Saru denies Kings request
27 Jan 2013
Saru has turned down the Southern King’s request to include five foreigners in their Super Rugby squad.
At the beginning of January, the Kings named a 40-man squad including five foreigners. Kings officials were, at that point, adamant that Saru would bend the rules and allow South Africa’s newest franchise to field all five players.
But according to Rapport, Saru has officially turned down the Kings’ request, and they will only be allowed to play two foreigners in the coming Super Rugby competition.
The foreign recruits are Tomas Leonardi and Nicolas Vergallo (both Argentina), Daniel Adongo (Kenya), Virgile Lacombe (France) and Hadleigh Parkes (New Zealand). It is believed Adongo is considering taking out South African citizenship.
Kings president Cheeky Watson said that the Eastern Cape franchise had not been officially informed about Saru’s decision.
‘If this is the case, we will accept and abide by the decision of SA Rugby. We know that the region has never been fed with a silver spoon, and have no reason to expect any different going into our debut Super Rugby season,’ Watson said.
‘The path for this region to get a Super Rugby franchise has been fraught with challenges, and yet, despite all the odds, we have overcome them and Super Rugby is a reality, with our first game against Western Force less than a month away.
‘We accept that this opportunity comes from a loaded deck of cards, but the bigger the challenge, the bigger the task, the bigger the team and the overall success.
‘We will not be releasing any of our foreign players, however, as there are still ample opportunities within our structures for them to contribute.’
303 Comments
27 Jan 2013, 09:19 am
no issue we shall moer alles regardless.
27 Jan 2013, 09:49 am
Fair call!!! The whole drive behind the Kings is transformation and exposure of that region so whats the point filling a already predominantly white team into a foreighn one too.
27 Jan 2013, 10:00 am
These entitles political harlots just hired 3 mercernaries who will be playing Vodacom cup rugby – LOL what a waste of money.
So instead of SARU bending the rules it will be Cheeky bending over to pay these foreigners.
27 Jan 2013, 10:36 am
I think the 2 Argentinians are the most needed & should be included in the squad.
Yip, play the other 3 in the Vodacom Cup & keep them active & in reserve as potential cover for injuries to the 2 Pumas.
Is there a foreign player limitation applicable to the July/Aug Super Rugby promo play-offs? If not, all 5 of them (or those of the 5 still fit & in form) come the play-offs, could conceivably be in the match-day squads for the play-offs. Whilst the 1st season in Super Rugby will be a very important learning experience opportunity for the Kings, one cannot realistically expect more than 2 or 3 victories for the Kings in their 1st season. That will almost certainly not be enough to spare them the wooden spoon. That makes the play-offs the most important games of the season for the Kings – everything is a progression towards that crescendo – and as said, depending on the play-off rules all their foreigners may be available for the all-important play-offs.
Go Kings!
{Keo/Tank can you establish & advise the promo play-off rules regarding these 5 foreign players? Thx}
27 Jan 2013, 10:37 am
Looking at those foreign recruits mentioned in this article….
No team was worried even if they fielded all of them.
Keep those oranges fresh….
27 Jan 2013, 12:02 pm
Why are important issues like these, left to the last minute it seems. This habit of putting the cart before the horse seems to be a trait amongst the Rugby administrators in the Republic.
27 Jan 2013, 12:02 pm
What idiots.
Can’t blame SARU for telling them to shove it. If this is how they run a business, they won’t last long.
Here I was hoping the Kings might actually hang on and become at least mildly competitive in a few years. Not when they’re paying big bucks for players they won’t use…
27 Jan 2013, 12:15 pm
Ha! Bunch of plonkers who should never be anywhere near s15. Hope the get pumped up the naught ever game!!! Will be the first time ever I will not give a saffa team a shout……
27 Jan 2013, 12:24 pm
It only a speculation at this point by the Rapport
That rag tag Kings team is a SARU’s creation, so it isn’t clear if they really prevented the strengthening of their own embarrassment ‘brain child’?
It also means that the Kings themselves feel they are so inadequate for the SR level and failed to attract to their roster some meaningful players from the huge SA reservoir.
27 Jan 2013, 12:25 pm
@Te Rangatira-6: Leadership is sorely lacking in SA rugby and other enterprises that are not in private hands.
27 Jan 2013, 12:26 pm
I though Adongo was playing in NZ.
27 Jan 2013, 12:30 pm
@stormer in a teacup-10:
Yes….the same could be said over here, not so much in Rugby but in other enterprises where they play around with money that is not their own…albeit funding from the poor tax payer.
27 Jan 2013, 12:31 pm
Yeah he played a few games for Counties manukau, but really is a B grade player! Plodered around the park but did nothing special, should stick to body building, they don’t gave to catch balls….
27 Jan 2013, 12:31 pm
@hendrikp-7:
The Kings don’t pay from their own pocket, rest assured!
@stormer in a teacup-10:
Embezzlement of funds and theft are not lacking though
27 Jan 2013, 12:32 pm
Yeah he played a few games for Counties manukau, but really is a B grade player! Plodder’ed around the park but did nothing special, should stick to body building, they don’t gave to catch balls….
27 Jan 2013, 12:33 pm
Interesting double up?
27 Jan 2013, 12:33 pm
@stormer in a teacup-11:
How could he possibly ‘play’ if he can’t see the ball?
27 Jan 2013, 12:35 pm
Elton Jantjies dad passed away from a bee sting.
http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Bee-sting-kills-Jantjiess-dad-20130127
Condolences to the family of course. Terrible thing to happen at such a young age.
27 Jan 2013, 12:36 pm
@Hondo-17: why can’t he see the ball?
27 Jan 2013, 12:37 pm
@whatthe-13:
I thought Adongo went ok with Counties.They certainly needed his bulk…looking back his cleanouts were a little part of the reason they could release their devastating backline
27 Jan 2013, 12:39 pm
@Te Rangatira-20:
He was never going to make the Blues squad, or any other squad for that matter… Probably would’ve had visa issues as well.
27 Jan 2013, 12:40 pm
@hendrikp-18: tragic. I understood he was a big influence in giving the boys the self discipline and levelheadedness that has contributed to their success.
27 Jan 2013, 12:42 pm
Te rangi, interesting you say that. I watched two of his games where he only game on as a sub And I thought he was unfit cause he did nothing! I was specifically watching him…but hey maybe his other games were better?
27 Jan 2013, 12:44 pm
The right decision was made.
Why were these foreign players recruited when the rules said no?
Why did it take so long for SARU to confirm their decision?
Both the KrapKings and SARU could have done better here.
Our rugby administration stinks.
27 Jan 2013, 12:45 pm
@hendrikp-21:
Yes…couldn’t see him break into a Nz Franchise, yet the raw product is there in Adongo for some team to grow and improve on.
27 Jan 2013, 12:48 pm
@whatthe-23:
As the season wore on his fitness improved and he actually started playing eighty minutes….thought he was a good fit for Counties cause they needed his size.For a first season in a foreign comp he did ok.
27 Jan 2013, 12:49 pm
Sad state for the Blues but we could probably have done with Parkes back. I feel bad for the guy, leaves because there’s no room at the Blues, Nonu announces his move south but by then it’s too late because he’d signed with the Kings. Now he may get dumped but it’s too late to join the Blues. He’ll probably be at the Force or Rebels come 2014
@Liewe Luiperd-24: It seemed to me that SARU already made a decision but Cheeky kept trying his luck.
27 Jan 2013, 12:51 pm
@stormer in a teacup-22:
Heard that yes. Feel for the guy.
Definitely no Enver Rose.
27 Jan 2013, 12:53 pm
Cheeky. Always tries his luck. That’s how he rolls and hence his name
27 Jan 2013, 12:54 pm
@gonzo-27:
Parkes will get a bit of game-time I think. Must be next in line behind the Argentinians. Might even see some sort of rotation, as there would be no point having any of them on the bench. I can see Scott Mathie pushing hard for the starting 9 jersey.
27 Jan 2013, 12:58 pm
@gonzo-27:
It is sad for Parkes and the Kings if he doesn’t get on the field. He was starting to hit his straps in the ITM cup and has plenty to offer…
27 Jan 2013, 13:01 pm
my condolences to Elton Jantjies, his family and friends on the loss of his father.
for your sake, if necessary take some time off from rugby, son. it’s just a game and it will be there when you get back.
sterkte voorentoe.
27 Jan 2013, 13:01 pm
I’m afraid that sometimes, when you demand a level playing field, that’ s exactly what you get. Welcome to one-rule-for-all rugby, Kings.
Also, what happens to the three chaps drafted but who won’t make the squad? They’ve left their countries, their families, their rugby careers for Super Rugby. Will Cheeky carry on paying them as though they’re in the squad?
Also, surely Adongo can’t simply “take out SA citizenship” like it’s a library book?
27 Jan 2013, 13:07 pm
@Te Rangatira-25:
Couldn’t agree more.
If Adongo had been born in a Rugby Orientated Nation. Who knows how good he could have been.
27 Jan 2013, 13:15 pm
@cane-34:
hehe…the Henry Rono of Rugby…..Caner
27 Jan 2013, 13:17 pm
@cane-34:
Rugby is not just an expression of athletism.
It is a culture.
And unless you are bred in this culture,
it is more than extremely difficult to excel at the highest level.
Just like soccer,
Just like golf.
………………………………Darts……………………….is that culture?
27 Jan 2013, 13:22 pm
@Te Rangatira-35:
Henry did well enough.
You might be older than I thought Rangi.
27 Jan 2013, 13:22 pm
come on guys, words hurt.
give the guy a break
its his dream, let him believe it
who knows, sometimes dreams come true.
27 Jan 2013, 13:23 pm
@hendrikp-18: a bee sting? Must have been alergic or somethin. Sad news and condolences to Elton and family.
@katman-33: how many times must SARU say no to those harlots.
@cane-34: or we can pull a kiwi trick and poack Kenyan moster babies and send then to guppr academy for a rugby educatuon – coiming toi Lions territiry as the finished product … wait that is arleady happening with Adongo being the first … of many.
27 Jan 2013, 13:37 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-38:
As a young man,
I always dreamed of becoming Brigitte Bardot’s s ex ual plaything.
Dreams………………………………..sometimes……………………….yeah right.
27 Jan 2013, 13:39 pm
@RL-39:
Dreams are free RL.
Reality bites.
27 Jan 2013, 13:39 pm
@RL-39:
Must have been. I’m highly alergic myself. Luckily haven’t been stung for about 15 years.
Last time was when I was living about 30-minutes drive outside Bloemfontein & got pretty close to heading that way myself.
Don’t get that many bees in New Zealand luckily
27 Jan 2013, 13:41 pm
How many saffas living in NZ? Anyone have a number?
27 Jan 2013, 13:47 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-43:
At a rough guess 45,000!
Particularly on Auckland’s North Shore.
27 Jan 2013, 13:47 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-43:
Hmm, must be nearing 50,000.
27 Jan 2013, 13:50 pm
That’s quite a number. Are they welcomed by kiwis? Is it a good life?
27 Jan 2013, 13:51 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-43: more than in Bloem.
27 Jan 2013, 13:52 pm
Millions of Saffas spread out across the globe. A true diaspora.
Estimates put it somewhere between 300,000 to 800,000 in the UK alone.
USA
Canada
Australia
NZ
A bit sad in a way. These people are needed in SA.
27 Jan 2013, 13:53 pm
@cane-40:
never give up on your dreams, Caner.
i think she’s still kicking, who knows…
27 Jan 2013, 13:55 pm
Some nations tend to stick to their heritage proudly. Australians for example. You can always tell an Aussie overseas.
Saffas tend to assimilate, the accent starts to disappear after a while and they seem more likely to inherit foreign customs.
27 Jan 2013, 13:56 pm
@RL-47:
27 Jan 2013, 13:57 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-50: happens to everyone.
27 Jan 2013, 14:00 pm
@stormer in a teacup-52: you miss the point. Saffas seem to do it quicker than others. Especially Afrikaners. They develop this weird hybrid sing song accent.
Aussies and Yanks may never be turned.
27 Jan 2013, 14:01 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-46:
It’s alright. Can’t complain too much but of course it is initially a culture shock.
You definitely get welcomed, but get sick of people asking you why you supposedly hate blacks. Or sometimes you get someone asking you why you aren’t black (because you’re from AFRICA!).
27 Jan 2013, 14:07 pm
{Here’s an IMO}:
The Kings’ foreign player pecking order was always (or rather, should always have been):
1. Tomas Leonardi
2. Nicolas Vergallo
3. Hadleigh Parkes
4. Daniel Adongo
5. Virgil Lacombe
With the 2 foreign players squad limitation reasonably expected to be applied, Parkes, Adongo & Lacombe were always reasonably anticipated to be there only to provide depth & cover in the wider squad. Sure, Cheeky pushed his luck in trying to get SARU to relax the rule for the Kings, &, hey, why not, the rule was relaxed for the Rebels, & Cheeky would’ve failed in his duty to the Kings had he not tried?
(a) Daniel Adongo – Is straight cover (medical joker) for Leonardi (although not as a substitute from the bench as per the foreigners limitation, but only as an extra-squad injury replacement to the squad)
(b) Hadleigh Parkes – His situation is more complicated; Had I been a Kings selector I’d have 3 scrumhalves in my squad, & if Vergallo was injured I’d bring in, not a replacement scrum half, but Parkes as run on player at #12 or #15, or as bench cover for those positions.
(c) Virgil Lacombe – His signing left me nonplussed; Before his late signing the Kings already had 3 competent, local hookers; & now with the injury to Hannes Franklin, his presence in the squad IS needed, but he is disqualified. I do not see how Lacombe will play Super Rugby other than as a medical joker in the unlikely event of 3 of the Kings’ other foreign signings are injured.
Thus the application to the Kings of this rule limitation is not a shock, & does not alter much to the likely 1st choice playing personnel of the Kings. However, I believe the Kings made a mistake with the signing of Lacombe (& I believed that all along). But the Kings is not the 1st franchise to make a costly mistake in signing a player.
Punters may yet see 4 of the Kings’ foreign contingent play Super Rugby in 2013.
27 Jan 2013, 14:07 pm
@hendrikp-54:
Ah and New Zealand has a BIG marijuana and drinking problem. Something they don’t advertise, but the weekly ritual of a kiwi teenager is getting drunk and drifting from between night-clubs.
How they let their daughters out god only knows. I’ve seen girls being manhandled, groped etc. more times then I can remember. Had my nose broken and lip go through my front teeth after interrupting a guy (what I’d call) sexually assaulting a female friend of mine.
27 Jan 2013, 14:08 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-50:
No Liewe,
The accent may soften.
But it never goes away.
And why should it.
27 Jan 2013, 14:12 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-53: it is a perception. You notice subtle changes to SA accents because it is your own. You won’t pick up changes to other accents as easily.
27 Jan 2013, 14:15 pm
@hendrikp-56: don’t mess with a drunk islander … ever again. When the blood alchohol level is .02 your women is their women.
27 Jan 2013, 14:18 pm
@RL-59: So you mean around about breakfast time.
27 Jan 2013, 14:19 pm
@RL-59:
Haha.
Unfortunately he wasn’t an Islander. I believe he was Cambodian! Has a twin brother so I’m not sure which one it was… though I’m not about to pretend I’m the type to seek any sort of retribution lol.
27 Jan 2013, 14:19 pm
@hendrikp-56:
sjoe! sounds bad.
was there a just resolution to your incident at least?
27 Jan 2013, 14:22 pm
@hendrikp-56:
Yes hendrikp….I feel lucky I don’t have daughters….respect for women and the elderly is declining…I can’t fathom this decline in the moralistic nature of our society.
Nowadays, marijuana its a criminal enterprise and a way of life for many. Mix it with alcohol and things get outta hand….so many people lose it, especially young males who coupled with the no respect attitude and a dislike for authority
27 Jan 2013, 14:27 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-62:
Happened on dance floor. I was having a beer at the bar and the guy was groping her from behind running his hands all over. Went over and put my arm in between them, next moment I thought to myself “wow, my face really hurts” and then saw him take off. Didn’t even see him hit me with the lights flickering on and off. Actually took me a few seconds to even click that I’d been hit.
Saw him outside the pub an hour or so later, but yeah I’ve got a girlfriend whose almost left me a couple of times for getting any sort of retaliation. Don’t quite understand but I do what I’m told lol.
27 Jan 2013, 14:29 pm
@Te Rangatira-63:
Couldn’t have said it any better.
27 Jan 2013, 14:29 pm
Was it consensual?
27 Jan 2013, 14:30 pm
You haven’t said how the girl reacted to all of this…. It may have been “groping” to you but if it was consensual then it probably wasn’t your place to interfere in the first place.
27 Jan 2013, 14:33 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-67:
She was pretty upset & tried to get him to leave her alone. Plus she was (at the time) my best friends girlfriend. Definitely my place to interfere!
27 Jan 2013, 14:33 pm
@hendrikp-54: “You definitely get welcomed, but get sick of people asking you why you supposedly hate blacks. ”
@RL-59: “don’t mess with a drunk islander … ever again. When the blood alchohol level is .02 your women is their women”
@hendrikp-61: “Unfortunately he wasn’t an Islander. I believe he was Cambodian!”
@hendrikp-54: Perhaps there’s the reason why people assume you hate blacks
27 Jan 2013, 14:36 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-67: how would you like to have a big Tongan cross dresser put her hands around your hips and start swinging – you would freeze and he would think yay consensual and hold you in his arms all night long .. occasionally looking to shake little johnny.
27 Jan 2013, 14:38 pm
@gonzo-69:
Don’t be a prick.
27 Jan 2013, 14:40 pm
@RL-70: nah Hennie had been, until his last post, silent on how the girl felt about it. If she was into it then so what, Hennie probably had a crush on the girl by interfering. But he has explained it wasn’t consensual, and she had a boyfriend who is Hennie’s mate, so full credit to him for sticking up for her. Although the girl could probably have ended the situation without the need for Hennie to go UFC on the crowd.
27 Jan 2013, 14:44 pm
@hendrikp-71: Sorry, I just thought the timing was funny. You not knowing why people assume saffers are racist then another saffer assuming the violent drunk guy had to be an islander. But I didn’t mean to make a sweeping remark about your nationality. Some of my best friends are saffers
27 Jan 2013, 14:46 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-72:
Thanks but I definitely didn’t go UFC! Calmly placed my hand in between them! I’m by nature a soft person
Not initiating anything!
I understand what you’re saying. Don’t think you’re quite picturing what I was describing though!
27 Jan 2013, 14:48 pm
@gonzo-73:
Ah okay I assumed you were having a go
It has to be in the top 3 most common question I get asked though. The others being “do you speak African (sic)” and “who do you support”.
27 Jan 2013, 14:51 pm
@RL-70: Why? Are you a pimp?
27 Jan 2013, 14:52 pm
@hendrikp-64:
well, looking on the bright side i guess it could have been a lot worse, he could have glassed you or something worse.
yes, women are usually like that and will expect you not to follow suit, if you did you would have to deal with the dissapointment and all that **** at home, which could have gone on for god knows how long
perhaps you should have involved the cops if it means it’ll help sort this guy out so he learns a lesson. it might even save him from being seriously hurt in the future.
27 Jan 2013, 14:53 pm
@gonzo-73:
Assuming you are a Kiwi? If you aren’t, disregard the rest of the message!
Saw a bit of this happening on Saturday:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/8228754/Terry-Serepisos-in-race-day-brawl
Really can’t stand Terry Serepisos.
27 Jan 2013, 14:56 pm
@hendrikp-75:
I saw a big islander in a pub in Wellington shaking a girl by the shoulders and the bouncers did nada.
27 Jan 2013, 14:59 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-77:
Seeing as I’m pretty much anonymous I’ll tell the prequel.
About 3 months before that a guy I knew (friend of a friend) was at my flat drinking. Would’ve been around 20 or so people there.
Now I knew he had a crush on my girlfriend because he had moved into my previous flat and was texting her about my mail – odd considering he had my cellphone number.
So anyway I had the girlfriends iphone because was messing around on the net. Next moment get a text from him saying just “xo”.
Ended up with me strangling him and so forth. Never been that angry in my life. Since then I’ve been on a tight leash (though I still feel to some extent it was justified).
27 Jan 2013, 14:59 pm
must say i’m amazed a Cambodian could hit him hard enough to break his nose
27 Jan 2013, 15:01 pm
@Fern-79:
Saw a bouncer throw a go down the Hotel Bristol stairs once. Back when Bill Cavubati was working there, though he was just watching lol.
27 Jan 2013, 15:01 pm
@hendrikp-78: That’s so sad if he was jumped unprovoked but the comment about having no money to donate was actually pretty funny
I still find the whole going-to-the-races thing strange. Kiwis and Aussies get all dressed up, only to end up drunk and fighting as if they were downtown at 3am outside McDs
27 Jan 2013, 15:01 pm
@hendrikp-80:
ek sou ook sy k ont ingeskop het.
27 Jan 2013, 15:02 pm
@hendrikp-78: and yes i’m a kiwi but have been away a while so you probably know more about the goings on there than me
27 Jan 2013, 15:04 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-81:
Wouldn’t have been much bigger then say 5 foot 7 either.
I was more amazed at how much blood can come out of your nose 0_0.
27 Jan 2013, 15:07 pm
I see Eltons dad died from a bee sting yesterday. What a start to the season for the poor kid and his brother.
27 Jan 2013, 15:07 pm
@gonzo-83:
Hahaha yeah loved the bit about him not having any money.
I doubt it was unprovoked though. He would’ve initiated it. Terry is a real prick when he wants to be. Only saw when it was over but he definitely got a few punches in… and it would have been before they all got involved.
27 Jan 2013, 15:08 pm
First SARU confirm there involvement at the 11th hour (they should have had a year to recruit) then they deny them foreign recruits
Say what you want about Australia but they had the Rebels sorted out and they were allowed 10 foreign players in their first year of super rugby, and progressively less as every new season starts
to summarize: Saru are a bunch a idiots
27 Jan 2013, 15:11 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-81: nerds are quite fragile Bakkies
27 Jan 2013, 15:11 pm
@Fern-84:
Thanks! Still get reminded of it when I’m in trouble
27 Jan 2013, 15:11 pm
@hendrikp-80:
hahaha
good story and as justified as you may have felt i’m gonna side with your better half on this one, moering someone is never on unless they really deserve it (i have a few simple rules for determining it in my case and always go to great lengths to solve problems without a need for violence first).
usually there is some hurt and dissapointment felt by your partner for you not having trusted her enough in the first place. thats what gets them mad
you sound like a nice chill oke from your description, Hendrik
def not a ‘breker’ and thats a good thing
oh and, fyi i had to google ‘xo’
27 Jan 2013, 15:13 pm
Sunni bin Williams says if Fransie Botha knocks him out,he will stop boxing.
27 Jan 2013, 15:14 pm
@numba4lock-89: sorry boetie but the KrapKings are all about “development” and “transformation” and “tapping in to the huge black player base” that supposedly exists in the EC. At no stage would it have been correct to allow the KrapKings more foreign players, given the stated aims of Sheeky and his political chums.
The KrapKings cannot be compared to the Rebels. The KrapKings are a political expediency with no regard to results are the effect on SA rugby. The Rebels are all about winning in typical Aussie efficiency, competence and shrewdness.
27 Jan 2013, 15:14 pm
@RL-90:
I don’t even lift
27 Jan 2013, 15:16 pm
@hendrikp-95:
http://p.twimg.com/A6GwnOoCQAErBZh.jpg
27 Jan 2013, 15:19 pm
@Fern-93: yeah, but not because he’s scared of boxing but he said if he gets knocked out, his mum won’t let him get in the ring again
27 Jan 2013, 15:20 pm
@hendrikp-86:
hehehe
i’ll bet that will be his ‘go to’ story around the braai for a long time to come.
@RL-90:
hahaha
it would seem so, RL
(no offense Hennie)
27 Jan 2013, 15:22 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-92:
Moes daai les die harde manier leer!
Maar sal saam stem en se jy voel eintlik moerse k@k na die tyd.
27 Jan 2013, 15:23 pm
@Fern-93:
there is a very real possibility he will.
its going to be the hardest that boy’s ever been hit in his life before.
and judging by his onfield behaviour he gets rattled easy, and when that happens the outcome’s usually not pretty.
27 Jan 2013, 15:35 pm
@hendrikp-99:
hahaha
goed vir jou, Hendrik.
jy’s n aangename jong man en dit klink vir my sy’s gelukkig om n kerel soos jy aan haar kant te he.
hou jou net uit die moeilikheid uit
27 Jan 2013, 15:35 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-94:
The Sharks have had an academy in the EC for while. It certainly isn’t to develop youngsters for the region, but for the Sharks. Until the EC has a franchise, it will be impossible for them to retain or attract talented youngsters.
27 Jan 2013, 15:38 pm
@David-102: do the Stormers not have any players from the EC?
Why does the EC “need” a franchise? They have never won the Currie Cup. Why does Limpopo or the North West or Mpumulanga not “need” their own franchise too?
The EC bought out of their franchise years ago and ran off with the cash. They made their bed.
Simple fact is that SA has no space for 6 franchises. It will dilute the lot.
27 Jan 2013, 15:45 pm
bakkies lyk my jy probeer vir hendrik opchat.
27 Jan 2013, 15:45 pm
By the way, where is this “Sharks academy in the EC”? And which players have come through it?………..
27 Jan 2013, 15:55 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-103: @Liewe Luiperd-103:
Scarra Ntubeni, Kurt Coleman, Siya Kolisi.
Can’t think of any others.
@Fern-104:
Jealous?
27 Jan 2013, 16:00 pm
@Fern-104:
hahaha
ag nee Fern, mens roep dit maniere.
27 Jan 2013, 16:02 pm
boy, i really am looking forward to the Sonny fight.
does he have a nickname yet?
27 Jan 2013, 16:07 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-103: To answer your first statement last. EP and Border (SWD was with the Stormers) never sold out of the Coastal Sharks, they sold their right to host a few games in PE and EL.
The EC is the traditional home of black rugby in SA, but was never allowed to compete in the CC because of apartheid. Unfortunately, the amalgamation of black and white unions coincided with the professional era and the traditional wealthy white unions, except for EP, were able to attract even more players from the EC region.
As things have developed, the regional franchise teams players are now identical to the major CC unions with the exception of FS and Griquas, so the chances of a non franchise EC side (EP) ever competing successfully for the CC is almost non existent.
Just remember that PWC selected the last Franchises, not CC success.
27 Jan 2013, 16:13 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-108: Sonny “Bill” Williams perhaps?
Probably a nickname wouldn’t work so well with his triple-barreled name…Sonny Bill “The Charger” Williams just doesn’t roll off the tongue. But you make a good point, who ever heard of a successful boxer that didn’t have a nickname?
27 Jan 2013, 16:23 pm
@gonzo-110:
exactly.
he’s going up against Francois “The White Buffalo” Botha
it would’ve been nice if he had one too.
27 Jan 2013, 16:24 pm
@gonzo-110:
He is not a succesfull boxer
27 Jan 2013, 16:29 pm
@Fern-112:
come on Fern, he’s the heavyweight champion of NZ.
that counts for something.
27 Jan 2013, 16:31 pm
@Fern-112:
also if i remember correct the bout’s supposed to be for the WBA International Heavyweight title or something like that?
27 Jan 2013, 16:31 pm
@David-109: you will be blue in the face repeating the same facts to bilebags.
27 Jan 2013, 16:32 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-113:
look at who his previous opponents was…
27 Jan 2013, 16:34 pm
@Fern-112: What do you mean he’s not successful? He knocked that gospel singer out cold like he was an overweight ageing sickness beneficiary.
Anyway, I know a lot of guys are looking forward to seeing SBW get smashed but the main event for me will be Quade, if he turns up. He looked scared to death when he met his opponent and complained about how it was so confrontational. What a circus Khoder has organised!
27 Jan 2013, 16:35 pm
@David-109: No, EP and Border no longer have anything to do with Sharks super rugby. They were bought out completely. And formed the Spears (remember them?).
Life is tough.
Leeds aren’t in the premier league. They don’t cry about it. Professional era and all that.
What’s up with the so called hordes of black players in the EC, can’t they leave home? If they were any good, they’d be snapped up in a flash by the other unions who are under immense pressure to select black players……………..
I just don’t see why there is a “need” for EC to have a super franchise…… EC raised players are free to play rugby at any union they choose, just like any other rugby player in SA.
27 Jan 2013, 16:35 pm
@Fern-116:
well, lets just say he will have a lot more credibility after this fight, if he wins it.
i dont think he will though and will probably hang up his gloves for while or until the money’s right for him to come back.
27 Jan 2013, 16:37 pm
A “bilebag”? Well, fuckyou very much Transformation. We all know your pro-black agenda, the fact you resort to cheap, childish insults is not surprising.
27 Jan 2013, 16:38 pm
@gonzo-117: Oh, I take that back after watching the highlights now. He went six rounds and won on points. Damn, if he couldn’t knock that guy out, he’s gonna get smashed by the Buffalo.
27 Jan 2013, 16:44 pm
@gonzo-117:
i don t like that Nasser character one little bit, but he sure has organised a circus indeed.
who is Copper fighting?
i hope they’re making more out of this than their manager is.
27 Jan 2013, 16:47 pm
I am glad that Transformation finally has a team. He is finally off the safety of sitting on the fence. He has finally pinned his colours to the mast (even though he has a crush on the Crusaders). I will enjoy discussing the KrapKings’ results with him this year
And I am sure he is in for a very happy and fun time 
This chop needs to be brought back down to size.
27 Jan 2013, 16:55 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-118:
They weren’t bought out. They stayed until SA was awarded a 5th franchise and then amalgamated with SWD who left the Stormers, to make a separate bid as the Spears. The Cheetahs did the same by withdrawing from the Cats. In each case the withdrawing unions cited abuses by the Sharks, Stormers and Lions over poaching players.
27 Jan 2013, 16:59 pm
@gonzo-121:
absolutely.
unless the fight’s fixed and there’s something in it for Botha to lose, you can be certain little Sonny Bill will come out a man at the end of this bout.
oh boy, talking about boxing is just making me sad and heartsore right now thinking about Corrie Sanders… (Legend)… R.I.P big guy….
27 Jan 2013, 16:59 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-122: I can’t remember all the details though i think he’s fighting some nobody but a nobody that’s at least done some thai boxing before. He sounded like he’s pretty motivated to teach these part-time boxer/rugby guys a lesson.
Yeah, I never liked Nasser at all. The NZRU surprisingly said he’s been quite easy to deal with but I just don’t like the advice he seems to give his clients, e.g. walking out on the Bulldogs, making the “toxic” comment, signing contracts at the last minute, fasting for ramadan during the trinations away leg. That said, Quade and SBW have probably made more money than they would have without all the publicity it attracts.
27 Jan 2013, 17:03 pm
@gonzo-126:
yip
he’s a mini Anzac version of Don King.
but as you say, if they’ve made more money because of him then its not such a bad thing.
27 Jan 2013, 17:12 pm
Of all the rugby players/cricketers turned “boxers;, Carlos Spencer looks the most impressive. In fact, I reckon he could even have made a career out of it if he started at an earlier age.
27 Jan 2013, 17:19 pm
@David-109: you are not normal – since when was Border or the EC excluded from the Currie Cup. Ask Jurie Roux and he will tell you that they are playing in the Currie Cup and always have played in the Currie Cup.
27 Jan 2013, 17:38 pm
@stormer in a teacup-19:
It surfaced here few months ago when the Sharks released him to the Bulls.
Something about eyesight focus, it came from someone who often watched the Sharks in training
27 Jan 2013, 17:47 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-103:
More accurately the EC Will never attract local talent
In the past they were a reasonable force, producing Boks such as Shalk Burger Sr, Franse Erasmuse, Hennie Le Roux or Adri Geldenhuys
Cut off was in 1994 when the ‘comrades’ took over EP Union, it will never recover back from that
27 Jan 2013, 17:49 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-123:
They will make him proud!
27 Jan 2013, 18:17 pm
Bakkies once told me that if Reechee ever became a pro boxer he would insist on entering the ring from the wrong side.
27 Jan 2013, 18:25 pm
@RL-129:
I was referring to the black clubs and players who constituted SARU pre 1994. Not the white SARFU unions.
27 Jan 2013, 18:29 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-133:
hahaha
that he would.
he wouldn’t make it as a por boxer though, too many cameras.
27 Jan 2013, 18:30 pm
@David-124: Are you rewritting the history of SA Rugby to suit your own version? I suggest you should really do some research first.
27 Jan 2013, 18:37 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-133:
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-135:
27 Jan 2013, 19:02 pm
@Robzim-128: Then you haven’t watched Anthony Mundine….
27 Jan 2013, 19:15 pm
@Wanderer-136:
Which part are you talking about?
27 Jan 2013, 20:42 pm
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-135:
Plus they’d need a fifth officilal “upstairs”?
27 Jan 2013, 20:43 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-118: I cry every day that Leeds are not in the Premiership.
27 Jan 2013, 20:46 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-123: Why would it please you for the Kings to do badly?
How would the Kings being poor help South African rugby? Wouldn’t you want the player pool of talented sportsmen to increase? Wouldn’t you want the support of rugby the sport to grow by bringing in more people, and more people who traditionally don’t support the game?
And Transie has always flown the same colors – for YEARS.
27 Jan 2013, 20:51 pm
@SodaJoe-141: That makes three of us?
27 Jan 2013, 20:55 pm
@SodaJoe-141:
Great win for Leeds. As for Norwich, I still remember Luton (a 1st division side) knocking us (a 3rd div side) out of the FA Cup semi replay with an offside goal by Billy Bingham in extra time in 1959.
27 Jan 2013, 21:01 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-143: Sure feels that way. Tough cross to bear, and tehn add in the Lions…Eish. And not the most fun in the worlds supporting the Boks.
I must have been an axe murderer in a previous life.
27 Jan 2013, 21:02 pm
@David-144: I used to like you until the fkg Canaries stole all our best players.
Luton just knocked Liverpool.
There is a god.
Howzit Dave.
27 Jan 2013, 21:22 pm
@SodaJoe-142: yes actually, I’d like to see the Kings get thumped to teach the politicians that it is not a good idea to meddle. The KrapKings are not there for any reason of merit, they are there for political expediency. So fck ‘em and Sheeky, I say.
Your team, the Lions, should be there.
Transie never had any colours…….. always sat on the fnece that one. But now he is off the fence and payback will be a b*tch.
27 Jan 2013, 21:25 pm
Oh and as for the “wouldn’t I like to see the sport grow by bringing in more people” question………. The EP Kings are quite free to do it the proper way……. by gaining promotion to the Currie Cup AND THEN we can talk.
As for now, they have no claim to Super rugby and the way they gained entrance STINKS!
Actually, I will support them to beat the Stormers.
27 Jan 2013, 21:40 pm
@Liewe luiperd, you make no sense at all…but then again yourre an imbecile I shouldve expected this. Btw I will be cheering the Kings, win or lose…much better than seeing your team play sr! Lol
27 Jan 2013, 21:42 pm
@SodaJoe-146:
Howzit Soda. Leeds beat Liverpool, not Luton. They beat the Canaries.
27 Jan 2013, 21:49 pm
I love it when people resort to childish name calling in response.
27 Jan 2013, 21:56 pm
@Slappes-149:
come on Slappes, you dont really mean that.
the cheetahs play an exciting and entertaining brand of rugby and whats more they comprehensively annihilated the Kings in the CC promo/releg playoffs last season.
you are just fighting Luiperds silly words with some silly words of your own.
27 Jan 2013, 22:07 pm
@Bakkies, I know but he/she is very entertaining. Love the lions fans – all 5600 that attended the game yesterday, unlike these useless cyberfans. Their team need bums on seats instead theyre here talking incoherent drivel.
27 Jan 2013, 22:15 pm
@Slappes-153:
sweet man, enjoy it
just dont get uptight, like some of these Kiwis
27 Jan 2013, 22:31 pm
@David-139: David, EP formed part of the Coastal Sharks, and were unhappy. They sold their rights back to the Sharks and started mopping around and ended up playing 1st Division and Vodacom cup, begging for hand outs from SARU.
As for the Sharks having a academy in the EC, come on you know you are talking through cheekies @ss, the academies are sponsored by SARU the EC partner.
Answer 1 question, in 130 years of rugby history how many times has EP won the Currie Cup?
27 Jan 2013, 22:44 pm
@SodaJoe-145:
27 Jan 2013, 22:44 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-118: ” 118. “No, EP and Border no longer
have anything to do with Sharks super
rugby. They were bought out completely.
And formed the Spears”
arguing with you is futile because your weak arguments are based on hearsay & propaganda. How much did the KZNRU pay Border & EP for their stakes in the Coastal Sharks?
Did SARU approve that sale?
please bring facts & not “braai talk”
oh & as for “sitting on the fence”, again you are being adamant about lies, most here know i have supported EP through & through & it has fokkol to do with “pro-black” anything.
27 Jan 2013, 22:56 pm
@Wanderer-155: ” They
sold their rights back to the Sharks and
started mopping around and ended up
playing 1st Division and Vodacom cup,
begging for hand outs from SARU.”
excuse me but you are mistaken, go do your research & bring us the facts about this sale.
27 Jan 2013, 22:56 pm
@transie, lol! Braaitalkers hahahahaha
27 Jan 2013, 22:57 pm
@Transformation-157: Liewe Luiperd said you also have a secret crush on the Crusaders, is that true?
27 Jan 2013, 22:58 pm
Sigh. Transie……… nobody is disputing that you support the Kings…………………. but if you open your ears and eyes you will see that I am talking about SUPER RUGBY…… when you supposedly did not support any SA team (although you had a soft spot for the Crusaders)…….. you always were able to mock any team of your choosing because you had no colours to fall back on………… well guess what NOW that you do have a team in Super rugby I will be speaking with you during the season hahahahahaha! You have some of your own medicine coming your way boy!
27 Jan 2013, 23:01 pm
Sharks have profiteered big time at EP’s expense. If it weren’t for EP and FS Sharks rugby wouldn’t exist. That why the Sharkishits and some other disgruntled colonialists are at the front of the queue waiting and baying for Kings to fail. Because if they succeed it will immediately and automatically impact on Sharks success who have been luring EP and FS players with their mercenary money since Sharkishits stepped out of 1st division sport Pienaar rugby.
Nearly all Sharks top flight players are either from EP or FS and a couple from GP and WP too.
27 Jan 2013, 23:03 pm
skopskiet is the mother of bullshit talkers
does he even believe what he spews?………………….
27 Jan 2013, 23:05 pm
how long until skopskiet tells people to leave the country back to Victoria’s skirts?
:stuckrecord:
27 Jan 2013, 23:06 pm
This coloniser from Israel by the name of Joel (skopskiet) has an issue with colonialism of the past………………….
:irony:
27 Jan 2013, 23:07 pm
@Transformation-157:
Call me stupid, naive or optimistic, but somehow I think the Kings will be good for a few wins.
Some teams will be “resting or rotating” their teams against them and if they take them too lightly anything can happen.
Who would have thought the Black Caps would win the one day series after the test results?
Complacency can be a bit.ch
27 Jan 2013, 23:09 pm
Sharks think money rules meantime they can’t develop too many top flight players through their school systems without buying them from EP or FS now they started buying them out the cradle from WP and even Pta. No wonder Sharkishits want EP rugby to fail so bad because if it succeeds a big portion of Sharkishits mercenary activities will be curtailed.
27 Jan 2013, 23:12 pm
and they never landed on the moon, JFK was assassinated by the CIA, 9/11 was a USA plot so they could invade for oil, Elvis is alive and living with Michael Jackson, and skop is a 6’7 giant.
27 Jan 2013, 23:17 pm
Stupid whiteys like this liewer luiperd prick is in for a rude awakening he’s still trying to hang on for dear life to his witbaas false sense of security little do these outdated colonialists like him realize those days are long time gone he better wake up and realize the witbaas fallacy is a myth and Kings might just kick his lily white vat to teach schmucks like him the overdue lesson
27 Jan 2013, 23:21 pm
Hahaha! Didn’t take very long for skopskiet to hurl the “C” word….. “colonialism”
Hahaha!
:stuckrecord:
:warpedmind:
:insanedelusions:
Long live the Empire!
27 Jan 2013, 23:22 pm
I will support the Kings over the Stormers.
:anyteamovertheStormers:
27 Jan 2013, 23:24 pm
so will the Stormers score any tries this year? discuss.
27 Jan 2013, 23:28 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-160: why don’t you ask him to qualify his claim?
27 Jan 2013, 23:30 pm
@Liewe Luiperd-161: i’m glad to know my commentary managed to leave you sounding as sour as you do
bring it on!
27 Jan 2013, 23:31 pm
You stupid white schmuck can’t even see what a stupid white schmuck you are stupid white schmucks like you are obsolete you should try come to terms with how stupid and obsolete you stupid white schmuck actually are. Arsetralia is waiting with open borders to welcome more of these stupid white displaced schmucks like you into their fold
27 Jan 2013, 23:33 pm
@nortierd-166: thanks for your positive words chap…my team will have to step up majorly…this is their chance…
27 Jan 2013, 23:36 pm
hahahaha skop is going haywire, the racist pr*ck, loved it!
Transie – you deserve it, you have it coming! Good luck!
27 Jan 2013, 23:38 pm
@Transformation-174: Don’t worry, it only takes a couple of months of consecutive defeat before it stops bothering you. Eventually you’re happy if they score the occasional try or don’t drop the ball at least half the time. Trust me, I’m a Blues fan, I speak from experience
27 Jan 2013, 23:41 pm
Supporting the Crusaders Is far more legitimate than supporting the Brumbies
At least supporting the Crusaders in a south Africa context carries some social correlation of conscientious objection to abhorrent social practices in sport. Supporting the Brumbies just shows what a pathetic delusional displaced thick white colonialist you are
27 Jan 2013, 23:41 pm
@Transformation-176:
no worries
Decisions were made and the rugger is thankfully close to kick off, so to still bleat about the how or why is a waste of time.
I hope the EC supporters pack out the Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium, that will paint the right picture from the first game.
Good luck to your team and enjoy the top flight rugby, it’s been a long time.
27 Jan 2013, 23:43 pm
@gonzo-178: cheers gonzo. i gather from the likes of Pops &NZinChina…the way they carry on here you’d swear their team is contesting playoffs
27 Jan 2013, 23:48 pm
@skop: legitimacy? the claim is outright rubbish…the saders play a brand of rugby i enjoy watching & have often contracted players i like eg israel dagg who impressed me in his rookie season for the landers.
27 Jan 2013, 23:58 pm
@Transformation-181:
Once the Blues are out of the running…the fans live vicariously through the success of whatever Nz team is making a charge for glory…this comes about because of our open mindedness. I will be jumping for joy when the Kings take any of the other Sa franchises down, even a win against any Nz team other than the Blues will make my day….Heres hoping for a successful debut season for the Kings and the sorry demise of Lions Rugby to be resurrected with a promo/relegation win over the Bulls….
27 Jan 2013, 23:58 pm
I don’t advocate supporting the Crusaders in fact of the NZ teams I enjoy the Chiefs brand of rugby more but if anyone who supports the Brumbies as a statement of objection agaInst political interference in S A sport then the dumb white politically duped colonialist idiot should pack his bags for Canberra at the first light of dawn.
28 Jan 2013, 00:35 am
@skopdiekan-184:
I enjoy the Chiefs brand of late. Having played in Waikato, they are staunch rugby people and believe in the hard work ethic and team culture.
With regards to supporting a foreign side to make a type of political statement well I’m trying to think of why do I support the Kings. Its because they deserve the support of Nzers. The Nzrfu by cow-towing to the demands of Sa Rugby during the Apartheid era in an effort to play the Bok gave no thought whatsoever to Black Rugby and how their actions by touring without Maori players would reinforce the ideology of white supremacy in Rugby. Its time we New Zealanders did something for Rugby in areas like EC by offering the little support we can through blogs like this.
28 Jan 2013, 01:02 am
@Te Rangatira-185: what a load of bollocks! “Support through a blog like this”? Man, you are talking shi.t that went down 40 to 50 years ago. Time to move on. Look at what is there today. The Kings are a fiasco. Cheeky Twatson is a doos. The team is a diabolical shambles. You know, people in SA would have been right behind them if they were just brought to the table in a fair and competitive manner, but the minute they were given a political free pass is the minute they lost the majority of SAcan rugby support. I will watch them this season with pity, like you look at an old dog on its last legs, because this sorry mob do not “deserve” to be in Super rugby at all. They don’t even have a Currie Cup team, FFS.
28 Jan 2013, 01:04 am
As a kiwi you love them because they are a walking 5 pointer every season! And for that you feel a little sorry for them. 100 point scorelines coming right up. Admit it. You only dream of more walking 5 pointers in the Republic.
28 Jan 2013, 01:37 am
@Liewe Luiperd-186:
What are you on about? Why do you think Saru have given a spot in Super Rugby to the Kings? I thought it was transformation in Sa rugby to rectify shitt that happened in the past.
You are obviously upset about the process that allowed the Kings in the comp, I can understand that because it was handled in an amateurish fashion, but I still believe they should be given their shot.
“I am talking shitt that went down 40-50 years ago” It still happened didn’t it. Lets be like you and forget about the past yet come up with nothing constructive for the present or future.
“As a kiwi you love them because they are a walking 5 pointer every season!”
No…incorrect….I want the Kings to succeed….At this stage in their development, if they show improvement throughout the season then we should be happy.
28 Jan 2013, 03:06 am
@Transformation-181: not last season but the season before our team WAS contesting play offs, they lost to the eventual champions that year in the Reds..
selective memory Trans?
28 Jan 2013, 03:30 am
I have just listened to the CBS 60 mins. interview conducted by Scott Pellety with USADA representative, Travis Tygart. It is explosive yet extremely chilling and totally sickening. And yet Armstrong has not accepted the challenge to testify under oath to USADA. He seeks to testify to the global cycling body, UCI, the org. he donated in excess of $100,000(a similar sum was rejected by USADA years ago)
In this report, if you follow its magnitude and complexity Tygart clearly is one of the threatened heroes but the global cycling body,UCI is one of the many cheating rogues(and there are very many).
If this, and more, is what happens to clean, good and healthy amateur sport after money is pumped in then ALL such sport is not worth worth a second of my time{but I will wait for whatever testimony is given under oath by the mafia(‘omerta’ is mentioned) machine of Armstrong and his ‘backers}
There are 5 separate and continuous pages to post and I will ascribe each post to a separate page. So expect 5 more pages(posts) after this introductory one.
Lance Armstrong admitted to doping for the first time in an interview with Oprah Winfrey last week. But Travis Tygart, the director of the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency, says Armstrong lied to Winfrey and withheld the truth on key issues. Scott Pelley reports.
28 Jan 2013, 03:36 am
@Liewe Luiperd-187:
Well SA seem to always produce walking 5 pointer teams….. consistency is important here.
I say give the Kings a chance. Let them have a crack at least.
28 Jan 2013, 03:41 am
PAGE 1(of 5). – remember it is an interview between Pelley and Travis Tygart’
The following script is from “The Fall of Lance Armstrong” which aired on Jan. 27, 2013 at &.00EST. Scott Pelley is the correspondent. Michael Radutzky, Michael Rey and Oriana Zill de Granados, producers.
60 Minutes Overtime
Did 60 Minutes help create the myth of Lance? :
We have learned that U.S. anti-doping authorities have given Lance Armstrong a deadline of February 6th to agree to confess all under oath. If he declines, we are told that his lifetime ban in sports will be irreversible. Armstrong admitted to doping, for the first time, in an interview with Oprah Winfrey last week. But the director of the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency, Travis Tygart, told us that Armstrong did not tell the truth in that interview and left out the most important facts that investigators want to nail down.
Tygart is the official who pursued the Armstrong investigation when others had given up. The evidence amassed by his anti-doping agency forced Armstrong to surrender his titles, lose his sponsors and quit his charity. Armstrong says he wants to return to sport. Travis Tygart holds the keys to that decision. So we asked him this week about Armstrong’s talk show confession.
Scott Pelley: You know, at one point in the interview he said that he was curious about the definition of the word cheater. And he looked it up in the dictionary and didn’t think it necessarily applied to him.
Travis Tygart: It’s amazing. I mean Scott you could go to almost any kindergarten in this country or frankly around the world and find kids playing tag or four square and ask ‘em what cheating is. And every one of ‘em will tell you it’s BREAKING THE RULES OF THE GAME. No real athlete has to look up the definition of cheating.
Scott Pelley: Armstrong described doping as so routine, it was, quote, “Like the air in our tires and the water in our bottles.” What did you think of that?
Travis Tygart: It’s just simply not true. And I think it’s a pretty cowardly self-interested justification or rationalization for his decision to defraud millions of people.
The U.S. Anti-Doping Agency, known as USADA, polices U.S. Olympic sport. Last October, it issued a report that’s called a “reasoned decision.” It was a thousand pages of evidence that found that Armstrong had run quote “the most sophisticated, professionalized and successful doping program that sport had ever seen.” That was one of USADA’S conclusions that Armstrong denied in his interview last week.
Scott Pelley: He suggested that cycling in those years was a level playing field because everyone did it. He wasn’t doing anything special.
Travis Tygart: It’s just simply not true. The access they had to inside information to how the tests work, what tests went in place at what time, special access to the laboratory, he was on an entirely different playing field than all the other athletes even if you assume all the other athletes had access to some doping products.
Scott Pelley: Armstrong admitted in the interview to doping throughout his seven Tour de France victories. He tried to make a comeback in 2009. He admitted the first seven, but those last two races in ’09 and 2010 he said he did not dope, he was racing clean.
Travis Tygart: Just contrary to the evidence. The evidence is clear. His blood tests in 2009, 2010, expert reports based on the variation of his blood values from those tests, one to a million chance that it was due to something other than doping.
Scott Pelley: You have to wonder why if he admits to doping in the first seven Tour de France races, why he would proclaim his innocence in 2009 and 2010.
Travis Tygart: I think it stops the criminal conspiracy and protects him and the others that helped him pull off this scheme from potential criminal prosecution if that was in fact true.
Scott Pelley: How does that help him in that way?
Travis Tygart: There’s a five-year statute on a fraud criminal charge. So the five years today would have been expired. However, if the last point of his doping as we alleged and proved in our reasoned decision was in 2010, then the statute has not yet expired and he potentially could be charged with a criminal violation for conspiracy to defraud.
The famous US Postal Team was fueled by dope. There was an illegal blood booster called EPO, there was testosterone, and a banned technique called blood doping in which riders store fresh blood and transfuse it into their bodies during a race. Records were broken, victories spoke for themselves and, for a decade, no one spoke of anything else.
Travis Tygart: The first break that finally cracked the code of silence or the “omerta” that existed in the sport was when several witnesses in the spring of 2010 came forward and they told us their stories.(CBS 60 mins. played a key role in that too).
28 Jan 2013, 03:46 am
PAGE 2(of 5) {On this pageTyler Hamilton is also interviewed}:
Scott Pelley: You used the word “omerta.” That’s a Mafia term.
Travis Tygart: It is a Mafia term. And I think there were parts of this scheme that were run like a Mafia.
In 2010, the U.S. Department of Justice opened a criminal investigation. Armstrong’s teammates were forced to testify — subpoenaed by a grand jury. One of them was Tyler Hamilton.
Scott Pelley: One of the things that is so amazing about all of this is how long it was kept quiet, how many people knew and didn’t say.
Tyler Hamilton: Yeah, people were afraid of Lance Armstrong. People were afraid.
Scott Pelley: But what’s to be afraid of?
Tyler Hamilton: It’s the machine, you know, the Lance machine. That he’s got a lot of connections. If you go against Lance Armstrong, your days in cycling are done.
The testimony of Hamilton and others before the grand jury in Los Angeles was secret — until Hamilton told his story in an interview on “60 Minutes.”
Tyler Hamilton: There was EPO, there was testosterone. So, I– and I did see a transfusion, a blood transfusion.
Three weeks after that story in 2011, Hamilton was in Aspen, Colo., working his way through a crowded bar.
Tyler Hamilton: Turned to my right, and it was Lance Armstrong.
Scott Pelley: So he stops you cold.
Tyler Hamilton: Stops me cold.
Scott Pelley: And says what?
Tyler Hamilton: Well, first he asked how much “60 Minutes” had paid me to do that interview.
Scott Pelley: Answer, nothing.
Tyler Hamilton: Obviously, nothing, yeah. The biggest thing he said is, you know, “We’re gonna make your life a living, f-in’ hell, both in the courtroom and out.”
Scott Pelley: He was, at that moment, the target of a federal investigation. And you were a witness in that federal investigation.
Tyler Hamilton: Yeah. Yeah.
Scott Pelley: Intimidating a witness is a federal crime. Did you feel intimidated?
Tyler Hamilton: I did, I did, I did.
The grand jury heard from at least a dozen Postal riders. There was testimony that a team bus had been pulled over in France while the riders inside were hooked up to banned blood transfusions. Some testified that riders used makeup to cover needle marks. The secret grand jury proceeding went on for two years, but in 2012 the U.S. attorney dropped the case without explanation.
Tyler Hamilton: I was really angry. I knew, you know, I’m not a rocket scientist, but I knew justice wasn’t being served here.
Scott Pelley: You’d gone to the grand jury. You’d told the truth. And the government dropped the case. You’re out there twisting in the wind by yourself.
Tyler Hamilton: Yeah, yeah. And I knew a lot of other people had testified and it was all going to be sealed. And everybody was just going to go along like it had never happened.
28 Jan 2013, 03:50 am
PAGE 3(of 5) {some of the Oprah interview comes in from time to time}
USADA had been monitoring the investigation and Tygart thought that the evidence gathered by the U.S. attorney was overwhelming.
Scott Pelley: Why do you think he dropped the case?
Travis Tygart: I don’t know, Scott. It’s a good question and one that if you find the answer, let me know.
Armstrong congratulated the government for closing the investigation and kept repeating what he told CBS Sports in 2005.
Lance Armstrong: Explain to me how we’ve passed so many tests if we’re so dirty. And they don’t want to answer that question. And that’s not fair.
But Tygart did want to answer that question and he began an investigation. He convinced riders to testify to USADA. He looked at Armstrong’s tests from his first Tour de France victory in 1999 and found EPO. Then, a Swiss lab director, Marcial Saugy, said that after he got a suspicious test result on Armstrong in 2001, he was directed to meet Armstrong and his coach Johan Bruyneel. Saugy said the meeting was set up by the International Cycling Union, which oversees the sport.
Travis Tygart: He was instructed by UCI to meet with Lance Armstrong and Johan Bruyneel and explain the EPO testing process, which he told us was unprecedented. And I asked him, “Did you give Lance Armstrong and Johan Bruyneel the keys to defeat the EPO test?” And he nodded his head yes.
Tygart believes Armstrong had influence over the UCI.
Scott Pelley: Lance Armstrong made a generous donation to the International Cycling Union of $100,000. Do you think that was meant to influence them?
Travis Tygart: I don’t know. Obviously, totally inappropriate.
Scott Pelley: Why inappropriate? Lance Armstrong’s trying to support anti-doping in sport. That’s what he would tell you.
Travis Tygart: It an inherent conflict of interest.
During that interview last week, Armstrong was asked about that 2001 Swiss test.
[Lance Armstrong: That story isn't true. There was no positive test. There was no paying off of the lab. There was no secret meeting with the lab director.
Oprah Winfrey: The UCI didn't make that go away.
Lance Armstrong: Nope. ]
Travis Tygart: He exonerated essentially the UCI. And our information is — and the evidence is — different than that.
Scott Pelley: What was it about what Armstrong said in the interview about UCI that you thought was wrong?
Travis Tygart: I think their involvement was a lot deeper in him pulling off this heist than he was willing to admit to.
Tygart told us Armstrong tried to make a similar donation to USADA.
Tygart made that revelation during our first interview earlier this month which was for “60 Minutes Sports,” our program on the Showtime network. Armstrong was asked about that in the interview last week.
[Oprah Winfrey: Were you trying to pay off USADA?
Lance Armstrong: No, that is not true.
Oprah Winfrey: That's not true?
Lance Armstrong: That is not true.]
28 Jan 2013, 03:53 am
PAGE 4(of 5)
Travis Tygart: That’s just not true. I received a phone call from one of his closest associates and they offered us the money.
Scott Pelley: You took this phone call yourself?
Travis Tygart: Yes.
Scott Pelley: And Armstrong’s representative said what to you precisely?
Travis Tygart: “Lance wants to make a financial donation to USADA.”
Scott Pelley: Who was this representative?
Tygart: It’s one of his closest representatives. I’ve told the federal government in its investigation on the civil fraud side, so I don’t think it would be appropriate now to name the name ’cause it’s still one of his closest representatives.
Scott Pelley: There was no mistaking the purpose of that call?
Travis Tygart: Absolutely not.
Influence and intimidation were key, according to Tygart, to getting riders onboard and keeping them in line.
Scott Pelley: The impression that Armstrong makes in the interview was that he was doping, yes, but he was just one of the guys.
Travis Tygart: He was the boss. The evidence is clear he was one of the ringleaders of this conspiracy that pulled off this grand heist that defrauded using tens of millions of taxpayer dollars, defrauded millions of sports fans and his fellow competitors.
Scott Pelley: There was a rider on the team named Christian Vande Velde. What happened to him?
Travis Tygart: Lance called Christian to his apartment and Lance verbally accosted Christian for not fully being on the doping program to maximize Christian’s performance ’cause his performance was not very good at that point.
Scott Pelley: And Christian Vande Velde’s understanding was after that meeting that if he didn’t dope, what would happen?
Travis Tygart: Lance made it crystal clear as did the doctor who was sitting there that you better fully get on the program or you’re gonna be off the team.
Another US Postal Service rider named Frankie Andreu testified that after he refused to dope, he was fired and Armstrong destroyed his career.
Travis Tygart: It was tough. All these witnesses were scared of the repercussions of them simply telling the truth.
Scott Pelley: What could Lance Armstrong do to them?
Travis Tygart: Incinerate them.
Former teammate Levi Leipheimer felt the heat. Leipheimer said in his sworn affidavit that he came to a cycling dinner after his testimony. Leipheimer says Armstrong was there and sent Leipheimer’s wife a text. It read, “run, don’t walk.”
Scott Pelley: What did she take it to mean?
Travis Tygart: It’s a veiled threat. Knowing her husband had just testified, truthfully, in front of the grand jury and had told citizens of this country about this great fraud. It was a message, “You better run.”
Scott Pelley: Your investigation showed that there were personal threats made against riders who had decided to come clean. I wonder if there were any threats against you.
Travis Tygart: There were, Scott.
Scott Pelley: These threats came from where?
Travis Tygart: Emails, letters.
Scott Pelley: Anonymous?
Travis Tygart: Yeah.
Scott Pelley: Can you remember any of the lines from the emails or the letters?
Travis Tygart: The worst was probably putting a bullet in my head.
Scott Pelley: Did you take that seriously?
Travis Tygart: Absolutely. Turned it over to the FBI to investigate it, which they’re doing.
28 Jan 2013, 04:00 am
Is Lance Armstrong still lying?
PAGE 5(of 5)
Tygart’s agency was also threatened. The CEO of the Livestrong Foundation — Armstrong’s cancer charity — lobbied against USADA before Congress. Members of Congress and 23 California state representatives called for an investigation of the agency’s practices and its taxpayer funding.
Scott Pelley: And yet, you chose to go ahead. You were gambling the fate of USADA itself on this one case.
Travis Tygart: If we’re unwilling to take this case and help this sport move forward, than we’re here for naught. We should shut down. And if they want to shut us down for doing our job on behalf of clean athletes, and the integrity of competition, then shut us down.
Last year, when Tygart made his evidence public, Armstrong had the option of a hearing and confronting the witnesses. But he chose not to fight and he was handed that lifetime ban. In last week’s interview Armstrong said the ban was unfair considering that riders who testified against him were banned for only six months.
Travis Tygart: If you traffic, if you distribute, if you possess, if you use the number of substances that he used over the period of time that he used, then you cover it up and you refuse to come in and be part of the solution, the rules mandate a lifetime ban. But the lowest his ban could go under the rules would be to an eight-year suspension.
Scott Pelley: What does Lance Armstrong have to do for there to be a possibility that USADA’s lifetime ban would be lifted?
Travis Tygart: He would have to come in just like all 11 of his teammates did and testify truthfully about all of those who were involved with him pulling off this grant heist.
Armstrong is facing a lawsuit that alleges that he defrauded the federal government when he lied about cheating to get the Postal Service sponsorship. The suit was filed by former teammate Floyd Landis and in the next few weeks the federal government is expected to decide whether to join Landis in the suit. The potential penalty for Armstrong and his business partners is $90 million.
Scott Pelley: The Department of Justice has not made a decision about whether to join that lawsuit against Lance Armstrong. What do you think they should do?
Travis Tygart: I think they have to join the suit. I mean, we were surprised the criminal case didn’t go forward based on the evidence that we had seen and generated through our investigation. So we’ll be, you know, once again shocked if they don’t join the suit. I think a jury should have an opportunity to decide whether the tens of millions of taxpayer dollars that were defrauded by this team and Lance Armstrong and his associates, whether or not the government should be paid back for that.
As we reported, Tygart has given Armstrong a deadline of February 6th to agree to tell all under oath. Armstrong’s lawyers have now replied to that saying Armstrong cannot appear by that date and, rather than USADA, Armstrong is more likely to tell his story to the International Cycling Union — the same organization that Tygart believes was complicit in hiding Armstrong’s doping.
Scott Pelley: If Lance Armstrong had prevailed in this case and you had failed, what would the effect on sport have been?
Travis Tygart: It would have been huge. Because athletes would have known that some are too big to fail.
Scott Pelley: And the message that sends is what?
Travis Tygart: Cheat your way to the top. And if you get too big and too popular and too powerful, if you do it that well, you’ll never be held accountable.
28 Jan 2013, 04:11 am
Read and weep all you ‘apartheid’ influenced thugs, for only you with that Hitlerite culture can even begin to deem to vaguely overlook his gross indiscretions and, worse still, his insults to any human’s ‘intelligence’ and ethics.
Fortunately, Armstrong never got too bio and too popular and too powerful as he was too much of an oaf and will now be held accountable even if he has to be tempted with the carrots of seemingly further sporting participation.
{{ Victory is certain and revenge for honest ,clean sporting endeavour is sweet.}}
Torment yourselves further with these:
Web Extras
Is Lance Armstrong still lying?
Did 60 Minutes help create the myth of Lance?
Getting on Lance Armstrong’s bad side
Travis Tygart comes face to face with Lance Armstrong
28 Jan 2013, 05:33 am
Psssssoff et, if we want to read about Armstrong we would do so elsewhere so fukoff with the copy and paste…..jeeeez
28 Jan 2013, 06:11 am
@Transformation-173: I asked you a simple question.
Yes or no?
And until I hear otherwise I” take that as a “Yes”.
28 Jan 2013, 06:15 am
@BrumbiesBoy-199: = I’ll
28 Jan 2013, 06:53 am
@BrumbiesBoy-160:
big time.
and dont forget about his man crush for Wayne Smith.
28 Jan 2013, 06:56 am
@skopdiekan-179: Shut-up you shrivelled old fossil.
Try and look on the bright side of things instead of being so belligerent and cantankerous.
28 Jan 2013, 07:02 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-201: Ah, so he’s a closet Cape-Crusader in the true sense of the word, is he?
That’s naaars to know.
Thanks
28 Jan 2013, 07:03 am
@ET.-197:
“honest ,clean sporting endeavour is sweet.”
now you need to turn your focus to rugby.
there is much to be done.
28 Jan 2013, 07:13 am
@BrumbiesBoy-203:
Transie has never been able to hide his admiration for the Crusaders.
i’m sure he sincerely supports the Kings, and the Boks maybe, but there’s no denying his Capesader tendencies.
and dont get me started on his huge man crush for Smith.
28 Jan 2013, 07:32 am
@BrumbiesBoy-199: and i told you exactly what to do with your lousy question, no?
” And until I hear otherwise I” take that as a
“Yes”.
clearly you are of the impression that i give a s.hit what you think
28 Jan 2013, 07:37 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-205: “capecrusader tendencies” geez coming from a self-outed closet bigot like yourself that is a compliment.
why are you “enamoured” with toulon bakkies?
28 Jan 2013, 07:37 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-205:
7 time champs, 2 or 3 times beaten finalists, most final appearances by a team etc etc blah blah and all this from a city of 400 odd thousand what’s there not to admire, and as for Wayne Smith he’s won everything there is to win and some. The Bokke would cement 2nd place in the world under a coach like Smithy.
28 Jan 2013, 07:39 am
@Transformation-207:
more, Transie
28 Jan 2013, 07:39 am
@Transformation-206:
That’s ok Tranny because nobody gives a **** what you think either, it’s a rugby blog for fun you should try and remember that sometimes
28 Jan 2013, 07:43 am
Go Kings!
28 Jan 2013, 07:43 am
@NZINCHINA-208:
Lance Armstrong was a ‘seven times winner’ too.
how coincidental.
28 Jan 2013, 07:44 am
China
If you think this is a rugby blog “for fun” then you are dof.
28 Jan 2013, 07:47 am
@NZINCHINA-208:
Wayne Smith would never be allowed to coach the Boks.
for us its about winning deservedly.
28 Jan 2013, 07:48 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-212:
Or SA schools where doping ( cheating) is rife.
@Dawn-213:
How sad, you’re here for other reasos are you?
28 Jan 2013, 07:48 am
@NZINCHINA-210:
who pissed on your tofu, China
28 Jan 2013, 07:48 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-214:
You mean like at SA schools?
28 Jan 2013, 07:49 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-216:
Yer it’s been a rough couple of days
28 Jan 2013, 07:50 am
Great news about Adongo considering S.A citzenship.
28 Jan 2013, 07:51 am
@NZINCHINA-215:
dont be a fool, China
its hardly ‘rife’.
besides, the point is we make the effort to root out cheating.
pity you cant say the same.
seriously, will the NZ public ever take a stance on dishonesty in the game?
28 Jan 2013, 07:51 am
@NZINCHINA-210: hi Noodles
how are the Blues’ chances this year with JK & Ted running the show?
28 Jan 2013, 07:52 am
@Sasuke-219:
He if doesn’t get SA citizenship the Poms will surely take him.
28 Jan 2013, 07:53 am
@Transformation-207: you do have capesader tendencies – just like your alter ego Rossi who performs impromptu haka’s in front of her tv when the All Blacks play.
28 Jan 2013, 07:53 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-220:
It’s rife but you know this, Goosen was caught just a few years back and numerous bloggers have confirmed this
@Transformation-221:
6th at best, mid table would be acceptable
28 Jan 2013, 07:55 am
@NZINCHINA-210: ” it’s a rugby blog
for fun you should try and remember that
sometimes”
yes, you derive loads of fun feeding your depleted self-confidence by living vicariously off chiefs victories, enjoy
28 Jan 2013, 07:55 am
@NZINCHINA-218:
well i’m sorry to hear, China
dont let it get you down
28 Jan 2013, 07:56 am
@RL-223:
28 Jan 2013, 07:57 am
@Transformation-225:
Look up “know all” in the dictionary and add rugby before it.
28 Jan 2013, 07:57 am
Ja China
I’m here for “other” reasons
To see what certain white people really think.
28 Jan 2013, 07:57 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-226:
Why thank you, I’m over it now, good weekend?
28 Jan 2013, 07:59 am
Oh and there’s another Kings thread just starting up
28 Jan 2013, 07:59 am
@Dawn-229:
You know what certain white people think already
28 Jan 2013, 08:01 am
Ja I’m smart like that
28 Jan 2013, 08:03 am
@NZINCHINA-224:
stop sucking soya out your arse, China
its not rife and Goosen unwittingly took a banned stimulant which was in a supplement he started using.
he admitted to this openly and in no way sought to deceive anyone.
he was punished and has never tested positive before of since.
28 Jan 2013, 08:08 am
@NZINCHINA-230:
ja, its always good for me, China.
28 Jan 2013, 08:22 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-234:
It’s not rife LOL that’s not what the KEO bloggers/ articles and institutions in SA are saying
28 Jan 2013, 08:38 am
@NZINCHINA-236:
when are you going to clean up NZ rugby, China?
28 Jan 2013, 08:54 am
@Dawn-229: This white person thinks Toya Delazy rocked Kirstenbosch yesterday
Lindiwe Suttle wasn’t half bad either 
Where is Taccy – is he embedded with the Bulls in pre-season camp?
28 Jan 2013, 09:07 am
@NZINCHINA-236:
It seems to be rife…China…an estimate of 60% in one school from a parent…easy to score too, just a phone call away without any screening of the call from the dealer…this needs sorting out. Heres hope Houston will take up the crusade with as much vigilance as he has done with that other fruitless cause.
28 Jan 2013, 09:24 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-238:
Lindiwe used to work with Fräulein Gunther.
she’s a beaut.
28 Jan 2013, 09:35 am
@gunther: lindiwe is alright…nandi mngoma though can get it…all day eyday!
http://orgellaonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Silhouette.jpg
28 Jan 2013, 09:38 am
@Transformation-241:
Ushiya
28 Jan 2013, 09:42 am
@gunther-240: She is a stunning woman yes. She was dressed in a pretty gorious white number, that made her look like an angel. In fact, my niece asked if she was meant to be a fairy princess.
Brilliant concert.
28 Jan 2013, 09:44 am
@Transformation-241:
When are you going to post a pic of the new kingmobile?
28 Jan 2013, 09:49 am
Wayne SMith would NEVER coach the Bokke bakkies
he realises that cavemen cant learn new tricks
you are the epitome of this statement
keep crying about how the world treats SA poorly..
given your history, its just desserts I reckon!!
28 Jan 2013, 09:51 am
@i_love_u_bakkiesbotha-234: just like Chilli and Bjorn “unwittingly” took nasal spray???
even when doping SA cant win anything
mind you, adding more dope to dopes doesnt enhance anything, except the meathead factor
28 Jan 2013, 09:54 am
@Te Rangatira-239: Bakkies is the figurehead of the New SA
he has entit\lement issues with his team even though they havent earnt squat
luckily Argentina were invited to join the Tri nations..
it saved them extending their wooden spoon collection, maybe they could use them to heat up the illegal drugs that are so rife in SA rugby
28 Jan 2013, 09:56 am
@the curse-247: Happy Australia Day Pops. Have you got your citizenship yet?
28 Jan 2013, 09:58 am
@stormer in a teacup-248: why would I want citizenship?
I dont need it
28 Jan 2013, 09:58 am
I also support the Crusaders, always been my second choice team.
I love the way they play and that sums up most of the NZ teams as well, exciting to watch.
Does that qualify me as a Cape Crusader?
No one has issues when SA citizens follow Manchester or rave about Brazil or Spain when it comes to soccer, throw in the Aus cricket side of the 90′s and early 2000′s as well.people enjoy watching the brand of play, so why may we not enjoy the AB’s?
Yes, we want our team to win against them, but logic sometimes prevails and we have to accept that the majority of times the NZ teams are better than us.
28 Jan 2013, 10:03 am
@NZINCHINA-228: Transie forgets about 2011, the last time our team made the semi finals… no need to live off the chiefs win, although it was awfully sweet to add yet another title to NZs coffers..
he will become another Tacitus shortly enough, once the kings prop up the table he’ll disappear as well..
all bluster, no substance is our Trans
28 Jan 2013, 10:05 am
@gunther-244: when i receive the mobile on friday…
curious aren’t we?
28 Jan 2013, 10:07 am
@the curse-249:
i thought kiwis were a form of cheap labour in oz?
pay full taxes but get buggerall state benefits?
surely it would pay to take out oz citizenship?
28 Jan 2013, 10:08 am
@the curse-249: Are you a guest worker?
28 Jan 2013, 10:09 am
@Transformation-252:
Fuckyes!
Sounds awesome.
I even googled a Yaris.
Apparently it’s also Hungarian for a vibrating sextoy.
28 Jan 2013, 10:10 am
@charo-253: shows how much you know doesnt it..
stick to berating the coloured people mate, you have a talent for that..
28 Jan 2013, 10:10 am
@nortierd-250: SA soccer sucks. SA rugby does not (well not all the time). That explains it, in a nutshell.
I can guarantee you that no Saffa “supported” the Aussie cricket team of the 90s/00s. What are you smoking?
28 Jan 2013, 10:15 am
@Chico the Chihuahua-257:
You can’t guarantee that, there’s hordes of SA Aussie Cricket fans around, they’re just not so noisy anymore.
28 Jan 2013, 10:16 am
@Chico the Chihuahua-257:
I admired them and barring when they played us, enjoyed their success. They had an awesome side.
We are close to that in our current test set up and it’s fantastic.
I enjoy watching the sport, and if a side is making for enjoyable viewing then I enjoy watching them.
Ps. Just normal cigarettes, I assure you
28 Jan 2013, 10:16 am
@stormer in a teacup-254:
Migrant labour.
28 Jan 2013, 10:18 am
@gunther-260: isnt that Maevis Gunther? or is she SA slave labour?
28 Jan 2013, 10:20 am
@the curse-251: me disappear? no such luck poeps…i know where my team are in terms of their development…no delusions from my side
28 Jan 2013, 10:21 am
Watched a programme on National Geographic about Kiwis (the bird). Apparently it originated in Australia and probably flew to NZ when it still had wings. So I assume that makes Kiwis wingless Aussies.
28 Jan 2013, 10:22 am
@the curse-261:
No Poeps Mavis is a South African citizen.
She probably earns more than you do.
28 Jan 2013, 10:23 am
@gunther-264: yeah okay
she must be one of the lucky ones who actually has a job and a roof over her head..
still, corrugated iron isnt really a roof is it?
28 Jan 2013, 10:25 am
@David-263: must feel awful being manshamed consistently by flightless aussies..
1 win in 8 games
hahahahaha
28 Jan 2013, 10:26 am
Poeps can’t become an aussie. They stopped taking on convicts and strays ages ago.
Although when Poeps heard it was a penal colony, he got mucho excitido. Images of Beau Brummel etc…
28 Jan 2013, 10:27 am
@katman-267: enjoy super rugby this year
oh wait..
still, at least you can beat Russia
‘hahahaha leeusers indeed..
28 Jan 2013, 10:27 am
@the curse-265:
You are a very silly little boy.
She is one of the lucky ones indeed.
I also have a corrugated iron roof.
Nothing beats the sound of the rain falling on it.
28 Jan 2013, 10:28 am
@Chico the Chihuahua-257: ” I can guarantee you that no Saffa
“supported” the Aussie cricket team of the
90s/00s. What are you smoking?”
BrumbiesBoy supported Aus then and still does.
28 Jan 2013, 10:28 am
the Lions
so bad, SARU had to kick them out of the comp
hahahaha
like their supporters, all mouth
hahaha
still, it is SA rugby, we all know how useless they are..
28 Jan 2013, 10:28 am
@the curse-268: I see that will be your standard “dig” for the next 12 months. Ever so creative.
Ja-nee, you cut me deep.
28 Jan 2013, 10:31 am
@katman-272 yawn..
yep, but good to see it doesnt worry you, must beat getting the wooden spoon every year though
something to look forward to for a change huh? ..
28 Jan 2013, 10:33 am
There is an important difference between support & admiration (& there is nothing wrong with admiring something foreign).
But there is something incongruous (I’ll avoid using stronger terminology) about a local person supporting a foreign club/franchise/nation rather than his own.
PS: I however have no compunction supporting a foreign entity where my own is not participating, e.g. I support Italy in European Championship football & in WC football where Bafana is not participating, or it may have been eliminated. I do so, coz one of my best mates is Italian & we often watch the big European/World tournaments together, & it keeps the interest & excitement alive when one actively supports a participating team.
At the end of the day, sport from a spectator’s point of view, is entertainment – yet, with me, & I guess with most others, feelings of historical loyalty & patriotism remain strong … probably decisive.
Go Bokke
Go Sharks
Go Kings
Go Cheetahs
Thereafter ANY local vs. foreign franchise
{in that order}
28 Jan 2013, 10:37 am
@Angostura-274:
Go Bokke
Go Stormers
Go whichever team I picked for Superbru for that 80 minutes:-)
28 Jan 2013, 10:43 am
@nortierd-275:
O, JA, I forgot about THAT!
28 Jan 2013, 10:44 am
Firstly – this was never SARU’s decision to agree to or to deny the Kings request – it is SANZAR that needs to approve/disapprove such a request
Secondly – this increase in 2 foreign players was never ever going to happen – you don’t change the rule book in mid competition
Thirdly – this is no big deal to the Southern Kings – they will acquit themselves well in Super XV
Roll on the 23 February Saturday game against the Force.
28 Jan 2013, 10:44 am
@nortierd-250: HG will be along sharpish to tell you that the Crusaders will never be ‘your team – even your 2nd one’, no matter how much you want it to be so.
And that’s rather richy rich coming from a Rhodesian who supports the Boks and Guppies with such va-va vooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooom and booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooom.
I’m with you on this. No-one can accuse me of being anything other than loyal to the Boks and the Stormers….but as for supporting other franchises in a PROVINCIAL (not national) competition JUST because they happen to be Saffas – bollocksandbuttocks. I don’t like any of them, and I don’t care if they lose. The end. (Cheetahs and Kings can win a few….if they are able)
28 Jan 2013, 10:48 am
@Angostura-274: In a provincial competition (where it is BETTER for my team in any event if the local teams lose as much as possible….) there is no way I give a ratstesticle about the other Saffa teams.
Stormers and Blues – the end.
(If folk are honest….they will admit this to be true
Like you’re really going to cheer for the Bulls (when they are 1 point behind the guppies on the leader board) to beat the Reds? Really?)
28 Jan 2013, 10:50 am
@Gordon Gekko-277:
Hear, hear
28 Jan 2013, 10:52 am
@Angostura-274: yeah!
Go Bokke
Go Kings
28 Jan 2013, 10:53 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-279:
Quite right.
I cheer for anyone but the Stormers.
28 Jan 2013, 10:55 am
@gunther-282: The way it should be
28 Jan 2013, 11:02 am
@Gordon Gekko-277: firstly, just to correct you. this indeed is SARU’s juristiction & not SANZAR!
The ARU unilaterally allowed the Rebels to have 10 international players in their team while all the other Aussie franchises are only allowed 1 big name star player & one ‘development’ player that can be a Wallaby in future.
it is SARU’s decision to make.
cheers.
28 Jan 2013, 11:04 am
Bokke
Stormers
Cheetahs
Sharks
Bulls
Faark the kings
If the sharks are one point behind the bulls and the bulls play the reds, tough **** sharks cause they in that position of their own accord, I still shout for the bulls!
28 Jan 2013, 11:07 am
Petty provincial jealousy by some here is quite pathetic. I don’t hate the sharks cause hg is a doos.
28 Jan 2013, 11:12 am
So what happens now to the three foreigners not in the squad? Do they get deported, like the Poms did to the Saffa flank when his contract ended?
28 Jan 2013, 11:13 am
@katman-287:
They will be pruning Sheeky’s roses.
28 Jan 2013, 11:15 am
@gunther-255: A Hungarian gigolo named Yaris?
28 Jan 2013, 11:16 am
@gunther-288: That sounds like a filthy euphemism. Do his roses need pruning in the same car park as Div’s?
28 Jan 2013, 11:19 am
@katman-290:
This won’t end well.
Mark my words.
28 Jan 2013, 11:23 am
@gunther-291: Perhaps not, but who cares when you’re going for gold at the Cheeky Flower Show?
28 Jan 2013, 11:24 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-289:
No angel.
A rubber **** like the one you keep in your sock drawer.
@katman-292:
He’s guaranteed a medal on the shrinking violet category.
28 Jan 2013, 11:40 am
@The Sharks rugby pedigree is packaged as dog food-279:
You make a valid point, & I’ll concede that there are tactical exceptions to my strategic rule that “local is lekker”.
But I’ll tell you what is really important to me, much more so than the fortunes of the Sharks, the Kings & the Cheetahs individually, & that is the health of SA Rugby overall (please note, not just Bok rugby).
I believe a good indication of SA Rugby HEALTH is when we observe the following symptoms:
1. WP rugby is strong
2. Tvl rugby is strong
3. N-Tvl rugby is strong
4. FS rugby is competitive
5. KZN rugby is competitive
6. EC rugby is competitive
7. Griquas rugby is competitive.
The above is what I’d like to see (& we have not seen it for ages!). I’ support the Sharks in S15/CC, but in the interests of SA Rugby I don’t mind the Stormers, the Bulls & the Lions being better than the Sharks. Those are the powerhouses of SA Rugby, & it is the way it should be given their rugby tradition/history, clubs, players & wealth.
Given this hypothesis, I cannot understand how genuine SA rugby lovers do not care about the state of rugby in the Tvl, FS, Griquas & especially the EC. Resources & sound policies should be applied to restore Tvl to its former glory, & the FS, Griquas & E-Cape to their traditional levels of competitiveness.
And in the Tvl AND the E-Cape the need is the greatest.
{KZN can take care of themselves, & are now consistently performing way beyond the historical norm for this region – Tvl, FS, Griquas & E-Cape can all learn from the Sharks … hmmm: perhaps I’m unfair to Griquas? perhaps they are already performing to potential?}
I simply cannot believe what I read here & in other blogs/publications – that the majority of (presumably white?) SA rugby fans are actively willing the Kings to failure (even against foreign teams!) with a passion bordering on fanaticism/hatred.
It is shocking.
It is entirely selfish.
It short-sighted & not in SA Rugby’s best interests.
It is ugly.
Both the Kings & the Lions are very important to SA Rugby – and ways must be found to restore rugby health in their feeder areas.
The common good, not the sectarian good, should be paramount.
28 Jan 2013, 12:05 pm
SARU are an embarrassment. The only fukkup they haven’t managed is to have the World Cup taken off them.
28 Jan 2013, 12:13 pm
June 26 2012
IT is time for the ARU to change their
rules on the amount of foreign imports
allowed each franchise.
The dilapidated state of the Western Force
makes it clear that Australia does not
have enough talent to sustain five
competitive teams in Super Rugby.
The Melbourne Rebels are allowed 10
international imports</bbut have raided
rival provinces to poach James O'Connor,
Kurtley Beale and Scott Higginbotham in
the past 18 months.
Their unused foreign import spots should
surely be given to the franchises affected
by local talent losses.
It is surprising to learn that none of the
franchises have officially made this
request to the ARU. While the Rebels'
foreign player quota will decrease over
the coming years, it is of no consolation
to the remaining Australian teams who
can hire just one marquee international,
and one emerging overseas player who
could develop into a Wallaby after a
three-year residency.
28 Jan 2013, 13:02 pm
@David-263: Cut the wings off to stop them going back did they?
Ah-ha, now we know where the poaching started!
28 Jan 2013, 13:04 pm
@katman-267:
28 Jan 2013, 13:08 pm
“‘If this is the case, we will accept and abide by the decision of SA Rugby. We know that the region has never been fed with a silver spoon, and have no reason to expect any different going into our debut Super Rugby season,’ Watson said”
What a load of kak. How did you get into S15 this year………..Thats as silver spoon as it gets
28 Jan 2013, 13:10 pm
@Transformation-270: At least you got that one right.
28 Jan 2013, 13:17 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-300: he reckons you’re a k.nob for it
28 Jan 2013, 14:14 pm
I’m happy for him.
28 Jan 2013, 15:56 pm
Kings got in cause nobody wants to see lions loose anymore. The rather watch kings loose.
Have your say
You must be logged in to post a comment.