Kings to field four foreigners
30 Jan 2013
The Southern Kings have included four international players in their squad for the warm-up match against a Franchise XV on Friday.
On Sunday, the Kings released a statement in reaction to an article published earlier that day in Rapport. The article said that Saru would not allow the Kings to field all five of their foreigners in Super Rugby, and that the Eastern Cape franchise would be restricted to two.
EP president Cheeky Watson did, however, state that while the franchise had accepted Saru’s decision, they would not be releasing their foreign players. ‘There are still ample opportunities within our structures for them to contribute,’ Watson said at the time.
Four of these players, namely Daniel Adongo (Kenya), Hadleigh Parkes (New Zealand), Tomas Leonardi (Argentina), and Virgil Lacombe (France), have been picked to play in a warm-up fixture this Friday. A statement released by the Kings on Wednesday revealed how much game time each player will enjoy in this match.
Southern Kings:
15. Elric van Vuuren
14. Sergeal Petersen (40 mins) / Siviwe Soyizwapi (40 mins)
13. Ronnie Cooke (60 mins) / Siyanda Grey (20 mins)
12. Andries Strauss (Captain) (40 mins) / Hadleigh Parkes (40 mins)
11. Marcello Sampson (40 mins) / Siyanda Grey (20 mins) / Sergeal Petersen (20 mins)
10. George Whitehead (40 mins) / Wesley Dunlop (Vice Captain) (40 mins)
9. Shaun Venter (40 mins) / Johan Herbst (40 mins)
1. Jaco Engels (40 mins) / Schalk Ferreira (40 mins)
2. Virgil Lacombe (40 mins) / Bandise Maku (40 mins)
3. Ross Geldenhuys (40 mins) / Kevin Buys (40 mins)
4. David Bullbring (80 mins)
5. Daniel Adongo (40 mins) / Rynier Bernardo (40 mins)
6. Devin Oosthuizen (Vice Captain) (40 mins) / Tomas Leonardi (40 mins)
7. Wimpie van der Walt (40 mins) / Mpho Mbiyozo (Captain) (40 mins)
8. Jacques Engelbrecht (40 mins) / Cornell du Preez (40 mins)
216 Comments
30 Jan 2013, 13:17 pm
Is this the Kings’ A or B team?
30 Jan 2013, 13:18 pm
@Tacitus-1: Hoekom is jy so skaars?
30 Jan 2013, 13:19 pm
@Taahirah-2:
Kom nou eers terug in the swing of things. Soos die rugby optel sal ek meer begin belangstel.
30 Jan 2013, 14:05 pm
@Tacitus-1: Kind of a combination: All the Kings’ carthorses and all the Kings’ journeymen.
30 Jan 2013, 14:12 pm
@Tacitus-1: they are either A Negative or B Positive.
30 Jan 2013, 14:19 pm
Cheeky…
30 Jan 2013, 14:25 pm
Go Kings!
30 Jan 2013, 14:26 pm
@Transformation-7: Yes, anywhere. Just fcking go.
30 Jan 2013, 14:28 pm
What the Bulls would give to have Johnny English back.
What is a franchise XV
A combined KFC & Nandos outfit?
30 Jan 2013, 14:30 pm
suur katte around here…
30 Jan 2013, 14:57 pm
i really feel SARU should have allowed them to field the extra foreign players.
perhaps there were some offence taken because the Kings (Cheeky) had tried (well, did do it) to contract the foreign players first and then asked SARU if it was ok after, understandably this probably left some persons sensibilities hurt.
basically a cart before the horse manuover.
@gunther-9:
30 Jan 2013, 14:59 pm
@Tacitus-3:
Good day!
30 Jan 2013, 15:32 pm
Nandos & KFC XV 51 Kings 3
30 Jan 2013, 16:06 pm
Is the team allowed to field so many players?
Even so, all the other teams will put more than 50 points pass them, despite playing a Kings Army.
30 Jan 2013, 16:12 pm
I think people are missing something here. On another site it said that they are not allowed more than 2 foreign players IN A MATCH DAY SQUAD. That is clearly something else than only allowing 2 in the full tournament bigger squad.
Of course then they can still provide some depth.
30 Jan 2013, 16:19 pm
Where is Catrakillis, Killian & Nell?
30 Jan 2013, 16:30 pm
two foreigners in Super squad submitted to SARU…can’t swap them match to match…
30 Jan 2013, 16:30 pm
@TooMuchRugby-16:
And Sykes?
30 Jan 2013, 16:32 pm
@Transformation-17:
That’s a pity. Kings have been screwd by SARU.
30 Jan 2013, 16:41 pm
Filthy arrogant fckers – what entitles them to field so many ineligible players.
30 Jan 2013, 16:43 pm
@RL-20:
They must have it
Dont you get it yet
When will you get it
30 Jan 2013, 16:46 pm
@TooMuchRugby-19: yeah SARU are adept at double speak…
Melbourne will be allowed to recruit up to
10 foreign players for their entry to the
expanded Super 15 rugby competition in
2011.
The Australian Rugby Union on Monday
announced significant foreign-player
concessions for Melbourne to give the
franchise every chance of being competitive
in their debut season.
The ARU Foreign Player Policy allows a
Super Rugby province to contract up to two
overseas players: one marquee signing who
has already qualified for another nation
and a development player who could
qualify for Australian selection under the
IRB’s three-year residency regulation.
If a province does not sign a marquee
player it can contract two development
players.
But the ARU board has eased the existing
Foreign Player Policy for Melbourne only,
granting them permission to sign up to 10
players to their 30-man roster.
It is hoped the concession also protects
Australia’s other four franchises – the NSW
Waratahs, Queensland Reds, ACT Brumbies
and Western Force.
The concession of eight additional foreign
players will gradually be rolled back so that
by 2015 Melbourne will have the same
number of overseas players as the other
four Australian teams
.
“It is important to ensure Melbourne can
recruit a team that is competitive from day
one,” ARU chief John O’Neill said.
“The concessions we have put in place
provide Melbourne with every opportunity
for immediate success, while also ensuring
there is ongoing sustainability moving
forward.
the only important thing to SARU are votes by the Presidents Council
30 Jan 2013, 16:47 pm
@RL-20:
Shall we go through this again…….slowly
Because SARU took so long to make decision about the Kings, they were unable to contract SA players like they would have liked to, because they were already signed at that stage abd previously were not willing to sign before SARU made a decision.
Capiche?
Furthermore, don’t hate the players for the administration’s cockups.
30 Jan 2013, 16:59 pm
@TooMuchRugby-23:
> Because SARU took so long to make decision about the Kings
Weren’t you one of the lot saying it’s no excuse when we said HM needed time and it’s not his fault when SARU only appointed him Bok coach a couple of months before his first test?
Yet now you want leniency for the Kings?
30 Jan 2013, 17:09 pm
@Dawn-21: they will not be having it.
@TooMuchRugby-23:really! They were told back in 2009 that they would play superrugby in 2013 – Checky said then that they were going to start preparing for their entry into superrugby cause the decision was made. He said they will be ready. Now if he was more interested in using the superrugby money SARU dished out to them on Pukes massive salary instead of on contracting young players and developing them by doing what the Lions are doing – that is giving their young players exposure to international teams – the Kings would not have a need to ‘buy’ success. – instead they adopt the typical victim mentality and wait for hand-outs and special exemptions. Pathetic!
30 Jan 2013, 17:11 pm
@TooMuchRugby-23:
Also what top player would take a chance of leaving an existing franchise to one that may only last one season?
@victoriabok-24:
Those were just opinions. HM didn’t have the possibility of being axed after one season if he didn’t perform.
30 Jan 2013, 17:16 pm
@David-26:
surely the kings would back themselves to win their promotion/relegation games vs the LIons?
30 Jan 2013, 17:24 pm
@David-26:
They still were very nasty about HM not having a WC winning side after one traing session
Make no mistake, it’s an unenvialble task to build a Super Squad in one season.
I know, HM had to do it as well in 2000 when the Bulls were very weak(I think they had to play a relegation match as well, it was when they merged the first and second division and they played in an X and Y pool)
I’ve got nothing against the players, not even Luke the player, he was very unlucky at his prime not to get a Bok jersey, just like Ettienne Botha was
But the way the Kings were pushed in by politicians and forced the Lions out left a bad taste in the mouths of most rugby supporters
Luke the politcian and his dad stirring the political pot ain’t making them friends either
30 Jan 2013, 17:25 pm
@gunther-27:
They might, but I wouldn’t, especially with all the Lions loan players back.
30 Jan 2013, 17:27 pm
To be fair, the Kings are only following the example set for them by SARU. Wasn’t it SARU who promised the Kings a spot in Super Rugby before consulting SANZAR about whether or not SA could enter an additional team without losing an existing one.
30 Jan 2013, 17:31 pm
@victoriabok-24: you seem to forget how the Lions miraculously avoided relegation in 2006
selective amnesia?
30 Jan 2013, 17:33 pm
” But the way the Kings were pushed in by
politicians and forced the Lions out left a
bad taste in the mouths of most rugby
supporters!
please tell us how did the lions keep their status in 2006 & what taste did that saga leave in the hallowed mouths of rugby supporters?
30 Jan 2013, 17:36 pm
@motomouse-30: politics aside- why is that they were unable to develeop a team strong enough to qualify for the Currie Cup premier division – remember that they were getting their superrugby cheque since 2009 – financially they were getting paid more than the Griqua’s, Puma’s and Leopards.
3 years of preparation and all that they could do was field an all white team that got moered by the Cheetahs B team in a promotion match.
30 Jan 2013, 17:36 pm
@Transformation-31:
Would the Kings/Spears have won a relegation match against the Lions in 2006?
They are a lot stronger now, yet they couldn’t beat the lowest ranked Cheetahs?
Twice
30 Jan 2013, 17:39 pm
I can’t answer that question RL, I was merely pointing out a trend in SA rugby, I’m a Sharks supporter so I’m more concerned about my team’s potential for looking so good on paper but failing to deliver, I really hope this is our year.
30 Jan 2013, 17:41 pm
@Transformation-32:
> 2006 & what taste did that saga leave in the hallowed mouths of rugby supporters?
Rather tell us how the first wave of comrade management(Pukie and Pappie are the second) destroyed EP rugby and in true kleptocrat fashion took(stole) all the money?
And what taste it left the mouths of EP/Mighty Elepahnts/Spears/Kings supporters?
30 Jan 2013, 17:42 pm
@victoriabok-34: that is subject to conjencture…SARU rules were te same as now, the lowest team after 2006 gets relegated..that never happened.
what taste did it leave in your mouth as a rugby lover?
30 Jan 2013, 17:47 pm
@motomouse-35: good luck for your team guppy – they are looking good.
Now score a ton against the entitled ones.
30 Jan 2013, 17:47 pm
@victoriabok-36: ahhh deflections…clearly certain things leave bittet taste n your selective mouth…
what taste is left in your mouth after manie reyneke & janie ferreira destroyed the lions, paid themselves handsomely from glru coffers, to the point the lions are reported by kpmg to be millions in the red? you like that taste?
30 Jan 2013, 17:50 pm
@RL-38:
Thank you, I can’t wait for Super Rugby to start. Living here in the UK I am subjected to rugby that looks like it’s being played in quicksand it’s so slow.
30 Jan 2013, 17:53 pm
@Transformation-37:
They would have been in for one year only as well, and the result would have been the same as this year
If a CC winning team like the Bulls couldn’t do much in S12 in 2002-2004, what chance would a First Division tean like EP have had?
BTW Do you know EP has played Super rugby before?
They’ve played in the Super 10 in 1994
Didn’t do much though
Guess some things never change eh?
30 Jan 2013, 17:54 pm
@RL-33: ” financially they were getting paid more
than the Griqua’s, Puma’s and Leopards.”
really? Border, Ep & SWD were getting paid more than the Central Cheetahs franchise partners?
30 Jan 2013, 17:55 pm
@Transformation-39:
> you like that taste?
Not so much as you it seems?
Do you prefer Luke’s or Cheeky’s?
30 Jan 2013, 17:56 pm
@RL-33:
Wasn’t the KIngs SR cheque divided between the three CC unions?
30 Jan 2013, 17:57 pm
@David-44:
Which is more than can be said for the Lions cheque.
30 Jan 2013, 17:59 pm
@victoriabok-41: ” They would have been in for one year only
as well, and the result would have been the
same as this year”
again you are babbling untruths…do the research and then comment with background. the above statement is wrong.
30 Jan 2013, 17:59 pm
@Transformation-42: what were they doing with their 1/6th of their superrugby cheque – besides paying Pukes salary – keeping it all to themselves ala Lions style.
30 Jan 2013, 18:01 pm
@victoriabok-41:
Yup, and N.Tvl, WP and OFS didn’t qualify that year.
30 Jan 2013, 18:10 pm
@RL-33: after hogging Supee Rugby money for FIVE YEARS the lions were still s.hit but their relegation leaves a bitter taste in VictoriaBok’s mouth
and you want to tell me these self-proclaimed rugby lovers are objective…
tltltl
30 Jan 2013, 18:14 pm
@Transformation-49: and after the Watsons carved up a huge portion of superrugby money to pay Puke does it not leave you feeling sick!
When did i say anyone was objective Transformer, on this place hahahahahaha.
30 Jan 2013, 18:17 pm
If you were wondering why we get so many articles on Keo about the Kings and the Watsons, this might enlighten you
http://www.sport24.co.za/Columnists/GraemeJoffe/SASCOC-is-sicker-than-sick-20130130
“Shane Keohane has seemingly assumed the position of SASCOC’s PR spokesperson, taking over from his brother* who resigned in disgrace just before the London Olympics. Still to this day, no tender for the SASCOC PR account, which SASCOC awarded to HSM and Gideon Sam’s old “Bok” mate, Mark Keohane.
In September last year, Mark Keohane tweeted: Gideon & Tubby. I had pleasure of seeing the work put in over 4 yrs. Stay strong, stay united. There’s not a better Pres/CEO combo
Keo, come up for some air!
No doubt, you’ve seen a recent upsurge in Luke Watson PR and “good” publicity. Luke apologising for his Afrikaans insult and saying the Lions have been treated unfairly with Super rugby relegation.
Well, the spin doctor, Mark Keohane is Luke’s agent but when exposed that he wasn’t an accredited SARU agent, he quickly threw the hospital pass to brother, Shane, as the cover up.
The HSM stable also “own” the SA Rugby magazine to aid their spin but SA Rugby (SARU) have conveniently turned a blind eye.
In short, SA Rugby is not the registered trademark of HSM and if they use it they should be paying SARU a rights fee – which they haven’t. SARU also paid HSM a stipulated annual amount to produce Fifteen and other publications.
They’re all in bed together.
So, you can see why SARU never took any action against Keohane for being an unaccredited agent and why I got hogwash answers and lies from SARU to a number of my related questions in a previous column.”
*- Would that be Keo?
30 Jan 2013, 18:19 pm
@Transformation-42:
They were definately paid more than the Lions franchise partners, they were never paid
30 Jan 2013, 18:25 pm
@victoriabok-51: nepotism! Just like the nepotism which saw Cheeky contract his son and pay him a huge salary way, way, way outside the bracket you would pay a vodacon cup player.
30 Jan 2013, 18:29 pm
@RL-50: after the Watsons took over we bought Darron Nell, Jaco Engels, SP Marais, Rory Duncan, Wayne van Heerden etc & won the 1st Div twice in three years from nowhere. Cheeky & Anele never stole or pilfered ANY money!
30 Jan 2013, 18:32 pm
hey RL…what do you call paying a coach millions to lose ALL 13 super rugby games & still keep him on the payroll as DoR?
30 Jan 2013, 18:39 pm
@Transformation-54:
What do you call the third oldest provincial union in the country, one that has never won anything worthwhile?
Losers?
No, the Kings/EP
30 Jan 2013, 18:43 pm
@RL-53:
That’s the point, isn’t it? If they’d only paid salaries at VC player level, they’d never attract any CC or SR players. I wonder how much of a drop Luke took when he left Bath?
30 Jan 2013, 18:45 pm
@victoriabok-56:
The oldest white provincial union. Stick to the facts VC.
30 Jan 2013, 18:46 pm
@Transformation-54: so paying Puke, a Vodacom cup play a huge, huge, huge superrugby salary while bringing in has-beens and paying them a pittance is all okay – nice.:wink:
and please come up with something better than “legacy” issues – LOL
30 Jan 2013, 18:47 pm
@David-57:
> I wonder how much of a drop Luke took when he left Bath?
If you add all the construction tenderpreneur kickbacks he’ll get under the table from Cheeky, he would surely make quite a bit more
And if you add all the Luke promoting Keo does on his site and in his magazine, he’ll probably get some sponsorship money as well
30 Jan 2013, 18:54 pm
@David-58:
Nope Western Province was formed in 1883, then Griquas in 1886 and then EP in 1888
30 Jan 2013, 18:54 pm
The simple fact is that SARU painted themselves into a corner, promising both the Kings & the Lions what they could not deliver (i.e. 6 Super Rugby franchises in 2013); SARU then drowning in the excrement of their own doing, & not knowing how to solve the problem, hatched this sinister plot to sacrifice the Lions for 2013 only (in the process probably unwittingly delivering the death knell to that once proud Union), whilst at the same advancing the Kings as SA’s 5th Super Rugby franchise for 2013 under such suffocating circumstances & conditions (1 year guarantee only, late [no, f_uckin laaaaaate!] decision to confirm the Kings’ participation so as to make it impossible to recruit properly, & then finally putting the boot in by refusing them more than 2 foreign players); all of this so as to ENSURE that the Kings fail at first (& only attempt) at readmission to the top tier. Those that control SARU have their own agenda, & that agenda is not disclosed. It was like that for a long time, & it must still be – coz the alternative simply cannot be; how can SARU possibly be so incompetent? I just cannot believe that they can be so utterly f_uckin useless. Tis a plot, dudes … tis the SARU way … look at the history of this thing & convince me otherwise.
But … maybe, just maybe the Kings won’t roll over and play dead – maybe things don’t go according to Plan – sport is full of surprising outcomes.
The victims here are both the Lions & the Kings.
Anyway, for the record:
1. The Southern Kings ARE a very different outfit to the EP Kings that faced the Cheetahs in the CC playoffs – so don’t make judgments based on CC playoffs;
2. It WAS impossible to recruit top quality players until it was too late to do so (thx SARU);
3. The fact that the Kings feeder unions were not playing rugby at the highest level for a long time made it impossible to retain their BEST homegrown talent – by my count 24 such players that learnt their rugby in the Kings area (i.e. up to & including at least high school level) find themselves gracing the squad sheets of other Super XV franchises; in addition there are another 4 or 5 players in current other Super XV squads that spent their formative rugby development (junior school years) in the greater southern & eastern cape areas, before they moved on to schools such as Grey College & KES (presumably on rugby bursaries); & most black African rugby players you see in your favourite franchise team come to you via the EC & Border regions; similarly SWD is a nursery for Coloured rugby players, & several of those now grace the squads of other (non-Kings) franchises;
4. I’m first and foremost a Sharks rugby fan, but I can tell you that the Kings area is much more important to SA Rugby than for instance KZN – all you have to do, is do a count of how many Super XV squad players countrywide learnt their rugby in the Kings area, & how many did so in KZN; & whilst you’re about it also tally how many of the (Mighty) Sharks & Cheetahs current squads actually come to them courtesy of Kings’ schools or provincial teams; also count the Springboks that the Sharks & Kings regions had respectively nurtured from primary school levels upwards from the beginnings of Bok rugby up to the present day;
5. Did the majority of the Black & Coloured rugby players who during the most recent decades became Springboks not add to the quality of our rugby, & did a substantial portion of them not come from the Kings feeder regions? And then, if we really wish to grow rugby in SA is it not very important that a franchise like the Kings should be successful?
Ai tog, mense …
Ah, well – let me say it: Viva Kings!
30 Jan 2013, 18:56 pm
@David-57: no that is not the point – the point is not to pay a Vodacom cup player a superrugby salary while neglecting the rest of the team – the team that won the currie cup 1st division were moered by a Cheetahs B team -s urley contracting young player(Jake White style) would have been the way to go. Instead one players gets the meat – oupa’s and has-beens next in line and the remainder to the plebs. (nothing to the suits as per Transformer)
Result 15 whilte players (1st divion champions) getting rogered!
30 Jan 2013, 19:01 pm
@David-58:
> The oldest white provincial union. Stick to the facts VC
I’ll remind you of this when you lot again extoll all Province’s CC wins in the 1880′s when there were no other teams to play against and the team bus was an oxwagon
30 Jan 2013, 19:02 pm
gun maar vir elkeen sy ou plekkie in die son.
our lives will still continue irrispective of who plays in the tournament, so it’s pointless sweating the small stuff.
30 Jan 2013, 19:03 pm
@victoriabok-61:
Sorry, I meant to type the 3rd oldest. My emphasis was on “white union”.
30 Jan 2013, 19:05 pm
RL: your Currie Cup playoff crutch is useless seeing that FRANCHISE participation in Super Rugby is not even remotely related to Currie Cup status, so all you’re doing is pissing against the wind
the Lions FRANCHISE played in Super Rugby while two of its partners played 1st division currie cup
30 Jan 2013, 19:06 pm
@victoriabok-64:
Don’t be jealous VB
It’s not us saying it, it’s engraved on those little golden plates on the Cup itself.
History for all to read.
If your team’s forefathers mushed the oxen a bit quicker they might have gotten their shi.t together sooner and also competed with us big boys
30 Jan 2013, 19:06 pm
@David-57:
250k at bath 3 bar at the kings?
Not much I’d say.
30 Jan 2013, 19:09 pm
@Angostura-62:
Thanks for introducing some sanity and substance to this never ending dismissal of the Kings region and SARUs ineptness.
30 Jan 2013, 19:09 pm
White provincial unions?
Which are they and which are not?
30 Jan 2013, 19:09 pm
@Angostura-62:
> The Southern Kings ARE a very different outfit to the EP Kings that faced the Cheetahs in the CC playoffs – so don’t make judgments based on CC playoffs;
Nope pull my other finger
Why would they deliberately hamper their chances by not selecting the strongest team available?
Anyway all teams are different from the ones last year, players move to other franchises, some retire and new ones join all the time
Everytime the Kings win, they wax lyrical about “how they must play Super Rugby”, yet everytimne they lose “it’s not a full strength team” and “mostly made up of Eagles and Bulldogs players” like when they played the Lions last year
30 Jan 2013, 19:10 pm
@Angostura-62:
Nicely done.
30 Jan 2013, 19:11 pm
@Transformation-67: nc nc nc Transformer – who needs partners. Lions can build a team without help from “partners”.
what is the difference between the Golden Lions and the Lions, between the Bulls and the Blue Bulls, between WP and the Stormers.
Try harder Transformer.
end of the day the EP Kings = Kings (yes/no)
30 Jan 2013, 19:14 pm
@victoriabok-72: look boet, lets cut the c_rap & wait for Super XV to commence
Then we chat on the strength of results, not conjecture
30 Jan 2013, 19:14 pm
@nortierd-68:
If you think beating the Worcester School for the Blind XV in 1884 and the Oom Tas Paternoster Fishermen rugby club in 1885 justifies the Currie Cup, moet jy meer water of rooi koeldrank byggooi
30 Jan 2013, 19:17 pm
@gunther-71:
Prior to ’94, all the CC unions. That’s why I added the word white to your definition of oldest.
30 Jan 2013, 19:18 pm
@Angostura-62:
> The fact that the Kings feeder unions were not playing rugby at the highest level for a long time made it impossible to retain their BEST homegrown talent – by my count 24 such players that learnt their rugby in the Kings area
If you think they’re going to recruit any young future Boks soon you’d be mistaken
The talent scouts from the big unions will keep signing them up while they’re still at school, and I doubt it the Kings would be able to match their offers
Barring a draft system the status quo will remain
30 Jan 2013, 19:19 pm
@RL-74:
FS Cheetahs and Cheetahs?
30 Jan 2013, 19:20 pm
@victoriabok-76:
So in other words you are admitting that the Worcester School for the Blind XV in 1884 and the Oom Tas Paternoster Fishermen rugby club in 1885 were actually better than your beloved Bulls because they could actually compete and play the game?
That takes a big man to admit that VB, I am proud of you.
Die groot groot oupa grootjies moes minder gestop het om van antie Ossewania op die pad te piets dan sou hulle vroeer n span kon bymekaar gelas het.
30 Jan 2013, 19:21 pm
@David-77:
Ok so we pretend that there was no rugby before that?
You’d better tell your pal norty.
30 Jan 2013, 19:22 pm
@David-79: FS Cheetahs B team moered the EP Kings – now imagine what their A team will do to the EP Kings – now imagine the FS Cheetahs, reinforced with some Griquas will to to the Kings (not the EP Kings)
30 Jan 2013, 19:26 pm
@Angostura-62:
> how many of the (Mighty) Sharks & Cheetahs current squads actually come to them courtesy of Kings’ schools or provincial teams; also count the Springboks that the Sharks & Kings regions had respectively nurtured from primary school levels upwards from the beginnings of Bok rugby up to the present day
Same could be said of many unions, like the Leopards(Western Transvaal)they’ve supplied many players and Boks to the Lions and Bulls over the years
And so did Boland with WP etc etc, and they will keep on doing it
A lot of the smaller unions are feeders to the bigger ones but it doesn’t mean it justifies inclusion into Super Rugby
30 Jan 2013, 19:26 pm
@victoriabok-78:
Ne? In PE they’ve already successfully retained their first such player, Sergeal Petersen, the 2012 Coca Cola Craven Week Player of the Tournament, & now a 2013 Kings Super XV squad member.
OK, out – time to go home
30 Jan 2013, 19:27 pm
@gunther-81:
I’m devastated Gunther.
That means going to Newlands every Saturday from primary school through high school doesn’t count.
O my misspent youth
Our glory days of the 80′s wiped out with a couple of clicks on Keo.
30 Jan 2013, 19:31 pm
@nortierd-85:
Ja.
Sorry.
30 Jan 2013, 19:32 pm
@nortierd-80:
> Die groot groot oupa grootjies moes minder gestop het om van antie Ossewania op die pad te piets dan sou hulle vroeer n span kon bymekaar gelas het
Hulle was te besig om met Tranie se oupagrootjie en uitgebreide familie te baklei
En om mielies te plant en beeste te boer
Almal weet jy moet ‘n braai hou voor, gedurende en na die rugby en hoe kan jy sonder pap en wors?
Dis tydmors
Ons eet nie waterlelies nie en vis net in noodgevalle, hel ons vermy tot meisies wat snoekerig ruik
30 Jan 2013, 19:36 pm
@nortierd-85:
Volgens David was dit wit rugby, was die toeskouers op Nuweland ook seker ekslusief wit?
Ek’s seker van die ouens wat ek op tv in die staan plekke(standing room) daar gesien het was nie net almal wit nie
30 Jan 2013, 19:48 pm
@Angostura-84:
> already successfully retained their first such player, Sergeal Petersen, the 2012 Coca Cola Craven Week Player of the Tournament
I’m sure he did, most Super unions prefer bigger players, if he weighs 82kg at 18 he might reach 90kg as a professional
That’s adequate for playing in the first division
30 Jan 2013, 19:52 pm
Why dont you all just wait for tournament to start then you can all howl “I TOLD YOU SO”
I mean arent we all expecting 100 points or more against this faux team
30 Jan 2013, 19:55 pm
When Victoria gets befuck slat hy gou oor na Afrikaans toe
30 Jan 2013, 19:56 pm
@Dawn-91:
Nope, Nortie is Afrikaans and so am I
Ons pleeg Brits net in noodweer
30 Jan 2013, 19:59 pm
@Dawn-91: how are things in Hore land going?
30 Jan 2013, 20:09 pm
These tirades are crashingly mind numbingly boring.
Wait till they play, and lose, then you all be happy.
Till then, shurrup
30 Jan 2013, 20:16 pm
@Dawn-94:
Simply don’t read it
30 Jan 2013, 20:19 pm
Is Jaco Engels?
30 Jan 2013, 20:28 pm
When it was announced in 2009 that the Kings were to play SR in 2013 – I thought, great, our young black baby boks who never seem to make out of age group rugby at the unions will have a home… Instead, most of them play VC and CC first division rugby, while most of their white peers are triving in SR and CC premier division.
Here’s a list of black players that have represented SA u20 since 2008:
15 Wilton Pietersen, 2008 (last I heard he was in a serious car crash)/ Cecil Afrika, 2008 (Blitzbokke)/ Clayton Blommetjies, 2009 (BB, vc)
14 Vainon Willis (Leopards)/ Courtnal Skosan (Tuks)/Sampie Mastriet (BB, vc)/Tshotsho Mbovane, 2011+12 (Blitzbokke)
13 Lionel Mapoe, 2008 (Bulls, SR)/ Juan de Jongh, 2008 (Stormers, SR)/ Wandile Mjekevu, 2010+11 (Sharks, vc)
12 Branco du Preez, 2010
(Blizbokke)
11 Tom Seabela, 2008 (???)/ Sibusiso Sithole, 2010 (Sharks, SR)/ Tythan Adams, 2010 (Boland)/ Travis Ishmael, 2012 (BB, vc)/ Raymond Rhule, 2012 (Cheetahs)
10 Elton Jantjies, 2010 (Stormers, SR)/ Tony Jantjies, 2012 (BB, vc)
09 Rudy Paige, 2008(BB, vc)/Kevin Luiters, 2012 (Cheetahs, SR)
8 Tenday Chikukwa, 2009 (BB)/ Lubabalo Mthembu, 2010 (Sharks, SR)/ Nizaam Carr, 2011 (Stormers)/ Fabian Booysen, 2012 (Lions)
7 Luvuyiso Lusaseni, 2008 (Leopards)/ Yaya Hatzenburg, 2009 (Pumas)/ Samkelo Mabombo, 2010 (Maties)
6 Serge Morole, 2008 (UJ)/ Siya Kolisi, 2010+11 (Stormers, SR)/ Khaya Majola, 2012 (Sharks, vc)
5 Cornell Hess, 2008+09 (Bulls, SR)/Mlungisi Bali, 2010 (former BB)
4 Chene Okafor, 2009+10 (former Sharks u21)
3
2 Monde Hadebe, 2010 (Sharks, SR)/ Bongi Mbonambi, 2011 (BB, vc)
1 Sabelo Nhlapo, 2008 (Tuks)
Apart from Mapoe, de Jongh, Rhule, Elton Jantjies, Kolisi and possibly Carr, none of these players will see regular SR action. My question is then, why can’t the Kings negotiate loan deals for such players?
30 Jan 2013, 20:35 pm
@victoriabok-87:
“hel ons vermy tot meisies wat snoekerig ruik”
Jy ook Simba Keols gekoop na n date by die Pta Skougronde om jou vingers te kamofleer?
30 Jan 2013, 20:36 pm
@nortierd-98:
Kreols nie keols
30 Jan 2013, 20:37 pm
@nortierd-98:
Nee Goodwood se skouterrein
30 Jan 2013, 20:37 pm
@nortierd-99:
Ek dog jy bedoel Katools?
30 Jan 2013, 20:39 pm
@victoriabok-101:
Klink omtrent reg.
Goodwood skougronde se jy, ja nee, as daai ou ysskaatsbaan kon praat…..
30 Jan 2013, 20:43 pm
@nortierd-98:
Ek en Voël(Vogel maar almal noem hom Voël) het altyd daai Kreols gekoop as ons patrollie gery het in Cullinan
Ons het dit p chips genoem
30 Jan 2013, 20:49 pm
@victoriabok-103:
Dis nou weer terug op die mark hier by ons.
Het n pak gekoop vir nostalgiese redes, maar dit proe maar sleg.
Daai tyd was dit lekker
30 Jan 2013, 20:53 pm
When it was announced in 2009 that the Kings were to play SR in 2013 – I thought, great, our young black baby boks who never seem to make out of age group rugby at the unions will have a home… Instead, most of them will be playing VC and CC first division rugby, whilst most of their white peers are triving in SR and CC premier division.
Here’s a list of black players that have represented SA u20 since 2008:
15 Wilton Pietersen, 2008 (last I heard he was in a serious car crash)/ Cecil Afrika, 2008 (Blitzbokke)/ Clayton Blommetjies, 2009 (BB, vc)
14 Vainon Willis (Leopards)/ Courtnal Skosan (Tuks)/Sampie Mastriet (BB, vc)/Tshotsho Mbovane, 2011+12 (Blitzbokke)
13 Lionel Mapoe, 2008 (Bulls, SR)/ Juan de Jongh, 2008 (Stormers, SR)/ Wandile Mjekevu, 2010+11 (Sharks, vc)
12 Branco du Preez, 2010
(Blizbokke)
11 Tom Seabela, 2008 (???)/ Sibusiso Sithole, 2010 (Sharks, SR)/ Tythan Adams, 2010 (Boland)/ Travis Ishmael, 2012 (BB, vc)/ Raymond Rhule, 2012 (Cheetahs)
10 Elton Jantjies, 2010 (Stormers, SR)/ Tony Jantjies, 2012 (BB, vc)
09 Rudy Paige, 2008(BB, vc)/Kevin Luiters, 2012 (Cheetahs, SR)
8 Tenday Chikukwa, 2009 (BB)/ Lubabalo Mthembu, 2010 (Sharks, SR)/ Nizaam Carr, 2011 (Stormers)/ Fabian Booysen, 2012 (Lions)
7 Luvuyiso Lusaseni, 2008 (Leopards)/ Yaya Hatzenburg, 2009 (Pumas)/ Samkelo Mabombo, 2010 (Maties)
6 Serge Morole, 2008 (UJ)/ Siya Kolisi, 2010+11 (Stormers, SR)/ Khaya Majola, 2012 (Sharks, vc)
5 Cornell Hess, 2008+09 (Bulls, SR)/Mlungisi Bali, 2010 (former BB)
4 Chene Okafor, 2009+10 (former Sharks u21)
3
2 Monde Hadebe, 2010 (Sharks, SR)/ Bongi Mbonambi, 2011 (BB, vc)
1 Sabelo Nhlapo, 2008 (Tuks)
Apart from Mapoe, de Jongh, Rhule, Elton Jantjies, Kolisi and possibly Carr, none of these players will see regular SR action. My question is then, why can’t the Kings negotiate loan deals for the rest?
For instance… with Daniel, Kanko, Deysel, Alberts, Coetzee, Kleinhans, Botes, Jordaan, Whitehead, Steyn and Bosman the Sharks would have no plausable reason not to release Mthembu, Majola and Mjekevu.
30 Jan 2013, 20:58 pm
@nortierd-104:
Wat was die ander een wat ook so visserig was, dit was sulke pienk skulpies amper soos vis kaaskrulle?
30 Jan 2013, 20:59 pm
@mxhosa-105:
Alan Solomons said that he wanted to bring home to PE all those players representing provinces elsewhere in the country.
Now, if only pigs could fly.
30 Jan 2013, 21:01 pm
@victoriabok-106:
Daai prawn flavoured goed?
Kan nie die naam onthou nie, Woolworths verkoop dit nog
30 Jan 2013, 21:02 pm
I would expect Hadleigh Parkes to make the starting squad come the start of Super Rugby. His elevation to captain of Auckland in the last ITM cup improved his play on the field, his leadership within the Kings backs will add some stability.
30 Jan 2013, 21:02 pm
@nortierd-104:
Have you got your tickets yet? Got 8, mixture of Bulls and Stormers supporters – but mostly Bulls. I wouldn’t have it any other way.
30 Jan 2013, 21:03 pm
@I am a stormer-107:
And I want to win the lotto and hump Kate Upton
30 Jan 2013, 21:04 pm
@nortierd-108:
Yes, daai een
Stink soos die Verpleegters koshuis on ‘n Sondagaand
30 Jan 2013, 21:05 pm
@mxhosa-105: I think that is quite interesting….I think Kings would come up with some plausible reason not to do that, frankly I think they don’t think the players are maybe good enough but don’t want to be put into a position and having to say it. Otherwise why haven’t they done this instead of getting in overseas players. Wonder why no one else has thought of this, its actually quite logical.
30 Jan 2013, 21:10 pm
@Treehugger-113:
They could have used some good players from other First Division teams as well
30 Jan 2013, 21:19 pm
@mxhosa-105: you must have pulled your hair out when the Kings fielded an all white team in the match against the FS.
30 Jan 2013, 21:31 pm
@RL-115:
Nee hulle maak dit op soos hulle aangaan, wit is die nuwe swart wanneer dit hulle pas
30 Jan 2013, 21:42 pm
@I am a stormer-110:
yep, 22nd in my new jersey will be gracing Loftus.
@victoriabok-112:
Dis nogal n mental image
30 Jan 2013, 21:47 pm
@nortierd-117:
Speler 23
30 Jan 2013, 21:51 pm
@victoriabok-118:
met die nuwe sub reels word ek seker 24
30 Jan 2013, 21:54 pm
@nortierd-119:
Van wanneer af tree dit in werking?
30 Jan 2013, 21:55 pm
@RL-115:
I have no hair to pull :p, but I was rather disappointed in that team.
30 Jan 2013, 21:58 pm
@mxhosa-121:
Smooth like a Ken doll down there eh?
30 Jan 2013, 21:58 pm
@victoriabok-120:
dog dit is al.
moet n volle voorry op die bank he.
aangeneem dit tel vir die super rugby ook
30 Jan 2013, 22:01 pm
@nortierd-123:
Goed so, geen voorry verdien om 80 minute rond te hardloop nie of hoe?
30 Jan 2013, 22:01 pm
@victoriabok-116:
Is ek die hulle waarvan jy praat?
30 Jan 2013, 22:14 pm
@mxhosa-125:
Glo jy ook aan dubbele standaarde?
Indien die antwoord ja is dan is die antwoord vanselfsprekend
30 Jan 2013, 22:21 pm
How are these foreigners helping the development of EC rugby? I thought that was the point of the Kings?
30 Jan 2013, 22:22 pm
The Rebels might have been allowed 10 foreign players in their first year, but their aim was to be competitive.
The Kings are only there for political reasons, being competitive is unimportant.
30 Jan 2013, 22:23 pm
@mxhosa-105: how many players in active Super rugby teams have ever gone on loan to other franchises?
30 Jan 2013, 22:30 pm
ek sien al die wittertjies huil nog oor die Kings.. hulle wil eerde die Kings sien reguit geklop word as eenige moontlikheid dat hul miskien a sukses storie uithaal.
as die Kings sukses behaal is die n ware traantjie in die ou vierkleur se wittertjie se oogie werd
30 Jan 2013, 22:32 pm
hierdie wittertjie dink hy is ‘n swartjie.
30 Jan 2013, 22:34 pm
maar jy’s taamlik nie eers n suid afrikaner jy behoord in die ou dame se frilly lace parade daar op buckingham palace
30 Jan 2013, 22:37 pm
@victoriabok-126:
I’ve spent of my time on this site highliting the lack of black players in SR and CC premier division…. Why then would I be happy to see a lily white CC first division team? I’d rather see Lusaseni instead of Devin Oosthuizen and Vince Gwavu instead of vd Walt, but alas that is not to be… I will go to the stadium to watch the Kings though, an experience RL will be missing out on this year, SR experience that is.
Volgende keer vra aseblief vir my opienie (spelling). Ek is nie `n hulle nie!
30 Jan 2013, 22:39 pm
Ay yay yay I truly wish the KrapKings well, they are SAcan after all, but I just cannot see them being a threat at all. I think there are big scorelines in store. Also, they way they gained entrance stinks so I don’t really care about them either way.
I remember the announcement of Puke Twatson being apppointed an “honorary black”. Did I miss the announcement of skopdiekunt being appointed an honorary black too? This foreign invader has colonised his foreign born brain of all sense.
30 Jan 2013, 22:40 pm
@mxhosa-133: better not to think about race at all……… lily white…… coal black……. who cares??????? As long as the best players available play, right?
30 Jan 2013, 22:40 pm
just laid my hands on this book.
http://www.wadardbooks.co.uk/acatalog/info_162.html
on the 1st page craven says
“The World War has been blamed for much, from the rise of Communism to the lack of municipal amenities in Pampoenville. But its effect on rugby was healthy & beneficial.
Some provincial centres, like Northern Transvaal, received a great fillip as a result of the war. Star players from other centres were posted there for military training, and their play set a standard and example for the youngsters who saw them in action at the Loftus Versfeld grounds.
For a province which had only recently achieved independence it meant a lot to have those players there.
I put it forward as one of the reasons why that province, in its first participation in thr Currie Cup Competition in 1946, won it.”
30 Jan 2013, 22:40 pm
dis tyd dat Afrika weer vir egte Afrikaners laat trots voel.. die wat wil weg fok laat hulle maar weg fok doer erens anderplek oorkant die see toe.. net soos die wat al dag na nag huil oor hulle suiwer ou kolonie wat dag na dag besig is om egtelik Afrika vir egte Afrikaners te word..
hulle huil nog steeds oor hulle ou herinderinne maar hulle bly maar weg veilig in hulle nuwe tuis in hulle nuwe kolonie wat hulle nou tans nie eintlik heeltemaal kan egtelik tuis noem.
30 Jan 2013, 22:41 pm
@mxhosa-105: @I am a stormer-107: @Treehugger-113:
No, that is looking at matters superficially; the Kings have to play the hand they were dealt to the best of their ability; in finance you have to balance your asset & liability mix, i.e. you have to marry your asset & liability duration (i.e. it is dangerous funding long term assets with short term money); well, the Kings were dealt this hand: 6 months’ notice of participation, 1 year guarantee of participation.
That is ludicrous – that had not been contemplated by anyone, not even SARU (in as far as they’ve let on) & had never happened before; & it was contrary to both SARU & the King’s reason for the King’s elevation to SR status. The King’s medium to long term aims were (1) to bring top flight rugby to the EC for the benefit of their spectators, their players & the (generally economically depressed) community at large, (2) the retention of their homegrown talent via opportunities at the highest level, (3) the transformation & development of rugby in their regions, especially among the previously disadvantaged. These are all laudable aims, but they are medium to long term, not 1 year aims that can be achieved with 6 months’ prior notice.
C’mon, get real: SARU’s malicious or grossly reckless delayed decision left the Kings with no choice – they were hurled into survival mode, & forced to think short term, & I guess, without knowing, forced to temporarily abandon their medium to long term plans in favour of short term survival. That entailed buying the best proven players that they could within the much too late & far too short window of opportunity granted them – and THAT is exactly what they did. To use an example, whereas Hess, Mthembu & Mjekevu would almost certainly have been better 3-year purchases, it is unlikely that they would have been better 1-year purchases/loans than Sykes, Leonardi & Parkes. The Kings had no choice but to go for players who had experience at high level, such as S15-, European Club competition- & International level. That is the reality.
So lets get real. To not do so is pure bloody-mindedness.
30 Jan 2013, 22:44 pm
Lol I see skop is still banging on about colonialism and telling people to leave. Not very tolerant is our little shortshit friend, is he?
Is colonialism your new bug bear or will Jake White regain your stuck record ire once the rugby starts?
30 Jan 2013, 22:46 pm
@Transformation-129:
This is an abnormal situation that SARU and the Kings find themselves in. A long time ago, I remember a young Gary Botha being drafted by the Sharks when he deemed surplus to requirements at the Bulls. So too Gurthro Steenkamp when he was behind Os du Randt and Lawrence Sephaka at the Cats.
It’s not only good for SA rugby, but also for the players as well the franchises, because they get back players with SR experience and as a result a stronger squad come CC time when the boks are away.
30 Jan 2013, 22:47 pm
Pity is Kings will likely get hammered they do not have a player base capable to withstand the rigors of SR in this short term infusion of thrust into the deep end survival mode..
IF they could get ALL their homegrown talent back that would be a vastly different story.. but this sad state of mercenary affairs that give suckup franchises like Sharkshits and Bulls buying rights over indigenous home grown talents like EC prevents that potentiality happening in the immediate short term.
30 Jan 2013, 22:49 pm
What of the colonialism of one foreign born jewish bakkiebouer in West Jozi? Shouldn’t this foreign born invader be turfed in to the sea? Does he belong in Africa?
30 Jan 2013, 22:51 pm
Jake White is a two bit little two face chickenshit just like all these big talking colonialists who talk big breek but run for the safety net of some estranged remote colony to hang out in while their hart verlang na die plek van waar hulle weggehardloop het
30 Jan 2013, 22:55 pm
I got zero hang ups about being associated and at home with true indigenous Africans.. the difference is two bit whitey colonialists like you do…
30 Jan 2013, 22:55 pm
@mxhosa-140:
I agree with that.
Whether it will ever happen is anyone’s guess.
As long as the Union contracts and pays the player they won’t release them, and although it might not be in the best interest of South Africa, it’s still their perogotive and right.
Then you get some of the bigger unions buying talent not necessarily to play them, but to prohibit other unions of playing them lest they be a threat to them in future, think of the Bulls buying Kennedy Tsimba from the Cheetahs and leaving him on the bench, but when he played for FS he was a threat.
The same for Zane, scored the winning try against them for Griekwas and the next season he was a Bull, yet Roets was their fullback.
He was lucky though as Roets announced his retirement at a young age which came as a surprise to everyone and Zane got his chance much earlier than anyone could have anticipated.
30 Jan 2013, 23:01 pm
Kirchner, Basson, Engelbrecht, Potgieter, Sadie, Hougaard, and now Mapoe all made big mistakes signing for the Herstigte Nasionale Bulls.. their careers and talents took a nose dive as soon as they donned that baby powder blue washed out faded jaded jersey
30 Jan 2013, 23:06 pm
and then they made it even worse they went from faded jaded washed out baby powder blue jerseys to shocking f’ng pienk.. how f’ng DUMB can these herstigte nasionale pers blommetjie blou frill nulletjies actually be?
30 Jan 2013, 23:06 pm
@Angostura-138: owned it!
30 Jan 2013, 23:07 pm
@Transformation-136:
> I put it forward as one of the reasons why that province, in its first participation in thr Currie Cup Competition in 1946, won it.”
Just like WP used Boland players all these years?
30 Jan 2013, 23:09 pm
@Transformation-136:
> municipal amenities in Pampoenville
Still better than farking PE
30 Jan 2013, 23:14 pm
@mxhosa-140: why is it only “good for SA rugby” now when the likes of tim whitehead languished behind jdv, frikkie walsh, mossie, jdj…they had to wait for their contracts to be finished to move to the sharks who were so poor at centre with oupa terblanche, riaan swanepoel, andries strauss & adi, no mention of a loan.
30 Jan 2013, 23:18 pm
@nortierd-145: i want to see the franna venter, serfontein, small-smith centre situation & see who will come up trumps & who will be shipped off to griekwas as a discard.
30 Jan 2013, 23:18 pm
@skopdiekan-146:
> Kirchner, Basson, Engelbrecht, Potgieter, Sadie, Hougaard, and now Mapoe all made big mistakes
Hmm let’s see
Kirchner became a Bok at the Bulls,
Basson too,
Engelbrecht and Potgieter as well
and Hougie too
I don’t know how you benchmark success in your Bakkie builder world, but becoming a Bok must surely rate as one of the high points in a rugby players career?
30 Jan 2013, 23:20 pm
@victoriabok-150: calm down…how old are you.
30 Jan 2013, 23:23 pm
@Transformation-152:
Yep, lots of surplus holding tackle bags.
@victoriabok-153:
Only Zane and Hougard are regular starters.
The others have the blazers and a couple of caps, but we all know were lucky that HM felt a bit blue when picking his first squad.
30 Jan 2013, 23:24 pm
I see PDV’s little fleetfooted bruinous fckd up TUTs big boerseun stampkar witous something chronic on Monday by 5 tries to zilch.. I watched the first 20 minutes and the big stampkar witous were all over the little fleetfooted bruinous like a bosbefokte rash and should have steamrolled at least a few tries but didn’t..
So wtf happened second half to turn the tide? PdV is an underrated rugby coach in spite of what most dyed in the wool barbare witous might think…he won the club champs with a no name Tygerberg bruinou side before he became junior bok coach and then won the junior bok WC and came runner up the following competition… he got handed a hot potato with that stuck in a rut JW one dimensional team.. Saru got it wrong.. HM should have inherited JW’s team and PdV should have got the gig now.. dan sou jy vonke sien spat heen en weer.
30 Jan 2013, 23:24 pm
@victoriabok-149: ” Just like WP used Boland players all these
years?”
pointing at other people doesn’t diminish your own inadiquacies. well that’s what craven says in the book, you can bust a gut trying to argue with a dead man
30 Jan 2013, 23:25 pm
@Angostura-138:
The Bulls were CC champs from 2002 – 2004, finalists in 2005 and in that time they never reached a SR semi final… and they Matfield, Bakkies, Wannenburg, Jacques Cronje, Steenkamp, Du Preez, Habana, Olivier, et al. The Cheetahs were champs in 2005 and 06, perenial semi finalists, yet they have never won more than 5 games in a single season… The Lions have won 6 games in the last 3 seasons and they were CC cahmps in 2011.
Therefore it is highly unlikely that these foreign imports will make that much of a difference. By the way I would take Sykes over Hess any day. My problem is the journeymen who couldn’t make it elsewhere.
My point here, is that these players are deemed good enough represent their country at u20 level but never seem to quite make the step up – especially those from the Sharks academy and u21s – while at the same time a lot of their white peers, seemingly, do not have a problem making the step up.
It would therefore benefit SA a lot more to have these players run out against the best in the Southern Hemisphere, than a short-term investment in foreign imports…
Another problem is that at the bigger unions, most of the time they are up against boks who are in their prime…
30 Jan 2013, 23:25 pm
@Transformation-157:
And quoting one makes you a rocket scientist?
30 Jan 2013, 23:26 pm
@skopdiekan-156:
“I see PDV’s little fleetfooted bruinous fckd up TUTs big boerseun stampkar witous something chronic on Monday by 5 tries to zilch.. I watched the first 20 minutes and the big stampkar witous were all over the little fleetfooted bruinous like a bosbefokte rash and should have steamrolled at least a few tries but didn’t..”
30 Jan 2013, 23:26 pm
@skopdiekan-156: there were some fantastic tries in that game skop…raw pace & hands.
30 Jan 2013, 23:27 pm
@Angostura-138:
Angostura…you talk too much sense.The limitations Saru have imposed on the Kings Franchise…the one year only guarantee of SR, the short notice inclusion in this years comp which has had knock on effects re: player availability are obstacles that the Kings may find impossible to overcome.Like you say the short term goal is now survival and the noble medium to long term aims of player development in the EC are on the back burner. I have to question whether Saru want the Kings to succeed considering the way they have handled the situation.
If the Kings get through this season with the right to play the next, it will be a minor miracle.
30 Jan 2013, 23:27 pm
@nortierd-160:
And the Souties from UCT?
30 Jan 2013, 23:28 pm
Kirchner Basson Engelbrecht Sadie and Hougaards rugby playing instincts all got honed right out of them.. they were great players at their home base franchises.. soon as they got to Bulls all the rugby instinct got coached straight out of them into one dimensional robots.. same as Morne Steyn come to think of it… in fact which Bulls back line player ever became great playing for Bulls.. Naas, Habana… wie nog? Etienne Botha but he was never picked because he was too small for boks.. yet Habana wasn’t.
30 Jan 2013, 23:29 pm
@victoriabok-159: no…just lekker seeing you bust a foefie…
30 Jan 2013, 23:30 pm
@victoriabok-163:
Don’t ask me, ask the author of the quote.
Just loved the way it was written.
I am going to have huge problems trying to predict the Varsity Cup, my knowledge of the teams are non existant and will have to rely on guesswork the first couple of rounds.
30 Jan 2013, 23:31 pm
@Te Rangatira-162: as cheeky said “loaded deck of cards” mate.
30 Jan 2013, 23:34 pm
where is Tacitus? Sergeal Peterson runs the 100m in a time of 10.35
is that good or not?
30 Jan 2013, 23:35 pm
@skopdiekan-141:
Here (as far as I can establish) are Kings (SWD, EC, NEC, Border/Transkei) homegrown talent CURRENTLY lost to other S15 franchises (looking only at players in contention for S15):
JJ Engelbrecht (Bulls)
Akona Ndungane (Bulls)
Zane Kirchner (Bulls)
Cameron Jacobs (Cheetahs)
Rocco Jansen (Cheetahs)
Jongi Nokwe (Cheetahs)
Nico Scheepers (Cheetahs)
Odwa Ndungane (Sharks)
Lwazi Mvovo (Sharks)
Sibusiso Sithole (Sharks)
Gouws Prinsloo (Sharks)
Jan Serfontein (Bulls)
Tim Whitehead (Sharks)
Siya Kolisi (Stormers)
Dewald Potgieter (Bulls)
Jacques Potgieter (Bulls)
Davon Raubenheimer (Cheetahs)
Philip van der Walt (Cheetahs)
Keegan Daniel (Sharks)
Ryan Kankowski (Sharks)
Lubabalo Mthembu (Sharks)
Cornell Hess (Bulls)
Andries Ferreira (Cheetahs)
Ligtoring Landman (Cheetahs)
Allan Dell (Sharks)
It is abundantly clear that it is only WP/Stormers that come out of this smelling sweet. The Sharks are bottom of the class – & the thieving is all inversely related to (1) selfish greed, & (2) to the ability to develop your own talent at grassroots level.
**
I can also add the following players to the above list, but in fairness, they only spent primary school within the Southern Kings regions before they moved on to other schools:
Frans Steyn (Sharks, via Grey College)
Johan Goosen (Cheetahs, via Grey College)
Paul Jordaan (Sharks via Grey College)
Deon Stegman (Bulls, via Grey College)
Scarra Ntubeni (Stormers, via KES)
Jano Vermaak (Bulls) may also fall in this category, but I’m not sure when his family left the EC for Tvl.
**
Quite an impressive list. You can see why I say the Kings region is a rugby nursery. And when it comes to development of Coloured & Black rugby players at grassroots level it is all happening in the W-Cape (Stormers/Boland) & the S-E Cape/Border (SWD/EP Kings/ Border) – not much happening elsewhere in South Africa. Perhaps this the reason they will the failure of The Kings – coz it’s easier, cheaper & for them socially more acceptable to poach already developed players of colour from an economically depressed area than to develop them themself?
How much have things really changed?
30 Jan 2013, 23:35 pm
@Transformation-167:
Certainly looks that way Trans…..makes it even more meritorious when the Kings do the business.
30 Jan 2013, 23:43 pm
@Te Rangatira-162: YES
there’s a political trojan horse – & that’s that
the Kings have been set up for failure, but the Kings’ grit (& the Lions solvency) might yet destroy the best laid plans
30 Jan 2013, 23:44 pm
@Angostura-169: 100% correct .. exactly what I been shouting from the roof tops ever since day dot.. I say the mercenary pilfering system superficially titled ‘professionalism’ in my ou doos ideology.. sucks to high f’ng heaven.. Sharkshits and Bulls would be absolutely NOWHERE if they had to rely on home grown talent as was the case before the advent of the Francois Pienaar and Hennie le Roux led player insurrection for rugby professionalization. FS and EC would be right up there with WP as legitimate beneficiaries of their own home grown nursery bred talent and Bulls and Sharks would be forced to play catch up instead of simply reverting to convenient check book swindling style fake supremacy.
30 Jan 2013, 23:55 pm
@Transformation-151:
The Sharks were a settled side and were apparently quite happy with their midfield options. The Kings on the other hand are new to SR and are looking for players…. By the way, Adi and Oupa Stef were experienced boks, much like JdV and Mossie, and Strauss became a bok tourist. Looks like Tim will be languishing behind Frans, Jordaan and possibly JP this year.
31 Jan 2013, 00:07 am
@mxhosa-158: I’m broadly in agreement with you, except that the Kings are not a charity: their purpose & reason for existence is NOT to give short term opportunities to Sharks academy players poached from them (the Kings) or other other franchises & not properly developed & not given adequate opportunity to flourish (unless it is also in the Kings’ interests to do so)
&
I have already expressed my opinion about the Kings’ short term survival requirements (which presently do not dovetail with what you suggest).
31 Jan 2013, 00:09 am
G’nite – already end of Jan – eish!
31 Jan 2013, 00:15 am
Kolisi
Liebenburg
Vermeulen
Carstens
Cilliers
Jantjies
Habana
Rhodes
Taute
van den Heever
Just some … and these Stormer groupies will try have you believe the Stormers are not a squad of mercenaries?
As I said. Lol.
31 Jan 2013, 00:38 am
@Angostura-174:
It is in the Kings’ best interest to give opportunities to these youngsters. They will realise playing at a franchise where their talents are appreciated is much better than to just being a squad member at a bigger union, where they aren’t likely to get an extended run. As a result it’ll keep more of our up and coming talent in the EC. We won’t situations where youngsters like Andile Jho believe it would much better to continue his rugby in Pretoria, where he can’t even break into the u21 side, than in PE. In effect that’s why the Kings were created, to lure back these players and to curtail the poaching of our potential stars by bigger unions, only for them to never make it beyond age group rugby….
31 Jan 2013, 01:27 am
Fair enough
let Kolisi go back to EC
Liebenberg back to NWC
Vermeulen back to Mpumalanga
Cilliers and Rhodes back to KZN
Jantjies, Habana, Taute back to GP
and Van den Heever back to PTA
Deon Carstens is BACK Home – born in Franschoek WP
but then give us back JP Pietersen, Pieter Steff Du Toit, JL Du Plessis, Conrad Hoffman, Francois Hougaard, Handre Pollard, Johann Sadie, Juandre Kruger, Wilhelm Steenkamp, Willie Le Roux, Dusty Noble, Rayno Benjamin, Josh Strauss, Caylib Oosthuizen, Anthony Volmink, Franco Vd Merwe
to name a few..
and then we talk… fairs fair…deal..?
31 Jan 2013, 01:43 am
and to top it we get to keep our WP bred core of :-
Deon Carstens, Steven Kitschoff, Frans Malherbe, De Kok Steenkamp, Andries Bekker, Eben Etsebeth, Wilhelm Vd Sluys, Schalk Burger, Nizaam Carr, Rynhardt Elstadt, Yaya Hartzenberg, Tyrone Holmes, Nick Koster, Dewalt Duvenhage, Nic Groom, Louis Schreuder, Marcel Brache, Juan De Jongh, Jean De Villiers, Damian de Allende, Ederies Arendse, Gio Aplon, Tim Swiel…etc..etc.. etc…
you wanna keep arguing mercenary status here.. you on a hiding to nothing.. sharkshit guppie yuppie.. you ain’t got a forlorn goddamn miserable middle leg to vaguely hobble on let alone stand on…
31 Jan 2013, 05:33 am
Wannabe Province supporter, who is the ‘we’ you talking about? You a born and bred Transvaler skop, don’t try and hide the truth…
31 Jan 2013, 05:59 am
@mxhosa-177: ” It is in the Kings’ best interest to give
opportunities to these youngsters. They will
realise playing at a franchise where their
talents are appreciated is much better than
to just being a squad member at a bigger
union, where they aren’t likely to get an
extended run.”
what you are saying is the Kings must be the antidote for SA Rugby’s ills and the contention that some of these kids played age-group rugby thus they’re good enough has been proved before as not such a foolproof one-too many examples to mention.
as i’ve said to you before i have no problem watching matthew taylor-smith learn the ropes at the Kings rather than watch a windgat andile jho play just because he is black. if jho is adamant that his future is at the bulls behind wynand, serfontein, venter & the like & won’t see the obvious that’s his story.
31 Jan 2013, 07:29 am
Slarti he was born in Israel
31 Jan 2013, 07:37 am
@Fern-182:
Physically or just ‘in his heart’? You know he spin more rubbish than most of us combined. Anyway, he spend his formative years in Transvaal.
31 Jan 2013, 07:43 am
@Slartibartfast-183: He is a one man Tower of Babel.
31 Jan 2013, 07:51 am
@stormer in a teacup-184:
Crossed with the leaning tower of Pisa…not all there.
31 Jan 2013, 07:53 am
@Slartibartfast-185:
Not surprising really. We’ve been taking the Pisa out of him for years.
31 Jan 2013, 07:56 am
@stormer in a teacup-184:
@Slartibartfast-185:
Always figured him more of a windmill type of person, or to be more exact, the Don Quixote character who charges at the windmills.
31 Jan 2013, 08:02 am
@nortierd-187: More like windmal.
31 Jan 2013, 08:03 am
@stormer in a teacup-186:
Hehehe reminded me of the time his mate asked Mike if he still takes his wife out for pizza. Nee se Mike, ek piets haar nou sommer by die huis…!
@nortierd-187:
Got a few klappe weg, if from the windmills or passer by I don’t know.
31 Jan 2013, 08:11 am
@Transformation-181:
We have to start somewhere, why not with the Kings? Of course not all the players who’ve played age group rugby for SA will make the step up…. I will take Tim Whitehead over Stefan Watermeyer any day. Johan van Deventer was once touted as a future bok, he’s now at the Leopards… at least he got a taste of SR.
My contention is that at the bigger unions it seems easier for the white players to make the step up than the black counterparts. For instance, the only baby bok locks who have not played SR are Cornel Hess, Chene Okafor, Mlungisi Bali, Sabelo Nhlapo (converted to prop) and Sebastian De Chaves (chose to continue his rugby in France).
FYI, I have no symapthy for Andile Jho! Was just trynna make a point… Would be even happier to see Tim come home. And I’m quite happy to support David Bulbring, Raynier Bernado and Armand du Preez instead of Cornel Hess.
31 Jan 2013, 08:19 am
WP bred core?
Captain Cunteye is starting to sound more and more like some mad Nazi doctor.
31 Jan 2013, 08:29 am
@stormer in a teacup-186: He thinks he’s a Tower of knowledge…we know differently.
31 Jan 2013, 08:35 am
@BrumbiesBoy-192:
Mmm maybe Tower of No Ledge…
31 Jan 2013, 08:39 am
@Slartibartfast-193: Or the Towering Inferno of Hatred which is sometimes spewed out of that vile thing he calls a mouth.
31 Jan 2013, 08:42 am
@BrumbiesBoy-194: The only time he is a tower is when he is pulling a trailer full of bricks behind his bakkie.
31 Jan 2013, 08:47 am
@stormer in a teacup-195:
In die regte lewe lyk hy seker soos die Hillbrow of Brixton toerings…’n lang d r o l van fokkol.
31 Jan 2013, 08:49 am
@stormer in a teacup-195:
You trying to tell me that Datsun can pull a trailer, nice try but we all know that is not true…
31 Jan 2013, 08:53 am
@BrumbiesBoy-196:
Nee man, beide daai torings is langer as 5 voet 3…oh hang on, you mean skop is like a Minnie Me Hillbrow toring?
31 Jan 2013, 08:55 am
@BrumbiesBoy-196:
31 Jan 2013, 08:55 am
As I see it, I don’t really believe that anyone has an issue with the Kings or the idea of the Kings.
The problem is the Twatsons. Had there been a different and more likeable face to the organization, things would move twice as quickly with twice as much support.
31 Jan 2013, 09:13 am
All the cry baby colonic colonialists crying together In tandem no wonder they such a bunch of miserable runaway chickenshIts complaining much better about the advent of the EC Kings seeking their demise before they even begin cause they represent the exact antithesis to their cowardly chickenshift colonial agenda. What’s this little colonic prick Brumbies prat still doing crying about Africa while he sucks off the marrow of African aspiring affiliations. Wtf you still doing here you pseudo champion of white sport for whites only punk you should have fckd off to that wannabe colonic culture where the colonialists are still proud of their genocide of the indigenous population just like Kosie and Brycie and Jakey and all the other colonic Jones’s did.
31 Jan 2013, 09:32 am
@skopdiekan-201: Hello Skop. I hope you are well.
31 Jan 2013, 09:40 am
Howdy Ruckerby baby I’m doing fine thankee doody ma’am hope you doing fine too.
31 Jan 2013, 10:01 am
@skopdiekan-201: Hey punk, wtf did I ever say anything about whites-only sport?
Come on, show me where?
Unlike your teams at least my “lily-white” Brumbies are a team selected on merit and not some abhorrently racist quota system which discriminates on the basis of race.
Do not put words in my mouth…prove your allegations otherwise STFU.
31 Jan 2013, 10:12 am
“my brumbies” while borm & bred in joburg
31 Jan 2013, 10:14 am
@skopdiekan-201:
Yada yada.
I still cant believe you’re just a wee Jewish fella from Fishoek.
31 Jan 2013, 10:15 am
we already have CapeCrusaders by die kaap now we have JoziBrumbies in die vaal…
disaffected saffas
31 Jan 2013, 10:15 am
@Transformation-205: Who said I was born in Joburg?
And don’t bother asking where I was born because it’s none of your business.
31 Jan 2013, 10:24 am
@BrumbiesBoy-208: i’m not in the least interested in you JoziBrumbie
31 Jan 2013, 10:25 am
So…Sheeke’ is developing rugby for New Zealand, Kenya, Argentina and France…four places for up and coming black players have been poached by unknown nationalities.
This would not usually phase me, but for all the hot gassy emissions that escape these Watson cretins blowholes on a regular basis about transformation in South African rugby.
So, much like their cousins in government, they sanctimoniously scream and grizzle about the unfairness of life in a white South Africa, but when it gets down to it, they are the ones being caught with their big smelly feet ankle deep in their chilly chicken giblet infested gobs.
We wait for the next comedy of events from the comrades. Politics 101 from the Laurel and Hardy of South African rugby.
31 Jan 2013, 10:33 am
@Transformation-209: Oh, I think you are.
31 Jan 2013, 13:57 pm
@Predawn-210: Well said!!!
Excuse my ignorance, as I really dont know, but why can the franchises not show SARU the middle finger, and put in a team they want to? I am sure that European clubs would love to have a full strength Sharks, Bulls, Stormers, Lions and Cheetahs team in their European tournament. Or should everything go through SARU? If so, I dont understand the franchise business that well…
31 Jan 2013, 14:24 pm
@Blue Label-212: SARU owns the Franchise licences, there’s a South African Rugby Franchise Agreement that unions are signatories to.
31 Jan 2013, 21:30 pm
@BrumbiesBoy-204:
You should fck off to Goolongonedwanaland where all your pale face puffy nosed pompous brethren systematically all but succeeded in obliterating the local indigenous inhabitants into extinction with their blight on humanity you pompous pricks like to promulgate. Wtf you still doing in Africa you dumb displaced colonialist there no place for you snotty nosed kind here this indigenous population is not going to be subservient and subjugated into extinction or oblivion like you thought you could successfully achieve on other blighted continents you occupied. Go play your colonic cockup of a cantankerous cockamamie excuse of colonial pastime called cricket on that wasteland of opportunity your kind usurped and
31 Jan 2013, 21:38 pm
Take your other brethren like this ponce here with you @John Galt-206: along with Bryce and Bruce and Clyde and Koos and all other displaced blighters who wanna make their little whitey colonial cocoon of convenience on somebody else’s land.
31 Jan 2013, 22:02 pm
@skopdiekan-214: Yawn.
#prattdeluxe
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