions out of the way, I would like to share with you my views on something that many of you are finally getting to grips with. I would like to entitle this article “The Scrumhalf Dilemma”… So without further ado:
The Scrumhalf Dilemma – by Mr Gambino – 24 November 2012
Scrumhalf is a crucial position as I’m sure you can appreciate. The player who fills the number 9 jersey has huge responsibility and is often more of a key player than anyone on the field (barring of course flyhalf, but thats another conversation altogether and one I don’t have time for at this present moment in time).
Whilst celebrating a recent successful business venture, I got to thinking about what makes a good scrumhalf. Why is he there? Why are they normally smaller guys? The questions go on…
After pondering this particular issue, It became clear to me that the scrumhalf is the link between the forwards and the backs. He’s the guy that connects the Brawn with the Brains, (or if you prefer), he’s the link between the Muscle and the Negotiators.
We have a saying back in the old country. “All brains and no muscle makes for a very difficult business meeting”.
So after the forwards do the hard work up front and get the defence on the back foot, what you really need is a guy who can recycle the ball really quickly to the backs so that they can run at an unset defensive line. Otherwise (as I’m sure you can appreciate), what is the point of the forwards putting in that much effort to break the advantage line and render the defense disorganised?
At this point in my thinking, I lit up a cigar. It’s a Gambino family tradition to light up a cigar after a successful business negotiation. I would have given cigars to everyone in my team but my associates were pre-occupied with cleaning up the mess that some of these negotiations unfortunately leave behind. As I said before, New Jersey can be a dangerous place and accidents occassionally happen.
But I digress…
As a Springbok supporter with vested business interests in the success of South African rugby, I began asking myself abuot a scrumhalf’s kicking game… How much should a scrumhalf be tasked with kicking?
Kicking is a funny thing. It decides where the game is played and at what pace. Your primary kicker is your game controller. Your decision-maker so to speak.
I guess you could say that I am the Gambino family’s “primary kicker” if you get my drift.
I therefore had to conclude that the flyhalf should be the primary kicker as he has a better view of the field than the scrumhalf does. He is not focused on the ruck, but instead can enjoy a view of the players around him while he waits for the ball to be recycled to him. After this, he can decide whether to kick, run or pass etc.
A glass of Prosecco always goes well with a cigar. I duly took a sip at this point.
So if the scrumhalf is tasked with getting quick ball to the “primary kicker”, then the scrumhalf’s rolse as a kicker should be more secondary than primary. I mean I’m not an expert on maths, buit it seems to me that is one is not primary then one is either secondary or nothing at all.
Another sip of prosecco.
I then begain thinking about our current scrumhalf and asking myself why some of his decision and indeed kicks today were not up to standard. Could it be that he is kicking too much? Could it be that he is undermining the responsibility that the flyhalf should enjoy as the game-controller?
It was great Prosecco. Vintage stuff from the old country. Imported. Fabulous stuff, they don’t make it like this anymore.
After the inevitable conclusion, I decided to ask myself a new question… What would happen if we changed our mindset on how a backline should function. What if we were to give the flyhalf more responsibility as the primary kicker and game controller and instead us the scrumhalf as a secondary kicker who only kicks occassionally to relieve some of the pressure from the flyhalf instead of undermining his position in the first place?
I would say that if we were to take such an approach, then the scrumhalf would have less repsponsibility as a kicker and more energy to focus on recycling the ball quicker and more freedom to snipe when the situation calls for it. I would even allow the occassional box kick if used in moderation.
At this point, II put out my cigar in the (now empty) glass of Prosecco.
With the above conclusion in mind, it became apparent to me that there is only one way of handling such a situation. For when players get injured, they can’t play. This often opens to the door for other players to stake their claim and prove why they are the better option.
Unfortunately we won’t have this case of affairs unless Ruan Pienaar were to become injured… Say from an accident of some sort.
The problem with this is that Pienaar seems to be one to avoid any action on the rugby field and as such he is unlikely to get injured on the rugby field.
At this point in my thinking, I noticed that my business associates had finally finished cleaning up the mess from our recent business negotiation. I thought about our Scrumhalf dilemma again and I knew we had to take matters into our own hands if we want to solve the probelm we have, so I addressed my team…
“Everybody listen up. We have business to do. Book us some flights. We’re going to South Africa”.
24 Nov 2012, 21:20 pm
@CoachPete
No FduPreez is not the future. He is the present. In the same way that Victor Matfield wasn’t the “future” after winning 07 WC, yet at the time he was the same age as Fourie is at 30.
Fourie is a one of a kind rugby playing brain and talent which needs to be utilized for his whole playing career. Like Gregan, Matfield, McCaw and Shane Williams. Yet we haven’t done this.
I know he’s in Japan but heck just because he’ll be turning 31 next year doesn’t mean anything in my opinion. If he’s still at his physical peak then he must play! 30 is not old… Or 34?! Shane Williams recently retired at 35.
24 Nov 2012, 21:20 pm
If Heyneke wants to improve our attack, he must involve Brendan Venter as advisor. He will take us to the next level!In fact I’m sure no one would beat us if we get this balance right, not even the AB’s!
24 Nov 2012, 21:21 pm
@Bokhoring-65:
Yeah exactly why he did not want to play Jdj
13 never sees the ball on attack withis game plan
He wants a big strong 13 there to crazy the ball defend like crazy and try win some tackle ball
I bet he got a call from the ANC ordering him to play Jdj
24 Nov 2012, 21:22 pm
@Charging Rhino-67:
Yes if he can make it to 2015 then nothing wrong in having a general like Fdp at 9
At same time add some talent at 9 and get rid of Pienaar
24 Nov 2012, 21:28 pm
@Mr Gambino-66:
Is that a letter to HM?
24 Nov 2012, 21:30 pm
Another clown walks through the asylum doors!
24 Nov 2012, 21:30 pm
@CoachPete-70: FdP in his prime could spin the ball and create space. He could also snipe and break.
However, I am very happy to see that the next generation of scrummies are not trying to emulate FdP.
24 Nov 2012, 21:33 pm
Another clown walks through the Keo asylum doors!
24 Nov 2012, 21:33 pm
@wnbb-72:
Lol
24 Nov 2012, 21:35 pm
@wnbb-74: double posts?
24 Nov 2012, 21:36 pm
@Mr Gambino-66:
So you want to intentionally injure Pienaar by some “accident” ??
Why not just drop him There’s a concept
What are you smoking ???
24 Nov 2012, 21:36 pm
@Mr Gambino-66: Wow
24 Nov 2012, 21:36 pm
@CoachPete-77: He said he is smoking a cigar
24 Nov 2012, 21:37 pm
@CoachPete-77: Lol. I think it’s a creative piece coach
24 Nov 2012, 21:38 pm
@willievz-79:
I wonder what’s in that Cigar
@Kaizan-80:
Creative yes when talking to cigar
24 Nov 2012, 21:42 pm
I think its a Gambino special
I combo of crack, LSD, and Durban poison
24 Nov 2012, 21:44 pm
@CoachPete-81: And I bet that the cigar is talking back to him.
24 Nov 2012, 21:45 pm
@wnbb-83:
Yeah talking walking and smiling as he sucks on it
24 Nov 2012, 21:54 pm
can we not implement game plans around current players we have instead of trying to clone past players? like seriously!
24 Nov 2012, 22:08 pm
Tight five isn’t aggressive and physical enough, especially at the breakdown. We need quick ball, the way to get that is to blast over the ball, a ruck is not a wrestling match but a collision point. Can anyone show me one single clean out this season where one of our tight 5 just destroyed someone? I dont remember one such occasion, we are the South Africa we should always be the most aggressive and physical team in the world end of story.
I dont think any team fears our tight 5 and why should they? Beast can be very good but how many times a game do you hear beaaaast from the crowd these days, 4 times maybe, doesnt say much for his work rate does it? A.Strauss is a very good player and could be exceptional if he played in a dominant pack, but he is not really the type of player who is picked for his abrasive qualities. Jannie is becoming a class act dont have a problem with him. Juandre Kruger is like Dean Greyling for me how he ever became a Bok i will never know, and i am a Bull supporter, he does not do anything that is of international standard. Eben has alot of potential and he is still young but i don’t see that physicality the media writes about in the rucks or in the tackles and that is where you win the physical battle(and the game), he does have a lot of potential so i would definitely play him at 5.
I hear Bakkies is negotiating an extension with toulon for a contract till 2015, so he is going to play till the next world cup, he will be 36 then not too old for a 4 lock, think Martin Johnson retired at 35(i think), Simon Shaw is still going he is like 38, and we all know Ackermann, Brad Thorn was 36 last year. HM is picking overseas players so why is Bakkies not playing, even if you dont take into account the way we all know he can play from what i hear he is tearing things up in France, he would be my and should be 4.
Just my opinion i could be wrong off course
24 Nov 2012, 22:10 pm
@skopdiekan-3: you also said he should have stayed at 10 – he is so mentally weak he´s no better than custard and jelly. He runs from left to right flailing his arms out at people in mock tackles when what he is actually doing is deliberately overunning the player to then fling his arm out like he is attempting the tackle but overan the player to avoid taking the contact – he is a a bloody disgrace – just watch the game again and watch how much aimless running form left to right he does.
Next up is his slow service from the base of the ruck – he took forever to clear one ball and the ref blew him and gave the ball to England? I mean WTF???? And then a bit later failing to clear a ruck England rucked over the ball. Lovely. INdecision from mr weak mind again.
Third he kicked every single ball away he possibly could on attack – Jean de Villliers who is usually the worst cuplrit hardly saw the ball this game – its like Ruan suddenyl decided he´s going to be flyhalf from a scrumhalf position. He kicked the leather off the flipping ball today and all of the kicks were poor – not too mention that idiotic quick punt of a penalty that put it into try scoring zone and thus killed the ball – couldnt even kick it out. Jeez the list goes on and on. He isnt a good scrumhalf – youre right – but I think he would be even more of a disaster at flyhalf – lets face facts – he needs to joing CJ and Jean and never wear a Bok jersey again. Bloody hell – what an embarrasment of a ballerina pu55y.
24 Nov 2012, 22:11 pm
@Slumtown-87: adding to that I think his preferred position is scrumhalf so he can hide behind the pack and not have to tackle – ditto the backline – he is a worm
24 Nov 2012, 22:13 pm
@Slumtown-88: mr bloody unibrow.
24 Nov 2012, 22:16 pm
Also Heyneke said this – Pat [Lambie] was superb today.
Personally he made a few errors but I also think he played well kicked his peanlties , had a few good probes and chips and was solid onj defence and attack. Maybe just kicked away a few balls too many. not brilliant but in an awful team on the day he certainly wasnt to blame for much.
24 Nov 2012, 22:17 pm
@Slumtown-87: Completely agree. The number of times this year that we have lost possession in the rucks or scrum because Ruan has taken too long to get the ball out… He takes so long that either the opposition counter rucks and wins the ball or sometimes the ref even blows us up for taking too long!
Absolute shambles.
Can’t wait for the day we find a scrumhalf who gets good clean, quick ball when we are on attack and allows us to attack at an unset defenseive line.
24 Nov 2012, 22:19 pm
@Kaizan-91: he takes so long some of the players on field doze off! lol Yeah man Houghaard hasnt been great and Pienaar has had some moments but scrumhalf is a huge problem for us right now (somewhere we were traditionally so strong) so we need a saviour here and soon. I really dont think Jano Vermaak would be any worse than Houghaard and Pienaar have been and deserves a chance at least.
24 Nov 2012, 22:20 pm
@Kaizan-91: Oh btw – that scrumhalfs name is Sarel pretorius. Mr Snappy. He has his issues but man id rather have him than Pienaar any day.
24 Nov 2012, 22:24 pm
Lol at Pienaar for getting penalised for taking more than 5 seconds to clear the ball when told to…
24 Nov 2012, 22:26 pm
@Slumtown-93: I’d like to see what Piet Van Zyl can do too. Lot of hype around him lately.
Personally I quite like Hougaard. He should just be allowed to play his natural game and not asked to kick all the time. If he is given that freedom, he could develop into a quality scrumhalf…. But I agree, he has some flaws to his game too.
24 Nov 2012, 22:40 pm
Pienaar too keen to do everything himself and not good enough to.
24 Nov 2012, 22:41 pm
@Kaizan-95: thing is he´s also been indecisive and slow at the base of the ruck at times and had many boxkicks charged down etc. I would like ot see Piet van Zyl or the new guy at the Sharks – forget his name – seems there are a few up n coming guys. Lets hope this Super rugby season sees one taking the forefront.
24 Nov 2012, 22:45 pm
@Kaizan-95: I like da poopoo in da bumbum.:
24 Nov 2012, 22:46 pm
@SIumtown-98: ??
24 Nov 2012, 22:46 pm
@SIumtown-98: Each to their own dude.
24 Nov 2012, 22:46 pm
@SIumtown-98: **** off ******** Thats not me again . Some d00s is taking my nick and being an ***.
24 Nov 2012, 22:48 pm
@Slumtown-101: lol
24 Nov 2012, 22:48 pm
@Kaizan-100: Not me some dumb twat using my nick
24 Nov 2012, 22:49 pm
@Slumtown-103: haha no worries man. This site is full of trolls.
24 Nov 2012, 22:54 pm
@Kaizan-104: lol
floaters i call them.
25 Nov 2012, 00:10 am
Now poor Lambie must take some of the blame because Pienaar was utter kak.
Lambie was not great but he was not a “horror” show either.
That would be Pienaar.
25 Nov 2012, 00:25 am
Ricky Januarie plays better rugby than both Pienaar and Hougard.
25 Nov 2012, 03:06 am
HM continues with a kicking gameplan without the players available to him to execute it. So disappointing.
25 Nov 2012, 03:43 am
The Boks wasted so many attacking opportunities by kicking away the ball – if it wasn’t Pienaar kicking then it was Lambie. I fail to see how kicking everything back to a team creates more pressure than mixing it up. The Boks need a 9 that gets the ball out quickly… time to put the box kick to rest. The All Black scrummie maybe does two box kicks a game most…
25 Nov 2012, 03:53 am
So happy I left SA. Would’ve been in jail long time ago. Dealing with dumb South Africans is something no one should have to do. Few trying to make a difference but when you read comments made by the vroue-slaners and kroeg-vliee then there is no hope. HM should resign and go over to Australia or somewhere else. He doesn’t need to be told what to do by kennisgestremdes. Same goes for players. Good for you Jake. Peter Div, we will take you in with open arms too.
25 Nov 2012, 03:57 am
@Big Jack-110: Good riddance.
25 Nov 2012, 04:06 am
Snivelling …. You should be happy
25 Nov 2012, 04:10 am
@Big Jack-112: I am klein Jackie
25 Nov 2012, 05:39 am
@Bokhoring-23:
Then you obviously didn’t watch the games he did play. Nearly every game he played in the S15 his attacking ability was on display and ditto for the Boks. He made several line breaks that no other flyhalf has made in years. Did he deliver complete performances? No. Will he live up to his promise? Who knows. He is 20 and just made his debut but his ability is clear to see for all but the most cynical.
25 Nov 2012, 06:12 am
Lambie was OKEY yesterday, but Pienaar was UBER pathetic…
25 Nov 2012, 07:03 am
Ruan P: same old, same old. Confidence player of note. He starts k-a-k, he ends k-a-k. He starts well, he ends well (although to be honest, even when playing well – by his standards – he is still slow and k-a-k, just a little less k-a-k).
No more Pienaar please. EVER. Dankie.
Lambie had an ok game, hell, Carter would look k-a-k next to Pienaar, so no harsh words for the Lamb after that performance.
For the haters
Duane Vermeulen…Duane Vermeuelen…Duane Vermeulen. The defence fuckingRESTS. Finally.
25 Nov 2012, 07:26 am
jacques rudolph should be dropped…waste of space…
25 Nov 2012, 07:30 am
@Transformation-117: I don’t really want to talk about cricket
Whatafuckingdisaster.
Sidenote: What was with Heyneke throwing cheap smirks at the end of the game, as though he had just unearthed some hidden secret. I wouldn’t be smirking if I were him…..idioticflowerpot.
25 Nov 2012, 07:33 am
@Transformation-117: uyibukele iTonga?
25 Nov 2012, 07:36 am
@Transformation-117:
Agree.
Been saying it since after the England series. They’ve given him all the chances in the world. He is just not up to it in the test arena.
What’s your verdict on the Boks performance yesterday?
25 Nov 2012, 07:38 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-118:
Throwing cheap smirks?
Jissus you are a bigger nutjob than he is.
25 Nov 2012, 07:52 am
@Transformation-117:
Here you go Transie. Meyer raving about the Boks defence again.
“Our defense was awesome. There wasn’t any space and it was a wet ball. But our discipline was very good. We talked about it before the time and we really did well with that. We only conceded one try on the whole tour and I am very happy about that.”
25 Nov 2012, 07:56 am
@nama1-120: boks haven’t made any progress in their attack since the 1st game vs england. last game of the year & we still played like we are scared of losing than intent on annihilating the opposition…ruan played his best FdP impersonation gister kicking all our possession away…
25 Nov 2012, 08:04 am
@Transformation-123:
How many tries scored by the Boks in the 12 test matches this year? Any idea?
One against Scotland last week and a lucky packet one yesterday. Can’t remember if we scored against Ireland.
25 Nov 2012, 08:06 am
@nama1-122: he is right…against these staid northern hemisphere attacks our defence looks s.exy, we monstered england in the collisions & only because they’re as unambitious as we are on attack.
25 Nov 2012, 08:07 am
@nama1-124:
Sorry.
One against Ireland (by Pienaar)
Two last week (by Strauss)
One yesterday.
4 tries scored on this tour.
25 Nov 2012, 08:20 am
@skopdiekan-9: Skop The English loose trio ran into Lambies channel all day His defence immense
25 Nov 2012, 08:33 am
@Mr Gambino-66: First name Carlo?
You a made man?
Capo di tutti capi?
25 Nov 2012, 08:39 am
@Slumtown-93: Very weak on defence.Are you the real slumtown?
25 Nov 2012, 08:46 am
@nama1-106: Well said Nama.A lot to
discuss later.Particularly about ZK
25 Nov 2012, 09:57 am
True, Pienaar didn’t have a good game with the boot but our scrums were a mess. I don’t profess to be a scrum expert but the overhead cam at Twickenham gave a perfect view of what looked like extremely illegal scrumming by the England loose-head. Surely that pedantic school master of a referee could see that ?? It seemed like he walked onto the pitch determined to find something wrong with the Boks….and he’s the best the NH can supply ??
25 Nov 2012, 10:28 am
@Nama1-126:
HM said, “Attack puts bums on seats, defence wins trophies”. Well at this rate, by the time we win a trophy, there’ll be no one there to see it!
25 Nov 2012, 11:15 am
The game was not a display of quality running rugby. However I think Lambie tried things at 10 of which I was impressed with his performance.
England were pumped and deserved more than they got, however it also showed how England have a long way to go. They tried to play an expansive game, which they cannot execute. They are not the Ozzies or the AB’s. The sooner they realize that the better.
25 Nov 2012, 11:17 am
Thought Lambie wasn’t too bad – notwithstanding the kick into touch at the precise moment of the game from kick-off, was inexcusable for a test fly-half – but his place kicking, which is critictal in these conditions and with these tactics, was pretty good.
But as for Pienaar, whose talent I have supported for a long time, but no more – it looked like he was trying to lose the game for us single-handedly: just appalling execution, self-play and decision-making – he is too consistently erratic to play a position that holds so much responsibility.
25 Nov 2012, 11:17 am
Lambie tried things. The team needs a bit more consistency as a unit.
They get that right then Sky’s the limit. England are not that good and it showed.
25 Nov 2012, 11:24 am
@J.B. Cowper-134: Pienaar had a nightmare game. We need a replacement trained up.
Possibe Replacements:
Vermaak of the Bulls
Piet Van Zyl Cheetahs
Charl Mcloed. Sharks
Hougaard (for me, this man is not a scrum-half, and he would have been worse than Pienaar at 9)
25 Nov 2012, 12:33 pm
@ryecatcher-129: yep that was me – i know his defence aint great but Pienaars is equally atrocious – at least Pretorius attack will be miles better. Give me Sarel over Ruaan any day thanks.
25 Nov 2012, 12:34 pm
@Tbozknows-136: Charl McCleod is just as bad. He makes crucial mistakes at the most innoportune of times. I dont rate McCleod at all.
25 Nov 2012, 19:00 pm
I dont like Ruan Pienaar. Anyone seen him trying to tackle? He looks afraid
25 Nov 2012, 19:12 pm
its time to put pienaar out to pasture
25 Nov 2012, 21:29 pm
WP are Currie Cup CHAMPIONS !!!! Champions, Champions, Champions !!!!
25 Nov 2012, 23:42 pm
Exactly right! Pienaar was so p iss poor it was scary……….we have plenty of better 9′s around, someone who is abrasive and snipes around the base and who………….never gets his bloody kicks charged down……what is it with this plonker??
25 Nov 2012, 23:43 pm
And I’m sick of his hung puppy, “the whole world is against me” look.
Grow a pair Pienaar!
25 Nov 2012, 23:46 pm
@Big Jack-110:
Doos comment!
26 Nov 2012, 06:55 am
@Transformation-123: At least FDP kicked well, Ruan kicked poorly. he was terrible against a average team, England have improved but they have a long way to go. The Aussies showed these boys up for what they are. They try the expansive thing and get caught, they need to go back to their own traditional ways.
26 Nov 2012, 14:00 pm
U must have been watching a different game, bambie was below average at best! over rated little boy!
Have your say
You must be logged in to post a comment.